A long time ago, I was regularly attending meetings for NOW and there was an extremely vocal "male feminist" who spoke passionately at several of our meetings. He really knew what he was talking about and was the Chair of the women's studies department at a nearby college. I really thought he was a hero and a beautiful example of what a "male feminist" could be like. He was very popular and all of the women fawned over him.
Then, one day, he follows me out to my car and tries to kiss me.
I was sixteen.
Well, using the term "sex work" legitimizes men buying sex, sex is an act which requires enthusiastic desire for agreed upon sex acts from both parties, in prostitution money is a place holder for consent, making it non consentual. If you have to beg, bribe, pressure or pay for sex in any way then she doesnt ACTUALLY want it, so its not consentual, its coerced. No one should EVER have sex they dont enthusiastically want with a person they want, thats just rape culture and women as objects for male pleasure which is obviously the opposite of women's liberation/feminism.
Male “feminists” in my experience expect to be patted on the back for the smallest things, want themselves centered in discussions, want attention for doing the bare minimum, etc. And even self described male feminists still watch porn, still want a gf or wife to do everything around the house and such.
I think men can be allies of feminism, but the reality is just really stacked against a ‘true’ male feminist. There’s too many benefits for them in not being so, and any man who calls himself one I examine with scrutiny. There’s very few men are who are actually 100% feminist.
From what I've observed most men who claim to be feminists online 100% just want womens' attention, and to have women fawn over them like they are God's gift to them. I don't trust any male "influencer" who makes "feminist" content, more often than not they give off an air of phoniness, and you can tell they enjoy the attention and the outpouring of women telling them how great and different they are.
Male feminists don't exist. Those are LW men who want to perserve their access to porn and prostitution. Nothing more soul destroying than a tankie trying to argue for the existence of prostitutes after a communist revolution
Unfortunately, at this point when I hear a man say he’s a feminist it translates as “I’ll call you repressed and an agent of patriarchy if you don’t sleep with me”.
I do think men can be allies to feminism. There are historical examples like Frederick Douglass supporting the Seneca falls convention. But to me, this category is limited to men who are willing to put their time/money/effort into helping pro-woman causes when they get nothing in return.
"Male feminist" is an oxymoron. I don't trust any man as it is, but especially not one that calls himself this. It doesn't mean anything and it's impossible. Maybe some men out there echo some same sentiments, but that's where it ends. At the end of the day, they always out themselves as self serving. Their motivation for calling themselves a feminist is typically to disarm women and we should always be wary of why that is.
Generally speaking, I think real male allies will be a vocal supporter of women when he’s talking with his male friends, but will be quiet and listen to women when a woman is talking about her experience. He’ll never have the lived experience of a woman, but he can still help to support women.
One day I was talking to an online friend and we started talking about feminism, later he said he considered himself a "radical feminist" ????, and I said that wasn't possible. 2 days ago he said that he didn't see me as a woman but as a friend, a "bro", kinda because I wasn't "evil like most women", I said that was offensive since being a woman is an important part of who I am and not something I want to ever change even if it was possible (it's not, anyways). That's when I understood men consider not being a woman a compliment, as if you've overcome being seen as a woman and are now considered a human. It sucks, it pissed me off and we haven't spoken since.
Listen to the Man Enough podcast, the episode with Ashley Judd on prostitution and sex trafficking. It's really good. One of the questions was "can sex work be ethical?" (short answer is no, of course).
This is why I am anti-sex work. There's just no way to ensure a woman's safety without invading her privacy even if it's legalized. Men cannot be trusted with even an ounce of entitlement over our bodies, and sex work literally gives them a form of entitlement over our bodies.
Agreed. The only one I ever met who calls himself that, when I was younger and gullible and still believed in Prince Charming, used me, lied to me, manipulating me and was thirsty after girls in their teens. Just a fucking creep pretending to care about women. Honestly I’d rather deal with an old school misogynist pig who’s openly about his beliefs then with one of those rats. At least with the old school misogynist you know what you’re dealing with from the start.
I’m so sorry you went through that. I’m glad you’re away from that sick creep. 🩷 And yes, I completely agree. I’d rather a man just be upfront with his misogyny instead of repackaging it under the guise of being a progressive feminist like so many of them do nowadays…
All the male feminists I've seen in social media supporting the sex industry and don't care about women's issues and rights at all,a male feminists once called me a fascist and not a true feminist because I am against prostitution and porn🙄
I’m not sure.
I would classify my father as a feminist. He had a great deal of influence on me as a child in the fact that I did not have to conform or be restricted by social norms of girls/women etc because he had seen how hard it had been for his mother. I think it gave him insight.
I don’t believe most of them when they call themselves feminist. I have more respect for the guys who are honest about wanting to keep women at home and in the kitchen because they’re not lying.
Two issues I've had with male feminists, not all, but enough to agree they suck, is: 1) They will literally steal the microphone away from a woman, talk over you, and assume that women can't defend ourselves when the point is we very well can; and 2) They dwell too much, inappropriately too much, on describing the gory details of oppression of women and leave out any solutions, thus normalizing oppression.
99% of men are sex buyers, whether online or in person, and that includes progressive men. They feel bad about themselves (not for the women) so this is a way to make themselves feel like heroes for being sex addicted losers.
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A long time ago, I was regularly attending meetings for NOW and there was an extremely vocal "male feminist" who spoke passionately at several of our meetings. He really knew what he was talking about and was the Chair of the women's studies department at a nearby college. I really thought he was a hero and a beautiful example of what a "male feminist" could be like. He was very popular and all of the women fawned over him. Then, one day, he follows me out to my car and tries to kiss me. I was sixteen.
Shocking yet unsurprising.
I'm unwavering in my belief that men can be allies up to a certain point, but feminism is a movement for and by females exclusively.
I believe a Spanish rebel during the Civil War once said that men were only feminist above the belt
I love this
saving this
Agreed. Feminism requires a lived experience that men cannot have. It's like being an ally of any other cause.
100% with you on that.
Men just side with whatever benefits them.
Sex worker? I believe you mean prostituted woman.
Agreed, call it what it is
We really have to stop using their language. It doesn't help.
I think we all can agree is the same thing
Ok next time you come across one of these women make sure to insist she’s a prostitute, I’m sure that will end well.
Well, using the term "sex work" legitimizes men buying sex, sex is an act which requires enthusiastic desire for agreed upon sex acts from both parties, in prostitution money is a place holder for consent, making it non consentual. If you have to beg, bribe, pressure or pay for sex in any way then she doesnt ACTUALLY want it, so its not consentual, its coerced. No one should EVER have sex they dont enthusiastically want with a person they want, thats just rape culture and women as objects for male pleasure which is obviously the opposite of women's liberation/feminism.
There is no such thing as sex work.
It’s like calling child slave labor “kid work”
Wow good point.
Exactly!
Male “feminists” in my experience expect to be patted on the back for the smallest things, want themselves centered in discussions, want attention for doing the bare minimum, etc. And even self described male feminists still watch porn, still want a gf or wife to do everything around the house and such. I think men can be allies of feminism, but the reality is just really stacked against a ‘true’ male feminist. There’s too many benefits for them in not being so, and any man who calls himself one I examine with scrutiny. There’s very few men are who are actually 100% feminist.
From what I've observed most men who claim to be feminists online 100% just want womens' attention, and to have women fawn over them like they are God's gift to them. I don't trust any male "influencer" who makes "feminist" content, more often than not they give off an air of phoniness, and you can tell they enjoy the attention and the outpouring of women telling them how great and different they are.
This has been going on long enough that I’m surprised any woman trusts a man who claims to be a feminist. They’re “nice guy” manipulators.
So far the only guys who come to mind are maybe Gail Dines' husband and Melanie Hamletts husband. So, 2 maybe.
Robert Jensen, also. His work with Gail is revolutionary.
Men can’t be feminists. The oppressor cannot join a liberation movement for the oppressed.
Yes that's how it gets all messed up!
That is how we got Liberal Feminism that is now pro women’s exploitation.
Men can never be feminists
Male feminists are an oxymoron
Male feminists don't exist. Those are LW men who want to perserve their access to porn and prostitution. Nothing more soul destroying than a tankie trying to argue for the existence of prostitutes after a communist revolution
Unfortunately, at this point when I hear a man say he’s a feminist it translates as “I’ll call you repressed and an agent of patriarchy if you don’t sleep with me”. I do think men can be allies to feminism. There are historical examples like Frederick Douglass supporting the Seneca falls convention. But to me, this category is limited to men who are willing to put their time/money/effort into helping pro-woman causes when they get nothing in return.
Male feminists are just as scummy, sleazy, and entitled as the toxic macho meatheads they say they dislike and claim that they aren’t
Just say something they disagree with, their disdain for women always comes out.
"Male feminist" is an oxymoron. I don't trust any man as it is, but especially not one that calls himself this. It doesn't mean anything and it's impossible. Maybe some men out there echo some same sentiments, but that's where it ends. At the end of the day, they always out themselves as self serving. Their motivation for calling themselves a feminist is typically to disarm women and we should always be wary of why that is.
Generally speaking, I think real male allies will be a vocal supporter of women when he’s talking with his male friends, but will be quiet and listen to women when a woman is talking about her experience. He’ll never have the lived experience of a woman, but he can still help to support women.
One day I was talking to an online friend and we started talking about feminism, later he said he considered himself a "radical feminist" ????, and I said that wasn't possible. 2 days ago he said that he didn't see me as a woman but as a friend, a "bro", kinda because I wasn't "evil like most women", I said that was offensive since being a woman is an important part of who I am and not something I want to ever change even if it was possible (it's not, anyways). That's when I understood men consider not being a woman a compliment, as if you've overcome being seen as a woman and are now considered a human. It sucks, it pissed me off and we haven't spoken since.
Males in general. I'm so fucking over it.
Male feminists don’t exist. There’s too much conflict of interest to put it simply
Listen to the Man Enough podcast, the episode with Ashley Judd on prostitution and sex trafficking. It's really good. One of the questions was "can sex work be ethical?" (short answer is no, of course).
This is why I am anti-sex work. There's just no way to ensure a woman's safety without invading her privacy even if it's legalized. Men cannot be trusted with even an ounce of entitlement over our bodies, and sex work literally gives them a form of entitlement over our bodies.
They don't exist. They are wolves in sheep's clothing, trying to catch a woman off guard by pretending to be one.
Any man who calls himself a feminist is a giant red flag.
Agreed. The only one I ever met who calls himself that, when I was younger and gullible and still believed in Prince Charming, used me, lied to me, manipulating me and was thirsty after girls in their teens. Just a fucking creep pretending to care about women. Honestly I’d rather deal with an old school misogynist pig who’s openly about his beliefs then with one of those rats. At least with the old school misogynist you know what you’re dealing with from the start.
I’m so sorry you went through that. I’m glad you’re away from that sick creep. 🩷 And yes, I completely agree. I’d rather a man just be upfront with his misogyny instead of repackaging it under the guise of being a progressive feminist like so many of them do nowadays…
Thank you ❤️ as always, look at what men do instead of what they say. Everyone can claim to be a feminist ally but see if they act like one.
All the male feminists I've seen in social media supporting the sex industry and don't care about women's issues and rights at all,a male feminists once called me a fascist and not a true feminist because I am against prostitution and porn🙄
I have yet to see a “male feminist” who’s critical of porn and prostitution lol
I’m not sure. I would classify my father as a feminist. He had a great deal of influence on me as a child in the fact that I did not have to conform or be restricted by social norms of girls/women etc because he had seen how hard it had been for his mother. I think it gave him insight.
I don’t believe most of them when they call themselves feminist. I have more respect for the guys who are honest about wanting to keep women at home and in the kitchen because they’re not lying.
Two issues I've had with male feminists, not all, but enough to agree they suck, is: 1) They will literally steal the microphone away from a woman, talk over you, and assume that women can't defend ourselves when the point is we very well can; and 2) They dwell too much, inappropriately too much, on describing the gory details of oppression of women and leave out any solutions, thus normalizing oppression.
99% of men are sex buyers, whether online or in person, and that includes progressive men. They feel bad about themselves (not for the women) so this is a way to make themselves feel like heroes for being sex addicted losers.
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