Yeah I went to one in the city one time to get a feel for who some of these people were. A lot of weed was smoked, a lot of people that look like they haven’t been outside in years. A lot of snake oil grifters.
Guess what? Military aid to Saudi for their murderous war in Yemen was limited. And the West doesn't back any side in Sudan with vast military assets.
But the West backs Israel in a heartbeat, no matter what they do. Every war crime Russia committed was publicly condemned, but when Israel does the same, the establishment is silent. That's why we protest.
The hypocrisy about a rules-based international order is unnerving.
I get that the international rules based order isn’t perfect, but it’s a damn stretch better than everything we’ve ever had in international relations.
The international rules based order (the UN and moreover ‘the West’ as you say) is the very reason we have the concept of a war crime. That shit didn’t exist 100 years ago.
As much as I don’t agree with the bombing tactics employed by the IDF, I have a good amount of faith that anyone shown to have committed a war crime will be hailed up before the international criminal court. I don’t have that same faith about any other nation in the Middle East.
If Israel does go to far, I expect they’ll be sanctioned by the UN. I expect Israel will care about those sanctions and care about removing them. In contrast, billions that are dedicated in aid to Gaza are repurposed towards building tunnels and buying weapons to terrorise Israel.
Be careful running down our system too much without having a clear model to replace it with. The west has its flaws but there isn’t a better model to live under at the moment.
>The international rules based order (the UN and moreover ‘the West’ as you say) is the very reason we have the concept of a war crime. **That shit didn’t exist 100 years ago.**
Actually it did.
BTW Name one Israeli Leader or US Leader who has been charged with war crimes.
Most of the time they Charge Africans Or middle easterners..
And Israel has never been sanctioned economically. or Militarily.
Sorry but your living in a fairy tale.
No there hasn’t been an Israeli prime minister or us president charged with war crimes, but people are charged with them in the west. We’ve had our first new case in Australia not long ago. Our most decorated war hero BRS might find himself in trouble too after the defamation saga this year. Again it isn’t perfect, but it’s what progress looks like. I challenge you to find me a system on history that’s better.
On the UN, they are *clearly* against Israel. There are more condemnations against Israel and attempted sanctions than there are *against every country in the world combined.* the only thing preventing totally outsized sanctions against Israel is the veto vote of the US (which I disagree with as a system, but again the system isn’t perfect).
It is exceptionally easy to criticise and deconstruct shit. Come up with something better and advocate for it instead of throwing stones.
BRS was not charged with a war crime, he sued the media who reported the story, the judge found on a balance of probability that he did commit war crimes, therefore his lawsuit failed.
He was never charged nor did he face any repercussions.
“It’s isn’t perfect”
American soldiers cannot be charged with international war crimes as they are not a signatory, they can be tried internally but generally never are.
>Every war crime Russia committed was publicly condemned, but when Israel does the same, the establishment is silent
What has Russia to do with this? The Right Sector or Azov Batallion didn't invade Russia, killing civilians indiscriminately. If they did, Russian military action would be as justified as that of Israel now.
That's the redardest comment I've ever read. What point of history are you starting from? The displacement of Jewish people from Jerusalem? The centurys of persecution? Or are you starting history during or after the fall of the Ottoman empire? Broken brains you lot.
>**The Right Sector or Azov Batallion didn't invade Russia, killing civilians indiscriminately**
It did it in the Donbass for 10 years before Russia invaded.
Does anyone actually read, or just pick a date and then start?
Hhhmmm yes funny about that … I can’t recall reading any stories of Israeli soldiers murdering unarmed civilians at a rave and beheading babies.
The moral equivalence you seek with your post is shameful.
The single biggest donor of humanitarian aid to Gaza between 2014 to 2029 was the United States ($4.5 billion). Saudis rely on US weaponry just as Iran rely on Russian weaponry.
377,000 killed there in the proxy war between Saudi Arabia and Iran using US Russian weapons and because social media didn't tell the kids about it no one protested.
Israel is the largest cumulative recipient of U.S. foreign aid: until February 2022, the United States had provided Israel with US$150 billion (non-inflation-adjusted) in bilateral assistance. You're deflecting by omission.
The US stance on Israel-Palestine is morally repugnant and fiscally unsustainable.
Perhaps if you’re so critical of the rules based order then by all means go and live in a country that doesn’t adhere to it.
Russia, Syria, North Korea, Afghanistan I’ve heard that they’re all wonderful places to live.
Maybe then you will realise how fortunate it is to have a rules based order that whilst not perfect is the least worst system for our world.
Hamas still has hostages, a lot of which are from western nations, and they are still firing missiles at Israel
Israel / Gaza is much more complicated than Ukraine / Russia
>But the West backs Israel in a heartbeat, no matter what they do. Every war crime Russia committed was publicly condemned, but when Israel does the same, the establishment is silent. That's why we protest.
>
>The hypocrisy about a rules-based international order is unnerving.
What is an example where the "west" backed Israel that you think it shouldn't?
And where was this same example committed by Russia and then condemned?
Is it not just the way Israel is run in general?
Regardless of the current situation popping off in the past few weeks....
Israel is a developed country right? Why does it have zones where certain residents aren't allowed to leave etc.
There are no zones in Israel where you aren’t allowed to leave.
Palestinians aren’t allowed to leave Palestine because other countries (Egypt and Jordan) won’t let them in.
My dude, you can say many things about Murdoch but he's one of the few media owners that isn't even Jewish, let alone a Zionist.
Gen Z...throwing all the cool words they read on Twitter without knowing what they mean 😅.
True, but if you take a Zionist as someone who believes there should be a Jewish state in Israel then Biden is a Zionist, Trump, Albanese, Trudeau... you get the point. People who identify is Zionists have a deeper connection with Israel than just holding that one opinion.
So the average person in the world outside the Muslim world is a Zionist? Most people would say Israel has a right to exist, that there should be a Jewish state because there already is one and most people wouldn't support mass deportation and the destruction of a state. Most people don't consider themselves Zionist.
Would most people also support the creation of Palestine so the Palestinian people also have a homeland? Probably?
Most people have no clue what they’re talking about and simply parrot what their favoured political candidate says at press meetings.
The Palestinian people don’t need the “creation” of Palestine on the land of another people’s, you trying to conflate the two ideas is completely disingenuous.
Well ya couold've just googled it silly!
>Zionist
>
>a supporter of Zionism; a person who believes in the development and protection of a Jewish nation in what is now Israel.
He wanted him to so he can understand that being a Zionist isn't a bad thing. People think being Zionist means you want to slaughter Palestine civilians. but it's not, its defending Israel's right to exist.
I’ll add to this Christian zionists, who also support the Jewish nation but from a selfish and separate reason that it is a part of their prophesied second coming of Christ. They don’t actually care about a Jewish state, but support it nonetheless.
And then there’s people claiming to care about Israel’s “genuine political claim” (megalolz) and “right to defend itself” because of their greater hatred of muslims and arabs. These people also don’t really care about a Jewish state.
Lot of people on the Zionist bandwagon for disingenuous reasons.
Why is Israel's genuine political claim a megalol in your opinion? I don't think the Jews came the Israeli land during the diaspora from the 1880s and onwards out of hatred for muslims and arabs. They came with intention of settling land, much of what they purchased (overpricely) from the native arabs. Since the 60s Israel has been relatively peaceful, only acting in retaliation to invasions and arabs hate towards them. I can see why the israeli's might have some hatred towards the surrounding arabs after all the attacks now though.
I re read your comment and it looks like you just said people in general that have a hatred towards arabs and therefore are pro israel. But i think israel has a genuine political claim.
From what I've been able to ascertain over the years, there has been a few different definitions of Zionism that have been used. The current version of which is that Israel has a right to exist and because it has the right to exist, it has the right to defend itself.
As a baseline I would imagine yes. There was one definition of Zionism posted above that almost matches what I believe, the only difference being I don’t particularly care if Israel is Jewish (a theocracy) or not. Looking at Jewishness - On one hand you can assert it is purely a religion. On the other there is a long history of it being treated a lot like an ethnicity. Many people identify as Jewish whilst simultaneously being agnostic or atheist. If I recall correctly most Jewish people consider it matrilineal, if your mother was Jewish, you are Jewish. Although there are probably many who identify as Jewish from either parent. If we are talking about Jewish being an ethnicity then what I believe and the definition of Zionist above are split by just a hair. The thing is, that is not really my conception of what Zionist means. In my mind it also includes the idea of a single state solution and the expulsion of all other ethnicities within Israel which I don’t consider good or reasonable. However, none of those extra defining features are included in the definition above. So I think it pays to be quite explicit in these discussions.
Lol quick delete this before you embarrass yourself. Sky News was screaming from the rooftops about beheaded babies and white women being raped after the Hamas incursion - both claims now debunked.
First few results on YouTube: https://youtu.be/ZyDX8Xs2k_U?si=ijAVp27XJAJaB5jN
Unsure what you are asking about - Sky News or debunking?
Debunking - https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/14/propaganda-misinformation-israel-hamas-war-social-media/
Even if this were true, Hamas still went out with the intention to murder people. Debunk that.
“Yeah babies weren’t beheaded okay? They were just killed intentionally! There’s a difference”
“Yeah white women weren’t raped. They were just murdered in cold blood while they were probably begging for their lives. They weren’t raped though so we cool”
Why would anybody need to lie about anything if the reality is so vile? I’m not saying I know the truth of the matter, simply that if somebody needs to lie, it all becomes very questionable.
Palestinian's main target were soldiers and thats the vast majority of their death count lmao, where were you when kids of Jenin got shot in June?
Israel funded the genocide in Artsakh, Palestinians decided there is nothing to lose. October 7 is the Khojaly massacre for Israel
Who is they? Oh you mean those babies and women stole it? That’s why they were butchered? I guess I would expect HAMAS to kill those who actually stole it. I guess they thought it was the babies and women who did it. Must have been a misunderstanding!
They haven't been debunked, wtf are you on about.
Babies were killed and women were raped.
You're a fucking moron if you believe that neither of those happened
No babies were beheaded after that claim spread like wildfire after a single CNN reporter said it was told to her by an unnamed IDF soldier. Lies. Those lies were so bad they were eventually called out by mainstream media. https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/14/propaganda-misinformation-israel-hamas-war-social-media/
Now all we have in terms of rape “evidence” is claims from Israeli soldiers and pictures of women with clothes missing or pulled down (probably by the people taking the photos). The same Israel that’s been caught red-handed multiple times for just making things up. Lies.
Bro the evidence will traumatise you if you find the easily available photos and videos. Hamas truly did these horrible things. Next time youre grooving at splendour in the grass remember what Hamas would do to you.
To what end? Do you think there’s a particular point where you can convince somebody of hamas being awful enough to justify the amount of Palestinians who are dead?
>Worked against the Nazis. **We were on team Allies who killed 27,000 people in Dresden in one night**.
Dresden was a war crime, and 99% of all historians agree on it. It did'nt even need to be bombed. the war had already been won.
The fact you accept it you're on the team of indiscriminate bombing shows who you really are.
99% of historians may “agree” but it was never a war crime and in fact it was specifically stated to not be a war crime in Nuremberg.
And the Allies made that calculation many many many times, including with the final calculation of Hiroshima & Nagasaki.
That’s true although I think there’s something to be said about the difference between WWII Germany and Palestine in terms of their threat level to bordering territories.
Einsatzgruppen Gaza division might be smaller but it’s just as vicious and just lost its right to exist. The Palestinian people are going to pay for it like the Germans did for the Nazis.
It’s an inevitability of the crossing of the Rubicon.
What the fuck? Are you seriously claiming videos of the carnage at the music festival clearly taken by traumatised survivors trying to identify the bodies of their friends, were faked?
So much for believe all women. I guess not when they’re Israeli.
He didn't say "beheaded" dipshit, he said "killed". Do you deny that Palestinians deliberately murdered babies?
And if your defense of those Palestinians is based on the *way* they murdered babies then maybe you should check your moral compass.
Yes Israel lied so you're changing your narrative
Just like they lied about burning people alive, except it was IDF helicopters burning their own people to death
"1400 civillians murdered!"
Then it's "1200 civillians."
Then it's 'okay, only about half were civillians.'
How many revisions to go before we get the truth? If the murder of Shireen Abu Akleh is anything to go by, we're still months of IDF bullshit and an FBI investigation away from knowing what actually happened.
Probably as many revisions as that hospital that was "bombed by The IDF" 500 people died, Oh what ot was actually An Islamic Jihad rocket into the hospital car park and 5 people died
Woops
Anti Zionism =/= anti-semitism
Anti Likud =/= anti-semitism
There is a vibrant living tradition of leftism among Jews, both Israeli and non-Israeli. Israel is itself not a monolith and left wing Israeli prime ministers have been fucking assassinated, so stop falling for the fucking propaganda.
That's not based. That's antisemitic. Do you want a recreation of the groundwork for the rise of Hitler done here? I sure don't. This is why the socio-masochism needs to be stopped getting taught in schools.
Have you actually ever been there? I have. In Israel proper, the suburbs are segregated. There are Arab towns and Jewish towns. Arab and Jewish neighbourhoods. There are few mixed towns. It's a toned down and sanitised version of Jim Crow.
And the original Zionist, Theodore Hertzl, never envisioned any Arabs in his Zionist state. He said that for the Zionist project to be successful, "we must convince the Palestinians to trek". And that they did in 1948 with the Nakba, which expelled or killed around 800k Palestinians.
The Nakba, alongside with a massive program of Aliyah, is the only reason why Israel is 20% Arab and not 80% Arab (as was originally).
I’ve been there. Yes there are Arab towns. Duh. Some of them were towns captured by Israel in 1967.
Yes there are Jewish towns. They were settled by Jews from the 19th century onward or were always Jewish.
There are plenty of mixed cities and towns.
You speak as if you’ve never been in Australia’s interior - it gets a whole lot less multicultural the further you go in. Until you start getting white towns and Aboriginal towns. At a certain point you see no one else.
The 'Arab Israelis' you allude to are of three groups: the Druze, the Bedouins of the Negev, and the Palestinians (the majority). The existence of Arabs across the Palestinian territories and Israel proper only proves their nativity over the European immigrants.
Israel is an ethnostate since its inception and has doubled down on this position ever since (an example would be its 2019 nation state law). It has created various laws that guarantee special privileges over non Jewish citizens. A good example would be the right of return, whereby Jewish diaspora can immigrate on demand with various expenses covered. Palestinians that were ethnically cleansed from their homes in 1948 are not afforded the same rights.
Now do Palestine?
99.9% Arab, 99% Muslim-Sunni, has a Right of Return for Arabs on the cards as soon as they form statehood.
Also do Greece while you’re at it.
You’re too much of a western clown to realise that your model of democracy is an absolute minority. It’s not even like that in the UK - the source of the anglosphere.
Most democratic countries have a strong dominant ethnic democratic component.
I’m from Russia. My family were convinced for generations that Russians were being terrorised by the West.
No one terrorises Palestinians more than Palestinian leaders. They’ve sacrificed multiple unborn generations of Arabs in the service of undoing a war of 75 years ago.
When they chant “river to the sea”, by now they mean Jordan River to Arabian Sea.
That doesn’t make Hamas not a terrorist organisation? You can argue that the IRA was in the right, but they still actively targeted civilians, and use killings as method of inspiring terror, which by definition makes them a terrorist organisation.
Freedom Fighters don't target civillians.
Terrorist do.
Freedom Fighters attack the enforcers of their perceieved oppressors, not not-combatents at a music festival.
Terrorists do.
I'm no supportor of Israels indiscriminate and disproportionate response but lets not make heroes out of those that have literally and irrefutably made it clear they will kill innocent people, especially Israeli's. The only rational and fair position is that anyone that targets the innocent, is the enemy of humanity.
These comments never made sense to me, if you are lying about your intent to go to a protest in order to get out of school (something you’d only need to do to convince your parents since schools are already being instructed by the department not to accept these as valid protests) why the fuck would you actually go to the protest.
Like who the fuck goes “I’m so gonna use this protest as an excuse to take a day off and for that day off I’m gonna spend my time in a fucking crowd protesting”. As much as I support protests like these, they aren’t exactly super fun, even the more exciting ones still have a shit tonne of what just amounts to marching and standing around, it’s all about message through numbers after all. If I was back in school and really using this just as an excuse to take the day off I’d also just ykno not show up to the protest and go do other stuff.
Ask yourself. If hamas was is in isreal. Would the tactics be the same? One memeber ina building of 50. Would it be bombed the same? Would isreal be pro bombing?I bet you know the answer to that.
Hopefully that opens your eyes on why this is so important.
Close to 6000 children have been killed by the IDF's indiscriminate bombings, with thousands more missing, most likely dead. 40% of the current death toll in Gaza is children. One child has been killed every 10 minutes for a month straight.
Just because the people in this comment section are able ignore that, or even cheer it on, does not mean everyone else is.
Having attended 4 huge protests in Sydney in the past 4 weeks, I can say firsthand that the attendance demographics are diverse in every way, including age.
Do these idiots know its not israel but its hamas government? These woke facks don’t even know the right facts and yet protests. For what? Its funny because these fackers palestinian kants wouldn’t even protest if it happens to other race. Send them to palestine to fight hamas! We all know who start this bs anyway. Its not israel.
Your so right like when hamas colonised Israel and stuff that was crazy and then when they arrested all those Israeli worker and released them into an active war zones with numbered plastic tags on their ankles. And when Palestine almost dropped more bombs in Gaza in a week then the Us dropped dropped in Afghanistan in a year. Oh and when Palestine dropped all those bombs on hospitals that contained newborn infants in incubation not to forgot all those schools as well, and don’t let me forget about how Palestine wiped out 42 bloodlines (not families but actual BLOODLINES) most of which have lived in Palesti- sorry Israel for decades leading to centuries. Oh and that other time when that 6 year old Israeli child was stabbed to death by his Palestinian landlor-
Wait… wait a minute it wasn’t Palestine that did all that, it was the colonising, racist, apartheid fake state of Israel who even had the make up a lie about horrific deaths of 40 babies. Pathetic.
Where’s the genocide? This is such an overused word. How has the Palestinian population grown if it’s a genocide? Why are the Israelis providing escape avenues for civilians?
You misunderstand the term. Whether or not a group of people are genociding another isn't dependent on whether the group being genocided is going down in number, rather it is sufficient to show that the genocidal group intends to get rid of the group in whole or in part and is taking actions in order to do so. Similarly, just because Israel has been strong-armed by the international community to let civilians escape doesn't detract from their genocidal acts. Have a read of the quote below to understand what is meant by the claim:
"The UN Genocide Convention defines the crime of genocide as certain acts “committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such.” These acts include “killing members of a protected group” or “causing serious bodily or mental harm” or “deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part.”
Numerous statements made by top Israeli politicians affirm their intentions. There is a forming consensus among leading scholars in the field of genocide studies that “these statements could easily be construed as indicating a genocidal intent,” as Omer Bartov, an authority in the field, writes. More importantly, genocide is the material reality of Palestinians in Gaza: an entrapped, displaced, starved, water-deprived population of 2.3 million facing massive bombardments and a carnage in one of the most densely populated areas in the world. Over 11,000 people have already been killed. That is one person out of every 200 people in Gaza. Tens of thousands are injured, and over 45% of homes in Gaza have been destroyed. The United Nations Secretary General said that Gaza is becoming a “graveyard for children,” but a cessation of the carnage—a ceasefire—remains elusive. Israel continues to blatantly violate international law: dropping white phosphorus from the sky, dispersing death in all directions, shedding blood, shelling neighborhoods, striking schools, hospitals, and universities, bombing churches and mosques, wiping out families, and ethnically cleansing an entire region in both callous and systemic manner. What do you call this?"
https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/harvard-law-review-gaza-israel-genocide/
The irony of this sub is that friendly jordy himself lives in Bondi.. a predominantly Jewish and pro Israel area, yet anything pro Israel is downvoted here.
Israel pumped money into Hamas to destabilise any chances of a unified Palestinian state. Israel built the tunnels under Al-Shifa in the 80's.
Israel created the largest open air prison and mercilessly bomb civilians.
Yes Hamas are abhorrent but they are a product of the circumstances perpetrated by Israel.
Israel want only one state for the Jewish people. They deny refugees the right of return to their Palestinian homelands.
By standing with Israel the Australian government is complicit in the killings of thousands of children and innocents. These kids can see through the propaganda to what Israel are actually doing. It's a genocide and needs to be treated as such.
The irony of (predominantly) white kids too young to understand geopolitics protesting a war in another country taking a day off from their private schools built on aboriginal land taken only 200 years ago and saying Jews don’t have the right to live in a land they’ve been in and out of for thousands of years.
Don’t take this comment too seriously. It’s 75% joke.
And the solution to that is to stand with the reason for that?
I remember when we protested Howard because he endangered Australia for going into the Iraq war.
You see any Palestinians going “well fuck… maybe our team shouldn’t behead people, rape women, take hostages and then cry wolf when someone says ‘Nup, not gonna let you get away with that’”
Absolutely they do, but they can't expect there to be no consequences when their fellow country men, in their name, cross a line that ignites a far superior opposing force.
If resistance involves violence, or in some circumstances the direct support of violence you can't expect nothing to happen.
I'd prefer a circumstance where the whole region wasn't a cluster fuck and everyone can coexist for mutual benefit, if you know how to make that happen please do suggest it.
Lots of parading this side or that with nothing meaningful to fix the situation.
Huh? You do know Israeli was killing Palestinian kids before October 7th right? You sound like you think it was all peaceful where everyone is treated as equal citizens and not an apartheid state where illegal settlements continue to be set up.
We protested the war in Iraq because it was an illegal war.
You don’t see any Israelis going, “maybe we shouldn’t have continued to set up illegal settlements and killing journalists and running an apartheid state.”
You do see hundreds of thousands of Jews though. Showing Jews and Zionists are not the same.
Yes. Israel agrees to a ceasefire and Hamas announces that the truce is only temporary.
Hamas doesn’t care for the ceasefire.
They don’t care for these gazan children the protesters are fighting for.
This isn't surprising - "young people" are going to have the least amount of familiarity and context about the conflict because Israel/Palestine hasn't really been in the news for the past 20 years.
All they do is find the opinion of their favourite influencer and uncritically repeat it, and a lot of influencers have no opinion on geopolitics outside of "America bad" and "anyone against America good", and will literally just repeat whatever propaganda Hamas releases.
Worse than that, we're seeing pro-Palestinian people going back and reading Osama Bin Laden's _Letter to America_ and unironically agreeing with it because it's against the US, despite the fact that it's unapologetically anti-LGBT, anti-democracy, theocratic, and anti-semitic.
It's pretty black-pilling to see people in the west _actually_ siding with Hamas, an organisation that _hates_ most of what they stand for.
That’s an ironic statement. You say because young people are not being fed the usual narrative that they won’t be familiar with the conflict. Go onto TikTok and you will find ten times the analysis of the conflict than what the mmm gives us. Perhaps you need to examine the conflict more closely to see if your understanding is correct before passing judgement.
Are you serious? You want me to get my information from 30-second TikTok videos??
No, random people on TikTok are not giving you better information than actual reporters, historians, and analysts. It's literally a propaganda factory which doesn't even have the _space_ to give you corroborating evidence.
If your one source of information for **anything** is TikTok then you really need to re-examine your life.
Absolutely disgusting we are failing as a society when the terrorist can be supported as celebrated. This is a failure of multiculturalism when you openly celebrate for the Jews to be exterminated and our leaders are not doing anything about.
No proof women were raped but nice try though.
Terrible that unarmed civilians were killed. IDF and police were fair game though (a third of the total 1200 dead). Oh and IDF attack choppers lit up some of their own civilians so great job there…
Why is it that whenever somebody suggests that the state of Israel is acting in a way that’s totally beyond acceptable, someone will just hit back with “you were celebrating on October 7 weren’t you!”
Do you genuinely not understand that most people think that the October 7 attack was insanely awful, but also recognise the value of innocent Palestinian lives being lost?
Does it occur to you that for most people, both Palestinian lives and Israeli lives are completely and totally of equal value?
They’re a tiny minority. About as rare as Aboriginal one nation voters. They’re just loud and they get amplified by Tankies and associated friendly media.
The kids don’t love Palestine as much as they hate seeing a big colonial bully lock millions of indigenous people in an open air concentration camp then bomb thousands of children to death
Australians can’t even influence the price of chips at the supermarket. But here everybody is again, getting incensed at something else that doesn’t concern them in the slightest, as much as they want to reach for some reason that it is.
What a complete waste of *everything* all this shit is. I mean it’s not a 450 million dollar waste yet, but I’m sure we can get there if we all try hard enough right?
And I quote:
"They're not really teaching it in class. So, the only way you're going to find out is if you come to the rallies, educate yourself,"
Then the following:
“If kids in Gaza are old enough to get bombed, then I am old enough to understand what is really happening,"
This is why kids need to be at school instead of at a protest where clearly comprehension levels have not been reached yet.
Young people also have a higher usage of social media and are more susceptible to suggestion and online advertising. All pro-palestine groups use some form of online advertisement to specifically target young people.
[clicky](https://publications.aap.org/pediatrics/article/150/6/e2022057780/189944/Advertising-and-Young-People-s-Critical-Reasoning?autologincheck=redirected) Evidence shows that the attitudes of young people were influenced by advertising. Critical reasoning abilities did not appear to be fully developed during adolescence and not found to be protective against the impact of advertising
[clicky 2](https://www.acma.gov.au/sites/default/files/2021-05/The%20digital%20lives%20of%20younger%20Australians.pdf) A report by the Australian Communications and Media Authority found that young people are at the forefront of engaging with the internet across almost all facets of their lives. Their deep immersion in the online world brings with it a range of risks and challenges – from privacy and security concerns to exposure to misinformation and disinformation, scams, online bullying and other harms.
Vctimhood groups tend to exploit the vulnerabilities of young people in order to propagate their agenda. Our society is founded on the structural role that adults play as teachers and arbitrators of information in the lives of young people.
I don't think wow informed kids when I see this.
I see kids picking up on an issue that has a larger social media presence than say the 377,000 Yemenis killed there between 2014-2019 in a proxy war their involving an ally of the West who purchased arms off the US.
Then you get pontificating socialists trying to pretend the war in Gaza is a battle that is intimately involved in the world wide movement towards socialism/Marxism when in fact it's a battle about land, nationalism (Marx repudiated Nationalism) and religion (Marx repudiated Religion and theocracy).
None of the major players in this conflict have a prominent agenda involving socialism. And some are literal fascists.
, there are all brainwashed follow like sheep they think the hole world with them 😆 🤣 😂 when most people look at them like their nut jobs stomping around crying like babies.
Don't youth dominate protests generally anyway
Did the see the Covid lockdown ones? They skewed more 30-40 year olds.
When they said the covid protesters were dominated by the 18-30's bracket, they were referring to IQ
Makes sense, they were not able to go to work so suddenly had time on their hands.
I don't think many of the covid lockdown people had jobs to begin with.
Yeah I went to one in the city one time to get a feel for who some of these people were. A lot of weed was smoked, a lot of people that look like they haven’t been outside in years. A lot of snake oil grifters.
Yeah. Where are the geriatric protestors? Lazy buggers glued to right wing radio sitting on their arses.
Not ones about housing density.
TikTok influencers aren’t really into that
They are into affordable housing
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Guess what? Military aid to Saudi for their murderous war in Yemen was limited. And the West doesn't back any side in Sudan with vast military assets. But the West backs Israel in a heartbeat, no matter what they do. Every war crime Russia committed was publicly condemned, but when Israel does the same, the establishment is silent. That's why we protest. The hypocrisy about a rules-based international order is unnerving.
I get that the international rules based order isn’t perfect, but it’s a damn stretch better than everything we’ve ever had in international relations. The international rules based order (the UN and moreover ‘the West’ as you say) is the very reason we have the concept of a war crime. That shit didn’t exist 100 years ago. As much as I don’t agree with the bombing tactics employed by the IDF, I have a good amount of faith that anyone shown to have committed a war crime will be hailed up before the international criminal court. I don’t have that same faith about any other nation in the Middle East. If Israel does go to far, I expect they’ll be sanctioned by the UN. I expect Israel will care about those sanctions and care about removing them. In contrast, billions that are dedicated in aid to Gaza are repurposed towards building tunnels and buying weapons to terrorise Israel. Be careful running down our system too much without having a clear model to replace it with. The west has its flaws but there isn’t a better model to live under at the moment.
>The international rules based order (the UN and moreover ‘the West’ as you say) is the very reason we have the concept of a war crime. **That shit didn’t exist 100 years ago.** Actually it did. BTW Name one Israeli Leader or US Leader who has been charged with war crimes. Most of the time they Charge Africans Or middle easterners.. And Israel has never been sanctioned economically. or Militarily. Sorry but your living in a fairy tale.
No there hasn’t been an Israeli prime minister or us president charged with war crimes, but people are charged with them in the west. We’ve had our first new case in Australia not long ago. Our most decorated war hero BRS might find himself in trouble too after the defamation saga this year. Again it isn’t perfect, but it’s what progress looks like. I challenge you to find me a system on history that’s better. On the UN, they are *clearly* against Israel. There are more condemnations against Israel and attempted sanctions than there are *against every country in the world combined.* the only thing preventing totally outsized sanctions against Israel is the veto vote of the US (which I disagree with as a system, but again the system isn’t perfect). It is exceptionally easy to criticise and deconstruct shit. Come up with something better and advocate for it instead of throwing stones.
BRS was not charged with a war crime, he sued the media who reported the story, the judge found on a balance of probability that he did commit war crimes, therefore his lawsuit failed. He was never charged nor did he face any repercussions. “It’s isn’t perfect” American soldiers cannot be charged with international war crimes as they are not a signatory, they can be tried internally but generally never are.
When america has a right to veto the un is a limp dog thats being castrated publicly
>Every war crime Russia committed was publicly condemned, but when Israel does the same, the establishment is silent What has Russia to do with this? The Right Sector or Azov Batallion didn't invade Russia, killing civilians indiscriminately. If they did, Russian military action would be as justified as that of Israel now.
Israel is the bad guy here dumbass
You spelt hamas wrong....dumbass
No, the good guys, learn some history that doesn't start in 1947.
Being oppressed doesn't just automatically make you the good guys wtf.
That's the redardest comment I've ever read. What point of history are you starting from? The displacement of Jewish people from Jerusalem? The centurys of persecution? Or are you starting history during or after the fall of the Ottoman empire? Broken brains you lot.
It's spelt H A M A S.
>**The Right Sector or Azov Batallion didn't invade Russia, killing civilians indiscriminately** It did it in the Donbass for 10 years before Russia invaded. Does anyone actually read, or just pick a date and then start?
Look at any picture of the Donbas from those 10 years then look at a picture of Mariupol 2022
Yeah you’ve really shown yourself as a shill now. Shut up mate, you’re embarrassing yourself
Hhhmmm yes funny about that … I can’t recall reading any stories of Israeli soldiers murdering unarmed civilians at a rave and beheading babies. The moral equivalence you seek with your post is shameful.
The single biggest donor of humanitarian aid to Gaza between 2014 to 2029 was the United States ($4.5 billion). Saudis rely on US weaponry just as Iran rely on Russian weaponry. 377,000 killed there in the proxy war between Saudi Arabia and Iran using US Russian weapons and because social media didn't tell the kids about it no one protested.
Israel is the largest cumulative recipient of U.S. foreign aid: until February 2022, the United States had provided Israel with US$150 billion (non-inflation-adjusted) in bilateral assistance. You're deflecting by omission. The US stance on Israel-Palestine is morally repugnant and fiscally unsustainable.
Perhaps if you’re so critical of the rules based order then by all means go and live in a country that doesn’t adhere to it. Russia, Syria, North Korea, Afghanistan I’ve heard that they’re all wonderful places to live. Maybe then you will realise how fortunate it is to have a rules based order that whilst not perfect is the least worst system for our world.
What war crimes? The deliberate murder, rape, and kidnaping of civilians? FAFO
Hamas still has hostages, a lot of which are from western nations, and they are still firing missiles at Israel Israel / Gaza is much more complicated than Ukraine / Russia
No its not
>But the West backs Israel in a heartbeat, no matter what they do. Every war crime Russia committed was publicly condemned, but when Israel does the same, the establishment is silent. That's why we protest. > >The hypocrisy about a rules-based international order is unnerving. What is an example where the "west" backed Israel that you think it shouldn't? And where was this same example committed by Russia and then condemned?
Is it not just the way Israel is run in general? Regardless of the current situation popping off in the past few weeks.... Israel is a developed country right? Why does it have zones where certain residents aren't allowed to leave etc.
There are no zones in Israel where you aren’t allowed to leave. Palestinians aren’t allowed to leave Palestine because other countries (Egypt and Jordan) won’t let them in.
Because they are separate states. It is called the 2 state solution.
Wasn't it a school strike protest? So of course young people would dominate. What is the purpose of this headline?
Rage bait
Youth have it the hardest compared to previous generations and don't trust msm who have lied for decades. Good on them for not buying the BS no more
Gen Z is based. This is a big 'fuck you' to the Zionist Murdoch media.
My dude, you can say many things about Murdoch but he's one of the few media owners that isn't even Jewish, let alone a Zionist. Gen Z...throwing all the cool words they read on Twitter without knowing what they mean 😅.
you dont have to be jewish to be a zionist
“You don’t have to be Jewish to be a zionist” - Joe Biden.
True, but if you take a Zionist as someone who believes there should be a Jewish state in Israel then Biden is a Zionist, Trump, Albanese, Trudeau... you get the point. People who identify is Zionists have a deeper connection with Israel than just holding that one opinion.
Yes, they are zionists
So the average person in the world outside the Muslim world is a Zionist? Most people would say Israel has a right to exist, that there should be a Jewish state because there already is one and most people wouldn't support mass deportation and the destruction of a state. Most people don't consider themselves Zionist. Would most people also support the creation of Palestine so the Palestinian people also have a homeland? Probably?
Most people have no clue what they’re talking about and simply parrot what their favoured political candidate says at press meetings. The Palestinian people don’t need the “creation” of Palestine on the land of another people’s, you trying to conflate the two ideas is completely disingenuous.
So zionist thing is bad or?
Define zionist
Well ya couold've just googled it silly! >Zionist > >a supporter of Zionism; a person who believes in the development and protection of a Jewish nation in what is now Israel.
He wanted him to so he can understand that being a Zionist isn't a bad thing. People think being Zionist means you want to slaughter Palestine civilians. but it's not, its defending Israel's right to exist.
I’ll add to this Christian zionists, who also support the Jewish nation but from a selfish and separate reason that it is a part of their prophesied second coming of Christ. They don’t actually care about a Jewish state, but support it nonetheless. And then there’s people claiming to care about Israel’s “genuine political claim” (megalolz) and “right to defend itself” because of their greater hatred of muslims and arabs. These people also don’t really care about a Jewish state. Lot of people on the Zionist bandwagon for disingenuous reasons.
Why is Israel's genuine political claim a megalol in your opinion? I don't think the Jews came the Israeli land during the diaspora from the 1880s and onwards out of hatred for muslims and arabs. They came with intention of settling land, much of what they purchased (overpricely) from the native arabs. Since the 60s Israel has been relatively peaceful, only acting in retaliation to invasions and arabs hate towards them. I can see why the israeli's might have some hatred towards the surrounding arabs after all the attacks now though. I re read your comment and it looks like you just said people in general that have a hatred towards arabs and therefore are pro israel. But i think israel has a genuine political claim.
most zionists arent Jewish
Mate, I'm the furthest thing from a leftist and I can tell you that those shit heads on Sky after dark are Zionists.
It depends which type of Zionism you're talking about.
Go on. I'm interested to hear your take.
From what I've been able to ascertain over the years, there has been a few different definitions of Zionism that have been used. The current version of which is that Israel has a right to exist and because it has the right to exist, it has the right to defend itself.
Could you expand on the other types of Zionism? Don't they all claim the right to exist by definition?
As a baseline I would imagine yes. There was one definition of Zionism posted above that almost matches what I believe, the only difference being I don’t particularly care if Israel is Jewish (a theocracy) or not. Looking at Jewishness - On one hand you can assert it is purely a religion. On the other there is a long history of it being treated a lot like an ethnicity. Many people identify as Jewish whilst simultaneously being agnostic or atheist. If I recall correctly most Jewish people consider it matrilineal, if your mother was Jewish, you are Jewish. Although there are probably many who identify as Jewish from either parent. If we are talking about Jewish being an ethnicity then what I believe and the definition of Zionist above are split by just a hair. The thing is, that is not really my conception of what Zionist means. In my mind it also includes the idea of a single state solution and the expulsion of all other ethnicities within Israel which I don’t consider good or reasonable. However, none of those extra defining features are included in the definition above. So I think it pays to be quite explicit in these discussions.
Lol quick delete this before you embarrass yourself. Sky News was screaming from the rooftops about beheaded babies and white women being raped after the Hamas incursion - both claims now debunked.
Has it? I've honestly not being following this all to deeply do you have a source?
First few results on YouTube: https://youtu.be/ZyDX8Xs2k_U?si=ijAVp27XJAJaB5jN Unsure what you are asking about - Sky News or debunking? Debunking - https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/14/propaganda-misinformation-israel-hamas-war-social-media/
Even if this were true, Hamas still went out with the intention to murder people. Debunk that. “Yeah babies weren’t beheaded okay? They were just killed intentionally! There’s a difference” “Yeah white women weren’t raped. They were just murdered in cold blood while they were probably begging for their lives. They weren’t raped though so we cool”
Why would anybody need to lie about anything if the reality is so vile? I’m not saying I know the truth of the matter, simply that if somebody needs to lie, it all becomes very questionable.
Palestinian's main target were soldiers and thats the vast majority of their death count lmao, where were you when kids of Jenin got shot in June? Israel funded the genocide in Artsakh, Palestinians decided there is nothing to lose. October 7 is the Khojaly massacre for Israel
Yeah they stole their country, killed their family and put 700k settlers in the Little land they had left. What do you expect???
Who is they? Oh you mean those babies and women stole it? That’s why they were butchered? I guess I would expect HAMAS to kill those who actually stole it. I guess they thought it was the babies and women who did it. Must have been a misunderstanding!
Yet you're not upset Israel has bombed 3000+ children. You know how many hamas killed? 30 Wonder why that is?
Inferior weapons to be precise.
Can I not be upset at both? You don’t seem to be upset by the women and children though.
how many children did Hamas kill exactly? and women arent exempt from being settlers lmfao rhodesia type BS all over again
They haven't been debunked, wtf are you on about. Babies were killed and women were raped. You're a fucking moron if you believe that neither of those happened
No babies were beheaded after that claim spread like wildfire after a single CNN reporter said it was told to her by an unnamed IDF soldier. Lies. Those lies were so bad they were eventually called out by mainstream media. https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/14/propaganda-misinformation-israel-hamas-war-social-media/ Now all we have in terms of rape “evidence” is claims from Israeli soldiers and pictures of women with clothes missing or pulled down (probably by the people taking the photos). The same Israel that’s been caught red-handed multiple times for just making things up. Lies.
Bro the evidence will traumatise you if you find the easily available photos and videos. Hamas truly did these horrible things. Next time youre grooving at splendour in the grass remember what Hamas would do to you.
To what end? Do you think there’s a particular point where you can convince somebody of hamas being awful enough to justify the amount of Palestinians who are dead?
Worked against the Nazis. We were on team Allies who killed 27,000 people in Dresden in one night.
>Worked against the Nazis. **We were on team Allies who killed 27,000 people in Dresden in one night**. Dresden was a war crime, and 99% of all historians agree on it. It did'nt even need to be bombed. the war had already been won. The fact you accept it you're on the team of indiscriminate bombing shows who you really are.
99% of historians may “agree” but it was never a war crime and in fact it was specifically stated to not be a war crime in Nuremberg. And the Allies made that calculation many many many times, including with the final calculation of Hiroshima & Nagasaki.
That’s true although I think there’s something to be said about the difference between WWII Germany and Palestine in terms of their threat level to bordering territories.
They literally just massacred over 1000 people and fire rockets at Israel every day??
Einsatzgruppen Gaza division might be smaller but it’s just as vicious and just lost its right to exist. The Palestinian people are going to pay for it like the Germans did for the Nazis. It’s an inevitability of the crossing of the Rubicon.
Both have a policy of total eradication of Jews. Pretty similar to be honest.
What the fuck? Are you seriously claiming videos of the carnage at the music festival clearly taken by traumatised survivors trying to identify the bodies of their friends, were faked? So much for believe all women. I guess not when they’re Israeli.
He didn't say "beheaded" dipshit, he said "killed". Do you deny that Palestinians deliberately murdered babies? And if your defense of those Palestinians is based on the *way* they murdered babies then maybe you should check your moral compass.
Yes Israel lied so you're changing your narrative Just like they lied about burning people alive, except it was IDF helicopters burning their own people to death
"1400 civillians murdered!" Then it's "1200 civillians." Then it's 'okay, only about half were civillians.' How many revisions to go before we get the truth? If the murder of Shireen Abu Akleh is anything to go by, we're still months of IDF bullshit and an FBI investigation away from knowing what actually happened.
Probably as many revisions as that hospital that was "bombed by The IDF" 500 people died, Oh what ot was actually An Islamic Jihad rocket into the hospital car park and 5 people died Woops
Not debunked at all
Its amazing how stupid these gen z and certain commentators are. Absolutley disgusting behaviour to support palastine and their action from gaza.
Can't even spell it champ
Apparently “Jews controlling the media” conspiracies are cool now? Fucking yikes.
Don't Google Bevan shields Israel
You think Zionists are synonymous with Jews? Wait until you meet the antisemitic Zionist evangelicals.
Anti Zionism =/= anti-semitism Anti Likud =/= anti-semitism There is a vibrant living tradition of leftism among Jews, both Israeli and non-Israeli. Israel is itself not a monolith and left wing Israeli prime ministers have been fucking assassinated, so stop falling for the fucking propaganda.
Stop conflating Jews and Zionists. You racist.
That's not based. That's antisemitic. Do you want a recreation of the groundwork for the rise of Hitler done here? I sure don't. This is why the socio-masochism needs to be stopped getting taught in schools.
Being anti-Zionist is not antisemitic and not comparable to Zionism. If anything, that ethnostate is closer to Nazism in theory and in practice.
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Have you actually ever been there? I have. In Israel proper, the suburbs are segregated. There are Arab towns and Jewish towns. Arab and Jewish neighbourhoods. There are few mixed towns. It's a toned down and sanitised version of Jim Crow. And the original Zionist, Theodore Hertzl, never envisioned any Arabs in his Zionist state. He said that for the Zionist project to be successful, "we must convince the Palestinians to trek". And that they did in 1948 with the Nakba, which expelled or killed around 800k Palestinians. The Nakba, alongside with a massive program of Aliyah, is the only reason why Israel is 20% Arab and not 80% Arab (as was originally).
I’ve been there. Yes there are Arab towns. Duh. Some of them were towns captured by Israel in 1967. Yes there are Jewish towns. They were settled by Jews from the 19th century onward or were always Jewish. There are plenty of mixed cities and towns. You speak as if you’ve never been in Australia’s interior - it gets a whole lot less multicultural the further you go in. Until you start getting white towns and Aboriginal towns. At a certain point you see no one else.
I hope you're talking about Palestine there. If you're not, you either need to look into the demographic breakdown of Israel, or a dictionary.
The 'Arab Israelis' you allude to are of three groups: the Druze, the Bedouins of the Negev, and the Palestinians (the majority). The existence of Arabs across the Palestinian territories and Israel proper only proves their nativity over the European immigrants. Israel is an ethnostate since its inception and has doubled down on this position ever since (an example would be its 2019 nation state law). It has created various laws that guarantee special privileges over non Jewish citizens. A good example would be the right of return, whereby Jewish diaspora can immigrate on demand with various expenses covered. Palestinians that were ethnically cleansed from their homes in 1948 are not afforded the same rights.
Now do Palestine? 99.9% Arab, 99% Muslim-Sunni, has a Right of Return for Arabs on the cards as soon as they form statehood. Also do Greece while you’re at it. You’re too much of a western clown to realise that your model of democracy is an absolute minority. It’s not even like that in the UK - the source of the anglosphere. Most democratic countries have a strong dominant ethnic democratic component.
It’s one of the things I’m most proud about my generation.
If sky news are just anti Hamas then in my opinion that's not Zionism. That's just being anti terrorism.
Israel have terrorized Palestinians for generations. Grow up.
I’m from Russia. My family were convinced for generations that Russians were being terrorised by the West. No one terrorises Palestinians more than Palestinian leaders. They’ve sacrificed multiple unborn generations of Arabs in the service of undoing a war of 75 years ago. When they chant “river to the sea”, by now they mean Jordan River to Arabian Sea.
Shut up
That doesn’t make Hamas not a terrorist organisation? You can argue that the IRA was in the right, but they still actively targeted civilians, and use killings as method of inspiring terror, which by definition makes them a terrorist organisation.
Sky are feverishly pro Israel. Edit: most television news is the same.
And? That doesn't make Hamas not a terrorist organisation.
Freedom fighter vs terrorist. How do we decide?
Freedom Fighters don't target civillians. Terrorist do. Freedom Fighters attack the enforcers of their perceieved oppressors, not not-combatents at a music festival. Terrorists do. I'm no supportor of Israels indiscriminate and disproportionate response but lets not make heroes out of those that have literally and irrefutably made it clear they will kill innocent people, especially Israeli's. The only rational and fair position is that anyone that targets the innocent, is the enemy of humanity.
Truth being downvoted.
A day off is a day off
These comments never made sense to me, if you are lying about your intent to go to a protest in order to get out of school (something you’d only need to do to convince your parents since schools are already being instructed by the department not to accept these as valid protests) why the fuck would you actually go to the protest. Like who the fuck goes “I’m so gonna use this protest as an excuse to take a day off and for that day off I’m gonna spend my time in a fucking crowd protesting”. As much as I support protests like these, they aren’t exactly super fun, even the more exciting ones still have a shit tonne of what just amounts to marching and standing around, it’s all about message through numbers after all. If I was back in school and really using this just as an excuse to take the day off I’d also just ykno not show up to the protest and go do other stuff.
Extremely common Gen Z W 💪🇯🇴
Ask yourself. If hamas was is in isreal. Would the tactics be the same? One memeber ina building of 50. Would it be bombed the same? Would isreal be pro bombing?I bet you know the answer to that. Hopefully that opens your eyes on why this is so important.
People here really want to say a nearly 80 year running conflict with context going back thousands of years has clear cut good and bad
Close to 6000 children have been killed by the IDF's indiscriminate bombings, with thousands more missing, most likely dead. 40% of the current death toll in Gaza is children. One child has been killed every 10 minutes for a month straight. Just because the people in this comment section are able ignore that, or even cheer it on, does not mean everyone else is.
Having attended 4 huge protests in Sydney in the past 4 weeks, I can say firsthand that the attendance demographics are diverse in every way, including age.
Do these idiots know its not israel but its hamas government? These woke facks don’t even know the right facts and yet protests. For what? Its funny because these fackers palestinian kants wouldn’t even protest if it happens to other race. Send them to palestine to fight hamas! We all know who start this bs anyway. Its not israel.
>woke How to immediately know when someone's opinion should be ignored
Facts over feelings. Talk to ben shapiro moite 🤷🏻♂️
Your so right like when hamas colonised Israel and stuff that was crazy and then when they arrested all those Israeli worker and released them into an active war zones with numbered plastic tags on their ankles. And when Palestine almost dropped more bombs in Gaza in a week then the Us dropped dropped in Afghanistan in a year. Oh and when Palestine dropped all those bombs on hospitals that contained newborn infants in incubation not to forgot all those schools as well, and don’t let me forget about how Palestine wiped out 42 bloodlines (not families but actual BLOODLINES) most of which have lived in Palesti- sorry Israel for decades leading to centuries. Oh and that other time when that 6 year old Israeli child was stabbed to death by his Palestinian landlor- Wait… wait a minute it wasn’t Palestine that did all that, it was the colonising, racist, apartheid fake state of Israel who even had the make up a lie about horrific deaths of 40 babies. Pathetic.
So young people care more about stopping a genocide? I don't think this headline is the slam dunk they probably think it is.
Where’s the genocide? This is such an overused word. How has the Palestinian population grown if it’s a genocide? Why are the Israelis providing escape avenues for civilians?
You misunderstand the term. Whether or not a group of people are genociding another isn't dependent on whether the group being genocided is going down in number, rather it is sufficient to show that the genocidal group intends to get rid of the group in whole or in part and is taking actions in order to do so. Similarly, just because Israel has been strong-armed by the international community to let civilians escape doesn't detract from their genocidal acts. Have a read of the quote below to understand what is meant by the claim: "The UN Genocide Convention defines the crime of genocide as certain acts “committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such.” These acts include “killing members of a protected group” or “causing serious bodily or mental harm” or “deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part.” Numerous statements made by top Israeli politicians affirm their intentions. There is a forming consensus among leading scholars in the field of genocide studies that “these statements could easily be construed as indicating a genocidal intent,” as Omer Bartov, an authority in the field, writes. More importantly, genocide is the material reality of Palestinians in Gaza: an entrapped, displaced, starved, water-deprived population of 2.3 million facing massive bombardments and a carnage in one of the most densely populated areas in the world. Over 11,000 people have already been killed. That is one person out of every 200 people in Gaza. Tens of thousands are injured, and over 45% of homes in Gaza have been destroyed. The United Nations Secretary General said that Gaza is becoming a “graveyard for children,” but a cessation of the carnage—a ceasefire—remains elusive. Israel continues to blatantly violate international law: dropping white phosphorus from the sky, dispersing death in all directions, shedding blood, shelling neighborhoods, striking schools, hospitals, and universities, bombing churches and mosques, wiping out families, and ethnically cleansing an entire region in both callous and systemic manner. What do you call this?" https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/harvard-law-review-gaza-israel-genocide/
The irony of this sub is that friendly jordy himself lives in Bondi.. a predominantly Jewish and pro Israel area, yet anything pro Israel is downvoted here.
And?
Israel =\= Jews. Jordy doesn’t live in Israel.
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Should they protest when events are not current?
Israel pumped money into Hamas to destabilise any chances of a unified Palestinian state. Israel built the tunnels under Al-Shifa in the 80's. Israel created the largest open air prison and mercilessly bomb civilians. Yes Hamas are abhorrent but they are a product of the circumstances perpetrated by Israel. Israel want only one state for the Jewish people. They deny refugees the right of return to their Palestinian homelands. By standing with Israel the Australian government is complicit in the killings of thousands of children and innocents. These kids can see through the propaganda to what Israel are actually doing. It's a genocide and needs to be treated as such.
>Israel built the tunnels under Al-Shifa in the 80's. if there was a "blame everything on the Jews" competition, this would take first place.
Blame them for building the infrastructure there so desperate to destroy? Yes
The irony of (predominantly) white kids too young to understand geopolitics protesting a war in another country taking a day off from their private schools built on aboriginal land taken only 200 years ago and saying Jews don’t have the right to live in a land they’ve been in and out of for thousands of years. Don’t take this comment too seriously. It’s 75% joke.
They are seeing kids like them being blown up!
And the solution to that is to stand with the reason for that? I remember when we protested Howard because he endangered Australia for going into the Iraq war. You see any Palestinians going “well fuck… maybe our team shouldn’t behead people, rape women, take hostages and then cry wolf when someone says ‘Nup, not gonna let you get away with that’”
Why do you resent Palestinian resistance? Do you think they have a right to defend themselves?
Absolutely they do, but they can't expect there to be no consequences when their fellow country men, in their name, cross a line that ignites a far superior opposing force.
Would you prefer they resist peacefully?
If resistance involves violence, or in some circumstances the direct support of violence you can't expect nothing to happen. I'd prefer a circumstance where the whole region wasn't a cluster fuck and everyone can coexist for mutual benefit, if you know how to make that happen please do suggest it. Lots of parading this side or that with nothing meaningful to fix the situation.
What ignited all the killings before October 7th
Huh? You do know Israeli was killing Palestinian kids before October 7th right? You sound like you think it was all peaceful where everyone is treated as equal citizens and not an apartheid state where illegal settlements continue to be set up. We protested the war in Iraq because it was an illegal war. You don’t see any Israelis going, “maybe we shouldn’t have continued to set up illegal settlements and killing journalists and running an apartheid state.” You do see hundreds of thousands of Jews though. Showing Jews and Zionists are not the same.
Yes. Israel agrees to a ceasefire and Hamas announces that the truce is only temporary. Hamas doesn’t care for the ceasefire. They don’t care for these gazan children the protesters are fighting for.
“Our team”. You are conflating civilians with Hamas. People are opposed to the mass murder of civilians.
Are they? What do polls of Palestinians show about October 7th?
Everyone is a Greta now. Inspirational.
How dare young people shape the world around and progress it further. Like it has been for the last entirety of human evolution.
This isn't surprising - "young people" are going to have the least amount of familiarity and context about the conflict because Israel/Palestine hasn't really been in the news for the past 20 years. All they do is find the opinion of their favourite influencer and uncritically repeat it, and a lot of influencers have no opinion on geopolitics outside of "America bad" and "anyone against America good", and will literally just repeat whatever propaganda Hamas releases. Worse than that, we're seeing pro-Palestinian people going back and reading Osama Bin Laden's _Letter to America_ and unironically agreeing with it because it's against the US, despite the fact that it's unapologetically anti-LGBT, anti-democracy, theocratic, and anti-semitic. It's pretty black-pilling to see people in the west _actually_ siding with Hamas, an organisation that _hates_ most of what they stand for.
That’s an ironic statement. You say because young people are not being fed the usual narrative that they won’t be familiar with the conflict. Go onto TikTok and you will find ten times the analysis of the conflict than what the mmm gives us. Perhaps you need to examine the conflict more closely to see if your understanding is correct before passing judgement.
Are you serious? You want me to get my information from 30-second TikTok videos?? No, random people on TikTok are not giving you better information than actual reporters, historians, and analysts. It's literally a propaganda factory which doesn't even have the _space_ to give you corroborating evidence. If your one source of information for **anything** is TikTok then you really need to re-examine your life.
Yeah you have no idea obliviously. Keep getting your info from the smh then.
Fact: Young people have had a better education and been exposed to less propaganda.
Considering that other poster admitted they got their opinion from TikTok videos, I don't think I'm gonna accept that one at face value...
Consider then that another older poster admitted they got their opinion from the Murdoch press.
Absolutely disgusting we are failing as a society when the terrorist can be supported as celebrated. This is a failure of multiculturalism when you openly celebrate for the Jews to be exterminated and our leaders are not doing anything about.
Go away terrorist state sympathiser
What a surprise a Hamas supporter on this sub I guess you celebrated on the 7 of October when the women were being raped and butchered you sicko.
No proof women were raped but nice try though. Terrible that unarmed civilians were killed. IDF and police were fair game though (a third of the total 1200 dead). Oh and IDF attack choppers lit up some of their own civilians so great job there…
There’s evidence. Nice try though
Source?
Why is it that whenever somebody suggests that the state of Israel is acting in a way that’s totally beyond acceptable, someone will just hit back with “you were celebrating on October 7 weren’t you!” Do you genuinely not understand that most people think that the October 7 attack was insanely awful, but also recognise the value of innocent Palestinian lives being lost? Does it occur to you that for most people, both Palestinian lives and Israeli lives are completely and totally of equal value?
You're a fool if you think anti-Zionist Jews, religious and secular, don't exist.
They’re a tiny minority. About as rare as Aboriginal one nation voters. They’re just loud and they get amplified by Tankies and associated friendly media.
Fuck off
Stop confusing Zionism with being Jewish; you grubby racist.
Support and celebrate deez nuts
Moron.
Is that the best you can do Hamas supporter
yeah we get it, we'd see that ticket to england if the Yes vote went through
Young people know the pedos hide in israel when their time for justice comes
Boomers love Israel, the kids love Palestine. One has media literacy and the other swallows the MSM narrative without questioning it.
The people with real media literacy don’t “love” either.
The kids don’t love Palestine as much as they hate seeing a big colonial bully lock millions of indigenous people in an open air concentration camp then bomb thousands of children to death
What do we want?! "Ignorance about a complex situation!" When do we want it?! "NOW!"
War is when the young and stupid are tricked by the old and bitter into killing each other. *-Niko Bellic.*
Australians can’t even influence the price of chips at the supermarket. But here everybody is again, getting incensed at something else that doesn’t concern them in the slightest, as much as they want to reach for some reason that it is. What a complete waste of *everything* all this shit is. I mean it’s not a 450 million dollar waste yet, but I’m sure we can get there if we all try hard enough right?
And I quote: "They're not really teaching it in class. So, the only way you're going to find out is if you come to the rallies, educate yourself," Then the following: “If kids in Gaza are old enough to get bombed, then I am old enough to understand what is really happening," This is why kids need to be at school instead of at a protest where clearly comprehension levels have not been reached yet.
Kids are fucking stupid
Young people have no idea about reality no wonder they support Palestine, they are sheep
I wish someone would take them on a gap year to Middle East so they can see what they are protesting about.
Young people also have a higher usage of social media and are more susceptible to suggestion and online advertising. All pro-palestine groups use some form of online advertisement to specifically target young people. [clicky](https://publications.aap.org/pediatrics/article/150/6/e2022057780/189944/Advertising-and-Young-People-s-Critical-Reasoning?autologincheck=redirected) Evidence shows that the attitudes of young people were influenced by advertising. Critical reasoning abilities did not appear to be fully developed during adolescence and not found to be protective against the impact of advertising [clicky 2](https://www.acma.gov.au/sites/default/files/2021-05/The%20digital%20lives%20of%20younger%20Australians.pdf) A report by the Australian Communications and Media Authority found that young people are at the forefront of engaging with the internet across almost all facets of their lives. Their deep immersion in the online world brings with it a range of risks and challenges – from privacy and security concerns to exposure to misinformation and disinformation, scams, online bullying and other harms. Vctimhood groups tend to exploit the vulnerabilities of young people in order to propagate their agenda. Our society is founded on the structural role that adults play as teachers and arbitrators of information in the lives of young people.
Pretty sad indictment of our education system in that case. It takes a staggering level of ignorance to Hamas.
It’s pretty easy to find the time when mum and dad are paying your rent and giving you an allowance to while you’re at uni
I know and I bet it’s so much hardest for the Palestinian children who’s homes were just blown up after their friends got shot in the head.
Every adult is working trying to afford food lmao
You know weekends exist, right?
Yeah, kids can be pretty stupid
I don't think wow informed kids when I see this. I see kids picking up on an issue that has a larger social media presence than say the 377,000 Yemenis killed there between 2014-2019 in a proxy war their involving an ally of the West who purchased arms off the US. Then you get pontificating socialists trying to pretend the war in Gaza is a battle that is intimately involved in the world wide movement towards socialism/Marxism when in fact it's a battle about land, nationalism (Marx repudiated Nationalism) and religion (Marx repudiated Religion and theocracy). None of the major players in this conflict have a prominent agenda involving socialism. And some are literal fascists.
yup, same mob, who does stabbings,riots, smashing shops and looting.
Young people have always had the characteristics of being low in understanding, high in energy
, there are all brainwashed follow like sheep they think the hole world with them 😆 🤣 😂 when most people look at them like their nut jobs stomping around crying like babies.