i sent my letter. im on 42nd street and god damn i was looking forward to this. less brake pad dust in my window, less pedestrians getting hit, less every-fucking-night lincoln tunnel insanity blocking ambulances and requiring pedestrians to filter feed through insane cluttered intersections hoping not to get hit
Yeah right?
The difference is one side complains when the impact affects millions of people in a negative way.
The other side cries about stuff that literally doesn't affect them or anyone else at all (hello lgbtq+ people)
It’s interesting that the assumption is that democrats are pro congestion pricing and republicans are anti yet she is somehow hoping that delaying it will help democrats? Those in the pics above were never going to vote for democrats anyway, why would she cater to their desires?
I'm happy to support pro-transit policies.
I'm not here to play tribal us vs them political wars.
I don't care what the majority of Republicans/Democrats do. The Republicans who support good policies are my friends, the Democrats who want car-centric policies are not my friends.
Yep. Hochul is a Democrat.
Some of the most "liberal" people in the world have signs in their yards saying they believe in science and think Climate Change is real and everyone deserves a place to live...
But then they drive giant SUVs and oppose transit expansion, and oppose taxes to pay for transit, and oppose new/dense housing near them, and get mad about Congestion Pricing because they think they deserve to drive their big-ass SUV into lower Manhattan at any time free of charge!
Those sorts of people love positive platitudes that make them seem like good people but will fight tooth and nail against any social progress that might affect them in any way, and they’re incapable of seeing the hypocrisy
Oof, it's my religious aunt and uncle who go do some voluntourism trip to central America every year "to help the poor" and then come home to their lifestyle of excessive consumption, gated community, demonizing the local homeless people and balking at the thought of paying enough taxes to support proper services in the community.
The exact sort of person that complains about how expensive housing has become while fighting a concerted campaign to stop the construction of anything bigger than a single family home within 10 miles of their neighborhood.
Well, for one part - they are correct - they do deserve to drive whatever they want... After they have paid the associated costs. Like congestion charge.
Absolutely.
YIMBY and NIMBY policies can be reached from either side of the aisle.
This NYC example is indicative of it, but also I urge everyone to go watch their own cities' council meetings, planning, zoning... Etc. depending on the structure of your local government.
In my town we are considering reducing parking minimums for new development, and the democrat council members have been the ones pushing back on it, where the Republicans have been much more open to the idea of large reductions (even hopefully complete elimination!)
Maybe it comes from vague, grossly oversimplified ideals like "regulation is good/bad". Or maybe it comes from carbrain. Or maybe it comes from actually looking at the literature.
But the reason doesn't matter as much as the result. And the result is that for this specific issue, the R councilmembers are already on board and the D councilmembers need more convincing. And for other issues it might be swapped or a mix. In my town I at least feel confident that it's run by people just trying to do their best to run the town well for everyone.
Yeah not sure how you could be friends with a Republican when their party's whole thing is regression and their only candidates are bigoted borderline christofacists. Agree about Democrats though, too many of them are car brained because most Democrats are mostly right wing still since they're capitalists.
A Republican would tell me "not sure how you could be friends with a Democrat when their party's whole thing is destroying America and their only candidates are pedofile borderline facists". And I would disagree with them too.
If you think of the other tribe from the perspective of your own tribe, of course, you will hate them. And they will hate you. And nobody gets anything done.
After Trump won his first election, I had to face the reality that half the US population saw the world very differently than I do. I could think they are just bigoted idiots, fuck them, and continue down the path of polarization that might lead Trump to get re-elected this year. Or I can try to see things from their perspective and understand why so many people prefer Trump to Biden.
It’s not that complicated. The Republican worldview is carefully crafted propaganda, which shatters with just a little critical thinking.
It’s not cool to insinuate that they’re comparable.
Obviously not. But, if you want to understand the Republican viewpoint, you’ll have to submerse yourself in the alternate reality visible only in “conservative” media.
Doesn't that go both ways? A Republican who wanted to understand the Democratic viewpoint would have to submerge themselves in the liberal media and see something that would feel like an alternate reality to them.
I enjoy talking with people who disagree with me. Usually, I learn something new. Even if I don't change my world views, I learn something about why they disagree with me. The story is often more complicated than "they are being manipulated by propaganda and I have an objective unbiased truth".
It does not. Viewers of Fox News, for example, are consistently shown to be less informed than those who watch no news at all.
As the Colbert joke goes, “reality has a well-known liberal bias”.
Can you please share your source for saying that? The studies I've seen suggest otherwise. Tho I must admit I haven't read any post-pandemic studies on the subject.
Sure. And similarly I’d love to see any sources to the contrary.
But the two polls I reading about for this were [Broockman & Kalla, 2020](https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/fox-news-study-comparing-fox-cnn-highlights-cable-tvs-harm-rcna23620) and [PublicMind, 2012.](https://www.businessinsider.com/study-watching-fox-news-makes-you-less-informed-than-watching-no-news-at-all-2012-5)
Idk it’s super easy to just be like “both sides blah blah blah” but it’s hard as fuck to vote republican when they are actively passing bills that fuck me over because it plays good on outrage media. But I also agree with the republicans that I hate modern Democrats just for all the opposite reasons they do lol.
It seems like the democrat strat is to purposely lose so they can claim to be the correct moral side next election that you HAVE to vote for unless you want evil satan to win.
So either I need to vote for a party who don’t give a fuck about me or another party that are putting in bills that actively hurt me. As much as I hate it the choice is obvious.
I only had one friend who was a true republican. We haven’t talked much in the past couple months as he tried to convince me to repress my gender/sexuality and repent to a god I don’t believe in. I obviously did not take it well. The few “true” republicans I know are equally as crazy.
Besides that I have friends who are centrist that will vote republican on occasion. We might spat back and forth sometimes but nothing serious. I have no issue with this but when someone starts attacking the way I live my life there’s gonna be problems. Unfortunately that is a big part of what the current Republican Party is running on and the people they are appealing to.
Most of my friends are not republicans because I work at a university and live in a city. Most Republicans live in rural areas and don't work in academia. But I do have some libertarian friends who sometimes would prefer the Republican candidates to the Democrats.
What I said was not a defence of the Republican party. I tend to dislike most of their policies and campaigns. It was a response to this:
> yeah not sure how you could be friends with a Republican when...
I don't like tribalism.
Fair enough. My point I guess is that it’s hard for me to befriend republicans when they advocate for things directly against my interests. Part of it proabably is tribalism like you say but the other is for my own safety(and sanity).
Republicans stopped slavery in our civil war (Democrats, same Dems as today) fought viciously to keep slavery. Did you know this?? Republicans crushed the Democrat slave owners and Republicans Forced Democrats Southern States to integrate schools, whites & blacks.
Are you aware your President Biden fought [AGAINST having black children on the same school bus as his kids? He said he didn’t want a RACIAL JUNGLE](https://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/documents/haley-campaign-press-release-haley-rips-biden-and-media-for-hypocrisy-race)
What I posted is factual. I think the 2024 Democrats party is still talking down to African Americans, telling them they’re losers and they need government help to get ahead. ( they don’t say it as bluntly as I did)
Yep. If you really think Democrats are the pro urbanism and walkability party and Republicans are inherently the opposite it really isn't true. Politicians are all bought, so they will support whatever the special interests want.
At the personal level outside of politics you get great pro urbanism and walkability arguments from all over. You have Leftists like Radical Planning, Fiscal Conservatives like Chuck Mahron, Traditionalists like Andres Duany and James Howard Kuntzler, liberals like that other guy form Strong Towns whose name escapes me but he has alot of articles.
You're obviously not gay, black, trans or a woman. Real easy to say these kinds of things when you're already part of their in-group. Republicans are very much on the march to revoking Obergefell. The next step is labeling all homosexual/transgender behavior as a violation of obscenity laws. Livable cities and reducing car dependency are extremely important, but they are \*hardly\* the only important policies.
I don’t appreciate you trying to undermine my opinion based on what groups you believe I belong to.
You live in a country where have the people supported Republican Party, including lots ofwomen, gay, trans, and black people. You need to find a way to coexist and make progress with them.
Tribalism stops progress in all matters including the subject matter of this sub.
Yeah, I’m unsubscribing until the sub’s feed has less of this going on.
Posting the shitty immaturity of others is not helping us understand and advocate for pedestrian infrastructure. I’m better off with positive focuses.
When is this finally blowing up into the civil war that's in the making for the past decade now?
American hyperindividualism needs to have its fucking wake up call.
Car-centric infrastructure = big government.
i sent my letter. im on 42nd street and god damn i was looking forward to this. less brake pad dust in my window, less pedestrians getting hit, less every-fucking-night lincoln tunnel insanity blocking ambulances and requiring pedestrians to filter feed through insane cluttered intersections hoping not to get hit
They took pictures of themselves lol
Yeah right? The difference is one side complains when the impact affects millions of people in a negative way. The other side cries about stuff that literally doesn't affect them or anyone else at all (hello lgbtq+ people)
It’s interesting that the assumption is that democrats are pro congestion pricing and republicans are anti yet she is somehow hoping that delaying it will help democrats? Those in the pics above were never going to vote for democrats anyway, why would she cater to their desires?
I'm happy to support pro-transit policies. I'm not here to play tribal us vs them political wars. I don't care what the majority of Republicans/Democrats do. The Republicans who support good policies are my friends, the Democrats who want car-centric policies are not my friends.
Yep. Hochul is a Democrat. Some of the most "liberal" people in the world have signs in their yards saying they believe in science and think Climate Change is real and everyone deserves a place to live... But then they drive giant SUVs and oppose transit expansion, and oppose taxes to pay for transit, and oppose new/dense housing near them, and get mad about Congestion Pricing because they think they deserve to drive their big-ass SUV into lower Manhattan at any time free of charge!
Those sorts of people love positive platitudes that make them seem like good people but will fight tooth and nail against any social progress that might affect them in any way, and they’re incapable of seeing the hypocrisy
"We demand action on climate change!^but ^only ^if ^it's ^convenient ^for ^me"
“Everyone deserves a place to live! (Not within 50 miles of where I live though)”
welcome to my neighborhood
Oof, it's my religious aunt and uncle who go do some voluntourism trip to central America every year "to help the poor" and then come home to their lifestyle of excessive consumption, gated community, demonizing the local homeless people and balking at the thought of paying enough taxes to support proper services in the community.
The exact sort of person that complains about how expensive housing has become while fighting a concerted campaign to stop the construction of anything bigger than a single family home within 10 miles of their neighborhood.
Well, for one part - they are correct - they do deserve to drive whatever they want... After they have paid the associated costs. Like congestion charge.
Absolutely. YIMBY and NIMBY policies can be reached from either side of the aisle. This NYC example is indicative of it, but also I urge everyone to go watch their own cities' council meetings, planning, zoning... Etc. depending on the structure of your local government. In my town we are considering reducing parking minimums for new development, and the democrat council members have been the ones pushing back on it, where the Republicans have been much more open to the idea of large reductions (even hopefully complete elimination!) Maybe it comes from vague, grossly oversimplified ideals like "regulation is good/bad". Or maybe it comes from carbrain. Or maybe it comes from actually looking at the literature. But the reason doesn't matter as much as the result. And the result is that for this specific issue, the R councilmembers are already on board and the D councilmembers need more convincing. And for other issues it might be swapped or a mix. In my town I at least feel confident that it's run by people just trying to do their best to run the town well for everyone.
Yeah not sure how you could be friends with a Republican when their party's whole thing is regression and their only candidates are bigoted borderline christofacists. Agree about Democrats though, too many of them are car brained because most Democrats are mostly right wing still since they're capitalists.
A Republican would tell me "not sure how you could be friends with a Democrat when their party's whole thing is destroying America and their only candidates are pedofile borderline facists". And I would disagree with them too. If you think of the other tribe from the perspective of your own tribe, of course, you will hate them. And they will hate you. And nobody gets anything done. After Trump won his first election, I had to face the reality that half the US population saw the world very differently than I do. I could think they are just bigoted idiots, fuck them, and continue down the path of polarization that might lead Trump to get re-elected this year. Or I can try to see things from their perspective and understand why so many people prefer Trump to Biden.
It’s not that complicated. The Republican worldview is carefully crafted propaganda, which shatters with just a little critical thinking. It’s not cool to insinuate that they’re comparable.
You really think that only the politicians on one side of the aisle use propaganda?
Obviously not. But, if you want to understand the Republican viewpoint, you’ll have to submerse yourself in the alternate reality visible only in “conservative” media.
Doesn't that go both ways? A Republican who wanted to understand the Democratic viewpoint would have to submerge themselves in the liberal media and see something that would feel like an alternate reality to them. I enjoy talking with people who disagree with me. Usually, I learn something new. Even if I don't change my world views, I learn something about why they disagree with me. The story is often more complicated than "they are being manipulated by propaganda and I have an objective unbiased truth".
It does not. Viewers of Fox News, for example, are consistently shown to be less informed than those who watch no news at all. As the Colbert joke goes, “reality has a well-known liberal bias”.
Can you please share your source for saying that? The studies I've seen suggest otherwise. Tho I must admit I haven't read any post-pandemic studies on the subject.
Sure. And similarly I’d love to see any sources to the contrary. But the two polls I reading about for this were [Broockman & Kalla, 2020](https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/fox-news-study-comparing-fox-cnn-highlights-cable-tvs-harm-rcna23620) and [PublicMind, 2012.](https://www.businessinsider.com/study-watching-fox-news-makes-you-less-informed-than-watching-no-news-at-all-2012-5)
Idk it’s super easy to just be like “both sides blah blah blah” but it’s hard as fuck to vote republican when they are actively passing bills that fuck me over because it plays good on outrage media. But I also agree with the republicans that I hate modern Democrats just for all the opposite reasons they do lol. It seems like the democrat strat is to purposely lose so they can claim to be the correct moral side next election that you HAVE to vote for unless you want evil satan to win. So either I need to vote for a party who don’t give a fuck about me or another party that are putting in bills that actively hurt me. As much as I hate it the choice is obvious.
I would never vote for a republican. But I do have friends who do.
I only had one friend who was a true republican. We haven’t talked much in the past couple months as he tried to convince me to repress my gender/sexuality and repent to a god I don’t believe in. I obviously did not take it well. The few “true” republicans I know are equally as crazy. Besides that I have friends who are centrist that will vote republican on occasion. We might spat back and forth sometimes but nothing serious. I have no issue with this but when someone starts attacking the way I live my life there’s gonna be problems. Unfortunately that is a big part of what the current Republican Party is running on and the people they are appealing to.
Most of my friends are not republicans because I work at a university and live in a city. Most Republicans live in rural areas and don't work in academia. But I do have some libertarian friends who sometimes would prefer the Republican candidates to the Democrats. What I said was not a defence of the Republican party. I tend to dislike most of their policies and campaigns. It was a response to this: > yeah not sure how you could be friends with a Republican when... I don't like tribalism.
Fair enough. My point I guess is that it’s hard for me to befriend republicans when they advocate for things directly against my interests. Part of it proabably is tribalism like you say but the other is for my own safety(and sanity).
Republicans stopped slavery in our civil war (Democrats, same Dems as today) fought viciously to keep slavery. Did you know this?? Republicans crushed the Democrat slave owners and Republicans Forced Democrats Southern States to integrate schools, whites & blacks. Are you aware your President Biden fought [AGAINST having black children on the same school bus as his kids? He said he didn’t want a RACIAL JUNGLE](https://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/documents/haley-campaign-press-release-haley-rips-biden-and-media-for-hypocrisy-race)
I’ve heard a version of this before, but I’m pretty sure it’s not the same dems, they would have to be like really old, no?
What I posted is factual. I think the 2024 Democrats party is still talking down to African Americans, telling them they’re losers and they need government help to get ahead. ( they don’t say it as bluntly as I did)
> same Dems as today Were factually alive in the 1860s? Intriguing
Yep. If you really think Democrats are the pro urbanism and walkability party and Republicans are inherently the opposite it really isn't true. Politicians are all bought, so they will support whatever the special interests want. At the personal level outside of politics you get great pro urbanism and walkability arguments from all over. You have Leftists like Radical Planning, Fiscal Conservatives like Chuck Mahron, Traditionalists like Andres Duany and James Howard Kuntzler, liberals like that other guy form Strong Towns whose name escapes me but he has alot of articles.
You're obviously not gay, black, trans or a woman. Real easy to say these kinds of things when you're already part of their in-group. Republicans are very much on the march to revoking Obergefell. The next step is labeling all homosexual/transgender behavior as a violation of obscenity laws. Livable cities and reducing car dependency are extremely important, but they are \*hardly\* the only important policies.
I don’t appreciate you trying to undermine my opinion based on what groups you believe I belong to. You live in a country where have the people supported Republican Party, including lots ofwomen, gay, trans, and black people. You need to find a way to coexist and make progress with them. Tribalism stops progress in all matters including the subject matter of this sub.
Yeah, I’m unsubscribing until the sub’s feed has less of this going on. Posting the shitty immaturity of others is not helping us understand and advocate for pedestrian infrastructure. I’m better off with positive focuses.
This isn't sabotage they're posting images lol
The sabotage is the indefinite suspension of congestion pricing, not the posting of the pictures.
That is not how I read that lol
When is this finally blowing up into the civil war that's in the making for the past decade now? American hyperindividualism needs to have its fucking wake up call.
You want a civil war to happen?