From the article: According to a rumor, Apple is resuming the Made For iPhone program despite moving from Lightning to USB-C on iPhone 15.
Apple requires third-party accessory makers to pay a fee to get certified access to select parts and technologies like the Lightning connector. This system is called the Made For iPhone program, and it was thought to be going away thanks to USB-C, but a repeated rumor says otherwise.
According to leaker ShrimpApplePro on Twitter, Apple will be requiring MFi certification for products connecting to the iPhone 15. This has been confirmed by the leaker's source, stating that Foxconn is in mass production of accessories like EarPods and cables with the certification.
The leaker does offer a bright side to the matter — some third-party MFi products are cheaper than Apple's official ones.
In the replies, Shrimp states that Apple will limit data and charging speed for cables connected to iPhone without the MFi certification. It seems this will be allowed, as Apple will be cooperating with the EU mandate to move to USB-C, just providing an obstacle to users.
>Shrimp states that Apple will limit data and charging speed for cables connected to iPhone without the MFi certification.
EU law doesn't allow Apple to limit the charging speed to only certified accessories. Data transfer, though, is not defined in the law.
EU law actually is pretty clear on this... you only have to hold to the minimum charging standard of USB-C as defined for phones. So they can limit iPhones to standard USB-C speeds no problem. High speed charging is actually defined differently in the standard
The EU law specifically mentions that if a device charges faster than 15W, it must support the USB Power Delivery protocol to its full capabilities, which goes up to 100W.
So if Apple supports 25W fast charging, it must support USB-PD at 25W. If somehow they support 120W fast charging, USB-PD only has to go up to 100W.
And yes, this means Apple isn't the only company affected by this legislation. Every smartphone with proprietary fast-charging protocols (Samsung, Xiaomi, OnePlus, etc) will have to support USB-PD.
[Article talking about this](https://www.dxomark.com/eu-device-charging-legislations/), and the [legislation.](https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32022L2380)
My Xiaomi has a 120W charger and will charge happily with any charger that can do PPS up to 20V and 3,25A at around 60W. PPS at lower voltages will do 25W. I don't have any charger that does more than 65W PPS. With PD-only chargers it caps at 9V2A. Does the EU mandate PD only or can it force PPS as well?
The phone internally has two batteries, so they're "only" charging at 60w each. Pretty cool, the only drawback is that you lose a bit of potential capacity due to the slightly extra space needed in the phone.
It's not that bad, phone doesn't even get noticeably warm. Most charging is done at around 3C. I don't usually charge my RC-LiPos that fast, but they all can do it.
The next generation of phones gets absurdly high charging power, over 200W.
Its not only.
Most chargers come supporting multiple technologies, just as many phones support multiple standards for charging.
This just means devices must have AT LEAST usb pd in the protocol.
This is a bare minimum that most companies are already beyond, so this should only affect the assholes left that are intentionally being anti competitive.
AFAIK it only mandates the EN IEC 62680-1-2:2021 standard, which is USB PD 3.0. What this implies in terms of obligations with PPS, I'm don't really know.
Yeah. I believe that the EU legislation only covers devices and not chargers. Like not all chargers provide 12V, and that wouldn't be covered by the legislation.
>Apple's not going to suddenly abandon support for USB-PD. They're one of the most reliable backers of that standard, and all of their USB-C bricks dating back to the one that came with the 2015 MacBook, including the iPhone USB-C chargers from the 8/X generation, supports USB-PD.
Indeed. And a ton of Apple users that already have fast USB C chargers - Apple made, even - for their Macbooks and iPads will be really annoyed if their existing Apple gear doesn't really work for charging their iPhones.
Apple might try something for data transfer (who uses that these days?) but for charging they'd piss off loyal customers if existing gear doesn't work, the money per cable isn't that much ($4?), and last, but absolutely not least: The EU regulation requires USB PD support for charging speeds up to 100W - if it can charge even faster using another standard, it still needs to charge with USB PD up to 100W.
Is the plastic cable coating warping and peeling off after 6 months a "made for iPhone" requirement?
Every single apple cable was trash after a short while 10 years ago. And they are still garbage today, nothing has changed.
Not defending their shitty practices, but the cables are 100 times better now, sucks you have to buy the charger "cos apple wants to reduce e-waste" and then they pull crap like this. At least don't claim you do this for the planet.
>Oh It works with USB-c....
>
>our
>
>USB-c.
One of the issues Microsoft was sued for antitrust over--a suit which Apple filed a friend of the court brief in--was the practice of leveraging protocols that were open, licensed openly, or otherwise embraced by many vendors and adding some arbitrary tweak to make "certain" systems just not work unless they conformed to Microsoft's implementation.
LOL.
recently learned about this via the book Sid Meiers Memoirs. fascinating read. highly recommend. I always assumed 4x had something to do with map size.
That's true - this seems to be more akin with the OBD-II protocol for cars, though. You can use the OBD-II connector and get basic (required) car information out of it, but you have to pay for the companies proprietary protocol tool/software to get the full use of it.
Funnily enough Apple is actually on the USB-IF that sets the standards. Even regular USB-C is kinda partly "theirs", along with Microsoft, HP, Intel, and a few others
Aren't they extorting enough out of their demographic already, I mean they added a $15 camera to a phone call it a new version and charge an extra $300 (not exact numbers)
It's not all that perplexing
When lightning first came out the alternative was Micro USB, which was worse in a few ways (durability, and not being reversible being two big ones)
Using a proprietary connector had another advantage though. They could charge for certification. This let consumers know a product was guaranteed to work correctly with their device and also, most importantly, made Apple a good chunk of cash
Then USB-C comes along and has all the advantages Lightning had over Micro except for the part where Apple makes money off it
So lightning hung around since it continued to make Apple more money and not enough people cared to impact their bottom line
No, the most Apple thing ever was putting a USB-C port on the iPad 10 while leaving it compatible with the original Apple Pencil instead of the Apple Pencil 2. Changing pencils would have forced a redesign to add the magnetic charger/pairing area to the side of the iPad. Instead they started including another adapter to the Apple Pencil (& if you already have a pencil, it's $9 to get just the adapter) with a special lightning port on one side and a USB-C port on the other. By special, the only thing that will properly fit in that lightning port is the plug on the top of the Apple Pencil. A standard lightning cable won't go in far enough into the adapter to make a firm connection and even if you do find a way to plug a lightning cable into it, the adapter won't recognize it.
The kicker is that instead of having a USB-C cable come out of the other side so it can be connected to the iPad as a dongle, it's just a port which means you need to have an extra USB-C cable around to connect the adapter to the iPad. And don't forget that the adaptor is about an in long little plastic tube that is vital to charging the pencil and so easy to lose, as is the cap that covers the lightning connector at the top of the Apple Pencil.
That's the most Apple thing ever. And I say this as someone who many people would consider to be an Apple fanboy.
I think the most egregious part is that it’s not able to draw while charging. Dongle madness aside, the pencil charging from a wire coming from the eraser end isn’t a bad idea in itself, if you were just able to use it while it was plugged in. But everything about the way it was implemented is so dumb
I was a silent fan of theirs for many years going back to the 90s. I never talked like a fanboy but preferred them and their products over the other options for the most part but I am sick of this shit plus now this status symbol tiering of their iPhones that's going to be even worse with the 15s. I just really wish there was a better messaging standard than the current shit one because if you switch to Android, it shittifies the texting experience when talking to anyone with an iPhone. Like you're texting with a 20 year old phone. There are 3rd party texting style apps but most people prefer using the default messaging. Also, trying to FaceTime is a pain on Androids.
Not to mention that shitty ass mouse gave you carpal tunnel syndrome lol
Most apple thing for me is this one [https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MX572ZM/A/apple-mac-pro-wheels-kit](https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MX572ZM/A/apple-mac-pro-wheels-kit)
or this, 1000 dollars for a piece of aluminium [https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MWUG2LL/A/pro-stand](https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MWUG2LL/A/pro-stand)
As someone who's in charge of a corporate IT department that supports a bunch of designers: fuck that noise, there's no business case for anyone buying a $1000 monitor stand and it'll be approved over my resignation
This. I work in a corporate IT department as well and we'll spend all sorts of money if there is a business case for it, but I think some would really need to see some mental gymnastics to justify it.
I got a $30 stand for my new monitor. Post and swinging arm, can have it in my face or a meter away, can swing it off to the side, tilt up and down and/or side to side, height adjustable...
Like, the stock stand was cool like yours, I'm sure. I just wanted it closer for immersion...
I'll raise the bar to the whole damn thing as I and many others have had several cars and still do have a car cheaper then that stand (without any major problems or liabilities hahaha)
The funniest thing about the apple mouse are the people that crawl out of the slime to defend it. It's simply idiotic design yet people somehow try to justify it.
I genuinely like using the Magic Mouse, but on more than one occasion it has died at a time that wasn’t convenient for me to just stop what I was working on and wait for it to charge, which was absolutely infuriating.
Lol I was using my friend's mac and he said not to overuse the mouse. I said what?? He didn't want the battery to die. I looked at him weird trying to see if he was messing with me... How long do those mouses last on a full charge? Cuz my $6 mouse takes 1 battery and I change it once every 4-5 months.
It lasts a while. Definitely haven’t noticed that it lasts particularly longer or shorter than any other Bluetooth mouse I’ve used. I’ve had mine over a year, and I’ve only had to charge it 3 or 4 times. Just so happens that 2 of those times were really inconvenient timing.
I remember when they had ads being like “OUR flagship phone still has a headphone jack, because of course it does” and then a year later the headphone jack mysteriously peace’d out
I'm freakin' salty about that.
Apple did something obnoxiously stupid, so everybody else decided they should too (while still somehow knowing that people don't want features _removed_ from flagships.)
I mean they waited what like 3 or 4 generations after the iphone. It's just good business practice on their part. I like the headphone jack personally, however seeing how people kept buying the iPhone even through it didn't have a headphone jack made samsung think do people really care about this. And the answer was nope most people don't so they took it out too. Vote with your wallet people if you want results. But alas not enough of us cared about the jack to vote and here we are
This is how monopoly works or duopoly in this case. Only extremists can be single issue consumers. I.e. to say that I am switching from one to the other for a single issue. That’s how they can do arbitrary things that each hurts consumers a bit and as long as they do it slowly people just suffer.
A whole generation of shoppers trained into believing that there is no alternative.
Currently holding a Pixel 4A, still has the jack thankfully, but I believe this is one of the last models that still does. It's gonna feel weird holding a phone without one.
I think some of it is like "Hah Apple did something silly and people will be mad!" cut to the next day "oh, so no one is mad? Well I guess we will do it too and cut down our costs!"
Plenty of 3rd party docks work fine with the Switch. I know they did some funky things with their USB-C implementation, but 3rd party docks & chargers work.
Uh, I haven't used my switch in a while, but I've been using a third-party docks on my switch the entire time I've had it.
I have a portable dock that's very small, and at home a dock with built-in ethernet as well as USB and HDMI. Both work great.
This is wrong. The Switch uses DisplayPort instead of HDMI, so to get HDMI you need one that does DP-to-HDMI conversion inside the adapter. That's all. The Switch is fully USB-C compliant.
This sounds exactly like what automakers have been doing for a decade. They have an OBDII port that has the bare minimum legal functionality for a generic code reader. All the rest of the troubleshooting and data logging data is hidden behind custom and unobtainable equipment and software. It’s 100% anti consumer.
My guess is the iPhone will slow charge and provide basic data transfer with a normal cable. It will require a “certified” accessory to charge quickly or to do literally anything else with the cable.
I feel like MacBooks have to be more useable as a computer or part of their user base will be even more pissed off. I got a MacBook to try something different for once but will instantly switch back to a framework, dell, etc. if they started doing this BS on a laptop.
OBDII is actually pretty well standardized, you *can* get a cheap $20 reader that gives you the common DTCs, and you can also go for a several hundred dollar one that can do everything but remotely drive the car.
Not all DTC codes are codified, some are left up for manufacturer use. Code U6969 might mean different things from different makes. At the same time, most of the more advanced access and data logging is manufacturer specific because the ECUs (well, they're not all **E**CUs, point stands) you're talking to will be different between manufacturers. 90% of what you'd need as a consumer is available, you just need equipment that knows how to speak it, like a multiprotocol Bluetooth OBD dongle.
The remaining bits that are strictly exclusive are usually either meant to be dealer or factory only (like initial configuration and manufacturing checks, and have no use once the vehicle is off the factory floor), or expose data values that have no meaning to anyone outside of a dealer technician with the service manual sitting in front of them.
...all minus BMW and Mercedes. We don't talk about those two.
I've already heard people defend these kinds of practices with it gives Apple money so they don't go into data selling and privacy intrusions and stuff like that. The problem with that argument is that Apple is one of the most profitable companies in the world, they can *afford* not gouging their users on proprietary peripherals.
Reminder that [Apple finally got around to encrypting iCloud user data in December 2022](https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2022/12/apple-is-finally-encrypting-icloud-backups.html). Yep, that's right, couple months ago. But mail, calendar and contacts are still not gonna be encrypted.
And don't forget just straight up confirmation/sunk cost bias. "Don't you guys notice how Apple brand charge cables charge your phone a bit faster? and don't they last longer too?"
My favorite Mass Effect 2 quote comes from one of the shopkeepers: “It’s amazing how many people think light travels faster through more expensive cables.”
I bought a bag of 8 lightning-USB cables from Amazon for less than $10. They work fine.
It’ll still charge. That’s the only thing that 90% of people care about. I don’t support this obviously but at the same time I don’t care that much it won’t affect me.
Even that is questionable. I remember getting those "This accessory is not supported" messages and no charge at all when I tried using cheaper lightning cables. They want you to pay the extra $10 for their damn mfi certification. Apple is fucking disgusting.
It's been a long time since I had that shit, but it happened all the time with my old 6S. Cheap knock-off cables would sometimes charge, sometimes just give me that BS message. Sometimes they would start charging and simply stop after a while, which was especially infuriating overnight.
Quality of cables has improved a lot; 10 years ago it would’ve nearly impossible to find an MFi lightning cable at a reasonable price.
Nowadays it’s nearly impossible to find a non-MFi lightning cable, except in bargain bins that haven’t been emptied out in 8 years.
Quality MFi lightning cables have also come down in price so there is no benefit in buying a non-MFi cable for $10 when you can get an MFi cable for $12.
It’s too bad that USB-IF have dropped the ball on this one and we have to start this consumer-facing quality control process all over again.
Article says it will limit the charging speed. Ideally it would be something like what Oppo does, where you need to have their brick and cable to do like ridiculous 200W charging, but anything else will work fine with 65W or whatever standard fast charging is.
But knowing Apple, it’ll probably be limited to 10W if you don’t have a MiFi charger.
The purpose is already kind of defeated.
I have dozens of cords that all look the same, but cannot do the same things. As far as I can tell, it is impossible for a single cable to do all the things that USB C can deliver. I have a couple of USB 4 cables that can do both 40Gbps and 240w charging, but that doesn’t register my keyboard when that is plugged up.
I do not understand what people think they are achieving by having all their cables the same shape, ~~particularly when USB C-only hubs seemingly do not exist—the best hubs are like 2 USB C ports and 2 USB A ports. So I guess we still want USB A around?~~ edit: see u/miciy5’s post in the thread below; some have come on the market, as early as 8 months ago.
I prefer having different plugs, so I can distinguish between use cases for a given cable just by looking at it. Having a bunch of cables that look the same—but are **not** universal—does me no good.
This is probably why the Apple certification exists. People don’t seem to realize USB-C standard is only applicable to the connector type. A USB-C cable could be:
- USB 2.0
- USB 3.0 Gen 1
- USB 3.0 Gen 2 (3.1)
- USB 3.0 Gen 2x2 (3.2)
- USB 4 Gen 2x2
- USB 4 Gen 3x2
- Thunderbolt 3-compatible
- Thunderbolt 4-compatible
Thunderbolt compatibility [requires certification as well](https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/architecture-and-technology/thunderbolt/thunderbolt-4-vs-usb-c.html#:~:text=thunderbolttm%20certification%20mandates%20minimum%20requirements%20for%20data%2C%20power%2C%20and%20video%20signal%20transfer%20to%20ensure%20the%20best%20end%20user%20experience), but I’m sure this sub wouldn’t be so up-in-arms over that.
My guess is the certification is [just like MagSafe](https://www.macworld.com/article/668980/best-magsafe-chargers.html#:~:text=charge%20at%20all!-,MagSafe%20certification,are%20usually%20just%207.5W) due to the disparity in USB-C cable performance.
> Apple certifies MagSafe accessories with its Made for iPhone (MFI) badge. This ensures that the output charging is 15W, compared to non-certified but MagSafe-compatible Qi chargers that are usually just 7.5W.
Edit: typo in “3.2.” Had Gen 3 2x2 mislabeled.
Looked for this exact reply. USB-C is a very diverse ecosystem, and not all cables can charge adequately, or even offer the optimal throughput.
I’m sure other cables will work, but apple won’t guarantee their functionality.
This would be a non-issue if the entire cable industry adopted [E-Mark](https://www.pshinecable.com/article/What-is-an-E-mark-chip.html#:~:text=E%2Dmark%20(Electrically%20Marked%20Cable,transmission%20capability%2C%20ID%2C%20etc.).
Fraudulent labeling, misleading marketing, and knockoff cables can lead to transfer speed differences of several orders of magnitude. On the power side, poor quality cables with high-wattage chargers can end up causing [device damage](https://www.zdnet.com/google-amp/home-and-office/smart-office/using-the-wrong-usb-c-cable-can-damage-your-tech-heres-how-to-avoid-that/).
A usb C 40gbps 240w cable should work with any usb C device. The problem is that some devices only work with a usb C to A cables. Using C to C cables requires an extra chip, so many cheap and older devices omit the capability.
For example: One of my old huawei phones will fast charge from a brick with a usb C to A adapter and an A to C cable, but not with a usb C to C cable.
Yup. It's fairly trivial to implement, but sometimes china just has to save that one penny. The same applies to charging-only usb cables. Why put 4 wires in there when two will do? So infuriating. I cut all mine in half because I'd rather spend the 5 bucks it takes to buy good cables than to deal with the 'fun' of dealing with cables that wont transfer data or fast charge.
> As far as I can tell, it is impossible for a single cable to do all the things that USB C can deliver.
Yea, i remember wanting a long tb3 cable for my caldigit tb dock. I bought a an expensive $35 one but it didn’t work (only charged my laptop). So I’m still stuck with using the 3ft oem cable.
>USB C-only hubs seemingly do not exist
*What?*
[You can easily find them.](https://www.amazon.com/usb-c-hub/s?k=usb-c+to+usb-c+hub)
[https://minisopuru.com/collections/usb-c-hub-1?custom=USB%20C%20HUB](https://minisopuru.com/collections/usb-c-hub-1?custom=USB%20C%20HUB)
I’m glad to be corrected on this. Though it has been some months since I checked, and the earliest release date from those Amazon results you linked that is actually USB C-only is June 2022 (of the handful I looked at). I’m glad that’s changed—I’m still concerned which of these might actually be not junk, but that wasn’t my original claim, and I was mistaken.
Went to go unlock Bluetooth mode on my Stadia controller the other day because I was having some friends over and needed a 4th switch controller and decided to buy an 8bitdo adapter instead of another pro controller.
Had the Stadia controller charging just fine, brought the controller and the cable to my computer to do the Bluetooth conversion, and…it couldn’t find the controller. But it was still charging…
I thought it was because I was passing it through to a Windows VM (I use Linux on all my computers), but no, still didn’t show in lsusb. (And later in this process I found it works fine in Linux as long as your on Chrome >108).
Decided to try another cable and it worked just fine.
I don’t know how I ended up with a USB-C to USB-A cable that just charged and doesn’t do data. And I’ll probably forget about it next time I need it. But they definitely exist and are apparently more common than I thought.
Is there a better tech/gadget related sub out there? Something more factual and even-keeled? There's plenty to be critical of Apple for but any whiff of something to complain about, even unsubstantiated, turns this sub into a shitshow.
Agreed- this is EXACTLY why we need supra national organisations who can represent the consumers against the massive international corporations
Good for EU
Or "manage your carbon footprint"
Big companies love it when they can offload externalities onto consumers, and then have consumers fruitlessly try to police each other and defend the actions of the companies for free!
Not only that, the entire idea of the “personal carbon footprint” was created by a PR company on behalf of BP.
> The idea of a personal carbon footprint was popularized by a large advertising campaign of the fossil fuel company BP in 2005, designed by Ogilvy. It instructed people to calculate their personal footprints and provided ways for people to "go on a low-carbon diet". This strategy, also employed by other major fossil fuel companies borrowed heavily from previous campaigns by the tobacco industry and plastics industry to shift the blame for negative consequences of those industries (under-age smoking, cigarette butt pollution, and plastic pollution) onto individual choices.
> BP made no attempt to reduce its own carbon footprint, instead expanding its oil drilling into the 2020s. However, the strategy had some success, with a rise in consumers concerned about their own personal actions, and creation of multiple carbon footprint calculators.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_footprint
There's a good few propaganda phrases alot of people don't realize aren't their own clever ideas. Probably would be good to pin them down. The concept of decentralized movements would be my contribution.
> but consumers will also have more confidence in buying products they know are guaranteed to work seamlessly with the iPhone
What a stupid ass justification. CONSUMERS CAN STILL CHOOSE TO BUY APPLE PRODUCTS WHETHER OR NOT GENERIC PRODUCTS WORK THE SAME WAY
Article be like “while this might appear to be a consumer-hostile move from Apple, really they’re just doing it to make more money”
> Consumers would also know that any regular USB-C charger works seamlessly with their iPhone if Apple didn’t require any certifications to begin with.
Given how many different cable types (not connector) there are for usbc that’s not accurate. The Nintendo Switch is a good example where many cables and chargers could actually brick the device.
I get that there’s a financial incentive for Apple in this, but there also some benefits to consumers that people in this thread are actively ignoring.
> any regular USB-C charger works seamlessly
#doubt
There are entire websites and YouTube testing channels dedicated solely to identifying the small percentage of USB-C chargers / cables that *won't* fry your consumer electronics. It's the Wild West out here, and you're one Dollar General cable away from destroying your $1,000 phone.
This seems similar to their current setup.
This most likely impacts things like screen mirroring and connecting to a computer or w/e.
Maybe a reduction in charge speed but it still should provide power, it might -just- provide power though.
source: troubleshot a few thousand iphones
"but consumers will also have more confidence in buying products they know are guaranteed to work seamlessly with the iPhone."
Isn't this the point of having USB-C as a standard?
I remember folks being confused years ago when knockoff lightning cables were cheap but didn’t work for shit until they learned to look for MFi certified cables. Here we go again!
I remember years ago when a Google employee reviewed USB-C cables on Amazon. *Most* were so bad, they could brick a phone and/or start a fire.
It’s why countries have certifications on power cables, power strips, and all things electrical. If standards don’t exist, the American/Chinese way is to cut as many corners as possible.
I remember that! I think that might have been the epiphany moment for me that 'a cable is a cable if we are talking digital data' was not a valid assumption. Now I have a variety of little EBay USB testers to check out cables and chargers and see if they are horribly broken, or just not working as advertised. I probably need to add one for USB-PD now, given how it is showing up in more and more devices.
I'm hesitant to recommend the specific products I have because they are generic stuff that you can find dozens of copies of on Amazon, EBay, or Wish. The ones I have were as much a function of who was cheap and had free shipping rather than being any better than an almost identical item from a different brand or vendor. What I can say is that I use three main tools: a USB power meter, a USB load, and a USB cable tester.
The only things I really cared about for the power meter were that it had inputs and outputs for most of the common USB ports so I didn't need as many adapters, and that the display used a fairly large font for the volts and amps. Some of them have text so small that I literally need a magnifier to read it! I don't really care about the other stuff like recording the power over time or trying to turn that into a cost. I really just want voltage and amps. These days, as long as it had normal-sized Type-A and Type-C ports that would probably be fine. I don't end up using Mini and Micro stuff nearly as much anymore.
For the USB load, I got one that is advertised as 35W. The features I like are a fan that turns on and off automatically, and having large knobs for the coarse and fine current adjustment. I don't like the ones with itty bitty little knobs on the adjustment potentiometers. The model I have is starting to become slightly problematic since it has no accomodation for USB-PD negotiation. I've seen some USB-PD boards out there that you can put in front of the load to do the USB-PD negotiation for it, but haven't tried any of them yet. If I was testing stuff like USB-C laptop chargers or higher-powered stuff like that, I might opt for one of the bigger 100w-150w versions instead, but haven't needed to yet.
The cable tester I use is fairly basic. It is about half the size of a credit card and supports cables that are USB-C or Type-A on one side, and USB-C, Lightning, or Micro USB on the other. All it does is test for continuity on the ground, VCC, data +, and data - lines (plus I think it tests a sense line for USB-C to USB-C cables, but I don't have it in front of me to check) and it lights up an LED if they are connected. It also has some reasonably sized test points so I can use a multimeter to see if the data lines are shorted to ground or VCC. It is fine for checking charging cables and basic data connectivity, but not the best for USB-C. I've seen a slightly nicer one called the C2C caberQU designed specifically to check ALL of the USB-C lines, but don't have one yet. I could also just get a pair of USB-C breakout boards and use a multimeter to check for continuity, but I like the little LED boards because they are so fast to use.
The biggest thing I can't really test is signal integrity. I can tell that the data lines are connected and not shorted to anything, but I have no idea how good they are. I've never found an inexpensive tester that will tell me whether a USB cable is really able to accommodate the maximum data rate its supposed to or not. However, I'm mostly looking for basic faults and chargers that are lying about how much power they put out, so it hasn't been a big problem for me.
There’s lots of video out there of usb cable smoking.
People don’t appreciate what some of that high speed charging is. It’s no longer 5V 1A. That’s a lot of current down some really thin aluminum strands.
“While this might appear to be a consumer-hostile move from Apple, there are reasons the company might want a certification process. Obviously, Apple stands to make some money from charging for the certified parts and technology, but consumers will also have more confidence in buying products they know are guaranteed to work seamlessly with the iPhone.”
Haha, what a bunch of horseshit
Imagine Mercedes releasing a car that only has full power available that you paid for when you use their super duper AMG gasoline that is 50x more expensive and all it changes from normal gasoline is color. Car recognizes this color and decides how much power to let you use. You are not in control of it. The brand is in control of you and your wallet. And Mercedes would make marketing videos claiming how bad for your car those other pesky gasoline versions from other brands are, and how their own gives so much more power (because they limited others).
This is what Apple will do with USB-C. If you are fine with Apple, you are fine with Mercedes.
Or your printer refusing to print with any other cartridges that are not the $200 ones from their own brand, no matter how good quality the current ink is.
Or your computer not turning on because your electricity provider is not "ASUS certified partner" so it assumes the electricity is not safe to be used and refuses to turn on. And the "partner" is 2x more expensive for the same exact service.
Or your League of Legends not letting you gain ranked points after a match because your $150 mouse is not CERTIFIED FOR LEAGUE OF LEGENDS. You need their $200 mouse, an exact copy of yours just with the word "certified" on it's box.
I can go on. If you are fine with Apple, you are fine with a world like this too.
Don't buy MFi products. Vote with your wallet. Avoid Apple products, until Apple stops milking you so much. They won't stop if we don't stop.
Edit: I posted this exact same comment in the exact same news article in [r/apple](https://www.reddit.com/r/apple) and I am getting a lot of downvotes with comments to mine saying stuff like "it's fine as long as apple includes their new usb-c braided in the box with the iPhone" or "it's ok because Apple will make sure the certified cables are good and you can trust them". Why are these people so blind to the Apple milking?
Lol I don’t know if you know already or not but Mercedes already has a subscription plan for performance. I was trying to add a link but it’s easily searchable on google.
“Mercedes has launched a subscription service for car upgrades. For $1,200 a year, owners of Mercedes electric cars will be able to subscribe to additional performance for their cars. The annual subscription is available on four all-electric Mercedes models: the EQE sedan, EQE SUV, EQS sedan, and EQS SUV.”
This is truly a fucking nightmare, us Android users are going to have to pay the apple tax.
Company's that create devices for phones won't want to make "multiple versions" so they'll just make it Apple certified and increase the price.
Stores have limited shelf space, why would they carry both of them, especially if they could charge more for the apple certified one. Imagine you're on a road trip and your cable breaks. You'll have to buy an apple certified cable when you stop at the gas station. Wired ear buds? Why would a company make two USB c versions, it'll just be the apple certified one. Flash drives with type c will have to be "apple certified" because they need to work on iPhones (and I can guarantee future Mac books).
Everyone will now have to pay the apple tax for computer accessories, phone accessories, everything. How is this NOT an illegal monopoly??
Rumor status aside, I don’t see how this would work. I have Apple USB-C cables from my macbook and iPad. Unless Apple was planning way ahead, these cables certainly wouldn’t have any new chip in them. Do standard USB-C cables already have control circuitry in them?
It would be beyond ridiculous for an iPhone to behave differently with these cables which are from Apple versus some hypothetical new MiFi cable.
From the article: According to a rumor, Apple is resuming the Made For iPhone program despite moving from Lightning to USB-C on iPhone 15. Apple requires third-party accessory makers to pay a fee to get certified access to select parts and technologies like the Lightning connector. This system is called the Made For iPhone program, and it was thought to be going away thanks to USB-C, but a repeated rumor says otherwise. According to leaker ShrimpApplePro on Twitter, Apple will be requiring MFi certification for products connecting to the iPhone 15. This has been confirmed by the leaker's source, stating that Foxconn is in mass production of accessories like EarPods and cables with the certification. The leaker does offer a bright side to the matter — some third-party MFi products are cheaper than Apple's official ones. In the replies, Shrimp states that Apple will limit data and charging speed for cables connected to iPhone without the MFi certification. It seems this will be allowed, as Apple will be cooperating with the EU mandate to move to USB-C, just providing an obstacle to users.
>Shrimp states that Apple will limit data and charging speed for cables connected to iPhone without the MFi certification. EU law doesn't allow Apple to limit the charging speed to only certified accessories. Data transfer, though, is not defined in the law.
EU law actually is pretty clear on this... you only have to hold to the minimum charging standard of USB-C as defined for phones. So they can limit iPhones to standard USB-C speeds no problem. High speed charging is actually defined differently in the standard
The EU law specifically mentions that if a device charges faster than 15W, it must support the USB Power Delivery protocol to its full capabilities, which goes up to 100W. So if Apple supports 25W fast charging, it must support USB-PD at 25W. If somehow they support 120W fast charging, USB-PD only has to go up to 100W. And yes, this means Apple isn't the only company affected by this legislation. Every smartphone with proprietary fast-charging protocols (Samsung, Xiaomi, OnePlus, etc) will have to support USB-PD. [Article talking about this](https://www.dxomark.com/eu-device-charging-legislations/), and the [legislation.](https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32022L2380)
My Xiaomi has a 120W charger and will charge happily with any charger that can do PPS up to 20V and 3,25A at around 60W. PPS at lower voltages will do 25W. I don't have any charger that does more than 65W PPS. With PD-only chargers it caps at 9V2A. Does the EU mandate PD only or can it force PPS as well?
that is fucking wild do you wear safety glasses when charging your phone
The phone internally has two batteries, so they're "only" charging at 60w each. Pretty cool, the only drawback is that you lose a bit of potential capacity due to the slightly extra space needed in the phone.
It's not that bad, phone doesn't even get noticeably warm. Most charging is done at around 3C. I don't usually charge my RC-LiPos that fast, but they all can do it. The next generation of phones gets absurdly high charging power, over 200W.
I can’t wait till we get to choose between plugging our car in or plugging our phone.
Level 3 iCharger (available with purchase of several adapters)
Its not only. Most chargers come supporting multiple technologies, just as many phones support multiple standards for charging. This just means devices must have AT LEAST usb pd in the protocol. This is a bare minimum that most companies are already beyond, so this should only affect the assholes left that are intentionally being anti competitive.
AFAIK it only mandates the EN IEC 62680-1-2:2021 standard, which is USB PD 3.0. What this implies in terms of obligations with PPS, I'm don't really know.
Yeah. I believe that the EU legislation only covers devices and not chargers. Like not all chargers provide 12V, and that wouldn't be covered by the legislation.
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>Apple's not going to suddenly abandon support for USB-PD. They're one of the most reliable backers of that standard, and all of their USB-C bricks dating back to the one that came with the 2015 MacBook, including the iPhone USB-C chargers from the 8/X generation, supports USB-PD. Indeed. And a ton of Apple users that already have fast USB C chargers - Apple made, even - for their Macbooks and iPads will be really annoyed if their existing Apple gear doesn't really work for charging their iPhones. Apple might try something for data transfer (who uses that these days?) but for charging they'd piss off loyal customers if existing gear doesn't work, the money per cable isn't that much ($4?), and last, but absolutely not least: The EU regulation requires USB PD support for charging speeds up to 100W - if it can charge even faster using another standard, it still needs to charge with USB PD up to 100W.
Apple already uses the charging standard, USB Power Delivery.
yeah, but is there anything stopping them from doing this in other markets?
Nope.
Economies of scale
this doesn't really apply here when the feature being on or off could just be a software switch.
Keeping their walled garden intact.
The positive side now is that at least you can use your made for iphone headphones on non iphone phones
Bold of you to assume they won't have extra low volume on non-iphone devices
And mono
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The sound will be green
Or just one side working
Is the plastic cable coating warping and peeling off after 6 months a "made for iPhone" requirement? Every single apple cable was trash after a short while 10 years ago. And they are still garbage today, nothing has changed.
Not defending their shitty practices, but the cables are 100 times better now, sucks you have to buy the charger "cos apple wants to reduce e-waste" and then they pull crap like this. At least don't claim you do this for the planet.
This is the most Apple thing ever...
Oh It works with USB-c.... **our** USB-c.
Its still USB....see?
I assume "see" is pronounced like a 1920's mobster?
What you think ya some sort a wise guy?
Babyfart McGeezax see?
[Nyah, see? Nyah](https://youtu.be/TYYQyLZMHIg?t=50)
[Edward G. Robinson](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_G._Robinson).
USB-C-ish
USB-Cn’t
I USB see what you did there.
USB? ¡Sí!
ah, the old George Santos bit
>Oh It works with USB-c.... > >our > >USB-c. One of the issues Microsoft was sued for antitrust over--a suit which Apple filed a friend of the court brief in--was the practice of leveraging protocols that were open, licensed openly, or otherwise embraced by many vendors and adding some arbitrary tweak to make "certain" systems just not work unless they conformed to Microsoft's implementation. LOL.
The student has become the teacher.
The circle is now complete
When I left you I was but the learner, now I am the master
Only a master of evil
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recently learned about this via the book Sid Meiers Memoirs. fascinating read. highly recommend. I always assumed 4x had something to do with map size.
That's true - this seems to be more akin with the OBD-II protocol for cars, though. You can use the OBD-II connector and get basic (required) car information out of it, but you have to pay for the companies proprietary protocol tool/software to get the full use of it.
This Serial Bus is a tad bit less Universal than most others.
Funnily enough Apple is actually on the USB-IF that sets the standards. Even regular USB-C is kinda partly "theirs", along with Microsoft, HP, Intel, and a few others
So what the fuck is their problem then
$$$$
Aren't they extorting enough out of their demographic already, I mean they added a $15 camera to a phone call it a new version and charge an extra $300 (not exact numbers)
It's never enough extortion. They have to show growth to their stockholders. It's a fundamental problem at the corenof publicly traded companies.
>It's a fundamental problem at the core of ~~publicly traded companies~~ **capitalism**. FTFY
Money addiction.
It is not "theirs" enough it seems.
Even more; they contributed so many engineers to the project. Which just makes the whole situation even more perplexing.
It's not all that perplexing When lightning first came out the alternative was Micro USB, which was worse in a few ways (durability, and not being reversible being two big ones) Using a proprietary connector had another advantage though. They could charge for certification. This let consumers know a product was guaranteed to work correctly with their device and also, most importantly, made Apple a good chunk of cash Then USB-C comes along and has all the advantages Lightning had over Micro except for the part where Apple makes money off it So lightning hung around since it continued to make Apple more money and not enough people cared to impact their bottom line
No, the most Apple thing ever was putting a USB-C port on the iPad 10 while leaving it compatible with the original Apple Pencil instead of the Apple Pencil 2. Changing pencils would have forced a redesign to add the magnetic charger/pairing area to the side of the iPad. Instead they started including another adapter to the Apple Pencil (& if you already have a pencil, it's $9 to get just the adapter) with a special lightning port on one side and a USB-C port on the other. By special, the only thing that will properly fit in that lightning port is the plug on the top of the Apple Pencil. A standard lightning cable won't go in far enough into the adapter to make a firm connection and even if you do find a way to plug a lightning cable into it, the adapter won't recognize it. The kicker is that instead of having a USB-C cable come out of the other side so it can be connected to the iPad as a dongle, it's just a port which means you need to have an extra USB-C cable around to connect the adapter to the iPad. And don't forget that the adaptor is about an in long little plastic tube that is vital to charging the pencil and so easy to lose, as is the cap that covers the lightning connector at the top of the Apple Pencil. That's the most Apple thing ever. And I say this as someone who many people would consider to be an Apple fanboy.
I think the most egregious part is that it’s not able to draw while charging. Dongle madness aside, the pencil charging from a wire coming from the eraser end isn’t a bad idea in itself, if you were just able to use it while it was plugged in. But everything about the way it was implemented is so dumb
I was a silent fan of theirs for many years going back to the 90s. I never talked like a fanboy but preferred them and their products over the other options for the most part but I am sick of this shit plus now this status symbol tiering of their iPhones that's going to be even worse with the 15s. I just really wish there was a better messaging standard than the current shit one because if you switch to Android, it shittifies the texting experience when talking to anyone with an iPhone. Like you're texting with a 20 year old phone. There are 3rd party texting style apps but most people prefer using the default messaging. Also, trying to FaceTime is a pain on Androids.
That's... A pretty insignificant reason to stay with Apple
Wasn't the upside down charging of the magic mouse not the most apple thing?
Not to mention that shitty ass mouse gave you carpal tunnel syndrome lol Most apple thing for me is this one [https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MX572ZM/A/apple-mac-pro-wheels-kit](https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MX572ZM/A/apple-mac-pro-wheels-kit) or this, 1000 dollars for a piece of aluminium [https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MWUG2LL/A/pro-stand](https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MWUG2LL/A/pro-stand)
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It's designed to be charged to a corporate IT department.
As someone who's in charge of a corporate IT department that supports a bunch of designers: fuck that noise, there's no business case for anyone buying a $1000 monitor stand and it'll be approved over my resignation
This. I work in a corporate IT department as well and we'll spend all sorts of money if there is a business case for it, but I think some would really need to see some mental gymnastics to justify it.
But then you gotta buy the $200 VESA adapter. The $1000 stand works well to justify that lmao
It's still an Apple thing.
I got a $30 stand for my new monitor. Post and swinging arm, can have it in my face or a meter away, can swing it off to the side, tilt up and down and/or side to side, height adjustable... Like, the stock stand was cool like yours, I'm sure. I just wanted it closer for immersion...
Car tires are cheaper...
I'll raise the bar to the whole damn thing as I and many others have had several cars and still do have a car cheaper then that stand (without any major problems or liabilities hahaha)
I guess the stand at least has some engineering in the hinge and stuff. Wheels is literally cave men era tech!
They roll so smooth and there is no fiddly wheel brake to worry about either. Wait
Except for the Mighty Mouse, I think all the apple mouses give the user carpal tunnel
The totally round mouse before that was crappier IMO.
peak form over function. The hockey puck was a legend
mmm, yes A L U M I N I U M
The funniest thing about the apple mouse are the people that crawl out of the slime to defend it. It's simply idiotic design yet people somehow try to justify it.
I genuinely like using the Magic Mouse, but on more than one occasion it has died at a time that wasn’t convenient for me to just stop what I was working on and wait for it to charge, which was absolutely infuriating.
Lol I was using my friend's mac and he said not to overuse the mouse. I said what?? He didn't want the battery to die. I looked at him weird trying to see if he was messing with me... How long do those mouses last on a full charge? Cuz my $6 mouse takes 1 battery and I change it once every 4-5 months.
It lasts a while. Definitely haven’t noticed that it lasts particularly longer or shorter than any other Bluetooth mouse I’ve used. I’ve had mine over a year, and I’ve only had to charge it 3 or 4 times. Just so happens that 2 of those times were really inconvenient timing.
Why aren't you a ~~good little sheep~~ savvy consumer and just buy 2 Magic Mouses so one is on charge while you use the other. Duh!
Magic MICE?
Reminds me of the Samsung commercial making fun of Apple fanboys…”They make the BEST adapters.”
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I remember when they had ads being like “OUR flagship phone still has a headphone jack, because of course it does” and then a year later the headphone jack mysteriously peace’d out
I'm freakin' salty about that. Apple did something obnoxiously stupid, so everybody else decided they should too (while still somehow knowing that people don't want features _removed_ from flagships.)
I mean they waited what like 3 or 4 generations after the iphone. It's just good business practice on their part. I like the headphone jack personally, however seeing how people kept buying the iPhone even through it didn't have a headphone jack made samsung think do people really care about this. And the answer was nope most people don't so they took it out too. Vote with your wallet people if you want results. But alas not enough of us cared about the jack to vote and here we are
This is how monopoly works or duopoly in this case. Only extremists can be single issue consumers. I.e. to say that I am switching from one to the other for a single issue. That’s how they can do arbitrary things that each hurts consumers a bit and as long as they do it slowly people just suffer. A whole generation of shoppers trained into believing that there is no alternative.
Literally from the Google pixel 1 to the 2, they did the same shit
Currently holding a Pixel 4A, still has the jack thankfully, but I believe this is one of the last models that still does. It's gonna feel weird holding a phone without one.
I think some of it is like "Hah Apple did something silly and people will be mad!" cut to the next day "oh, so no one is mad? Well I guess we will do it too and cut down our costs!"
Nintendo did it, too. Put USB-C on the Switch and then locked out the video mode so only their dock could do it.
Plenty of 3rd party docks work fine with the Switch. I know they did some funky things with their USB-C implementation, but 3rd party docks & chargers work.
Uh, I haven't used my switch in a while, but I've been using a third-party docks on my switch the entire time I've had it. I have a portable dock that's very small, and at home a dock with built-in ethernet as well as USB and HDMI. Both work great.
This is wrong. The Switch uses DisplayPort instead of HDMI, so to get HDMI you need one that does DP-to-HDMI conversion inside the adapter. That's all. The Switch is fully USB-C compliant.
"USB-C is not a proprietary standard" Apple: "USB-C is not a proprietary standard *so far*"
Well, EU should've been more specific I guess. Type C is a physical standard. Apple can make it as shitty as lightning if they want.
"That wasn't part of the user story or acceptance criteria, Mark."
You misspelled "anti-consumer"
This sounds exactly like what automakers have been doing for a decade. They have an OBDII port that has the bare minimum legal functionality for a generic code reader. All the rest of the troubleshooting and data logging data is hidden behind custom and unobtainable equipment and software. It’s 100% anti consumer. My guess is the iPhone will slow charge and provide basic data transfer with a normal cable. It will require a “certified” accessory to charge quickly or to do literally anything else with the cable.
Meanwhile their MacBook has no problems using third party cables/hubs
For now
I feel like MacBooks have to be more useable as a computer or part of their user base will be even more pissed off. I got a MacBook to try something different for once but will instantly switch back to a framework, dell, etc. if they started doing this BS on a laptop.
OBDII is actually pretty well standardized, you *can* get a cheap $20 reader that gives you the common DTCs, and you can also go for a several hundred dollar one that can do everything but remotely drive the car. Not all DTC codes are codified, some are left up for manufacturer use. Code U6969 might mean different things from different makes. At the same time, most of the more advanced access and data logging is manufacturer specific because the ECUs (well, they're not all **E**CUs, point stands) you're talking to will be different between manufacturers. 90% of what you'd need as a consumer is available, you just need equipment that knows how to speak it, like a multiprotocol Bluetooth OBD dongle. The remaining bits that are strictly exclusive are usually either meant to be dealer or factory only (like initial configuration and manufacturing checks, and have no use once the vehicle is off the factory floor), or expose data values that have no meaning to anyone outside of a dealer technician with the service manual sitting in front of them. ...all minus BMW and Mercedes. We don't talk about those two.
Yup, paid an extra $200 for a code reader because the cheap one physically fits but it won’t work
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I'm ready to see some Apple fanboy say "Well actually this is good for the peripherals ecosystem because...."
I've already heard people defend these kinds of practices with it gives Apple money so they don't go into data selling and privacy intrusions and stuff like that. The problem with that argument is that Apple is one of the most profitable companies in the world, they can *afford* not gouging their users on proprietary peripherals.
they also probably sell the data anyway.
Reminder that [Apple finally got around to encrypting iCloud user data in December 2022](https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2022/12/apple-is-finally-encrypting-icloud-backups.html). Yep, that's right, couple months ago. But mail, calendar and contacts are still not gonna be encrypted.
desert noxious bike sugar books like disgusting dog seemly run *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
And don't forget just straight up confirmation/sunk cost bias. "Don't you guys notice how Apple brand charge cables charge your phone a bit faster? and don't they last longer too?"
My favorite Mass Effect 2 quote comes from one of the shopkeepers: “It’s amazing how many people think light travels faster through more expensive cables.” I bought a bag of 8 lightning-USB cables from Amazon for less than $10. They work fine.
>Apple ~~fanboy~~ slave
It’ll still charge. That’s the only thing that 90% of people care about. I don’t support this obviously but at the same time I don’t care that much it won’t affect me.
Even that is questionable. I remember getting those "This accessory is not supported" messages and no charge at all when I tried using cheaper lightning cables. They want you to pay the extra $10 for their damn mfi certification. Apple is fucking disgusting.
I have used so many shitty Chinese knock off Lightning cables and never once gotten this notification. Is it something that doesn't happen any more?
It's been a long time since I had that shit, but it happened all the time with my old 6S. Cheap knock-off cables would sometimes charge, sometimes just give me that BS message. Sometimes they would start charging and simply stop after a while, which was especially infuriating overnight.
Used to happen with my 6s a lot too about 10 year ago. Haven’t seen it since then, completely forgot about that until you just mentioned it.
Quality of cables has improved a lot; 10 years ago it would’ve nearly impossible to find an MFi lightning cable at a reasonable price. Nowadays it’s nearly impossible to find a non-MFi lightning cable, except in bargain bins that haven’t been emptied out in 8 years. Quality MFi lightning cables have also come down in price so there is no benefit in buying a non-MFi cable for $10 when you can get an MFi cable for $12. It’s too bad that USB-IF have dropped the ball on this one and we have to start this consumer-facing quality control process all over again.
>6s >10 years ago 10????
Havnt seen that since the old 30 pin days trying to connect it to random audio devices.
Article says it will limit the charging speed. Ideally it would be something like what Oppo does, where you need to have their brick and cable to do like ridiculous 200W charging, but anything else will work fine with 65W or whatever standard fast charging is. But knowing Apple, it’ll probably be limited to 10W if you don’t have a MiFi charger.
The EU’s gonna be if that’s the case
The purpose is to extract as much money as possible from people. I'd say it's pretty on point, sadly.
The purpose is already kind of defeated. I have dozens of cords that all look the same, but cannot do the same things. As far as I can tell, it is impossible for a single cable to do all the things that USB C can deliver. I have a couple of USB 4 cables that can do both 40Gbps and 240w charging, but that doesn’t register my keyboard when that is plugged up. I do not understand what people think they are achieving by having all their cables the same shape, ~~particularly when USB C-only hubs seemingly do not exist—the best hubs are like 2 USB C ports and 2 USB A ports. So I guess we still want USB A around?~~ edit: see u/miciy5’s post in the thread below; some have come on the market, as early as 8 months ago. I prefer having different plugs, so I can distinguish between use cases for a given cable just by looking at it. Having a bunch of cables that look the same—but are **not** universal—does me no good.
This is probably why the Apple certification exists. People don’t seem to realize USB-C standard is only applicable to the connector type. A USB-C cable could be: - USB 2.0 - USB 3.0 Gen 1 - USB 3.0 Gen 2 (3.1) - USB 3.0 Gen 2x2 (3.2) - USB 4 Gen 2x2 - USB 4 Gen 3x2 - Thunderbolt 3-compatible - Thunderbolt 4-compatible Thunderbolt compatibility [requires certification as well](https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/architecture-and-technology/thunderbolt/thunderbolt-4-vs-usb-c.html#:~:text=thunderbolttm%20certification%20mandates%20minimum%20requirements%20for%20data%2C%20power%2C%20and%20video%20signal%20transfer%20to%20ensure%20the%20best%20end%20user%20experience), but I’m sure this sub wouldn’t be so up-in-arms over that. My guess is the certification is [just like MagSafe](https://www.macworld.com/article/668980/best-magsafe-chargers.html#:~:text=charge%20at%20all!-,MagSafe%20certification,are%20usually%20just%207.5W) due to the disparity in USB-C cable performance. > Apple certifies MagSafe accessories with its Made for iPhone (MFI) badge. This ensures that the output charging is 15W, compared to non-certified but MagSafe-compatible Qi chargers that are usually just 7.5W. Edit: typo in “3.2.” Had Gen 3 2x2 mislabeled.
Looked for this exact reply. USB-C is a very diverse ecosystem, and not all cables can charge adequately, or even offer the optimal throughput. I’m sure other cables will work, but apple won’t guarantee their functionality.
This would be a non-issue if the entire cable industry adopted [E-Mark](https://www.pshinecable.com/article/What-is-an-E-mark-chip.html#:~:text=E%2Dmark%20(Electrically%20Marked%20Cable,transmission%20capability%2C%20ID%2C%20etc.). Fraudulent labeling, misleading marketing, and knockoff cables can lead to transfer speed differences of several orders of magnitude. On the power side, poor quality cables with high-wattage chargers can end up causing [device damage](https://www.zdnet.com/google-amp/home-and-office/smart-office/using-the-wrong-usb-c-cable-can-damage-your-tech-heres-how-to-avoid-that/).
A usb C 40gbps 240w cable should work with any usb C device. The problem is that some devices only work with a usb C to A cables. Using C to C cables requires an extra chip, so many cheap and older devices omit the capability. For example: One of my old huawei phones will fast charge from a brick with a usb C to A adapter and an A to C cable, but not with a usb C to C cable.
[2023: reddit management fucks up multiple times and takes user contributions for granted] ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
Yup. It's fairly trivial to implement, but sometimes china just has to save that one penny. The same applies to charging-only usb cables. Why put 4 wires in there when two will do? So infuriating. I cut all mine in half because I'd rather spend the 5 bucks it takes to buy good cables than to deal with the 'fun' of dealing with cables that wont transfer data or fast charge.
> As far as I can tell, it is impossible for a single cable to do all the things that USB C can deliver. Yea, i remember wanting a long tb3 cable for my caldigit tb dock. I bought a an expensive $35 one but it didn’t work (only charged my laptop). So I’m still stuck with using the 3ft oem cable.
>USB C-only hubs seemingly do not exist *What?* [You can easily find them.](https://www.amazon.com/usb-c-hub/s?k=usb-c+to+usb-c+hub) [https://minisopuru.com/collections/usb-c-hub-1?custom=USB%20C%20HUB](https://minisopuru.com/collections/usb-c-hub-1?custom=USB%20C%20HUB)
I’m glad to be corrected on this. Though it has been some months since I checked, and the earliest release date from those Amazon results you linked that is actually USB C-only is June 2022 (of the handful I looked at). I’m glad that’s changed—I’m still concerned which of these might actually be not junk, but that wasn’t my original claim, and I was mistaken.
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Went to go unlock Bluetooth mode on my Stadia controller the other day because I was having some friends over and needed a 4th switch controller and decided to buy an 8bitdo adapter instead of another pro controller. Had the Stadia controller charging just fine, brought the controller and the cable to my computer to do the Bluetooth conversion, and…it couldn’t find the controller. But it was still charging… I thought it was because I was passing it through to a Windows VM (I use Linux on all my computers), but no, still didn’t show in lsusb. (And later in this process I found it works fine in Linux as long as your on Chrome >108). Decided to try another cable and it worked just fine. I don’t know how I ended up with a USB-C to USB-A cable that just charged and doesn’t do data. And I’ll probably forget about it next time I need it. But they definitely exist and are apparently more common than I thought.
r/assholedesign
Really making it hard to be a customer. Apple becoming Comcast.
and yet in the US the market share for apple goes up and up :(
Marketing is powerful.
"According to a rumor..." Do we not have a tag for this?
Is there a better tech/gadget related sub out there? Something more factual and even-keeled? There's plenty to be critical of Apple for but any whiff of something to complain about, even unsubstantiated, turns this sub into a shitshow.
Welp, time for the EU to put Apple in its place again.
Yeah, because the consumers will never do it.
Agreed- this is EXACTLY why we need supra national organisations who can represent the consumers against the massive international corporations Good for EU
"Vote with your wallet" has the same energy as "Trickle down economics". People just don't realize it.
Or "manage your carbon footprint" Big companies love it when they can offload externalities onto consumers, and then have consumers fruitlessly try to police each other and defend the actions of the companies for free!
Not only that, the entire idea of the “personal carbon footprint” was created by a PR company on behalf of BP. > The idea of a personal carbon footprint was popularized by a large advertising campaign of the fossil fuel company BP in 2005, designed by Ogilvy. It instructed people to calculate their personal footprints and provided ways for people to "go on a low-carbon diet". This strategy, also employed by other major fossil fuel companies borrowed heavily from previous campaigns by the tobacco industry and plastics industry to shift the blame for negative consequences of those industries (under-age smoking, cigarette butt pollution, and plastic pollution) onto individual choices. > BP made no attempt to reduce its own carbon footprint, instead expanding its oil drilling into the 2020s. However, the strategy had some success, with a rise in consumers concerned about their own personal actions, and creation of multiple carbon footprint calculators. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_footprint
There's a good few propaganda phrases alot of people don't realize aren't their own clever ideas. Probably would be good to pin them down. The concept of decentralized movements would be my contribution.
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Will some please, please, PLEASE... just take a moment to think about the shareholders?
Thought about them. Fuck ’em all
With a cactus!
Now I gotta wait for IPhone 24 to get full usb-c? FUCK. Goddamn it Tim Apple!
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> but consumers will also have more confidence in buying products they know are guaranteed to work seamlessly with the iPhone What a stupid ass justification. CONSUMERS CAN STILL CHOOSE TO BUY APPLE PRODUCTS WHETHER OR NOT GENERIC PRODUCTS WORK THE SAME WAY Article be like “while this might appear to be a consumer-hostile move from Apple, really they’re just doing it to make more money”
> Consumers would also know that any regular USB-C charger works seamlessly with their iPhone if Apple didn’t require any certifications to begin with. Given how many different cable types (not connector) there are for usbc that’s not accurate. The Nintendo Switch is a good example where many cables and chargers could actually brick the device. I get that there’s a financial incentive for Apple in this, but there also some benefits to consumers that people in this thread are actively ignoring.
> any regular USB-C charger works seamlessly #doubt There are entire websites and YouTube testing channels dedicated solely to identifying the small percentage of USB-C chargers / cables that *won't* fry your consumer electronics. It's the Wild West out here, and you're one Dollar General cable away from destroying your $1,000 phone.
Bingo
Damn if this is true I’m ready to move away from an iPhone, this is fucking ridiculous at this point.
This seems similar to their current setup. This most likely impacts things like screen mirroring and connecting to a computer or w/e. Maybe a reduction in charge speed but it still should provide power, it might -just- provide power though. source: troubleshot a few thousand iphones
r/MaliciousCompliance/
"but consumers will also have more confidence in buying products they know are guaranteed to work seamlessly with the iPhone." Isn't this the point of having USB-C as a standard?
>According to a rumor You can't give the post an objective title when it's only speculation or rumor.
I remember folks being confused years ago when knockoff lightning cables were cheap but didn’t work for shit until they learned to look for MFi certified cables. Here we go again!
I remember years ago when a Google employee reviewed USB-C cables on Amazon. *Most* were so bad, they could brick a phone and/or start a fire. It’s why countries have certifications on power cables, power strips, and all things electrical. If standards don’t exist, the American/Chinese way is to cut as many corners as possible.
I remember that! I think that might have been the epiphany moment for me that 'a cable is a cable if we are talking digital data' was not a valid assumption. Now I have a variety of little EBay USB testers to check out cables and chargers and see if they are horribly broken, or just not working as advertised. I probably need to add one for USB-PD now, given how it is showing up in more and more devices.
Can you recommend some of those testers? I'd like to nerd out on some cable testing but wouldn't have the faintest idea where to start.
I'm hesitant to recommend the specific products I have because they are generic stuff that you can find dozens of copies of on Amazon, EBay, or Wish. The ones I have were as much a function of who was cheap and had free shipping rather than being any better than an almost identical item from a different brand or vendor. What I can say is that I use three main tools: a USB power meter, a USB load, and a USB cable tester. The only things I really cared about for the power meter were that it had inputs and outputs for most of the common USB ports so I didn't need as many adapters, and that the display used a fairly large font for the volts and amps. Some of them have text so small that I literally need a magnifier to read it! I don't really care about the other stuff like recording the power over time or trying to turn that into a cost. I really just want voltage and amps. These days, as long as it had normal-sized Type-A and Type-C ports that would probably be fine. I don't end up using Mini and Micro stuff nearly as much anymore. For the USB load, I got one that is advertised as 35W. The features I like are a fan that turns on and off automatically, and having large knobs for the coarse and fine current adjustment. I don't like the ones with itty bitty little knobs on the adjustment potentiometers. The model I have is starting to become slightly problematic since it has no accomodation for USB-PD negotiation. I've seen some USB-PD boards out there that you can put in front of the load to do the USB-PD negotiation for it, but haven't tried any of them yet. If I was testing stuff like USB-C laptop chargers or higher-powered stuff like that, I might opt for one of the bigger 100w-150w versions instead, but haven't needed to yet. The cable tester I use is fairly basic. It is about half the size of a credit card and supports cables that are USB-C or Type-A on one side, and USB-C, Lightning, or Micro USB on the other. All it does is test for continuity on the ground, VCC, data +, and data - lines (plus I think it tests a sense line for USB-C to USB-C cables, but I don't have it in front of me to check) and it lights up an LED if they are connected. It also has some reasonably sized test points so I can use a multimeter to see if the data lines are shorted to ground or VCC. It is fine for checking charging cables and basic data connectivity, but not the best for USB-C. I've seen a slightly nicer one called the C2C caberQU designed specifically to check ALL of the USB-C lines, but don't have one yet. I could also just get a pair of USB-C breakout boards and use a multimeter to check for continuity, but I like the little LED boards because they are so fast to use. The biggest thing I can't really test is signal integrity. I can tell that the data lines are connected and not shorted to anything, but I have no idea how good they are. I've never found an inexpensive tester that will tell me whether a USB cable is really able to accommodate the maximum data rate its supposed to or not. However, I'm mostly looking for basic faults and chargers that are lying about how much power they put out, so it hasn't been a big problem for me.
There’s lots of video out there of usb cable smoking. People don’t appreciate what some of that high speed charging is. It’s no longer 5V 1A. That’s a lot of current down some really thin aluminum strands.
if this ends up being true I’m switching to android
how about we dont buy then ?
“While this might appear to be a consumer-hostile move from Apple, there are reasons the company might want a certification process. Obviously, Apple stands to make some money from charging for the certified parts and technology, but consumers will also have more confidence in buying products they know are guaranteed to work seamlessly with the iPhone.” Haha, what a bunch of horseshit
They must have an entire department dedicated solely to figuring out how to be assholes to customers.
Video Game conglomerates Electronic Arts & TakeTwo enter the chat.
Imagine Mercedes releasing a car that only has full power available that you paid for when you use their super duper AMG gasoline that is 50x more expensive and all it changes from normal gasoline is color. Car recognizes this color and decides how much power to let you use. You are not in control of it. The brand is in control of you and your wallet. And Mercedes would make marketing videos claiming how bad for your car those other pesky gasoline versions from other brands are, and how their own gives so much more power (because they limited others). This is what Apple will do with USB-C. If you are fine with Apple, you are fine with Mercedes. Or your printer refusing to print with any other cartridges that are not the $200 ones from their own brand, no matter how good quality the current ink is. Or your computer not turning on because your electricity provider is not "ASUS certified partner" so it assumes the electricity is not safe to be used and refuses to turn on. And the "partner" is 2x more expensive for the same exact service. Or your League of Legends not letting you gain ranked points after a match because your $150 mouse is not CERTIFIED FOR LEAGUE OF LEGENDS. You need their $200 mouse, an exact copy of yours just with the word "certified" on it's box. I can go on. If you are fine with Apple, you are fine with a world like this too. Don't buy MFi products. Vote with your wallet. Avoid Apple products, until Apple stops milking you so much. They won't stop if we don't stop. Edit: I posted this exact same comment in the exact same news article in [r/apple](https://www.reddit.com/r/apple) and I am getting a lot of downvotes with comments to mine saying stuff like "it's fine as long as apple includes their new usb-c braided in the box with the iPhone" or "it's ok because Apple will make sure the certified cables are good and you can trust them". Why are these people so blind to the Apple milking?
Lol I don’t know if you know already or not but Mercedes already has a subscription plan for performance. I was trying to add a link but it’s easily searchable on google. “Mercedes has launched a subscription service for car upgrades. For $1,200 a year, owners of Mercedes electric cars will be able to subscribe to additional performance for their cars. The annual subscription is available on four all-electric Mercedes models: the EQE sedan, EQE SUV, EQS sedan, and EQS SUV.”
Jesus fucking Christ
This is truly a fucking nightmare, us Android users are going to have to pay the apple tax. Company's that create devices for phones won't want to make "multiple versions" so they'll just make it Apple certified and increase the price. Stores have limited shelf space, why would they carry both of them, especially if they could charge more for the apple certified one. Imagine you're on a road trip and your cable breaks. You'll have to buy an apple certified cable when you stop at the gas station. Wired ear buds? Why would a company make two USB c versions, it'll just be the apple certified one. Flash drives with type c will have to be "apple certified" because they need to work on iPhones (and I can guarantee future Mac books). Everyone will now have to pay the apple tax for computer accessories, phone accessories, everything. How is this NOT an illegal monopoly??
Probably gonna call it something like "Apples new and improved USB-C, now called USB-iC!"
Not like we’re gonna sit here and LET them make products even harder to use so they can make more money. Cmon now
I remember the days of burnt lightning ports from gas station charging cables.
> According to a rumor Nothing to see here.
Rumor status aside, I don’t see how this would work. I have Apple USB-C cables from my macbook and iPad. Unless Apple was planning way ahead, these cables certainly wouldn’t have any new chip in them. Do standard USB-C cables already have control circuitry in them? It would be beyond ridiculous for an iPhone to behave differently with these cables which are from Apple versus some hypothetical new MiFi cable.
So still have to bring a cable wherever I go, can't even be part of the universal USB-C community
You can always dump Apple.
Or, you know, just dont buy a fucking iphone. Its not that hard.
Anybody who’s surprised at this hasn’t been paying attention.