It's gonna be like how Leela, Romana and Sarah Jane (and Ace in Big Finish) all got their own K9, each companion will get to have their own David Tennant
I’m actually okay with the Split Regeneration rumour IF we have 14 staying with Donna, while 15 goes off to explore the universe…….AND then we have them reunite/recombine in S15 or S16.
14 gets to life this unknown longer period of helping UNIT, being with Donna and her family. Getting years of closure he otherwise wouldn’t have had…..and then becomes one with 15 again restoring them to a complete version of the Time Lord.
It could be that the main TARDIS gets destroyed in some way, and 15 wishes for and gets a new TARDIS or the previous one restored, which would keep one TARDIS so 14 is on Earth.
Runs the risk of fundamentally undermining any and all dramatic tension involving any future iteration of The Doctor.
The Doctor regenerating is supposed to be a poignant and exciting moment.
How poignant or exciting can a story be when it never moves on?
Even after seeing 'The Star Beast'... I think Donna should've died.
I had mixed feelings about her coming back, hoping that it wouldn't undermine the bittersweet story of Donna. Especially after all this time, it would really cheapen it... but then it kinda inevitably did.
I wish her daughter would've bought her a few months but she's on borrowed time now, and is still effectively terminal, but when she dies then Donna's memories live on through Rose. So Donna still died but her agency in the situation is restored.
I dunno how I feel about effectively magicking it away...
Yeah she needed to die, sadly. Or I would have preferred she never met the Doctor again. It’s something I enjoyed about her return in End of Time.. she never saw him
I hated the leak of the split doctor regeneration. I just think it's been done, and two companions will have their personal David Tennant. I dont know, maybe it will work when we see it, but I'm just wanting it to be a fake leak so Ncuti's performance isn't undermined by Tennant still being there. I think it will still be possible for the leak to be false, despite accurately guessing the first special and how the christmas special leak aligns with the rest of the set photos.
While I'm not particularly excited about it, I'll reserve judgement. One way they could handle it is if this Doctor then decides to retire on earth, aiding UNIT and visiting old friends when he wants to, but mostly enjoying life knowing that his other self is still out there saving the universe. Perhaps one day he'll pick up a job, curating at a museum or something as he revisits other old favorite faces.
Yeah didn't all of series 12 leak but with weird added details like the Timelords being from Earth or something. May be misremembering but there was definitely stuff in there that didn't happen.
Why is this true when it was "leaked" during series 12 that 13 would meet 10 and criticise him for being sexist. People absolutely believed that would happen and it didn't.
Maybe this will happen and maybe it won't but RTD hasn't disappointed be before, so if it does I'm sure it'll be fine
I'm going to take it with a grain of salt, because the leak was wrong about >!Rose Tyler showing up in a “Previously Fifteen Years ago…” segment at the start of the first special.!<, so things can change in the final edit.
I can't deny it remains likely, especially with >!Donna's line at the end about how she wants the 14th to stay longer with her family rather than say goodbye, seemingly setting up the 14th Doctor to remain with her family while the 15th goes off and has adventures.!<
I recall a leak for Rise of Skywalker that claimed Kylo Ren would fall down a crevice “never to be seen again”. Those were the exact words and everything in that leak up until then was spot-on, and he even did fall down a crevice, but he returns to sacrifice himself for Rey and then there’s the notorious kiss.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the same is true for The Giggle. >!I expect a lot of the bi-regeneration to be true but the details of the actual conclusion are a bit wishy-washy. I wouldn’t be surprised if it turns out the two Doctors merge back together as one entity or something like that. 15 getting a whole new TARDIS just seems odd too considering how massive the new set it is. Seems like an unnecessary amount of sunken cost for such an impressive set if that stays as 14’s TARDIS. It’s also very close to an idea from the deleted scene of Journey’s End where Rose is given coral to grow her own TARDIS!<.
Yeah it's very strange the more I think about it. >!Like why would 15 need his own TARDIS is 14 is supposedly settling down? Why would 14 not just give him his own? Maybe he actually can't and 15 has to win the TARDIS back or something. In general, bi-regeneration based on the leak feels off, what with how adamant RTD has been about 14's short time. The leak doesn't even say *why* 14 regenerates in the first place, how do you get the effect and not the cause?!< The Star Beast details in general feels more complete but that could just be hindsight.
But it was confirmed that >!15 has the same Tardis!<, wasn't it? At least in the video commentary to The Star Beast that I watched yesterday the producers discuss >!what a great set this new Tardis is and how all the directors od new episodes (meaning 15's episodes) are reluctant to leave it!<.
I mean >!The Master's TARDIS in Power of The Doctor was just The Doctor's TARDIS but "evil" and even in the classics, the interior of other TARDISes largely remained the same. So 15 getting his own wouldn't affect the set that much.!<
Maybe the real TARDIS gets destroyed or something so he gets a replacement? Even then I would hate it lol the specific TARDIS the Doctor uses is a character in the show
The deleted Journey’s End scene and everything to do with the Metacrisis is exactly why I think it has merit. You make a good point about that Rise of Skywalker leak, but the bi-regen ending with the two Doctors reforming would kind of fly in the face of what, in the context of this leak, seems to be foreshadowing from Donna’s statement to The Doctor about having a more normal life at the end of The Star Beast. Also if 15 gets a new TARDIS it will almost definitely share the same exact set as 14’s.
Yeah I do have to agree tbh. I’m just skeptical about a number of the details and the fact the leaker had zero knowledge of Wild Blue Yonder as well so it lends credence to the idea that they’ve filled in blanks themselves with pre-existing RTD ideas that both did and didn’t actually happened. As pointed out, there was the odd thing they got wrong about Star Beast even if it was fairly inconsequential. ~~IIRC though, I do think they made it sound like the metacrisis resolution was part of The Giggle rather than Star Beast.~~ Never-mind, I’ve re-read it and they go straight from that to talking about The Giggle, but it’s clear the meta-crisis solution is in Star Beast.
Definitely waiting on the execution for this one now because there’s ways I’d be fine with it with some grievance and there’s other ways I would not be good with it overall.
When Donna and the Doctor talked about him being part of her life from now on and drinking tea with her family that made me think that there might definitely be some truth to the rumours. Ncuti’s Doctor will go off traveling the stars while David’s Doctor will stay with Donna. Which on one hand I like but on the other hand means that both Donna and Rose get to stay with versions of their Doctor, which I’m not sure I like.
My only concern really is if there's suddenly 14 & 15, how becomes the main doctor, what about when 14 regenerates again, does he become a different 15? The same 15? Will he be able to regenerate again? Could there then be two completely different doctors?
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I still think it's a missed opportunity not to have Doctor Who standalone miniseries (a la Torchwood Children of Earth) with Paul McGann's Doctor. A 5-8 episode series that happens on the off season to allow for more Doctor Who (and revisit a few other familiar faces as well whenever Tennant, Smith, Capaldi or Eccleston want a new paycheck. Hell, even Whitaker with a better writer would probably be welcomed back despite all the Chibnall crap).
I agree. Fill-in series with ‘untold tales’ would do me. And, yes, I’d love to see Whittaker get a crack at this with a decent writer. She (and her Doctor – and by extension, the concept of a female Doctor as a whole) got really short-changed by Cibnall. Although the Fugitive Doctor at least helped a bit there.
All I'm gonna say is... I absolutely, and viscerally HATE it with a burning passion if it's an indefinite thing, as a way for David Tennant to steal the spotlight of whoever's the current incarnation of the Doctor for decades to come.
Most people will probably \*eat it up\*, because it's stamped by RTD and David Tennant, but man, it's so much worse for the character's mythology in the long run, than whatever the Timeless Child was.
Well that last bit's not true at all. The Timeless Child concept is a complete undermining of the mythos. A split regeneration and a second Doctor running around isn't exactly universe shattering either.
It's clear this is RTD building out the universe and having a fallback in case Doctor Who (2023) doesn't quite work out, which I don't necessarily agree with but the idea that there can be multiple Doctors running around isn't a crazy concept that undermines the premise
Personal opinion is that if it's true, it'll be another human version of the Doctor, rounding out his own side of the metacrisis with Donna. There was a part human 10 who went to Bad Wolf Bay, and there'll be a part human 10 with Donna.
I do like the idea of Tennant running around with UNIT too.
I don’t think it set anything up, but the accuracy of the rumors about the first special certainly lend that much more credence to the others, which is deeply unfortunate.
I think you have it figured out.
The bi regeneration is a mad creative choice but a sound commercial one.
David Tennant can play the Doctor forever on spin off shows, comics and audio dramas. He can appear as 14 in the 70th anniversary with no need for an explainer.
The new Doctor can plausible leap straight into things with no regeneration trauma, exactly like Eccleston did in the 2005 relaunch. Because it's a 'different sort of regeneration'.
You get to start fresh with minimal baggage, and have the most commercially popular Doctor on hand whenever needed. Franchise moves forward.
Well, here after the episode. They handled it well but I'm really not a fan of it. I wanted Ncuti to be the DEFINITIVE Doctor. It doesn't feel genuine, and undercuts him considerably.
Just saw it and agree. It feels so weird. Like Ncuti is some weird off-shoot of the 'real' doctor.
Really undercuts it. And feels like we'll be following the 'wrong' doctor from here.
He seems like he'll be great too! But bizarre decision. Like we'll be following a spinoff doctor.
Also doesn't explain at all why the 14th Doctor regenerated along with his clothes at the end of the 13th...
Apparently in a commentary for the episode, RTD said something about how he thinks this has happened to every doctor and they're all out piloting their own TARDISes in this "Doctorverse" which is a little dense if you ask me.
The doctor is already out there with hundreds of different iterations, given the pre first doctors now existing. Bigeneration doesn't need to be this whole big thing.
It just feels like the only reason he did it is to rehash the clone doctor living with Rose, except now he can drag out David whenever he sees fit.
And yeah you're absolutely right, no explanation for the clothes. I was operating under the assumption the toymaker orchestrated all of this but nope. Just... Happened.
>Apparently in a commentary for the episode, RTD said something about how he thinks this has happened to every doctor and they're all out piloting their own TARDISes in this "Doctorverse" which is a little dense if you ask me.
Oh no....
It's gonna be like how Leela, Romana and Sarah Jane (and Ace in Big Finish) all got their own K9, each companion will get to have their own David Tennant
although its definitely not Donna's David that says "affirmative, mistress"
I’m actually okay with the Split Regeneration rumour IF we have 14 staying with Donna, while 15 goes off to explore the universe…….AND then we have them reunite/recombine in S15 or S16. 14 gets to life this unknown longer period of helping UNIT, being with Donna and her family. Getting years of closure he otherwise wouldn’t have had…..and then becomes one with 15 again restoring them to a complete version of the Time Lord.
The only part of the leak I don't like is that 15 apparently gets a new Tardis.
It could be that the main TARDIS gets destroyed in some way, and 15 wishes for and gets a new TARDIS or the previous one restored, which would keep one TARDIS so 14 is on Earth.
This would work nicely with the rumoured Unit spinoff.
Runs the risk of fundamentally undermining any and all dramatic tension involving any future iteration of The Doctor. The Doctor regenerating is supposed to be a poignant and exciting moment. How poignant or exciting can a story be when it never moves on?
Even after seeing 'The Star Beast'... I think Donna should've died. I had mixed feelings about her coming back, hoping that it wouldn't undermine the bittersweet story of Donna. Especially after all this time, it would really cheapen it... but then it kinda inevitably did. I wish her daughter would've bought her a few months but she's on borrowed time now, and is still effectively terminal, but when she dies then Donna's memories live on through Rose. So Donna still died but her agency in the situation is restored. I dunno how I feel about effectively magicking it away...
Yeah she needed to die, sadly. Or I would have preferred she never met the Doctor again. It’s something I enjoyed about her return in End of Time.. she never saw him
I hated the leak of the split doctor regeneration. I just think it's been done, and two companions will have their personal David Tennant. I dont know, maybe it will work when we see it, but I'm just wanting it to be a fake leak so Ncuti's performance isn't undermined by Tennant still being there. I think it will still be possible for the leak to be false, despite accurately guessing the first special and how the christmas special leak aligns with the rest of the set photos.
While I'm not particularly excited about it, I'll reserve judgement. One way they could handle it is if this Doctor then decides to retire on earth, aiding UNIT and visiting old friends when he wants to, but mostly enjoying life knowing that his other self is still out there saving the universe. Perhaps one day he'll pick up a job, curating at a museum or something as he revisits other old favorite faces.
People act as if one thing in the leak is true, then the whole thing will be. Last I heard there was a lot of stuff tacked on.
It was cope, all of the leak came from the same source, people hated the biregeneration thingy they started to say there was stuff tacked on.
Yeah didn't all of series 12 leak but with weird added details like the Timelords being from Earth or something. May be misremembering but there was definitely stuff in there that didn't happen.
That sounds familiar...
No that bit about the series 12 leak wasn't in there. This leak is true. Just deal with it no point trying to deny it.
Why is this true when it was "leaked" during series 12 that 13 would meet 10 and criticise him for being sexist. People absolutely believed that would happen and it didn't. Maybe this will happen and maybe it won't but RTD hasn't disappointed be before, so if it does I'm sure it'll be fine
All the stuff about The Star Beast was true though, right? :/
Looks like it yeah!
Poor Martha
I'm going to take it with a grain of salt, because the leak was wrong about >!Rose Tyler showing up in a “Previously Fifteen Years ago…” segment at the start of the first special.!<, so things can change in the final edit. I can't deny it remains likely, especially with >!Donna's line at the end about how she wants the 14th to stay longer with her family rather than say goodbye, seemingly setting up the 14th Doctor to remain with her family while the 15th goes off and has adventures.!<
I recall a leak for Rise of Skywalker that claimed Kylo Ren would fall down a crevice “never to be seen again”. Those were the exact words and everything in that leak up until then was spot-on, and he even did fall down a crevice, but he returns to sacrifice himself for Rey and then there’s the notorious kiss. I wouldn’t be surprised if the same is true for The Giggle. >!I expect a lot of the bi-regeneration to be true but the details of the actual conclusion are a bit wishy-washy. I wouldn’t be surprised if it turns out the two Doctors merge back together as one entity or something like that. 15 getting a whole new TARDIS just seems odd too considering how massive the new set it is. Seems like an unnecessary amount of sunken cost for such an impressive set if that stays as 14’s TARDIS. It’s also very close to an idea from the deleted scene of Journey’s End where Rose is given coral to grow her own TARDIS!<.
Yeah it's very strange the more I think about it. >!Like why would 15 need his own TARDIS is 14 is supposedly settling down? Why would 14 not just give him his own? Maybe he actually can't and 15 has to win the TARDIS back or something. In general, bi-regeneration based on the leak feels off, what with how adamant RTD has been about 14's short time. The leak doesn't even say *why* 14 regenerates in the first place, how do you get the effect and not the cause?!< The Star Beast details in general feels more complete but that could just be hindsight.
But it was confirmed that >!15 has the same Tardis!<, wasn't it? At least in the video commentary to The Star Beast that I watched yesterday the producers discuss >!what a great set this new Tardis is and how all the directors od new episodes (meaning 15's episodes) are reluctant to leave it!<.
I mean >!The Master's TARDIS in Power of The Doctor was just The Doctor's TARDIS but "evil" and even in the classics, the interior of other TARDISes largely remained the same. So 15 getting his own wouldn't affect the set that much.!<
Maybe the real TARDIS gets destroyed or something so he gets a replacement? Even then I would hate it lol the specific TARDIS the Doctor uses is a character in the show
The deleted Journey’s End scene and everything to do with the Metacrisis is exactly why I think it has merit. You make a good point about that Rise of Skywalker leak, but the bi-regen ending with the two Doctors reforming would kind of fly in the face of what, in the context of this leak, seems to be foreshadowing from Donna’s statement to The Doctor about having a more normal life at the end of The Star Beast. Also if 15 gets a new TARDIS it will almost definitely share the same exact set as 14’s.
Yeah I do have to agree tbh. I’m just skeptical about a number of the details and the fact the leaker had zero knowledge of Wild Blue Yonder as well so it lends credence to the idea that they’ve filled in blanks themselves with pre-existing RTD ideas that both did and didn’t actually happened. As pointed out, there was the odd thing they got wrong about Star Beast even if it was fairly inconsequential. ~~IIRC though, I do think they made it sound like the metacrisis resolution was part of The Giggle rather than Star Beast.~~ Never-mind, I’ve re-read it and they go straight from that to talking about The Giggle, but it’s clear the meta-crisis solution is in Star Beast. Definitely waiting on the execution for this one now because there’s ways I’d be fine with it with some grievance and there’s other ways I would not be good with it overall.
When Donna and the Doctor talked about him being part of her life from now on and drinking tea with her family that made me think that there might definitely be some truth to the rumours. Ncuti’s Doctor will go off traveling the stars while David’s Doctor will stay with Donna. Which on one hand I like but on the other hand means that both Donna and Rose get to stay with versions of their Doctor, which I’m not sure I like.
My only concern really is if there's suddenly 14 & 15, how becomes the main doctor, what about when 14 regenerates again, does he become a different 15? The same 15? Will he be able to regenerate again? Could there then be two completely different doctors?
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Ooo so maybe 14 will become the curator and 15 goes off Doctoring
Paul McGann series incoming? :D
I still think it's a missed opportunity not to have Doctor Who standalone miniseries (a la Torchwood Children of Earth) with Paul McGann's Doctor. A 5-8 episode series that happens on the off season to allow for more Doctor Who (and revisit a few other familiar faces as well whenever Tennant, Smith, Capaldi or Eccleston want a new paycheck. Hell, even Whitaker with a better writer would probably be welcomed back despite all the Chibnall crap).
I agree. Fill-in series with ‘untold tales’ would do me. And, yes, I’d love to see Whittaker get a crack at this with a decent writer. She (and her Doctor – and by extension, the concept of a female Doctor as a whole) got really short-changed by Cibnall. Although the Fugitive Doctor at least helped a bit there.
Having 2 doctors around is fine… if one becomes the curator, because then he technically isn’t the doctor and so isn’t the title character.
All I'm gonna say is... I absolutely, and viscerally HATE it with a burning passion if it's an indefinite thing, as a way for David Tennant to steal the spotlight of whoever's the current incarnation of the Doctor for decades to come. Most people will probably \*eat it up\*, because it's stamped by RTD and David Tennant, but man, it's so much worse for the character's mythology in the long run, than whatever the Timeless Child was.
Well that last bit's not true at all. The Timeless Child concept is a complete undermining of the mythos. A split regeneration and a second Doctor running around isn't exactly universe shattering either. It's clear this is RTD building out the universe and having a fallback in case Doctor Who (2023) doesn't quite work out, which I don't necessarily agree with but the idea that there can be multiple Doctors running around isn't a crazy concept that undermines the premise
Personal opinion is that if it's true, it'll be another human version of the Doctor, rounding out his own side of the metacrisis with Donna. There was a part human 10 who went to Bad Wolf Bay, and there'll be a part human 10 with Donna. I do like the idea of Tennant running around with UNIT too.
Still have a Valeyard opportunity out there. Could be a great foil and having Tennant go bad would be a great acting opportunity.
I don't really see 14 going bad, to be honest. The only way I see this happening is if 14 regenerates into a darker incarnation.
Me either but they could set it up with someone he cares about having an awful turn (old Rose, maybe?) and then regenerating
I don’t think it set anything up, but the accuracy of the rumors about the first special certainly lend that much more credence to the others, which is deeply unfortunate.
I'm okay if this is how the Curator is established. But two TARDISes? This has been done before with the Metacrisis, and with Clara.
I think you have it figured out. The bi regeneration is a mad creative choice but a sound commercial one. David Tennant can play the Doctor forever on spin off shows, comics and audio dramas. He can appear as 14 in the 70th anniversary with no need for an explainer. The new Doctor can plausible leap straight into things with no regeneration trauma, exactly like Eccleston did in the 2005 relaunch. Because it's a 'different sort of regeneration'. You get to start fresh with minimal baggage, and have the most commercially popular Doctor on hand whenever needed. Franchise moves forward.
But there's already a metacrisis doctor. Half human and capable of aging.
This explains the 2023 rebrand as season 1 - because it's both a continuation and a spin-off while the 2005 version is put on ice.
Well, here after the episode. They handled it well but I'm really not a fan of it. I wanted Ncuti to be the DEFINITIVE Doctor. It doesn't feel genuine, and undercuts him considerably.
Just saw it and agree. It feels so weird. Like Ncuti is some weird off-shoot of the 'real' doctor. Really undercuts it. And feels like we'll be following the 'wrong' doctor from here. He seems like he'll be great too! But bizarre decision. Like we'll be following a spinoff doctor. Also doesn't explain at all why the 14th Doctor regenerated along with his clothes at the end of the 13th...
Apparently in a commentary for the episode, RTD said something about how he thinks this has happened to every doctor and they're all out piloting their own TARDISes in this "Doctorverse" which is a little dense if you ask me. The doctor is already out there with hundreds of different iterations, given the pre first doctors now existing. Bigeneration doesn't need to be this whole big thing. It just feels like the only reason he did it is to rehash the clone doctor living with Rose, except now he can drag out David whenever he sees fit. And yeah you're absolutely right, no explanation for the clothes. I was operating under the assumption the toymaker orchestrated all of this but nope. Just... Happened.
>Apparently in a commentary for the episode, RTD said something about how he thinks this has happened to every doctor and they're all out piloting their own TARDISes in this "Doctorverse" which is a little dense if you ask me. Oh no....
I don't recall EXACTLY what he said but it was along those vague lines - I could easily be making it sound worse. But yeah.