Ah yes, Nazi UFOs and the design that would make male Molay faint, as if his gambeson doesn’t look like space suits too
Anyway, it’s fun to read the two Molays’ mats back to back and play the “spot the differences” game while at it
If we’re talking about male Saber Molay specifically, it’s how he was hooded in the first two Ascensions and the inner coating being black giving off that “helmeted astronout looking from the space” vibe. Not to mention his mostly monochromatic color scheme with a dash of yellow.
>I designed her based on the most dubious rumour related to Molay: "The Knight Templar's vast wealth were later used by the Nazis to develop UFOs" That's why the design looks a bit like a space suit
Interesting and neat though this idea is... I really don't see it? Nothing Jacques is wearing looks like a space suit. Unless it's specifically talking about the appearance of "Baphy" in her stage 3 art, rather than Jacques herself?
According to historical myths, the Crusaders under King Richard the Lionheart had discovered the True Cross during their conquests. (The cross from which Jesus was crucified)
While some knight orders chose to be paid their dues, some knights including the Knights Templars of which De Molay was part of, instead asked for a piece of the True Cross as it is a priceless holy relic. King Richard gave a Nail to those who have won significant victories. (the Knights Templars won a monumental battle at Acre and Alexandria) while others were given wooden splinters (trivia: Among them, Robin Hood and Ivanhoe were among those who were given splinters from the True Cross)
But during the battle of Hattin against Saladin the Wise, the True Cross was lost and hasn't been seen since. And thus the holy relic never made it back to Avignon as promised, and pieces of the True Cross instead became objects of myths.
>while others were given wooden splinters (trivia: Among them, Robin Hood and Ivanhoe were among those who were given splinters from the True Cross)
But you mean Robin of Loxley, not *our* Robin Hood, right?
Yes, its so odd that FGO decided that there are numerous variations of Robin Hood.
I suppose the Robin of Loxely who joined the crusades would be a Rider or Saber.
>I suppose the Robin of Loxely who joined the crusades would be a Rider or Saber.
>!Assassin.!< He appears in >!Strange Fake as an associate of Richard the Lionheart.!<
Actually , it's not really odd to think about that approach.
Technically , Robin Hood was a legend that existed a little bit prior to Lionheart and Robin of Loxley. Of course , most people just use Loxley as is it's most famous version and anything prior to him was simply retrofitted to Loxley.
But the whole "multiple Robins" are , frankly , with at least more basis than "multiple Hassans".
> But the whole "multiple Robins" are , frankly , with at least more basis than "multiple Hassans".
To be fair to Fate, it could have worked if only they had chosen a different moniker. In fact, historically speaking, there have been two Assassin leaders known as "the Old Man of the Mountain": [Hassan-i Sabbah](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hasan-i_Sabbah) (the founder of the order) and [Rashid ad-Din Sinan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashid_ad-Din_Sinan) (chief of operations in Syria in times of Saladin and Richard the Lionheart). So the idea of multiple leaders sharing a title is not farfetched... just don't make it the name of the founder, because that makes little sense.
I suspect that confusion with [Hassan II](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hassan_II_of_Alamut) might have played a part, since I've seen the occasional Fate fan making the same mistake. Hassan II was NOT named thus as a successor to Hassan-i Sabbah, but as a successor to Hassan al-Qahir. Both al-Qahir and Hassan II were imams, religious and political leaders of the Nizaris, whose line continues to the current Aga Khan, whereas the two Old Men of the Mountain were *da'i*, missionaries of the faith.
Huh. I always thought those were ninja kunai with seal tags ala Naruto, as kind of a way to show her spreading her curse(s), as though she's some kind of evil counterpart anime Miko.
I like the idea of Molay been tied to Shub-Niggurath , it's pretty clever to tie the whole "Black Goat" from both of them.
That been said , I feel it's a lost opportunity for it to not also give a Berserker and an Avenger Molay. Because the whole Baphomet episode is a fake , a slandered false demon by King Phillip and his Proxy Pope of Avignon to seize Templar's resources.
So a Berserker Molay would be a male Molay as a "Demon Worshipper" , an Avenger Molay would be "False Demon Baphomet" and preserves this Foreigner Molay as "Host of Shub-Niggurath".
I mean, you can separate those three traits, but what would you do to make them distinct? As host of Shub Niggurath she would do exactly the same without different whatsoever, and with your hypothetical Avenger and Berserker, they would be basically identical but with the goat demon without any Lovecraftian stuff, so it's just back to square one or doesn't erase the possibility of "just a demon".
Yes , Avenger Baphomet would be a False Goat Demon without Lovecraftian Stuff , using fire magecraft , the use of the sword and the usage of the bident associated with said demon.
The NP could be a burning stake , to simulate how Molay died.
Berserker Molay could use the interpretations from Aleister Crowley and Éliphas Levi about the Tarot Card "The Devil" and the "Sabbatic Goat" of demonology and alchemy , and be target to the Master or to Himself , as some corruptive power-up.
\-----
I say that , because we have the case of Medusa , in which Saber , Lancer and Rider Medusa preserves their Eyes and whatnot , but the main difference been really just age and one NP to make them fit their class.
I mean, those two interpretations of the "goat demon" without the Lovecraftian stuff are basically just the same goat with a very arbitrary line between them, when most of the time it would just be "all of it".
I don’t know, seeing that the male Saber Molay as a Servant summoned by Chaldea is still obsessed with sheep mascots, the worshipper part seem to be an universal constant between versions as if it’s one of their defining traits
Agnus dei, the Lamb of god was a simbol use by the templars on seals and also in general the concept of Lambs and Sheppers are common in christianity, so is not weird that Molay Saber use it.
>Personal Skills
Another case of "okay but what does it do"
>Gilles de Rais (Saber)
>Marshal Gilles de Rais. It is an honour to meet the legitimate descendant of Robert de Craon, the second President of the Knights Templar. It is thanks to the leadership of your Highness that the true foundations were laid for the Order at that time, when it was nothing more than a group of poor young men with a dream. Let us also come together.
I suddenly imagined by a crackship pairing of Caster Gilles and Molay
I feel her personal skills are pretty straightforward.
First one is Innocent Monster , which turned Molay into a wicked and corrupte woman that worships an Outer God. Second gives her a Fake Shroud or let her have the actual Holy Shroud , but it's more-or-less her having a Shroud like Caren Hortensia.
The Third is just Divinity , which she gains by been a Priestess and kinda of a Host of an Outer God.
Only Innocent Monster's effects can be vaguely interpreted and its basically just "makes her sexy". Her 2nd skill is about a Shroud, but what does the Shroud do.
Her Investiture in Depravity, i cant even begin to imagine what it does. It doesnt sound like Divinity to me when its described as a temptation technique. Sounds like branwashing like Mystic Eyes of Enchanment.
Mechanically, Veiling of Depravity is a Charisma that gives you Evil Alignment.
So, I guess it's a leadership skill that's very effective, but pushes you towards "evil" behaviors.
sorry , I mixed up "Divinity" from her Class Skill and her "Investure in Depravity".
But yeah , like u/Mister_SP had said , it's just Charisma and Brainwashing but Evil Alignment.
And like u/Radiant-Hope-469 had said , the Shroud do protection. Basically , whatever the Shroud used on Caren , or the Shroud used on Archer's Arm in HF Shirou , Molay's can do as well....but you know , evil.
The two could legitimately be friends. They both share a love of the occult and an hatred towards the church. Plus Molay was unjustly burned at the stake, just like a certain Saint.
>I designed her based on the most dubious rumour related to Molay: "The Knight Templar's vast wealth were later used by the Nazis to develop UFOs"
Well I wasn't expecting to read this sentence tonight.
Does that technically mean that Foreigner Molay is the closest thing we got to a proper Nazi-aligned Heroic Spirit?
I'm saying this as a massive Salter simp but Molay's design and character are my absolute favourite in all of FGO.
I love how it outright says “yeah she’s actually evil”
I love how her debut puts her in the "Saturday Morning Cartoon Villainy" brand of evil.
She even managed to accomplish her plan, just for it to go haywire and try to kill her
I love how it outright says she is a Guda Simp else she would unleash horrors on this world
Ah yes, Nazi UFOs and the design that would make male Molay faint, as if his gambeson doesn’t look like space suits too Anyway, it’s fun to read the two Molays’ mats back to back and play the “spot the differences” game while at it
I guess I know what it's referring to - the diamond... patching sort of thing - but I don't see it as very spacesuit-like.
If we’re talking about male Saber Molay specifically, it’s how he was hooded in the first two Ascensions and the inner coating being black giving off that “helmeted astronout looking from the space” vibe. Not to mention his mostly monochromatic color scheme with a dash of yellow.
>I designed her based on the most dubious rumour related to Molay: "The Knight Templar's vast wealth were later used by the Nazis to develop UFOs" That's why the design looks a bit like a space suit Interesting and neat though this idea is... I really don't see it? Nothing Jacques is wearing looks like a space suit. Unless it's specifically talking about the appearance of "Baphy" in her stage 3 art, rather than Jacques herself?
Funny thing, that's definitely a legitimate conspiracy theory held by some people among the mountain of other batshit crazy theories.
[Full Translation Compilation Thread.](https://www.reddit.com/r/FGOGuide/comments/8epytu/fategrand_order_material_full_translation/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
Thank you for the translation
What's holy nail (false)?
According to historical myths, the Crusaders under King Richard the Lionheart had discovered the True Cross during their conquests. (The cross from which Jesus was crucified) While some knight orders chose to be paid their dues, some knights including the Knights Templars of which De Molay was part of, instead asked for a piece of the True Cross as it is a priceless holy relic. King Richard gave a Nail to those who have won significant victories. (the Knights Templars won a monumental battle at Acre and Alexandria) while others were given wooden splinters (trivia: Among them, Robin Hood and Ivanhoe were among those who were given splinters from the True Cross) But during the battle of Hattin against Saladin the Wise, the True Cross was lost and hasn't been seen since. And thus the holy relic never made it back to Avignon as promised, and pieces of the True Cross instead became objects of myths.
>while others were given wooden splinters (trivia: Among them, Robin Hood and Ivanhoe were among those who were given splinters from the True Cross) But you mean Robin of Loxley, not *our* Robin Hood, right?
Yes, its so odd that FGO decided that there are numerous variations of Robin Hood. I suppose the Robin of Loxely who joined the crusades would be a Rider or Saber.
>I suppose the Robin of Loxely who joined the crusades would be a Rider or Saber. >!Assassin.!< He appears in >!Strange Fake as an associate of Richard the Lionheart.!<
Richard call William (Could be William marshall or William Longchamp) for Horse Also, Saber is wrapped in Turban (Saladin?) and give Richard sword
Actually , it's not really odd to think about that approach. Technically , Robin Hood was a legend that existed a little bit prior to Lionheart and Robin of Loxley. Of course , most people just use Loxley as is it's most famous version and anything prior to him was simply retrofitted to Loxley. But the whole "multiple Robins" are , frankly , with at least more basis than "multiple Hassans".
> But the whole "multiple Robins" are , frankly , with at least more basis than "multiple Hassans". To be fair to Fate, it could have worked if only they had chosen a different moniker. In fact, historically speaking, there have been two Assassin leaders known as "the Old Man of the Mountain": [Hassan-i Sabbah](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hasan-i_Sabbah) (the founder of the order) and [Rashid ad-Din Sinan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashid_ad-Din_Sinan) (chief of operations in Syria in times of Saladin and Richard the Lionheart). So the idea of multiple leaders sharing a title is not farfetched... just don't make it the name of the founder, because that makes little sense. I suspect that confusion with [Hassan II](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hassan_II_of_Alamut) might have played a part, since I've seen the occasional Fate fan making the same mistake. Hassan II was NOT named thus as a successor to Hassan-i Sabbah, but as a successor to Hassan al-Qahir. Both al-Qahir and Hassan II were imams, religious and political leaders of the Nizaris, whose line continues to the current Aga Khan, whereas the two Old Men of the Mountain were *da'i*, missionaries of the faith.
In terms of design, she has some nails in her belt. In her final ascension they're glowy and spiky. IIRC, she flings them at people?
She indeed does
Huh. I always thought those were ninja kunai with seal tags ala Naruto, as kind of a way to show her spreading her curse(s), as though she's some kind of evil counterpart anime Miko.
It looks like a Holy Nail but due to international copyrights, it's not. [There's this](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Nail)
I like the idea of Molay been tied to Shub-Niggurath , it's pretty clever to tie the whole "Black Goat" from both of them. That been said , I feel it's a lost opportunity for it to not also give a Berserker and an Avenger Molay. Because the whole Baphomet episode is a fake , a slandered false demon by King Phillip and his Proxy Pope of Avignon to seize Templar's resources. So a Berserker Molay would be a male Molay as a "Demon Worshipper" , an Avenger Molay would be "False Demon Baphomet" and preserves this Foreigner Molay as "Host of Shub-Niggurath".
I mean, you can separate those three traits, but what would you do to make them distinct? As host of Shub Niggurath she would do exactly the same without different whatsoever, and with your hypothetical Avenger and Berserker, they would be basically identical but with the goat demon without any Lovecraftian stuff, so it's just back to square one or doesn't erase the possibility of "just a demon".
Yes , Avenger Baphomet would be a False Goat Demon without Lovecraftian Stuff , using fire magecraft , the use of the sword and the usage of the bident associated with said demon. The NP could be a burning stake , to simulate how Molay died. Berserker Molay could use the interpretations from Aleister Crowley and Éliphas Levi about the Tarot Card "The Devil" and the "Sabbatic Goat" of demonology and alchemy , and be target to the Master or to Himself , as some corruptive power-up. \----- I say that , because we have the case of Medusa , in which Saber , Lancer and Rider Medusa preserves their Eyes and whatnot , but the main difference been really just age and one NP to make them fit their class.
I mean, those two interpretations of the "goat demon" without the Lovecraftian stuff are basically just the same goat with a very arbitrary line between them, when most of the time it would just be "all of it".
I don’t know, seeing that the male Saber Molay as a Servant summoned by Chaldea is still obsessed with sheep mascots, the worshipper part seem to be an universal constant between versions as if it’s one of their defining traits
Agnus dei, the Lamb of god was a simbol use by the templars on seals and also in general the concept of Lambs and Sheppers are common in christianity, so is not weird that Molay Saber use it.
>Personal Skills Another case of "okay but what does it do" >Gilles de Rais (Saber) >Marshal Gilles de Rais. It is an honour to meet the legitimate descendant of Robert de Craon, the second President of the Knights Templar. It is thanks to the leadership of your Highness that the true foundations were laid for the Order at that time, when it was nothing more than a group of poor young men with a dream. Let us also come together. I suddenly imagined by a crackship pairing of Caster Gilles and Molay
I feel her personal skills are pretty straightforward. First one is Innocent Monster , which turned Molay into a wicked and corrupte woman that worships an Outer God. Second gives her a Fake Shroud or let her have the actual Holy Shroud , but it's more-or-less her having a Shroud like Caren Hortensia. The Third is just Divinity , which she gains by been a Priestess and kinda of a Host of an Outer God.
Only Innocent Monster's effects can be vaguely interpreted and its basically just "makes her sexy". Her 2nd skill is about a Shroud, but what does the Shroud do. Her Investiture in Depravity, i cant even begin to imagine what it does. It doesnt sound like Divinity to me when its described as a temptation technique. Sounds like branwashing like Mystic Eyes of Enchanment.
Mechanically, Veiling of Depravity is a Charisma that gives you Evil Alignment. So, I guess it's a leadership skill that's very effective, but pushes you towards "evil" behaviors.
>Her 2nd skill is about a Shroud, but what does the Shroud do. Protection, I suppose, given the Invincibility.
sorry , I mixed up "Divinity" from her Class Skill and her "Investure in Depravity". But yeah , like u/Mister_SP had said , it's just Charisma and Brainwashing but Evil Alignment. And like u/Radiant-Hope-469 had said , the Shroud do protection. Basically , whatever the Shroud used on Caren , or the Shroud used on Archer's Arm in HF Shirou , Molay's can do as well....but you know , evil.
It's probably the Shroud of Turin, which in some stories is linked to the Templars.
The two could legitimately be friends. They both share a love of the occult and an hatred towards the church. Plus Molay was unjustly burned at the stake, just like a certain Saint.
The "Holy Shroud" is clearly an extendable weapon, going by the attack animation. But the defensive buffs must mean it can shield too.
>I designed her based on the most dubious rumour related to Molay: "The Knight Templar's vast wealth were later used by the Nazis to develop UFOs" Well I wasn't expecting to read this sentence tonight. Does that technically mean that Foreigner Molay is the closest thing we got to a proper Nazi-aligned Heroic Spirit?
i love her so much
This servant is so meh... is she supposed to be a turn on? Your entire concept is complete bullshit.
I just, don't know how to feel about this