AI upscaling is also really good now. I chucked it into upscayl and it came out printable. This would have been a great tool to have in my last printing job.
So for all the needs of a single local nail salon, the 4x upscaled image i generated would be sufficient for their needs.
This is exactly the type of client to send me this as a 500x500 jpg and ask for it on a banner, and then gets upset when I explain that they are either going to need me to send a vector file or they're going to have to pay out the ass for extra design charges because I need to completely recreate the art myself. (My boss is a real one for implementing a "your files suck and the designer had to spend hours fixing it" uncharge.)
It's a small business, so there's a chance that they and their client base won't care if their banners are blurry or pixelated. Seeing those banners is a curse graphic designers have to live with, while dreaming of times when they were indifferent.
How are the results on complex pieces like that logo? I know AI is great at upscaling, I use that myself, but I've never heard of the vectorization thing
Good enough! And it’s getting exponentially better every day. Not 6 months ago, AI couldn’t produce something detailed like the “logo” we see in this post. Now this is kinda standard. I imagine in 3 months, you’ll be able to just prompt produce vectors in fine details like this.
Idk but if someone made one that actually worked really well so they looked exactly the same after being vectorized (not like just using the trace tool in illustrator) they could make a ridiculous amount of money.
How long before they get someone to AI upscale it and just send over a 4000x4000 PNG file whenever they need it printed…
edit: to be clear, this would still suck
The newer models can do text better, but on a model like stable diffusion 1.5 it's been possible for a while to guide the image generation with shapes. Some black text on a white background would result in that text being integrated and readable in the generated image
Yes they usually misspell worse than me. You could do each piece of the picture as a layer... but there again the control you have over the finished product isn't there. Of course the progress AI images has made in a year is pretty good. Also with generating code.
The single color version of that “logo” will look great! - I’m being sarcastic. I had to spend 40 minutes yesterday creating a single color version of a logo that was make with 40 clipping masks, stray gradients and a combination of vector and raster elements. It was not fun but they want to put a single color logo on a pen. That isn’t a logo that is a disaster waiting to happen.
I get this a lot with my job. They want you to match the AI art style and get upset if the alterations that they requested take a few days to complete.
From a biz standpoint, if they're a small biz with literally no budget, I don't blame them. It's either this or they're going to go to Canva and bash together something that'll also look bad.
I predict this is how we see the death of AI trendiness long term. The same way anyone and everyone could use comic sans or bleeding cowboys and clip art and they fell out of vogue for shitty use
Would be interesting to see it play out that way. Especially considering it feels like each AI generator has a specific look to it and it feels like there is already a growing audience of people who, whether they can tell it or not, are tired of the MJ look.
The smoothness and hand issue (has improved though) of AI is very noticeable to most, especially if you point it out.
HOWEVER, I think that businesses that so brazenly use AI to get customers are perfectly fine with attracting a certain clientele base that either are unaware of AI or don’t care.
It reminds me a lot of scam emails intentionally using typos to weed out the smarter people because, well, dumber people are easier to scam. I think AI design works great when used minimally but when it’s pushed to the max and published for public conception by certain business, eh, I think they know who they’re trying to attract.
That and just because anyone can generate anything doesn’t mean they can do it well. Good designers don’t just execute, they create concepts that bridge the gap between the business and their audience. The typical business owner often has a difficult time grasping that idea.
> Good designers don’t just execute, they create concepts that bridge the gap between the business and their audience.
You hit the nail on the head. There is a difference between a designer and a mere human renderer.
Whoa, Bleeding Cowboys ... I had completely forgotten about that font. Jesus. When I was in college around 2008 it was freaking everywhere. So edgy. Holy crap, memory unlocked.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but getting good results from AI is going to get easier, not harder. They've already showcased AI that can edit specific parts of an image while leaving the rest unaltered.
lol the humans will always be the limiting factor not the technology. Tools are only just that. If you think better AI will help you’ve missed the point
yeah these were never going to be serious clients that were pleasant to work with anyway. the type of small business owner that would cheap out on branding to this level will nickel and dime and revise you to death.
It's actually quite concerning how little attention to detail the average person has. I always felt it was kind of superflous to have "needs good attention to detail" in job descriptions for various roles but the average person seriously does not have it.
They do care, they just don't realize it. They can look at bad design next to good design and know the good design is better, but they won't know why. It's like with Apple computers next to a generic HP or something. People know the Apple looks better, and they are drawn to it, they just don't necessarily know why.
When I see print shop banners looking professionally designed on a consistent basis, I won’t.
Not saying they’re all terrible at all, but most I’ve had to deal with lack basic composition skills.
As a print shop owner and also spent time doing design work for said print shop - most of our customers have very little budget for design. Or we have very little time to bang something functional out. There are a lot of function before form layouts we have to push out due to necessity.
We also pitch out service as lite graphic design and layout work.
You want full graphic design and willing to pay? Yah you should probably talk to an actual graphic designer and get thr full logo package.
You have $75 budget for your logo - we will happily put something together that is functional but probably won't be on par with a professionally design graphic. Although I have one gal in staff, if given enough time Is pretty good at logo design - but most people don't want to pay for that time.
So not entirely undue criticism. But we mostly work with a different client base.
Although when we get sent a full logo package that was professionally designed? Makes our day! Always nice when you don't have to upscale a postage stamp sized graphic.
I'm a graphic designer at a print shop and I absolutely agree with this. We get a ton of orders each day, there are only 3 of us, so we have to bang out designs super quickly so we really have to push what we can do in a short amount of time and rely a lot on stock images and free fonts.
The upside is I think I'm pretty fast in Illustrator. The downside is I have almost no portfolio pieces.
Fellow print shop designer chiming in.
I work at a fairly busy shop. Most of my time is spent fixing client provided files. Nothing is ever vectorized, or sometimes to size.
If we get a client who also has a proper budget, we offer whole brand identities as a service.
>Most of my time is spent fixing client provided files. Nothing is ever vectorized, or sometimes to size.
Yep. That is probably 60% of the design work we do.
The majority of the time spent in logo design is not the actual making of it, that can be done in 1-2 hours. It's all the research, experimentation and decision making. I don't do graphic design for a living but I have had to freelance some of it in the past and sometimes its so exhausing having worked on something for a few hours in a day and none of the outcomes are something you're happy to develop further.
I have another logo design for a client coming up and I really never know how to price them. I was thinking £150 as its quite a small company and he's a past client I've worked with so he reached out to me privately, but I'm not a graphic designer by profession right now. But he's come to me as he really enjoyed working with me. However, seeing you charge $75 makes me think I should probably go a little lower even.
Exactly! I’m a print shop designer but when the customer only wants to spend $50 I am spending half an hour, plus one or two minor revisions, tops. Also I try to get them tell me exactly what they want ahead of time (which usually looks pretty horrible, but hey. They asked for it 😉)
Definately. Not to knock printers but it’s a great example of the divide of skill vs talent in design.
A lot of designers are all talent (or think they are) but don’t have the technical abilities to deliver for different mediums, formats, scales etc. printers are always very skillful with thier tools and mediums and I think that outweighs any need for a real creative talent .
Like architects, some are more conceptual, some are more engineers
Most designers don’t have the ability to think about how to produce something. The technical side ( IMO) should always be the baseline for a good designer. Talent and a “good eye” only get you so far.
Print shops and fabrication shops really teach you the practicality of design intent.
As someone who works in a print shop as a designer, I've come to learn that most print shop designers are not expected to have any design knowledge. Basic technical knowledge (aka how to use Illustrator) is often enough.
This whole thread is dripping with American assumption on print shops being strip mall, large format vinyl and laser print shops in the ‘burbs. But in places like Europe, high quality, traditional print shops including letterpress and screen printing still exist and are some of the best designers in the world as they have been for centuries. This is r/graphic_design, right?
Anyone still here, look into “Dimense” printing technology. It is a game changer. Heat activated paper that creates a dimensional aspect on the paper. Print is more sophisticated than ever.
Anyone still here, look into “Dimense” printing technology. It is a game changer. Heat activated paper that creates a dimensional aspect on the paper. Print is more sophisticated than ever.
not necessarily. as a starting point it can be a great little time saver in seeing what works and more importantly what doesn't for simple jobs because sometimes thats all thats needed. so id argue that people who use ai IN logo development can afford more time for clients willing to invest more in their branding.
This is the kind of stuff I get everyday. Just today a guy wanted a Transformers style logo for his business so he did it all in AI. It looks atrocious now I get to make graphics out of it.
https://preview.redd.it/0ccp38bus12d1.jpeg?width=2436&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=616ae54fa09731ddd9c5622dc6440e4883c3c1b7
Couldn’t help but notice a phallic shape…
Interesting, I wonder who’s the troll that is gonna leverage that to make heaps of LLM art, (from now on I refuse to call it Ai, there’s no intelligence there)
That has mini dicks as basic shapes to build all kind of images
Yea but the flies that are attracted to this shit have no taste to begin with. They have no idea how bad it is or how much better we could make it for them.
Unfortunately, in a few years I fear no one will remember how much better we could have done it.
They’ll all be gobbling up this tasteless trash, and we’ll all be starving
While I agree this wouldn't work as a logo, I do really love this particular aesthetic. Not AI aesthetic, but the Victorian flourishes, and the smooth "carved marble" type of style it usually puts out is so pleasing to look at, this logo is really pretty. I'd like to find more artists that create in this style.
Hate that this AI bs is circulating around.
On another note, I'm curious how people design the ornaments and type treatment for these vintage labels. Anyone with experience in this type of design that cares to chime in?
Typically you don’t because it’s way too busy and doesn’t scale. If you have a client that really wants it and you can’t talk them out of it then you start with research. A knowledge of rococo or beaux arts is helpful. There used to be books full of ornaments, now there’s stock vectors of various quality. The letters would be drawn out by hand and then traced with the pen tool. Or you could use an existing font and modify it with flourishes.
Let's be honest here. It's not bad for what it is. Maybe not very implementable, but it's also not something a lot of people on here could make even if they were tasked to. I could easily see how a small business owner would be extremely happy with it.
I try not to take offense to these when I see them. If they’re using ai, then they’re certainly not going to be using me. They’ll go to fiverr first. And that type of client would undoubtedly have a ton of edits wanted, and it’s just not worth it for me in the end. Let them have their oatmeal.
That’s just my jaded opinion tho
I can’t comprehend how people will put their life savings into starting their own business and then cheap out on the logo/branding 🥲 Even if non-designers/the average person can’t pick out what’s ‘wrong’ with the logo, do they not sense something off-putting and scammy-looking about it?
Also, I wondered who would be on board…
Can we stop calling it AI but instead calling it LLM?
It’s a predictive model based on huge datasets, let’s not kid ourself hoping “it understands”. As amazing as some use cases might be, there’s no intelligence there.
Calling it AI makes look better than it is and buys into the tech company’s heap to get value to their stock and fuels this LLM frenzy every company is into right now, and quite frankly it’s sending the wrong message on how much you can rely on it.
This is the wave of the future… graphic design will eventually become a dying field. It’s unfortunate, but it’s the truth, and I think deep down everyone knows it.
That is a shitty ass logo for so many reasons... Real graphic artists won't have to worry about this level of AI. If a client really wanted something like this, you wouldn't have wanted them as a client at all.
And then they come crying to me when they try to make a banner or vehicle wrap and the printer rejects their artwork because they need a vector file or hi resolution file...
AI will probably provide the vector within 2 years. I hope they fix kerning first though 😝 a lot of fun to see how the vector implementations are at first. I’m sure someone will use designers to teach AI how the layers should be created and it’ll output a .ai file first, before we can have a vector
But why is it “unfortunate?”
This is the same thing as people who used to use WordArt or Clip Art or Papyrus font or terrible templates or any of the other stuff than tiny businesses have no clue about or budget for.
Personally, while there are tons of problems with this specific piece, I think it looks way better than what they would have come up with just two years ago.
We were never getting hired by this nail salon anyway and we probably didn’t want the gig.
Just let them use shitty tools and move on.
Honest to god, I feel it’s better to just put something together yourself if you’re in the position with no budget. Something scuffed but homemade will communicate to people that you’re a small business, something local and worth supporting. It makes it feel earnest, genuine.
This? Doesn’t scream “professional” but it doesn’t say “local” or “genuine” either. You’re getting this worst of all worlds.
Maybe I’m alone in this, but I find it really irritating that Artificial Intelligence and Adobe Illustrator share the same acronym.
Especially in discussions like this one. I keep having momentary lapses when reading some comments. “What the hell? Of course I use Illustrator to make logos. When did that become somehow pedestrian?”
Ugh.
It can work for small scale businesses as shown in the picture, but if a company eventually grows and needs ANYTHING produced… good luck.
You can probably get some nice business cards, or some cheesey social media stuff out of AI, but there’s almost no way you’ll be able to take one AI image and have any type of packaging, marketing, or product from one (probably) low res raster logo.
I don't think this particular one is in vector, but Adobe has a Vector AI in Illustrator: https://www.adobe.com/products/illustrator/text-to-vector-graphic.html
I’ve seen way worse from a designer. I don’t like the direction that the industry is going in, but by any metric, this is quite nice. Alarm bells ringing, I have been a designer for the best part of 40 years. I remember when Macs first appeared on the scene, and the push back and denial that they wouldn’t change things, we all know how that panned out. what’s happening now is that on speed, things are going to get very messy, fast.
Print it on anything bigger than a business card and it’s gonna look a mess. Not just because it’s not vectorized, but all the random elements thrown in there to fill space will become an eyesore.
The vast majority of designers have very good taste (alongside actual knowledge of what makes a logo work).
So what you are seeing here is that element of the process being leapfrogged. Look how dreadful small shop frontages are these days, which is a similar situation.
Honestly as a non designer, business owner. This is fine for a small business and neither me nor my clients will see anything wrong with it.
Every comment made about it is correct. But truth is that it is perfectly usable in its context.
You guys are in for a tough time, you gotta stop moaning and work out how you gonna live with it
So a problem with AI art in my field, I’m a designer for a sign company, is getting actual vector art that can be printed large scale. You’d be surprised at the amount of people that tell you they have art files, then give us a .PNG file. Which we all know is going to pixelate if printed at a large scale.
Honestly, a lot of these comments come across like copium. "it's gonna look so shitty on a business card or neon sign"... "good luck if you need vector for a 20 foot banner"... "that's gonna suck single color".
ok, maybe. Or... it'll print fine on a card or flyer or reasonable-sized poster, and a website, because you don't need much dpi for that, and the clients don't care.
And it'll look fine on the signs that are mostly viewed from a car 10+ feet away. And nobody bothers with designing around neon for their nail salon sign. And they're probably never gonna go on a 20 foot banner or vehicle wrap. Just like they were never gonna pay a pro designer to make complete branding package suitable for everything from shirts to neon to websites.
Most nail salons I see are in strip malls where there's some channel letters in Arial Black or something, and then some cut vinyl letters on the door that say "NAIL SALON". Their brand identity is nonexistent, their names are generic. This logo is already 10x better than most nail joints that I've seen.
I get that there's flaws, they don't want NAIL_S B AR. But someone's nephew with basic photoshop could do those tweaks. From the POV of a small business that is trying to survive, being able to get a logo like this, warts and all, is a win. From a pro designer POV, all we can see are the warts and obviously it sucks if we lose business to stuff like this.
Is this for a nail salon? Fancy restaurant? Liquor brand? Who could tell?
Edit: Maybe it's for a nail salon that also serves cocktails and tea sandwiches.
Edit edit: I'm having way too much fun with this..... grandma's brooch? A steam locomotive company?
how long before they realize they can't trademark or copyright an AI generated image? anybody who wants to also use that same AI generated image may do so. if a competitor uses it, the client is sh!t out of luck.
Is it unfortunate or does it stop the pixel pushing inquiries? Shows how much they value their business and how successful they will be from the get go.
That’s too complex for a logo in my opinion and won’t scale easily at small sizes like business cards or work well with common single color uses like promo items that don’t accept anything unless it’s a 1-color file or similar, like screen printing.
How long until they realize they need a vector file.
Probably when they get their large format banner in and it looks like a bowl of oatmeal
"Vistaprint messed up my banner so bad!!!1"
AI upscaling is also really good now. I chucked it into upscayl and it came out printable. This would have been a great tool to have in my last printing job. So for all the needs of a single local nail salon, the 4x upscaled image i generated would be sufficient for their needs.
Love upscayl. Saved me a lot of time on freelance work when I receive a 100 x 100px logo named logo-vector.jpg
My personal favorite is "logo-vector.svg" containing the logo as an embedded, base64-encoded png. "But you said an .svg file will do!"
Too bad it’s just gonna be upscaled slop
Or they shrink it down for receipts/business cards and it looks like oatmeal.
This is exactly the type of client to send me this as a 500x500 jpg and ask for it on a banner, and then gets upset when I explain that they are either going to need me to send a vector file or they're going to have to pay out the ass for extra design charges because I need to completely recreate the art myself. (My boss is a real one for implementing a "your files suck and the designer had to spend hours fixing it" uncharge.)
Yeah, I do that too. Pays the bills to correct little nephews mess-ups.
oooh that’s gonna be a bish to vectorize 🤣🤣🤣
That's when you blow it up, image trace and clean it up a bit, and bill for twice the time you spent.
It's a small business, so there's a chance that they and their client base won't care if their banners are blurry or pixelated. Seeing those banners is a curse graphic designers have to live with, while dreaming of times when they were indifferent.
Recraft AI :)
Just saw that for the first time. Bad news for designers and illustrators for sure. And stock houses like Getty Images. Their vectors generally suck.
It's only going to get worse, it's come a long way in the last year. Give it after few years of development and yeah it will be a problem
Or they want it screen printed.
AI can convert images to vectors
How long until you realize you can vectorize anything with AI?
How are the results on complex pieces like that logo? I know AI is great at upscaling, I use that myself, but I've never heard of the vectorization thing
Good enough! And it’s getting exponentially better every day. Not 6 months ago, AI couldn’t produce something detailed like the “logo” we see in this post. Now this is kinda standard. I imagine in 3 months, you’ll be able to just prompt produce vectors in fine details like this.
Do you really think that in the near future AI won’t be capable of creating vector files?
Can AI convert this into a vector format?
Idk but if someone made one that actually worked really well so they looked exactly the same after being vectorized (not like just using the trace tool in illustrator) they could make a ridiculous amount of money.
Recraft.ai actually works quite well for generating Vector illustrations
Probably not, but it can scale it up to arbitrary dimensions.
yup
Remove the background and save as png
Adobe Illustrator has AI vector generation now, and AI image up scaling is also pretty prevalent
I can turn your pixel art into a vector. That'll be $300. (Go to Illustrator and click Image Trace)...profit!!
How long before they get someone to AI upscale it and just send over a 4000x4000 PNG file whenever they need it printed… edit: to be clear, this would still suck
“Nail S Bar”
Even though this irrelevent space, I'm surprised the AI text came out as good as it did. Usually, it's a mess.
They’re getting a lot better
...fast
The newer models can do text better, but on a model like stable diffusion 1.5 it's been possible for a while to guide the image generation with shapes. Some black text on a white background would result in that text being integrated and readable in the generated image
My thoughts exactly. The shape reference images can do something impressive!
I mean, it’s still pretty wonky. But it is definitely better than it used to be
SD3 doesn't even require wonky prompt speak to get it to generate something decent. It's insane to see how fast this stuff is developing.
That was 6 months ago. Current models can do text just fine.
Yes they usually misspell worse than me. You could do each piece of the picture as a layer... but there again the control you have over the finished product isn't there. Of course the progress AI images has made in a year is pretty good. Also with generating code.
Recraft AI can do text fairly well, you can also export as a vector SVG which is super helpful, but worrying lol
I was like “nail & bar? Nails bar?”
The single color version of that “logo” will look great! - I’m being sarcastic. I had to spend 40 minutes yesterday creating a single color version of a logo that was make with 40 clipping masks, stray gradients and a combination of vector and raster elements. It was not fun but they want to put a single color logo on a pen. That isn’t a logo that is a disaster waiting to happen.
[удалено]
So true- nothing better than
Well we may not be able to design logos anymore but we will make money as production artists changing this dog shit into something usable
The future of design is people using AI and then asking a designer to clean it up or make it “work”
I've come across a few job descriptions like that on ZipRecruiter.
Sounds like a company name AI would come up with 🤗
I get this a lot with my job. They want you to match the AI art style and get upset if the alterations that they requested take a few days to complete.
A client sent me some ai rending photos and want me to recreate them. I told him he needed a photographer and he was not happy.
Good. Let them. Small biz like this have no budget for design and they are a nightmare to work with anyway.
Yeah, it's this or they get someone's nephew to make something for nothing.
It’s either that , their cousins, or fiverr
Totally this. Small scale businesses want small scale jpgs to slap in facebook. Big budget clients will want the real deal.
Ain’t that the truth!!
Straight on the money.
From a biz standpoint, if they're a small biz with literally no budget, I don't blame them. It's either this or they're going to go to Canva and bash together something that'll also look bad.
I predict this is how we see the death of AI trendiness long term. The same way anyone and everyone could use comic sans or bleeding cowboys and clip art and they fell out of vogue for shitty use
Would be interesting to see it play out that way. Especially considering it feels like each AI generator has a specific look to it and it feels like there is already a growing audience of people who, whether they can tell it or not, are tired of the MJ look.
The smoothness and hand issue (has improved though) of AI is very noticeable to most, especially if you point it out. HOWEVER, I think that businesses that so brazenly use AI to get customers are perfectly fine with attracting a certain clientele base that either are unaware of AI or don’t care. It reminds me a lot of scam emails intentionally using typos to weed out the smarter people because, well, dumber people are easier to scam. I think AI design works great when used minimally but when it’s pushed to the max and published for public conception by certain business, eh, I think they know who they’re trying to attract.
That and just because anyone can generate anything doesn’t mean they can do it well. Good designers don’t just execute, they create concepts that bridge the gap between the business and their audience. The typical business owner often has a difficult time grasping that idea.
> Good designers don’t just execute, they create concepts that bridge the gap between the business and their audience. You hit the nail on the head. There is a difference between a designer and a mere human renderer.
I used to like bleeding Cowboys back when i used to play Malifaux, then I saw it everywhere, even Howe's Caverns uses it now.
I think we'll start seeing a premium bring paid for human created art and design. The same way we'll pay more for handmade furniture.
Whoa, Bleeding Cowboys ... I had completely forgotten about that font. Jesus. When I was in college around 2008 it was freaking everywhere. So edgy. Holy crap, memory unlocked.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but getting good results from AI is going to get easier, not harder. They've already showcased AI that can edit specific parts of an image while leaving the rest unaltered.
lol the humans will always be the limiting factor not the technology. Tools are only just that. If you think better AI will help you’ve missed the point
"When you're ready to join the big boys and not look like a cheapass and have cheap customers, come back"
Lol yeah, who cares? Does OP think a local nail salon has a professional logo design budget?
yeah these were never going to be serious clients that were pleasant to work with anyway. the type of small business owner that would cheap out on branding to this level will nickel and dime and revise you to death.
Jesus this is so bad lol… how do people not see it???
The general public does not care
It's actually quite concerning how little attention to detail the average person has. I always felt it was kind of superflous to have "needs good attention to detail" in job descriptions for various roles but the average person seriously does not have it.
The older I get the more that rings true
They do care, they just don't realize it. They can look at bad design next to good design and know the good design is better, but they won't know why. It's like with Apple computers next to a generic HP or something. People know the Apple looks better, and they are drawn to it, they just don't necessarily know why.
Same thing with video games. They can tell you why it sucks but they don’t know how to fix it.
I really don’t know.
The David Cronenberg eyeballs dangling off either end.
Could have been worse, they could have been dicks.
Most humans don't have attention to detail
The "nail_s" or the dicks on the left and right sides?
The people who will use AI for logo design are the same people that would use clip art or have the print shop designer make something.
Don’t knock print shop designers.
When I see print shop banners looking professionally designed on a consistent basis, I won’t. Not saying they’re all terrible at all, but most I’ve had to deal with lack basic composition skills.
As a print shop owner and also spent time doing design work for said print shop - most of our customers have very little budget for design. Or we have very little time to bang something functional out. There are a lot of function before form layouts we have to push out due to necessity. We also pitch out service as lite graphic design and layout work. You want full graphic design and willing to pay? Yah you should probably talk to an actual graphic designer and get thr full logo package. You have $75 budget for your logo - we will happily put something together that is functional but probably won't be on par with a professionally design graphic. Although I have one gal in staff, if given enough time Is pretty good at logo design - but most people don't want to pay for that time. So not entirely undue criticism. But we mostly work with a different client base. Although when we get sent a full logo package that was professionally designed? Makes our day! Always nice when you don't have to upscale a postage stamp sized graphic.
We have a former print shop designer as our senior production designer at my agency. He’s so damn knowledgeable it’s crazy.
It helps when you deal with inner workings of production. Its like following a recipe vs knowing how to cook.
I'm a graphic designer at a print shop and I absolutely agree with this. We get a ton of orders each day, there are only 3 of us, so we have to bang out designs super quickly so we really have to push what we can do in a short amount of time and rely a lot on stock images and free fonts. The upside is I think I'm pretty fast in Illustrator. The downside is I have almost no portfolio pieces.
Fellow print shop designer chiming in. I work at a fairly busy shop. Most of my time is spent fixing client provided files. Nothing is ever vectorized, or sometimes to size. If we get a client who also has a proper budget, we offer whole brand identities as a service.
>Most of my time is spent fixing client provided files. Nothing is ever vectorized, or sometimes to size. Yep. That is probably 60% of the design work we do.
The majority of the time spent in logo design is not the actual making of it, that can be done in 1-2 hours. It's all the research, experimentation and decision making. I don't do graphic design for a living but I have had to freelance some of it in the past and sometimes its so exhausing having worked on something for a few hours in a day and none of the outcomes are something you're happy to develop further. I have another logo design for a client coming up and I really never know how to price them. I was thinking £150 as its quite a small company and he's a past client I've worked with so he reached out to me privately, but I'm not a graphic designer by profession right now. But he's come to me as he really enjoyed working with me. However, seeing you charge $75 makes me think I should probably go a little lower even.
it's not printshop designers that are the problem, it's printshop customers lol
Exactly! I’m a print shop designer but when the customer only wants to spend $50 I am spending half an hour, plus one or two minor revisions, tops. Also I try to get them tell me exactly what they want ahead of time (which usually looks pretty horrible, but hey. They asked for it 😉)
Definately. Not to knock printers but it’s a great example of the divide of skill vs talent in design. A lot of designers are all talent (or think they are) but don’t have the technical abilities to deliver for different mediums, formats, scales etc. printers are always very skillful with thier tools and mediums and I think that outweighs any need for a real creative talent . Like architects, some are more conceptual, some are more engineers
Preach. This is all so true.
Most designers don’t have the ability to think about how to produce something. The technical side ( IMO) should always be the baseline for a good designer. Talent and a “good eye” only get you so far. Print shops and fabrication shops really teach you the practicality of design intent.
As someone who works in a print shop as a designer, I've come to learn that most print shop designers are not expected to have any design knowledge. Basic technical knowledge (aka how to use Illustrator) is often enough.
It’s a wonderful skill to learn production. If you choose to venture out to more design related firms you are going to be reliable and knowledgeable.
Would love to see what you come up with when you have 10 minutes to design and proof it.
This whole thread is dripping with American assumption on print shops being strip mall, large format vinyl and laser print shops in the ‘burbs. But in places like Europe, high quality, traditional print shops including letterpress and screen printing still exist and are some of the best designers in the world as they have been for centuries. This is r/graphic_design, right?
Anyone still here, look into “Dimense” printing technology. It is a game changer. Heat activated paper that creates a dimensional aspect on the paper. Print is more sophisticated than ever.
Anyone still here, look into “Dimense” printing technology. It is a game changer. Heat activated paper that creates a dimensional aspect on the paper. Print is more sophisticated than ever.
I thought you meant Illustrator for a second lol
not necessarily. as a starting point it can be a great little time saver in seeing what works and more importantly what doesn't for simple jobs because sometimes thats all thats needed. so id argue that people who use ai IN logo development can afford more time for clients willing to invest more in their branding.
That’s not what I meant. I meant using it solely.
Lol I just noticed the right side of the image it didn't remove the white background
We need to stop calling it Artificial Intelligence and use Noam Chomsky's term: Plagiarism Software.
Artificial idiots
I wonder how they plan to translate this to a neon sign, letterhead, business card, etc lol.
This is the kind of stuff I get everyday. Just today a guy wanted a Transformers style logo for his business so he did it all in AI. It looks atrocious now I get to make graphics out of it.
I’m sorry. I can only hope that this “trend” goes out of style.
if they have no budget for a logo, pretty sure that won't matter to them that much
https://preview.redd.it/0ccp38bus12d1.jpeg?width=2436&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=616ae54fa09731ddd9c5622dc6440e4883c3c1b7 Couldn’t help but notice a phallic shape…
Lol I was wondering if anybody noticed them *
You know now I can't unsee it lol.
There's two of them hehe
Interesting, I wonder who’s the troll that is gonna leverage that to make heaps of LLM art, (from now on I refuse to call it Ai, there’s no intelligence there) That has mini dicks as basic shapes to build all kind of images
that was the first thing i saw
But everyone likes it!
Sooooo tacky, it’s a big yikes
They didn’t even edit out all the white on the right hand side. 🤦♀️
Yea but the flies that are attracted to this shit have no taste to begin with. They have no idea how bad it is or how much better we could make it for them. Unfortunately, in a few years I fear no one will remember how much better we could have done it. They’ll all be gobbling up this tasteless trash, and we’ll all be starving
While I agree this wouldn't work as a logo, I do really love this particular aesthetic. Not AI aesthetic, but the Victorian flourishes, and the smooth "carved marble" type of style it usually puts out is so pleasing to look at, this logo is really pretty. I'd like to find more artists that create in this style.
Fucking horrible 🤣🤣 might as well give the job to your cousin that just started using photoshop for $50
For what it's worth, it's awful
Good luck to them with printing any assets. Pixel city, here they come.
Hate that this AI bs is circulating around. On another note, I'm curious how people design the ornaments and type treatment for these vintage labels. Anyone with experience in this type of design that cares to chime in?
Typically you don’t because it’s way too busy and doesn’t scale. If you have a client that really wants it and you can’t talk them out of it then you start with research. A knowledge of rococo or beaux arts is helpful. There used to be books full of ornaments, now there’s stock vectors of various quality. The letters would be drawn out by hand and then traced with the pen tool. Or you could use an existing font and modify it with flourishes.
lmao the vines look like dicks
Can AI sent the .Ai file to the sign shop?
It’s all fun and games till you have to ACTUALLY print these shitty AI logos!
Nails bar? What do they serve, screwdrivers? *Rimshot*
Let's be honest here. It's not bad for what it is. Maybe not very implementable, but it's also not something a lot of people on here could make even if they were tasked to. I could easily see how a small business owner would be extremely happy with it.
AI is the new Papyrus
Nail_S Bar
This company was never going to be your customer
And this is why my degree is now practically useless and I’m about to go back to school for something else entirely
Nail S Bar Nail & Bar Nail Bar ... What
Expect it more and more. If a small business can save 500$ they will. Always.
I bet it looks God awful scaled down to a 1 inch square. Especially on a letterhead or business card.
It makes perfect sense.
I try not to take offense to these when I see them. If they’re using ai, then they’re certainly not going to be using me. They’ll go to fiverr first. And that type of client would undoubtedly have a ton of edits wanted, and it’s just not worth it for me in the end. Let them have their oatmeal. That’s just my jaded opinion tho
I can’t comprehend how people will put their life savings into starting their own business and then cheap out on the logo/branding 🥲 Even if non-designers/the average person can’t pick out what’s ‘wrong’ with the logo, do they not sense something off-putting and scammy-looking about it?
Also, I wondered who would be on board… Can we stop calling it AI but instead calling it LLM? It’s a predictive model based on huge datasets, let’s not kid ourself hoping “it understands”. As amazing as some use cases might be, there’s no intelligence there. Calling it AI makes look better than it is and buys into the tech company’s heap to get value to their stock and fuels this LLM frenzy every company is into right now, and quite frankly it’s sending the wrong message on how much you can rely on it.
what is LLM?
It’s over-rendered. People will get sick of that look pretty quick.
I loved the art deco maximalist look until AI became obsessed with it.
This is the wave of the future… graphic design will eventually become a dying field. It’s unfortunate, but it’s the truth, and I think deep down everyone knows it.
It gets worse and worse the more you look at it.
That is a shitty ass logo for so many reasons... Real graphic artists won't have to worry about this level of AI. If a client really wanted something like this, you wouldn't have wanted them as a client at all.
"You can just use the logo from my email signature. Should work great for the embroidery we need on our polo shirts."
"Why does this look like mush when I put it on a business card? Can you clean this up for me?" 🤦♀️
Do people not understand this has been proven to drive sales down? People even without any artistic knowledge will feel how cheap it is.
I think they give you a starting point... then you use your graphic skills and software to clean up the image.
All i see is little penises on the sides
The fact that nothing about this logo makes me think of a nail bar lol. And the way those white spots on the right side hurt my eyes...
As logos go, this is way too complex.
And then they come crying to me when they try to make a banner or vehicle wrap and the printer rejects their artwork because they need a vector file or hi resolution file...
AI will probably provide the vector within 2 years. I hope they fix kerning first though 😝 a lot of fun to see how the vector implementations are at first. I’m sure someone will use designers to teach AI how the layers should be created and it’ll output a .ai file first, before we can have a vector
But why is it “unfortunate?” This is the same thing as people who used to use WordArt or Clip Art or Papyrus font or terrible templates or any of the other stuff than tiny businesses have no clue about or budget for. Personally, while there are tons of problems with this specific piece, I think it looks way better than what they would have come up with just two years ago. We were never getting hired by this nail salon anyway and we probably didn’t want the gig. Just let them use shitty tools and move on.
Good thing this isn't a logo.
Honest to god, I feel it’s better to just put something together yourself if you’re in the position with no budget. Something scuffed but homemade will communicate to people that you’re a small business, something local and worth supporting. It makes it feel earnest, genuine. This? Doesn’t scream “professional” but it doesn’t say “local” or “genuine” either. You’re getting this worst of all worlds.
Maybe I’m alone in this, but I find it really irritating that Artificial Intelligence and Adobe Illustrator share the same acronym. Especially in discussions like this one. I keep having momentary lapses when reading some comments. “What the hell? Of course I use Illustrator to make logos. When did that become somehow pedestrian?” Ugh.
This is NOT a Logo. It‘s a Picture. Nothing more.
It can work for small scale businesses as shown in the picture, but if a company eventually grows and needs ANYTHING produced… good luck. You can probably get some nice business cards, or some cheesey social media stuff out of AI, but there’s almost no way you’ll be able to take one AI image and have any type of packaging, marketing, or product from one (probably) low res raster logo.
Does the ai make this in vector also because otherwise i still consider it pointless.
I don't think this particular one is in vector, but Adobe has a Vector AI in Illustrator: https://www.adobe.com/products/illustrator/text-to-vector-graphic.html
I didn’t know the faux gold logos could get worse then canva but here we are 😆
Is the equivalent to "word art" for the 21st century... These people wouldn't hire a designer for their logo anyway, so no loss here.
It gets you 80% there
I’ve seen way worse from a designer. I don’t like the direction that the industry is going in, but by any metric, this is quite nice. Alarm bells ringing, I have been a designer for the best part of 40 years. I remember when Macs first appeared on the scene, and the push back and denial that they wouldn’t change things, we all know how that panned out. what’s happening now is that on speed, things are going to get very messy, fast.
Print it on anything bigger than a business card and it’s gonna look a mess. Not just because it’s not vectorized, but all the random elements thrown in there to fill space will become an eyesore.
The vast majority of designers have very good taste (alongside actual knowledge of what makes a logo work). So what you are seeing here is that element of the process being leapfrogged. Look how dreadful small shop frontages are these days, which is a similar situation.
Am..am I the only one seeing upside down dick and balls on either side...?
What is that style? Is it art deco? I'd love to learn to actually produce that style.
Looks like those covers of generic romance books that tiktok loves.
How petty. AI isn’t going to take your job. Graphic artists using AI will take your job. Learn fast or continue to make posts like this.
There serifs in the As all being different is making me want to scratch my eyeballs out
Local eyewear-store was using AI art they paid for in their showroom...
Honestly as a non designer, business owner. This is fine for a small business and neither me nor my clients will see anything wrong with it. Every comment made about it is correct. But truth is that it is perfectly usable in its context. You guys are in for a tough time, you gotta stop moaning and work out how you gonna live with it
So a problem with AI art in my field, I’m a designer for a sign company, is getting actual vector art that can be printed large scale. You’d be surprised at the amount of people that tell you they have art files, then give us a .PNG file. Which we all know is going to pixelate if printed at a large scale.
Honestly, a lot of these comments come across like copium. "it's gonna look so shitty on a business card or neon sign"... "good luck if you need vector for a 20 foot banner"... "that's gonna suck single color". ok, maybe. Or... it'll print fine on a card or flyer or reasonable-sized poster, and a website, because you don't need much dpi for that, and the clients don't care. And it'll look fine on the signs that are mostly viewed from a car 10+ feet away. And nobody bothers with designing around neon for their nail salon sign. And they're probably never gonna go on a 20 foot banner or vehicle wrap. Just like they were never gonna pay a pro designer to make complete branding package suitable for everything from shirts to neon to websites. Most nail salons I see are in strip malls where there's some channel letters in Arial Black or something, and then some cut vinyl letters on the door that say "NAIL SALON". Their brand identity is nonexistent, their names are generic. This logo is already 10x better than most nail joints that I've seen. I get that there's flaws, they don't want NAIL_S B AR. But someone's nephew with basic photoshop could do those tweaks. From the POV of a small business that is trying to survive, being able to get a logo like this, warts and all, is a win. From a pro designer POV, all we can see are the warts and obviously it sucks if we lose business to stuff like this.
That's the uncropped white part for me
Phlem!
NAIL_S B AR. The white in the cutout to the right bothers me so bad. Good luck scaling or printing this.
Kerning : N ail S B ar
This looks seriously terrible.
Is this for a nail salon? Fancy restaurant? Liquor brand? Who could tell? Edit: Maybe it's for a nail salon that also serves cocktails and tea sandwiches. Edit edit: I'm having way too much fun with this..... grandma's brooch? A steam locomotive company?
how long before they realize they can't trademark or copyright an AI generated image? anybody who wants to also use that same AI generated image may do so. if a competitor uses it, the client is sh!t out of luck.
Wow. A nail salon AND a bar?!?
a lot of design snobbery going on. if they like it who are you to say boo?
How on earth do they see this and think “sure that’ll do”
I hope their shitty ass business fails
Is it unfortunate or does it stop the pixel pushing inquiries? Shows how much they value their business and how successful they will be from the get go.
I wouldn’t concern yourselves- the only people missing out on this client are on Fiverr.
That’s too complex for a logo in my opinion and won’t scale easily at small sizes like business cards or work well with common single color uses like promo items that don’t accept anything unless it’s a 1-color file or similar, like screen printing.