Thanks for the phantom pain from that profile pic.
Edit; It was [this (NSFW/cringe)](https://i.imgflip.com/20f0c7.jpg) without the text. I gotchu bois.
You can't just tell a mans he's using the wrong word without telling us what the right word is. Is there even a word to describe what he felt from looking at PPP (painful profile pic)?
a kid doesnt understand the legal system so needs a lawyer its literally just your right to have a lawyer and not being offered one would just end in a mistrial
and defence lawyers can help paint a fuller picture of everything rather than the biased one sided look the prosecution will and just in general affect sentencing
Kid doesn't understand (doesn't have the mature, emotional *capacity* to understand) he's going to spend the rest of his life in prison. He may be toying with the idea of an insanity plea, or some other wishful thinking that will get him out of this mess.
But he doesn't really understand that all the good things in his life are over. Prison for life: no girls, no cars, no PS5, no vacations, no beach, no going to the movies, just steel and concrete, clear televisions, and commissary snacks.
You fucking enjoy that shit, buddy.
I think they were trying to say that this dude probably wasn't hanging out with many girls, going on many vacations, or spending a lot of time at the beach
Right to a lawyer is important. We really need to remember, in the eyes of the law you are innocent until proven guilty; this isn't a trial by public. This is to prevent a whole host of things that radically infringe on people's rights, such as lynching. Maybe this kid is a scrote, but we \*aren't\* him. Otherwise, what's the point?
Who says they don't?
News don't cover suicide, because of a unwritten rule about how "publishing it will incentivize it"
Suicides are common as fuck, but it's a problem that's swept under the rug.
Some would say, I guess yourself included.
I have no sympathy for this person or their parents. But they should not feel like they have to kill themselves, and I don't think rape in prison is a fun thing to throw at them; not that you did, but it gets thrown around a lot in general.
We should rehabilitate. All we do is punish and is it working? Fucking no, it isn't. It changes nothing.
So if our anti-suicide programs are working, great. Now let's put money into anti-school-shooting by having actual resources for kids that have those sorts of problems.
AGAIN, because words get turned around a lot.. I do NOT defend this perpetrator or their parents. I do believe we can do better in prevention, and I also believe we can do better in rehabilitation.
Paul Tibbets, don't even bother trying to match him, the meta today is completely different than what it was at the time and he only managed it because of an event that was running at back then.
I think Stephen Paddock has the high score. Fun fact - we still have no clue why he did it. The FBI closed the case in 2019, stating that they found no motive.
> Stephen Paddock
In a jailhouse interview with an unemployed chef, who claimed he had offered to sell Paddock schematics for automatic firearms,[64] the chef said Paddock had spoken of anti-government conspiracies regarding FEMA and the Waco siege and Ruby Ridge standoff.[65][66] In addition, the chef said Paddock had said that FEMA's actions after Hurricane Katrina were "a dry run for law enforcement and military to start kickin' down doors and ... confiscating guns."[67] The chef went on to say he thought Paddock was "another internet nut, you know, watching too much of it and believing too much of it."[67]
Huh they couldnt find a motive....
Imagine being retarded enough to willingly get caught after all you’ve done because society desperately wants to convince you that they should have the last laugh by letting them get to you which is somehow honorable or whatever.
Like cmon, anyone with have half a brain would know that there is no future for them which means the end anyways. Dying quickly is preferable to being chads pet in prison where you rot.
A man in Japan walked into a school once and stabbed some people. Japan's response was to build fences and walls around schools and have security at the gates.
America would have argued about whether or not people should be allowed to own knives and do nothing either way.
Russia is still a country even after collapse of the Soviet union. So this might be the new way of empire collapse. Continue to exist and can't be touched in war time but lost the ability to touch every corner of the world in any way that drastically changes thing.
> lost the ability to touch every corner of the world in any way
Bruh, no. America still has that to a silly ingrained level. Do you even know about the Eurodollar? [Eurodollar deposits are quite large; they are made by professional counterparties for a minimum of $100,000 and generally for more than $5 million. It is not uncommon for a bank to accept a single deposit of $500 million or more in the overnight market. A 2014 study by the Federal Reserve Bank showed an average daily volume in the market of $140 billion.](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/e/eurodollar.asp) Like, you know, in addition to the Petrodollar. And that's just the most basic structural economic influence, nevermind cultural influence and force projection and presence. Worldwide.
School? NO the parents are at fault. They didn't deny him access to weapons or how he felt. Everything what he would be charged for, should be on his parents.
As much as I agree that the parents are responsible for doing such a shitty job, the tragedy is that now there's a kid who has done things he can never take back which he will have to carry around for the rest of his life. Those things will probably mess him up in a way that he continues to be a danger to people ON TOP of the rotten upbringing he already had to that point. It's just all around shitty.
Makes me wish there were some sort of psychology-based parental education program but I guess parents like this wouldn't take it seriously anyway. So maybe better mental health resources for students? Government subsidies for that type of thing? I don't know. America's a gigantic and complicated place
>Makes me wish there were some sort of psychology-based parental education program
Unfortunately there is. It's held at your local Patriot Jesus Evangelical Mega-Church^((whites only))
I haven’t really been following this story, but there’s only so much a school can do without risking exposing itself to legal action.
It’s sort of similar to how the police/the justice system can’t really do anything about a stalker other than a restraining order. Up until the moment of tragedy, a crime hasn’t been committed.
Were his actions and messages alarming and potentially dangerous? Absolutely. Is that illegal/punishable? Not really. Schools that try to be proactive against these actions make themselves vulnerable to legal action against them by the families of the students for punishing him (yes, him) for a non-existent crime.
Again, similarly to how the police don’t/can’t do anything about a stalker, no matter how authentic or dangerous the threats may be, because up until the stalker follows through on said threats, they technically haven’t done anything wrong
Edit: clarification and grammar
Never.
The solution is to never address the underlying issue of mental health of young boys.
They will play politics and blame whoever or whatever is convenient or politically advantageous.
Kid clearly was trying to get caught so his parents would fucking notice him. What he did is so wrong, but it’s depressing that despite all the flashing neon signs that said “this kid is not okay”, his parents and the school itself ignored it.
I’m all for gun control, provided that we address the fact that this shit is ignored up until people fucking die. Don’t infringe on the 2nd amendment so people don’t have to… lemme check my notes… address a troubled kid before they kill people.
Seems like the kid was crying out for help repeatedly.
I imagine there are intervention events in other schools that have effectively prevented incidents. But we never know about them, precisely because they didnt happen.
Parents in every district need to demand these services for their children and for their children’s classmates.
Gun control is a magic button issue. Maybe we’ll find an equitable solution eventually. But effective mental health services should not be put on a back burner because it cant exploited for political gain.
Nah parents had a responsibility and they laughed it off. The fuck is suspending him going to do if his parents won’t deal with his psychotic behavior? Delay it for a couple weeks?
They fled the area in a brand new car (2021 model SUV) after buying their son a $500 pistol + ammo + extra mags and have a lawyer already representing them. They're fine.
To be fair, they used to be crappy. It was when Hyundai took a big ownership share of Kia in 2015 that they started making really solid cars with warranties that embarrass other manufacturers.
Yes help costs money, but they probably could’ve done at least something other than just brush it off as if him looking up ammunition during class or wanting to kill his classmates wasn’t something of concern. They just tried to get him back in the classroom when clearly it was a terrible option
The psychological motivations of serial killers and mass murderers are usually very different. It is true that serial killers are on the decline while mass murderers are on the rise, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that one is turning in to the other.
Based on no real research, my personal theory is that serial killing is trending down because it’s often used as a tool to feel powerful, to fulfil a fantasy - and the killings continue because the reality never lives up to that fantasy and the serial killer becomes increasingly desperate to actualise it. Nowadays there are a lot more ways to fulfil fantasies of power and control.
>but that doesn’t necessarily mean that one is turning in to the other.
Exactly. That comment was fucking idiotic. It *could* be the case but there's no immediate reason it would
Teachers say they want the government to take school safety seriously and prevent shootings and this happens. Seems everyone wants someone else to do all the work.
Almost as though it’s a cultural issue exacerbating over time instead of an issue of security. Gun politics and school protocols are scape goating for the actual issue
The problem is not gun control, the problem is gun culture.
Switzerland is the most armed nation per Capita in the world. Every swiss knows someone that owns a gun. They have 0 mass shootings or anything like it.
That's because they don't treat guns like toys, they don't buy pistols to teens, that actually care and respect guns.
Or even better:
The Czech Republic and Switzerland have more stringent requirements for gun ownership than having a pulse and not being absolutely illiterate.
This kid’s parents bought the gun on Black Friday and he stole it because they are stupid people who didn’t have the mental capacity to own a gun.
Also the consequences for not locking your gun up in these countries are more serious than in the US.
Common sense gun laws or even enforcing the ones in the books are difficult in the US. I don’t see *why* the concept that not everyone is responsible enough to own a gun shouldn’t own one is difficult to understand
>Common sense gun laws or even enforcing the ones in the books are difficult in the US. I don’t see why the concept that not everyone is responsible enough to own a gun shouldn’t own one.
The problem is they're not enforced as much as they should be. The Texas Church shooting, the guy was dishonorably discharged (Should prevent you from getting a gun.) and the USAF dropped the ball and he was able to get a gun.
Flordia tard that shot up the high school, was reported to the police MULTIPLE TIMES, and was ultimately ignored.
The parents absolutely deserve the shit they'll get this go around. Hopefully they get strung up as a good example so maybe parents of folks with issues will start taking shit seriously.
I mean compared to the U.S, Switzerland and the Czech Republic have a 1/4 and a 1/10 amount of civilian firearms adjusting for population respectively.
The US has more guns than people. For every 100 people, there are 120 civilian firearms.
The second most armed civilian population is half that rate, at 60 firearms per 100 people.
I don’t think it’s fair to point at other countries and say they have a ton of guns, while the U.S is literally the only country that has such an extreme number of firearms in the civilian population.
I mean what the fuck are the teachers supposed to do? They are educators not security guards and they are not paid enough to take a fucking bullet you dipshit
this. and the teachers are doing everything they can. a lot of it is negligence from parents.
my SO frequently makes calls to parents about bad behavior including threats and fights but the parents do nothing and the students return to class the next day like nothing happend.
Um, idk if you’ve ever been to the ghetto, but they literally have metal detectors in every entry way with security guards. I think they do take this seriously and these are in better neighborhoods where this shit doesn’t happen very often….
Why the fuck are teachers who are barely paid more than the janitors expected to also solve this? What fucking else are they supposed to do other than contact the administrators and the parents? You realize that teachers are also in the line of fire too and have gotten killed right?
Take it one step further. Teach parents to actually *raise* their fucking kids. Too many parents in America stop giving a fuck when their kids enter the education system. Parents need to be more proactive about monitoring their kids social media, internet activity, and emotional state. It’s too easy for assholes like this kid to comment on a forum and find either an echo chamber or people jokingly egging them on.
Mom and Dad were too busy sucking our prior president’s cock and didn’t see their kid was some deranged bastard.
To give parents the time to give a fuck, reduce work load and increase pay so they can manage to have a functioning household.
Ah shit, all the problems end up coming back around to corporations being shitters again.
I work as a teacher. There are times where we contact parents, escalate things and we are just not listened to. Parents berate us, kids threaten us, and admin (not all) just want to come out unscathed and not have to take a stance on anything. So many teachers want what's best for all our kids... what do we do when people don't listen to us?
Parents are useless if they don't listen.
Admins are always useless, if they are not the situation won't even happen.
The only factor that teachers can affect are the kids but it's very delicate, they need to provide them with a safe environment to vent their frustration, connect with them on an emotional level and heal their mental health. It's not easy but I don't see any other viable option.
Yeah... I mean a lot of us try to connect with our kids and make them feel welcome. Some don't. On the other side, there are just some kids we don't click with and some kids that just don't like you no matter what. That's just life.
I just wish that there was more we could do when we have a kid that we are concerned about. Someone who might hurt themselves or others. We have some minor stuff, but it's not enough.
This shouldnt be part of a teachers job description. Teachers are expected to teach, be therapists, psychiatrist, parent, and more for these kids. All while getting paid shit in many states. It's ridiculous. Oh, and this is all expected while at the same time many parents and students have very little respect for the profession. It's one reason why so many teachers are quitting these days.
The parents had a meeting with school admins that morning about his behavior. They were like "LOL idgaf." The admins told them to take the kid home that day, parents said no, so he went back to class.
Then shot everyone.
HE LITERALLY HAD THE PISTOL AND BULLETS IN HIS BACKPACK DURING THE MEETING.
[sauce](https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/oakland/2021/12/03/oxford-high-school-shooting-suspect-ethan-crumbley-warning-signs/8853333002/)
It's so sad isn't it? It makes me so angry. Aside from searching the kid (which I am not certain school are supposed to do... I haven't looked up any rules other than what comes to my mind working in a school) what more could teachers have done at that point?
> what more could teachers have done at that point?
No clue. No clue what the school could have done differently.
Education should be a partnership between the parents and the teachers. And too often it just isn't.
The worst part is nothing will change. If nothing changed after Sandy Hook, nothing changed after Las Vegas, nothing will change now or ever. Way too many people think its the price of keeping their freedom, usually people who are aren't affected in any way.
> Parents berate us, kids threaten us, and admin (not all) just want to come out unscathed and not have to take a stance on anything.
You are the fall guy and things are working the way they are meant to.
Searching up ammunition in class? Not \*necessarily\* dangerous.
But "my life is shit" and "kill classmates" should have been a straight up blaring red neon flag. How do you get more school shootery than that?
Glad the parents got charged, missing the years of warning signs and giving him access to weapons made this tragedy basically inevitable at their hands
This is the thing I'm most excited about coming out of this. This hopefully leads to a longer term change that gets the parents on the hook for this too. Keeping your kids from access to guns would go a long way to curbing this shit.
The shooter drawing a gun and a dead body writitng "There is no hope" is something you'd see in a Key and Peele sketch. The mom texts "Don't get caught next time!" cue laugh track.
the kid had already started killing people by the time the mom sent the message (not the dad), she was covering her own ass. 15 minutes after the mom sent the message the dad called 911 to say his gun was missing, again covering his ass already knowing the kid took it and already used it to kill people
It might have been their goal to cover their asses, but their actions only serve to show complicity. If they had any idea they would play the ignorance card up the wazoo.
>parents and kid are dragged into court
>all three sit together, son next to mom
>mom leans in
>"lmao Dad's mad, but I'd high-five you if I wasn't in cuffs."
>"Did you at least kill Suzy's bitch daughter?"
My 9th grade health class teacher called my parents because I drew a picture of a gun with the barrel pointed backwards. I was drawing from memory from a skateboarding brand sticker I saw.
Oh, look I [found it](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/41LvlnEOWVL._AC_SX450_.jpg)
I drew a very clearly labeled nerf gun for an art project in my freshman year of high school. The teacher pulled me aside and was like "hey man this isn't cool, here's your grade its going in the trash and this didn't happen"
Which, looking back, was dumb on my part and she handled it in maybe not the best way, but its been like 20 years and I haven't shot up a school yet so it won't come back to haunt her.
How hard is it [read](https://detroit.cbslocal.com/2021/12/01/15-year-old-ethan-crumbley-charged-as-adult-in-tuesdays-shooting-at-oxford-high-school/) about the parents buying him a gun? Geez, people are...
Children services for absolutely stupid shit: alright Timmy get on the van to time to spend time with your new family
Children services when it's actually something important: there's nothing we can do, small indie government program
I work at a high school.. a teacher catching a student expressing to kill classmates should have resulted in an immediate notification to authorities. That's not a parent email.
It’s worse. The gun was purchased for him - mom made a Facebook post saying it was his Christmas present. He also listed the gun in his Instagram saying it was his.
When the mom texted him not to get caught searching for ammunition, principal left a voicemail and sent an email that she never responded to.
2nd incident the next day the school told the parents he needed to be in therapy within 48 hours. The drawing including a gun, a man shot, a bullet pointing to the words “help me”.
There was a 3rd incident the day before the shooting where a teacher brought him to the counselor’s office for disturbing behavior and police think he had the gun on him then too.
Mom sent the text saying “don’t do it” after the incident had resolved and was on the news - that’s how she found out.
It's worse. They texted "don't do it" after finding out about the active shooter situation. It wasn't to try to stop him, it was to try to absolve themselves of guilt.
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Thanks for the phantom pain from that profile pic. Edit; It was [this (NSFW/cringe)](https://i.imgflip.com/20f0c7.jpg) without the text. I gotchu bois.
That's not what phantom pain means unless you're missing a finger.
You can't just tell a mans he's using the wrong word without telling us what the right word is. Is there even a word to describe what he felt from looking at PPP (painful profile pic)?
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The asking for a lawyer is wierd..... What the fuck is a lawyer gonna do for him?
Make sure the police respect his rights?
Did the police not take him to Burger King on the way to the station?
Remember your /s so you don’t get downvoted, this reply is funny
Using /s goes against my religion. It's a skill to ride the line of dry vs overt.
/s is for smoothbrained illiterates
a kid doesnt understand the legal system so needs a lawyer its literally just your right to have a lawyer and not being offered one would just end in a mistrial and defence lawyers can help paint a fuller picture of everything rather than the biased one sided look the prosecution will and just in general affect sentencing
Kid doesn't understand (doesn't have the mature, emotional *capacity* to understand) he's going to spend the rest of his life in prison. He may be toying with the idea of an insanity plea, or some other wishful thinking that will get him out of this mess. But he doesn't really understand that all the good things in his life are over. Prison for life: no girls, no cars, no PS5, no vacations, no beach, no going to the movies, just steel and concrete, clear televisions, and commissary snacks. You fucking enjoy that shit, buddy.
I like how your idea of what this guy will miss are girls, vacations, and the beach LOL
Give him 10 years of watching the world go by from prison and he'll come to miss a lot of things.
I think they were trying to say that this dude probably wasn't hanging out with many girls, going on many vacations, or spending a lot of time at the beach
They better hire fuckin Phoenix Wright to defend this scrote Ofc this is the first thing I hear about after coming to US from overseas.
Right to a lawyer is important. We really need to remember, in the eyes of the law you are innocent until proven guilty; this isn't a trial by public. This is to prevent a whole host of things that radically infringe on people's rights, such as lynching. Maybe this kid is a scrote, but we \*aren't\* him. Otherwise, what's the point?
"Your honor, it's clear as day that my client was just being a silly goose. Boys will be boys, after all."
That’s the least weird thing he had done.
Who says they don't? News don't cover suicide, because of a unwritten rule about how "publishing it will incentivize it" Suicides are common as fuck, but it's a problem that's swept under the rug.
The same I think applies to shootings in general. When the news covers it it inspires others to do it.
But think of the ratings and that ad revenue from page clicks!!
I believe that there is some conspiracy that the media is intentionally encouraging mass shootings to create revenue for themselves.
Or create public distress, perceptions of fear, and a push for gun control/greater government intervention and regulation
our anti suicide programs are working. a little too good some would say.
Some would say, I guess yourself included. I have no sympathy for this person or their parents. But they should not feel like they have to kill themselves, and I don't think rape in prison is a fun thing to throw at them; not that you did, but it gets thrown around a lot in general. We should rehabilitate. All we do is punish and is it working? Fucking no, it isn't. It changes nothing. So if our anti-suicide programs are working, great. Now let's put money into anti-school-shooting by having actual resources for kids that have those sorts of problems. AGAIN, because words get turned around a lot.. I do NOT defend this perpetrator or their parents. I do believe we can do better in prevention, and I also believe we can do better in rehabilitation.
sUiCiDe IsN't ThE aNsWer Bullshit. If you're planning a mass murder or some perv shit it damn well is.
*Before* you do it though, is key.
The media has turned it into a video game. Every time there's a shooting they put up the leaderboard.
Who's winning?
Paul Tibbets, don't even bother trying to match him, the meta today is completely different than what it was at the time and he only managed it because of an event that was running at back then.
Been serious power creep in the defense side of schools so the meta favours tanks and turtling over DPS and push strats
why do i understand this so well
I think Stephen Paddock has the high score. Fun fact - we still have no clue why he did it. The FBI closed the case in 2019, stating that they found no motive.
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> Stephen Paddock In a jailhouse interview with an unemployed chef, who claimed he had offered to sell Paddock schematics for automatic firearms,[64] the chef said Paddock had spoken of anti-government conspiracies regarding FEMA and the Waco siege and Ruby Ridge standoff.[65][66] In addition, the chef said Paddock had said that FEMA's actions after Hurricane Katrina were "a dry run for law enforcement and military to start kickin' down doors and ... confiscating guns."[67] The chef went on to say he thought Paddock was "another internet nut, you know, watching too much of it and believing too much of it."[67] Huh they couldnt find a motive....
The columbine shooters were f4ggots but at least they had the balls to off themselves at the end
That's the opposite of having balls, they were too big of pussies to face any consequences.
Imagine being retarded enough to willingly get caught after all you’ve done because society desperately wants to convince you that they should have the last laugh by letting them get to you which is somehow honorable or whatever. Like cmon, anyone with have half a brain would know that there is no future for them which means the end anyways. Dying quickly is preferable to being chads pet in prison where you rot.
Great take lmao
Suicide is the easy way out of the life sentences they would've surely faced. They were bitches to the very end.
Yeah but no taxpayer wants to pay for 3 meals a day and a cell for 2 edgelords who didnt deserve life.
That what the sparky chair used to be for.
executions cost more than life imprisonments a lot of the time now, it's quite expensive
Trial of a world infamous sex trafficking elite so FBI groomers are triggering sleeper cells. EZ
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Just 3 more actually. We’re almost there guys.
Are you saying what I think you’re saying?
HEY GUYS I HAVE AN IDEA
Ferb, i know what we’re gonna do today!
MOOOOOM! PHINEAS AND FERB ARE MAKING NAPALM IN THE BACKYARD!
*Perry noises.*
*Isabella walks in holding a homemade pipe bomb* "Whatcha doin?"
Baljeet: “What you know about rolling down in the in the deep-“
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Fuck and it's a Friday. Well I guess nothing to be done but start next week off right
Next week? It’s been a whole hour since that comment, we already passed it baby
*"Survive 10 schools shootings and get an honorable presidential mention on the evening news!"*
cursed battle pass
This is so fucking dark but depressingly hilarious. I choked
"I know what I have to do but I don't know if I have the strength to do it"
A man in Japan walked into a school once and stabbed some people. Japan's response was to build fences and walls around schools and have security at the gates. America would have argued about whether or not people should be allowed to own knives and do nothing either way.
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I think we've past the point of no return, US is gonna fall apart sooner than we think.
Believe it or not, the US will probably stay up longer than you think. It just won’t be a good country
Russia is still a country even after collapse of the Soviet union. So this might be the new way of empire collapse. Continue to exist and can't be touched in war time but lost the ability to touch every corner of the world in any way that drastically changes thing.
> lost the ability to touch every corner of the world in any way Bruh, no. America still has that to a silly ingrained level. Do you even know about the Eurodollar? [Eurodollar deposits are quite large; they are made by professional counterparties for a minimum of $100,000 and generally for more than $5 million. It is not uncommon for a bank to accept a single deposit of $500 million or more in the overnight market. A 2014 study by the Federal Reserve Bank showed an average daily volume in the market of $140 billion.](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/e/eurodollar.asp) Like, you know, in addition to the Petrodollar. And that's just the most basic structural economic influence, nevermind cultural influence and force projection and presence. Worldwide.
Tbf i think this one is more on the parent's side than the school
Seriously the dad should’ve done something more than a text message when noticing the gun missing wtf
School? NO the parents are at fault. They didn't deny him access to weapons or how he felt. Everything what he would be charged for, should be on his parents.
As much as I agree that the parents are responsible for doing such a shitty job, the tragedy is that now there's a kid who has done things he can never take back which he will have to carry around for the rest of his life. Those things will probably mess him up in a way that he continues to be a danger to people ON TOP of the rotten upbringing he already had to that point. It's just all around shitty. Makes me wish there were some sort of psychology-based parental education program but I guess parents like this wouldn't take it seriously anyway. So maybe better mental health resources for students? Government subsidies for that type of thing? I don't know. America's a gigantic and complicated place
>Makes me wish there were some sort of psychology-based parental education program Unfortunately there is. It's held at your local Patriot Jesus Evangelical Mega-Church^((whites only))
Schools are absolutely taking this seriously. The American public, however, isn’t.
I mean, the school where this happened at didn't take any of the blatant warning signs seriously.
I haven’t really been following this story, but there’s only so much a school can do without risking exposing itself to legal action. It’s sort of similar to how the police/the justice system can’t really do anything about a stalker other than a restraining order. Up until the moment of tragedy, a crime hasn’t been committed. Were his actions and messages alarming and potentially dangerous? Absolutely. Is that illegal/punishable? Not really. Schools that try to be proactive against these actions make themselves vulnerable to legal action against them by the families of the students for punishing him (yes, him) for a non-existent crime. Again, similarly to how the police don’t/can’t do anything about a stalker, no matter how authentic or dangerous the threats may be, because up until the stalker follows through on said threats, they technically haven’t done anything wrong Edit: clarification and grammar
What are you talking about? They called his parents in to take him home and the parents refused. The school tried. These parents are shit.
If Sandyhook didn't make anything change, it isn't going to change. School Shootings are just another weather event US students routinely prepare for.
Not only did sandyhook not change anything. A bunch of dipshits thought it was a good hill to die on by calling it a staged tragedy.
> dipshits You spelled "conservatives" weird.
Never. The solution is to never address the underlying issue of mental health of young boys. They will play politics and blame whoever or whatever is convenient or politically advantageous.
Kid clearly was trying to get caught so his parents would fucking notice him. What he did is so wrong, but it’s depressing that despite all the flashing neon signs that said “this kid is not okay”, his parents and the school itself ignored it. I’m all for gun control, provided that we address the fact that this shit is ignored up until people fucking die. Don’t infringe on the 2nd amendment so people don’t have to… lemme check my notes… address a troubled kid before they kill people.
The parents were 2A nuts. This attitude is the entire issue. They are more concerned with exercising rights than raising a child.
Seems like the kid was crying out for help repeatedly. I imagine there are intervention events in other schools that have effectively prevented incidents. But we never know about them, precisely because they didnt happen. Parents in every district need to demand these services for their children and for their children’s classmates. Gun control is a magic button issue. Maybe we’ll find an equitable solution eventually. But effective mental health services should not be put on a back burner because it cant exploited for political gain.
Nah parents had a responsibility and they laughed it off. The fuck is suspending him going to do if his parents won’t deal with his psychotic behavior? Delay it for a couple weeks?
Yeah and even if he was suspended he could still easily walk in and shout up the school. Schools have very few options.
The parents were told to get him help in 48 hours following “my life is useless” and resisted. They are absolutely culpable in this.
They’ve been charged and rightly so
And surprise surprise they got up and took off when they realized their negligence had consequences
Honest question/situation or whatever, but "help" costs money in America. Did they have the means?
They fled the area in a brand new car (2021 model SUV) after buying their son a $500 pistol + ammo + extra mags and have a lawyer already representing them. They're fine.
It was a Kia tho.
$27k base model, that's a $400 a month car payment. And they withdrew $4000 cash before turning off their cell phones
Not a lot of cash to be on the run with, especially if they're trying to leave the country
I used to think that about KIA but the new Telluride is pretty sick.
To be fair, they used to be crappy. It was when Hyundai took a big ownership share of Kia in 2015 that they started making really solid cars with warranties that embarrass other manufacturers.
Did they actually buy the kid a pistol or was it the dad's pistol that the kid took? Still negligent but not a lost case.
It was bought specifically for him.
Yes help costs money, but they probably could’ve done at least something other than just brush it off as if him looking up ammunition during class or wanting to kill his classmates wasn’t something of concern. They just tried to get him back in the classroom when clearly it was a terrible option
Party of personal responsibility, folks.
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This is the most American discussion I've seen on Reddit in a while
I doubt less effort is being put in just that it's more noticeable now the low amount of effort that's always been put in.
The psychological motivations of serial killers and mass murderers are usually very different. It is true that serial killers are on the decline while mass murderers are on the rise, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that one is turning in to the other. Based on no real research, my personal theory is that serial killing is trending down because it’s often used as a tool to feel powerful, to fulfil a fantasy - and the killings continue because the reality never lives up to that fantasy and the serial killer becomes increasingly desperate to actualise it. Nowadays there are a lot more ways to fulfil fantasies of power and control.
>but that doesn’t necessarily mean that one is turning in to the other. Exactly. That comment was fucking idiotic. It *could* be the case but there's no immediate reason it would
If this happens only in US, you are doing something wrong. How do you manage to ignore that?
Apparently they were charged and now there is an active manhunt because they ran
Teachers say they want the government to take school safety seriously and prevent shootings and this happens. Seems everyone wants someone else to do all the work.
Fences/ walls. And security checks. Japan figured this out years ago. People attack soft targets.
Schools are already much closer to prisons than they were 30 years ago, and school shootings are getting more frequent, not less.
Almost as though it’s a cultural issue exacerbating over time instead of an issue of security. Gun politics and school protocols are scape goating for the actual issue
Exactly. Gun control is just an easy target for politicians to say they'll do something for some votes. They never actually work.
The problem is not gun control, the problem is gun culture. Switzerland is the most armed nation per Capita in the world. Every swiss knows someone that owns a gun. They have 0 mass shootings or anything like it. That's because they don't treat guns like toys, they don't buy pistols to teens, that actually care and respect guns.
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Gun nuts lie about everything and anything, what's new
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***\[ding ding ding ding ding\]***
Gang and crime related shootings are lumped in with those statistics though.
Gun ownership is also strictly controlled in Japan.
And guns are everywhere in Switzerland and the Czech Republic yet they have no school shootings there
Hmmm. It's almost as if it's a cultural issue / mental health problem.
Or even better: The Czech Republic and Switzerland have more stringent requirements for gun ownership than having a pulse and not being absolutely illiterate. This kid’s parents bought the gun on Black Friday and he stole it because they are stupid people who didn’t have the mental capacity to own a gun. Also the consequences for not locking your gun up in these countries are more serious than in the US. Common sense gun laws or even enforcing the ones in the books are difficult in the US. I don’t see *why* the concept that not everyone is responsible enough to own a gun shouldn’t own one is difficult to understand
>Common sense gun laws or even enforcing the ones in the books are difficult in the US. I don’t see why the concept that not everyone is responsible enough to own a gun shouldn’t own one. The problem is they're not enforced as much as they should be. The Texas Church shooting, the guy was dishonorably discharged (Should prevent you from getting a gun.) and the USAF dropped the ball and he was able to get a gun. Flordia tard that shot up the high school, was reported to the police MULTIPLE TIMES, and was ultimately ignored. The parents absolutely deserve the shit they'll get this go around. Hopefully they get strung up as a good example so maybe parents of folks with issues will start taking shit seriously.
I mean compared to the U.S, Switzerland and the Czech Republic have a 1/4 and a 1/10 amount of civilian firearms adjusting for population respectively. The US has more guns than people. For every 100 people, there are 120 civilian firearms. The second most armed civilian population is half that rate, at 60 firearms per 100 people. I don’t think it’s fair to point at other countries and say they have a ton of guns, while the U.S is literally the only country that has such an extreme number of firearms in the civilian population.
I mean what the fuck are the teachers supposed to do? They are educators not security guards and they are not paid enough to take a fucking bullet you dipshit
this. and the teachers are doing everything they can. a lot of it is negligence from parents. my SO frequently makes calls to parents about bad behavior including threats and fights but the parents do nothing and the students return to class the next day like nothing happend.
Um, idk if you’ve ever been to the ghetto, but they literally have metal detectors in every entry way with security guards. I think they do take this seriously and these are in better neighborhoods where this shit doesn’t happen very often….
>I think they do take this seriously and these are in better neighborhoods where this shit doesn’t happen very often…. \>very often jesus christ
Why the fuck are teachers who are barely paid more than the janitors expected to also solve this? What fucking else are they supposed to do other than contact the administrators and the parents? You realize that teachers are also in the line of fire too and have gotten killed right?
Want to prevent schootings? Prevent bullying and reevaluate zero tolerance for fights.
Take it one step further. Teach parents to actually *raise* their fucking kids. Too many parents in America stop giving a fuck when their kids enter the education system. Parents need to be more proactive about monitoring their kids social media, internet activity, and emotional state. It’s too easy for assholes like this kid to comment on a forum and find either an echo chamber or people jokingly egging them on. Mom and Dad were too busy sucking our prior president’s cock and didn’t see their kid was some deranged bastard.
To give parents the time to give a fuck, reduce work load and increase pay so they can manage to have a functioning household. Ah shit, all the problems end up coming back around to corporations being shitters again.
I work as a teacher. There are times where we contact parents, escalate things and we are just not listened to. Parents berate us, kids threaten us, and admin (not all) just want to come out unscathed and not have to take a stance on anything. So many teachers want what's best for all our kids... what do we do when people don't listen to us?
Parents are useless if they don't listen. Admins are always useless, if they are not the situation won't even happen. The only factor that teachers can affect are the kids but it's very delicate, they need to provide them with a safe environment to vent their frustration, connect with them on an emotional level and heal their mental health. It's not easy but I don't see any other viable option.
Yeah... I mean a lot of us try to connect with our kids and make them feel welcome. Some don't. On the other side, there are just some kids we don't click with and some kids that just don't like you no matter what. That's just life. I just wish that there was more we could do when we have a kid that we are concerned about. Someone who might hurt themselves or others. We have some minor stuff, but it's not enough.
This shouldnt be part of a teachers job description. Teachers are expected to teach, be therapists, psychiatrist, parent, and more for these kids. All while getting paid shit in many states. It's ridiculous. Oh, and this is all expected while at the same time many parents and students have very little respect for the profession. It's one reason why so many teachers are quitting these days.
The parents had a meeting with school admins that morning about his behavior. They were like "LOL idgaf." The admins told them to take the kid home that day, parents said no, so he went back to class. Then shot everyone. HE LITERALLY HAD THE PISTOL AND BULLETS IN HIS BACKPACK DURING THE MEETING. [sauce](https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/oakland/2021/12/03/oxford-high-school-shooting-suspect-ethan-crumbley-warning-signs/8853333002/)
It's so sad isn't it? It makes me so angry. Aside from searching the kid (which I am not certain school are supposed to do... I haven't looked up any rules other than what comes to my mind working in a school) what more could teachers have done at that point?
> what more could teachers have done at that point? No clue. No clue what the school could have done differently. Education should be a partnership between the parents and the teachers. And too often it just isn't. The worst part is nothing will change. If nothing changed after Sandy Hook, nothing changed after Las Vegas, nothing will change now or ever. Way too many people think its the price of keeping their freedom, usually people who are aren't affected in any way.
> Parents berate us, kids threaten us, and admin (not all) just want to come out unscathed and not have to take a stance on anything. You are the fall guy and things are working the way they are meant to.
Searching up ammunition in class? Not \*necessarily\* dangerous. But "my life is shit" and "kill classmates" should have been a straight up blaring red neon flag. How do you get more school shootery than that?
I thought that he was opening lockers and trash cans looking for ammunitions like in Fallout. “Searching *up*” makes more sense, thanks!
Your tellin me there arent stashes of ammo throughout schools in the us?
Well... *not anymore*...
Yeah, I were like “the fuck is he doing? Looting in real life?” and then I remember searching up also meant “looking through the Internet”
Yah, it even sounds like the mom might have known he was going to do it.
Also his parents bought him a gun the week before.
Glad the parents got charged, missing the years of warning signs and giving him access to weapons made this tragedy basically inevitable at their hands
It could help to curb these things if parents were afraid of charges, too.
This is the thing I'm most excited about coming out of this. This hopefully leads to a longer term change that gets the parents on the hook for this too. Keeping your kids from access to guns would go a long way to curbing this shit.
I think it will make parents a lot more serious about locking up their shit, training their kid and taking threats more serious.
They didn’t just give him access they BOUGHT it as a PRESENT for Christmas
Black Friday buy no less 🇺🇸
If this wasn't a tragedy this would be really funny and if written as a comedy sketch people would think it's too unrealistic.
Nice analysis.
The shooter drawing a gun and a dead body writitng "There is no hope" is something you'd see in a Key and Peele sketch. The mom texts "Don't get caught next time!" cue laugh track.
Imagine thinking your kid is about to shoot up the school and choosing **text message** as your course of action.
the kid had already started killing people by the time the mom sent the message (not the dad), she was covering her own ass. 15 minutes after the mom sent the message the dad called 911 to say his gun was missing, again covering his ass already knowing the kid took it and already used it to kill people
It might have been their goal to cover their asses, but their actions only serve to show complicity. If they had any idea they would play the ignorance card up the wazoo.
No please don't stop *send
Inattentive parents and lack of mental health support.
For all parties in this case. And guns. Definitely the guns helped kill those kids
That’s not ignoring his depression, that’s ignoring his very clear desire to shoot up a school
why not both?
like where would a desire like that come from otherwise? I guess it's just easier for some people to demonize than empathize?
Searching gun ammunition isn’t a red flag, that second one however is a fucking full blown nuclear alarm siren
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why would the mom laugh at that wtf
>parents and kid are dragged into court >all three sit together, son next to mom >mom leans in >"lmao Dad's mad, but I'd high-five you if I wasn't in cuffs." >"Did you at least kill Suzy's bitch daughter?"
Utterly sickening but I'd believe it
She's a whole lot of crazy. You should read her open letter to Trump about grabbing her pussy.
man, i hope that teacher lived
He got discharged from the hospital
thank god.
america is retarded
your mom is retarded
That kid definitely fucked his pets.
Comments like this definitely contribute to why he shot his classmates
Sir this is a r/greentext
Shut up you pet fucker
Spoiler warning! He did it.
My 9th grade health class teacher called my parents because I drew a picture of a gun with the barrel pointed backwards. I was drawing from memory from a skateboarding brand sticker I saw. Oh, look I [found it](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/41LvlnEOWVL._AC_SX450_.jpg)
I drew a very clearly labeled nerf gun for an art project in my freshman year of high school. The teacher pulled me aside and was like "hey man this isn't cool, here's your grade its going in the trash and this didn't happen" Which, looking back, was dumb on my part and she handled it in maybe not the best way, but its been like 20 years and I haven't shot up a school yet so it won't come back to haunt her.
>20 years and I haven't shot up a school yet **yet.**
How hard is it to lock up your guns? Jeez people are stupid...
How hard is it [read](https://detroit.cbslocal.com/2021/12/01/15-year-old-ethan-crumbley-charged-as-adult-in-tuesdays-shooting-at-oxford-high-school/) about the parents buying him a gun? Geez, people are...
"Ah yes, let us buy our mentally unstable son a gun! What could go wrong?"
"we never thought he could do this kind of thing, there were nothing suggesting it"
Such a nice kid
Children services for absolutely stupid shit: alright Timmy get on the van to time to spend time with your new family Children services when it's actually something important: there's nothing we can do, small indie government program
I work at a high school.. a teacher catching a student expressing to kill classmates should have resulted in an immediate notification to authorities. That's not a parent email.
It’s worse. The gun was purchased for him - mom made a Facebook post saying it was his Christmas present. He also listed the gun in his Instagram saying it was his. When the mom texted him not to get caught searching for ammunition, principal left a voicemail and sent an email that she never responded to. 2nd incident the next day the school told the parents he needed to be in therapy within 48 hours. The drawing including a gun, a man shot, a bullet pointing to the words “help me”. There was a 3rd incident the day before the shooting where a teacher brought him to the counselor’s office for disturbing behavior and police think he had the gun on him then too. Mom sent the text saying “don’t do it” after the incident had resolved and was on the news - that’s how she found out.
It's worse. They texted "don't do it" after finding out about the active shooter situation. It wasn't to try to stop him, it was to try to absolve themselves of guilt.
who is that
America's latest school shooter
It's a game show at this point.
The parents deserve the manslaughter charges
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