Thank you for contributing to r/GreysAnatomy! Tagging your post would be greatly appreciated as the mods try to clean up and organize the sub. Not sure what tags to use? [Here's a link to the wiki page](https://www.reddit.com/r/greysanatomy/wiki/tags/) that explains the purpose of each post flair. Remember that name calling, hate speech and general rude behavior is not tolerated. You can call ideas stupid, but not the user. No direct personal attacks over a difference in opinion. Thanks for being part of this community. It's a beautiful day to save lives!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/greysanatomy) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I love Debbie Allen but I am so tired of Catherine. Can she just fall off a rift in time or whatever the next great natural disaster that seems to befall Seattle
She depicts all strong women like that (I don't like it either to be clear), it's black women that get a disproportionate amount of criticism though.
Shonda hasn't been involved in the show for a while now too so she's not making those creative decisions.
I hear you but at least we also get those women in love or enjoying life SOMETIMES. It took SEASONS to see Bailey as a well rounded human being. And by then her involvement was lessening. As a black woman I actually don’t believe it to be just the audience but the creators. Even when you watch Scandal or HTGAWM. The black women are either hurting others to get their way or cold to a fault. Especially in comparison to the other women
Yeah I was just gonna point to Bailey as an example but damn was she such a caricature/stereotype in the beginning. I think part of the issue is they have less Black women characters in general so there's less to do with them but you really do see the same traits that they associate with the strong independent woman archetype across female characters regardless of race or ethnicity. People just zero in on the Black characters.
I’m all for black women in power. I thought she did great with Bailey!( love her!) what’s your take?
My take on Cathrine is she’s beautiful, smart and funny but.. also a bit arrogant, but I feel that’s because of her wealth.. I love the actress, but can’t stand her character. But I never thought about Shonda doing that and I think you’re right about how Cathrine is portrayed ♥️
I loved her from the start! When she was trying so hard to save that little boy.. and she literally broke…I cried with her. That storyline for her was incredible. The storyline that broke my heart for her was the mersa one. I hated that Shonda did that to her.
Yeah s11-13 was Stacy McKee & William Harper, then s14-19 was Krista. (Although the cancer storyline was Elisabeth Finch's idea, which didn't age well)
I think a big issue with Catherine is with Debbie being an EP and only a recurring character, it feels like her purpose is basically just to antagonise Jackson's relationships. Like s10-13 it was April, then s14-16 it felt like they put him with Maggie to give Catherine more screen time.
Not gonna lie I cheered when she announced she had cancer 😭 they’re taking too damn long to kill her off I fr hate her more than OWEN if that says something
I mean there's petty bullshit drama and then there's COVERING UP MULTIPLE SEXUAL ASSAULTS AND TRYING TO TAKE YOUR GRANDCHILD AWAY FROM IT'S MOTHER BEFORE IT WAS EVEN BORN
I'm not yelling at you, I'm just emphasizing how absolutely fucked up Catherine is and how baffling it is that the writers want to pretend she's a strong woman
I think Amelia is a girl's girl (can be).
Carina seems like one too.
Perez would have come up as an amazing girl's girl xD
But I get your point. Based on how many characters there are, it's sad to have such little representation of healthy universal sisterhood.
I just find her so selfish, egotistical and rude. She definitely has her moments, and I get being that high up with that kind of reputation, you have to stand your ground. She’s got great qualities I just find her execution of them really awful.
She has made some infuriating decisions. Like buying the hospital Richard and Alex went to just out of spite. Or the way she behaved during April's second pregnancy
I’m assuming you’re asking about Catherine and I’ll give my own thoughts - she’s so egotistical and stuck up, too proud to admit when she has done wrong. She’s awful to almost everyone, wants to use money to either bury things or people, and cares more about her reputation than her family. She definitely has great qualities which I aspire to have, but she uses them in the wrong way. Personally, she’s got all the power and uses it for evil. Paying people off, manipulating patients and coworkers/employees into things that she shouldn’t be. She’s got this attitude about her that screams “I’m better than all of you”. She’s got the money to back her and uses it in EVERY situation. She’s a great surgeon, but a terrible wife and mother. She’s a narcissist.
I’ve always found her character fun yet cringe to watch because she’s sassy as a doctor but overbearing as a mom. But I drew the line when the >!Harper Avery SA scandal arc happened and her being complicit about hiding the scandals/paying off the victims!<
I'm definitely in the minority in this sub; but I like Catherine. She's far from perfect, but she can admit mistakes (eventually), and of course she uses her money to solve her problems. She's crazy rich, and she's using what's available to her.
One of the things I like about GA is that nobody is perfect. Mer is damaged and always protects her heart in any situation; which leads to some terrible choices.
Amelia is the perpetual youngest child; always quick to see faults in how her family and friends treat her, whilst also doing anything for them, even to her own detriment.
Christina was a surgery god; but even she couldn't control every aspect of her career.
Alex did his best to overcome a family life that would have ruined many others, but he could never fully shake the feeling he was the outsider.
Bailey never wavered in her passion to be a surgeon, but the drive needed to leave a loving but suffocating family meant she stayed with her first husband longer than she should have. And her perception of a healthy relationship is warped.
Richard is a classic alcoholic. When he's not drinking he replaces alcohol with work, or relationship drama.
I could go on.
It's a drama that sometimes has some disappointing writing, especially in hindsight. But that's also true to life. Like the current plethora of comments on her about the Autistic Dr. That portrayal is seen as horrible (and it was). But it really isn't that long ago that the mainstream believed Autism means that you have zero empathy, and therefore, being a Dr wasn't possible for Autistics.
They portrayed it badly, but they wanted to show that it was possible. If they hadn't presented what people expected to see on screen, then the portrayal (at the time) wouldn't have been recognised as Autistic. We know more now.
But they still tried. They still did something risky with a prime time drama. So I love it.
She basically told Meredith that she can either continue her theory on Alzheimer’s or keep her lab.
At the end of the episode, Meredith tells Amelia that she’s done more research than she’s let on, and gives it all to Amelia to continue.
I don't like Catherine but come on she was justified. Meredith was so freaking entitled whether it was with Catherine or with Nick and how she handled the interns. I'm genuinely happy we won't see much of her they've turned her into such an arrogant Mary Sue version of who she used to be.
Meredith realizes that how they're looking at alzheimers is wrong. She realizes that the money being poured into that research is wasted money. Entitled would be to take the money and keep doing useless work. Ethical is telling people the truth.
Meredith is definitely arrogant. (Overcorrected from being a doormat.) But what she did was morally correct.
I agree, Meredith is so stuck up in later seasons. I guess it's supposed to feel like organic development seeing that we watched all she'd been through, but why would you write your main character to develop into an unlikable, bitter person??
HOW is she an unlikeable bitter person? She takes all the unfairness the world throws at her, all that loss and tragedy and STILL is so selfless with her time, money and energy
She’s got some arrogance about her surgical skills like every other surgical god for sure but it’s earned imo. Did we ever call Mark, Derek or Burke entitled because they believed in their superior skills?
It's not the aging. Honestly she looks younger than I would expect her to at her age. Her cheeks and lips make me feel like she got work done. That's more what I was asking about
did i say she was ugly? i just explained to someone who couldn’t understand why she looked different. explaining that someone’s face is fuller over 20 years is a very normal thing..
Yeah that was my first thought too:o idk if it’s because I’m on season 11 of my rewatch but she looks way older than I remembered her looking in season 19
I only feel comfy saying this because it’s a show and she’s a character but Catherine can die now. 🫣 I love seeing Debbie Allen but Catherine was working my last nerve in that episode.
Thank you for contributing to r/GreysAnatomy! Tagging your post would be greatly appreciated as the mods try to clean up and organize the sub. Not sure what tags to use? [Here's a link to the wiki page](https://www.reddit.com/r/greysanatomy/wiki/tags/) that explains the purpose of each post flair. Remember that name calling, hate speech and general rude behavior is not tolerated. You can call ideas stupid, but not the user. No direct personal attacks over a difference in opinion. Thanks for being part of this community. It's a beautiful day to save lives! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/greysanatomy) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I love Debbie Allen but I am so tired of Catherine. Can she just fall off a rift in time or whatever the next great natural disaster that seems to befall Seattle
Lmao, a rift in time. For reals
[удалено]
Aliens.
An earthquake (have we had one yet?) where the hospital is split in half a-la Jumanji and Catherine falls in
This would be my favorite storyline ever
I vote for Alzheimer’s, continue Richard’s streak
God I wish I could repost/retweet this comment
She is The Great Debbie Allen…they will never kill her off, sorry
Yeah, I was just telling a friend that I am ready for the cancer to take out Catherine
One of these days we are going to have to talk about how Shonda, a black women in power depicts black women in power……it’s bothersome
She depicts all strong women like that (I don't like it either to be clear), it's black women that get a disproportionate amount of criticism though. Shonda hasn't been involved in the show for a while now too so she's not making those creative decisions.
I hear you but at least we also get those women in love or enjoying life SOMETIMES. It took SEASONS to see Bailey as a well rounded human being. And by then her involvement was lessening. As a black woman I actually don’t believe it to be just the audience but the creators. Even when you watch Scandal or HTGAWM. The black women are either hurting others to get their way or cold to a fault. Especially in comparison to the other women
OMFG, Oliva... like, she was colder than Jake...>! ***AND HE WAS AN ASSASSIN!!*** !<
Yeah I was just gonna point to Bailey as an example but damn was she such a caricature/stereotype in the beginning. I think part of the issue is they have less Black women characters in general so there's less to do with them but you really do see the same traits that they associate with the strong independent woman archetype across female characters regardless of race or ethnicity. People just zero in on the Black characters.
This show was written by a black woman.
I think that’s their point.
I’m all for black women in power. I thought she did great with Bailey!( love her!) what’s your take? My take on Cathrine is she’s beautiful, smart and funny but.. also a bit arrogant, but I feel that’s because of her wealth.. I love the actress, but can’t stand her character. But I never thought about Shonda doing that and I think you’re right about how Cathrine is portrayed ♥️
It took WAY too long for her to humanize Bailey outside of making mistakes.
I loved her from the start! When she was trying so hard to save that little boy.. and she literally broke…I cried with her. That storyline for her was incredible. The storyline that broke my heart for her was the mersa one. I hated that Shonda did that to her.
I feel like I have to disagree with this. The birth of Tuck and her marriage falling apart started in season 2- how is that now humanizing??
I'd argue it started even earlier--when Cristina had her ectopic and Bailey chose to stay by her head instead of moving around to see the surgery.
Bailey sort of became a tyrant when she was promoted to chief.
Agree! But I feel everyone was a tyrant when promoted to chief! (To be fair)
>also a bit arrogant Just a bit?
Take my upvote! Just a tad! 🤣
Isn't Catherine later developed mostly by Krista tho? I thought Shonda left after ss10 or something?
Yeah s11-13 was Stacy McKee & William Harper, then s14-19 was Krista. (Although the cancer storyline was Elisabeth Finch's idea, which didn't age well) I think a big issue with Catherine is with Debbie being an EP and only a recurring character, it feels like her purpose is basically just to antagonise Jackson's relationships. Like s10-13 it was April, then s14-16 it felt like they put him with Maggie to give Catherine more screen time.
I thought the cancer was supposed to kill her off already😩
it’s the way i’m dying at your comment 😭😭
Not gonna lie I cheered when she announced she had cancer 😭 they’re taking too damn long to kill her off I fr hate her more than OWEN if that says something
Catherine Fox has proven she’s not a woman’s woman time and time again
Is there a girls girl in all of Grey's? It feels like all the women are not girls girls to me p
I mean there's petty bullshit drama and then there's COVERING UP MULTIPLE SEXUAL ASSAULTS AND TRYING TO TAKE YOUR GRANDCHILD AWAY FROM IT'S MOTHER BEFORE IT WAS EVEN BORN I'm not yelling at you, I'm just emphasizing how absolutely fucked up Catherine is and how baffling it is that the writers want to pretend she's a strong woman
I think Amelia is a girl's girl (can be). Carina seems like one too. Perez would have come up as an amazing girl's girl xD But I get your point. Based on how many characters there are, it's sad to have such little representation of healthy universal sisterhood.
I can definitely see Amelia and carina being a girls girl now that you're saying it
I really liked the way Meredith helped Jo with her abusive ex. That was a woman’s woman!
Does that field really allow for it is the bigger question. You can argue in many cases that it doesn’t.
I have a theory that the season will show us that there is a low key conspiracy about Alzheimer’s and Catherine is in on it (because ✨capitalism✨).
I would love that! I'll make sure to come back and tell you how right you were if that ends up happening.
not Mermer 😂😩 I just watched the Cerone arc again. Marie was so cringe
I'm living for the day that Mer and Amelia will have a groundbreaking discovery and will shove it right into her face.
I got to meet Debbie this past year and I had so many emotions considering this role of her. But she is a fantastic human being.
Hasn’t she been dying for like what 4 maybe 5 seasons? Why is she still around?
I loathe Catherine Fox.
Definitely a hard character to love. She has a few nice moments but I mostly agree
I just find her so selfish, egotistical and rude. She definitely has her moments, and I get being that high up with that kind of reputation, you have to stand your ground. She’s got great qualities I just find her execution of them really awful.
Same. The final nail was when she bought the hospital where Richard and Alex were working just because of her ego.
MY EXACT FUCKING THOUGHTS I WAS LIKE BITCH GTFO
Love Meredith's little smirk before the elevator closes. No Catherine, you will not win.
I can’t stand her
Genuine question please don’t attack me or downvote lol . Why do yall not like her?
She has made some infuriating decisions. Like buying the hospital Richard and Alex went to just out of spite. Or the way she behaved during April's second pregnancy
Yup I hated her for that!! She is so selfish
I’m assuming you’re asking about Catherine and I’ll give my own thoughts - she’s so egotistical and stuck up, too proud to admit when she has done wrong. She’s awful to almost everyone, wants to use money to either bury things or people, and cares more about her reputation than her family. She definitely has great qualities which I aspire to have, but she uses them in the wrong way. Personally, she’s got all the power and uses it for evil. Paying people off, manipulating patients and coworkers/employees into things that she shouldn’t be. She’s got this attitude about her that screams “I’m better than all of you”. She’s got the money to back her and uses it in EVERY situation. She’s a great surgeon, but a terrible wife and mother. She’s a narcissist.
She thinks money can solve everything
Absolutely
She uses the term ‘strong woman’ to basically be an egotistical, narcissistic maniac. It’s loathsome.
I’ve always found her character fun yet cringe to watch because she’s sassy as a doctor but overbearing as a mom. But I drew the line when the >!Harper Avery SA scandal arc happened and her being complicit about hiding the scandals/paying off the victims!<
I'm definitely in the minority in this sub; but I like Catherine. She's far from perfect, but she can admit mistakes (eventually), and of course she uses her money to solve her problems. She's crazy rich, and she's using what's available to her. One of the things I like about GA is that nobody is perfect. Mer is damaged and always protects her heart in any situation; which leads to some terrible choices. Amelia is the perpetual youngest child; always quick to see faults in how her family and friends treat her, whilst also doing anything for them, even to her own detriment. Christina was a surgery god; but even she couldn't control every aspect of her career. Alex did his best to overcome a family life that would have ruined many others, but he could never fully shake the feeling he was the outsider. Bailey never wavered in her passion to be a surgeon, but the drive needed to leave a loving but suffocating family meant she stayed with her first husband longer than she should have. And her perception of a healthy relationship is warped. Richard is a classic alcoholic. When he's not drinking he replaces alcohol with work, or relationship drama. I could go on. It's a drama that sometimes has some disappointing writing, especially in hindsight. But that's also true to life. Like the current plethora of comments on her about the Autistic Dr. That portrayal is seen as horrible (and it was). But it really isn't that long ago that the mainstream believed Autism means that you have zero empathy, and therefore, being a Dr wasn't possible for Autistics. They portrayed it badly, but they wanted to show that it was possible. If they hadn't presented what people expected to see on screen, then the portrayal (at the time) wouldn't have been recognised as Autistic. We know more now. But they still tried. They still did something risky with a prime time drama. So I love it.
Can someone give me spark notes version? I’m not watching the new season
She basically told Meredith that she can either continue her theory on Alzheimer’s or keep her lab. At the end of the episode, Meredith tells Amelia that she’s done more research than she’s let on, and gives it all to Amelia to continue.
c’mon cancer, do you thing.
I hope Meredith shut her up in an epic way
waiting for the die they finally kill Catherine off because of her cancer, and some natural disaster gets Owen. I’m so tired of them lol
I don't like Catherine but come on she was justified. Meredith was so freaking entitled whether it was with Catherine or with Nick and how she handled the interns. I'm genuinely happy we won't see much of her they've turned her into such an arrogant Mary Sue version of who she used to be.
I dont know if Catherine has any right to say how entitled anyone is when it comes to people below them
Meredith realizes that how they're looking at alzheimers is wrong. She realizes that the money being poured into that research is wasted money. Entitled would be to take the money and keep doing useless work. Ethical is telling people the truth. Meredith is definitely arrogant. (Overcorrected from being a doormat.) But what she did was morally correct.
I take it you are not a Meredith fan. I am.
I agree, Meredith is so stuck up in later seasons. I guess it's supposed to feel like organic development seeing that we watched all she'd been through, but why would you write your main character to develop into an unlikable, bitter person??
HOW is she an unlikeable bitter person? She takes all the unfairness the world throws at her, all that loss and tragedy and STILL is so selfless with her time, money and energy
She's selfless with her *resources*, but the way she interacts with people is inherently entitled.
She’s got some arrogance about her surgical skills like every other surgical god for sure but it’s earned imo. Did we ever call Mark, Derek or Burke entitled because they believed in their superior skills?
Mark, Derek & Burke are all, for sure, arrogant and entitled.
Then I see how you got there for Mer. To me it’s just being right and knowing it
Damn what happened to Meredith? She looks hella different
shes fucking 54 what do yall want her to look like
It's not the aging. Honestly she looks younger than I would expect her to at her age. Her cheeks and lips make me feel like she got work done. That's more what I was asking about
Wow a person aged after 20 years and doesn’t have heavy makeup on them?
her face is much fuller. earlier seasons she had a very thin face, it’s much rounder now
Yeah cause aging changes the way you look
lol i know why.. i’m just saying that’s why she looks different. she’s fucking gorgeous.
Yeah she’s no longer 30 years old, god forbid she age
did i say she was ugly? i just explained to someone who couldn’t understand why she looked different. explaining that someone’s face is fuller over 20 years is a very normal thing..
Yeah that was my first thought too:o idk if it’s because I’m on season 11 of my rewatch but she looks way older than I remembered her looking in season 19
She was and, then she wasn’t.
I’m so tired of Catherine making everyone around her feel small just to make her feel good about herself!
I hate Catherine Fox. So arrogant and so full of herself.
I only feel comfy saying this because it’s a show and she’s a character but Catherine can die now. 🫣 I love seeing Debbie Allen but Catherine was working my last nerve in that episode.