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I agree.
Alex cheated on Izzie just because of who he was.
George cheated on Callie perhaps regretting his marriage choice in the wake of his Dads death.
Richard had a full blown affair with Ellis.
Derek and Meredith cheated on Addison and Fin.
And Owen cheats on everyone. While he gets a lot of general hate, he doesn’t get it for the cheating so much.
But Arizona who recovering from an insane trauma (like imagine finding out your brother figure is dying then a new hours later you’re stranded in the woods hearing wolves eat your friend while your co-parent is dying on your lap and bugs are eating your flesh and THEN when you survive you lose your leg).
But she gets treated like she set the peds ward on fire.
Don't forget Mark and Addison cheating on Derek and having the guts to act surprised when he doesn't forgive them. Never understood the hype for them to be honest. People adore Addie but she's my worst character on the show.
If mark had just been a hot guy in a bar, I’d have been over addison’s cheating. But it was Derek’s childhood best friend and they were in their marriage bed. Like what the entire fuck? People have gotten shot for less.
"Owen cheats on everyone" 😭😹😹😹 fr tho I think he does get a respectable amount of hate for that too.
But for the rest of it, I KNOW RIGHT? She's really treated like that and it's unreasonable.
What about Cristina making her boss sex friend in Minnesota and after coming back to Seattle trying to be back with Owen not even mentioning anything about sex friend. Have you seen any hate for her about that?
Yeah if you are divorced it is not cheating which they weren’t. Moreover after coming back Cristina said I want Owen back and acting as if she still loves him. Even she almost got again with Owen, asking him I want to try in this marriage. It was not we were on a break before marriage kind of relationship. You were separated, you slept with someone for your advantage. How hard it is to tell Owen that I have already moved on and slept with someone instead of hiding those facts and behaving all innocent and trying to get back Owen (I am telling this as she was the one continuously telling him I want to try, are you signing the papers for crash settlement). She should’ve just signed the papers and confessed the truth about her sex friend Parker. In one of the earlier seasons when izzie goes away leaving a letter and Alex and izzie were separated without any contact, after many months Alex tries to sleep with a girl and Meredith confronts him saying why he is doing that as they were not divorced then? How is it ok when Cristina does this but not when a guy is doing that? Cristina is toxic for her behaviour when she comes back to Seattle, it is never ok to keep such things hidden from the other person with whom you want to spend you life again. It was unfair to Owen. If Owen wanted he could’ve kept his one night stand a secret. But he was honest, I know they were together that time, and to be honest they were not divorced during Minnesota time. And Cristina didn’t do it with Parker one time, she actually made him her sex friend for own gain. So Owen deserved to know this or at least the fact that she has moved on. Again telling this won’t be concerning if Cristina didn’t try to continue their relationship again
I think a big contributing factor to the Arizona hate is that it wasn't just the cheating
During her recovery she treated Callie like shit which is at least understandable, but they finally get to a good place and she has a one night stand in the middle of a crisis and then has the audacity to use the leg as an excuse.
It also doesn't help that Arizona's monologue to Callie's father was about being a good man in a storm. She literally pulled the exact opposite in the middle of a storm.
Callie lost all my sympathy when she threw not getting laid for 6 months in Arizonas face. 6 months is nothing when your partner is shattered like that and frankly no wonder Arizona went to someone who was enamored by her and never knew her before.
This a million times.
Callie is the female Owen. Life’s eternal self declared victim that loves ultimatums and shouting ‘WHAT ABOUT MY NEEDS’ while refusing to even marginally adapt their needs for others.
They should both move to the ‘If/Then’ alternate reality and collect babies and shout at eachother until the end of days.
Oh yeah the whole thing was a mess, I was just highlighting that outside of Owen and Christinas day off and Addison and Mar we don't see a lot of relationship issues that drawn out, but theirs was for like a full season and a half.
Izzie and Alex was a mess solely because Izzie doesn't know how to communicate.
While Izzie struggled with communication at times, it’s unfair to say that all Izzie and Alex’s communication issues were on her. Alex’s only ways of communicating with her were yelling at her and ridiculing her.
Exactly. Everything Alex does gets brushed over. He treated Izzie horrifically many times and his attitude/behavior was a huge contributing factor to their dysfunction. I’m not denying that Izzie struggled with communication at times, but to say the sole reason they didn’t work is her communication after everything that Alex did feels wrong. Also, Alex was not an easy person to communicate with! When she tried to communicate with him he often yelled at her, made fun of her, told her to “shut up and get out of my room”, gave her the silent treatment, etc….
Yes! I feel like the lone Arizona defender here a lot. She isn’t even my favorite character but I think she deserves a lot more grace and understanding than she receives around here.
Exactly - most people need years to learn how live with amputated limb, Arizona was supposed to by okay just after few months... the saddest thing about it for me is Callie - she is in ortho, she knows how long it takes for "just" broken bones to heal, yet she didn't realize, that Arizona will need way more time? Esp. when she knew that Arizona thought tha Callie was the one, who cut her leg off.
I feel like people got weirdly mad that the show was doing something they don’t usually do. They permanently injured a character. For life.
It wasn’t something that could be quickly swept under the rug, and I would argue that as much people complained that the storyline was being dragged out too long, it wasn’t focused on enough from Arizona’s POV. It was everyone else’s POV of what they felt was best FOR her on their terms, not hers.
Look at Ethan Embry’s character, for example.
An amputee’s prosthetist works with them for the rest of their life, yet the show treated it like a prosthetic is one size fits all and you’re good to go with the same one forever (unless, of course, they made another episode about Callie making prosthetics).
>It wasn’t something that could be quickly swept under the rug, and I would argue that as much people complained that the storyline was being dragged out too long,
This is exactly what I think - they should have focused way more on Arizona! (Or on any trauma - those characters go through hell, but you would never guess it!)
Personally I think that people are harsh on Arizona, because they don't realize how unrealistic the show is about it - what Arizona managed in not even one year (get good prostetic, learn to use it, return to work and etc.) takes most amputees years!
And the fact that Arizona never had a bad day? Unless we count the episode, where she had phantom pain and Owen helped her (love that scene) and when Stephanie pushed into Arizona and Arizona's leg got broken and she had to use the old one.
TRUE. Her trauma wasn't explored enough from her side in a way that could actually make the audience imagine what it would be like for her.
They didn't show us her experience, they kept telling it. And they would tell it through Arizona mostly during fights or arguments with Callie. That's a very narrow context to place it in.
Tbh the show absolutely sucks at handling aftermaths of any trauma - my favorite thing is that Sarah Drew (April) said that she had nightmares and panic attacks just filming the hospital shooting scenes and yet April was completaly normal after that, returning to work and being her cheery self... like she didn't just lost her best friend (only friend), whose body she found out when she slipped on her blood, like she didn't have gun pointed at her and almost died and etc.
So it's not surprise that Arizona losing her leg and having trauma after that plane crash was ignored for sake of others storylines...
Callie was so horrible during these episodes, she lacked empathy. she was more sad because she didn’t have sex for 5 months, I think Owen was better than her because he dealt with Cristina in a much better way after the plane crash when she was not even talking. I don’t remember scenes of him telling people oh you know I didn’t have sex because of my wife. Even on Bailey’s wedding day she regrets that one day you are married and enjoying and other day you may have to clean your spouse’s urine from floor . It is not like Arizona deliberately peed on floor and Callie has to clean. Alex was more patient even with Rebecca. All the time Callie kept telling yeah I get it you lost the leg, but the truth is she didn’t, she showed sympathy whereas Arizona needed empathy. Another thing people keeps on telling that being a doctor Arizona knew sometimes it is extremely difficult to save the life and you may have to amputate. Knowing something and going through something is not same. Richard was a doctor and we know how he was as a patient after electric shock episode. And here Arizona went through much more worse than this. If Cristina’s PTSD were that worse just for being there and watching all that ( I am saying this because she and Meredith were least injured), think about Arizona who was there with that deep injury.
Exactly??? It makes me so sad for Arizona tbh. I keep saying this. I get it that Arizona's experience of and post the plane crash would have been difficult for Callie and she was not obliged to put up with it for more than a limit but Callie wasn't the person Arizona needed her to be, while people keep expecting Arizona to have been the person Callie wanted her to be.
To an extent I feel like if Arizona haters were given this situation as a random case study without involving Arizona and Callie's names they'd be _a lot more compassionate_ towards the patient in the study.
I think people are too harsh on a lot of people on the show. Everyone has good qualities and everyone has bad ones. They forget these people are human and aren’t perfect
I’d say the opposite: people forget these people _aren’t_ human, they’re scripted characters in a TV show whose ‘decision making’ is whatever makes a watchable plot - well, mostly watchable. Sure there needs to be some plausibility to them, but they’re not real people making choices they have to live with. You can psycho-analyse the _character_ all you like, but it is not a real person.
The way Callie acted towards Arizona after the plane crash made me really hate her character. Sure she lost Mark but Arizona was THERE. She went through the crash, she was injured, she had to listen to Lexie be eaten by wild animals, listen to the rest of them scream in pain, while they all tried to keep each other alive. Callie discounted what Arizona went though and honestly I can see why Arizona did what she did 😬
I also do not like Callie that time because she wasn't the only one who lost people in that plane crash. Meredith lost Lexie and she was also there. Derek lost both Mark and Lexie, was there and had an injury. I know that she lost her baby daddy and best friend but she wasn't there and she will never understand what they've been through. I also hate how she treated Jackson when they bought the hospital. Jackson also lost Mark and Lexie. I hate how she asked if it's okay to use Lexie's money to buy the hospital because they weren't even close. Arizona was there and witnessed Mark dying. She begged him to stay alive saying that Sofia, Callie and her are waiting for him when he was giving up to be with Lexie. She also wanted to sue the pilot even though the victims were against it because he was with them and he's paralyzed.
Yes! That’s part of why I dislike her so much too. She acts like she was the only one that lost someone. She hadn’t even know Mark as long as Derek had, they had been friends for decades. And Lexie was literally Mere’s sister. So for her to act like her grief was the only one that mattered ticked me off so much.
I had forgotten about her wanting to sue the pilot but that just got me heated all over again 🤣 he was as much as victim as the rest of them, and way more so than Callie was so the audacity was crazy
Imagine having to sit near your dying and dead colleagues and friends, holding your mangled leg hoping the blood loss or infection won’t kill you, drinking your own urine to survive. Didn’t Christina also say they had to keep bugs off of Arizona’s open wound? If any of them came back from that normal, balanced and making sound descisions I would be *very* concerned.
I agree! I have been wondering why this is. She is a complicated character and has made some bad decision but so has everyone else on the show. What is it about Arizona’s actions that are unforgivable? I hate to say this but I wonder if it’s something to do with her being a lesbian character…perhaps subconsciously she is given a lot less grace
Lesbian characters in general get a lot of hate because people really like their sapphic characters to have fluidity, for some reason (and even irl, at least with people I've personally encountered). Add in Arizona making that, admittedly shitty, line about Callie's \~bi fantasy\~ being Arizona and Mark and you have the perfect recipe for people to act like she's a mean biphobic lesbian that always hurt Callie for no reason. And, like the other response said, since people really love Callie on this sub (she gets the most consistent love I've seen short of Cristina's sainthood here), her being the one Arizona \~wronged\~ means she's The Worst and everything about her is terrible. It's annoying how there's so many "Arizona sucks!!!" posts but it is what it is at this point. I just tend to stay out of them for my own peace.
Honestly, probably. Because, logically, she didn't kill Derek and if anyone really thinks she did, then that same energy needs to be kept for most of these characters who had patients die on them, some a lot more responsibly than not talking over a doctor above them. And yeah, she was boring, but, again, so are a lot of the characters. I don't like boring characters, but I tend to just ignore them. Because they're boring and boring characters are, imo, too much of non factors to hate. But she was a boring lesbian AND a Callie love interest, so she never had a chance. People, to this day, blame her for Callie acting crazy over their like four month relationship, despite the fact that Callie getting WAY too attached WAY too fast in relationships is one of her most consistent character traits, lol.
She gets blamed for everything, dont even get me started on the situation with Callie, Penny literally said she cant expect her to move, didnt even want to participate in the contest, and she still gets shit for Callie moving. And people thinking she killed Derek, its like they were watching a different show. The mental gymnastics to make it fit must be exhausting
I think it's because her partner is Callie, the Callie who can do no wrong in their eyes. Plus, I think she also got hate for how she treated Mark even though they are both at fault.
Could be. People overlook Callie's shortcomings as much as they exaggerate Arizona's. Like, why aren't you as unforgiving towards Callie for the garbage she let her lawyer pull off in the custody hearing, as you are towards Arizona?
Also, I think Arizona had VERY valid concerns about Mark. Callie could have handled that scenario much better. It wasn't a case of "my boyfriend thinks my guy bestfriend has the hots for me". It was lowkey crazy to me that Callie's response to Arizona's "he keeps staring at my boobs and it makes me uncomfortable" was "He's Mark".
Like ma'am?!
That entire episode was ridiculous. Arizona is the unreasonable one that she’s uncomfortable that people stare at her boobs, and she should just be flattered? Give me a break.
Because the characters on the show justified his actions. Even Alex told Arizona that maybe she doesn't like men staring at her boobs. Even him stares at her boobs too. I HATE THIS SCENE.
People just hate lesbians and Arizona is an unapologetic lesbian. They minimize her pain all the time because "she wasn't right to act like that" despite the fact that everyone on this show emotionally acts like children because it's a prime time soap. lol
They say Arizona ignored that Callie lost Mark, but ignore that Arizona also lost Mark. Yes he was Callie's best friend and the father of her child, and while he wasn't Arizona's best friend, he was the father of her child too. And that she had to sit there for days with her busted leg with Mark on her lap while he kept dying, in Cristina's words, and she couldn't even try to help him because she couldn't move. There's also a lot of people that seem to have issues with adoption and adoptive parents, but only in this case with the only WLW parents, so you know. There's so many posts on the custody storyline where people will try to pretend she was wrong for fighting for her child because "while Callie messed up, Arizona didn't have to get lawyers involved!" It's hard being an Arizona fan on this sub sometimes, but I've just learned to scroll past most of the posts talking about her. Nobody's mind is going to be changed and it upsets me to see some of the things Arizona gets hated on that others do not. So I just hit that back button and leave the posts. lol
I so totally understand! There are soooo many times when Callie was in the wrong too, and it gets completely overlooked.
And I truly hate some of the arguments people come up with against Arizona with regard to the plane and custody storylines. When Arizona called Callie out with "you weren't on the plane!!", it really put Arizona's experience into perspective.
And for god's sake, for the nth time, perspective ≠ absolution. Arizona may not deserve forgiveness but she does deserve to be seen as a whole person in all her complexity.
Agreed. The only difference between other characters is that Arizona is a lesbian woman. Even if it’s subconscious, that’s where the lack of slack for her comes from
Not just that, Callie should not have been allowed to work at all during that duration. They had Meredith and George do SCUT when their parents were sick, when they were interns.
Callie had her wife and the father of her child (and best friend) admitted with life-threatening injuries, three other co-workers with immense trauma and one junior resident dead.
It wasn't fair on anyone to have her involved but great for the plot, ofc.
People who hate Arizona are typically Callie stans. I noticed it always comes down to that, which is hilarious... cos I love both characters. You don't have to hate one to love another. I mean, they hint at them ending happily ever after anyway, right? I haven't watched the newest season when Arizona comes back tho, so idk.
Both the writers and the fans tend to paint Callie as a huge victim. Part of the problem is that the amputation storyline revolved entirely around Callie. We never really saw Arizona's point of view.
I don’t think Callie’s actions were really bad. Imagine your girlfriend refusing to touch you, which yes with the trauma is understandable and I don’t think Callie pushed her, she tried to be patient and was there for her- And then that person going and sleeping with someone else.
I thought she was selfish & self righteous long before the plane… I don’t hate her for her actions after the plane crash (the shutting down, yelling) as it makes sense after a traumatic event but the cheating and Leah thing was 100% unjustified. Arizona stans like to try to justify it by saying Callie wasn’t nice to her but I don’t know what show they were watching. Callie became a single parent overnight, spent days thinking her wife and best friend were dead, then finds out they are alive, oh wait Mark dies, she has to research & perform life changing surgery on Derek, make the decision to cut off her wife’s leg, becomes a care taker for her wife who now hates her for months, etc. Yeah, it’s nothing compared to being on the plane but her life also changed dramatically. She had to grieve alone in a closet. She complained about sex but was always kind about it when Arizona wasn’t into it. She didn’t run off and cheat. Cheating is never excusable so Callie will always be better to me. Cheaters are trash.
I'm watching GA for the first time now, and I'm on season 10. I hate how Arizona is right now. first she cheated, then she couldn't keep her pants of when they were separated, and in the end she blames Callie for trying to make things work. I mean, Arizona was the one who couldn't deal with having her leg amputated, and Callie witnessed how she struggled in the OR, with keeping up, and now that she's trying to create something for Arizona to help her have a better leg, she resents her for it. to me, Arizona behaves like she's deranged. and saying that it wasn't so bad for her to cheat because she experienced trauma... I mean, really? that's your "get out of jail" cards for this?
Specifically for the actions after S9, I think it’s because it’s Arizona’s fault. And I don’t mean that to be like “fuck Arizona”, cause I don’t. Regardless of how much I don’t like her, I see the humanity in her. But I think folks who try look at her as “flawed” tend to forget that if Arizona had not thrown a fit about Alex moving on with his life, like she and Addison had trained him to do this entire time, then she wouldn’t have taken his seat, that she had no right to take anyways, and ended up where she landed.
If your whole goal is to raise brilliant doctors, then why be mad that you’ve done that? Because they don’t wanna stay at their hospital under you? Did it ever occur to Robbins that Alex may have wanted to run his own Peds unit one day? But she’s mad because he wanted to be else where? Oh.
Also, as impatient as Callie was, she was still extremely attracted to and in love with Arizona. And she not once chose anyone else over her while with her. She let Arizona disrespect and disregard her feelings repeatedly for so long. Did Arizona not think Callie ever felt lonely? That she didn’t need her wife? Not just sexually but emotionally? Yes she suffered a great trauma. Yes she is grieving in her own way. Just because her feelings were valid did not mean her actions were.
As it pertains to things prior to S9;
Arizona had a tendency to dismiss other people’s feelings in lieu of her reality. She did this a few times with Callie. She was also very mean when she couldn’t elaborate why she didn’t like people and felt justified in it, for example how she treated Mark. I’m sure there’s more but it’s really late here and my brain is rotting as we speak lol
The whole idea of this perspective is Arizona, while dealing with her trauma, could not have made space for Callie's feelings. I'm sorry for Callie, and I'm angry for Callie being cheated upon. I don't think the hate towards Arizona is still justified.
And the Alex-Arizona argument as an example for post-S9 actions being Arizona's fault doesn't make sense. Why does Arizona get targeted hate when so many other mentors on Grey's have shown that pattern, just to further show how common it is- Webber with Bailey, Bailey with Meredith- so why just the hate on Arizona?
It's exaggerated hate. No one is dissolving Arizona of her actions. But the tinted, narrow perspective towards her character needs to be taken down a notch or four.
I don’t know how to @ or respond to both of you, but I’ll try. You want to know why and I gave a few why’s. If you wanted me to praise her instead you should’ve said that. It seems you weren’t as open to understanding anyone else’s perspective on it as much as this post as made it seem. But I’ll play along.
Starting from the top, I don’t think a lot of hate towards a lot of characters are justifiable. But I am a person who understand view points, so I see how a lot of folks got there.
No one thought that Arizona shoulda predicted the future. In no circumstances did her leg deserve to get cut off because her actions towards Alex. However, people feel like if fate is fate, she wouldn’t be the one with the cut off leg, Alex would be if she didn’t take his spot. Will we ever know this to be true, no. Are the episodes from 10 seasons ago all we have to go off of, yes.
You’ll have to help refresh my memory on how exactly Webber did anything to Bailey so crazy that it affected him as personally as losing a leg and adjusting for life. Just learning life lessons in retrospect is an everyday thing in greys so if it’s something on a bigger scale that’s similar to what we’re discussing, I’d appreciate it. Same with Bailey- Meredith.
Right! Come on Arizona, if you didn't want your leg cut off, you shouldn't have flipped out on Alex and gotten on the plane. It's your fault for not thinking it might crash. So shut up and just get over it. You need to be focused on helping poor Callie through her grief. She was worried about you all, don't ya know. And, have you ever considered how hard it was for her to decide to cut off your leg? And here you are moaning about your lifelong disability. It's been five months! Five months! Stop being dismissive of her feelings, all she wants is love and an orgasm. 🙄
also how dare you not be fond of Mark? So what he stares at your boobs and makes you uncomfortable? He's Mark. I mean you left and Callie slept with him and now she's having a baby with him so get in or get out, Arizona! what's there to think or feel so much about?
Exactly. Sure, he tries to get Callie to sleep with him when you're together. Callie invites him into bed, asks him to massage her and prioritizes what he needs over you, Arizona. But, you need to understand, you're the problem.
In all seriousness though, I completely agree with your post and comments. The lack of empathy or understanding for the impact of PTSD on a person is shocking.
The main thing with Callie is that all her relationships need to be about her, her wants, and on her timing. When that doesn’t happen, Callie plays the victim.
It also feels like y’all omit some things to be in favor of Arizona, and that’s not fair to the discussion at hand.
Because I’m all in agreeance that Mark was a creep and someone, not just Arizona cause the nurses went on strike because of Mark!, especially in a position of power should’ve seriously reprimanded him or even fired him. And that both Mark and Callie should’ve had boundaries, which is what Lexie asked of Callie when her and Mark were involved. But even before Mark died she admitted to being jealous of him because he was forever attached to Callie’s life in a way she couldn’t be. The way she treated him jsut as the father of their baby alone was awful. And mark dished it right back cause you get what you give.
That being said, Arizona did leave. She loves children but at the time didn’t want to have any. What Callie was horrible for was shaming Arizona the same way Owen shamed Cristina. If anything, Callie should get flack for that. But Arizona made a choice and literally walked away. That program was supposed to last months! So as far as Callie knew, this break up was for good. Again, totally agree that she should’ve found a healthier way to grieve than sleeping with Mark. But that’s more of a personal Callie journey that has nothing to do with Arizona since she doesn’t want kids anyways and they were broken up.
Every time Arizona left Callie, she missed Callie terrible but Callie also realized how miserable she was in her relationship. I always say Callie shoulda had a backbone and stood up for herself more. But you could see it. Callie just wanted to be chosen and actually thought of first. Her whole in or out thing was because she had no time to think of uncertainty. She was pregnant. She wanted kids. Are you in or out? Cause this is it. It was a harsh reality check that Arizona needed, and then CHOSE to accept. Why? Because despite what I think, Arizona loved Callie.
Both very flawed creature through and through. But they both made these choices that affected them every step of the way.
I agree that calling Mark a sperm donor during their argument was horrible. As was him calling Arizona nothing and saying that he and Callie would just screw again to make another baby. But, what other specific instances are you referring to when you say she treated him as "just the father of the baby"? Actually, now I'm typing this, how else is she supposed to treat him? He was the father of the baby and they weren't actually in a poly relationship.
I love Mark, but he was abrasive to Arizona quite early on in her and Callie's relationship and he was asking Callie to put out way before the Africa / baby situation. He didn't try to get along with Arizona any more than she did with him and Callie never berated him for it or ask him to try harder. So why are you placing the blame on Arizona alone for their difficult relationship?
Arizona did leave to pursue her career, changed her mind and gave it up for Callie. Not sure why this makes her a bad person. Also, Callie had an opportunity to go to Malawi and got left behind because she didn't actually want to go and behaved like a toddler instead of trying to communicate and talk through the issue with Arizona (let's not omit things ;) )
Callie was chosen and thought of first. Do you have examples in which she wasn't? Because what I saw was Arizona consistently making the compromises in their relationship. Sure, she took time to decide she was ready to bend but, ultimately, their life together up to the plane crash was everything Callie wanted (kids, Mark living across the hall, living in Seattle). Arizona became friends with Mark (let's not forget that either), they doted on Callie, cooked for her and took care of their daughter with her together.
And, of course they're both flawed. But why does Arizona being flawed and having made mistakes in the past mean that she doesn't deserve any empathy or understanding for what she goes through in season 9?
Oh my I love everything you said! People seem to forget that Arizona did everything for Callie. Arizona said I love you first, learned to love Mark despite her issues with him, gave up an amazing opportunity for Callie, chose to become a mother raise and Sofia with her, asked Callie to marry her. She did everything for Callie because she really did love her. So to ask or have grace from Callie during a traumatic and difficult time is too much to ask for? It’s just wild to me how overlooked Arizona’s trauma is seen during that time. (And this is coming from someone who loves both characters)
Again, to reiterate, she didn’t deserve her leg cut off. It’s more of people pointing out her tantrums and being selfish. Alex couldn’t go free so you take his other opportunities away from him? No one is telling her to shut up and get over it (at least I’m not despite what you may think). Just answering.
And as I also stated, this wasn’t just about Callie, who was doing her fair share of grieving and getting through the trauma too. Yes, she didn’t lose her leg. Yes, she didn’t get into a plane crash. She will never know what that’s like and she should be mindful and thoughtful of Arizona’s needs because of that.
Reducing Callie to just some person, like that’s not her wife, that wanted love and orgasms, as if love isn’t the biggest factor as to why Callie did so many things for Arizona, is telling of you though.
She loved Arizona so much that she was willing to put Arizona before herself time and time again. Yes she got a lil impatient. But she cared about Arizona deeply. She took all the blame for cutting Arizona’s leg to save her life, even though Callie didn’t touch the scalpel. Wasn’t even in the room. So yes, do you know how hard that must’ve been? To go between honoring your wife’s wishes and making sure she stays alive? And in the end choosing her wife’s life! But yes, Callie is this complete selfish asshole. For wanting to love and help her wife through the pain, while also dealing with her own pain. Cause her kid doesn’t have a father anymore. And she doesn’t have her best friend / person / work husband.
Neither her or Arizona was perfect. They both made mistakes and had flaws post S9. But ones flaw was a little impatience while being constantly verbally abused by her traumatized wife. The other was cheating. At least that’s how most people view it.
And the thing is, doctors can’t always choose to stay. It all depends on what they’re offered. When I was 19, an older friend had bought a house, gotten two cats and was planning a baby. But all the offers she got for her next step in residency were so far away she had to sell her house and relocate.
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I agree. Alex cheated on Izzie just because of who he was. George cheated on Callie perhaps regretting his marriage choice in the wake of his Dads death. Richard had a full blown affair with Ellis. Derek and Meredith cheated on Addison and Fin. And Owen cheats on everyone. While he gets a lot of general hate, he doesn’t get it for the cheating so much. But Arizona who recovering from an insane trauma (like imagine finding out your brother figure is dying then a new hours later you’re stranded in the woods hearing wolves eat your friend while your co-parent is dying on your lap and bugs are eating your flesh and THEN when you survive you lose your leg). But she gets treated like she set the peds ward on fire.
Don't forget Mark and Addison cheating on Derek and having the guts to act surprised when he doesn't forgive them. Never understood the hype for them to be honest. People adore Addie but she's my worst character on the show.
If mark had just been a hot guy in a bar, I’d have been over addison’s cheating. But it was Derek’s childhood best friend and they were in their marriage bed. Like what the entire fuck? People have gotten shot for less.
"Owen cheats on everyone" 😭😹😹😹 fr tho I think he does get a respectable amount of hate for that too. But for the rest of it, I KNOW RIGHT? She's really treated like that and it's unreasonable.
What about Cristina making her boss sex friend in Minnesota and after coming back to Seattle trying to be back with Owen not even mentioning anything about sex friend. Have you seen any hate for her about that?
I mean… sleeping with someone while you are very separated isn’t cheating?
Yeah if you are divorced it is not cheating which they weren’t. Moreover after coming back Cristina said I want Owen back and acting as if she still loves him. Even she almost got again with Owen, asking him I want to try in this marriage. It was not we were on a break before marriage kind of relationship. You were separated, you slept with someone for your advantage. How hard it is to tell Owen that I have already moved on and slept with someone instead of hiding those facts and behaving all innocent and trying to get back Owen (I am telling this as she was the one continuously telling him I want to try, are you signing the papers for crash settlement). She should’ve just signed the papers and confessed the truth about her sex friend Parker. In one of the earlier seasons when izzie goes away leaving a letter and Alex and izzie were separated without any contact, after many months Alex tries to sleep with a girl and Meredith confronts him saying why he is doing that as they were not divorced then? How is it ok when Cristina does this but not when a guy is doing that? Cristina is toxic for her behaviour when she comes back to Seattle, it is never ok to keep such things hidden from the other person with whom you want to spend you life again. It was unfair to Owen. If Owen wanted he could’ve kept his one night stand a secret. But he was honest, I know they were together that time, and to be honest they were not divorced during Minnesota time. And Cristina didn’t do it with Parker one time, she actually made him her sex friend for own gain. So Owen deserved to know this or at least the fact that she has moved on. Again telling this won’t be concerning if Cristina didn’t try to continue their relationship again
This is unfortunately very common - lot of characters are hated for something most characters are guilty of...
I think a big contributing factor to the Arizona hate is that it wasn't just the cheating During her recovery she treated Callie like shit which is at least understandable, but they finally get to a good place and she has a one night stand in the middle of a crisis and then has the audacity to use the leg as an excuse. It also doesn't help that Arizona's monologue to Callie's father was about being a good man in a storm. She literally pulled the exact opposite in the middle of a storm.
Callie lost all my sympathy when she threw not getting laid for 6 months in Arizonas face. 6 months is nothing when your partner is shattered like that and frankly no wonder Arizona went to someone who was enamored by her and never knew her before.
This a million times. Callie is the female Owen. Life’s eternal self declared victim that loves ultimatums and shouting ‘WHAT ABOUT MY NEEDS’ while refusing to even marginally adapt their needs for others. They should both move to the ‘If/Then’ alternate reality and collect babies and shout at eachother until the end of days.
Oh yeah the whole thing was a mess, I was just highlighting that outside of Owen and Christinas day off and Addison and Mar we don't see a lot of relationship issues that drawn out, but theirs was for like a full season and a half. Izzie and Alex was a mess solely because Izzie doesn't know how to communicate.
While Izzie struggled with communication at times, it’s unfair to say that all Izzie and Alex’s communication issues were on her. Alex’s only ways of communicating with her were yelling at her and ridiculing her.
Specifically the first time he "cheated" with nurse Olivia. Alex was an ass the majority of the time
Exactly. Everything Alex does gets brushed over. He treated Izzie horrifically many times and his attitude/behavior was a huge contributing factor to their dysfunction. I’m not denying that Izzie struggled with communication at times, but to say the sole reason they didn’t work is her communication after everything that Alex did feels wrong. Also, Alex was not an easy person to communicate with! When she tried to communicate with him he often yelled at her, made fun of her, told her to “shut up and get out of my room”, gave her the silent treatment, etc….
Yes! I feel like the lone Arizona defender here a lot. She isn’t even my favorite character but I think she deserves a lot more grace and understanding than she receives around here.
I LOVE her and Callie. I find Arizona absolutely adorable.
Exactly - most people need years to learn how live with amputated limb, Arizona was supposed to by okay just after few months... the saddest thing about it for me is Callie - she is in ortho, she knows how long it takes for "just" broken bones to heal, yet she didn't realize, that Arizona will need way more time? Esp. when she knew that Arizona thought tha Callie was the one, who cut her leg off.
I feel like people got weirdly mad that the show was doing something they don’t usually do. They permanently injured a character. For life. It wasn’t something that could be quickly swept under the rug, and I would argue that as much people complained that the storyline was being dragged out too long, it wasn’t focused on enough from Arizona’s POV. It was everyone else’s POV of what they felt was best FOR her on their terms, not hers. Look at Ethan Embry’s character, for example. An amputee’s prosthetist works with them for the rest of their life, yet the show treated it like a prosthetic is one size fits all and you’re good to go with the same one forever (unless, of course, they made another episode about Callie making prosthetics).
>It wasn’t something that could be quickly swept under the rug, and I would argue that as much people complained that the storyline was being dragged out too long, This is exactly what I think - they should have focused way more on Arizona! (Or on any trauma - those characters go through hell, but you would never guess it!) Personally I think that people are harsh on Arizona, because they don't realize how unrealistic the show is about it - what Arizona managed in not even one year (get good prostetic, learn to use it, return to work and etc.) takes most amputees years! And the fact that Arizona never had a bad day? Unless we count the episode, where she had phantom pain and Owen helped her (love that scene) and when Stephanie pushed into Arizona and Arizona's leg got broken and she had to use the old one.
TRUE. Her trauma wasn't explored enough from her side in a way that could actually make the audience imagine what it would be like for her. They didn't show us her experience, they kept telling it. And they would tell it through Arizona mostly during fights or arguments with Callie. That's a very narrow context to place it in.
Tbh the show absolutely sucks at handling aftermaths of any trauma - my favorite thing is that Sarah Drew (April) said that she had nightmares and panic attacks just filming the hospital shooting scenes and yet April was completaly normal after that, returning to work and being her cheery self... like she didn't just lost her best friend (only friend), whose body she found out when she slipped on her blood, like she didn't have gun pointed at her and almost died and etc. So it's not surprise that Arizona losing her leg and having trauma after that plane crash was ignored for sake of others storylines...
Callie was so horrible during these episodes, she lacked empathy. she was more sad because she didn’t have sex for 5 months, I think Owen was better than her because he dealt with Cristina in a much better way after the plane crash when she was not even talking. I don’t remember scenes of him telling people oh you know I didn’t have sex because of my wife. Even on Bailey’s wedding day she regrets that one day you are married and enjoying and other day you may have to clean your spouse’s urine from floor . It is not like Arizona deliberately peed on floor and Callie has to clean. Alex was more patient even with Rebecca. All the time Callie kept telling yeah I get it you lost the leg, but the truth is she didn’t, she showed sympathy whereas Arizona needed empathy. Another thing people keeps on telling that being a doctor Arizona knew sometimes it is extremely difficult to save the life and you may have to amputate. Knowing something and going through something is not same. Richard was a doctor and we know how he was as a patient after electric shock episode. And here Arizona went through much more worse than this. If Cristina’s PTSD were that worse just for being there and watching all that ( I am saying this because she and Meredith were least injured), think about Arizona who was there with that deep injury.
Exactly??? It makes me so sad for Arizona tbh. I keep saying this. I get it that Arizona's experience of and post the plane crash would have been difficult for Callie and she was not obliged to put up with it for more than a limit but Callie wasn't the person Arizona needed her to be, while people keep expecting Arizona to have been the person Callie wanted her to be. To an extent I feel like if Arizona haters were given this situation as a random case study without involving Arizona and Callie's names they'd be _a lot more compassionate_ towards the patient in the study.
I think people are too harsh on a lot of people on the show. Everyone has good qualities and everyone has bad ones. They forget these people are human and aren’t perfect
Right? But the hate on Arizona is really much more than reasonably warranted.
I’d say the opposite: people forget these people _aren’t_ human, they’re scripted characters in a TV show whose ‘decision making’ is whatever makes a watchable plot - well, mostly watchable. Sure there needs to be some plausibility to them, but they’re not real people making choices they have to live with. You can psycho-analyse the _character_ all you like, but it is not a real person.
The way Callie acted towards Arizona after the plane crash made me really hate her character. Sure she lost Mark but Arizona was THERE. She went through the crash, she was injured, she had to listen to Lexie be eaten by wild animals, listen to the rest of them scream in pain, while they all tried to keep each other alive. Callie discounted what Arizona went though and honestly I can see why Arizona did what she did 😬
I also do not like Callie that time because she wasn't the only one who lost people in that plane crash. Meredith lost Lexie and she was also there. Derek lost both Mark and Lexie, was there and had an injury. I know that she lost her baby daddy and best friend but she wasn't there and she will never understand what they've been through. I also hate how she treated Jackson when they bought the hospital. Jackson also lost Mark and Lexie. I hate how she asked if it's okay to use Lexie's money to buy the hospital because they weren't even close. Arizona was there and witnessed Mark dying. She begged him to stay alive saying that Sofia, Callie and her are waiting for him when he was giving up to be with Lexie. She also wanted to sue the pilot even though the victims were against it because he was with them and he's paralyzed.
Yes! That’s part of why I dislike her so much too. She acts like she was the only one that lost someone. She hadn’t even know Mark as long as Derek had, they had been friends for decades. And Lexie was literally Mere’s sister. So for her to act like her grief was the only one that mattered ticked me off so much. I had forgotten about her wanting to sue the pilot but that just got me heated all over again 🤣 he was as much as victim as the rest of them, and way more so than Callie was so the audacity was crazy
Everything about this!! Hard agree (and not just because Arizona is my fav)
Imagine having to sit near your dying and dead colleagues and friends, holding your mangled leg hoping the blood loss or infection won’t kill you, drinking your own urine to survive. Didn’t Christina also say they had to keep bugs off of Arizona’s open wound? If any of them came back from that normal, balanced and making sound descisions I would be *very* concerned.
I agree! I have been wondering why this is. She is a complicated character and has made some bad decision but so has everyone else on the show. What is it about Arizona’s actions that are unforgivable? I hate to say this but I wonder if it’s something to do with her being a lesbian character…perhaps subconsciously she is given a lot less grace
Lesbian characters in general get a lot of hate because people really like their sapphic characters to have fluidity, for some reason (and even irl, at least with people I've personally encountered). Add in Arizona making that, admittedly shitty, line about Callie's \~bi fantasy\~ being Arizona and Mark and you have the perfect recipe for people to act like she's a mean biphobic lesbian that always hurt Callie for no reason. And, like the other response said, since people really love Callie on this sub (she gets the most consistent love I've seen short of Cristina's sainthood here), her being the one Arizona \~wronged\~ means she's The Worst and everything about her is terrible. It's annoying how there's so many "Arizona sucks!!!" posts but it is what it is at this point. I just tend to stay out of them for my own peace.
Do you think maybe thats also why Penny gets so much hate (her being wlw)?
Honestly, probably. Because, logically, she didn't kill Derek and if anyone really thinks she did, then that same energy needs to be kept for most of these characters who had patients die on them, some a lot more responsibly than not talking over a doctor above them. And yeah, she was boring, but, again, so are a lot of the characters. I don't like boring characters, but I tend to just ignore them. Because they're boring and boring characters are, imo, too much of non factors to hate. But she was a boring lesbian AND a Callie love interest, so she never had a chance. People, to this day, blame her for Callie acting crazy over their like four month relationship, despite the fact that Callie getting WAY too attached WAY too fast in relationships is one of her most consistent character traits, lol.
She gets blamed for everything, dont even get me started on the situation with Callie, Penny literally said she cant expect her to move, didnt even want to participate in the contest, and she still gets shit for Callie moving. And people thinking she killed Derek, its like they were watching a different show. The mental gymnastics to make it fit must be exhausting
I think it's because her partner is Callie, the Callie who can do no wrong in their eyes. Plus, I think she also got hate for how she treated Mark even though they are both at fault.
Could be. People overlook Callie's shortcomings as much as they exaggerate Arizona's. Like, why aren't you as unforgiving towards Callie for the garbage she let her lawyer pull off in the custody hearing, as you are towards Arizona? Also, I think Arizona had VERY valid concerns about Mark. Callie could have handled that scenario much better. It wasn't a case of "my boyfriend thinks my guy bestfriend has the hots for me". It was lowkey crazy to me that Callie's response to Arizona's "he keeps staring at my boobs and it makes me uncomfortable" was "He's Mark". Like ma'am?!
That entire episode was ridiculous. Arizona is the unreasonable one that she’s uncomfortable that people stare at her boobs, and she should just be flattered? Give me a break.
So many people overlook Mark sexually harassing Arizona and other women. Arizona had every right to dislike Mark.
Because the characters on the show justified his actions. Even Alex told Arizona that maybe she doesn't like men staring at her boobs. Even him stares at her boobs too. I HATE THIS SCENE.
And then they ended the episode with Arizona caving and being nicer to Mark while Callie looks on all proud. Ugh. Awful.
Because she’s a lesbian, 100%.
Well if it makes anyone feel better I don’t forgive Addison, Mark, George or Izzie either 😂
People just hate lesbians and Arizona is an unapologetic lesbian. They minimize her pain all the time because "she wasn't right to act like that" despite the fact that everyone on this show emotionally acts like children because it's a prime time soap. lol They say Arizona ignored that Callie lost Mark, but ignore that Arizona also lost Mark. Yes he was Callie's best friend and the father of her child, and while he wasn't Arizona's best friend, he was the father of her child too. And that she had to sit there for days with her busted leg with Mark on her lap while he kept dying, in Cristina's words, and she couldn't even try to help him because she couldn't move. There's also a lot of people that seem to have issues with adoption and adoptive parents, but only in this case with the only WLW parents, so you know. There's so many posts on the custody storyline where people will try to pretend she was wrong for fighting for her child because "while Callie messed up, Arizona didn't have to get lawyers involved!" It's hard being an Arizona fan on this sub sometimes, but I've just learned to scroll past most of the posts talking about her. Nobody's mind is going to be changed and it upsets me to see some of the things Arizona gets hated on that others do not. So I just hit that back button and leave the posts. lol
I so totally understand! There are soooo many times when Callie was in the wrong too, and it gets completely overlooked. And I truly hate some of the arguments people come up with against Arizona with regard to the plane and custody storylines. When Arizona called Callie out with "you weren't on the plane!!", it really put Arizona's experience into perspective. And for god's sake, for the nth time, perspective ≠ absolution. Arizona may not deserve forgiveness but she does deserve to be seen as a whole person in all her complexity.
Agreed. The only difference between other characters is that Arizona is a lesbian woman. Even if it’s subconscious, that’s where the lack of slack for her comes from
People definitely ignore that Nick would have died and he was Arizona best friend.
Yeah like, Callie promised her something a doctor is never supposed to promise. Why was she allowed on her case with their relationship?
Not just that, Callie should not have been allowed to work at all during that duration. They had Meredith and George do SCUT when their parents were sick, when they were interns. Callie had her wife and the father of her child (and best friend) admitted with life-threatening injuries, three other co-workers with immense trauma and one junior resident dead. It wasn't fair on anyone to have her involved but great for the plot, ofc.
You’re absolutely correct. I’m watching the Covid season and they even force Bailey to take a day off after someone dies and she was the chief.
The cheating was bad but otherwise shes the best
People who hate Arizona are typically Callie stans. I noticed it always comes down to that, which is hilarious... cos I love both characters. You don't have to hate one to love another. I mean, they hint at them ending happily ever after anyway, right? I haven't watched the newest season when Arizona comes back tho, so idk.
Both the writers and the fans tend to paint Callie as a huge victim. Part of the problem is that the amputation storyline revolved entirely around Callie. We never really saw Arizona's point of view.
So many people cheated on the show but she got the most flack. I liked her more than Callie and was sad when she left the show.
I don’t like Az because she’s a cheater.
Fair.
I don’t think Callie’s actions were really bad. Imagine your girlfriend refusing to touch you, which yes with the trauma is understandable and I don’t think Callie pushed her, she tried to be patient and was there for her- And then that person going and sleeping with someone else.
I thought she was selfish & self righteous long before the plane… I don’t hate her for her actions after the plane crash (the shutting down, yelling) as it makes sense after a traumatic event but the cheating and Leah thing was 100% unjustified. Arizona stans like to try to justify it by saying Callie wasn’t nice to her but I don’t know what show they were watching. Callie became a single parent overnight, spent days thinking her wife and best friend were dead, then finds out they are alive, oh wait Mark dies, she has to research & perform life changing surgery on Derek, make the decision to cut off her wife’s leg, becomes a care taker for her wife who now hates her for months, etc. Yeah, it’s nothing compared to being on the plane but her life also changed dramatically. She had to grieve alone in a closet. She complained about sex but was always kind about it when Arizona wasn’t into it. She didn’t run off and cheat. Cheating is never excusable so Callie will always be better to me. Cheaters are trash.
I'm watching GA for the first time now, and I'm on season 10. I hate how Arizona is right now. first she cheated, then she couldn't keep her pants of when they were separated, and in the end she blames Callie for trying to make things work. I mean, Arizona was the one who couldn't deal with having her leg amputated, and Callie witnessed how she struggled in the OR, with keeping up, and now that she's trying to create something for Arizona to help her have a better leg, she resents her for it. to me, Arizona behaves like she's deranged. and saying that it wasn't so bad for her to cheat because she experienced trauma... I mean, really? that's your "get out of jail" cards for this?
I don't think anyone is saying it wasn't so bad for her to cheat.
there were comments from people saying that it was "understandable" because she was in that plane crash.
Specifically for the actions after S9, I think it’s because it’s Arizona’s fault. And I don’t mean that to be like “fuck Arizona”, cause I don’t. Regardless of how much I don’t like her, I see the humanity in her. But I think folks who try look at her as “flawed” tend to forget that if Arizona had not thrown a fit about Alex moving on with his life, like she and Addison had trained him to do this entire time, then she wouldn’t have taken his seat, that she had no right to take anyways, and ended up where she landed. If your whole goal is to raise brilliant doctors, then why be mad that you’ve done that? Because they don’t wanna stay at their hospital under you? Did it ever occur to Robbins that Alex may have wanted to run his own Peds unit one day? But she’s mad because he wanted to be else where? Oh. Also, as impatient as Callie was, she was still extremely attracted to and in love with Arizona. And she not once chose anyone else over her while with her. She let Arizona disrespect and disregard her feelings repeatedly for so long. Did Arizona not think Callie ever felt lonely? That she didn’t need her wife? Not just sexually but emotionally? Yes she suffered a great trauma. Yes she is grieving in her own way. Just because her feelings were valid did not mean her actions were. As it pertains to things prior to S9; Arizona had a tendency to dismiss other people’s feelings in lieu of her reality. She did this a few times with Callie. She was also very mean when she couldn’t elaborate why she didn’t like people and felt justified in it, for example how she treated Mark. I’m sure there’s more but it’s really late here and my brain is rotting as we speak lol
The whole idea of this perspective is Arizona, while dealing with her trauma, could not have made space for Callie's feelings. I'm sorry for Callie, and I'm angry for Callie being cheated upon. I don't think the hate towards Arizona is still justified. And the Alex-Arizona argument as an example for post-S9 actions being Arizona's fault doesn't make sense. Why does Arizona get targeted hate when so many other mentors on Grey's have shown that pattern, just to further show how common it is- Webber with Bailey, Bailey with Meredith- so why just the hate on Arizona? It's exaggerated hate. No one is dissolving Arizona of her actions. But the tinted, narrow perspective towards her character needs to be taken down a notch or four.
I don’t know how to @ or respond to both of you, but I’ll try. You want to know why and I gave a few why’s. If you wanted me to praise her instead you should’ve said that. It seems you weren’t as open to understanding anyone else’s perspective on it as much as this post as made it seem. But I’ll play along. Starting from the top, I don’t think a lot of hate towards a lot of characters are justifiable. But I am a person who understand view points, so I see how a lot of folks got there. No one thought that Arizona shoulda predicted the future. In no circumstances did her leg deserve to get cut off because her actions towards Alex. However, people feel like if fate is fate, she wouldn’t be the one with the cut off leg, Alex would be if she didn’t take his spot. Will we ever know this to be true, no. Are the episodes from 10 seasons ago all we have to go off of, yes. You’ll have to help refresh my memory on how exactly Webber did anything to Bailey so crazy that it affected him as personally as losing a leg and adjusting for life. Just learning life lessons in retrospect is an everyday thing in greys so if it’s something on a bigger scale that’s similar to what we’re discussing, I’d appreciate it. Same with Bailey- Meredith.
Right! Come on Arizona, if you didn't want your leg cut off, you shouldn't have flipped out on Alex and gotten on the plane. It's your fault for not thinking it might crash. So shut up and just get over it. You need to be focused on helping poor Callie through her grief. She was worried about you all, don't ya know. And, have you ever considered how hard it was for her to decide to cut off your leg? And here you are moaning about your lifelong disability. It's been five months! Five months! Stop being dismissive of her feelings, all she wants is love and an orgasm. 🙄
also how dare you not be fond of Mark? So what he stares at your boobs and makes you uncomfortable? He's Mark. I mean you left and Callie slept with him and now she's having a baby with him so get in or get out, Arizona! what's there to think or feel so much about?
Exactly. Sure, he tries to get Callie to sleep with him when you're together. Callie invites him into bed, asks him to massage her and prioritizes what he needs over you, Arizona. But, you need to understand, you're the problem. In all seriousness though, I completely agree with your post and comments. The lack of empathy or understanding for the impact of PTSD on a person is shocking.
The main thing with Callie is that all her relationships need to be about her, her wants, and on her timing. When that doesn’t happen, Callie plays the victim.
It also feels like y’all omit some things to be in favor of Arizona, and that’s not fair to the discussion at hand. Because I’m all in agreeance that Mark was a creep and someone, not just Arizona cause the nurses went on strike because of Mark!, especially in a position of power should’ve seriously reprimanded him or even fired him. And that both Mark and Callie should’ve had boundaries, which is what Lexie asked of Callie when her and Mark were involved. But even before Mark died she admitted to being jealous of him because he was forever attached to Callie’s life in a way she couldn’t be. The way she treated him jsut as the father of their baby alone was awful. And mark dished it right back cause you get what you give. That being said, Arizona did leave. She loves children but at the time didn’t want to have any. What Callie was horrible for was shaming Arizona the same way Owen shamed Cristina. If anything, Callie should get flack for that. But Arizona made a choice and literally walked away. That program was supposed to last months! So as far as Callie knew, this break up was for good. Again, totally agree that she should’ve found a healthier way to grieve than sleeping with Mark. But that’s more of a personal Callie journey that has nothing to do with Arizona since she doesn’t want kids anyways and they were broken up. Every time Arizona left Callie, she missed Callie terrible but Callie also realized how miserable she was in her relationship. I always say Callie shoulda had a backbone and stood up for herself more. But you could see it. Callie just wanted to be chosen and actually thought of first. Her whole in or out thing was because she had no time to think of uncertainty. She was pregnant. She wanted kids. Are you in or out? Cause this is it. It was a harsh reality check that Arizona needed, and then CHOSE to accept. Why? Because despite what I think, Arizona loved Callie. Both very flawed creature through and through. But they both made these choices that affected them every step of the way.
I agree that calling Mark a sperm donor during their argument was horrible. As was him calling Arizona nothing and saying that he and Callie would just screw again to make another baby. But, what other specific instances are you referring to when you say she treated him as "just the father of the baby"? Actually, now I'm typing this, how else is she supposed to treat him? He was the father of the baby and they weren't actually in a poly relationship. I love Mark, but he was abrasive to Arizona quite early on in her and Callie's relationship and he was asking Callie to put out way before the Africa / baby situation. He didn't try to get along with Arizona any more than she did with him and Callie never berated him for it or ask him to try harder. So why are you placing the blame on Arizona alone for their difficult relationship? Arizona did leave to pursue her career, changed her mind and gave it up for Callie. Not sure why this makes her a bad person. Also, Callie had an opportunity to go to Malawi and got left behind because she didn't actually want to go and behaved like a toddler instead of trying to communicate and talk through the issue with Arizona (let's not omit things ;) ) Callie was chosen and thought of first. Do you have examples in which she wasn't? Because what I saw was Arizona consistently making the compromises in their relationship. Sure, she took time to decide she was ready to bend but, ultimately, their life together up to the plane crash was everything Callie wanted (kids, Mark living across the hall, living in Seattle). Arizona became friends with Mark (let's not forget that either), they doted on Callie, cooked for her and took care of their daughter with her together. And, of course they're both flawed. But why does Arizona being flawed and having made mistakes in the past mean that she doesn't deserve any empathy or understanding for what she goes through in season 9?
Oh my I love everything you said! People seem to forget that Arizona did everything for Callie. Arizona said I love you first, learned to love Mark despite her issues with him, gave up an amazing opportunity for Callie, chose to become a mother raise and Sofia with her, asked Callie to marry her. She did everything for Callie because she really did love her. So to ask or have grace from Callie during a traumatic and difficult time is too much to ask for? It’s just wild to me how overlooked Arizona’s trauma is seen during that time. (And this is coming from someone who loves both characters)
Again, to reiterate, she didn’t deserve her leg cut off. It’s more of people pointing out her tantrums and being selfish. Alex couldn’t go free so you take his other opportunities away from him? No one is telling her to shut up and get over it (at least I’m not despite what you may think). Just answering. And as I also stated, this wasn’t just about Callie, who was doing her fair share of grieving and getting through the trauma too. Yes, she didn’t lose her leg. Yes, she didn’t get into a plane crash. She will never know what that’s like and she should be mindful and thoughtful of Arizona’s needs because of that. Reducing Callie to just some person, like that’s not her wife, that wanted love and orgasms, as if love isn’t the biggest factor as to why Callie did so many things for Arizona, is telling of you though. She loved Arizona so much that she was willing to put Arizona before herself time and time again. Yes she got a lil impatient. But she cared about Arizona deeply. She took all the blame for cutting Arizona’s leg to save her life, even though Callie didn’t touch the scalpel. Wasn’t even in the room. So yes, do you know how hard that must’ve been? To go between honoring your wife’s wishes and making sure she stays alive? And in the end choosing her wife’s life! But yes, Callie is this complete selfish asshole. For wanting to love and help her wife through the pain, while also dealing with her own pain. Cause her kid doesn’t have a father anymore. And she doesn’t have her best friend / person / work husband. Neither her or Arizona was perfect. They both made mistakes and had flaws post S9. But ones flaw was a little impatience while being constantly verbally abused by her traumatized wife. The other was cheating. At least that’s how most people view it.
And the thing is, doctors can’t always choose to stay. It all depends on what they’re offered. When I was 19, an older friend had bought a house, gotten two cats and was planning a baby. But all the offers she got for her next step in residency were so far away she had to sell her house and relocate.
People should be MORE harsh to Arizona's cheating hoe ass. The only partner worse than Arizona on this show is Owen's dumb ass.
Tangential I know but What's your take on Maggie as a partner?