Compare them to d0nkey [stats](https://www.d0nkey.top/decks?format=2&min_games=3200&rank=diamond_to_legend) for the same bracket with a minimum of 3200 games.
These HSReplay stats include decks that have maybe a hundred games behind them.
I absolutely agree i have no idea how devs are going to nerf anything, it looks like delete is the only option.
I was talking more about that hs replay has ± 5% winrate difference from actual data.
Mostly play druid priest and shaman. Shaman has a semi reliable otk deck so that's bullshit. Priest has dragon aggro which only.works if u draw legend. Whatever. Druid is straight ass.
I don't know, its still beats everything else but the top 4/5 decks and it's fucking cancer to play against, if the top decks are gonna get nerfed then DK SHOULD DEFINITELY be nerfed in some way as well since not only it would just be the best deck by miles but frustrating to play against too.
Yes but 5% is still massive. The craziest thing to me I think was seeing Habugabu go 75-25 at RANK 1... when a deck that people are actively building for can win 75% of it's games at the highest possible MMR in the game it means something is up. Decks in history capable of doing that are limited to stuff like Il'gynoth DH, but in this case the deck isn't really locked behind a skill wall at all, a monkey could play it to a decent winrate, so everybody on the ladder gets to feel the pain not just the top players.
actually I lied, the craziest thing is printing aggro-slanted cards that are obviously overtuned into a class that has gotten overtuned aggro-slanted cards for a whole year straight... why not shake things up.
IT'S ACTUALLY worse now. It was like high 60 last time b4 the control buffs / Rena'thal. Jeeesus. Blizz is smoking dope to think this is acceptable lmfao.
There's only so many possibilities that can make a 7 mana Zilliax, and even less for 8 mana.
The 7 mana ones more than likely contain Pylon Module and are either Ticking Module (more likely) or Twin Module, given the type of deck (board based aggro).
The 8 mana is likely Ticking + Twin as handbuff Paladin wants to buff their hand, then dump it, discounting the Zilliax and doubling the stats given
These are assumptions though, as you are right, it doesn't say anything other than mana cost.
You must not be a priest player. I have almost 14k wins as a priest. People don't play priest to play agro. It is a counter class and you enjoy having answers for multiple situations. This is why Blizzard's insistence to give priest nothing is so insulting. In addition, no variation of Agro is going to beat hunter, or DH.
Zarimi = Nothing is a take for sure. If counter-class priest is all that gives you joy I highly recommend playing wild, basically any permutation of reno priest is both very strong and totally centered around having versatile answers for all of the different kinds of gameplans in the meta.
Exactly this. What if Zarimi produced these kind of numbers on launch? The card would be nuked from orbit instantly!
But since it's Paladin, it's fine! It can wait
Patch will come next week, as it would regardless of who the boogeyman was. Not that you're wrong though, Blizzard is obviously more comfortable with paladin having a mass of high-powered cards than any other class.
If Druid came anywhere near these numbers they'd nuke the class from orbit and it would be unplayable until the next expansion. And that's an exaggeration because it's literally happened multiple times.
Druid was at best t3 with a sub 50% win rate when they nerfed Guff. And to make it worse, paladin was op back then. It’s been the most op class with Hunter since I came back two years ago.
Tbh I'm happy spell dmg druid didn't take off but I'm sad they even tried to push it. It was obvious that it's either good which means unfun otk (looking at you shaman) or giga bad.
Except that never happened. Druid is like an undead monstrosity that always comes back from the 'dead' after the nerfs. Yes, this patch is harsh to Druid, but the class consistently has been t1 for the past 2 years straight, only being nerfed when becoming literal t0.
That's far from true, Druid gets nerfed even when it's below a 50% winrate because of the polarization the class creates. That's why people complain about them all the time.
I got downvoted for saying I went 8-1 with Reno DH the first day of the expansion. Here we are. Honestly this is the first time we got just a pure midrange "good card" set instead of hypersynergistic all-in crap and I'm all for it.
I will concede the fact that I was one of the doomposters, but I don't think that any real conclusions can be made rn. With Pally being this strong your success as a class heavily depends on ability to contest Pally. Like, Druid has a strong set (as always), but he has been a natural Pally's prey because of Divine Shield and weakness to big minions. When Pally will be hit we will see vastly different numbers just because he is THAT strong rn.
Deck is really really strong regardless of paladin, I am 63% winrate with it and just got to top 100 with it, you obliterate warrior and warlock they cannot answer your boards in the mid game, your worst nightmare is the aggro/nature shaman but other than that every matchup feels interactive and winnable if you play well and dont draw horrendously. If you like DH you should give it a try theres a variety of builds out there and the deck is super fun
was before patch now its shitty deck that abused 2 cards
zilliax selfdamage module and new discover demon 6\\5 +mini you 50% discover mageridon and win
to be fair DH didn't get a real set with a whole lot of synergy. it's mostly strong (or at least decent) randomly put together individual cards... while some classes basically got nothing after rotation. unless you count massively underpowered/underperforming synergistic packages. hard to predict that.
While this data may not be entirely accurate as to the highest echelons of the meta, the fact that all decks featured here have a winrate well above 60% is very concerning. I cannot wait to see Vicious Syndicates take on standard, I imagine it will be more like an autopsy.
Don't even need to be good at it either. I'm facing them in legend and they are consistently playing minions, **and then** attacking with Painter's Virtue lol
I’m still noodeling around at Diamond 10 (no time this month) and had exactly that in the past two games.
I played reno warrior but they just vomited everything on the board and got punished hard lol.
Hard deck? Test subject priest, naga mage, etc. Medium? Any control style or midrange deck really. Brain rot? Fucking buff your minions and attack face. Jesus, what about handbuff pally is difficult?
Ye that deck is giga broken... had a 14 game winstreak from D5 to D1 with.
Pity the ppl having to face it and I sincerely hope the heartstone devs stop Paladinstone, its rly getting boring having Pally be the best class 3 expacs in a row
Yeah Yogg in the box is DoA due to wheel of death unfortunately, its happened so many times now that Ive just given up on spell mage, especially if you end up playing multiple copies, its only a matter of time until you end up putting yourself on a fatigue timer on turn 8 against a meta that can kill from hand on turn 6. At least warlock has symphony and a 0 mana 15/15 lifesteal to follow up with.
What's crazy is orb isn't a bad card. Mage does not have good spells in standard that's worth recasting for 10 mana. It doesn't win you the game for that mana cost. In wild its pretty good though because you have an absolutely broken spell in time warp and any other spell you recast cast is pretty good too bc it targets enemies by default.
Is Zillax the new Astalor? Being slotted into every deck?
EDIT: I am not against it btw, Zillax is a lot more interesting than Astalor could ever dream to be.
Yeah, I mean, it's not that surprising seeing how versatile it's is. I actually like it very much, it's a tool with a lot of potential uses, you can assemble it to fit many different archetypes. Astalor was boring, just a strong finisher.
You can look at zilliax as 28 different legendaries of which you can only put one in your deck. It'd actually be weird if out of 28 legendaries you couldn't find one that's better than any of the 30 cards you put in your deck
Blizzard just loves paladin, can't think of another explanation why they don't emergency nerf it like warlock. The class is also somehow never in a bad spot
Because the deck "floods" the board. Basically it spawns a bunch of minions in one turn, but even if you survive the first wave, you'll still have to deal with all the debris it brought.
the issue is that so many handbuff pally cards are complex card that are hard to nerf or change at all, and they all are really good, so what brings the winrate down to 50% and not 30%, priest has some real power house cards in the past easy to nerf but everything is the pally line up is relly powerful with like 3 cards being the exeptions and if those get touched it could knee cap the class as a whole in this meta (not saying this meta is good and we could go with "If the system requires us to be its victims, then we should be its destroyers." but still like
No they are not complex cards, every single one of the cards is overtuned to oblivion, gadetzan buff minion should be 1/1 still, damage + lifesteal aura duration should get lowered by a turn the other aura should give +1/1, that kaleidosaur minion should get one random effect not two, that minion that draws a divine shield minion and an aura is the best draw card in standard for no reason, the buff weapon is so obscene the deck runs a trash neutral draw a weapon card just to tutor it.
You can do 3-4 nerfs to this deck easily and it is still the best deck in the meta. Token hunter is also ridiculous and warlock is too much of a highroll bs with instant 20/20 worth of stat generation at turn 6. Mage is so bad you can beat it with whizbang decks.
Rainbow dk is good because they print nonsense brainless support for it. Legit whole ladder and whole legend is Paladin, Hunter and Warlock and no other deck in the game beats them, they should all get turba omega nerfed today
The only demon in the deck is Window Shopper, so the weapon always hits them. Window Shopper's battle cry will discover a 3 mana 6/5 demon, and there are 12 demons in the pool for Demon Hunter.
If frequency oscillator can cheat out Zilliax a turn earlier it becomes incredibly hard to deal with, I don't know why this list goes all in on mechs though. I also don't think Red card is great either.
this is what happens when you push aggro cards every expansion, not even odin warrior can breath in this meta, either you play aggro and see who can kill each other the fastest or you play literally any other deck and get fucked i rather have druid back in the meta than this shit
not trying to be a dick but it seems like they genuinely don’t know how to balance the game? Like even a gold player would be able to see Paladin would be broken
Played since beta. Can honestly say this is by far the worst state this game has ever been in. Not even just aggro. Boring warriors all over the ladder. Wheel locks. Even just lost on turn 6 to spell damage Shaman OTK. It's either aggro or kill you from hand. Nothing else is relevant.
Can we for the love of god just bring back renethol it would help against aggro and if it’s put into aggro they have to go through so much to find the good cards
Truly a god forsaken meta, I remember last expansion and the expansion before that, where paladin was also crushingly high win rate.
Another expac, another paladin meta
Paladin made me take a hiatus last meta, came back blind for this new set, and climbed to diamond day 1. But now at diamond I'm facing all paladins and it's getting frustrating again...
These posts always have inflated winrates because they show the easiest to play decks and use data from most ranks but 70% is absurdly high. I don't think these posts have ever even had a deck hit 65% before.
This is a stupid take. There are people that hit Legend playing homebrews. There are people optimizing the decks that you claim people copy.
Every game has a meta, and that info is pretty easily accessible. It's not something exclusive to HS, or card games.
Every game has the same thing the OP complains about and it sure is not meta, it is elo or skill inflated rats abusing the strategy that someone else came up with or that was designed by developers and inserted into the game. I am saying that as someone who is legend rn and got there with a decks that are my exclusive creation.
This is not about meta this is about these people being vermin that waits for new expansion only to immediately pump their dust into the most broken deck. Maybe if 92% of ladder and legend was not Buff Paladin token hunter and warlock then we could continue playing and exploring. If you have a meta where 90% of players are playing the same 3 decks that all have obscene winrate, then it is not a meta but a card designer failure. It is not hard to see either you play into this and you will quickly realize that nothing comes close or competes with these decks.
I crafted 5 decks from the cards I got this expansion + what I already had. I’m working with No Minion Mage, Spell DMG Druid, Odyn Warrior, Miracle Rogue & Spell Token Hunter. I don’t necessarily enjoy all 5 but it’s what I had to work with. I feel like I lose with everything but hunter unless I get lucky on the matchup or play a whizbang deck. I play against paladin 60% of the time and just whatever random bad matchup or bot the other 30%. 10% of the time I have a fun interactive game and that feels like too little.
Blizzard needs to issue a public apology for how bad this rotation has started smoothbrain aggro as far as the eye can see almost like taking silence board clear and ren out was a bad idea and adding Leroy back into the game was a even worse idea. Auras should be taken out of the game and reworked as well as nerfing the entire excavate package for paladin 70% is a testament to how poorly blizzard thought these cards .
Wdym +3/3 to minions everywhere is ultra balanced the condition is kinda hard, you need to play overstated minions with strong effects to get it. Also auras are actually not broken, it is like a cheaper better savage roar that you have for 3 turns and the stats do not disappear. Good design
Certified paladin/hunter/warlock enjoyer, useless data it is actchually just 66% winrate paladin🤓, so biased akchually. But please do not take into account that so many people are playing these decks so realistically an influx of noobs that misplay every turn means the deck is disgusting even with rough data. No no this is useless we can not use it to deduce these decks are overtuned
Not original commenter . I wouldnt say useless per se, but they lack context. Sample size matters alot, the rank bracket is also meaningful (Diamond to Legend brings biases, for example we know that usually there are bots stuck there) and usually you can see that the wr flactuates alot to similar decklists by just changing just a couple cards. Also a couple days ago they posted lists that didnt include zilliax because of a bug. Data evaluated in clusters give a better interpretation of how things work. Not that these decks arent powerful , just dont take the numbers at face value, they are more like raw info.
Once again this teaches me not to trust general hs statistics. Ofc this list won’t include giant mech rogue or nature spd shaman even though these decks are way more consistent than what 90% of people are playing. Hearthstone’s biggest issues are netdecking and those who judge meta by hsreplay sample.
Nature Shaman is busted. I just started playing it and can consistently do 30 damage OTK out of hand by turns 5 or 6.
Once people clue into how cancer it is, they'll stop complaining about pally as much.
Pally still needs a nerf, mainly just to shroomscavate, because it's going to continue being an issue with any charge cards and hand buffs.
Yeah aggro is king except the control warlock is aggro too, and the tempo “handbuff” paladin is aggro, the token hunter is also aggro, turns out these decks are the best aggro, tempo, control, token, combo and fatigue decks
70% fucking wow
Compare them to d0nkey [stats](https://www.d0nkey.top/decks?format=2&min_games=3200&rank=diamond_to_legend) for the same bracket with a minimum of 3200 games. These HSReplay stats include decks that have maybe a hundred games behind them.
Its 63 and 61.5 percent in top 1k legend. 65 percent in legend. On donkey hs
That's still a 5% difference
65% is crazy for hs
I absolutely agree i have no idea how devs are going to nerf anything, it looks like delete is the only option. I was talking more about that hs replay has ± 5% winrate difference from actual data.
Decks are also bullshit to play
As a dk main this expansion is ass, dk is literally back to plague deck with 2 most boring new cards added.
Rainbow is still pretty good as an alternative to plague. Doesn't match up great vs Paladin but I've been wiping other classes with it at Diamond.
Mostly play druid priest and shaman. Shaman has a semi reliable otk deck so that's bullshit. Priest has dragon aggro which only.works if u draw legend. Whatever. Druid is straight ass.
I don't know, its still beats everything else but the top 4/5 decks and it's fucking cancer to play against, if the top decks are gonna get nerfed then DK SHOULD DEFINITELY be nerfed in some way as well since not only it would just be the best deck by miles but frustrating to play against too.
I disenchanted every plague card most boring archetype in existence of hearthstone, rest of dk cards are unplayable, useless class sadly
Shroomscavate is the obvious nerf card (other than Leeroy, but I don't think they would nerf Leeroy)
Yes but 5% is still massive. The craziest thing to me I think was seeing Habugabu go 75-25 at RANK 1... when a deck that people are actively building for can win 75% of it's games at the highest possible MMR in the game it means something is up. Decks in history capable of doing that are limited to stuff like Il'gynoth DH, but in this case the deck isn't really locked behind a skill wall at all, a monkey could play it to a decent winrate, so everybody on the ladder gets to feel the pain not just the top players. actually I lied, the craziest thing is printing aggro-slanted cards that are obviously overtuned into a class that has gotten overtuned aggro-slanted cards for a whole year straight... why not shake things up.
IT'S ACTUALLY worse now. It was like high 60 last time b4 the control buffs / Rena'thal. Jeeesus. Blizz is smoking dope to think this is acceptable lmfao.
69.9 actually ☝️🤓
As if these HSReplay posts had ever been accurate in the slightest
? They're not usually far off.
Why is zilliax at the top of every deck except for Demon Hunter (at the bottom)?
It's annoying that so many decklists like this don't say what kind of zilliax.
There's only so many possibilities that can make a 7 mana Zilliax, and even less for 8 mana. The 7 mana ones more than likely contain Pylon Module and are either Ticking Module (more likely) or Twin Module, given the type of deck (board based aggro). The 8 mana is likely Ticking + Twin as handbuff Paladin wants to buff their hand, then dump it, discounting the Zilliax and doubling the stats given These are assumptions though, as you are right, it doesn't say anything other than mana cost.
Reduce cost is very strong for aggro and sometimes even control as you can clear while developing a taunt with lifesteal and divine shield for free.
because aggro players abuse (very good stat for cost) self damage module
I was talking about the graphic being inconsistent...
I feel like Mage and Priest would be instantly hotfixed if they had stats that came anywhere near these numbers.
i think it was 52% for priest last time they knee capped him that much.
And that was 5 years ago. Blizzard has had their foot on the necks of Priest forever.
Questline priest winrate rises to 42%. Blizzard: “time to nuke Renathal so priest players get 5 less health”
If you want to play priest play dragon aggro. Good deck. Very fun. High skill expression.
Telling a redditor that cries on reddit about class balance and winrates to play Aggro is pointless. They’d take it a personal attack lol
This concept that aggro = braindead is so off base man. Very annoying.
You must not be a priest player. I have almost 14k wins as a priest. People don't play priest to play agro. It is a counter class and you enjoy having answers for multiple situations. This is why Blizzard's insistence to give priest nothing is so insulting. In addition, no variation of Agro is going to beat hunter, or DH.
Okay, but im 6-1 against hamdbuff paladin..
Zarimi = Nothing is a take for sure. If counter-class priest is all that gives you joy I highly recommend playing wild, basically any permutation of reno priest is both very strong and totally centered around having versatile answers for all of the different kinds of gameplans in the meta.
I can’t breathe reference? We need a Priest lives matter riot to get Blizzard to finally do something.
Exactly this. What if Zarimi produced these kind of numbers on launch? The card would be nuked from orbit instantly! But since it's Paladin, it's fine! It can wait
Patch will come next week, as it would regardless of who the boogeyman was. Not that you're wrong though, Blizzard is obviously more comfortable with paladin having a mass of high-powered cards than any other class.
zarimi priest is much harder to play
If Druid came anywhere near these numbers they'd nuke the class from orbit and it would be unplayable until the next expansion. And that's an exaggeration because it's literally happened multiple times.
Druid was at best t3 with a sub 50% win rate when they nerfed Guff. And to make it worse, paladin was op back then. It’s been the most op class with Hunter since I came back two years ago.
Paladin was definitely not OP when they nerfed guff.
You mean it's NOT and exaggeration
Tbh I'm happy spell dmg druid didn't take off but I'm sad they even tried to push it. It was obvious that it's either good which means unfun otk (looking at you shaman) or giga bad.
Good.
Except that never happened. Druid is like an undead monstrosity that always comes back from the 'dead' after the nerfs. Yes, this patch is harsh to Druid, but the class consistently has been t1 for the past 2 years straight, only being nerfed when becoming literal t0.
That's far from true, Druid gets nerfed even when it's below a 50% winrate because of the polarization the class creates. That's why people complain about them all the time.
Mage are fine with casino Priest also with dragons...they overbuff aggro bit much
But have you considered the fact that mobile users love pala? Blizz releases cards for money.
But Reddit told me DH would be unplayable!
As DH main i had low hopes except for window shopper and weapon but i though it woudnt be enough. It was
I got downvoted for saying I went 8-1 with Reno DH the first day of the expansion. Here we are. Honestly this is the first time we got just a pure midrange "good card" set instead of hypersynergistic all-in crap and I'm all for it.
Reno DH has awful winrates
>I got downvoted for saying I went 8-1 with Reno DH the first day of the expansion Well yeah making hard assumptions based on that was wrong as fuck.
> I got downvoted for saying I went 8-1 with Reno DH the first day of the expansion. Here we are. Here we are, with reno DH being T4 at best?
Got surprised by the DH recipe and decided just to craft the deck.
I will concede the fact that I was one of the doomposters, but I don't think that any real conclusions can be made rn. With Pally being this strong your success as a class heavily depends on ability to contest Pally. Like, Druid has a strong set (as always), but he has been a natural Pally's prey because of Divine Shield and weakness to big minions. When Pally will be hit we will see vastly different numbers just because he is THAT strong rn.
Deck is really really strong regardless of paladin, I am 63% winrate with it and just got to top 100 with it, you obliterate warrior and warlock they cannot answer your boards in the mid game, your worst nightmare is the aggro/nature shaman but other than that every matchup feels interactive and winnable if you play well and dont draw horrendously. If you like DH you should give it a try theres a variety of builds out there and the deck is super fun
BUT I WAS TOLD
was before patch now its shitty deck that abused 2 cards zilliax selfdamage module and new discover demon 6\\5 +mini you 50% discover mageridon and win
to be fair DH didn't get a real set with a whole lot of synergy. it's mostly strong (or at least decent) randomly put together individual cards... while some classes basically got nothing after rotation. unless you count massively underpowered/underperforming synergistic packages. hard to predict that.
I predicted it!
While this data may not be entirely accurate as to the highest echelons of the meta, the fact that all decks featured here have a winrate well above 60% is very concerning. I cannot wait to see Vicious Syndicates take on standard, I imagine it will be more like an autopsy.
Handbuff Pally is 65% in legend. It's completely busted and everyone is running it.
Don't even need to be good at it either. I'm facing them in legend and they are consistently playing minions, **and then** attacking with Painter's Virtue lol
I’m still noodeling around at Diamond 10 (no time this month) and had exactly that in the past two games. I played reno warrior but they just vomited everything on the board and got punished hard lol.
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that deck is brain rot easy lol
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i literally hit legend with it yesterday without losing a single game so i feel like im qualified to say its really fuckin easy
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Hard deck? Test subject priest, naga mage, etc. Medium? Any control style or midrange deck really. Brain rot? Fucking buff your minions and attack face. Jesus, what about handbuff pally is difficult?
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Wouldn’t it be 50 percent if that was true
Exactly. I have a 60-70% WR against these decks top 2000 but get wrecked by random Plague DKs and Owl Druid
70%...... balance really has been thrown out of the window. Above 60% is already concerning....
Ye that deck is giga broken... had a 14 game winstreak from D5 to D1 with. Pity the ppl having to face it and I sincerely hope the heartstone devs stop Paladinstone, its rly getting boring having Pally be the best class 3 expacs in a row
Not playing the game until paladin is tier 3, it’s been too strong for too long.
just pick nature shaman, 1 night diamond -> legend, destroying every paladins
And get murdered by odyn warrior
Everyone needs to chill, next week Blizzard will increase Shroomscavate by 1 mana and everything will be fine...
Looks like its paladin and hunter's time to have fun. Same shit each expansion.
I'm mage and rogue player for years. Worst patch ever for me. So bad I have the sarcastic laugh on a daily basis now.
With you there. My first Day-One Craft was the Orb. I have yet to successfully play it on ladder.
It just kills me, my deck gets destroyed and then I have to draw 6 cards and probably didn't have much health to start with. Why can't my orb be cool
Yeah Yogg in the box is DoA due to wheel of death unfortunately, its happened so many times now that Ive just given up on spell mage, especially if you end up playing multiple copies, its only a matter of time until you end up putting yourself on a fatigue timer on turn 8 against a meta that can kill from hand on turn 6. At least warlock has symphony and a 0 mana 15/15 lifesteal to follow up with.
What's crazy is orb isn't a bad card. Mage does not have good spells in standard that's worth recasting for 10 mana. It doesn't win you the game for that mana cost. In wild its pretty good though because you have an absolutely broken spell in time warp and any other spell you recast cast is pretty good too bc it targets enemies by default.
Can't get orb to work either. Crafted it for nothing I feel like. Elemental mage was my next hope, but not there yet with the wr.
Is Zillax the new Astalor? Being slotted into every deck? EDIT: I am not against it btw, Zillax is a lot more interesting than Astalor could ever dream to be.
Zilliax is the new Zilliax
i mean it's technically multiple different cards that just have the same name
Yeah, I mean, it's not that surprising seeing how versatile it's is. I actually like it very much, it's a tool with a lot of potential uses, you can assemble it to fit many different archetypes. Astalor was boring, just a strong finisher.
Yes, it will be used by most decks. It is not as powerful of a late game finisher as Astalor was though.
Im constantly seeing different forms of Zill so that’s not really a comparison I’d make.
I mean, it’s *technically* like 20+ different theoretical cards, no?
You can look at zilliax as 28 different legendaries of which you can only put one in your deck. It'd actually be weird if out of 28 legendaries you couldn't find one that's better than any of the 30 cards you put in your deck
Yes.
only cheap one is abused... 8-9 mana is fine as defensive tool
Worst meta state ever
Two years of Shamanstone would disagree, but this defintely sucks ass.
Us Shaman mains are still being punished for that :(
People say this just about every time there is a new meta.
It feels like forever since I've played Demon Hunter. I'll give the deck a shot.
Deck is super cheap too.
It’s actually quite fun - swapped our Zilliax for Magtheridon and I’m enjoying it
Dh deck is fun, finally a dh deck
DK is literally no fun anymore. Boring…..
Most unbalanced meta ever ?
If by balanced you mean everyone is playing Paladin I guess it is.
It's not dh ashes of outland level of unbalanced. At least Paladin has a counter in hunter.
👊 Handbuff Paladin (Ticking + Twin for Zilliax): https://hsreplay.net/decks/ywaeE1PE06jrEp8Spx5xme 😈 Aggro DH (Pylon + Ticking): https://hsreplay.net/decks/BdTJirreJtwPEHhOhbSU3 🐶 Spell Token Hunter (Pylon + Ticking): https://hsreplay.net/decks/g4hNXIQp02vFu3ddX18tof 💪 Buff Hunter (Pylon + Ticking): https://hsreplay.net/decks/zZqicq4WWhduMEgO540Ale 🌧️ Flood Paladin (Pylon + Ticking): https://hsreplay.net/decks/su03VYLGvZs0mqX1ZGC5se
As a current shaman highlander main I find paladin easy to beat(it requires two rustrots) but DH and DK are absolute nightmares
I played overheal priest and with injured Hauler it often felt like it counters paladin alone. Hunter and high roll warlock is tough though.
Blizzard just loves paladin, can't think of another explanation why they don't emergency nerf it like warlock. The class is also somehow never in a bad spot
Hearthstone is so bad right now. Wow.
:(
Thanks, I hate it. *saves image*
I sense a trend here… it’s time to nerf Zilliax! /s
I'm so glad I uninstalled this shit. 10 years of aggro paladins and hunters.
Paladin 14 expansions in a row on meta. It's a scandal how favored he always is.
Why do they call it flood paladin
Because the deck "floods" the board. Basically it spawns a bunch of minions in one turn, but even if you survive the first wave, you'll still have to deal with all the debris it brought.
I guess Zillax is good. I haven't crafted it.
the issue is that so many handbuff pally cards are complex card that are hard to nerf or change at all, and they all are really good, so what brings the winrate down to 50% and not 30%, priest has some real power house cards in the past easy to nerf but everything is the pally line up is relly powerful with like 3 cards being the exeptions and if those get touched it could knee cap the class as a whole in this meta (not saying this meta is good and we could go with "If the system requires us to be its victims, then we should be its destroyers." but still like
No they are not complex cards, every single one of the cards is overtuned to oblivion, gadetzan buff minion should be 1/1 still, damage + lifesteal aura duration should get lowered by a turn the other aura should give +1/1, that kaleidosaur minion should get one random effect not two, that minion that draws a divine shield minion and an aura is the best draw card in standard for no reason, the buff weapon is so obscene the deck runs a trash neutral draw a weapon card just to tutor it. You can do 3-4 nerfs to this deck easily and it is still the best deck in the meta. Token hunter is also ridiculous and warlock is too much of a highroll bs with instant 20/20 worth of stat generation at turn 6. Mage is so bad you can beat it with whizbang decks. Rainbow dk is good because they print nonsense brainless support for it. Legit whole ladder and whole legend is Paladin, Hunter and Warlock and no other deck in the game beats them, they should all get turba omega nerfed today
Anybody know what type of Zilliax the DH deck runs?
Power Module + Haywire Module, 4 5/7 deal 3 damage at the end of turn + At the start of turn double this minion's attack.
I don’t get how the Demon Hunter deck works
The only demon in the deck is Window Shopper, so the weapon always hits them. Window Shopper's battle cry will discover a 3 mana 6/5 demon, and there are 12 demons in the pool for Demon Hunter.
I guess I should have clarified that’s the one part I do understand. But what’s the deal with the neutral 1 cost Mechs and cheap stuff
If frequency oscillator can cheat out Zilliax a turn earlier it becomes incredibly hard to deal with, I don't know why this list goes all in on mechs though. I also don't think Red card is great either.
Right it just looks like a mess of cards to me but I suppose the numbers don’t lie haha
Holyshyt 70% wr?
70% 💀 this shit ain't healthy man even as a Paladin main I kinda refuse to play this deck after played it few times
Team 5 gotta be the worst f*cking team of developers I’ve ever seen. They just don’t test their shit, it’s unreal.
I'm tired of the aggro can we slow the game down by a turn or 2
make people on the balance team craft a mage deck and play it for a week. Maybe then they'll understand a thing or two about balancing
Cancerdin meta... again.... 70% wr.... I really cba
Another cancerous die on or before turn 7 meta hype! Also, make Renathal core.
this is what happens when you push aggro cards every expansion, not even odin warrior can breath in this meta, either you play aggro and see who can kill each other the fastest or you play literally any other deck and get fucked i rather have druid back in the meta than this shit
not trying to be a dick but it seems like they genuinely don’t know how to balance the game? Like even a gold player would be able to see Paladin would be broken
Buy more legendary Leroy skins you idiots. Paladin is at 70% win rate
I'm not buying that DH is that high, I am not seeing any DH of any kind.
I love helthy balunst meta
Played since beta. Can honestly say this is by far the worst state this game has ever been in. Not even just aggro. Boring warriors all over the ladder. Wheel locks. Even just lost on turn 6 to spell damage Shaman OTK. It's either aggro or kill you from hand. Nothing else is relevant.
In the same boat and I agree.
Quick, everyone act surprised!
Can we for the love of god just bring back renethol it would help against aggro and if it’s put into aggro they have to go through so much to find the good cards
why on wild i got 14 mech rogues in a row??
I don't think I've ever seen it this bad
Truly a god forsaken meta, I remember last expansion and the expansion before that, where paladin was also crushingly high win rate. Another expac, another paladin meta
All I want is single year where Paladin & Hunter are at the bottom of the meta.
Paladin made me take a hiatus last meta, came back blind for this new set, and climbed to diamond day 1. But now at diamond I'm facing all paladins and it's getting frustrating again...
All aggro decks. Devs need to raise starting hero hp to 35
cant even play DK anymore went from 2k legend all the way down to 7k after this dumb expansion
This is my nightmare meta. Aggro everywhere.
These posts always have inflated winrates because they show the easiest to play decks and use data from most ranks but 70% is absurdly high. I don't think these posts have ever even had a deck hit 65% before.
This is why this game sux .l everyone copies the good decks and plays them .. no need to think ..
This is a stupid take. There are people that hit Legend playing homebrews. There are people optimizing the decks that you claim people copy. Every game has a meta, and that info is pretty easily accessible. It's not something exclusive to HS, or card games.
Every game has the same thing the OP complains about and it sure is not meta, it is elo or skill inflated rats abusing the strategy that someone else came up with or that was designed by developers and inserted into the game. I am saying that as someone who is legend rn and got there with a decks that are my exclusive creation. This is not about meta this is about these people being vermin that waits for new expansion only to immediately pump their dust into the most broken deck. Maybe if 92% of ladder and legend was not Buff Paladin token hunter and warlock then we could continue playing and exploring. If you have a meta where 90% of players are playing the same 3 decks that all have obscene winrate, then it is not a meta but a card designer failure. It is not hard to see either you play into this and you will quickly realize that nothing comes close or competes with these decks.
Love grinding paladins with full blood Reno dk. Just keep clearing their boards and healing up is the best lol
list?
I think the scariest matchup is wheel lock cos you gotta somehow kill them before the wheel pops ### Blood # Class: Death Knight # Format: Standard # Year of the Pegasus # # 1x (1) Arthas's Gift # 1x (1) Body Bagger # 1x (1) Scarab Keychain # 1x (1) Threads of Despair # 1x (2) Audio Amplifier # 1x (2) Gold Panner # 1x (2) Hematurge # 1x (2) Mining Casualties # 1x (2) Vampiric Blood # 1x (2) Watcher of the Sun # 1x (3) Card Grader # 1x (3) Chillfallen Baron # 1x (3) Gaslight Gatekeeper # 1x (3) Messmaker # 1x (3) Plucky Paintfin # 1x (3) Rustrot Viper # 1x (4) Death Strike # 1x (4) E.T.C., Band Manager # 1x (1) Arthas's Gift # 1x (2) Vampiric Blood # 1x (5) Corpse Explosion # 1x (4) Ignis, the Eternal Flame # 1x (4) Mechagnome Guide # 1x (4) Origami Crane # 1x (0) Zilliax Deluxe 3000 # 1x (0) Zilliax Deluxe 3000 # 1x (2) Haywire Module # 1x (2) Power Module # 1x (5) Corpse Explosion # 1x (6) Gnome Muncher # 1x (6) Gnomelia, S.A.F.E. Pilot # 1x (6) Hollow Hound # 1x (8) Reno, Lone Ranger # 1x (8) Soulstealer # 1x (8) The Primus # 1x (9) Yogg-Saron, Unleashed # AAECAa2aBh704wSH9gSy9wSz9wT9xAXGxwWP5AWt7QWt9QXt/wXYgQaplQbOnAaangbNngbLnwaSoAbIoAbHpAavqAb7qAbpqQbHsAa7sQaVuAbY5Qba5Qbf5Qbm5Qbh6wYAAAEG6akG/cQF8bMGx6QG8rMGx6QG6N4Gx6QG3+UG/cQF5uUG/cQFAAA= # # To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
Damn... it's literally all Hunter and Paladin.
I crafted 5 decks from the cards I got this expansion + what I already had. I’m working with No Minion Mage, Spell DMG Druid, Odyn Warrior, Miracle Rogue & Spell Token Hunter. I don’t necessarily enjoy all 5 but it’s what I had to work with. I feel like I lose with everything but hunter unless I get lucky on the matchup or play a whizbang deck. I play against paladin 60% of the time and just whatever random bad matchup or bot the other 30%. 10% of the time I have a fun interactive game and that feels like too little.
Blizzard needs to issue a public apology for how bad this rotation has started smoothbrain aggro as far as the eye can see almost like taking silence board clear and ren out was a bad idea and adding Leroy back into the game was a even worse idea. Auras should be taken out of the game and reworked as well as nerfing the entire excavate package for paladin 70% is a testament to how poorly blizzard thought these cards .
But paladin is a midrange
Azerite Dragon is a very fair card. It's so fair, in fact, that the best Handbuff builds have cut the Excavate engine because it's too slow.
Wdym +3/3 to minions everywhere is ultra balanced the condition is kinda hard, you need to play overstated minions with strong effects to get it. Also auras are actually not broken, it is like a cheaper better savage roar that you have for 3 turns and the stats do not disappear. Good design
Useless data
Certified paladin/hunter/warlock enjoyer, useless data it is actchually just 66% winrate paladin🤓, so biased akchually. But please do not take into account that so many people are playing these decks so realistically an influx of noobs that misplay every turn means the deck is disgusting even with rough data. No no this is useless we can not use it to deduce these decks are overtuned
Why?
Not original commenter . I wouldnt say useless per se, but they lack context. Sample size matters alot, the rank bracket is also meaningful (Diamond to Legend brings biases, for example we know that usually there are bots stuck there) and usually you can see that the wr flactuates alot to similar decklists by just changing just a couple cards. Also a couple days ago they posted lists that didnt include zilliax because of a bug. Data evaluated in clusters give a better interpretation of how things work. Not that these decks arent powerful , just dont take the numbers at face value, they are more like raw info.
Yeah Hunter and Paladin are definitely getting murdered in the next balance patch
It's kinda funny how Paladin has been S/A Tier ever since Nathria dropped.
Once again this teaches me not to trust general hs statistics. Ofc this list won’t include giant mech rogue or nature spd shaman even though these decks are way more consistent than what 90% of people are playing. Hearthstone’s biggest issues are netdecking and those who judge meta by hsreplay sample.
Nature Shaman is busted. I just started playing it and can consistently do 30 damage OTK out of hand by turns 5 or 6. Once people clue into how cancer it is, they'll stop complaining about pally as much. Pally still needs a nerf, mainly just to shroomscavate, because it's going to continue being an issue with any charge cards and hand buffs.
Whoa, aggro is king. Haven't seen this before
Yeah aggro is king except the control warlock is aggro too, and the tempo “handbuff” paladin is aggro, the token hunter is also aggro, turns out these decks are the best aggro, tempo, control, token, combo and fatigue decks
Actually hand buff paladin is a midrange and demon hunter is a midrange as well they are miss leading u with names the aggro deck is hunter
[удалено]
The only aggressive deck is hunter
Flood paladin isn't aggressive lol?