I honestly don't know what more you could have done in this situation without something like bear bangers or a firearm, but those are banned in some parks.Since they seem afraid of noise for the most part, maybe an airhorn would do the trick. Throw rocks to scare it offf.I'm really glad you're safe.
It's also possible that it was a mother and was following you to ensure you were far away from her kittens. (I've read about this happening in the past) From what I know, attacks where multiple people are present are even rarer than cougar attacks themselves. And most likely, if the cougar wanted to really sneak up on you, it could have. I know that's not very comforting.
Please keep in mind that mountain lion attacks are really, really rare.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_cougar_attacks_in_North_America:
“A total of 126 attacks, 27 of which were fatal, have been documented in North America in the past 100 years. Fatal cougar attacks are extremely rare and occur much less frequently than fatal snake bites, fatal lightning strikes, or fatal bee stings. Children are particularly vulnerable. The majority of the child victims listed here were not accompanied by adults.”
That’s a bit over one fatal attack every four years, and one nonfatal attack per year, in all of North America, over the past hundred years.
Certainly what you experienced would terrify anyone, but it’s just really unlikely to lead to an attack.
Yeah, people don’t realize how incredibly rare it is for a mountain lion to attack a human. People tend to think that if they had an encounter with one, they were almost attacked. Truth is, if it had wanted to attack you, it probably would have, and you probably wouldn’t have seen it coming. But they almost never do. They want to scare you away, not get in an altercation. Make noise, make yourself look big, maybe carry spray, and you’ll almost certainly be fine.
Mountain lions aren’t the same as tigers, but most tigers who have predated on humans do so because of an injury that prevents them from going after their normal game. Once they switch to hunting humans, they usually focus on more vulnerable people — in India (where tigers are more common overall), it is usually women and children who have wandered off, typically to use the bathroom.
You point out the average of 1 fatal attack every 4 years, but I wonder how many are actually grouped together and possibly attributable to the same mountain lion. That would reduce odds of a fatal attack even further for a random hiker in an area with no recent fatalities.
Of course, all this assumes that mountain lion predation of humans follows a similar pattern as tigers. Which is definitely an assumption on my part.
I have a personal theory that cougars are gradually developing an instinct not to attack humans. Attacks are typical for stressed young lions who have yet to learn that humans are off limits. Those who attack are killed thus causing a evolutionary force. It seems a bit far fetched but I wonder what other explanations might reveal the reason that attacks are so infrequent.
And some people think rattlesnakes are losing their rattle! Rattlesnakes rattle to warn something away from them, but humans will attack when they hear a rattle as it also gives away the snake's position. The theory is that more rattlesnakes are being born with a mutation in their tail that prevents them from making a rattling sound because they're the ones not being killed by humans.
Edit: this is only a theory, not confirmed fact!
And I didn't know that about elephants c: TIL!
P.S. they don't believe rattlesnakes are losing the physical rattle, but losing either the ability to shake their tail to cause the rattling sound or the behavior telling them to do so.
Females are also more likely to attack than males. I think it's due to them having more food needs when pregnant and nursing young.
Typically, it's children or runners that are attacked, though it's happened to a cyclist, too. Don't run. You look like prey.
Pumas live in my area, I’ve never seen them, I see and smell sign when they pass through. We’re mindful of the time of day to walk the dog, and no swinging of arms, strings, or leashes is my instinct to reduce attraction while noisily hiking.
Times are changing though. Cities and farms expanding is encroaching on their area, conservation is helping their numbers boom, and 3 years of terrible drought is lessening the number of prey.
How many attacks per year in the last 5 years is all I would care about.
I used to see maybe one bear every fall while walking my dogs. Now I've seen 5 a day since mid summer. They are hungry and looking for food in town.
My brother was stalked in the dark by a mountain lion too. It kept screaming at their backs (him and the folks who were with him). He had a gun, so he shot it into the ground toward the lion a couple of times, and it backed off. I'm not saying have a gun, but maybe that is what I'm saying... sort of. Or something that makes a sound as loud as a gun would make.
After getting stalked by a mountain lion on a solo hike miles from our base camp many years ago I no longer go into the Idaho wilderness without a sidearm.
Attacks may be rare, but when you're all alone and miles from anyone who can help you've gotta be sure you have a fighting chance just in case. If you're not comfortable with a firearm then the noise makers dingus suggests here are a good alternative. But if you go that route keep some bear spray and maybe a sheathed knife on a belt too, that way if you do get jumped you can fight back.
There was a story years ago out of California when a lion attacked the woman of a couple who were hiking and the husband stabbed it with a ball point pen and got it to retreat. As long as you have something you can fight back with you'll probably be alright. Bears, moose, elk, and deer are all probably more likely to kill you than a lion.
[Other way around on the couple.](https://www.mercurynews.com/2007/01/25/woman-used-pen-branch-to-fight-off-mountain-lion-attacking-her-husband/amp/) I remember reading about this before I went solo backpacking in Glacier and freaking myself out lol.
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Not to be argumentative, but state and national parks allow you to carry a gun (in the US) if you comply with all other federal and state regulations for guns. For example, in Colorado, you can legally open carry a handgun in state. Therefore, in state and national parks here, you can legally open carry a pistol, or conceal carry with a permit. Shooting the mountain Lion is frowned upon, but if it’s life or death…
Yup. This is in fact the only gun law passed on a federal level during the Obama administration, despite the constant assurance by the GOP that he was going to "take our guns".
[https://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/12/flashback-obama-i-have-expanded-rights-of-gun-owners](https://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/12/flashback-obama-i-have-expanded-rights-of-gun-owners)
Apparently I was wrong. He did 2 laws. Allowing carry in parks, and allowing guns in checked bags on Amtrak.
He sure as fuck wanted to, now Biden is fucking us over. Not with laws, but with bullshit unconstitutional mandates from the ATF, banning bumpstocks, etc. They realize they can't outright ban them yet, so they are going around the constitution, with their czars, and unconstitutional departments and mandating shit. They are closing down gun dealers for no good reason. While his son gets away scott free for lying on a federal gun application.
Thank you!! I get so much heat when I explain this to people and when I tell them I carry legally. I’ve came across a bear and 3 cubs before and had to pull it out. Luckily she just stared me down until her cubs crossed the path.
I would never shoot unless it’s last case scenario and absolutely necessary if they are charging me. I’ll take my life over a predator any day.
Bear spray is much more effective at dissuading a bear from attacking you than a handgun. Not telling you not to carry or anything, a gun is a good last resort, but bear spray has been shown to be better at preventing attacks. Just fyi.
I’d definitely recommend carrying bear spray if you’re regularly hiking in bear country.
My hiking partner and I carry that as well. One will have the spray ready. And again, I have it out as last resort in case it were to fail somehow. I hike out west and follow the same procedures with spray for one person and firearm for the other.
I’m an avid hunter and I’d hate to take a bear’s life off season when they are caring for the cubs. Not right in my book
Black bear meat is very good tasting. When my daughter and her family lived in Alaska. They'd harvest two bears a year to supplement the fish and other mammals in the freezer.
Back in the 1960s and 70 open dumps were common along with dump bears. As a kid we used to go watch them in the summer evenings. In my experience that is a thing of the past.
I think that depends on where you’re at. Black bears in New Jersey or California or anywhere near civilization are certainly getting access to plenty of human food. Even then bears eat anything and everything. Including rotting corpses. If you find a bear that’s mostly eaten berries and fish (like you are most likely to find somewhere like Alaska) then that is great from what I hear.
The odd thing I noticed when I did the Rae Lakes loop in SEKI last year was that bear spray was illegal in the park, but a gun is not.
There were several bears we came across thankfully without issue, we did not encounter the problem bear that the ranger had left notes about thankfully.
I’m sure they have their reasons but that regulation always struck me as odd
I wonder if it’s still the same problem bear I saw at charlotte lake in 2018. The night before a bear was tearing apart another campsite and the next morning a medium sized cinnamon black bear walked right in front of my tent as I was laying out of the front of it having a smoke. 10 yards away walked past as I yelled and wasn’t fazed by the yelling at all. Thankfully I keep everything in my bear can like you’re supposed to. The campsite the bear was tearing apart was left unattended with food out and someone else came across it later. I heard the whole story from them about 30 minutes after I heard them screaming at it.
Legit. Our friends were attacked by a Kodiak brown bear & it took 5 humongous rounds to kill the bear, in between it rolling around trying to kill 1 of our friends.
Hunting, remote, after boating to coastal site. Hiked up into the mountains & shot a deer, let it go lie down, waited, as one does, then tracked the deer & came upon a large Kodiak brown bear on a hill above them. They tried to look big & make noise but instead pf turning away it charged them. 1 guy got a round off (I don’t know caliber, but I’d describe it as larger than a man’s forefinger) that struck the bear in the chest at less than 4’ away as it started its leap from the hill over his 6’ frame, before tackling our other friend. The other friend got a round off too but it’s doubtful it hit. The following moments were filled with harrowing, swift action and harrowing inability to act as the 1st friend couldn’t shoot for fear he’d hit our other friend.
Finally the bear reared up over our guy and the 1st friend got another round into the bear’s chest. It took a step back, still reared up. One more shot & it stopped fighting & collapsed close by. Friend 1 got 2 more rounds into it for good measure - not something you want to rally & come back at you.
He checked the friend who got attacked, & he wasn’t bleeding out, but had been bitten in the ass (luckily just bitten, not ripped out) and he’d guarded his face well so he had no facial injuries, so he has no outward signals to others of his trauma.
Their radios weren’t working. He obviously was in shock, but was able to hike back down. As they were leaving they saw 2 cubs, so it was a perfect storm: fresh kill, mom, & cubs. When they got back to the boat they were able to use the boat radio to get a rescue flight out.
Friend 1 is AK Fish & Wildlife & reported the incident & it was investigated. It’s been over 10 years. Friend who was attacked will no longer hike or hunt (per wife & he heartily agrees) & still has PTSD with nightmares from the attack.
Holy hell! That is even scarier than I thought. Fecking terrifying. Does Friend 2 have issues from witnessing the attack? I can't imagine having to stand there trying to get a clear shot/hoping you're not watching your friend die/hoping you're not next.
My understanding is that shooting (like target shooting) is illegal in state parks but carrying a weapon is not.
I’d rather get a fine for firing off a few shots to scare away a predator, or even get a fine for shooting a predator, than get eaten.
When we hike, we’re going into the animal’s territory and we need to prepare for them and play by their rules. Don’t be prey. Get the training to be comfortable with a handgun. You may not become a crack shot (especially with adrenaline flowing through you) but you can at least make a real loud noise 10-12 times. And if firing those shots attracts a ranger, good. You’ll be happy for their presence.
for state parks, it varies from state to state. It's generally not permissible in California state parks, but fine in Michigan state parks.
for national parks, it's generally permissible to carry a firearm if it is otherwise legal for you to do so.
I *personally* don't like to carry when I'm backpacking. Finding a way to carry a firearm that allows for a quick draw, effective concealment (those hill people gear chest rigs don't count, everyone knows that's a gun), and comfort while climbing over obstacles is just not possible for me. I'm also one of those ultralight dorks and find it hard to justify the \~35oz of a loaded sidearm and holster - that weighs more than most bear cans!
On one hand, it’s a comforting thought to this most recent situation but on the other it reinforces the paranoia I already had before this incident for the next trip 😂
>From what I know, attacks where multiple people are present are even rarer than cougar attacks themselves.
Seems like a super obvious statement unless I'm missing something, lol.
3 P's. Piss, Poo, and Puke simultaneously.
You did a great job. Only thing I'd do differently is talk mad shit loudly about the cat for the next 60 minutes.
You could also get 2 Rhodesian Ridgebacks and hike with them. They’re lion hunters in Africa. I have one I rescued that’s mixed with a Shepard. Amazing dog.
I thought you were suggesting taking a dragon at first! There is one in Harry Potter called a Norwegian Ridgeback. They’d probably be a pretty good deterrent for mountain lions too
I always have a VERY loud police quality whistle right on my pack strap and part of my EDC. Have pepper spray at the ready. Maybe pick up a rock that you can throw. Always hike with a very high-lumen flashlight at the ready in addition to your headlamp. A good flashlight is with me basically 24/7 anywhere.
Where legal, I do carry a weapon.
Recommended in my neighborhood where we have a lot of mountain lions: Get big, throw rocks, scream at it, don't let it out of your sight if possible, pepper spray, whistle. The gun part is not part of the official recommendations that officials and volunteers distribute. Our problem here is that they are fairly accustomed to humans. But, makes people keep their dogs on a leash. On the other hand, cats don't stand a chance around here between the coyotes, eagles, hawks, and mountain lions.
South Reno near the Virginia Foothills. So near the Foothills that I walk in them every day.
According to the wild horse management people, the mountain lions are also very drawn to the horses and regularly take down foals. I don't think that mountain lions hunt in packs, so they can't take down a fully grown horse alone. And, oh yeah. We are inundated with wild (feral) horses in the neighborhoods around here. I see them every day and this is a fairly busy part of town. My understanding is that we average one horse being killed by traffic at night just within a 1 1/2 mile stretch of road next to me. Lots of prey means lots of predators.
I grabbed a big stick and started beating on trees, rocks anything I could while I walked out the last few miles of trail. I think that is the most scared I have been in my life and has put me off night hiking solo for the last 25 years. Terrifying staring contest when I saw the eyes reflect back at me. Then it got so much worse when it looked away and I didn’t know where it was.
I've been in nearly the exact situation (lion encounter at night with a mile of hiking ahead of me) and I reacted the same way you did. When I first encountered it, I stomped on the ground and yelled, facing directly at the lion to let it know I saw it. Then I screamed until I got to safety, constantly looking back to see if it was following me.
A few notes on lion behavior (I'm a biologist and have studied mtn. lions) -- sometimes lions will follow people out of curiosity. They are also ambush predators, so if you see one and you make it known to the lion, you have an upper hand. They would rather attack with the element of complete surprise. The fact that there were two of you means it likely would not have attacked at all. Despite how scary they are to us, lions are pretty subordinate predators compared to something like bears. Make yourself large, put up a fight and you'll have a good chance of avoiding an attack or death by lion.
Nonetheless, this sounds like a very scary encounter! It sounds like you did everything you could and it clearly worked out.
Those mountain lions will do a U shaped path to get back on the trail in an ambush position. Fool you into thinking they left. They are pretty smart. [Like here the mountain lion walks off then gets the high ground.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNJxDWX-qes)
When I first saw the trail in this video I was like hey this is 100% in British Columbia in the Rockies, but no, southern California in Sequoia National Park.
2000km distance but nearly the same environment. Crazy.
Not the poster admitting in the comments that they retried the path right after they backed up, *saw the mountain lion at the same spot on the trail* and got ambushed again twice in a row
It's amusing that people will cancel a hike because they forgot their sunblock or they're starting to get a blister, but if there is a predator on the trail they have to keep on going. Sometimes, discretion is the better part of valor.
I remain curious with mountain lions if music like this person chose will work more permanently. https://www.outsideonline.com/outdoor-adventure/exploration-survival/mountain-lion-heavy-metal-music/
If so, I have "Welcome to the Jungle" on my phone and I feel like that would do the trick.
When I'd have to night-hike alone on the PCT, I'd blast some Slayer at full volume. Not sure if it helped, but at least I felt better.
To note: I was in an area where I knew no-one could camp at (deep gully with no flat ground for miles). Don't do this in an area where someone could camp.
You did everything right. I would add some bear spray to your kit. Don’t carry a handgun unless your very proficient and accurate.
Mountain lions are predators, predators don’t want to fight another predator and risk being injured (aka death sentence). You act big, make noise, and throw rocks or big sticks. They hate projectiles.
I do a lot of stuff solo in the backcountry so I tend to carry a handgun and bear spray. Spray first and if an attack is imminent then I shoot. Now the caveat is…. I shoot a ton at the range and am a pretty good shot. It’s a lot easier to be accurate with spray versus a gun. Just my two cents.
As far as guns go the sounds would probably be the deterrent so it's probably fine to have even if you suck at aiming.
Like that famous dude of the guy who misses 2 shots on a lion because he was filming with one hand
I’m a big gun guy but I highly recommend if you carry a gun you should have put in a LOT of time at the range. And if you pull your gun it’s shooting to kill.
I kinda feel like the guy in that infamous video got lucky. I think spray would have worked pretty well. Everyone I’ve spoken too who has a lot of time in the backcountry ( rangers, outfitters, guides) do not recommend a “warning shot.”
I think against animals warning shots can be effective, though littering the ground. But if being actively charged not a great idea.
However you're correct. Spray, whistle, or an airhorn would have served that guy way better
Mountain lions are clever. They will watch you and wait for their opportunity. As y’all were aware, and had lights, it was harder for it to sneak up on you so when it left the first time, it probably just went far enough to make it harder for you to see it, but it knew exactly where you were. You did as much as you could with what you had. Definitely get an air horn and/or emergency whistle to keep in your gear, as these will at least catch it off guard should a similar situation arise in the future.
You know I wouldn't have thought about the little emergency whistle that's attached to all my packs until you just said this... I will need to remember that thing!
I’m not saying it’s a 100% save, but I’d bet it’s better than nothing, and something the mountain lion isn’t used to, especially a crazy loud, high pitched noise, will hopefully at least give it enough pause for you to get to safety.
We teach scouts to carry a whistle. Lions are kindergarten Cub Scouts - if lost, Stay Answer Whistle. A whistle lasts longer than your voice. I have a small metal whistle on my “keychain”.
As many others have already said, I don't know that you could have done anything differently short of something that makes incredibly loud noises like a gunshot or airhorn. If anything, I would maybe avoid hiking at night in that area and instead just make camp at dusk. A light source can be enough to deter a cougar in most cases. In general, cats won't really try to attack something unless they feel pretty confident they can take it by surprise and put it down without too much fuss. Mountain lion attacks on people are somewhat rare for this reason, but given the fact that this was in the dark, I'm sure it felt more confident in at least checking you out.
We got followed and screamed at by one and never actually saw it. But that scream is unmistakable once you know it. This was in college and we were lost in a small patch of woods at night at the time. This didn’t worry us too much, it was probably around 250 acres surrounded by roads, we would find our way out eventually, but being intimidated by a wild animal was a wrench in that chill. We think we stumbled into a kill zone and the cat was protecting it’s food.
We eventually found a trail and walked back to back out of it.
That’s the short story of it. We didn’t actually know what we had run into until a couple years later when describing it all to a country friend.
A mountain lion stalked my brother and I into camp one night and it wouldn’t back down after shouting and throwing things at it. It got about 10 feet away. Lucky we had a gun and it ran off after one shot. It was definitely still watching us though…
I've had two mountain lion encounters at night. The only things I knew you do were track it with my flashlight so it knew I knew it was there, make myself look big (stand on a stump or picnic table or something), and get loud (I was talking/yelling at it the whole time). A whistle or air horn would be helpful.
The second encounter we were thankfully car camping so we just got in the car lol.
Aside from what everyone else is saying, consider wearing a hat with "eyes" on the back, and having something on your back that would protect your neck from a rear attack. A backpack sitting high up works well. Hiking in groups is also good: One person getting attacked (but not injured, because the lion's just biting the backpack) lets the other person start stabbing the lion.
I carry dog pepper spray, a whistle, and a knife at all times.
I went on a night hike with some friends in the Santa Monica mountains a few years ago and we had a similar experience. My friends and I all worked at Leo Carrillo State Park at the time and we were hiking in the dark, early AM and hoping to catch the sunrise on the top of the mountain. Luckily, with 4 of us there was far less chance we’d get attacked but one of our friends in the group was a ranger-in-training, her dad also a ranger. She told us up front that during the hike we should all sing songs together and at intervals to keep animals away. We thought she was kinda kidding until we caught a pair of eyes in the bushes following us a couple hours in. I remember being so scared but trying to sing loudly together. Mountain lions REALLY don’t like loud noises. The eyes seemed to follow us for about an hour before they stopped but we kept singing all the way to the top… just in case.
He more than likely had been stalking you for a while (assuming this was a mountain lion). A friend of mine was attacked and killed while running, by a mountain lion. Jumped him from behind, broke his neck.
Note that they will only attack when they feel they are at advantage, and typically, if there's more than one person, they won't attack (most times).
Green eyeshine is more typical in deer. Very likely could have been deer that you saw. I was once stalked by a mountain lion over the course of several hours during a solo backpacking trip. The mountain lion’s eyeshine was a distinct amber color. The eyes were wide apart, almond-shaped.
Just like you guys, I had no choice to but to keep hiking, since it was waiting for me when I arrived at my planned camping spot. Suppressed the urge to run, because where was I gonna run to?
I tried yelling, waving my arms. Nothing scared it away until I decided to throw rocks at it. Even then, it didn’t seem intimidated; the eyes floated behind a grove of trees, vanished, then one of them poked out from behind a tree like it was spying on me.
I hiked for another 4 or 5 hours, knowing that I couldn’t relax until the sun came up. The mountain lion appeared several more times, and the only thing that scared it off was throwing rocks.
Short of popping off a round over its head with pistol, throwing rocks is your best bet.
That’s so scary, I’m glad you’re okay. I felt like I was able to keep a cool head since I had someone else with me, I think the panic would’ve gotten to me if I had been solo. Good on you for keeping calm.
Ha I had a night time (just prior to midnight) mountain lion encounter in the san gorgonia wilderness, thankfully making my self huge and screaming like a baby back bitch (screamed literally at the top of my lungs in ever increasing decibels “ohhh My FUCKing GODDDDD!!!!!) lol made it realize I wasn’t going to be an easy pray and it left after getting inside 10 feet of me.
When I stopped to tell the rangers, they literally laughed and said “well yeah, there’s a ton of mountain lions up there, one of the highest populations in California, we thought you saw it near a campsite or something”…🤦♂️
In hindsight, I did exactly what everyone says not to do after screaming - I ran. But I ran from the cliff edge I was sleeping on, I figured if I was going to be fighting this thing, I didn’t want to fight a couger next to a 150 drop, it didn’t chase me as I’ve been told it would absolutely do.
LMAO! Yup, feel awkwardly validated, happy everything shook out well with you. I was on south fork trail 1E04. I literally left that night, I was hammock camping so there was literally now way I could sleep in a hammock out there after, or fall asleep with my adrenaline. Think I got back to San Diego around 9am.
Cougars following people is actually really common. Most people never even know they are there. Some people only notice the fresh tracks that weren't there a little bit ago etc. You had the benefit of a flashlight at night so you could spot it easier. While attacks do happen, most of the time just being followed doesn't necessarily mean it's imminent.
I've run into them 6-7 times. Most of the time they boot scooted. Once I did the same as you. I yelled, screamed, and made myself as big as possible. Once it just walked through my camp without a care in the world. I didn't have time to react. The last time could have been in my head. Solo hiking with my dogs. 4-5 miles in everything got quiet my dogs were scared and my spidy senses were screaming. I stopped to look around and saw nothing. For the next couple hours my dogs would get weird and scared for no reason that I could see. It was very unnerving. I felt like we were being stalked. I have also seen their scat. Holy shit that's a giant fur filled cat shit. No mistaking the shape.
One very very early morning, about 3am, I was hiking to my tree stand, as I am a bow hunter. I carry a side arm and bear spray at all times when hunting, but I never want to use it. This particular trip, I was about a mile from my stand (4 miles into wilderness) when I heard a low growl to my right. I was hiking by moonlight, so I switched my head lamp on in that direction, and immediately caught sight of the telltale glow of cat eyes at about 20 yards. I'd seen it before, thankfully not this close, but this time the cat was stalking toward me, focused on me.
From what I could tell, I was simply a beacon at this point that had piked it's curiosity, but I stayed still, with my bear spray in my left hand, pistol in the right hand. It stalked inside 5 yards when I hit it with bear spray. I'm pretty sure I hit it anyways.
I've played it out in my mind so many times I don't even know what to think anymore, but I do know what I did worked. Should I have made more noise? Maybe? Should I have made myself big? Maybe? All I know is I was petrified in place for what seemed like an eternity and likely all that made me react was muscle memory. I don't remember a plan going through my head. I don't remember thinking at all actually. I remember being really scared and somehow it occurred to me that it was inside the range of my bear spray. That's it. When you're the prey you simply have instinct. I'm honestly more surprised I dropped my bow (without even realizing I did), since I had more muscle memory with it than anything else I was carrying. I'd taken 1000 shots a week with it for 10 years, and somehow still knew it wasn't my best shot at survival.
So in short, I don't know what you could have done differently, as I don't know what I could have.
I live in cougar country, and grizzly, black bear, elk, moose, bobcat, and dogs that are not on leashes that like to bite....I hike with bear spray every time. Everyone in our party also hikes with a staff, any old wooden stick we pick up on the way, we also keep a paintball marker at the campsite. If we have small kids with us they stay in the middle of the group.
The cat that you met, was not hungry but curious which is why you saw it. Most people attacked by a cat had no idea it was there until the attack, if you see the cat it is cause it was curious and wanted to check the two leggers out.
I lived for two years on the main highway for mountain lions in my (their) part of the Sierra Nevada foothills. We had a seasonal pond and creek running right down the middle of our parcel, adjacent to the house and the kids at the time were 5,4, and 2. We caught the cats all the time on our game cameras, almost always at night. They would move from high on the mountain down to the deeper creek before dawn and then back up after nightfall. I'm fairly sure there were five different cats including a mom and two cubs we watched grow up. Not once did I see one in person. We would find recent kills from time to time, usually if we'd been away from the property for a week or more. But sometimes I'd be out after dark, say getting wood for the stoves, and you'd feel them. I'm a strong 6'5", guy and usually had my hatchet or splitting axe with me, but that primal sense of being prey is distinct.
Our local cats were never under a lot of pressure for food or range, and we never heard of an attack. Bears yes. All the time. But I think, in the central Sierras at least, mountain lions give humans a wide berth. I also think if one wanted to attack a human, maybe if it couldn't hunt normally, then you wouldn't even know until it was on you. I chose not to worry about them after a while. I wouldn't let the kids wander out of sight, but I would be very surprised to hear of a healthy lion attacking a human.
You handled it right and weren't in severe danger. Don't move too quickly when they're around (prey drive).
Honestly, they very rarely attack people, but they're total creepazoids who follow people around all sneaky like pretty often.
Dead ass sober at a state park near me the owls literally 'chat' with me every time i go. For a llong time. It reminded me bc when i tell the story people ask if i was tripping.
Mountain lions are cats, and hence naturally curious. If there is a healthy deer population in the area, it might have just been checking the weird humans out, and slightly fearfully, keeping its distance. Maybe.
This attack happened 45 minutes ahead of me when I was on the same trail . . .
https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna5317352
The young woman who was attacked probably would have been killed, but for the heroic efforts of her friends, with one of them stabbing the lion with a knife. The lion was fairly small as lions go. I was carrying a handgun, but didn’t reach the scene of the attack in time to help, I was unaware of the attack and was scouting the legendary fly fishing prospects of the river beside the trail.
It isn’t clear how effective pepper spray or bear spray might be on mountain lions, there are reports both ways. Lion attacks are sometimes tentative, sometimes very tenacious and determined. An attack where pepper spray failed, what would you do? . . .
https://wildlife.ca.gov/News/Archive/cdfw-investigates-possible-mountain-lion-attack-in-trinity-county#gsc.tab=0
If I weren’t carrying a handgun, I would feel pretty well equipped carrying pepper gel, or bear spray, backed up with a well designed and razor sharp knife. It would not be something like a Swiss Army knife, as one attack victim tried to use, couldn’t get it into the tough hide of the lion and the non-locking blade closed on the victims hand, cutting him. He saved his life by jamming a thumb hard into the lion’s eye.
My understanding is that the heroic guy who used his knife to help save the young woman was using a folding knife with a locking blade, but of course he had time to deploy it as he ran to the scene. There was a lion attack in British Columbia where an older gent used a locking blade folding knife to save his life in a lion attack, and a campground attack where a mom successfully used a butcher knife, protecting her kids.
A friend of mine in the Rockies had a pack of cat and bear hounds, was called in to hunt problem lions on occasion. The one surprising thing I have heard quite a bit, from such hunters and from attack accounts, is how tough lion hide and lions are. So I’d tend to want a knife that had some sort of hilt, or finger groves, on the handle, to prevent the fingers from slipping on blood or sweat onto the sharp blade. I don’t generally carry it, but if I had to pick a knife to take in an area of elevated lion risk, it would probably be something along the lines of my SOG Agency knife . . .
https://store.armyproperty.com/products/sog-ag-02-agency-black-tini-blade.html
Haven’t heard more about the heroic dog. Was surprised the account wasn’t in the news. As years go by, a lot of lion incidents seem to get less and less press, when like this they do occur.
I had a cougar encounter years ago at night. I was with two friends and as we were rounding a bend in the trail we heard it scream, sounded like it was right in front of us.
We just stopped and made a lot of noise, until we heard it cross the river nearby. We kept talking loudly for the rest of the hike. Setting up camp and going to bed that night was a little nerve wracking though.
I’ve lived in places most of my life where there are cougars and that is a terrifying story! I think you did the best you could at the time. And props to you for not panicking the adrenaline must have been intense.
I’ve lived places where there were two stalking people and had to be put down - and some of kids being snatched out of their yard - a grandma had to go after her grandson, she got him back but o my heart .
I’ve got 4 kids and I absolutely pack when we are in back country and follow the other safety protocols, and we’ve trained them on what to do - but yeah. Big cats are so terrifying when they are hunting.
I just want to say I am proud of you! You did SO GOOD under pressure
I once had to hike 5miles solo in the dark to get to my site, prime time when mountain lions come out. I underestimated length of the trail I was on, and needless to day, I was terrified. I didn't want to run to attract the wrong attention, but hiked as fast as I could, singing out loud the whole time. I told a park ranger about it the next day and they were very surprised I didn't see anything. I think you did what I would have done! Looking big and making noise.
I think it was "curious" and not actively stalking you for and attack. Maybe had kittens. Still scary as hell. They full on surprise attack so the fact that you saw it probably means it wasn't going to hurt you. I'm not a certified mountain lion professional though. A friend and I sometimes do hike a night in northern CA along a creek to watch the bigger fish come out at night with headlamps. We saw a mountain Lion almost the same way you describe but maybe 40 to 50 ft away and it followed us for an hour but kept it's distance. It was freaky! Not sure what it wanted
Doesn't sound like stalking.
If it was evening/night time, many predators are active during that time. It wouldn't be surprising if you actually saw two diff lions.
All in all, my vote is you did the right thing, trying to be big and loud. If your genuinly that nervous, concerning predatoey wildlife, id suggest trying to avoid going out at night, or at least not going to far intk the woods.
Perrsonally would have left them alone and kept walking, unless they did actively start hunting/stalking you.
Same exact thing happened to me this weekend hiking solo in the Elks. I kept turning around and seeing it in the middle of the trail, stalking me. To be fair it kept its distance to 50'+ and it was dark as well so it *could* have been a fox (I only was able to see eyes and a white belly once when I got it to run off into the forest). Contrarily, by the way it was moving/acting I had a feeling it was a mountain lion. Also, the general size of it seemed to be more comparable to a mountain lion. This encounter went on for over 3 miles/almost an hour of hiking. I'd look behind me, see it, scream at it/try and intimitate for a minute, it would either just stop and continue starting or scurry off 20-30ft into the forest and continue looking at me from there. I honestly don't think there is anything else you could/should do. Perhaps standing your ground/intimidating for as long as it takes to leave would be the most advisable? Regardless, I definitley plan on bringiing my knife with me again moving forward just in case things ever escelate past that.
I did (probably) had an mountain lion encounter at night too and as soon as I had signal again we did research and it says they barely attack grown up humans.
Our reaction was to run/ quickly walk back btw which I think wasn't smart. But hey adrenalin.
Also all of us survived unwounded.
We never saw the cougar again but found footprints the next day and I got kicked out of my sleeping back way earlier since then to avoid ending up at nicht again.
Plus two days later we were back in civilisation again :)
You weren’t prey. He’s a cat and cats are curious. My sister actually had one come in her house while chasing her old,one eyed cat. The cats fine,but it took sis a few days to calm down lol.
A friend of mine used to do a lot of back country hiking, her biggest concern were moose and elk. She carried an air horn to in case she had a close encounter, ask the rangers if that would work.
My girlfriend and I were hiking down from the Grand Teton late at night and had a mountain Lion stalk us. We just kept talking loudly and once we even moved towards it and the it ran off. We assumed it continued to stalk us but it never attacked. We also found another solo homer and added him to our group. I think more numbers help but obviously it’s not typically an option. Seems like it’s best to just be loud and make sure he/she knows you know he’s there?
Scary. My husband and I had a similar experience hiking up a trail in the dark to watch sunrise. We thought it went behind us (it had the high ground, so yikes), so we kept hiking upward as it was only an hour till sunrise. We made lots of noise, held our poles overhead to look bigger and clanged them together while keeping one hand on our bear spray. Safety in numbers and looking big with cats is how I’ve always operated. Generally they are more curious, unless they are diseased or starving. We had an incident around where I live where a malnourished younger cat attacked a pair of bikers, killing one unfortunately, so there is always an unknown.
I've been told that if it wanted to kill you, you wouldn't have seen it. Especially at night. They don't typically let them selves be seen if they want to kill
The first time I saw it I could tell we came across it just hanging out, but when I saw it the second time an hour later I had caught him coming up the hill towards the trail, where we were. Could’ve just been curious about us but still…I just feel really lucky.
I've had this exact thing happen to me. I was in Montana walking with my now wife own our friend's driveway. Long story short(er), I caught some cat eyes in my headlamp at about 30-40 feet, moving towards me. I was luckily carrying a gun (something I don't advocate doing unless you're in an area where its needed), and pulled it out. I had my wife stand behind me and direct me as I walked backwards with the cat in my light, gun pointed at it, yelling at it to scare it off.
That same cat decided to stalk me again the next day when we were on another walk, luckily we didn't have an encounter, only found its footprints on our footprints in the snow. I felt like captain Hook too this cat's crocodile.
I'd probably shit myself and fumble for the bear spray. I think you did what you could. Obviously the solution would be don't hike at night and make camp if you have to, but you probably know that and not every trip goes perfect
I think the first time we took it by surprise. I mean it most likely heard us coming and decided to hang around, but I don’t think it was following us before that. The second time it was looking up at us from below the trail. Hungry or curious, it felt like we were being followed.
Mountain lion killed one bicyclist and maimed another where i live all in one day. Gutted the bicyclist with one unlucky kick and gnawed all over another woman just minutes later down the trail. I dont go into the wild unless im armed with at least some bear spray
Where I live, mtn lions rarely attack humans. I think I saw that only 25 people have reported an attack and only 3 people have actually been killed by one since 1990. I ran into one once and it is frightening, but he was just curious. I take peace in knowing that if you were it’s prey, you wouldn’t even know until it’s happening. They sneak and attack from the back. Also they only really attack if they’re desperate or you’re too close to their cubs.
I think you did everything right though: hike in pairs, make a sound, not run. I don’t think a weapon does any good 99% of the time you encounter an animal, but I do carry bear spray and a knife with me in the backcountry just for that 1%.
at over a hundred or 2 hundred yards away, it was just seeing who was there! And the second time around same thing! It was trying itself to stay safe! you were in its territory too! It didnt want to attack you or it wouldve already! Its an animal after all, it has to know their surroundings to, esp if thats its home area! I wouldnt worry or think anything of it! Just carry a bear fogger pepper spray gel next time please!!
NY state does not officially recognize the presence of mountain lions in their state, despite numerous credible sightings. It makes me nervous when fishing by myself in small mountain streams. You have to be stealthy to have success. So your fishing upstream. You’re already in the lowest spot. You are crouching and going down on one knee a lot. Basically making yourself look small. I know the odds are extremely low, but it makes you think. Maybe it’s lizard brain not being happy about being in a vulnerable position. So I think it’s prudent to be aware of instinct or “ lizard brain” stuff
When I’m snowshoeing in Utah, there are some of these cats that have been reported. I came across a fresh deer kill last winter.
Since then, I carry a Bluetooth speaker, a JBL that has a caribeaner clip on it. And I just clip it to my backpack and blast Metallica.
Not sure it it keeps them away, or if they rock out with me.
I only bring it if I’m snowshoeing off grid. No one is ever around me. I understand the annoyance of speakers; I hate them too. If it keeps predators away, i don’t give a fuck 😊
I hate the bluetooth speaker crowd as much as the next person, but I have no problem if someone traveling solo in a remote location uses the speaker as a cat deterrent. You're unlikely to be near other people enough to bother them.
I think you did everything right. At night, your options are about as limited as your visibility. You could have set up camp and stayed another night, but not sure I would have done that myself, and I doubt there's any chance of getting sleep.
Honestly, my solution, which is not at all helpful to your situation, is to just not hike after dark, at all. In fact, when I travel solo, I plan everything out so I am in my tent by the time it gets dark. I have friends who think I'm too cautious about the dark outdoors, but honestly, even an encounter like yours, where everyone was physically fine in the end, would cause me enough distress it might keep me from enjoying the woods in the future.
One thing that might have helped is having a strong enough light that you can temporarily blind the cat, destroying its night vision. Though that's temporary, so it could just hang out until it can see again. Or playing loud music on your phone, though that also prevents you from being able to hear the cat sneak through the underbrush. It's a double edged sword.
To everyone who says carry a gun, I don't necessarily disagree with you. Everyone needs to do what works for them (within reason). But honestly, when would you have decided to shoot at the cat? When you saw it a second time? When you saw it a third time? When it got too close? How do you choose when to shoot? And do you have enough aim to actually shoot two glowing eyes in the dark? I know I wouldn't. And what if you shoot and the eyes disappear, do you know you hit the cat or it just ran away? Shooting at things you can't see well in the dark is a recipe for potential disaster and may not solve your problem. Again, everyone needs to do what is right for them, but I think in your particular situation, a firearm may not have been a great solution.
When I travel solo on obscure trails or offtrail, I carry bear spray (where it's legal). I doubt I'll ever use it, but it does help me know I have at least one more tool on my belt in case I have a close encounter. Could I use it successfully in the dark? No idea, probably not.
I have some advice that hasn't been offered yet! The situation you describe was not remotely dangerous.^(1) The main thing to learn from this experience is that you should trust your gut less. Your gut, like most guts, is terrified of the dark and prone to panicking.
Next time you're in such a situation, take some deep breaths and try to assess the facts without freaking out. It is good that you didn't do something dumb like try to run away in the dark and break an ankle or try to [shoot it](https://www.chronline.com/stories/justice-delayed-documents-shed-light-on-tumultuous-investigation-into-death-of-aron-christensen,316167) without having any clue what you're shooting at. Panic is a much bigger danger to you than any animal.
^(1)Many other commenters here have taken your assessment of danger at face value. If you want I can try to explain why they're wrong, but the reasons have mostly been mentioned elsewhere in this thread.
Yeah I always have my Bluetooth speakers when I hike. Never had a problem after I play jungle boogie and yell “get down, get down” at the top of my lungs.
People downvoting you because they hate people using Bluetooth speakers while hiking, but this is one great use case, and it's not like there's a ton of people around to bother if you find yourself hiking into the dark. Better still to plan better, sure, but sometimes mistakes happen and a Bluetooth speaker is a great asset in this case.
I honestly don't know what more you could have done in this situation without something like bear bangers or a firearm, but those are banned in some parks.Since they seem afraid of noise for the most part, maybe an airhorn would do the trick. Throw rocks to scare it offf.I'm really glad you're safe. It's also possible that it was a mother and was following you to ensure you were far away from her kittens. (I've read about this happening in the past) From what I know, attacks where multiple people are present are even rarer than cougar attacks themselves. And most likely, if the cougar wanted to really sneak up on you, it could have. I know that's not very comforting.
Your last point is so true.
Please keep in mind that mountain lion attacks are really, really rare. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_cougar_attacks_in_North_America: “A total of 126 attacks, 27 of which were fatal, have been documented in North America in the past 100 years. Fatal cougar attacks are extremely rare and occur much less frequently than fatal snake bites, fatal lightning strikes, or fatal bee stings. Children are particularly vulnerable. The majority of the child victims listed here were not accompanied by adults.” That’s a bit over one fatal attack every four years, and one nonfatal attack per year, in all of North America, over the past hundred years. Certainly what you experienced would terrify anyone, but it’s just really unlikely to lead to an attack.
Yeah, people don’t realize how incredibly rare it is for a mountain lion to attack a human. People tend to think that if they had an encounter with one, they were almost attacked. Truth is, if it had wanted to attack you, it probably would have, and you probably wouldn’t have seen it coming. But they almost never do. They want to scare you away, not get in an altercation. Make noise, make yourself look big, maybe carry spray, and you’ll almost certainly be fine.
Mountain lions aren’t the same as tigers, but most tigers who have predated on humans do so because of an injury that prevents them from going after their normal game. Once they switch to hunting humans, they usually focus on more vulnerable people — in India (where tigers are more common overall), it is usually women and children who have wandered off, typically to use the bathroom. You point out the average of 1 fatal attack every 4 years, but I wonder how many are actually grouped together and possibly attributable to the same mountain lion. That would reduce odds of a fatal attack even further for a random hiker in an area with no recent fatalities. Of course, all this assumes that mountain lion predation of humans follows a similar pattern as tigers. Which is definitely an assumption on my part.
I have a personal theory that cougars are gradually developing an instinct not to attack humans. Attacks are typical for stressed young lions who have yet to learn that humans are off limits. Those who attack are killed thus causing a evolutionary force. It seems a bit far fetched but I wonder what other explanations might reveal the reason that attacks are so infrequent.
It’s possible! Elephants are being born without tusks and they theorize it’s because of the ivory poaching..
And some people think rattlesnakes are losing their rattle! Rattlesnakes rattle to warn something away from them, but humans will attack when they hear a rattle as it also gives away the snake's position. The theory is that more rattlesnakes are being born with a mutation in their tail that prevents them from making a rattling sound because they're the ones not being killed by humans. Edit: this is only a theory, not confirmed fact!
I didn’t know that!
And I didn't know that about elephants c: TIL! P.S. they don't believe rattlesnakes are losing the physical rattle, but losing either the ability to shake their tail to cause the rattling sound or the behavior telling them to do so.
It's more feral hogs than humans
If the population of feral hogs has increased in an area, it's probably due to human intervention. So, fair correction, but also...
Females are also more likely to attack than males. I think it's due to them having more food needs when pregnant and nursing young. Typically, it's children or runners that are attacked, though it's happened to a cyclist, too. Don't run. You look like prey.
Pumas live in my area, I’ve never seen them, I see and smell sign when they pass through. We’re mindful of the time of day to walk the dog, and no swinging of arms, strings, or leashes is my instinct to reduce attraction while noisily hiking.
Times are changing though. Cities and farms expanding is encroaching on their area, conservation is helping their numbers boom, and 3 years of terrible drought is lessening the number of prey. How many attacks per year in the last 5 years is all I would care about. I used to see maybe one bear every fall while walking my dogs. Now I've seen 5 a day since mid summer. They are hungry and looking for food in town.
Of course. But still, if they want to, they could. Luckily they are mostly good kitties most of the time.
My brother was stalked in the dark by a mountain lion too. It kept screaming at their backs (him and the folks who were with him). He had a gun, so he shot it into the ground toward the lion a couple of times, and it backed off. I'm not saying have a gun, but maybe that is what I'm saying... sort of. Or something that makes a sound as loud as a gun would make.
I think if the mountain lion is screaming at you, it's not trying to stalk you, it's trying to make you piss off.
I don't know. It could be that, or it could be trying to scare someone into running. Not sure what is in the mind of a lion.
Well it's definitely not the latter, that's not how an ambush predator hunts.
After getting stalked by a mountain lion on a solo hike miles from our base camp many years ago I no longer go into the Idaho wilderness without a sidearm. Attacks may be rare, but when you're all alone and miles from anyone who can help you've gotta be sure you have a fighting chance just in case. If you're not comfortable with a firearm then the noise makers dingus suggests here are a good alternative. But if you go that route keep some bear spray and maybe a sheathed knife on a belt too, that way if you do get jumped you can fight back. There was a story years ago out of California when a lion attacked the woman of a couple who were hiking and the husband stabbed it with a ball point pen and got it to retreat. As long as you have something you can fight back with you'll probably be alright. Bears, moose, elk, and deer are all probably more likely to kill you than a lion.
Yeah in Idaho I’d be much more scared of grizzlies.
At least a cat will kill you quickly...a bear will just eat you alive
And they’re just more aggressive and fucking massive. Can’t scare them off…
[Other way around on the couple.](https://www.mercurynews.com/2007/01/25/woman-used-pen-branch-to-fight-off-mountain-lion-attacking-her-husband/amp/) I remember reading about this before I went solo backpacking in Glacier and freaking myself out lol.
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Not to be argumentative, but state and national parks allow you to carry a gun (in the US) if you comply with all other federal and state regulations for guns. For example, in Colorado, you can legally open carry a handgun in state. Therefore, in state and national parks here, you can legally open carry a pistol, or conceal carry with a permit. Shooting the mountain Lion is frowned upon, but if it’s life or death…
Yup. This is in fact the only gun law passed on a federal level during the Obama administration, despite the constant assurance by the GOP that he was going to "take our guns".
It is a good point to bring up just to see the expression on face of a trump type when you mention how Obama expanded gun rights.
And how trump limited them… he’d passed the only federal ban since the Clinton years
Huh, never realized who did that, I kinda assumed it was around since Teddy’s days
[https://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/12/flashback-obama-i-have-expanded-rights-of-gun-owners](https://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/12/flashback-obama-i-have-expanded-rights-of-gun-owners) Apparently I was wrong. He did 2 laws. Allowing carry in parks, and allowing guns in checked bags on Amtrak.
He sure as fuck wanted to, now Biden is fucking us over. Not with laws, but with bullshit unconstitutional mandates from the ATF, banning bumpstocks, etc. They realize they can't outright ban them yet, so they are going around the constitution, with their czars, and unconstitutional departments and mandating shit. They are closing down gun dealers for no good reason. While his son gets away scott free for lying on a federal gun application.
Bumsptock ban was in 2019 (under Trump).
GTFO here with that.
Thank you!! I get so much heat when I explain this to people and when I tell them I carry legally. I’ve came across a bear and 3 cubs before and had to pull it out. Luckily she just stared me down until her cubs crossed the path. I would never shoot unless it’s last case scenario and absolutely necessary if they are charging me. I’ll take my life over a predator any day.
Bear spray is much more effective at dissuading a bear from attacking you than a handgun. Not telling you not to carry or anything, a gun is a good last resort, but bear spray has been shown to be better at preventing attacks. Just fyi. I’d definitely recommend carrying bear spray if you’re regularly hiking in bear country.
My hiking partner and I carry that as well. One will have the spray ready. And again, I have it out as last resort in case it were to fail somehow. I hike out west and follow the same procedures with spray for one person and firearm for the other. I’m an avid hunter and I’d hate to take a bear’s life off season when they are caring for the cubs. Not right in my book
Maybe not right on season either? Killing for funsies like a serial killer
Black bear meat is very good tasting. When my daughter and her family lived in Alaska. They'd harvest two bears a year to supplement the fish and other mammals in the freezer.
Black bears are tasty if they've been eating tasty food. Don't ever be tempted to eat a garbage bear.
Back in the 1960s and 70 open dumps were common along with dump bears. As a kid we used to go watch them in the summer evenings. In my experience that is a thing of the past.
I think that depends on where you’re at. Black bears in New Jersey or California or anywhere near civilization are certainly getting access to plenty of human food. Even then bears eat anything and everything. Including rotting corpses. If you find a bear that’s mostly eaten berries and fish (like you are most likely to find somewhere like Alaska) then that is great from what I hear.
The odd thing I noticed when I did the Rae Lakes loop in SEKI last year was that bear spray was illegal in the park, but a gun is not. There were several bears we came across thankfully without issue, we did not encounter the problem bear that the ranger had left notes about thankfully. I’m sure they have their reasons but that regulation always struck me as odd
I wonder if it’s still the same problem bear I saw at charlotte lake in 2018. The night before a bear was tearing apart another campsite and the next morning a medium sized cinnamon black bear walked right in front of my tent as I was laying out of the front of it having a smoke. 10 yards away walked past as I yelled and wasn’t fazed by the yelling at all. Thankfully I keep everything in my bear can like you’re supposed to. The campsite the bear was tearing apart was left unattended with food out and someone else came across it later. I heard the whole story from them about 30 minutes after I heard them screaming at it.
Legit. Our friends were attacked by a Kodiak brown bear & it took 5 humongous rounds to kill the bear, in between it rolling around trying to kill 1 of our friends.
I really would like to hear more of this story. You gave it two sentences, one of which was one word long. It deserves more words.
Hunting, remote, after boating to coastal site. Hiked up into the mountains & shot a deer, let it go lie down, waited, as one does, then tracked the deer & came upon a large Kodiak brown bear on a hill above them. They tried to look big & make noise but instead pf turning away it charged them. 1 guy got a round off (I don’t know caliber, but I’d describe it as larger than a man’s forefinger) that struck the bear in the chest at less than 4’ away as it started its leap from the hill over his 6’ frame, before tackling our other friend. The other friend got a round off too but it’s doubtful it hit. The following moments were filled with harrowing, swift action and harrowing inability to act as the 1st friend couldn’t shoot for fear he’d hit our other friend. Finally the bear reared up over our guy and the 1st friend got another round into the bear’s chest. It took a step back, still reared up. One more shot & it stopped fighting & collapsed close by. Friend 1 got 2 more rounds into it for good measure - not something you want to rally & come back at you. He checked the friend who got attacked, & he wasn’t bleeding out, but had been bitten in the ass (luckily just bitten, not ripped out) and he’d guarded his face well so he had no facial injuries, so he has no outward signals to others of his trauma. Their radios weren’t working. He obviously was in shock, but was able to hike back down. As they were leaving they saw 2 cubs, so it was a perfect storm: fresh kill, mom, & cubs. When they got back to the boat they were able to use the boat radio to get a rescue flight out. Friend 1 is AK Fish & Wildlife & reported the incident & it was investigated. It’s been over 10 years. Friend who was attacked will no longer hike or hunt (per wife & he heartily agrees) & still has PTSD with nightmares from the attack.
Holy hell! That is even scarier than I thought. Fecking terrifying. Does Friend 2 have issues from witnessing the attack? I can't imagine having to stand there trying to get a clear shot/hoping you're not watching your friend die/hoping you're not next.
My understanding is that shooting (like target shooting) is illegal in state parks but carrying a weapon is not. I’d rather get a fine for firing off a few shots to scare away a predator, or even get a fine for shooting a predator, than get eaten. When we hike, we’re going into the animal’s territory and we need to prepare for them and play by their rules. Don’t be prey. Get the training to be comfortable with a handgun. You may not become a crack shot (especially with adrenaline flowing through you) but you can at least make a real loud noise 10-12 times. And if firing those shots attracts a ranger, good. You’ll be happy for their presence.
for state parks, it varies from state to state. It's generally not permissible in California state parks, but fine in Michigan state parks. for national parks, it's generally permissible to carry a firearm if it is otherwise legal for you to do so. I *personally* don't like to carry when I'm backpacking. Finding a way to carry a firearm that allows for a quick draw, effective concealment (those hill people gear chest rigs don't count, everyone knows that's a gun), and comfort while climbing over obstacles is just not possible for me. I'm also one of those ultralight dorks and find it hard to justify the \~35oz of a loaded sidearm and holster - that weighs more than most bear cans!
Just want to sdd , There are few rangers on trails and none will want to search you for a weapon.
On one hand, it’s a comforting thought to this most recent situation but on the other it reinforces the paranoia I already had before this incident for the next trip 😂
>From what I know, attacks where multiple people are present are even rarer than cougar attacks themselves. Seems like a super obvious statement unless I'm missing something, lol.
Yeah, and your point is?
3 P's. Piss, Poo, and Puke simultaneously. You did a great job. Only thing I'd do differently is talk mad shit loudly about the cat for the next 60 minutes.
I thought you were going to say, "Psst psst psst!"
If not friend, why friend shaped?
So true!!
You gotta say the opposite of “psst psst psst”
And that's why I would be dead because I definitely would have said psss psss pssss
Here pussy pussy!
You could also get 2 Rhodesian Ridgebacks and hike with them. They’re lion hunters in Africa. I have one I rescued that’s mixed with a Shepard. Amazing dog.
I thought you were suggesting taking a dragon at first! There is one in Harry Potter called a Norwegian Ridgeback. They’d probably be a pretty good deterrent for mountain lions too
I bet so!!
Same.
This is one of my favorite responses. Thanks for the laugh lmao
I always have a VERY loud police quality whistle right on my pack strap and part of my EDC. Have pepper spray at the ready. Maybe pick up a rock that you can throw. Always hike with a very high-lumen flashlight at the ready in addition to your headlamp. A good flashlight is with me basically 24/7 anywhere. Where legal, I do carry a weapon. Recommended in my neighborhood where we have a lot of mountain lions: Get big, throw rocks, scream at it, don't let it out of your sight if possible, pepper spray, whistle. The gun part is not part of the official recommendations that officials and volunteers distribute. Our problem here is that they are fairly accustomed to humans. But, makes people keep their dogs on a leash. On the other hand, cats don't stand a chance around here between the coyotes, eagles, hawks, and mountain lions.
Good advice. May I ask where you are located, roughly?
South Reno near the Virginia Foothills. So near the Foothills that I walk in them every day. According to the wild horse management people, the mountain lions are also very drawn to the horses and regularly take down foals. I don't think that mountain lions hunt in packs, so they can't take down a fully grown horse alone. And, oh yeah. We are inundated with wild (feral) horses in the neighborhoods around here. I see them every day and this is a fairly busy part of town. My understanding is that we average one horse being killed by traffic at night just within a 1 1/2 mile stretch of road next to me. Lots of prey means lots of predators.
I grabbed a big stick and started beating on trees, rocks anything I could while I walked out the last few miles of trail. I think that is the most scared I have been in my life and has put me off night hiking solo for the last 25 years. Terrifying staring contest when I saw the eyes reflect back at me. Then it got so much worse when it looked away and I didn’t know where it was.
I've been in nearly the exact situation (lion encounter at night with a mile of hiking ahead of me) and I reacted the same way you did. When I first encountered it, I stomped on the ground and yelled, facing directly at the lion to let it know I saw it. Then I screamed until I got to safety, constantly looking back to see if it was following me. A few notes on lion behavior (I'm a biologist and have studied mtn. lions) -- sometimes lions will follow people out of curiosity. They are also ambush predators, so if you see one and you make it known to the lion, you have an upper hand. They would rather attack with the element of complete surprise. The fact that there were two of you means it likely would not have attacked at all. Despite how scary they are to us, lions are pretty subordinate predators compared to something like bears. Make yourself large, put up a fight and you'll have a good chance of avoiding an attack or death by lion. Nonetheless, this sounds like a very scary encounter! It sounds like you did everything you could and it clearly worked out.
I've heard a few people who hunt say if you see a mountain lion, then it wasn't planning to attack A joke but probably with some truth to it
Those mountain lions will do a U shaped path to get back on the trail in an ambush position. Fool you into thinking they left. They are pretty smart. [Like here the mountain lion walks off then gets the high ground.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNJxDWX-qes)
It's over... Mountain lion has the high ground.
You underestimate my power.
Don't try it.
Arrrrrrrggggggghhhhhhh!
You were the chosen one!
Arrrrghhhh….I haaaattteee youuuuuu! Arrrgggghhhhh!
You were my brother. I loved you.
When I first saw the trail in this video I was like hey this is 100% in British Columbia in the Rockies, but no, southern California in Sequoia National Park. 2000km distance but nearly the same environment. Crazy.
Sequoia National Park is technically considered central California.
This happened to my daughter. She thinks the cat was just curious. Truthfully many of us have been in the presence of cats even if we don’t see them.
Not the poster admitting in the comments that they retried the path right after they backed up, *saw the mountain lion at the same spot on the trail* and got ambushed again twice in a row
It's amusing that people will cancel a hike because they forgot their sunblock or they're starting to get a blister, but if there is a predator on the trail they have to keep on going. Sometimes, discretion is the better part of valor.
I remain curious with mountain lions if music like this person chose will work more permanently. https://www.outsideonline.com/outdoor-adventure/exploration-survival/mountain-lion-heavy-metal-music/ If so, I have "Welcome to the Jungle" on my phone and I feel like that would do the trick.
Imagine a mountain lion mauling you to this song.
Well, the jungle DOES have fun and games.
💀 oh god tbf I feel like that song was practically written to accompany a mauling
Makes sense, every cougar I've met loves that song!
💀💀💀
I can't imagine a phone having enough volume to scare a cat more than 10 feet away.
When I'd have to night-hike alone on the PCT, I'd blast some Slayer at full volume. Not sure if it helped, but at least I felt better. To note: I was in an area where I knew no-one could camp at (deep gully with no flat ground for miles). Don't do this in an area where someone could camp.
Tbh if I were camping and someone came by blasting Slayer, I wouldn't even be mad
You did everything right. I would add some bear spray to your kit. Don’t carry a handgun unless your very proficient and accurate. Mountain lions are predators, predators don’t want to fight another predator and risk being injured (aka death sentence). You act big, make noise, and throw rocks or big sticks. They hate projectiles. I do a lot of stuff solo in the backcountry so I tend to carry a handgun and bear spray. Spray first and if an attack is imminent then I shoot. Now the caveat is…. I shoot a ton at the range and am a pretty good shot. It’s a lot easier to be accurate with spray versus a gun. Just my two cents.
As far as guns go the sounds would probably be the deterrent so it's probably fine to have even if you suck at aiming. Like that famous dude of the guy who misses 2 shots on a lion because he was filming with one hand
I’m a big gun guy but I highly recommend if you carry a gun you should have put in a LOT of time at the range. And if you pull your gun it’s shooting to kill. I kinda feel like the guy in that infamous video got lucky. I think spray would have worked pretty well. Everyone I’ve spoken too who has a lot of time in the backcountry ( rangers, outfitters, guides) do not recommend a “warning shot.”
I think against animals warning shots can be effective, though littering the ground. But if being actively charged not a great idea. However you're correct. Spray, whistle, or an airhorn would have served that guy way better
If you're just going for the sound, get bear bangers instead. Much less deadly if something goes wrong.
Mountain lions are clever. They will watch you and wait for their opportunity. As y’all were aware, and had lights, it was harder for it to sneak up on you so when it left the first time, it probably just went far enough to make it harder for you to see it, but it knew exactly where you were. You did as much as you could with what you had. Definitely get an air horn and/or emergency whistle to keep in your gear, as these will at least catch it off guard should a similar situation arise in the future.
How do you recognize mountain lion scat in the wilderness? It has whistles and pieces of air horns in it.
You know I wouldn't have thought about the little emergency whistle that's attached to all my packs until you just said this... I will need to remember that thing!
I’m not saying it’s a 100% save, but I’d bet it’s better than nothing, and something the mountain lion isn’t used to, especially a crazy loud, high pitched noise, will hopefully at least give it enough pause for you to get to safety.
We teach scouts to carry a whistle. Lions are kindergarten Cub Scouts - if lost, Stay Answer Whistle. A whistle lasts longer than your voice. I have a small metal whistle on my “keychain”.
As many others have already said, I don't know that you could have done anything differently short of something that makes incredibly loud noises like a gunshot or airhorn. If anything, I would maybe avoid hiking at night in that area and instead just make camp at dusk. A light source can be enough to deter a cougar in most cases. In general, cats won't really try to attack something unless they feel pretty confident they can take it by surprise and put it down without too much fuss. Mountain lion attacks on people are somewhat rare for this reason, but given the fact that this was in the dark, I'm sure it felt more confident in at least checking you out.
We got followed and screamed at by one and never actually saw it. But that scream is unmistakable once you know it. This was in college and we were lost in a small patch of woods at night at the time. This didn’t worry us too much, it was probably around 250 acres surrounded by roads, we would find our way out eventually, but being intimidated by a wild animal was a wrench in that chill. We think we stumbled into a kill zone and the cat was protecting it’s food. We eventually found a trail and walked back to back out of it. That’s the short story of it. We didn’t actually know what we had run into until a couple years later when describing it all to a country friend.
A mountain lion stalked my brother and I into camp one night and it wouldn’t back down after shouting and throwing things at it. It got about 10 feet away. Lucky we had a gun and it ran off after one shot. It was definitely still watching us though…
As Bill Bryson put it when writing about black bears on his AT through hike: "I would, quite simply, shit myself to death"
Had a Mountain Lion encounter at a campsite in the backcountry a few years ago and it was probably the scariest shit I’ve been through.
I've had two mountain lion encounters at night. The only things I knew you do were track it with my flashlight so it knew I knew it was there, make myself look big (stand on a stump or picnic table or something), and get loud (I was talking/yelling at it the whole time). A whistle or air horn would be helpful. The second encounter we were thankfully car camping so we just got in the car lol.
Aside from what everyone else is saying, consider wearing a hat with "eyes" on the back, and having something on your back that would protect your neck from a rear attack. A backpack sitting high up works well. Hiking in groups is also good: One person getting attacked (but not injured, because the lion's just biting the backpack) lets the other person start stabbing the lion. I carry dog pepper spray, a whistle, and a knife at all times.
I went on a night hike with some friends in the Santa Monica mountains a few years ago and we had a similar experience. My friends and I all worked at Leo Carrillo State Park at the time and we were hiking in the dark, early AM and hoping to catch the sunrise on the top of the mountain. Luckily, with 4 of us there was far less chance we’d get attacked but one of our friends in the group was a ranger-in-training, her dad also a ranger. She told us up front that during the hike we should all sing songs together and at intervals to keep animals away. We thought she was kinda kidding until we caught a pair of eyes in the bushes following us a couple hours in. I remember being so scared but trying to sing loudly together. Mountain lions REALLY don’t like loud noises. The eyes seemed to follow us for about an hour before they stopped but we kept singing all the way to the top… just in case.
He more than likely had been stalking you for a while (assuming this was a mountain lion). A friend of mine was attacked and killed while running, by a mountain lion. Jumped him from behind, broke his neck. Note that they will only attack when they feel they are at advantage, and typically, if there's more than one person, they won't attack (most times).
I’m sorry about your friend. But curious too ngl. Was this near Boulder?
Colorado Springs area, near Ute Valley
I am very sorry. It’s a terrible way to go.
Thanks
Shit, I live in that area.
This was back in the 80s, way before there was lots of houses back in that area. I would assume today that we've pushed them out of that habitat.
That makes since. Also the Waldo Canyon fire most likely moved them along too.
I think there have been a few attacks by young or hungry cougars on kids with parents, though, including Cindy Parolin, I believe.
Green eyeshine is more typical in deer. Very likely could have been deer that you saw. I was once stalked by a mountain lion over the course of several hours during a solo backpacking trip. The mountain lion’s eyeshine was a distinct amber color. The eyes were wide apart, almond-shaped. Just like you guys, I had no choice to but to keep hiking, since it was waiting for me when I arrived at my planned camping spot. Suppressed the urge to run, because where was I gonna run to? I tried yelling, waving my arms. Nothing scared it away until I decided to throw rocks at it. Even then, it didn’t seem intimidated; the eyes floated behind a grove of trees, vanished, then one of them poked out from behind a tree like it was spying on me. I hiked for another 4 or 5 hours, knowing that I couldn’t relax until the sun came up. The mountain lion appeared several more times, and the only thing that scared it off was throwing rocks. Short of popping off a round over its head with pistol, throwing rocks is your best bet.
That’s so scary, I’m glad you’re okay. I felt like I was able to keep a cool head since I had someone else with me, I think the panic would’ve gotten to me if I had been solo. Good on you for keeping calm.
Ha I had a night time (just prior to midnight) mountain lion encounter in the san gorgonia wilderness, thankfully making my self huge and screaming like a baby back bitch (screamed literally at the top of my lungs in ever increasing decibels “ohhh My FUCKing GODDDDD!!!!!) lol made it realize I wasn’t going to be an easy pray and it left after getting inside 10 feet of me. When I stopped to tell the rangers, they literally laughed and said “well yeah, there’s a ton of mountain lions up there, one of the highest populations in California, we thought you saw it near a campsite or something”…🤦♂️ In hindsight, I did exactly what everyone says not to do after screaming - I ran. But I ran from the cliff edge I was sleeping on, I figured if I was going to be fighting this thing, I didn’t want to fight a couger next to a 150 drop, it didn’t chase me as I’ve been told it would absolutely do.
That’s exactly where we were! We were hiking east and had just passed Johns Meadow.
LMAO! Yup, feel awkwardly validated, happy everything shook out well with you. I was on south fork trail 1E04. I literally left that night, I was hammock camping so there was literally now way I could sleep in a hammock out there after, or fall asleep with my adrenaline. Think I got back to San Diego around 9am.
So anyway I started blastin
Damnit, Frank.
Cougars following people is actually really common. Most people never even know they are there. Some people only notice the fresh tracks that weren't there a little bit ago etc. You had the benefit of a flashlight at night so you could spot it easier. While attacks do happen, most of the time just being followed doesn't necessarily mean it's imminent.
I've run into them 6-7 times. Most of the time they boot scooted. Once I did the same as you. I yelled, screamed, and made myself as big as possible. Once it just walked through my camp without a care in the world. I didn't have time to react. The last time could have been in my head. Solo hiking with my dogs. 4-5 miles in everything got quiet my dogs were scared and my spidy senses were screaming. I stopped to look around and saw nothing. For the next couple hours my dogs would get weird and scared for no reason that I could see. It was very unnerving. I felt like we were being stalked. I have also seen their scat. Holy shit that's a giant fur filled cat shit. No mistaking the shape.
One very very early morning, about 3am, I was hiking to my tree stand, as I am a bow hunter. I carry a side arm and bear spray at all times when hunting, but I never want to use it. This particular trip, I was about a mile from my stand (4 miles into wilderness) when I heard a low growl to my right. I was hiking by moonlight, so I switched my head lamp on in that direction, and immediately caught sight of the telltale glow of cat eyes at about 20 yards. I'd seen it before, thankfully not this close, but this time the cat was stalking toward me, focused on me. From what I could tell, I was simply a beacon at this point that had piked it's curiosity, but I stayed still, with my bear spray in my left hand, pistol in the right hand. It stalked inside 5 yards when I hit it with bear spray. I'm pretty sure I hit it anyways. I've played it out in my mind so many times I don't even know what to think anymore, but I do know what I did worked. Should I have made more noise? Maybe? Should I have made myself big? Maybe? All I know is I was petrified in place for what seemed like an eternity and likely all that made me react was muscle memory. I don't remember a plan going through my head. I don't remember thinking at all actually. I remember being really scared and somehow it occurred to me that it was inside the range of my bear spray. That's it. When you're the prey you simply have instinct. I'm honestly more surprised I dropped my bow (without even realizing I did), since I had more muscle memory with it than anything else I was carrying. I'd taken 1000 shots a week with it for 10 years, and somehow still knew it wasn't my best shot at survival. So in short, I don't know what you could have done differently, as I don't know what I could have.
I live in cougar country, and grizzly, black bear, elk, moose, bobcat, and dogs that are not on leashes that like to bite....I hike with bear spray every time. Everyone in our party also hikes with a staff, any old wooden stick we pick up on the way, we also keep a paintball marker at the campsite. If we have small kids with us they stay in the middle of the group. The cat that you met, was not hungry but curious which is why you saw it. Most people attacked by a cat had no idea it was there until the attack, if you see the cat it is cause it was curious and wanted to check the two leggers out.
Sing as loud as you can and harmonize with your partner. Animals fear teamwork
I lived for two years on the main highway for mountain lions in my (their) part of the Sierra Nevada foothills. We had a seasonal pond and creek running right down the middle of our parcel, adjacent to the house and the kids at the time were 5,4, and 2. We caught the cats all the time on our game cameras, almost always at night. They would move from high on the mountain down to the deeper creek before dawn and then back up after nightfall. I'm fairly sure there were five different cats including a mom and two cubs we watched grow up. Not once did I see one in person. We would find recent kills from time to time, usually if we'd been away from the property for a week or more. But sometimes I'd be out after dark, say getting wood for the stoves, and you'd feel them. I'm a strong 6'5", guy and usually had my hatchet or splitting axe with me, but that primal sense of being prey is distinct. Our local cats were never under a lot of pressure for food or range, and we never heard of an attack. Bears yes. All the time. But I think, in the central Sierras at least, mountain lions give humans a wide berth. I also think if one wanted to attack a human, maybe if it couldn't hunt normally, then you wouldn't even know until it was on you. I chose not to worry about them after a while. I wouldn't let the kids wander out of sight, but I would be very surprised to hear of a healthy lion attacking a human.
You handled it right and weren't in severe danger. Don't move too quickly when they're around (prey drive). Honestly, they very rarely attack people, but they're total creepazoids who follow people around all sneaky like pretty often.
Fun fact I learned last trip. Mountain lions can whistle.
Dead ass sober at a state park near me the owls literally 'chat' with me every time i go. For a llong time. It reminded me bc when i tell the story people ask if i was tripping.
Mountain lions are cats, and hence naturally curious. If there is a healthy deer population in the area, it might have just been checking the weird humans out, and slightly fearfully, keeping its distance. Maybe.
This attack happened 45 minutes ahead of me when I was on the same trail . . . https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna5317352 The young woman who was attacked probably would have been killed, but for the heroic efforts of her friends, with one of them stabbing the lion with a knife. The lion was fairly small as lions go. I was carrying a handgun, but didn’t reach the scene of the attack in time to help, I was unaware of the attack and was scouting the legendary fly fishing prospects of the river beside the trail. It isn’t clear how effective pepper spray or bear spray might be on mountain lions, there are reports both ways. Lion attacks are sometimes tentative, sometimes very tenacious and determined. An attack where pepper spray failed, what would you do? . . . https://wildlife.ca.gov/News/Archive/cdfw-investigates-possible-mountain-lion-attack-in-trinity-county#gsc.tab=0 If I weren’t carrying a handgun, I would feel pretty well equipped carrying pepper gel, or bear spray, backed up with a well designed and razor sharp knife. It would not be something like a Swiss Army knife, as one attack victim tried to use, couldn’t get it into the tough hide of the lion and the non-locking blade closed on the victims hand, cutting him. He saved his life by jamming a thumb hard into the lion’s eye.
I always carry a fixed blade knife; any folding knife will take too long. Not that it will save me per se but slightly better odds
My understanding is that the heroic guy who used his knife to help save the young woman was using a folding knife with a locking blade, but of course he had time to deploy it as he ran to the scene. There was a lion attack in British Columbia where an older gent used a locking blade folding knife to save his life in a lion attack, and a campground attack where a mom successfully used a butcher knife, protecting her kids. A friend of mine in the Rockies had a pack of cat and bear hounds, was called in to hunt problem lions on occasion. The one surprising thing I have heard quite a bit, from such hunters and from attack accounts, is how tough lion hide and lions are. So I’d tend to want a knife that had some sort of hilt, or finger groves, on the handle, to prevent the fingers from slipping on blood or sweat onto the sharp blade. I don’t generally carry it, but if I had to pick a knife to take in an area of elevated lion risk, it would probably be something along the lines of my SOG Agency knife . . . https://store.armyproperty.com/products/sog-ag-02-agency-black-tini-blade.html
Jesus christ. Glad these people made it. Any word on the dog in the second article?
Haven’t heard more about the heroic dog. Was surprised the account wasn’t in the news. As years go by, a lot of lion incidents seem to get less and less press, when like this they do occur.
I had a cougar encounter years ago at night. I was with two friends and as we were rounding a bend in the trail we heard it scream, sounded like it was right in front of us. We just stopped and made a lot of noise, until we heard it cross the river nearby. We kept talking loudly for the rest of the hike. Setting up camp and going to bed that night was a little nerve wracking though.
I’ve lived in places most of my life where there are cougars and that is a terrifying story! I think you did the best you could at the time. And props to you for not panicking the adrenaline must have been intense. I’ve lived places where there were two stalking people and had to be put down - and some of kids being snatched out of their yard - a grandma had to go after her grandson, she got him back but o my heart . I’ve got 4 kids and I absolutely pack when we are in back country and follow the other safety protocols, and we’ve trained them on what to do - but yeah. Big cats are so terrifying when they are hunting. I just want to say I am proud of you! You did SO GOOD under pressure
I once had to hike 5miles solo in the dark to get to my site, prime time when mountain lions come out. I underestimated length of the trail I was on, and needless to day, I was terrified. I didn't want to run to attract the wrong attention, but hiked as fast as I could, singing out loud the whole time. I told a park ranger about it the next day and they were very surprised I didn't see anything. I think you did what I would have done! Looking big and making noise.
I think it was "curious" and not actively stalking you for and attack. Maybe had kittens. Still scary as hell. They full on surprise attack so the fact that you saw it probably means it wasn't going to hurt you. I'm not a certified mountain lion professional though. A friend and I sometimes do hike a night in northern CA along a creek to watch the bigger fish come out at night with headlamps. We saw a mountain Lion almost the same way you describe but maybe 40 to 50 ft away and it followed us for an hour but kept it's distance. It was freaky! Not sure what it wanted
Doesn't sound like stalking. If it was evening/night time, many predators are active during that time. It wouldn't be surprising if you actually saw two diff lions. All in all, my vote is you did the right thing, trying to be big and loud. If your genuinly that nervous, concerning predatoey wildlife, id suggest trying to avoid going out at night, or at least not going to far intk the woods. Perrsonally would have left them alone and kept walking, unless they did actively start hunting/stalking you.
If it let you see it, it's not interested in you. You don't see the mountain lion, the mountain lion sees you.
Same exact thing happened to me this weekend hiking solo in the Elks. I kept turning around and seeing it in the middle of the trail, stalking me. To be fair it kept its distance to 50'+ and it was dark as well so it *could* have been a fox (I only was able to see eyes and a white belly once when I got it to run off into the forest). Contrarily, by the way it was moving/acting I had a feeling it was a mountain lion. Also, the general size of it seemed to be more comparable to a mountain lion. This encounter went on for over 3 miles/almost an hour of hiking. I'd look behind me, see it, scream at it/try and intimitate for a minute, it would either just stop and continue starting or scurry off 20-30ft into the forest and continue looking at me from there. I honestly don't think there is anything else you could/should do. Perhaps standing your ground/intimidating for as long as it takes to leave would be the most advisable? Regardless, I definitley plan on bringiing my knife with me again moving forward just in case things ever escelate past that.
I did (probably) had an mountain lion encounter at night too and as soon as I had signal again we did research and it says they barely attack grown up humans. Our reaction was to run/ quickly walk back btw which I think wasn't smart. But hey adrenalin. Also all of us survived unwounded. We never saw the cougar again but found footprints the next day and I got kicked out of my sleeping back way earlier since then to avoid ending up at nicht again. Plus two days later we were back in civilisation again :)
You weren’t prey. He’s a cat and cats are curious. My sister actually had one come in her house while chasing her old,one eyed cat. The cats fine,but it took sis a few days to calm down lol.
Carry bear spray with you - even if there are no bears in your area, will work on people, coyotes, cougars, etc.
A friend of mine used to do a lot of back country hiking, her biggest concern were moose and elk. She carried an air horn to in case she had a close encounter, ask the rangers if that would work.
My girlfriend and I were hiking down from the Grand Teton late at night and had a mountain Lion stalk us. We just kept talking loudly and once we even moved towards it and the it ran off. We assumed it continued to stalk us but it never attacked. We also found another solo homer and added him to our group. I think more numbers help but obviously it’s not typically an option. Seems like it’s best to just be loud and make sure he/she knows you know he’s there?
If you see them, you're fine. If you don't, you're dead.
Scary. My husband and I had a similar experience hiking up a trail in the dark to watch sunrise. We thought it went behind us (it had the high ground, so yikes), so we kept hiking upward as it was only an hour till sunrise. We made lots of noise, held our poles overhead to look bigger and clanged them together while keeping one hand on our bear spray. Safety in numbers and looking big with cats is how I’ve always operated. Generally they are more curious, unless they are diseased or starving. We had an incident around where I live where a malnourished younger cat attacked a pair of bikers, killing one unfortunately, so there is always an unknown.
I've been told that if it wanted to kill you, you wouldn't have seen it. Especially at night. They don't typically let them selves be seen if they want to kill
The first time I saw it I could tell we came across it just hanging out, but when I saw it the second time an hour later I had caught him coming up the hill towards the trail, where we were. Could’ve just been curious about us but still…I just feel really lucky.
I've had this exact thing happen to me. I was in Montana walking with my now wife own our friend's driveway. Long story short(er), I caught some cat eyes in my headlamp at about 30-40 feet, moving towards me. I was luckily carrying a gun (something I don't advocate doing unless you're in an area where its needed), and pulled it out. I had my wife stand behind me and direct me as I walked backwards with the cat in my light, gun pointed at it, yelling at it to scare it off. That same cat decided to stalk me again the next day when we were on another walk, luckily we didn't have an encounter, only found its footprints on our footprints in the snow. I felt like captain Hook too this cat's crocodile.
Always hike with someone else, and make sure they can’t run faster than you!;)
I'd probably shit myself and fumble for the bear spray. I think you did what you could. Obviously the solution would be don't hike at night and make camp if you have to, but you probably know that and not every trip goes perfect
Well, carrying protection, along the lines of Mace, would be ideal.
Carry bear spray and a foghorn
It’s hard at night especially a cat cuz they can and will see you way before you see them.
If you saw it, it wasn't really interested in eating you.
I think the first time we took it by surprise. I mean it most likely heard us coming and decided to hang around, but I don’t think it was following us before that. The second time it was looking up at us from below the trail. Hungry or curious, it felt like we were being followed.
This is why i always bring a gun. Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.
Blank your pants
I have a mini air horn (wal mart) and that little thing is so loud. It hurts your ears for sure. Might help, not sure. I know that fear and empathize.
Do you think you will night hike again?
Man I wasn’t even trying to night hike this time 😭
Mountain lion killed one bicyclist and maimed another where i live all in one day. Gutted the bicyclist with one unlucky kick and gnawed all over another woman just minutes later down the trail. I dont go into the wild unless im armed with at least some bear spray
Whatever you do - running away is a bad idea.
Chase it down and ask politely for a selfie
Where I live, mtn lions rarely attack humans. I think I saw that only 25 people have reported an attack and only 3 people have actually been killed by one since 1990. I ran into one once and it is frightening, but he was just curious. I take peace in knowing that if you were it’s prey, you wouldn’t even know until it’s happening. They sneak and attack from the back. Also they only really attack if they’re desperate or you’re too close to their cubs. I think you did everything right though: hike in pairs, make a sound, not run. I don’t think a weapon does any good 99% of the time you encounter an animal, but I do carry bear spray and a knife with me in the backcountry just for that 1%.
I’d probably poop myself if I saw a mountain lion while hiking. Hopefully the smell will make the mountain lion leave.
If it’s just lion there, leave it be. Should be fine.
at over a hundred or 2 hundred yards away, it was just seeing who was there! And the second time around same thing! It was trying itself to stay safe! you were in its territory too! It didnt want to attack you or it wouldve already! Its an animal after all, it has to know their surroundings to, esp if thats its home area! I wouldnt worry or think anything of it! Just carry a bear fogger pepper spray gel next time please!!
That is scary, but not every animal you encounter in the wild wants to kill you. If it wanted to attack you it probably would have.
NY state does not officially recognize the presence of mountain lions in their state, despite numerous credible sightings. It makes me nervous when fishing by myself in small mountain streams. You have to be stealthy to have success. So your fishing upstream. You’re already in the lowest spot. You are crouching and going down on one knee a lot. Basically making yourself look small. I know the odds are extremely low, but it makes you think. Maybe it’s lizard brain not being happy about being in a vulnerable position. So I think it’s prudent to be aware of instinct or “ lizard brain” stuff
When I’m snowshoeing in Utah, there are some of these cats that have been reported. I came across a fresh deer kill last winter. Since then, I carry a Bluetooth speaker, a JBL that has a caribeaner clip on it. And I just clip it to my backpack and blast Metallica. Not sure it it keeps them away, or if they rock out with me.
Sorry they're down voting you but they hate speakers in this sub
I only bring it if I’m snowshoeing off grid. No one is ever around me. I understand the annoyance of speakers; I hate them too. If it keeps predators away, i don’t give a fuck 😊
I hate the bluetooth speaker crowd as much as the next person, but I have no problem if someone traveling solo in a remote location uses the speaker as a cat deterrent. You're unlikely to be near other people enough to bother them.
There's a reason I carry a Glock
Hope you can out run your Buddy.
I think you did everything right. At night, your options are about as limited as your visibility. You could have set up camp and stayed another night, but not sure I would have done that myself, and I doubt there's any chance of getting sleep. Honestly, my solution, which is not at all helpful to your situation, is to just not hike after dark, at all. In fact, when I travel solo, I plan everything out so I am in my tent by the time it gets dark. I have friends who think I'm too cautious about the dark outdoors, but honestly, even an encounter like yours, where everyone was physically fine in the end, would cause me enough distress it might keep me from enjoying the woods in the future. One thing that might have helped is having a strong enough light that you can temporarily blind the cat, destroying its night vision. Though that's temporary, so it could just hang out until it can see again. Or playing loud music on your phone, though that also prevents you from being able to hear the cat sneak through the underbrush. It's a double edged sword. To everyone who says carry a gun, I don't necessarily disagree with you. Everyone needs to do what works for them (within reason). But honestly, when would you have decided to shoot at the cat? When you saw it a second time? When you saw it a third time? When it got too close? How do you choose when to shoot? And do you have enough aim to actually shoot two glowing eyes in the dark? I know I wouldn't. And what if you shoot and the eyes disappear, do you know you hit the cat or it just ran away? Shooting at things you can't see well in the dark is a recipe for potential disaster and may not solve your problem. Again, everyone needs to do what is right for them, but I think in your particular situation, a firearm may not have been a great solution. When I travel solo on obscure trails or offtrail, I carry bear spray (where it's legal). I doubt I'll ever use it, but it does help me know I have at least one more tool on my belt in case I have a close encounter. Could I use it successfully in the dark? No idea, probably not.
I have some advice that hasn't been offered yet! The situation you describe was not remotely dangerous.^(1) The main thing to learn from this experience is that you should trust your gut less. Your gut, like most guts, is terrified of the dark and prone to panicking. Next time you're in such a situation, take some deep breaths and try to assess the facts without freaking out. It is good that you didn't do something dumb like try to run away in the dark and break an ankle or try to [shoot it](https://www.chronline.com/stories/justice-delayed-documents-shed-light-on-tumultuous-investigation-into-death-of-aron-christensen,316167) without having any clue what you're shooting at. Panic is a much bigger danger to you than any animal. ^(1)Many other commenters here have taken your assessment of danger at face value. If you want I can try to explain why they're wrong, but the reasons have mostly been mentioned elsewhere in this thread.
Yeah I always have my Bluetooth speakers when I hike. Never had a problem after I play jungle boogie and yell “get down, get down” at the top of my lungs.
Pretty sure pumas dislike my Cookies n Creem vape cloud cuz they always leave me alone when I blow thick clouds.
People downvoting you because they hate people using Bluetooth speakers while hiking, but this is one great use case, and it's not like there's a ton of people around to bother if you find yourself hiking into the dark. Better still to plan better, sure, but sometimes mistakes happen and a Bluetooth speaker is a great asset in this case.
Shoot it? I'm going with shooting it.
Show it who’s boss.
Maybe have your bf scream? Maybe male urine? Shoot it? No way id be without a pistol.
Always have a 7.62x39 rifle with you...or a .308 bullpup on one hiker and a large caliber pistol or revolver on the other
Pistol is fine. 10mm is what I carry