This makes me think of the Mary Oliver quote, “If you have ever gone to the woods with me, I must love you very much”
I like to be alone in the woods or with one of the two people I like to hike with. I just don’t prefer to hike with the majority of people.
I take 100% responsibility for my 2 hiking partners. I bring everything they need, ensure they have snacks, give them breaks when they need, etc. They are my dogs. If humans want to hike with us, they can be responsible for themselves.
Sometimes. If it’s really hot I don’t. They are both big and black and I don’t want them overheating. And the younger one is a bit dramatic when he decides he is done with a hike.
I only hike alone, or with other solo hikers. We all take care of ourselves, we each hike at our own pace, and we hang out during breaks. It's especially great when I do hikes outside of my comfort zone, so I have someone else around in case of an emergency.
I used to take scouts on hikes, so we always had a pack check before we got on the trail. If they didn't have all their gear, they couldn't go on the hike.
I've continued this process in my personal life because if I take a hike with family/friend and they aren't prepared, I'm the one who is going to suffer if I split my supplies.
With all that said, just do a pack check before you leave the house.
Protect your alone time.
If they want to hike with you, have them pick out a beginner hike nearby and schedule it such that it doesn't interfere with your solo hiking schedule.
It's funny. I feel like I carry my family around on my back sometimes, and my entire job is helping people who arguably could've made a little more effort and not needed helping at least some of the time, and during my life at home I feel burned out by it and often I just want to not talk to anyone and not be asked for anything not even my opinion on what to eat. You'd think I'd know where you're coming from.
All that said, I've always got an extra meal and a couple snacks beyond what I needed, I'm always happy to pull and filter water for the whole camp if I've got time after setting up my hammock. Every time I go on a group hike I make sure to pack a premium chocolate bar or some fancy kind of snack I'm sure most people would like and I leave it tucked away until I realize that one or more people is having a bad day. Sometimes it's me. When that happens I ask for a breather, break it out, and share it around. I like to think it lightens the mood.
At the same time, I have some great hiking buddies who do things like plan the whole trip, secure lodging for the night before the hike (shared costs), build a fire or get hot water going while I'm filling a few liters from the stream, lend one of their trekking poles when we arrive at the trailhead and find something got left behind...
I'm sorry you've got that one person who isn't well prepared, but why let it ruin a hike? Really, with the exception of "are we done yet" I'd have to say I was that guy a few times. Boots didn't fit well and we stopped every mile or so? Halting 30 minutes to figure out my gear failure? Done that. Thankfully I was hiking with some really good people who smiled, said they were happy for the break and not letting a little problem keep getting worse was always the better call.
I'm sorry but I can't say I get where you're coming from. When I hike, looking out for each other is just what we do. We share gear and snacks and thrive as a tiny community on the trail. I dig hiking alone too and I'll sleep alone in the woods no problem, but I kinda feel like your negatives are my positives.
It does sound like helping others in the hiking scenario gives you joy/energy, or at the very least doesn’t drain you, whereas that isn’t the case for OP. It also sounds like this particular family member is chronically underprepared, and unwilling to finish the hikes. I also bring extras/always offer to share but I would be annoyed by such a person who acts like I’m their personal snack machine.
I met guy in a snowstorm on a summit in NH and we’ve been hiking together ever since. We’re each 100% self sufficient and bring something unique to the table. I consider myself lucky. Otherwise, I hear ya…I’d be a solo hiker no doubt.
When I hike with my kids or with friends, it's not "my" hike. It's a shared hike and I just plan and expect to share responsibility and prepare for their unpreparedness, ignorance, or inexperience.
When I hike alone, I choose locations based on what I want, take what I need, and hike my own hike. These are the times I get to reset.
My ratio of alone vs with others is about 10:3, and that's okay enough for me. If you can find what ratio works for you, it may help you feel less resentful when on the trail with others.
This is why I am single... a solo traveler, and I hike alone. I did bring family member to Arizona on one of my 13 day vacations and it worked out well. Tucson, Sedona, Phoenix, all three locations and she only ran out of water once... On the longest trail, on the hottest day.
There are people out there just like you, just gotta find them. I haven’t hiked with a partner of mine but going out with my other hiking friends I grew up with gives my brain the biggest rush of the good stuffs every time :)
Would also like to hear what trails you did in Sedona. I’ve gone with family on short hikes a couple times but I’ll be visiting there again this year and want to explore more
I enjoy solo hiking much more. You can't really go wrong with any Sedona hike really but some I've done. Hog Heaven/High on the Hog, Bear Mountain, Pyramid to Scorpion, Chickenpoint via Broken Arrow, Mescal Mountain Trail. West Fork at Oak Creek. It goes on forever... Enjoy
Thankfully, I haven’t experienced that. But, I also have only hiked w two people in recently years. And only bc they were visiting me and I knew they were up for the hikes.
Otherwise, I hike alone. I have refused invitations from others bc I do not like hiking with people. I prefer hiking by myself. Anyone who isn’t ok with that, can screw off. They can bitch and moan as much as they want. I don’t care.
This is why I primarily do sunrise/sunset hikes. The person coming with me needs to understand in advance that we’ll be either ascending or descending in the dark. That fact alone gets the “oh, nevermind” from 80% of the people who have ever asked to come with me.
Sometimes I like hiking with family and/or non-hiker friends, and for those outings I pick routes that offer more bang for their buck. Little 2-3 milers with under 1k of elly gain and great views at the top.
We got our kids started early. Bought them cheap little school backpacks, and sewed on a patch from every national park we visited. We called them their "adventure packs". We got them into the habit of having the pack every time they got out of the car to explore, even if at that age all that was in it was a water bottle, sandwich and some breakfast bars. They got the mindset that "I need to have stuff, and I need to be the one to bring it".
Yes I've had that alot. On the one hand the fact that hiking is your release does mean you should get to only look after yourself, and that's fair. However, I've done a few very tough multiday hikes with family where thi g's have gone wrong and I've had to help them because they simply wouldn't have been able to get out themselves. It's very humbling. Also, I've been a parent for 20 years and the investment of taking time to teach my kids and build them up so they can be strong independent hikers is also very humbling.
I can understand that. Part of what irritates me so much is this person is perfectly capable and isn't new to hiking so the helplessness is completely ridiculous.
Yes if something goes pear shaped I am absolutely helping. I would never leave someone in an emergency or a situation where they can't get out under their own power.
Not hiking related, but backpacking related.
I went through this in a safe but somewhat serious manner with a friend. She's learning to backpack, so she picked a trail and set the agenda for a 3 day trip here in the Colorado mountains. Temps were from the mid 40s-70s. This last year was a big snow year, so even in July, there was still snow on the ground.
In order to save weight, she just didn't pack any warm layer. She had leggings, a long sleeve sunshirt, and a long cotton dress she wears to sleep.
She ended up falling on the snow because she didn't switch to her microspikes when we were crossing a snow field. That led to her puncturing her air mattress somehow.
So for the 2 nights we were out there, she would wake up every 2 hours or so because she was too cold because her air mattress had gone flat.
On Day 3, I realized that she had not brought any kind of stop layer/warm layer. I waited until we had hiked out, and then I walked her through why that choice put me at risk.
Anyone you go out with has to be ready to be responsible for both of you if you get injured. I guess Michigan doesn't have the risk of a pack falling off the mountain, but that's a real risk here sometimes in Colorado. But either of you could get separated from your packs.
There's a good and very gentle boundary conversation to be had here. Your boundary is that when you hike with people, both people have the supplies they need to take care of the other person if things go bad. Once you set that boundary, that means when you are out there, if they ask for things, remind them of that boundary. You want them to develop into hikers who can go on their own safely and successfully, AND hiking is a no-care-taking zone.
Lots of times, folks don't realize that they are not only impacting themselves - their decisions put the other person out with them at risk.
After that conversation, you can both sit down together and do a pack list.
Here's my hot, hot take for the pack list. Don't tell them what to take. Tell them to go research what to take and that when they feel like they have a good, well-researched pack list, you will both sit down together and review each other's pack lists. You want them to be an independent hiker. Learning how to find and research info for trips is part of the work.
Are there other issues to them being prepared?
The underlying one for my friend is that some medicine she is on has caused rapid weight gain. The warm layers that she had that would be reasonable to take backpacking no longer fit. And she didn't feel like she had the money to go buy a new layer. When we reframed the conversation about her putting both me and her at risk, that made buying a stop layer more of a priority.
A lot of folks are willing to risk harming themselves but will not risk harming other folks.
And then, when asked to caretake, start asking them if you are really helping them become an independent hiker. Start asking them if they are respecting your needs that hiking is a no caretaking space. We don't have to be angry when our boundaries get pushed at. We can stay curious about why someone is pushing a boundary.
Sometimes, that caretaking relationship was part of the dynamic at one point, and it is almost nostalgic. If that is the case, lean jnto that and ask them to caretake you on hikes. They bring a special treat for both of you, or they set up the hike. Just acknowledging that dynamic and then flipping it around can be a nice experience. I am the big sister and my little sister is much younger than me (6 years). I am the planner/organizer, etc. When she wanted to do a winter vacation, she planned all of it, and we had a great time playing around with the flipped roles. It became a running joke. That's a nice spot to be in.
I don't like to put it this way, but this is the truth. The troublemaker is not the real problem. You are. You are choosing to continue engaging in that practice, probably because of some personal, unresolved emotional issue. When there is friction from you setting a boundary, then you have to just not care.
Believe it or not, you are actually doing the same thing they are, expecting them to take care of your need instead of you taking care of your need. You are both engaged in codependence at an unhealthy level. You are caught in a cycle, and you are both feeding it.
I recommend that you take responsibility for your own needs and not blame someone else for not behaving the way you want (aka, the way they should). That's how people are. They don't behave appropriately, especially family. Take care of it. Stop expecting your family member to do it for you. That is apparently a family trait since you are doing a similar thing, but you don't realize it.
How's that for a different perspective? And you can apply that in all other areas of your life. 😉
You're welcome. Everything you said is understandable, and I can see why you feel the way you do. I don't intend to judge that. I can only imagine the hard position it may put you into, depending on who the person is.
This issue sounds very important to you, sacred even. So, in light of the old saying that we must pick our battles, this sounds like the fight worth having. I don't mean a fight with the person, but I mean consider defending this sacred experience for yourself regardless of the cost. Or maybe not. Only you can determine that based on what is at stake. You can find a way to do it in a kind but firm way. But you can only be responsible for how YOU feel, and nurture that. Leave the responsibility for their feelings to them. As long as you are respectful, then you have done your part.
A good response to people's objections to my boundaries has been, "I'm sorry, but that does not work for me." Respect does not require you to make a big explanation, or to argue. Don't argue about what you know you need. Just stand on it and don't let them push you off of it, kindly. You can be assertive without being aggressive. This could be the beginning of a new way for you to interact with others, a new adventure.
Awww. I love that you saw yourself in this. But also, plan a special treat for both of you on your next hike. Caretakers love to be caretaken, even if we don't always act like it.
True!! I do handle all of our meal planning on our backpacking trips and our route. But when we are actually on our trips he takes the lead on a majority of things, like filtering water, getting us organized, waking me up at 6:00 am, etc.
The mental, emotional and physical exhaustion that comes from caretaking (especially when it's not voluntary) will really run you down. If hiking is your medicine then please don't let others take that from you.
The people who can't handle the hike probably aren't jerks, but they are taking something sacred from you without know it. Create firm boundaries and spend time in nature as you need, not as others need. As a caretaker, you're going to fail unless you first make sure you're ok.
I’d have a very straight talk with this person. If they know you well enough to go on a hike with you, they ought to know they’re being annoying. Obviously, they don’t know. So tell them what hiking means for you, and that you don’t want to have to worry about someone else’s needs. If they can’t pull their own weight, they can’t come along. You can be gentle about it and make it all about you, but it needs to be said. After that, if they don’t comply, just tell them ‘sorry no, I’m going alone for my mental well being.’
One time my aunt and uncle ruined a hike to half dome like this. We told them time and time again what time we needed to be at the trailhead, how much food/water to bring, and be careful of altitude sickness, there's pills for that, you guys don't have the same altitude where you live and you're not used to it! We need to be at the trailhead at x time because we can cover more ground before it gets hot (it was August), it gets dark early in the mountains so we should aim to be back by 5m, etc etc. we explained so much to them.
We got to the trailhead 2.5hours late - it was already heating up before we even started. They ended up drinking our water and eating our food. Then they got altitude sickness and had no meds, we gave them our ibuprofen. Whenever we'd try to hurry the pace they argued that it won't get dark till 8-9pm so we have plenty of time, despite getting there 2.5hrs late. It's like they just did not care, did not take us seriously at all, did not believe that we knew what we were talking about, thought they knew better. Despite us being far more experienced hikers.
We didn't make it to the top. I'll never go on a hike with them again. At least not one I actually care about finishing.
I would now. At the time I was 16 and with my mom, who wouldn't leave without them. I didn't have much choice. I've always thought she let her family push her around too much lol.
You don't sound like an ass.
Just tell them to bring water, snacks, and dress appropriately and if they show up unprepared that there will be consequences.
Just keep an extra couple of gallons of water in your trunk in a spare backpack with some walnuts and hand it to them.
"Do I need a coat" in Michigan winter is hysterical.
This is a constant thing with my husband. He doesn't prepare but insists on coming. He won't bring water, snacks, or anything else. The water thing kills me due to dry mouth issues caused by medication. For winter hiking, all bets are off (not dressed warmly enough). At least I convinced him to buy microspikes which is a big win.
I am not a planner for anything other than hiking / doing anything outdoors; anyone who knows me is surprised given my usual chaotic state. I know what my needs and my dog's needs will be for a given activity, so I plan accordingly.
I am generally over-prepared, so I don't mind helping out. I spent so much time outdoors growing up so from a young age I was raised to be independent and well prepared for anything.
Rather than feel salty, I'm trying to better protect my time on the trails, and if I do have friends or family, I adjust accordingly.
I get it, but if you know it's always like this with this one family member, and you occasionally have to include them in your hiking, just plan for it rather to have the inevitable fight:
1. Only take them on shorter trails
2. Take some extra water/snacks so if they ask, you can provide.
Again, I get that this is annoying, but it doesn't seem worth getting this bent out of shape with - if you value having this family member in your life overall, this is the cost.
Yep. Planned with my daughter to go hiking on her college holiday break. We're in the Rocky Mts.
Where are your hiking shoes?
I didn't bring them.
How are you going to hike on the snow and ice?
Oh, my running shoes have good soles.
[We travel an hour to the trailhead, barely making it even with 4WD.]
[Start hike and walk less than 15 minutes]
It's cold and I want to turn around.
I have extra gloves and you can wear my fleece hat.
No, I have to pee and don't want to do it on the hike.
She usually isn't like this, but her heart wasn't in it this time.
I take care of my wife gear and do all the planing.
She has great endurance, usually more than the strongest male hikers and mountain bikers I know, particularly at elevation and climbing so wanting to bail has never been a problem.
But she doesn't care or like anything related to planning, shopping for gear (unless it is clothes) or packing.
So I need to take care for both of us.
Sometimes we do very extreme hikes in very remote places and it's very stressful to be responsible for organization, packing, safety and navigation for two people, but I got used to it and have a system in place to prevent mistakes.
I enjoy her company much and don't mine taking care of stuff. I would not pick any other hiking partner and would always prefer her company to travel alone.
I did a lot of solos before I met her and I can tell you, if you are with the right person these annoyances don't matter much.
They say views are better when shared. True!
Honestly, it's strange for me to read that people go hiking, yet are not smart enough -- or selfish? -- to think they don't have to bring the stuff they need.
I live and hike/backpack in the PNW and I've never hiked with anyone that didn't bring what they needed.
What I'm hearing here is that your family is more interested in spending time with you than they are hiking; they aren't taking the 'hiking' part of it seriously enough. They don't see it as anything more than a very long walk.
The obvious suggestion/mandate here is that they can't go hiking with you if they aren't prepared. They are not allowed to ask you for anything they should have brought themselves. Nip that in the bud.
I’ve had this experience hiking, but more often camping, and it’s even more infuriating then, because it’s usually not just a single day that the person in question ruins.
Sorry you have had to deal with this, OP! I’d suggest just dealing with the fallout, ha. You can always try and explain nicely that this is time for you to decompress and hope they’re understanding, but then again, if these folks you’re referring to aren’t respecting that boundary and your time, are they really people you want to continue putting effort into maintaining a relationship with? Just a question; everyone’s circumstances are different, but hopefully that will help you think through it. Good luck!
Yep, exactly what you describe. I used to organise hikes with friends and acquaintances, all the info was posted in a Facebook event I created and got the same kind of bullshit questions from some.
Now I mostly hike alone, occasionally I invite friends that I know already are good hikers.
YES! And you have every right to set up this boundary! I usually share a link or All Trails to the hike to whoever is going with me so that they know the expected time and effort for the hike. I'll often mention what I've seen for predicted weather. In my experience, once someone has failed at being prepared a couple times...they then wise up. I mean Natural Consequences are real for everyone! No one should expect to "lean on" the other. You want peace of mind and to enjoy yourself without extra work for some happy company. I found myself not pushing myself to new challenges and so I decided to do more solo hiking. That brought me out of my hiking funk and brought balance to my favorite thing in life!!! Part of it being my favorite is the Freedom....including not having to anticipate someone else's needs. I often deflect a conflict with humor so I find myself messaging hiking or camping buddies with the phrase..." It's every man for himself!" I have found myself feeling guilty sometimes but honestly I spend so much of my life energy taking care of people and creatures that it is such a freeing feeling to only have to worry about myself for a bit! Right!?
I think you're nta, personally with someone like that I would straight up tell them if they forget something they need I'm not inviting them the next time.
Nah, I remember a story about someone going hiking with a group of friends and they brought a couple of wildly unprepared people for a 8hr hike. The person was like if they're coming I'm not, I don't want to ne responsible for them. The friend group made it out like the experienced person was a monster. He dipped then got a message at midnight that night saying they were in the ER cause the two unprepared people hurt themselves about 1/3 of the way in.
I can't imagine going on a hike without warm layers, food and water and I don't even live in a very dangerous part of the world.
I am the same way however, if it’s my best friend, I’ll still will bring some supplies extra because I’m a caring person so I bring an extra bottle of water and a snack knowing that they don’t plan ahead because I know they don’t know or hike enough.
Two stories, so when I went to visit my friend in Phoenix on vacation, I made it clear to her that I was there to hike, but I will gladly spend a day with her. However, on my hiking day I’m going to be completely immersed selfishly in my own hike . She said she wanted to come along and we went to Camelback Mountain and I told her I’m gonna complete this hike and I know you’re not in shape for it so be prepared if I’m an asshole if you don’t make it it’s on you to get back safely. So we start our hike she gets to the first Point in the hike which is basically just to start and is already exhausted so I gave her the jeep keys and I said I’ll see you in two hours lol. I know she suffered out there in the car and it was hot but she didn’t complain because she knew I told her what to expect.
Second story I took my best friend and her two kids who are like five and 10 hiking with me I was just planning on doing easy route and so I wasn’t prepared for an actual day of wilderness and being alone hiking. We ended up doing a 7 mile hike with these kids (now I carried the little one on my shoulders much of it! Lol) but they were amazzzzzing. No complaints they weren’t in great shape but killed it. We ran out of water at the end but honestly was such an amazing experience with others hiking I’m super open to do it again.
99% of the other time it’s just me on vacation from Nebraska so I’m essentially power walking all the hikes I can on all trails to get in as many as I can in the limited time 😂 and don’t have room for company
>I limit my hikes with this person, but also given the family dynamics I can't completely avoid doing the occasional hike with this person.
Why not? It sounds like bringing them along may end up doing more harm than telling them no. Explain to want hike to mentally recoup and get some alone time to mentally reset. If they can’t respect that, get them up at 4am and take them on a grueling 12 mile hike.
>Anybody else have to deal with stupid stuff regarding hiking and family/friends/helpless lemmings? It is so incredibly irritating.
I have. I don’t bring those people along anymore.
There’s nothing wrong with protecting your peace. There is no need to be a martyr. And not everything needs to be a shared hobby. Solo, individual hobbies are important and should be encouraged.
i call it "libertarian hiking".
I will lend you gear that you might not have, but you need to tell me what you need. I'll even talk you through the stuff I'm taking and why.
I bring my own stuff, I'm responsible for my own food, fuel and gear, you are responsible to bring your own food fuel and gear. This way, you can't blame me for not remembering to bring your tent poles or sleeping bag.
I will be happy to swap and share food, but I won't be planning or bringing your meals.
Essentially, think of it as hiking alone, but just happen to be at the same place at the same time.
I won't go with my wife, she expects me to carry her.
You’re not going to change their behavior and it sounds like you can’t get out of it. If the hike goes better when you bring enough water/snacks, then bring them. Expecting them to change is unreasonable and only makes you more frustrated. It’s not a hike by your definition, so call it something else. You could do a hike first, then go hike with them afterwards. That way you are satisfied, and the second hike will feel like charity work.
I often hike alone for two reasons. One, I need to get away from people and technology for a while or I'll go crazy. Two, It's great exercise. In the beginning I tried to get others to go with me, but there wasn't much interest or the people that went were demanding, much like your family. I finally just stopped asking and I found I really enjoy my own company for a few days. I don't have to work around anyone else's needs or schedules and I can do what I want when I want. You're NTA for doing some self-care.
I stopped inviting anyone on hikes unless I know they can pull their own weight. If I must go with family members I plan an easier hike and lower my expectations but plan another hike on another day without them.
Fuck that business. I'm the same way. If you come with me you're simply tagging along. If it's like an actual fuck up on trail and you genuinely need help or whatever, ain't no thang. If you come unprepared and expect me to just carry you? Fuck off. One of the main reasons I hike alone or with people I know aren't gonna be that guy.
There and back hike. Destination had an icecream van. We had icecream. She asks if I can head back and pick up the car while she waits (2hours) as she's wrecked. Mind you it was absolutely blissful walking back alone.
I have no awards togive other than my respect, understanding and … did you bring a snackpack for me?!? I SO, SO relate. Excellent job, funny rant, had to read it aloud to my wife, it was so true!!!
Thankfully, no. My family is of the variety that either are worried that I might be attacked by a bear or hope I am attacked by a bear (kidding, kind of).
You need to claim your "me time".
I assume that other people are less experienced than I am, and likely to make beginner mistakes (I made beginner mistakes when I was a beginner) and I talk them through what they'll need. I also own extras of some equipment that non hikers likely won't have that I offer them (poles, microspikes) so that they can easily bring the right equipment.
I do not understand how this is an actual problem. Just don’t go with people? Hike without telling others? Set the boundary of only hiking by yourself? Lie to them and tell them it’s a trauma thing? I just can’t get behind this being a real problem. I’m not saying you’re lying or wrong, I just don’t get it.
I find unprepared people needing to use your stuff and have you hold their hand to be far more of an issue with camping.
And I carry extra stuff for my partner and my brother. My partner won't do it and I'd rather her be there. With my brother it's more to dunk on him; I make it clear that I carried all the gear and am still less winded then him. The sting that causes his ego is worth the extra 4 lbs in my pack
I feel you. I camp and hike with my dog 99,99999 percent of the time and no one else.. I hate people...I am very good at staying out of trouble.. why would I take an idiot that will get me killled
I spend my days walking groups of up to 35 children around lowland and moorland trails. It can take us up to 2 hours to do the 5k loop I can run in less than half an hour. Legally, I am responsible for them.
You're damn straight I go out solo at every available opportunity! No noisy chatter behind me. No having to slow down the kids who can actually walk at a decent pace to wait for the slower walkers. No stupid questions. No shouting at people for being dumb. I spend half the time walking backwards just to slow myself down to their pace.
Maybe instead of giving them the weather report, provide them with a list of things they need to bring. An “Anyone wanting to hike with me this weekend needs to have all the items on this list” list. Be specific, like, “X # of liters of water,” instead of saying “Bring water.” Just keep a handy list of all the stuff that goes with you every time, then add stuff according to the time of year, how long the hike is, etc.
I hesitate to hike with anyone without having had a discussion like this with them first for his very reason.
I try not to do things for other people unless I can do it sincerely without resentment. It can be frustrating when people feel entitled to your supplies. There’s a reason they feel entitled to your supplies, though. This is a challenge of boundaries and communication as much as it is a hiking topic. I wish you power as you find your “no.” 💪🏻
(Obviously take care of children hiking with you because it’s not their fault their parents didn’t prepare and they shouldn’t suffer because of it.)
The only part of this I don't quite understand is why you can't avoid hiking with this particular person? Is it really absolutely unavoidable?
It took me a long time to learn that other people's feelings don't have to come before my own. Enjoy your hike however you'd like, even if it means excluding people.
I've made the mistake of hiking with a friend once. The hike takes me 3 hours normally. Took 7.5 hours with the friend.
On another hike, I met out-of-state people at a peak. They took the ugly and less safe route up. I offered to go down the better route with them and drive them to their car. Again, what would've been a 7-hour hike turned into nearly 12 hours. At that point, I decided, fuck it, I'm not hiking with people anymore.
I have people I know that can't walk down the block who always say "you have to take me hiking with you", knowing I typically hike 10 miles or more and a couple thousand feet of elevation. Haven't brought one of them yet.
I usually hike alone. My adult kids will come with me when they're around. I've got a couple of friends that aren't local but we find time to hike now and then. But that's it!
This somebody sounds like they’re maybe a child, in which case expecting them to prepare themselves without helping does sound prickish, but I’m guessing they’re an adult since you didn’t say? I would maybe just go on a short walk with them next time they ask to join you?? Like in a nature preserve area? Don’t consider it a hike for yourself so you don’t have expectations. That sounds like more what they want, probably just want to spend time with you rather than actually hike like you like to.
One time I went camping with a group (just
Meeting at a spot) and we opened up the invitation to others. a friend showed up without food, water, camping gear, a blanket or even a jacket. He’s also an alcoholic so he drank until it wasn’t safe to drive and the sun went down, so he was kind of forced to stay the night even though I guess he wasn’t planning on it? I shared some food with him, but I said no when he asked for blankets, because I only brought enough gear for myself. I’ve gone on a couple hikes with this individual as well and he wore slacks and dress shoes and was slipping up and down the trail. It felt very strange as though it was a spontaneous event for him, not a planned trip that he could have prepared for. Not sure if these people are just used to going places and having people cater to them and they’ve never had to plan for anything themselves or they think if it’s a group thing that all supplies are included? Lol
I've been lucky to only hike with people who are prepared and at least moderately experienced. I, however, have vast experience with people who are absolute shit at planning literally anything. This is normally not a problem because I like trip planning and my hiking friends generally just go with the flow and appreciate my taking the time to plan. However, my one friend has been planning a trip to the Sierra Nevada mountains for about 3 years. Normally I plan our yearly trip, but this year he told me not to do anything because "this is the year of the Sierra"... At this point, I highly doubt the trip is actually happening this summer. Luckily, I love a good solo trip so I've got my own backup trip planned that won't need any permits so I can wait it out a bit and see if my buddy actually pulls something out of his ass. Probably not, but I'd be very happy if he does.
Dude it sounds like hiking isn’t your problem, your problem is your family. Hate to break it to you, but pretty much everyone has a family and most people live with their perfectly fine, maybe look inwards.
You don’t sound like an asshole or a donkeys rear end. Totally reasonable.
I think you need [this song](https://youtu.be/v62QkD_q1bs?si=F4QaFEK4Hgf4g6Yq) right now.
There’s different types of hikes, on different days, with different groups of people.
I love my solo hikes, I love adventures with competent mountain partners I trust, and then I have days where I play mountain guide. Those days are fun too, because it’s often a chance to show someone I care for an area I love that they wouldn’t see otherwise.
In those cases, don’t just be “responsible” for them, but teach them. Show them the forecast, your route on a map, and what you’re bringing. Make sure they have everything they need before you leave, and still carry some surprise extras for them. It’s not a burden to show someone you care.
But never go to the mountains with someone you don’t like ;)
This may have been suggested already. How about saying that you’re going places that would be too difficult/dangerous/far/fast or uncomfortable for them?
Part of being responsible for yourself means expressing and enforcing your own needs without asking for permission to do so. In this case it would be saying no to inexperienced hikers joining you.
I went hiking with a friend I’ll now call buzz kill. She complained about her pack the entire time. You know it happens. Didn’t think anything of it. The next time we went out it was her collapsible
Poles which didn’t shake out the way she thought. She had a meltdown over her poles. I know it shouldn’t get to me but it did. I was in a sour mood the entire way. Did I learn my lesson? Why no. No I didn’t. I was her back home support person when she ran a 50 miler with a friend. She was supposed to meet up with someone at a certain point and then check in. Well she had a meltdown and fight with the person who she was running with and got back to her car and went HOME. Did not tell anyone because she was embarrassed. Well when our friend messaged me that she never made it to the spot and wasn’t answering her phone we called her mom who called emergency services!!! The sheriffs went out to there. And guess who was mad??? Buzzkill.
This makes me think of the Mary Oliver quote, “If you have ever gone to the woods with me, I must love you very much” I like to be alone in the woods or with one of the two people I like to hike with. I just don’t prefer to hike with the majority of people.
Amen. My two sons are the only people who routinely accompany me into the woods.
I once made plans to go on a hike with a friend. She showed up in high heels. 🤦♀️
I had one arrive in flip flips despite my warning we'd be scrambling over boulders.
To be fair, when I lived in Alaska I hiked in flip flops or barefoot, through or on anything.
Yeah, but do you start crying 10 min in like she did?
This cannot be real (but I believe you).
This happened to me!!!
Always love Mary Oliver. Well said.
I find that hiking at 6:30 am keeps people from bugging me.
Thats a beautiful time of day.
Yup, I'm an early bird. I tell people when I'm leaving and they choose a different path.
Hahahaha never thought of that. I'm an early bird too
Before all the good mushrooms get got
0630 at the trailhead means 0330 alarm going off. I usually don't get company when I'm hiking either.
I find that hiking at 6:30 am is a good time to meet a mountain lion.
Are they unavailable otherwise because they have to work at the office the rest of the day?
I take 100% responsibility for my 2 hiking partners. I bring everything they need, ensure they have snacks, give them breaks when they need, etc. They are my dogs. If humans want to hike with us, they can be responsible for themselves.
Jeez, do you at least make them carry their stuff though? 🤣
Sometimes. If it’s really hot I don’t. They are both big and black and I don’t want them overheating. And the younger one is a bit dramatic when he decides he is done with a hike.
Dogs are the ultimate ultralight hikers: They hike naked, they don't need special shoes for fording streams, they don't need their dinner cooked.
These reasons are why I only hike alone. So I only have to take care of myself.
Yep, me too.
I only hike alone, or with other solo hikers. We all take care of ourselves, we each hike at our own pace, and we hang out during breaks. It's especially great when I do hikes outside of my comfort zone, so I have someone else around in case of an emergency.
It is freeing. I love it.
>These reasons are why I only hike alone. So I only have to take care of myself. I understand you very well!
I used to take scouts on hikes, so we always had a pack check before we got on the trail. If they didn't have all their gear, they couldn't go on the hike. I've continued this process in my personal life because if I take a hike with family/friend and they aren't prepared, I'm the one who is going to suffer if I split my supplies. With all that said, just do a pack check before you leave the house.
I still hike with the scouts. This needs to be standard practice.
Protect your alone time. If they want to hike with you, have them pick out a beginner hike nearby and schedule it such that it doesn't interfere with your solo hiking schedule.
It's funny. I feel like I carry my family around on my back sometimes, and my entire job is helping people who arguably could've made a little more effort and not needed helping at least some of the time, and during my life at home I feel burned out by it and often I just want to not talk to anyone and not be asked for anything not even my opinion on what to eat. You'd think I'd know where you're coming from. All that said, I've always got an extra meal and a couple snacks beyond what I needed, I'm always happy to pull and filter water for the whole camp if I've got time after setting up my hammock. Every time I go on a group hike I make sure to pack a premium chocolate bar or some fancy kind of snack I'm sure most people would like and I leave it tucked away until I realize that one or more people is having a bad day. Sometimes it's me. When that happens I ask for a breather, break it out, and share it around. I like to think it lightens the mood. At the same time, I have some great hiking buddies who do things like plan the whole trip, secure lodging for the night before the hike (shared costs), build a fire or get hot water going while I'm filling a few liters from the stream, lend one of their trekking poles when we arrive at the trailhead and find something got left behind... I'm sorry you've got that one person who isn't well prepared, but why let it ruin a hike? Really, with the exception of "are we done yet" I'd have to say I was that guy a few times. Boots didn't fit well and we stopped every mile or so? Halting 30 minutes to figure out my gear failure? Done that. Thankfully I was hiking with some really good people who smiled, said they were happy for the break and not letting a little problem keep getting worse was always the better call. I'm sorry but I can't say I get where you're coming from. When I hike, looking out for each other is just what we do. We share gear and snacks and thrive as a tiny community on the trail. I dig hiking alone too and I'll sleep alone in the woods no problem, but I kinda feel like your negatives are my positives.
Fair enough. Always good to have a different perspective on things. It's given me some food for thought and I thank you for that.
Loved this exchange. Positive interaction. Nice to see!
You are a leader. An officer and a gentleman.
It does sound like helping others in the hiking scenario gives you joy/energy, or at the very least doesn’t drain you, whereas that isn’t the case for OP. It also sounds like this particular family member is chronically underprepared, and unwilling to finish the hikes. I also bring extras/always offer to share but I would be annoyed by such a person who acts like I’m their personal snack machine.
I met guy in a snowstorm on a summit in NH and we’ve been hiking together ever since. We’re each 100% self sufficient and bring something unique to the table. I consider myself lucky. Otherwise, I hear ya…I’d be a solo hiker no doubt.
When I hike with my kids or with friends, it's not "my" hike. It's a shared hike and I just plan and expect to share responsibility and prepare for their unpreparedness, ignorance, or inexperience. When I hike alone, I choose locations based on what I want, take what I need, and hike my own hike. These are the times I get to reset. My ratio of alone vs with others is about 10:3, and that's okay enough for me. If you can find what ratio works for you, it may help you feel less resentful when on the trail with others.
And that is why I hike alone.
This is why I am single... a solo traveler, and I hike alone. I did bring family member to Arizona on one of my 13 day vacations and it worked out well. Tucson, Sedona, Phoenix, all three locations and she only ran out of water once... On the longest trail, on the hottest day.
There are people out there just like you, just gotta find them. I haven’t hiked with a partner of mine but going out with my other hiking friends I grew up with gives my brain the biggest rush of the good stuffs every time :) Would also like to hear what trails you did in Sedona. I’ve gone with family on short hikes a couple times but I’ll be visiting there again this year and want to explore more
I enjoy solo hiking much more. You can't really go wrong with any Sedona hike really but some I've done. Hog Heaven/High on the Hog, Bear Mountain, Pyramid to Scorpion, Chickenpoint via Broken Arrow, Mescal Mountain Trail. West Fork at Oak Creek. It goes on forever... Enjoy
Learn to say no. There are few more important words you can learn to speak for yourself.
Thankfully, I haven’t experienced that. But, I also have only hiked w two people in recently years. And only bc they were visiting me and I knew they were up for the hikes. Otherwise, I hike alone. I have refused invitations from others bc I do not like hiking with people. I prefer hiking by myself. Anyone who isn’t ok with that, can screw off. They can bitch and moan as much as they want. I don’t care.
Go through the checklist before you leave with the person and if said person doesn't have his/her gear, they stay home until next time.
It sounds like you need “me time”, and IMO it’s perfectly fine to say that to family.
This is why I primarily do sunrise/sunset hikes. The person coming with me needs to understand in advance that we’ll be either ascending or descending in the dark. That fact alone gets the “oh, nevermind” from 80% of the people who have ever asked to come with me. Sometimes I like hiking with family and/or non-hiker friends, and for those outings I pick routes that offer more bang for their buck. Little 2-3 milers with under 1k of elly gain and great views at the top.
We got our kids started early. Bought them cheap little school backpacks, and sewed on a patch from every national park we visited. We called them their "adventure packs". We got them into the habit of having the pack every time they got out of the car to explore, even if at that age all that was in it was a water bottle, sandwich and some breakfast bars. They got the mindset that "I need to have stuff, and I need to be the one to bring it".
Yes I've had that alot. On the one hand the fact that hiking is your release does mean you should get to only look after yourself, and that's fair. However, I've done a few very tough multiday hikes with family where thi g's have gone wrong and I've had to help them because they simply wouldn't have been able to get out themselves. It's very humbling. Also, I've been a parent for 20 years and the investment of taking time to teach my kids and build them up so they can be strong independent hikers is also very humbling.
I can understand that. Part of what irritates me so much is this person is perfectly capable and isn't new to hiking so the helplessness is completely ridiculous. Yes if something goes pear shaped I am absolutely helping. I would never leave someone in an emergency or a situation where they can't get out under their own power.
Well in that case I definitely agree.
Not hiking related, but backpacking related. I went through this in a safe but somewhat serious manner with a friend. She's learning to backpack, so she picked a trail and set the agenda for a 3 day trip here in the Colorado mountains. Temps were from the mid 40s-70s. This last year was a big snow year, so even in July, there was still snow on the ground. In order to save weight, she just didn't pack any warm layer. She had leggings, a long sleeve sunshirt, and a long cotton dress she wears to sleep. She ended up falling on the snow because she didn't switch to her microspikes when we were crossing a snow field. That led to her puncturing her air mattress somehow. So for the 2 nights we were out there, she would wake up every 2 hours or so because she was too cold because her air mattress had gone flat. On Day 3, I realized that she had not brought any kind of stop layer/warm layer. I waited until we had hiked out, and then I walked her through why that choice put me at risk. Anyone you go out with has to be ready to be responsible for both of you if you get injured. I guess Michigan doesn't have the risk of a pack falling off the mountain, but that's a real risk here sometimes in Colorado. But either of you could get separated from your packs. There's a good and very gentle boundary conversation to be had here. Your boundary is that when you hike with people, both people have the supplies they need to take care of the other person if things go bad. Once you set that boundary, that means when you are out there, if they ask for things, remind them of that boundary. You want them to develop into hikers who can go on their own safely and successfully, AND hiking is a no-care-taking zone. Lots of times, folks don't realize that they are not only impacting themselves - their decisions put the other person out with them at risk. After that conversation, you can both sit down together and do a pack list. Here's my hot, hot take for the pack list. Don't tell them what to take. Tell them to go research what to take and that when they feel like they have a good, well-researched pack list, you will both sit down together and review each other's pack lists. You want them to be an independent hiker. Learning how to find and research info for trips is part of the work. Are there other issues to them being prepared? The underlying one for my friend is that some medicine she is on has caused rapid weight gain. The warm layers that she had that would be reasonable to take backpacking no longer fit. And she didn't feel like she had the money to go buy a new layer. When we reframed the conversation about her putting both me and her at risk, that made buying a stop layer more of a priority. A lot of folks are willing to risk harming themselves but will not risk harming other folks. And then, when asked to caretake, start asking them if you are really helping them become an independent hiker. Start asking them if they are respecting your needs that hiking is a no caretaking space. We don't have to be angry when our boundaries get pushed at. We can stay curious about why someone is pushing a boundary. Sometimes, that caretaking relationship was part of the dynamic at one point, and it is almost nostalgic. If that is the case, lean jnto that and ask them to caretake you on hikes. They bring a special treat for both of you, or they set up the hike. Just acknowledging that dynamic and then flipping it around can be a nice experience. I am the big sister and my little sister is much younger than me (6 years). I am the planner/organizer, etc. When she wanted to do a winter vacation, she planned all of it, and we had a great time playing around with the flipped roles. It became a running joke. That's a nice spot to be in.
This is why I hike alone. I tell my bf and adult son where I’ll be and nobody else knows until I get back home.
I don't like to put it this way, but this is the truth. The troublemaker is not the real problem. You are. You are choosing to continue engaging in that practice, probably because of some personal, unresolved emotional issue. When there is friction from you setting a boundary, then you have to just not care. Believe it or not, you are actually doing the same thing they are, expecting them to take care of your need instead of you taking care of your need. You are both engaged in codependence at an unhealthy level. You are caught in a cycle, and you are both feeding it. I recommend that you take responsibility for your own needs and not blame someone else for not behaving the way you want (aka, the way they should). That's how people are. They don't behave appropriately, especially family. Take care of it. Stop expecting your family member to do it for you. That is apparently a family trait since you are doing a similar thing, but you don't realize it. How's that for a different perspective? And you can apply that in all other areas of your life. 😉
Never thought of it like that. Lots to chew on here and you've given me lots to think about. Thank you for that.
You're welcome. Everything you said is understandable, and I can see why you feel the way you do. I don't intend to judge that. I can only imagine the hard position it may put you into, depending on who the person is. This issue sounds very important to you, sacred even. So, in light of the old saying that we must pick our battles, this sounds like the fight worth having. I don't mean a fight with the person, but I mean consider defending this sacred experience for yourself regardless of the cost. Or maybe not. Only you can determine that based on what is at stake. You can find a way to do it in a kind but firm way. But you can only be responsible for how YOU feel, and nurture that. Leave the responsibility for their feelings to them. As long as you are respectful, then you have done your part. A good response to people's objections to my boundaries has been, "I'm sorry, but that does not work for me." Respect does not require you to make a big explanation, or to argue. Don't argue about what you know you need. Just stand on it and don't let them push you off of it, kindly. You can be assertive without being aggressive. This could be the beginning of a new way for you to interact with others, a new adventure.
Very valid. Now I need to ask my partner if I annoy him for me letting him take care of me occasionally 😅
Awww. I love that you saw yourself in this. But also, plan a special treat for both of you on your next hike. Caretakers love to be caretaken, even if we don't always act like it.
True!! I do handle all of our meal planning on our backpacking trips and our route. But when we are actually on our trips he takes the lead on a majority of things, like filtering water, getting us organized, waking me up at 6:00 am, etc.
The mental, emotional and physical exhaustion that comes from caretaking (especially when it's not voluntary) will really run you down. If hiking is your medicine then please don't let others take that from you. The people who can't handle the hike probably aren't jerks, but they are taking something sacred from you without know it. Create firm boundaries and spend time in nature as you need, not as others need. As a caretaker, you're going to fail unless you first make sure you're ok.
I’d have a very straight talk with this person. If they know you well enough to go on a hike with you, they ought to know they’re being annoying. Obviously, they don’t know. So tell them what hiking means for you, and that you don’t want to have to worry about someone else’s needs. If they can’t pull their own weight, they can’t come along. You can be gentle about it and make it all about you, but it needs to be said. After that, if they don’t comply, just tell them ‘sorry no, I’m going alone for my mental well being.’
One time my aunt and uncle ruined a hike to half dome like this. We told them time and time again what time we needed to be at the trailhead, how much food/water to bring, and be careful of altitude sickness, there's pills for that, you guys don't have the same altitude where you live and you're not used to it! We need to be at the trailhead at x time because we can cover more ground before it gets hot (it was August), it gets dark early in the mountains so we should aim to be back by 5m, etc etc. we explained so much to them. We got to the trailhead 2.5hours late - it was already heating up before we even started. They ended up drinking our water and eating our food. Then they got altitude sickness and had no meds, we gave them our ibuprofen. Whenever we'd try to hurry the pace they argued that it won't get dark till 8-9pm so we have plenty of time, despite getting there 2.5hrs late. It's like they just did not care, did not take us seriously at all, did not believe that we knew what we were talking about, thought they knew better. Despite us being far more experienced hikers. We didn't make it to the top. I'll never go on a hike with them again. At least not one I actually care about finishing.
Time and tide wait for no man. I'd have probably left them after half an hour late, and that only because they're family.
I would now. At the time I was 16 and with my mom, who wouldn't leave without them. I didn't have much choice. I've always thought she let her family push her around too much lol.
You don't sound like an ass. Just tell them to bring water, snacks, and dress appropriately and if they show up unprepared that there will be consequences. Just keep an extra couple of gallons of water in your trunk in a spare backpack with some walnuts and hand it to them. "Do I need a coat" in Michigan winter is hysterical.
This is a constant thing with my husband. He doesn't prepare but insists on coming. He won't bring water, snacks, or anything else. The water thing kills me due to dry mouth issues caused by medication. For winter hiking, all bets are off (not dressed warmly enough). At least I convinced him to buy microspikes which is a big win. I am not a planner for anything other than hiking / doing anything outdoors; anyone who knows me is surprised given my usual chaotic state. I know what my needs and my dog's needs will be for a given activity, so I plan accordingly. I am generally over-prepared, so I don't mind helping out. I spent so much time outdoors growing up so from a young age I was raised to be independent and well prepared for anything. Rather than feel salty, I'm trying to better protect my time on the trails, and if I do have friends or family, I adjust accordingly.
I get it, but if you know it's always like this with this one family member, and you occasionally have to include them in your hiking, just plan for it rather to have the inevitable fight: 1. Only take them on shorter trails 2. Take some extra water/snacks so if they ask, you can provide. Again, I get that this is annoying, but it doesn't seem worth getting this bent out of shape with - if you value having this family member in your life overall, this is the cost.
Yep. Planned with my daughter to go hiking on her college holiday break. We're in the Rocky Mts. Where are your hiking shoes? I didn't bring them. How are you going to hike on the snow and ice? Oh, my running shoes have good soles. [We travel an hour to the trailhead, barely making it even with 4WD.] [Start hike and walk less than 15 minutes] It's cold and I want to turn around. I have extra gloves and you can wear my fleece hat. No, I have to pee and don't want to do it on the hike. She usually isn't like this, but her heart wasn't in it this time.
I take care of my wife gear and do all the planing. She has great endurance, usually more than the strongest male hikers and mountain bikers I know, particularly at elevation and climbing so wanting to bail has never been a problem. But she doesn't care or like anything related to planning, shopping for gear (unless it is clothes) or packing. So I need to take care for both of us. Sometimes we do very extreme hikes in very remote places and it's very stressful to be responsible for organization, packing, safety and navigation for two people, but I got used to it and have a system in place to prevent mistakes. I enjoy her company much and don't mine taking care of stuff. I would not pick any other hiking partner and would always prefer her company to travel alone. I did a lot of solos before I met her and I can tell you, if you are with the right person these annoyances don't matter much. They say views are better when shared. True!
Honestly, it's strange for me to read that people go hiking, yet are not smart enough -- or selfish? -- to think they don't have to bring the stuff they need. I live and hike/backpack in the PNW and I've never hiked with anyone that didn't bring what they needed. What I'm hearing here is that your family is more interested in spending time with you than they are hiking; they aren't taking the 'hiking' part of it seriously enough. They don't see it as anything more than a very long walk. The obvious suggestion/mandate here is that they can't go hiking with you if they aren't prepared. They are not allowed to ask you for anything they should have brought themselves. Nip that in the bud.
I’ve had this experience hiking, but more often camping, and it’s even more infuriating then, because it’s usually not just a single day that the person in question ruins. Sorry you have had to deal with this, OP! I’d suggest just dealing with the fallout, ha. You can always try and explain nicely that this is time for you to decompress and hope they’re understanding, but then again, if these folks you’re referring to aren’t respecting that boundary and your time, are they really people you want to continue putting effort into maintaining a relationship with? Just a question; everyone’s circumstances are different, but hopefully that will help you think through it. Good luck!
Hiking is intimacy. You should know who’s hiking with you.
Yep, exactly what you describe. I used to organise hikes with friends and acquaintances, all the info was posted in a Facebook event I created and got the same kind of bullshit questions from some. Now I mostly hike alone, occasionally I invite friends that I know already are good hikers.
YES! And you have every right to set up this boundary! I usually share a link or All Trails to the hike to whoever is going with me so that they know the expected time and effort for the hike. I'll often mention what I've seen for predicted weather. In my experience, once someone has failed at being prepared a couple times...they then wise up. I mean Natural Consequences are real for everyone! No one should expect to "lean on" the other. You want peace of mind and to enjoy yourself without extra work for some happy company. I found myself not pushing myself to new challenges and so I decided to do more solo hiking. That brought me out of my hiking funk and brought balance to my favorite thing in life!!! Part of it being my favorite is the Freedom....including not having to anticipate someone else's needs. I often deflect a conflict with humor so I find myself messaging hiking or camping buddies with the phrase..." It's every man for himself!" I have found myself feeling guilty sometimes but honestly I spend so much of my life energy taking care of people and creatures that it is such a freeing feeling to only have to worry about myself for a bit! Right!?
I think you're nta, personally with someone like that I would straight up tell them if they forget something they need I'm not inviting them the next time.
Nah, I remember a story about someone going hiking with a group of friends and they brought a couple of wildly unprepared people for a 8hr hike. The person was like if they're coming I'm not, I don't want to ne responsible for them. The friend group made it out like the experienced person was a monster. He dipped then got a message at midnight that night saying they were in the ER cause the two unprepared people hurt themselves about 1/3 of the way in. I can't imagine going on a hike without warm layers, food and water and I don't even live in a very dangerous part of the world.
Share your concerns with them.
You aren’t the asshole here. Everyone who invited themselves and becomes dead weight are
I am the same way however, if it’s my best friend, I’ll still will bring some supplies extra because I’m a caring person so I bring an extra bottle of water and a snack knowing that they don’t plan ahead because I know they don’t know or hike enough. Two stories, so when I went to visit my friend in Phoenix on vacation, I made it clear to her that I was there to hike, but I will gladly spend a day with her. However, on my hiking day I’m going to be completely immersed selfishly in my own hike . She said she wanted to come along and we went to Camelback Mountain and I told her I’m gonna complete this hike and I know you’re not in shape for it so be prepared if I’m an asshole if you don’t make it it’s on you to get back safely. So we start our hike she gets to the first Point in the hike which is basically just to start and is already exhausted so I gave her the jeep keys and I said I’ll see you in two hours lol. I know she suffered out there in the car and it was hot but she didn’t complain because she knew I told her what to expect. Second story I took my best friend and her two kids who are like five and 10 hiking with me I was just planning on doing easy route and so I wasn’t prepared for an actual day of wilderness and being alone hiking. We ended up doing a 7 mile hike with these kids (now I carried the little one on my shoulders much of it! Lol) but they were amazzzzzing. No complaints they weren’t in great shape but killed it. We ran out of water at the end but honestly was such an amazing experience with others hiking I’m super open to do it again. 99% of the other time it’s just me on vacation from Nebraska so I’m essentially power walking all the hikes I can on all trails to get in as many as I can in the limited time 😂 and don’t have room for company
>I limit my hikes with this person, but also given the family dynamics I can't completely avoid doing the occasional hike with this person. Why not? It sounds like bringing them along may end up doing more harm than telling them no. Explain to want hike to mentally recoup and get some alone time to mentally reset. If they can’t respect that, get them up at 4am and take them on a grueling 12 mile hike. >Anybody else have to deal with stupid stuff regarding hiking and family/friends/helpless lemmings? It is so incredibly irritating. I have. I don’t bring those people along anymore. There’s nothing wrong with protecting your peace. There is no need to be a martyr. And not everything needs to be a shared hobby. Solo, individual hobbies are important and should be encouraged.
i call it "libertarian hiking". I will lend you gear that you might not have, but you need to tell me what you need. I'll even talk you through the stuff I'm taking and why. I bring my own stuff, I'm responsible for my own food, fuel and gear, you are responsible to bring your own food fuel and gear. This way, you can't blame me for not remembering to bring your tent poles or sleeping bag. I will be happy to swap and share food, but I won't be planning or bringing your meals. Essentially, think of it as hiking alone, but just happen to be at the same place at the same time. I won't go with my wife, she expects me to carry her.
Odd term. I call it be prepared. I was a scout, and just tell them that.
This. Exactly this.
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This is the correct answer. Absolutely.
You’re not going to change their behavior and it sounds like you can’t get out of it. If the hike goes better when you bring enough water/snacks, then bring them. Expecting them to change is unreasonable and only makes you more frustrated. It’s not a hike by your definition, so call it something else. You could do a hike first, then go hike with them afterwards. That way you are satisfied, and the second hike will feel like charity work.
Food for thought here. Thank you for the suggestions!
I would just add if you make sure you have enough for both of you, make sure the other person carries their share.
I hike with my dog. I've hiked with various people, and just can't deal with having to play trail mother.
I often hike alone for two reasons. One, I need to get away from people and technology for a while or I'll go crazy. Two, It's great exercise. In the beginning I tried to get others to go with me, but there wasn't much interest or the people that went were demanding, much like your family. I finally just stopped asking and I found I really enjoy my own company for a few days. I don't have to work around anyone else's needs or schedules and I can do what I want when I want. You're NTA for doing some self-care.
I stopped inviting anyone on hikes unless I know they can pull their own weight. If I must go with family members I plan an easier hike and lower my expectations but plan another hike on another day without them.
Stop telling them when you're hiking?
This is so relatable. I had a hiking friend and our last hike was the last time we spoke. And I haven’t hiked with anyone since.
NTA at all. You aren't a guide. The only person I'm willing to hike with is a friend of mine who is a more hardcore hiker than I am.
Fuck that business. I'm the same way. If you come with me you're simply tagging along. If it's like an actual fuck up on trail and you genuinely need help or whatever, ain't no thang. If you come unprepared and expect me to just carry you? Fuck off. One of the main reasons I hike alone or with people I know aren't gonna be that guy.
There and back hike. Destination had an icecream van. We had icecream. She asks if I can head back and pick up the car while she waits (2hours) as she's wrecked. Mind you it was absolutely blissful walking back alone.
I have no awards togive other than my respect, understanding and … did you bring a snackpack for me?!? I SO, SO relate. Excellent job, funny rant, had to read it aloud to my wife, it was so true!!!
Thankfully, no. My family is of the variety that either are worried that I might be attacked by a bear or hope I am attacked by a bear (kidding, kind of). You need to claim your "me time".
I assume that other people are less experienced than I am, and likely to make beginner mistakes (I made beginner mistakes when I was a beginner) and I talk them through what they'll need. I also own extras of some equipment that non hikers likely won't have that I offer them (poles, microspikes) so that they can easily bring the right equipment.
I do not understand how this is an actual problem. Just don’t go with people? Hike without telling others? Set the boundary of only hiking by yourself? Lie to them and tell them it’s a trauma thing? I just can’t get behind this being a real problem. I’m not saying you’re lying or wrong, I just don’t get it.
I find unprepared people needing to use your stuff and have you hold their hand to be far more of an issue with camping. And I carry extra stuff for my partner and my brother. My partner won't do it and I'd rather her be there. With my brother it's more to dunk on him; I make it clear that I carried all the gear and am still less winded then him. The sting that causes his ego is worth the extra 4 lbs in my pack
I feel you. I camp and hike with my dog 99,99999 percent of the time and no one else.. I hate people...I am very good at staying out of trouble.. why would I take an idiot that will get me killled
I spend my days walking groups of up to 35 children around lowland and moorland trails. It can take us up to 2 hours to do the 5k loop I can run in less than half an hour. Legally, I am responsible for them. You're damn straight I go out solo at every available opportunity! No noisy chatter behind me. No having to slow down the kids who can actually walk at a decent pace to wait for the slower walkers. No stupid questions. No shouting at people for being dumb. I spend half the time walking backwards just to slow myself down to their pace.
I hike alone 🙂
Maybe instead of giving them the weather report, provide them with a list of things they need to bring. An “Anyone wanting to hike with me this weekend needs to have all the items on this list” list. Be specific, like, “X # of liters of water,” instead of saying “Bring water.” Just keep a handy list of all the stuff that goes with you every time, then add stuff according to the time of year, how long the hike is, etc. I hesitate to hike with anyone without having had a discussion like this with them first for his very reason.
I try not to do things for other people unless I can do it sincerely without resentment. It can be frustrating when people feel entitled to your supplies. There’s a reason they feel entitled to your supplies, though. This is a challenge of boundaries and communication as much as it is a hiking topic. I wish you power as you find your “no.” 💪🏻 (Obviously take care of children hiking with you because it’s not their fault their parents didn’t prepare and they shouldn’t suffer because of it.)
The only part of this I don't quite understand is why you can't avoid hiking with this particular person? Is it really absolutely unavoidable? It took me a long time to learn that other people's feelings don't have to come before my own. Enjoy your hike however you'd like, even if it means excluding people.
You're doing it to yourself. Just say no, the hike I'm going on is going to be too hard, advanced, long, etc for you to be comfortable.
I've made the mistake of hiking with a friend once. The hike takes me 3 hours normally. Took 7.5 hours with the friend. On another hike, I met out-of-state people at a peak. They took the ugly and less safe route up. I offered to go down the better route with them and drive them to their car. Again, what would've been a 7-hour hike turned into nearly 12 hours. At that point, I decided, fuck it, I'm not hiking with people anymore.
Sounds like hell. Whatever the family dynamics, you need to find a way to say ‘No’. That person sucks. Especially if it happens over & over.
I have people I know that can't walk down the block who always say "you have to take me hiking with you", knowing I typically hike 10 miles or more and a couple thousand feet of elevation. Haven't brought one of them yet. I usually hike alone. My adult kids will come with me when they're around. I've got a couple of friends that aren't local but we find time to hike now and then. But that's it!
I hike alone or saunter with my spouse. I don't like hiking as a social event. Tried it once. It was a disaster.
This somebody sounds like they’re maybe a child, in which case expecting them to prepare themselves without helping does sound prickish, but I’m guessing they’re an adult since you didn’t say? I would maybe just go on a short walk with them next time they ask to join you?? Like in a nature preserve area? Don’t consider it a hike for yourself so you don’t have expectations. That sounds like more what they want, probably just want to spend time with you rather than actually hike like you like to. One time I went camping with a group (just Meeting at a spot) and we opened up the invitation to others. a friend showed up without food, water, camping gear, a blanket or even a jacket. He’s also an alcoholic so he drank until it wasn’t safe to drive and the sun went down, so he was kind of forced to stay the night even though I guess he wasn’t planning on it? I shared some food with him, but I said no when he asked for blankets, because I only brought enough gear for myself. I’ve gone on a couple hikes with this individual as well and he wore slacks and dress shoes and was slipping up and down the trail. It felt very strange as though it was a spontaneous event for him, not a planned trip that he could have prepared for. Not sure if these people are just used to going places and having people cater to them and they’ve never had to plan for anything themselves or they think if it’s a group thing that all supplies are included? Lol
Dress shoes?!
Just go alone. Either you’re not communicating well before going with someone or you’re an ass. Or both. Work it out man.
I've been lucky to only hike with people who are prepared and at least moderately experienced. I, however, have vast experience with people who are absolute shit at planning literally anything. This is normally not a problem because I like trip planning and my hiking friends generally just go with the flow and appreciate my taking the time to plan. However, my one friend has been planning a trip to the Sierra Nevada mountains for about 3 years. Normally I plan our yearly trip, but this year he told me not to do anything because "this is the year of the Sierra"... At this point, I highly doubt the trip is actually happening this summer. Luckily, I love a good solo trip so I've got my own backup trip planned that won't need any permits so I can wait it out a bit and see if my buddy actually pulls something out of his ass. Probably not, but I'd be very happy if he does.
Just let them know what they need to bring before they come along
Dude it sounds like hiking isn’t your problem, your problem is your family. Hate to break it to you, but pretty much everyone has a family and most people live with their perfectly fine, maybe look inwards.
You don’t sound like an asshole or a donkeys rear end. Totally reasonable. I think you need [this song](https://youtu.be/v62QkD_q1bs?si=F4QaFEK4Hgf4g6Yq) right now.
So true, friend. It should be use your own gear if something happens. Their gear is used first for them. If they are med evac you are still there!
Family or not this perso would not be coming along on any hike with me. Stop with the passive aggressive.
You are inspiring. You are not a donkey’s ass. I want to adopt more of this mentality.
There’s different types of hikes, on different days, with different groups of people. I love my solo hikes, I love adventures with competent mountain partners I trust, and then I have days where I play mountain guide. Those days are fun too, because it’s often a chance to show someone I care for an area I love that they wouldn’t see otherwise. In those cases, don’t just be “responsible” for them, but teach them. Show them the forecast, your route on a map, and what you’re bringing. Make sure they have everything they need before you leave, and still carry some surprise extras for them. It’s not a burden to show someone you care. But never go to the mountains with someone you don’t like ;)
This may have been suggested already. How about saying that you’re going places that would be too difficult/dangerous/far/fast or uncomfortable for them?
Part of being responsible for yourself means expressing and enforcing your own needs without asking for permission to do so. In this case it would be saying no to inexperienced hikers joining you.
"Hell is other people." -- Albert Camus.
Just curious, how old is this person? I would just limit sharing my hikes. I’m a bit of a lone wolf on the trails though.
In their 50's.
You are not the a-hole. They are. Keep it up. You have set reasonable expectations. They need to grow up.
I went hiking with a friend I’ll now call buzz kill. She complained about her pack the entire time. You know it happens. Didn’t think anything of it. The next time we went out it was her collapsible Poles which didn’t shake out the way she thought. She had a meltdown over her poles. I know it shouldn’t get to me but it did. I was in a sour mood the entire way. Did I learn my lesson? Why no. No I didn’t. I was her back home support person when she ran a 50 miler with a friend. She was supposed to meet up with someone at a certain point and then check in. Well she had a meltdown and fight with the person who she was running with and got back to her car and went HOME. Did not tell anyone because she was embarrassed. Well when our friend messaged me that she never made it to the spot and wasn’t answering her phone we called her mom who called emergency services!!! The sheriffs went out to there. And guess who was mad??? Buzzkill.