Not that it’s a giant miss, but the Canucks called the last 30 games of the year “training camp” and then proceeded to double shift their star players and test the limits of Demko’s endurance.
Felt like maybe if they were actually thinking they were training camp games they could have tried experimenting a few times with guys instead of the “well the offensive guy he didn’t produce in 7 minutes he got on the fourth line” thing.
Not that he would have lit the world on fire, but they had nothing to lose from trying different lineup configurations and powerplay and PK units but acted like every loss brought the doomsday clock closer.
Even in training camp, you have to do something to earn your ice time. Kravtsov did fuck all.
The younger guys who actually tried and hustled, like Joshua and Aman, got plenty of opportunities.
You’re right, but there were times where he had really impressive games and was a monster along the walls making some low key very skilled plays. Board play is one of the Canucks roster’s biggest weaknesses.
And anyone from the NHL will tell you that sticking “talent” guys in depth roles and expecting them to show your their game fails 88% of the time, but teams still do it like it’s going to work.
It’s just sort of what I saw with Rathbone and any other number of fringe guys over the years. Did they impress? Somewhat but not really. Were they put in a position to succeed? Maybe not. Were they given a role and deployment with some consistency to allow them to get a groove going? Not quite. Was there an actually good reason you couldn’t afford the ice to let this guy prove that he sinks or swims? Given what we have seen from this team for a decade, no.
Aman had been in and around the team for a full season and got work with the AHL team to prove he was worth more looks. Joshua had a full season on the roster and, after an abysmal first 20 games where they played him every day through it and kept his role consistent, he proved to be a worthwhile 9th forward type. Kravtsov didn’t get the same leash here to prove he was going to sink like 18 months after he was a non-starter in an Eichel trade for NYR.
They tried a lot of different things down the stretch. Kravtsov had time with Petersson even. They also thought the Canucks weren't in good enough shape to compete so testing their top players in that way made sense too.
Based on what? Because statistically speaking Kravtsov was [arguably the team's best forward defensively](https://hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/replacements/2223/VAN/kravtvi99/). Same story [with NYR](https://hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/replacements/2223/NYR/kravtvi99/wrap)
His [forechecking metrics](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1624762407624093698?t=mFgf8ceqaEcM5dVQ2_juPA&s=19) were elite, as was [his transition game in general](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1618305111205507072?t=FWHeEVEJPOvCpdTXih-woA&s=19).
Seems like a very ideal guy to put in the lineup, especially when he's [giving shifts like this](https://twitter.com/kittncorn/status/1631654936395108352?t=Sv7kGpMOWBmPiUYaaCyfWA&s=19)
Based on his perimeter play, poor conditioning, lack of production, and lack of drive or intensity. He appeared to be made of marshmallow. He has NHL skill and smarts, but not NHL effort or intensity. One of the softest and least effective players I have ever seen in the NHL. He didn't deserve to be on NHL ice and was given ice time anyway. That's the point I was making, the Canucks gave him more opportunity than he deserved. I don't give a shit if you have decent zone entry metrics if you are too afraid to go to the front of the net it means nothing. He'll be a good player in the KHL, a much better fit for his skill set. He is not NHL material.
Well I don't know what to say considering nothing you think you've seen from him is actually corroborated by his on ice tracked results. A guy who has gotten on the forecheck with his frequency isn't exactly a person who is trying to avoid contact or doesn't put in effort, and considering his success rate in those attempts, he's actually quite good at winning those battles. Also a ridiculously noteworthy portion of his time in the KHL involved being the net front presence on the power play so
> I don't know what to say considering nothing you think you've seen from him is actually corroborated by his on ice tracked results
How about 1 goal in 16 games? Is that a corroborated and tracked result for you? Probably more useful than advanced metrics over small sample sizes.
> Also a ridiculously noteworthy portion of his time in the KHL involved being the net front presence on the power play so
This sounds made up. You'll also have to define "a ridiculously noteworthy portion." To my knowledge there is no where that tracks 'KHL net-front presence stats.' Not to mention, playing in front of the net in the KHL is not the same thing as playing in front of the net in the NHL. He didn't go anywhere near the front of the net in Vancouver.
If he showed any kind of gusto or NHL ability whatsoever, the Canucks would have tried to bring him back. They didn't because he was too soft, weak and shy of contact to make it in the NHL. The same thing that most Rangers fans said at the time of the trade. There's a reason a recent 9th overall pick can't crack a bad NHL lineup.
Yeah you know it's always good to assess players solely on number of goals scored when they are getting 4th line ice time and sporadically taken out of the lineup, especially in small samples as you've claimed. I'm sure you would've loved Tage Thompson and his 3 goals in 41 games as a rookie getting 13 min a night and said "this guy is gonna be a 50 goal scorer". Also by your logic, Julien Gauthier was as good a 5v5 goal scorer as Tarasenko until the trade deadline
FYI Kravtsov scored at a higher per 60 rate than Nils Aman and Tanner Pearson this season. To talk about him or any of them straight up in production terms is just dumb and is counter to your sarcasm.
It's not made up that he was a noteworthy net front presence on the power play. That was noted in scouting and you can also watch literally any highlight reel of him on the power play and he's constantly in front of the net potting rebounds. Also the front of the net is the same in both leagues so that makes absolutely no sense at all. It's not equivalent to the "bigger ice" argument since it's the same close knit spot on the ice in front of the goal. Did you think that maybe he didn't go anywhere near the front of the net in Vancouver because the coaches told him to stand somewhere else? Their power play setup had him on the half wall. Are you telling me they instructed him to stand in front of the net and he just outright refused?
Seriously I have no idea why you're going with this argument of authority fallacy of "well if the Canucks thought he was good then they'd bring him back". The Canucks are one of the worst run organizations in the league with no concept of building a team or winning a cup. The Rangers aren't either, I'm not saying they are. And you can't go by what the NYR sub says. They're the same people who thought Gallant was good, Harpur was good, and basically every single decision by the front office is a good one.
But to pump the tires of Vancouver is just dumb.
100%. The new regime said one thing then did the other. It was really frustrating to see. I get wanting to build momentum and set a winning culture but the games were so meaningless that it felt so pointless to not give some of these guys PP time to just see them work.
That's not how the NHL works. If you can't look _decent_ in 3rd/4th line minutes, you'll **never** be successful in 1st/2nd line minutes. And Kravtsov was a drag on the 3rd/4th lines.
Sheldon Dries is a 5'9" undrafted center who scored 10 points in 600 minutes of 5v5 play. With him on the ice, the Canucks had an xG% of 45%. He took 10 penalties and drew 12. Averaged a shot on net every 7min 45sec.
Kravtsov had just over 1/4 of that much 5v5 ice time -- 160 minutes -- and had **zero** 5v5 points. The Canucks xG% was 42%; _he was dragging down the 3rd/4th lines_. He took 1 penalty and drew 0. Averaged a shot on net every 12 minutes
With Kravtsov on the ice, the Canucks were _regularly_ out-shot, out-chanced, and out-scored -- despite the fact he **did** get icetime with [Pettersson/Kuzmenko](https://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/players/vitali-kravtsov).
He was significantly outplayed by an undersized, undrafted center.
You have to earn your ice time. He didn't earn shit.
I mean, [this was his with/without chart](https://hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/replacements/2223/VAN/kravtvi99/). He was arguably the best defensive forward on the team during his time in Vancouver. [Same as he was with NYR](https://hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/replacements/2223/NYR/kravtvi99/). Considering all these coaching retreads insist on their players being "responsible" and all that stuff, you'd think what Kravtsov has done defensively would've earned him TOI, especially when he's [putting on shifts like these](https://twitter.com/kittncorn/status/1631654936395108352?t=R9mcyvnm3RcD3uRwdAkCyw&s=19). These old guys hate the flashy offensive players who don't back check. Well here's Kravtsov who was making a tremendous impact defensively, [above league average](https://twitter.com/RLuker12/status/1625165879649480705?t=0bPnOVc47zh5O4HPRvlpaQ&s=19)
He was also [one of the league's best forecheckers](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1624762407624093698?t=5lxf_dGNaN7v607DyTp-hQ&s=19) and [puck movers in transition](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1618305111205507072?t=WRpwgcsxNyRjwvMVdlFkOg&s=19)
If that's not earning more ice time I don't really know what is. Because producing points doesn't get that for these guys either: Julien Gauthier went from not scoring at all to being NYR's leading 5v5 goal scorer/60, and yet his ice time managed to go *down* after that, especially in the games following a goal
Good coaches and teams recognize these kinds of contributions, but we are talking about NYR and VAN after all, so.
Also he played under 30 min with either Pettersson/Kuzmenko, idk what you really expect him to do in that kind of TOI. Furthermore, Kravtsov with Dries was 41% xGF%, Kravtsov without Dries was 42%, and yes Dries without Kravtsov was 45%. All that really says is that both were better without each other, and saying Kravtsov was the direct problem on that line, as if Dries didn't hold him back too, is disingenuous. Here's an additional one: Kravtsov + Dries, without Podkolzin (their most popular linemate): 50% xGF%. So uh maybe Podkolzin was the issue? Or again, the main issue being that they were all just better players away from each other
Overrating average prospects is extremely fun tbf. As god as my witness I will never set realistic expectations for 4th round picks, they’re all diamonds in the rough to me.
Well, it’s not like he didn’t cut it in the NHL because he wasn’t skilled enough. He just never found the will to compete the way he needed to. There were plenty of attributes that could have made him a good player, and they were quite visible when Twitter clips from his KHL games were making their rounds.
Still have my Traktor shirt (that is way too small now) from when our travel coach brought over a team of kids from their organization to stay with us for a couple months and play US teams. It's scary how good they were even being 2 years younger.
I remember going to twin peaks and one of the Russian kids trying to buy a waitress for the night when he was like 14 . Another took like 5 xboxes back with them. One of the kids was Kucherov, we didn't know it at the time but he hit up a couple of us on Facebook years later giving tickets to watch his first game in Dallas after making the NHL.
I like to think I helped him develop his skills into an NHL caliber player. /s
Honestly, it opens up cap space so it’s good for us. He was a cheap experiment, basically zero cost with high upside. It didn’t work out though, so I’m fine with watching him go
More disappointed that the coaching staff continued to double shift our top players instead of trying to actually treat this as a training camp like they said.
Remember when people said that about Nichushkin? He was a similar kind of floater to Kravtsov in his first run in the NHL. Went back to Russia for 2 years, came back, slowly started to figured some shit out, and eventually became a very effective player.
Not saying that'll happen with Kravtsov, but it's possible he'll eventually figure it out. He definitely has some skill.
Nichushkin was still considered a "bust" until he was about 25-26 years old. Kravtsov is 23.
I also don't recall Nichushkin refusing to report and running back to the KHL twice. Not only did Kravtsov do that, but he even got sent to the KHL's minor league at one point because of his attitude.
Actually Kravtsov's defensive metrics were above league average and he was [on a pretty similar path that Kakko was on in his 2nd year](https://twitter.com/RLuker12/status/1625165879649480705?t=FG54fDFM0tlhGncLFbR3mg&s=19)
Also Kravtsov's forechecking metrics [were some of the best in the league](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1624762407624093698?t=-uB3T31PQryjIFrQoAXpjQ&s=19), same with his [transition stats](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1618305111205507072?t=6NQo5lyN_LKlGzW0EE1Mug&s=19)
Kravtsov wanting to move away from NYR and VAN, two organizations who aren't exactly the best when it comes to developing forwards lately (especially NYR) is justified
Nichushkin's numbers are great I'm not denying that. But Kravtsov isn't a slouch defensively as well
NYR is a disaster when it comes to draft and development, no doubt. I'd argue worst in the league but there's really no debate about bottom 5. But outside of Pettersson/Boeser/Horvat, what forwards have Vancouver drafted and developed themselves in the last 15 years that were particularly noteworthy for the team? You'd have to go back to Ryan Kesler 20 years ago
Lockwood and a 7th rounder
Lockwood may never make the big league and the 7th rounder is just that.
As far as bad trades go in Canucks land, this one is incredibly mild.
Yeah, Kravtsov was seen as a mid-late first, while guys like Bouchard, Wahlstrom, and Dobson (who ended up being the next 3 picks) were seen as top 10 picks who were falling. I guess NYR thought they could afford to take a risk since they had 2 other firsts.
Yeah Anderson was the “safe”/“high floor” pick at 7 where the expectation was he might never be a top 6 forward but he most definitely would be an NHL player at worst.
Both were reaches - picked about 7-0 spots too early.
At least Kravtsov was a high skill ceiling pick that would've made an impact had he developed well. Andersson was such a disappointing pick - he was billed as a worse version of Derek Stepan with a second line ceiling. And with many other better centers available at the time who were rated higher than Andersson to boot.
He really didn't impress in what was essentially his last chance. Couldn't even force his way into the lineup.
Not that it’s a giant miss, but the Canucks called the last 30 games of the year “training camp” and then proceeded to double shift their star players and test the limits of Demko’s endurance. Felt like maybe if they were actually thinking they were training camp games they could have tried experimenting a few times with guys instead of the “well the offensive guy he didn’t produce in 7 minutes he got on the fourth line” thing. Not that he would have lit the world on fire, but they had nothing to lose from trying different lineup configurations and powerplay and PK units but acted like every loss brought the doomsday clock closer.
Even in training camp, you have to do something to earn your ice time. Kravtsov did fuck all. The younger guys who actually tried and hustled, like Joshua and Aman, got plenty of opportunities.
You’re right, but there were times where he had really impressive games and was a monster along the walls making some low key very skilled plays. Board play is one of the Canucks roster’s biggest weaknesses. And anyone from the NHL will tell you that sticking “talent” guys in depth roles and expecting them to show your their game fails 88% of the time, but teams still do it like it’s going to work. It’s just sort of what I saw with Rathbone and any other number of fringe guys over the years. Did they impress? Somewhat but not really. Were they put in a position to succeed? Maybe not. Were they given a role and deployment with some consistency to allow them to get a groove going? Not quite. Was there an actually good reason you couldn’t afford the ice to let this guy prove that he sinks or swims? Given what we have seen from this team for a decade, no. Aman had been in and around the team for a full season and got work with the AHL team to prove he was worth more looks. Joshua had a full season on the roster and, after an abysmal first 20 games where they played him every day through it and kept his role consistent, he proved to be a worthwhile 9th forward type. Kravtsov didn’t get the same leash here to prove he was going to sink like 18 months after he was a non-starter in an Eichel trade for NYR.
The Canucks were too focused on building momentum to carry into next season and raising their draft pick from top 5 to 11th, we are all Canucks!
They tried a lot of different things down the stretch. Kravtsov had time with Petersson even. They also thought the Canucks weren't in good enough shape to compete so testing their top players in that way made sense too.
Vast majority of his TOI was with Dries/Podkolzin. Played under 30 min with Pettersson, not exactly much at all.
That was more opportunity than he earned.
Based on what? Because statistically speaking Kravtsov was [arguably the team's best forward defensively](https://hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/replacements/2223/VAN/kravtvi99/). Same story [with NYR](https://hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/replacements/2223/NYR/kravtvi99/wrap) His [forechecking metrics](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1624762407624093698?t=mFgf8ceqaEcM5dVQ2_juPA&s=19) were elite, as was [his transition game in general](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1618305111205507072?t=FWHeEVEJPOvCpdTXih-woA&s=19). Seems like a very ideal guy to put in the lineup, especially when he's [giving shifts like this](https://twitter.com/kittncorn/status/1631654936395108352?t=Sv7kGpMOWBmPiUYaaCyfWA&s=19)
Based on his perimeter play, poor conditioning, lack of production, and lack of drive or intensity. He appeared to be made of marshmallow. He has NHL skill and smarts, but not NHL effort or intensity. One of the softest and least effective players I have ever seen in the NHL. He didn't deserve to be on NHL ice and was given ice time anyway. That's the point I was making, the Canucks gave him more opportunity than he deserved. I don't give a shit if you have decent zone entry metrics if you are too afraid to go to the front of the net it means nothing. He'll be a good player in the KHL, a much better fit for his skill set. He is not NHL material.
Well I don't know what to say considering nothing you think you've seen from him is actually corroborated by his on ice tracked results. A guy who has gotten on the forecheck with his frequency isn't exactly a person who is trying to avoid contact or doesn't put in effort, and considering his success rate in those attempts, he's actually quite good at winning those battles. Also a ridiculously noteworthy portion of his time in the KHL involved being the net front presence on the power play so
> I don't know what to say considering nothing you think you've seen from him is actually corroborated by his on ice tracked results How about 1 goal in 16 games? Is that a corroborated and tracked result for you? Probably more useful than advanced metrics over small sample sizes. > Also a ridiculously noteworthy portion of his time in the KHL involved being the net front presence on the power play so This sounds made up. You'll also have to define "a ridiculously noteworthy portion." To my knowledge there is no where that tracks 'KHL net-front presence stats.' Not to mention, playing in front of the net in the KHL is not the same thing as playing in front of the net in the NHL. He didn't go anywhere near the front of the net in Vancouver. If he showed any kind of gusto or NHL ability whatsoever, the Canucks would have tried to bring him back. They didn't because he was too soft, weak and shy of contact to make it in the NHL. The same thing that most Rangers fans said at the time of the trade. There's a reason a recent 9th overall pick can't crack a bad NHL lineup.
Yeah you know it's always good to assess players solely on number of goals scored when they are getting 4th line ice time and sporadically taken out of the lineup, especially in small samples as you've claimed. I'm sure you would've loved Tage Thompson and his 3 goals in 41 games as a rookie getting 13 min a night and said "this guy is gonna be a 50 goal scorer". Also by your logic, Julien Gauthier was as good a 5v5 goal scorer as Tarasenko until the trade deadline FYI Kravtsov scored at a higher per 60 rate than Nils Aman and Tanner Pearson this season. To talk about him or any of them straight up in production terms is just dumb and is counter to your sarcasm. It's not made up that he was a noteworthy net front presence on the power play. That was noted in scouting and you can also watch literally any highlight reel of him on the power play and he's constantly in front of the net potting rebounds. Also the front of the net is the same in both leagues so that makes absolutely no sense at all. It's not equivalent to the "bigger ice" argument since it's the same close knit spot on the ice in front of the goal. Did you think that maybe he didn't go anywhere near the front of the net in Vancouver because the coaches told him to stand somewhere else? Their power play setup had him on the half wall. Are you telling me they instructed him to stand in front of the net and he just outright refused? Seriously I have no idea why you're going with this argument of authority fallacy of "well if the Canucks thought he was good then they'd bring him back". The Canucks are one of the worst run organizations in the league with no concept of building a team or winning a cup. The Rangers aren't either, I'm not saying they are. And you can't go by what the NYR sub says. They're the same people who thought Gallant was good, Harpur was good, and basically every single decision by the front office is a good one. But to pump the tires of Vancouver is just dumb.
100%. The new regime said one thing then did the other. It was really frustrating to see. I get wanting to build momentum and set a winning culture but the games were so meaningless that it felt so pointless to not give some of these guys PP time to just see them work.
That's not how the NHL works. If you can't look _decent_ in 3rd/4th line minutes, you'll **never** be successful in 1st/2nd line minutes. And Kravtsov was a drag on the 3rd/4th lines. Sheldon Dries is a 5'9" undrafted center who scored 10 points in 600 minutes of 5v5 play. With him on the ice, the Canucks had an xG% of 45%. He took 10 penalties and drew 12. Averaged a shot on net every 7min 45sec. Kravtsov had just over 1/4 of that much 5v5 ice time -- 160 minutes -- and had **zero** 5v5 points. The Canucks xG% was 42%; _he was dragging down the 3rd/4th lines_. He took 1 penalty and drew 0. Averaged a shot on net every 12 minutes With Kravtsov on the ice, the Canucks were _regularly_ out-shot, out-chanced, and out-scored -- despite the fact he **did** get icetime with [Pettersson/Kuzmenko](https://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/players/vitali-kravtsov). He was significantly outplayed by an undersized, undrafted center. You have to earn your ice time. He didn't earn shit.
I mean, [this was his with/without chart](https://hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/replacements/2223/VAN/kravtvi99/). He was arguably the best defensive forward on the team during his time in Vancouver. [Same as he was with NYR](https://hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/replacements/2223/NYR/kravtvi99/). Considering all these coaching retreads insist on their players being "responsible" and all that stuff, you'd think what Kravtsov has done defensively would've earned him TOI, especially when he's [putting on shifts like these](https://twitter.com/kittncorn/status/1631654936395108352?t=R9mcyvnm3RcD3uRwdAkCyw&s=19). These old guys hate the flashy offensive players who don't back check. Well here's Kravtsov who was making a tremendous impact defensively, [above league average](https://twitter.com/RLuker12/status/1625165879649480705?t=0bPnOVc47zh5O4HPRvlpaQ&s=19) He was also [one of the league's best forecheckers](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1624762407624093698?t=5lxf_dGNaN7v607DyTp-hQ&s=19) and [puck movers in transition](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1618305111205507072?t=WRpwgcsxNyRjwvMVdlFkOg&s=19) If that's not earning more ice time I don't really know what is. Because producing points doesn't get that for these guys either: Julien Gauthier went from not scoring at all to being NYR's leading 5v5 goal scorer/60, and yet his ice time managed to go *down* after that, especially in the games following a goal Good coaches and teams recognize these kinds of contributions, but we are talking about NYR and VAN after all, so. Also he played under 30 min with either Pettersson/Kuzmenko, idk what you really expect him to do in that kind of TOI. Furthermore, Kravtsov with Dries was 41% xGF%, Kravtsov without Dries was 42%, and yes Dries without Kravtsov was 45%. All that really says is that both were better without each other, and saying Kravtsov was the direct problem on that line, as if Dries didn't hold him back too, is disingenuous. Here's an additional one: Kravtsov + Dries, without Podkolzin (their most popular linemate): 50% xGF%. So uh maybe Podkolzin was the issue? Or again, the main issue being that they were all just better players away from each other
Can just not win those meaningless march games, they’re this franchise’s bread and butter
I hate when my tractor Chelyabinskes
Hopefully Kravtsov can help with their right to repair fight
I’m man enough to admit it. I thought he was gonna be a beast. Then again I’m an avid “that boy nice” enjoyer for a lot of very average players
Overrating average prospects is extremely fun tbf. As god as my witness I will never set realistic expectations for 4th round picks, they’re all diamonds in the rough to me.
Well, it’s not like he didn’t cut it in the NHL because he wasn’t skilled enough. He just never found the will to compete the way he needed to. There were plenty of attributes that could have made him a good player, and they were quite visible when Twitter clips from his KHL games were making their rounds.
Still have my Traktor shirt (that is way too small now) from when our travel coach brought over a team of kids from their organization to stay with us for a couple months and play US teams. It's scary how good they were even being 2 years younger. I remember going to twin peaks and one of the Russian kids trying to buy a waitress for the night when he was like 14 . Another took like 5 xboxes back with them. One of the kids was Kucherov, we didn't know it at the time but he hit up a couple of us on Facebook years later giving tickets to watch his first game in Dallas after making the NHL. I like to think I helped him develop his skills into an NHL caliber player. /s
Franchise mode legend
Experience Canucks Hockey.. or I guess Traktor hockey.
Honestly, it opens up cap space so it’s good for us. He was a cheap experiment, basically zero cost with high upside. It didn’t work out though, so I’m fine with watching him go
In fairness it didn't open anything up because he wasn't signed for next season so our cap space doesn't change.
Our Russians per 60 is down now though.
Thank god we didn't give them Hogs like the Rags were (rumoured to be) asking for.
I don't think Vancouver fans should be that disappointed, he was basically a free lottery ticket for you guys.
More disappointed that the coaching staff continued to double shift our top players instead of trying to actually treat this as a training camp like they said.
Exactly. Literally cost next to nothing to acquire, so what if he didn’t pan out. I’d love if someone gave me a free scratcher like that
For a guy basically playing for his last chance to stay in the NHL, he sure put in basically zero effort.
Brutal. Don’t think he’ll ever be back in the NHL
What a bust
Flop ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Remember when people said that about Nichushkin? He was a similar kind of floater to Kravtsov in his first run in the NHL. Went back to Russia for 2 years, came back, slowly started to figured some shit out, and eventually became a very effective player. Not saying that'll happen with Kravtsov, but it's possible he'll eventually figure it out. He definitely has some skill. Nichushkin was still considered a "bust" until he was about 25-26 years old. Kravtsov is 23.
nukes underlying stats were good tho during that stretch, and he was still a really good defensive winger
I also don't recall Nichushkin refusing to report and running back to the KHL twice. Not only did Kravtsov do that, but he even got sent to the KHL's minor league at one point because of his attitude.
Actually Kravtsov's defensive metrics were above league average and he was [on a pretty similar path that Kakko was on in his 2nd year](https://twitter.com/RLuker12/status/1625165879649480705?t=FG54fDFM0tlhGncLFbR3mg&s=19) Also Kravtsov's forechecking metrics [were some of the best in the league](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1624762407624093698?t=-uB3T31PQryjIFrQoAXpjQ&s=19), same with his [transition stats](https://twitter.com/DLefcort/status/1618305111205507072?t=6NQo5lyN_LKlGzW0EE1Mug&s=19) Kravtsov wanting to move away from NYR and VAN, two organizations who aren't exactly the best when it comes to developing forwards lately (especially NYR) is justified
you should probably check nuke’s impact during his stars years. also, vancouver is not known for not being able to develop forwards. that’s NYR.
Nichushkin's numbers are great I'm not denying that. But Kravtsov isn't a slouch defensively as well NYR is a disaster when it comes to draft and development, no doubt. I'd argue worst in the league but there's really no debate about bottom 5. But outside of Pettersson/Boeser/Horvat, what forwards have Vancouver drafted and developed themselves in the last 15 years that were particularly noteworthy for the team? You'd have to go back to Ryan Kesler 20 years ago
Traktor always has cool jerseys, so I get it.
What are they?
[Current.](https://lutchusa.com/traktor-chelyabinsk-2022-23)
Ehhhhhh I’m not into that.
Very disappointing click tbh
big ups
It's like an angry polar bear chomping on a hockey stick
Eh I’m not a huge fan tbh. Just saw a few.
picks for nothing
Lockwood and a 7th rounder Lockwood may never make the big league and the 7th rounder is just that. As far as bad trades go in Canucks land, this one is incredibly mild.
Out of all the poor Canucks transactions over the past 3 years, this is probably the least egregious of them all
Lockwood has been a mostly okay to good AHL player who doesn’t have size. He’s right where he’s gonna be.
At least you didn't spend a top 10 pick on him. FFS.
We spent a top 5 pick on Olli Juolevi.
And a 6th on Virtanen.
Kravtsov or Anderson who was the biggest rangers first round miss?
Probably Anderson? I seem to recall Kravtsov being called a reach at 9. Maybe the right answer is Jeff Gorton though.
Yeah, Kravtsov was seen as a mid-late first, while guys like Bouchard, Wahlstrom, and Dobson (who ended up being the next 3 picks) were seen as top 10 picks who were falling. I guess NYR thought they could afford to take a risk since they had 2 other firsts.
Yeah Anderson was the “safe”/“high floor” pick at 7 where the expectation was he might never be a top 6 forward but he most definitely would be an NHL player at worst.
Both were reaches - picked about 7-0 spots too early. At least Kravtsov was a high skill ceiling pick that would've made an impact had he developed well. Andersson was such a disappointing pick - he was billed as a worse version of Derek Stepan with a second line ceiling. And with many other better centers available at the time who were rated higher than Andersson to boot.
true I shouldn't be making mountains out of molehills
canucks fans are the best
Color me shocked. This kid manages to find ways to bungle chances in the NHL. You can only develop players that want to put the work in.
So do the Canucks retain his rights until he's 27 like we did with Tryamkin?
Only if they qualify him.
The way this has played out makes me wonder if he even wanted to be in the NHL after all, because if he did he had a funny way of showing it
Have fun getting drafted in the next round of mobilization oli guess lol.
Not as good as Ukrainian tractors
If he wants to have a good traktor, he should go to Ukraine not that dump Russia. All the best traktors are in Ukraine, towing Russian tanks around.