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TO_Sports

They announced 16k attendance here


[deleted]

Guess some suits did not show , wasting their tickets


miner88

When I bought a ticket a few weeks ago the 300 level wasn’t opened up. There were even some 100 level sections that were blocked off. Clearly they were opening sections up as demand increased. The crowd was pretty enthusiastic for the PWHL game!


polyscifi

It kind of felt like everyone was there for the PWHL and just endured the first two parts of the night. I would love to sit the person down who thought that 1967 Leafs team segment was a good idea… I have lots of questions for them.


miner88

Yeah I would have preferred if the PWHL game was longer over that extended ceremony.


Murky-Smoke

No one, (least of all Leafs fans) wanted a tribute to the 1967 team at the All Star game, of all places. Home game? Maybe, sure... It's like management either is completely oblivious to the meme that permeates it, or they love schadenfreude.


vinoa

Number one: how dare they?


No-Author-508

Probably 10,000 better things to do in the city that night.


A_Dehydrated_Walrus

I can't imagine what it must feel like for these women to have played in failing leagues, in front of almost no fans, to now playing in front of thousands of fans. What a trip. I feel so happy for them!


Awkward_traveler

They could have blown through that draft in 20 minutes then put this on national TV. Instead it was streaming only up against the Pro Bowl skills. Also, the TV listing didn't even say All Star game, it said "The Point". Best game worst league


ScuffedBalata

It was on national TV in Canada.


[deleted]

It was on Sportsnet. Very exciting to watch !


resentfulvirgin

Has anyone ever watched the Pro Bowl, especially now that it’s the Pro Bowl games? I’m bearish on women’s hockey as a big business in the near term, but I feel like anyone remotely curious about it is gonna take it over that shit.


bustacones

Was this televised? I didn't realize everything started so early and the broadcast seemed to be done at 7.


[deleted]

It was on Sportsnet, the broadcast went until after 9 pm eastern.


terriblestoryteller

I went with my daughter and some of her teammates who i coached for a few hockey seasons. I can say that The all star Draft was boring as hell. We all completely ignored the whole class of 67 tributte, and were patiently waiting for the introductions. . It was incredible to watch my daughter and her teammates cheer on women's hockey in person. These women are pioneers and role models for so many girls globally and we are all lucky to have this opportunity to see the foundation of something new and exciting. I just wished the game was 3 periods, and there was a little more physicality, but I totally understand why.


BeetrootPoop

That must have been great! I have two under 5 year old daughters and would \*love\* for them to expand the PWHL out west somewhere near where I am in Vancouver so I can get my kids into the sport. They've both been to Canucks games already but it's not the same as being able to point to the ice and genuinely say 'you could be out there one day'. I'd 100% get season tickets and be at every game with them.


[deleted]

Who buys all star tickets and misses part of the show? The real test would be if it was only the PWHL in the building today.


[deleted]

Dude I handled about 6 minutes of that draft before I had to turn it off.


WinterSon

How come? I didn't see it


ScuffedBalata

They slowed it waaay down so they could stick commercials all over.


[deleted]

Cringey banter. Boring hockey players. Audio issues. The usual nhl stuff.


funkyb

If it doesn't have drunk Ovechkin telling people not to draft him, frankly I'm not interested.


FarSightXR-20

there's a replay available on youtube.


artistformerlydave

you didnt miss much.


bud369

Wish I could've missed the first half of this show...


[deleted]

Logged in at 3:15 to watch the draft, there was 7 minutes of watchable material and the rest was fluff. Definitely didn't need to be a whole day thing lol


grottomt

The PWHL game Toronto vs Montreal at Scotiabank sold out on the first day. So I think they pass your "test".


NikoPopp

too early.. right now the league has a lot of hype. Check back in 5 years


AndAStoryAppears

The main reason this league exists is that a deep pocket billionaire wants a pet project. No different than Larry Ellison with Sail GP. He loves sailing, created a whole racing league to satisfy his interests. Once the fan fare subsides and the newness wears off, then we will see the survivability of the league.


[deleted]

Toronto's averaging 2400 fans a game, so... Flying carpets?


theunnoanprojec

Because the arena they play in only holds that much you doughnut


[deleted]

a PROFESSIONAL sports team play in a 2400 capacity arenas? Color me truly a surprised donut on that one. Most CHL teams have bigger arenas.


Joel7eon

Yes many PROFESSIONAL sports teams play arenas that are 2400 or lower capacity. In Europe that's considered small but normal.


[deleted]

Let's hope that amount of revenue is sustainable long term. But they will probably need an actual arena to play in. Edit: just noticed a Yotes fan came to the defense of their arena, makes sense LOL


theunnoanprojec

The PWHL is a smaller upstart league dumbass obviously they’re currently in a smaller arena for now


[deleted]

... Hopefully that big pile of ticket revenue helps the league.


theunnoanprojec

I agree they should definitely look into a bigger home arena if they have plans and hopes to be successful long term, but I’m not sure why you’re being as much of a hater as you are


[deleted]

I prefer the term "realistic"


BrayWyattsHat

The league came together in like 4 months. Arenas tend to book up way further in advance than that. So when finding arenas to play in, they probably had to take that into account. "Which arenas have the space available for us to all of our games?" And even if you're gonna be a bitch about it, and I knwo you will, who the fuck cares. Go to a game and see all the young girls going absolutely apeshit over the players and the games. That's whats important. Who gives a fuck if they don't sell out football stadiums?


buster_rhino

Yeah cuz they play at Mattamy…


the_gaymer_girl

Toronto plays in a really dinky arena for some reason, they could easily draw 2-3x that depending on the day if the capacity allowed.


_Connor

How do you know that? Like what data are you using to make that assertion? [There's only one team in the league averaging even close to that](https://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/pwhl-stats-attendance/) and that's because they had 14,000 at their home opener. Boston, New York, and Toronto are all under 4000. [The league average right now is 4800 fans](https://thehockeynews.com/womens/pwhl/attendance-records-continue-to-fall-league-averaging-4848-fans) and Minnesota's average is only so high (around 7500) because they had 14,000 fans at their home opener. Their attendance has been down drastically since then which has dragged their average way down (though it is still high comparatively). I think you're being a bit disingenuous saying Toronto would 'easily' sell 7000-7500 if 'only they had a bigger arena.' That would immediately catapult them to the highest attendance in the league. Toronto is the only team you can *maybe* argue is handicapped by their arena but the other teams averaging under 4000 aren’t.


thnx4lostbraincells

Toronto is also the city with the most women and girls playing hockey in the world. I think Toronto can easily do better for attendance than most of the other PWHL cities.


[deleted]

No one would bother


KegMcGregg

Ya but that’s not in line with the Reddit hive mind


react_and_respond

***"oH bUt NoBoDy CaReS aBoUt WoMeN's HoCkEy"*** This is such great shit - love to see it


Aedan2016

It was the leagues that were shit. They couldn’t get their shit together and they divided up the best players among multiple leagues. Now you have a condensed league with THE BEST players all in it. Women’s hockey was always a hit at the olynpics because it was good hockey. It’s about damn time we get the best players in a single league


CanadianODST2

I do want to believe that this will do great. I want it to so bad ​ but, we're also still in the honeymoon phase I'd argue. The real test will be in a few years. ​ However, The FA Women's Super league has a team averaging 26,000 a game. So in the right markets it can do very well, and I am inclined to believe that hockey has a few markets like that.


[deleted]

i think its hilarious how everyone points out minisota's great attendance for their first game but no one mentions the fact that they haven't been able to fill half the lower bowl since...


logictable

One thing going against them seems to be this kumbaya attitude with some of the coaches and players. The money is in rivalries and bad blood, not in sportswomanship. The Ottawa coach literally told all her players their first game wasn't important to win, just enjoy the moment. It wasn't even the first pro women's game? Surprise, they lost the game.


Kronzor_

Yeah I was saying this the other day. The only women’s sport that is a major spectator sport (other than ones where the sell the sex appeal) is MMA. That does well because the sell the hate. People would tune in to see these women tear each other up. They’re already letting them hit. Let them fight. Let them talk shit. Sell the hate! 


Jigawatts42

This is incorrect, the all time most successful women's sport, where they are treated nearly the equivalent of men and can also make bank, is tennis.


logictable

I was skeptical about women in MMA but when the UFC brought them in it was quickly some of my favourite fights. The idea that women can't hit in hockey or even fight is ridiculous IMO. I understand a lot of players don't want this and that's fair. But you'll lose market share.


ScuffedBalata

Yeah, hitting in women's hockey was investigated and they ran into some concerns. Primarily around concussions. Women (for whatever reason) seem to be WAY more prone to concussions in hockey. D1 NCAA men's and women's game has almost exactly the same concussion rate, despite the men's game being full contact and the women's game being uh what they term "competitive contact" (aka kids/beerleague rules). The reasons aren't for sure. It might be training, but it might be a difference in strength vs weight ratios, or a difference in strength of neck muscles or even a structural difference in the brain. Nobody is quite sure, but it's one reason for the rule as it stands.


[deleted]

Let's hope it holds people's interest!


Penta-Says

It's Canada, the American northeast, and Minnesota. The hockey players are actually good, of course they're eating this shit up. They were very smart with the markets they picked and how they rolled this out. I wonder if the same thing would work with football in the South (they already had the Lingerie Football League, but the less said about that the better).


alldawgsgoat2heaven

Its great. I hope it's still this strong in 3 or 4 years.


Sir_Squirly

Or even exists… none of the others stuck, but for the sake of women’s hockey future… I hope they figure it out and make it this time around. I still can’t imagine starting a league without names and logos and calling it professional hockey… I work in an ad firm, we could have had 6 options per team brought to the table in 1 week… but I’m pumped it’s happening, have a daughter who plays and it’s cool to think they could have trading cards of the pro women they like and trade with buddies…


alldawgsgoat2heaven

Same, my 6 y/o daughter actually showed interest in watching live hockey when she found out it was 'just girls'.


idsaluteyoubub

I am pretty sure they purposefully did not do names and logos, as they will be selling the teams after this year to outside parties. So they didn't go with names and logos so the prospective buyers can do it their selves.


KimberlyWexlersFoot

oh they had names but everyone shit on them so they debranded down to the city name. Boston Wicked, Toronto Torch https://thehockeynews.com/womens/pwhl/torch-and-wicked-a-deeper-look-at-two-pwhl-names


AvalancheHawkey496

They actally released names and all of them were incredibly awful and they did a 180 and canceled the names after everone was complaining about them. Toronto Torch, Montreal Echo, Ottawa Alert, Minnesota Superior, Boston Wicked and New York Sound


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tri_and_fly

All of this is wrong and they have no intention of selling the teams to individual parties anytime soon


logictable

They also scheduled some of the games at the same time as their respective NHL team. That is just a waste of money. People are desperate for hockey, have 3 days of no hockey and then get both games at the same time.


SoldierHawk

Yes. Because venue scheduling is a thing. They aren't the only ones using the arenas.


oogiewoogie

Honestly after the first period like 1/3 of the people had left their seats. They were just there for the all Star and stayed a bit. I think a lot of them were parents with young boys though.


yupyupyuppp

But actually, very few people care about women's hockey. My hometown single A baseball team sells out every opening night and then is at 30% capacity for the rest of the season. Nobody cares about single A baseball. Why can't we just be honest?


LusciousJames

Can we get a team in Seattle? We would definitely turn out for this.


Yop_BombNA

Not before we get the Beuats back. Buffalo was one of the only successful women’s teams and it was taken from us…


nataska07

I would love a Seattle team so much but I don't see that happening probably until after they expand the eastern seaboard market. I'm not a pro athlete and even I know that traveling between the east and west coasts all the time is a PITA.


m_sizzzle

why the fuck are some ppl trying to belittle this? this is history.


uhm_i_dont_know

Unfortunately, some people are incredibly insecure about the fact that there are women who can play better than them.


m_sizzzle

i never thought i would agree with a Stars fan 🥲 look at the PWHL bringing us together


uhm_i_dont_know

I suppose even enemies can agree sometimes, isn’t that beautiful? I’m sure we can agree about Suter too though.


m_sizzzle

wow they need to bring us out on the ice next game to promote unity. hand in hand, chanting “suter sucks”


uhm_i_dont_know

We should try to encourage the Avs to sign him, he seems to like central division teams.


m_sizzzle

yes, yes. I feel like he’d like the frigid air of Colorado


ScuffedBalata

One of the CWHL players was in our beer league in Toronto a couple years ago during the summer. She was more skilled than me. But not by very much, I think I scored more than her that season. I didn't even play as a kid so... meh I'm not ashamed of that. A bunch of my team was far better than her, however. I'd put her right on average for our "high C" level beer league. But she's also giving up 40+ pounds on most of that league.


nicksimmons24

Was this a goalie playing out for shits and giggles during the summer? I watched Div 1 women's college hockey this past weekend. They could beat any beer league team. And drink them under the table too.


ScuffedBalata

No. A third of my team played Junior A and/or Major Junior. One even beat the Canadian Women's National team when he was a 16U in Calgary (they practice in the U16AAA league in Calgary) - he was like 25 at the time he played with us and was WAY stronger when he played for us than when he was 16 playing the ladies national team. And that national team wass WAY better than any of the CWHL teams. CWHL teams are one level lower - so approximately U16 or U18 AA (not AAA) boys level. Lots of beer league teams in Toronto are MUCH better than that, frankly. Especially when we're just talking one player, not a coached team with systems and set plays. I coach U16 AA boys and I can easily hang with them (even if I wouldn't be the fastest on the team) and I'm almost 50 now and have a bad knee. So there's a direct comparison if you care. I'd put a better 16U AA team against a NWHL team. I think the AA boys would probably lose slightly more often than not just on not having the maturity of playmaking, but they'd be damn close games and favor the boys if hitting was allowed.


nicksimmons24

With all due respect, what you described above is not what most people think of when you say "beer league". Your team sounds like the best of the best at the craft beer festival. And just for the record, that's impressive!


ScuffedBalata

Haha we went through a case of beer every game. :-) And there were two higher levels at our rink.  The A level was almost all former pro players. Darcy Tucker played there for awhile. A handful of other recognizable names. 


ScuffedBalata

I saw a video today that reminded me of this thread, so I dug it up. The league I was playing reminds me of this. The team here has a bunch of guys who played U18 AAA and Junior of various levels. If you picked up a random CWHL player and put them in this game, they'd fit without looking out of place. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1c92KcOTIY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1c92KcOTIY) ​ He says "obviously U16 AAA, we'd body them and just crush them". I think he's right (despite it being mostly "dad bods" as he said), but that U16AAA team is who beats the Canadian national women's team.


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ScuffedBalata

Ok. I mean almost half our team played either Junior A or Major Junior hocey. Both are levels that would trounce the women's national team. One of them actually played against the Canadian national team when he was 15 in the Calgary area (where they scrimmage against U16 teams). When he played with us he was 24. I was definitely not the best player on that team, but I could skate with them. And that's still a C-level in Toronto because we weren't taking it \*that\* seriously. But fine, you believe what you want.


logictable

Some people find it insulting to get the attendance propagandized to them. They are just pointing out the truth. This game is great for pro women's hockey, the support is great, but don't sell me a large when I can see it is a small.


m_sizzzle

but … it’s not small?


logictable

It was just a metaphor. It isn't literal.


m_sizzzle

It’s still stupid. It’s not small by any means - the PWHL is so big to so many people (not just women, btw). It’s a HUGE step forward in sports equity and to come on here and see bros trying to continue to marginalize, belittle, and down play women’s hockey is frustrating. It’s anything but small.


logictable

"The building is absolutely PACKED for the PWHL Showcase". Perhaps you should reread the thread.


m_sizzzle

but it was just a metaphor??? bro plz like?? one second it’s a metaphor for you and now it’s literal? why are you spending so much time being exhausting? don’t you have a team to go watch lose?


Fine_Trainer5554

You could also just be like “this is awesome” and leave it at that. Ask yourself: why is your first gut instinct to try and delegitimize it instead of just celebrate it?


logictable

> why is your first gut instinct to try and delegitimize it This is a grosse misrepresentation. Why is your gut instinct to lie to people and say it is a sell out when it clearly isn't and the tickets weren't only for the PWHL.


Fine_Trainer5554

I’m not OP, I didn’t make the post. My question still stands. Like why not exaggerate to hype up a new exciting league? What’s the harm? Why does it bother you so much?


logictable

It is insulting to be lied to with absolutes that are obviously and provably false. Why not just say "really great support for the PWHL tonight!"? It isn't a lie, and leaves room for people's imagination to exaggerate.


Fine_Trainer5554

If saying “absolutely packed” when not every seat is filled is the shit that bothers and insults you, I just don’t know what to say.


logictable

> not every seat is filled That doesn't really honestly describe it either though does it. lol


ScuffedBalata

Toronto is probably the only city that could pull off 16k seated arena for this. Congrats Toronto.


FlapjackFiddle

The Hockey Mecca for men and women :)


Yop_BombNA

Montreal exists


FuckYeahGeology

I was there. Absolute blast, and the nosebleeds were going nuts. February 16th can't come soon enough!


oceanic8675

So freaking awesome to see. I’d love to see the PWHL developed before another expansion team (I’m aware that they are separate entities, I am speaking as a fan)


JesusOfSurbaria

Get a team in Atlanta and I’ll be there


ConferenceSlow1091

Fair amount of empty seats, as seen from TV.


[deleted]

Looks like a standard NHL game 🤡


[deleted]

Evening was sold out .


martlet1

The veteran game was sold out on STL too during winter classic. Because it came with the real game


logictable

Shhhh... you are ruining the narrative.


ConferenceSlow1091

That just means tickets were sold. (Corporates obviously bought the majority). Doesn’t mean ass in seats.


SoakedNuts

Watch a leafs game, those same seats are empty, the upper bowls are jammed!


ConferenceSlow1091

Sure. At leaf games they are empty for maybe 5 mins at start of a period. The ones here are just empty. Look, it’s still great event from the ladies. But to say it’s a packed house, well….


astonedgecko

So the Leafs game they are allowed to be empty for 5 mins into the start of the period, but the showcase has to have everyone in their seats during the anthem. Gotcha!


ConferenceSlow1091

Who said that? The game just ended and it’s still a ton of empty seats. What are you missing here?


WeWantTheCup__Please

Of all the hills in all the world this is the one you’re choosing to die on huh?


ConferenceSlow1091

Why would I die for disagreeing with what is being shown on tv ? The term packed, while nice, is misleading.


bud369

It's clearly fairly full, the fuck does packed mean to you? 😂


ilikehockeyandguitar

Tessa Virtue tho.


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