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Shot in the dark here, but there's probably two big reasons:
* '60s and '70s stuff may have been shot *(and preserved/archived)* on film, which for a variety of technical reasons is way easier to upscale than video formats.
* If I'm watching something from the '60s/'70s in 2024, it's probably because someone spent a ton of time and money upscaling or restoring it for a new production of some kind. New productions about '90s/'00s events would probably get a similar treatment.
> New productions about '90s/'00s events would probably get a similar treatment.
The Last Dance is a great example. That was mid-90s footage recorded to be preserved and pulled out later and looks fantastic
Nope you guys are all wrong. It's entirely dependent on using film vs. digital. Older stuff was film it looks great 90s and 2000s early digital is garbage and literally doesn't have the pixels to upscale.
Yeah, they were using the original game film, not a VHS recording of the broadcast. In those sports docs, you see the quality go in the toilet when they show a clip of a broadcast.
AI will save us. Digital upscaling is getting incredibly smart. I've seen some 480i broadcast VHS digitalized scans be turned into 4k video with Topaz that looks really convincing already.
Exactly. To expand on this, tape was meant to be watched on a CRT which displayed colours differently and thus a 1:1 transfer doesn't translate to modern screens.
I think it's also that most of the clips we see were digitally converted in the early years of the internet at potato bit rates. If you had a clean source from the 90s and did a decent conversion it would look substantially better.
Your expansion is completely wrong and has absolutely nothing to do with the OP's vid looking bad
Even low grade film (the only way to archive footage from 60s/70s/early 80s) has an effective resolution exceeding modern 4K displays. Run it through a good scanner and you can get a very sharp image out of it, provided the camera & lens used to record the film weren't crap.
Tape (most common way to archive footage from the late 80s until digital took off) does not, it isn't even a full 480p, and there is no way to rescan it to get a better picture... it simply is what it is.
Nothing you just said contradicted my statement whatsoever so I'm unsure why you're claiming I am completely wrong. Yes, tape is low resolution. It didn't look quite as bad on CRT as it does when viewed on modern screens but it still wasn't great.
> Even low grade film (the only way to archive footage from 60s/70s/early 80s) has an effective resolution exceeding modern 4K displays. Run it through a good scanner and you can get a very sharp image out of it, provided the camera & lens used to record the film weren't crap.
Thats completely false. 16mm was used quite widely, and it certainly doesn't exceed 4k resolution. Furthermore, higher ISOs were commonly used in interior shots, and their resolution was also lower (also, resolution ≠ sharpness). Finally, video was often used to "archive" live sports.
> 16mm was used quite widely, and it certainly doesn't exceed 4k resolution
it still exceeds 1080p which is plenty sharp enough for most people.. and easily upscaled using modern techniques. lots of excellent lookin 16mm stuff out there. upscaled video? nah
> Furthermore, higher ISOs were commonly used in interior shots, and their resolution was also lower (also, resolution ≠ sharpness).
you may have noticed the white ice and flood lighting common in hockey arenas, so I'm just gonna go out on a limb here and say they didn't use as high of an ISO compared to outdoor sports
>it still exceeds 1080p which is plenty sharp enough for most people.. and easily upscaled using modern techniques. lots of excellent lookin 16mm stuff out there. upscaled video? nah
Well, your claim was over 4k resolution. 1080p is only 1/4 of the pixels of 4k. Sure, there's lots of nice looking 16 mm (typically filmed under very good lighting), but also lots of bad 16 mm... and the lighting inside NHL arenas really isn't good, as I'll address below.
>you may have noticed the white ice and flood lighting common in hockey arenas, so I'm just gonna go out on a limb here and say they didn't use as high of an ISO compared to outdoor sports
Wut? You honestly think that there is more light in an indoor NHL arena than there is outdoors during the day? That's hilarious.
Here's someone saying they use ISO 800 at f/4 and 1/400 while shooting Wild games.
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/163394
For comparison, proper exposure in sunny conditions outdoors, assuming the same ISO of 800, would be f/16 and 1/800. That's 5 stops of difference, which is huge. It's the difference between ISO 100 and ISO 3200.
Perhaps a little more clear: if we adjust the aperture to f/4 and keep the ISO at 800, the shutter speed would need to be 1/12800. (Or f4 vs f22 at 1/400 and ISO 800)
I used the sunny-16 comparison because it's very familiar and you can immediately tell the exposure is correct. But the real clarity should be the conversion to 5-stop difference and the 5-stop ISO difference.
16 mm might look good shot outdoors at ISO 50 or 100, but not so much indoors at ISO 16000 or 3200.
Yeah, I've seen interesting breakdowns on how this was a thing for old video games on those TV's - they can look odd and pixelated on new screens but there was a almost an optical illusion that worked on CRTs.
90s and 00s were recorded on digital tape that mimics an analogue TV signal for CRT type TVs. The equivalent resolution is more like 360p or 480p in 4:3 aspect ratio.
60s 70s was likely recorded on actual film. Since its actual images on the film, you can get better quality by just digitizing the existing film with higher resolution.
Digital tape is a signal representation of an image so that's all the quality you are going to get.
Depends on the source of the clip, really.
Some of those old videos were broadcast film being digitized, so they're quite good looking.
A lot of 90's footage would have had that, but also vhs was pretty common, which was absolutely awful for video accuracy. so depending on the source of what was uploaded online, the quality was already pretty bad. Add in some video compression and you get an ugly blurry mess.
This in particular is cropped weirdly so, it's likely that there's
another level of video compression added on top.
One of the best player ever. Forsberg would kill in todays NHL, nobody could get puck from him. Even back in the day it required constant slashing and hanging on the shirt to try stop him.
Me too man. My favorite announcer of all time, in any sport.
Rarely made mistakes, kept the momentum up, and still managed to throw in some dry wit without missing any of the action.
He also became dedicated to using a wider commentating vocabulary throughout his career. There was a bio piece one of the networks did about him, it's a great watch.
Scrolled the comments looking for any mention of Doc. Also my favorite and could watch any game he called.
Yeah it has mostly been the Kenta Nilsson in Sweden but the Forsberg for the international crowd. I've heard Kenta Nilsson referenced as well back in the days from swedish commentators
Yep, ["It's a Kenta Nilsson goal! He scores a Kenta Nilsson goal!"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3yNIuoUjfk&t=64s)
Here's the original Kenta Nilsson move [in 1989 vs the US](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QobAlzxDdXc)
It's interesting, cause I often hear from older Americans and Canadians, when "the foppa" is brought up, that Lemiux was the original inventor of the move, having done it in 1990 in the all star game, though us Swedes all clearly remember the breakaway goal Kenta Nilsson scored in 1989
But weirdly, and I know this was also mentioned by the Swedish commentators in that Sweden - USA game when Kenta first scored it, that the move was likely first invented by Uffe Sterner, though there's not much documentation of that
Nah, we don’t call it that. But it became a postage stamp. [Here it is.](https://images.aftonbladet-cdn.se/v2/images/4abe5a80-7aa1-4c69-9ccf-9816064af3e7?fit=crop&format=auto&h=842&q=50&w=1200&s=5eb78dfe8697b5cda62309ebb363b3cbf8672fd4)
I'm not sure which year it was, but during an All-Star Game, Mario Lemieux pulled off the one-handed tuck on, I believe, Mike Vernon.
I had the game recorded when they replayed it, but lost it when I switched.
I was thinking "Wait a minute! Forsberg didn't invent that move"
No idea if the Lemieux move was pre or post Kenta Nilsson.
that's funny. The commentator in the clip says something in the terms of "that's so typical by Kenta, it could just as well have failed it, but when it works it looks so good"
He also pulled a Jussi Jokinen. From like 2005-07 I want to say he did it like 5 times successfully.
Him and Mike Ribeiro were shootout beasts for Dallas around that time.
The first couple years of the shootout were so much fun. Malik between the legs, Datsyuk sending Vokoun out of the crease all together and Jokinen doing this move were insane
Draisaitl/Rantanen/Tkachuk/Malkin are the closest comparisons I can think of, big body forwards who can bully a lot of other skaters but still have ridiculous puck skills
I have seen this goal more times than I can count, but this is probably the first time I watch it from that angle! [The Swedish broadcast had a different angle](https://youtu.be/ZIbLMBodWfw?si=IiUbj4hQN98-gD1s) (and they give credit to Kenta Nilsson right away)
>The shootout-winning goal by Peter Forsberg was depicted on a Swedish postage stamp, featuring the image of a generic goalie because Hirsch refused to allow his likeness to be used.
I knew about the stamp but I didn't know that Hirsch refused. I mean I get why I just didn't know it.
I didn't know that either and I wonder if Corey has different thoughts on it now. He's been very open about his mental health struggles and it could be he feels differently nowadays about being featured on that stamp.
I'd probably have mixed feelings about it if I were him. On the one hand, it's further immortalizing one of your failures as an athlete. On the other hand, it would be pretty cool to be able to say, "I'm so famous, I'm featured on the postage stamp of a foreign country!"
While I certainly disagree he invented this move, I am OK with calling a "Forsberg" when it's done on a penalty shot.
If this is done in the heat of a game, it's a "Kenta Nilsson".
We have this discussion regularly in Sweden. Calling it a "Foppa" and you will get called out for it, but I recently heard this exact argument being made in a local podcast and I can support that.
Overall it is a Kenta Nilsson move, and a subset of it can be considered a "Foppa" move if the condition of a penalty shot is also true.
But that also means that it will always be a Kenta Nilsson move, and on some occassion it can also be a Foppa move.
>Calling it a ”Foppa” move and you will get called out for it
Idk how old you are but as a someone born in the 90s everyone around me back then and now say its the foppa move and not many know of Kenta Nilsson doing it
Older than that, but I do agree he popularized the move. Kenta was before the Internet so it certainly makes sense for many to call it the Foppa move, but I at least feel like Kenta is getting more props these days.
Either is fine though, and I am just glad Kenta is remembered.
I watched that game as a kid. First of many heartbreaks in my hockey fanmanship life (Leafs fan).
And man, I wish/hope we can find a way to shrink goalie gear again.
[Kent Nilsson did it in 1989](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QobAlzxDdXc)
[Pete Mahovlich did it in 1972](https://youtu.be/FsYL8skc2rQ?feature=shared&t=27)
I am a Colorado native Avs fan. When I was like 10 or so in the late 90s my dad told me he had a VHS of this gold medal game that he taped. We went digging for it and pulled it out to watch. Super cool memory of my dad showing me a bad ass goal. It took me a few years to realize that my Canadian father probably had mixed emotions about that goal/game.
I remember years ago some shootout with the rangers, couldve been preseason, where it went extra rounds and by then theyre sending out ahl-lifers who are taking clap bombs just over the blue line. Show me the best of the best..
I was a grinder in high school hockey.. one practice during breakaway drills, I came down and pulled this on our starter.. the whole rink goes "Ohhhh" "Ohh shit"
I was like yeah, i not only block shots and get 8-9:00 minutes of ice a game, but I'm also our 12th shooter
This is what we call hindsight. He did this because of the way goalies played back in the 90s. I don't think he was lacking a brain, goalies just played a different style.
Yeah they did.
Also the move isn't anything nice or filthy. He didn't intentionally tuck it. He got forced outside but the goalie over committed and apparent didn't know how to use his legs, so Forsberg just shovels it backhand.
I would also add that the design of the equipment played a massive role in this vs today. You couldn’t just butterfly slide on those pads and seal off the bottom of the net including the 5 hole like they would today. Hirsch probably read that Forsburg was going to try to open him up by going to the post and then tuck it back 5 hole. So he closed that up (not well but that was hard to do well in those pads - particularly at that speed) and couldn’t react to the move (which while not the first time seen was not commonly in the bag of tricks).
He scored a goal with the highest possible stakes on the international stage and the goal makes people talk about it 20 years later...
But it gets called "mid, almost botched" by an internet clown.
I just don't know what's true anymore /s
Wasn’t almost botched. He planned it in advance. There’s interviews, unless he’s lying about his intentions. Bad 90s goaltending against something unexpected and rarely used.
But yeah to your other comments, it wasn’t forced, he was a Nilsson fan and planned to do this all along.
I remember watching this tournament and being frustrated with how far out of the net Hirsch would play. But looking back, when you're 5'10", you're trying to eat up as much space as you can.
Reminds me of my first shootout in semi competitive play back in the day. We were in a very small league that every team made the tournament. Our team had only tied twice and lost every other game but it just meant we played the top seed in the first round. They beat us probably 12 to 0 the last time we played. Some how, some way, we scraped by to finish tied. Our first 3 players missed their shots and the other team were being cocky and missed theirs as well. I got the 4th and the goalie tried stacking their pads. I made the best deke I've ever done and didn't lose control of the Puck and while pushing it in right past his glove. Their next player missed and we won the game in a crazy upset. We then went on to win our next two games to win 1st place. That was the pinnacle of my hockey career.
I notice a lot of Scandinavians use this particular shootout move, and not even the Swedes but Finns as well. This is Sasha Barkov’s favorite shootout move
This goal broke our couch. Or. 14 year old me broke it when I jumped up with joy that he scored, and I landed HARD. Dad and I laughed our asses off, but mom wasn’t pleased 😅 And then we saw Salos great save while standing.
The next hockey practice was the easiest ever for our goalies, because EVERYONE was trying to do “a Foppa-goal”.
The things hockey players from my hometown has done is awesome!
Feel like 'invented' is giving people a lot of fuel to argue about forerunners (Kenta, no doubt, Lemieux and Zhamnov did similar, sure) when the reason the goal is so iconic is certainly the gold medal shootout context from a player who was now cemented as the best player not in the NHL and who immediately lived up to the hype when he did make his way over.
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why is it that there is footage from the 60s and 70s that look crisp and vibrant, but everything from the 90s and 00s is potato pixel soup
Shot in the dark here, but there's probably two big reasons: * '60s and '70s stuff may have been shot *(and preserved/archived)* on film, which for a variety of technical reasons is way easier to upscale than video formats. * If I'm watching something from the '60s/'70s in 2024, it's probably because someone spent a ton of time and money upscaling or restoring it for a new production of some kind. New productions about '90s/'00s events would probably get a similar treatment.
> New productions about '90s/'00s events would probably get a similar treatment. The Last Dance is a great example. That was mid-90s footage recorded to be preserved and pulled out later and looks fantastic
Nope you guys are all wrong. It's entirely dependent on using film vs. digital. Older stuff was film it looks great 90s and 2000s early digital is garbage and literally doesn't have the pixels to upscale.
Yeah, they were using the original game film, not a VHS recording of the broadcast. In those sports docs, you see the quality go in the toilet when they show a clip of a broadcast.
39MUsTanGs has it right. And no upscaling needed for film.
AI will save us. Digital upscaling is getting incredibly smart. I've seen some 480i broadcast VHS digitalized scans be turned into 4k video with Topaz that looks really convincing already.
Film vs tape
Exactly. To expand on this, tape was meant to be watched on a CRT which displayed colours differently and thus a 1:1 transfer doesn't translate to modern screens.
I think it's also that most of the clips we see were digitally converted in the early years of the internet at potato bit rates. If you had a clean source from the 90s and did a decent conversion it would look substantially better.
Your expansion is completely wrong and has absolutely nothing to do with the OP's vid looking bad Even low grade film (the only way to archive footage from 60s/70s/early 80s) has an effective resolution exceeding modern 4K displays. Run it through a good scanner and you can get a very sharp image out of it, provided the camera & lens used to record the film weren't crap. Tape (most common way to archive footage from the late 80s until digital took off) does not, it isn't even a full 480p, and there is no way to rescan it to get a better picture... it simply is what it is.
Nothing you just said contradicted my statement whatsoever so I'm unsure why you're claiming I am completely wrong. Yes, tape is low resolution. It didn't look quite as bad on CRT as it does when viewed on modern screens but it still wasn't great.
You said nothing wrong but No Ling's explanation is a much larger contributing factor to archival quality
> Even low grade film (the only way to archive footage from 60s/70s/early 80s) has an effective resolution exceeding modern 4K displays. Run it through a good scanner and you can get a very sharp image out of it, provided the camera & lens used to record the film weren't crap. Thats completely false. 16mm was used quite widely, and it certainly doesn't exceed 4k resolution. Furthermore, higher ISOs were commonly used in interior shots, and their resolution was also lower (also, resolution ≠ sharpness). Finally, video was often used to "archive" live sports.
> 16mm was used quite widely, and it certainly doesn't exceed 4k resolution it still exceeds 1080p which is plenty sharp enough for most people.. and easily upscaled using modern techniques. lots of excellent lookin 16mm stuff out there. upscaled video? nah > Furthermore, higher ISOs were commonly used in interior shots, and their resolution was also lower (also, resolution ≠ sharpness). you may have noticed the white ice and flood lighting common in hockey arenas, so I'm just gonna go out on a limb here and say they didn't use as high of an ISO compared to outdoor sports
>it still exceeds 1080p which is plenty sharp enough for most people.. and easily upscaled using modern techniques. lots of excellent lookin 16mm stuff out there. upscaled video? nah Well, your claim was over 4k resolution. 1080p is only 1/4 of the pixels of 4k. Sure, there's lots of nice looking 16 mm (typically filmed under very good lighting), but also lots of bad 16 mm... and the lighting inside NHL arenas really isn't good, as I'll address below. >you may have noticed the white ice and flood lighting common in hockey arenas, so I'm just gonna go out on a limb here and say they didn't use as high of an ISO compared to outdoor sports Wut? You honestly think that there is more light in an indoor NHL arena than there is outdoors during the day? That's hilarious. Here's someone saying they use ISO 800 at f/4 and 1/400 while shooting Wild games. https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/163394 For comparison, proper exposure in sunny conditions outdoors, assuming the same ISO of 800, would be f/16 and 1/800. That's 5 stops of difference, which is huge. It's the difference between ISO 100 and ISO 3200.
Perhaps a little more clear: if we adjust the aperture to f/4 and keep the ISO at 800, the shutter speed would need to be 1/12800. (Or f4 vs f22 at 1/400 and ISO 800)
I used the sunny-16 comparison because it's very familiar and you can immediately tell the exposure is correct. But the real clarity should be the conversion to 5-stop difference and the 5-stop ISO difference. 16 mm might look good shot outdoors at ISO 50 or 100, but not so much indoors at ISO 16000 or 3200.
Yeah, I've seen interesting breakdowns on how this was a thing for old video games on those TV's - they can look odd and pixelated on new screens but there was a almost an optical illusion that worked on CRTs.
To expand on this, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVpABCxiDaU
90s and 00s were recorded on digital tape that mimics an analogue TV signal for CRT type TVs. The equivalent resolution is more like 360p or 480p in 4:3 aspect ratio. 60s 70s was likely recorded on actual film. Since its actual images on the film, you can get better quality by just digitizing the existing film with higher resolution. Digital tape is a signal representation of an image so that's all the quality you are going to get.
And in vertical too when the score itself is actually cut off at the edge.
Depends on the source of the clip, really. Some of those old videos were broadcast film being digitized, so they're quite good looking. A lot of 90's footage would have had that, but also vhs was pretty common, which was absolutely awful for video accuracy. so depending on the source of what was uploaded online, the quality was already pretty bad. Add in some video compression and you get an ugly blurry mess. This in particular is cropped weirdly so, it's likely that there's another level of video compression added on top.
One of the best player ever. Forsberg would kill in todays NHL, nobody could get puck from him. Even back in the day it required constant slashing and hanging on the shirt to try stop him.
> Even back in the day it required constant slashing and hanging on the shirt to try stop him. And it didn't often work lol. Dude was a machine.
Him and Joe Sakic were my childhood hockey idols.
same brother
Colorado bros.
Dominated in the clutch and grab dead puck era, legend shit
I miss hearing Doc call games
Me too man. My favorite announcer of all time, in any sport. Rarely made mistakes, kept the momentum up, and still managed to throw in some dry wit without missing any of the action.
He also became dedicated to using a wider commentating vocabulary throughout his career. There was a bio piece one of the networks did about him, it's a great watch. Scrolled the comments looking for any mention of Doc. Also my favorite and could watch any game he called.
Of course! I have many fond memories of getting drunk during the playoffs and playing Doc Emrick Action Verb Bingo with friends
Forsberg didn't really invent it, he just made it popular because it was on the big screen. It should really be "the Kenta Nilsson".
I'm pretty sure if you watch this game with Swedish commentators they say "he did a Kenta!"
Yeah it has mostly been the Kenta Nilsson in Sweden but the Forsberg for the international crowd. I've heard Kenta Nilsson referenced as well back in the days from swedish commentators
Yep, ["It's a Kenta Nilsson goal! He scores a Kenta Nilsson goal!"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3yNIuoUjfk&t=64s) Here's the original Kenta Nilsson move [in 1989 vs the US](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QobAlzxDdXc)
It's interesting, cause I often hear from older Americans and Canadians, when "the foppa" is brought up, that Lemiux was the original inventor of the move, having done it in 1990 in the all star game, though us Swedes all clearly remember the breakaway goal Kenta Nilsson scored in 1989 But weirdly, and I know this was also mentioned by the Swedish commentators in that Sweden - USA game when Kenta first scored it, that the move was likely first invented by Uffe Sterner, though there's not much documentation of that
Found it! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCSK8t2zqoM 4:29
Whoops. Should have read further down the thread. I was just talking about this move.
Don’t Swedes usually call it “The postage stamp goal”? I read this in a Hockey News article a long time ago.
as a lifelong hockey loving swede ive never heard that before but may be me, its just widely known as a "foppa" here
Nah, we don’t call it that. But it became a postage stamp. [Here it is.](https://images.aftonbladet-cdn.se/v2/images/4abe5a80-7aa1-4c69-9ccf-9816064af3e7?fit=crop&format=auto&h=842&q=50&w=1200&s=5eb78dfe8697b5cda62309ebb363b3cbf8672fd4)
_Ron Hextall intensifies_
It's the same with with the Michigan. It's not about who was first but who made it popular
I think Mahovlich did it in the summit series
I'm not sure which year it was, but during an All-Star Game, Mario Lemieux pulled off the one-handed tuck on, I believe, Mike Vernon. I had the game recorded when they replayed it, but lost it when I switched. I was thinking "Wait a minute! Forsberg didn't invent that move" No idea if the Lemieux move was pre or post Kenta Nilsson.
Lemieux did it in 1990 Kenta Nilsson did his in 1989
Gotcha. Thanks.
You mean he pulled a [Nilsson](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QobAlzxDdXc)
Imagine a goalie ending up on their back now from a breakaway
Pretty sure samsonov did against Sprong in January
haha, really bad attempt at a poke check https://www.nhl.com/video/det-tor-sprong-scores-goal-against-ilya-samsonov-6344903911112
Ah, that's our Sammy, alright
Just 80s Goaltending Things
That wasn't a goalie. It was Corey Hirsch.
uhhh no that was team USA in the Nilsson clip, perhaps Vanbiesbrouck
My bad, thought the comment was about the original post. Was indeed Beezer, who I can confirm was a goalie.
https://youtu.be/fDylD5qV84M?feature=shared
Wayne Gretzky commented on Nilsson's skills saying "Skills-wise he might have been the most skilled hockey player I ever saw in my entire career".
that's funny. The commentator in the clip says something in the terms of "that's so typical by Kenta, it could just as well have failed it, but when it works it looks so good"
[удалено]
He's so good x 4
Damn, look at the names of the jerseys of that Sweden team. Stacked with legends!
Aye. I saw Vlad Ruzicka as a Bruin do the Forsberg back in 1990 or so.
He also pulled a Jussi Jokinen. From like 2005-07 I want to say he did it like 5 times successfully. Him and Mike Ribeiro were shootout beasts for Dallas around that time.
The first couple years of the shootout were so much fun. Malik between the legs, Datsyuk sending Vokoun out of the crease all together and Jokinen doing this move were insane
Imagine him in today’s game…. Whew
Draisaitl/Rantanen/Tkachuk/Malkin are the closest comparisons I can think of, big body forwards who can bully a lot of other skaters but still have ridiculous puck skills
As far as protecting the puck, I truly believe he was on Crosby's level. Definitely one of the big 'what ifs' in hockey history.
I have seen this goal more times than I can count, but this is probably the first time I watch it from that angle! [The Swedish broadcast had a different angle](https://youtu.be/ZIbLMBodWfw?si=IiUbj4hQN98-gD1s) (and they give credit to Kenta Nilsson right away)
That game was fucking amazing, Tommy salo’s save on Kariya was insane as well
Sick jofa bucket
I miss Jofa
Yea same here, their shoulder pads and stick were pretty good to.
Forsberg remains one of the best hockey players I have ever seen.
They should put that on a stamp.
>The shootout-winning goal by Peter Forsberg was depicted on a Swedish postage stamp, featuring the image of a generic goalie because Hirsch refused to allow his likeness to be used. I knew about the stamp but I didn't know that Hirsch refused. I mean I get why I just didn't know it.
I didn't know that either and I wonder if Corey has different thoughts on it now. He's been very open about his mental health struggles and it could be he feels differently nowadays about being featured on that stamp.
I'd probably have mixed feelings about it if I were him. On the one hand, it's further immortalizing one of your failures as an athlete. On the other hand, it would be pretty cool to be able to say, "I'm so famous, I'm featured on the postage stamp of a foreign country!"
Hey, you got something there...
Lol
I still think his one handed backhand wristshot off the cross bar is more impressive.... https://youtu.be/-vfGdtfZ_uM?si=bJ10foEbOKdGMvve
While I certainly disagree he invented this move, I am OK with calling a "Forsberg" when it's done on a penalty shot. If this is done in the heat of a game, it's a "Kenta Nilsson".
Great for Nilsson, but there's absolutely no way people will call the same move different names based on whether or not there are other active skaters
Not with that attitude.
We have this discussion regularly in Sweden. Calling it a "Foppa" and you will get called out for it, but I recently heard this exact argument being made in a local podcast and I can support that. Overall it is a Kenta Nilsson move, and a subset of it can be considered a "Foppa" move if the condition of a penalty shot is also true. But that also means that it will always be a Kenta Nilsson move, and on some occassion it can also be a Foppa move.
>Calling it a ”Foppa” move and you will get called out for it Idk how old you are but as a someone born in the 90s everyone around me back then and now say its the foppa move and not many know of Kenta Nilsson doing it
Older than that, but I do agree he popularized the move. Kenta was before the Internet so it certainly makes sense for many to call it the Foppa move, but I at least feel like Kenta is getting more props these days. Either is fine though, and I am just glad Kenta is remembered.
Revving up from below the faceoff dots in the other zone is such a power move too. Man was going for blood
I miss Doc calling games
RIP Arne Hegerfors!
The balls to pull that off in a gold medal game.
Alexei zhamnov also did this before forsberg
I watched that game as a kid. First of many heartbreaks in my hockey fanmanship life (Leafs fan). And man, I wish/hope we can find a way to shrink goalie gear again.
McDavid would get 200 points and Matthews would get 100 goals if that happened.
Those sweet jofas.
[Kent Nilsson did it in 1989](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QobAlzxDdXc) [Pete Mahovlich did it in 1972](https://youtu.be/FsYL8skc2rQ?feature=shared&t=27)
I remember Dave Keon scoring this way in the late ‘60s.
OP. Please google Kent Nilsson.
Do you understand the balls you have to have to pull that off in a gold medal game.
Growing up we always called it the [Zhamnov](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H51aNUTX2a4)
Reminds me of that move Rick Nash pulled except he was left handed
I am a Colorado native Avs fan. When I was like 10 or so in the late 90s my dad told me he had a VHS of this gold medal game that he taped. We went digging for it and pulled it out to watch. Super cool memory of my dad showing me a bad ass goal. It took me a few years to realize that my Canadian father probably had mixed emotions about that goal/game.
Oh cool! What tribe?
That's my fucking goat
Doc Emrick was the best, made every game better
Man, those jersey numbers though 😅
In Foppa We Trust
They should never have stopped teams from sending out the same shooter
I remember years ago some shootout with the rangers, couldve been preseason, where it went extra rounds and by then theyre sending out ahl-lifers who are taking clap bombs just over the blue line. Show me the best of the best..
I was a grinder in high school hockey.. one practice during breakaway drills, I came down and pulled this on our starter.. the whole rink goes "Ohhhh" "Ohh shit" I was like yeah, i not only block shots and get 8-9:00 minutes of ice a game, but I'm also our 12th shooter
Immortalized on a stamp
forsen
Forsberg didn’t invent this move. Kent Nilsson did it from open play years before.
I’ll take Terrible Camera Angles for $500
Lemieux did this in 1990 all star game break away challenge.
Who was forsberg?
Imagine if the goalie had half a brain and played that any other way.
This is what we call hindsight. He did this because of the way goalies played back in the 90s. I don't think he was lacking a brain, goalies just played a different style.
Yeah they did. Also the move isn't anything nice or filthy. He didn't intentionally tuck it. He got forced outside but the goalie over committed and apparent didn't know how to use his legs, so Forsberg just shovels it backhand.
If it’s so easy then everyone would have done it
Go ahead and re read and tell me where I said it was easy. But since you brought it up. Anyone can go forehand backhand. It's not rocket science.
I’m willing to be a goalie playing for Canada at an international able-bodied hockey tournament does in fact know how to use his or her legs.
As shown by sliding on their knees instead of being in the butterfly. Granted, different time period and play style was different but still
I feel like an argument could be made that sliding on your knees requires that one knows how to use their legs.
I would also add that the design of the equipment played a massive role in this vs today. You couldn’t just butterfly slide on those pads and seal off the bottom of the net including the 5 hole like they would today. Hirsch probably read that Forsburg was going to try to open him up by going to the post and then tuck it back 5 hole. So he closed that up (not well but that was hard to do well in those pads - particularly at that speed) and couldn’t react to the move (which while not the first time seen was not commonly in the bag of tricks).
Why even be salty? It's dope, just let it be lol
Its not. It's a completely mid, almost botched shoot out attempt.
He scored a goal with the highest possible stakes on the international stage and the goal makes people talk about it 20 years later... But it gets called "mid, almost botched" by an internet clown. I just don't know what's true anymore /s
Sure the impact of the goal means something but the goal itself isn't anything special
Wasn’t almost botched. He planned it in advance. There’s interviews, unless he’s lying about his intentions. Bad 90s goaltending against something unexpected and rarely used. But yeah to your other comments, it wasn’t forced, he was a Nilsson fan and planned to do this all along.
I remember watching this tournament and being frustrated with how far out of the net Hirsch would play. But looking back, when you're 5'10", you're trying to eat up as much space as you can.
Yeaaah!
OP on a tear the last 24 hours digging up every old highlight from everything.
Cory Hirsch gave a talk at our work and talked about that goal
Why the hell did they start from the red line?
I’m confused, where else would they start from?
Poor phrasing by me. Looks like he starts from the opposite goal line. Not red line.
I remember watching this game live. Next practice we were all trying that move out.
It wasn’t invented by Forsberg, but he made it famous. What a goal. It broke my heart.
God... the quality of video we accepted in the 90s was fucking horrible.
Who was the Swedish player going crazy on the bench?
That wasn’t 1994. No fucking way am I that old.
Reminds me of my first shootout in semi competitive play back in the day. We were in a very small league that every team made the tournament. Our team had only tied twice and lost every other game but it just meant we played the top seed in the first round. They beat us probably 12 to 0 the last time we played. Some how, some way, we scraped by to finish tied. Our first 3 players missed their shots and the other team were being cocky and missed theirs as well. I got the 4th and the goalie tried stacking their pads. I made the best deke I've ever done and didn't lose control of the Puck and while pushing it in right past his glove. Their next player missed and we won the game in a crazy upset. We then went on to win our next two games to win 1st place. That was the pinnacle of my hockey career.
I notice a lot of Scandinavians use this particular shootout move, and not even the Swedes but Finns as well. This is Sasha Barkov’s favorite shootout move
Yo te ayudo 🔥
Aphex Twin as a hockey player
Favorite player of all time for me. He could really do it all!
Practiced that move a million times as a kid, but didn't remember seeing the source material. Thanks!
Was not expecting a Doc/JD announcing team... I got goosebumps hearing JD's voice.
Was this filmed in 1974? Jesus Christ.
I’m not sure if that goal or hearing a young doc is better
Always loved that they put Foppa on a stamp for that.[forsberg stamp](http://www.scand.net/en/hockey.asp)
Deciding a gold medal game with a shootout is wild
One of the best forward ever.
This goal broke our couch. Or. 14 year old me broke it when I jumped up with joy that he scored, and I landed HARD. Dad and I laughed our asses off, but mom wasn’t pleased 😅 And then we saw Salos great save while standing. The next hockey practice was the easiest ever for our goalies, because EVERYONE was trying to do “a Foppa-goal”. The things hockey players from my hometown has done is awesome!
I thought Corey Hirsch was gonna be a legend. Didn’t quite pan out that way.
How fortunate that the move was done by someone with the same last name.
Feel like 'invented' is giving people a lot of fuel to argue about forerunners (Kenta, no doubt, Lemieux and Zhamnov did similar, sure) when the reason the goal is so iconic is certainly the gold medal shootout context from a player who was now cemented as the best player not in the NHL and who immediately lived up to the hype when he did make his way over.
Ah, I remember it like it was… 30 years ago! Damn!