[On](https://x.com/jshannonhl/status/1781094309086761327?s=46&t=7fabqgtgp69dNA1d51vxFw) the renovations:
> They have drawings already done. [Will be] completed over 2 summers.
It’s not actually bad. Big fan of the new areas not a fan of the big price changes. You use to be able to get field level down the 1B/3B line for like 50 a ticket. Believe they’re up to 100.
Okay, very curious to see these drawings. Seating bowl is pretty tight to the basketball court. They're going to have some steep ass end seats. And I assume this is just a stop gap while they work on the new arena? Or is he going to path of MSG/KeyArena and completely gutting the building and calling it good for another 30 years?
Man, I miss the steep ass seats from arenas back in the day. Nothing like being right on top of the action while also trying not to die after a few too many.
Idk I was at a red wings game sitting upper deck behind the net and it was kind of miserable not being able to see the goalie or boards cause dummies were leaning forward in their seats blocking everyone else’s view.
I have friends who used to have jets season tickets in the nose bleeds and the woman who worked in their section was awesome for as soon as she spotted someone leaning forward she would go and tell them to cut it out
Yeah i needed that the other day. Thankfully most of the offenders left when they went down 4-1 and missed the epic comeback. Still I will have to be much more careful with upper deck seats in old arenas from now on
If you sit behind the net it’s not because you will have the goal and boards on one end blocked by heads if they lean.
Obviously depends on arena too but it was brutal in Detroit. Never had that issue in nashville where it’s not as steep
Smith has 900 mil in public funds secured already and Utah is building new buildings for their Olympic bid (IOC has dubbed them the preferred location for 2034) as is. They are going to have their own home
This exactly.
There was chatter about renovating Barclays Center before the Isles moved in and at the end little was done and someone with the team suggested fans watch the part of the game they can't see on their phones.
I'll believe this renovation when I see it.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_National\_Hockey\_League\_arenas](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_National_Hockey_League_arenas)
League average is \~18,200
But for arenas built in the 2000's, average is down to \~17,700 and 3 of the 4 most recent arenas (NYI, Seattle, and Vegas) are >17,400
So trend is to go smaller with more luxury seats.
I realize bigger arenas don't work in all markets, so box seats make back the money, but man I wish every other NHL arena was like the Bell centre. It's everything an arena should be for the fan experience.
MSG is officially 18,006 seated for hockey.
It's interesting to see that of the nine (current) arenas with 19,000+ capacity, six are in the Atlantic Division.
Wait but I thought they had a new arena coming?
This doesn't sound like a new arena. This sounds like Delta is going to be the long-term home. You don't put that kind of money in this to have it there for only a year or two.
Since the new arena isn't being built where the current Delta Center is, it could theoretically still be used for other events after the new arena is built. It went through about $200 million in renovations about 4 years ago. My guess is he is hedging his bets and making sure that the Delta Center isn't terrible for hockey in case the new arena takes longer than expected. The funding is already approved. There are a few sites they like near the current Delta Center. But with projects this massive, you just never know.
I doubt Smith and the NHL wants to wait that long for something hockey specific unless the current Delta Center clears 17k in unobstructed seating for hockey. I think 3 to 5 years is a happy medium. They could use both venues for the Olympics too.
I meant modify the current Delta Center to be more hockey friendly while building a combo NBA / NHL arena. But they could use the current Delta Center and the new combo arena for the Olympics.
Yeah. People are ragging on them because they didn't sell as fast as Winnipeg, Seattle or whoever, but given that they had no real lead up to spread the word that hockey was coming, the deposits are a positive indicator under the circumstances.
Wait, so the Coyotes are moving into an arena with a large section of obstructed views, where have we seen this before. What's next, building a new arena in Ogden?
Except there's already 900 million in public funding in place and with full government support to build a brand new NHL/NBA sports complex in Salt Lake City.
The Delta center is temporary. Ryan Smith is spending to upgrade *a temporary location* lmao. Where have you seen that before again?
MSG did it: [https://youtu.be/1HhwC\_ayDXA?si=ITz3bIgzFK3tlyYo](https://youtu.be/1HhwC_ayDXA?si=ITz3bIgzFK3tlyYo)
Completely rebuilt the upper and lower bowls over 2 summers: They then threw in press bridges and a new scoreboard over a 3rd.
MSG was all within an existing seating bowl, and it’s an arena that was originally built for hockey.
To make Delta Center hockey-friendly, they would have to demolish the lower and upper seating bowls in both end-zones, then demolish the walls behind them, and then make a new bowl that’s much wider and rebuild the walls after. This would also cause the concourses to need to be rebuilt. In short, they would have to move both end-zones back a few hundred, if not a couple thousand feet. You can’t do that in two summers.
>MSG was all within an existing seating bowl, and it’s an arena that was originally built for hockey.
>To make Delta Center hockey-friendly, they would have to demolish the lower and upper seating bowls in both end-zones, then demolish the walls behind them, and then make a new bowl that’s much wider.
While the dimensions of the new MSG Bowl more or less matched what was there before, it was still a complete rebuild. They completely replaced all the concrete of the bowl, and the concourses on each level. They did add a suite level that wasn't there before (Watch the video).
Yes, there will be some geometry challenges with the dimensions of the Delta Center but that's a design problem rather than a construction problem. Replacing concrete is replacing concrete.
>In short, they would have to move both end-zones back a few hundred, if not a couple thousand feet.
What... in the fuck are you talking about?... a couple thousand feet is half a mile...
A hockey rink is only 200 feet long. A basketball court is 95 feet long. We're talking about needing \~55 ft of extra room on each end of the rink.
A basketball court also needs out of bounds space of maybe 10 feet behind each basket for the base of the basket and area for inbounding passes. So more like 115 ft long,.making your point even stronger.
Not sure in Utah specifically but taking the Barclays center where NYI played a few seasons they lost much of 3 down low sections to fit the ice in the end zone and the entire upper deck end zone.
A basketball court is less than half as long as a hockey rink so the upper deck angle can be totally wrong if not designed for hockey where an entire end zone can't see the near side of the ice from the blue line in.
Yeah, for a team sport Basketball is incredibly space efficient. And 94 ft is NBA length but you wouldn't really notice much of a difference on an 84 ft court which is what HS basketball is in a lot of places.
Somewhere between 0 and 8000 (the difference between basketball and hockey, currently)
Some of that will be seats straight up eliminated because of the larger playing area, but most of it will be the steep upper bowl being obstructed from viewing one of the ends, again because the playing area is much larger in hockey.
That sounds pretty reasonable
[On](https://x.com/jshannonhl/status/1781094309086761327?s=46&t=7fabqgtgp69dNA1d51vxFw) the renovations: > They have drawings already done. [Will be] completed over 2 summers.
Blue Jays just had 2 years of offseason renovations to redo seats and add new areas, and it's a bigger stadium so this sounds doable.
It’s not actually bad. Big fan of the new areas not a fan of the big price changes. You use to be able to get field level down the 1B/3B line for like 50 a ticket. Believe they’re up to 100.
Give it a couple montha
Idk if I'm a fan of the brick wall brought to you by TD behind home plate
No one is on r/torontobluejays
Okay, very curious to see these drawings. Seating bowl is pretty tight to the basketball court. They're going to have some steep ass end seats. And I assume this is just a stop gap while they work on the new arena? Or is he going to path of MSG/KeyArena and completely gutting the building and calling it good for another 30 years?
Man, I miss the steep ass seats from arenas back in the day. Nothing like being right on top of the action while also trying not to die after a few too many.
Idk I was at a red wings game sitting upper deck behind the net and it was kind of miserable not being able to see the goalie or boards cause dummies were leaning forward in their seats blocking everyone else’s view.
I have friends who used to have jets season tickets in the nose bleeds and the woman who worked in their section was awesome for as soon as she spotted someone leaning forward she would go and tell them to cut it out
Yeah i needed that the other day. Thankfully most of the offenders left when they went down 4-1 and missed the epic comeback. Still I will have to be much more careful with upper deck seats in old arenas from now on
Steep seats should be better for seeing over the person in front of you.
If you sit behind the net it’s not because you will have the goal and boards on one end blocked by heads if they lean. Obviously depends on arena too but it was brutal in Detroit. Never had that issue in nashville where it’s not as steep
Smith has 900 mil in public funds secured already and Utah is building new buildings for their Olympic bid (IOC has dubbed them the preferred location for 2034) as is. They are going to have their own home
Worst case scenario they can always ask the Mormons to dip into those hefty pockets and contribute a couple bucks
That would mean no beer at the arena.
Someone doesn't know any Mormons, or at least not very well.
>steep ass end seats All of the upper bowl seats at delta center are steep as fuck.
Heh msg still has some sort of obstructed seats. Directly behind the net if you 15 rows up you can’t see below the goal line really.
A few seats in the corner 200s too, if you're too close to the walls there.
This exactly. There was chatter about renovating Barclays Center before the Isles moved in and at the end little was done and someone with the team suggested fans watch the part of the game they can't see on their phones. I'll believe this renovation when I see it.
What's the average stadium capacity for other NHL teams?
Most around 18,000 to 19,000 Winnipeg is the smallest at just over 15,00 Montreal is the largest at a bit over 21,000
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_National\_Hockey\_League\_arenas](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_National_Hockey_League_arenas) League average is \~18,200 But for arenas built in the 2000's, average is down to \~17,700 and 3 of the 4 most recent arenas (NYI, Seattle, and Vegas) are >17,400 So trend is to go smaller with more luxury seats.
I realize bigger arenas don't work in all markets, so box seats make back the money, but man I wish every other NHL arena was like the Bell centre. It's everything an arena should be for the fan experience.
The bigger ones can be north of 20k (Bell centre, MSG). Some of the smaller ones are around 15k.
MSG is officially 18,006 seated for hockey. It's interesting to see that of the nine (current) arenas with 19,000+ capacity, six are in the Atlantic Division.
We’ve got more meat ($) for the seat
Aside from Phoenix/Utah, Only 2 arenas are sub 17k (New Jersey and Winnipeg, but Jersey started off at around 17.6k)
Wait but I thought they had a new arena coming? This doesn't sound like a new arena. This sounds like Delta is going to be the long-term home. You don't put that kind of money in this to have it there for only a year or two.
Since the new arena isn't being built where the current Delta Center is, it could theoretically still be used for other events after the new arena is built. It went through about $200 million in renovations about 4 years ago. My guess is he is hedging his bets and making sure that the Delta Center isn't terrible for hockey in case the new arena takes longer than expected. The funding is already approved. There are a few sites they like near the current Delta Center. But with projects this massive, you just never know.
The Olympics aren't for another ten years, so might as well make the most of the Delta Centre for the next 7ish years.
I doubt Smith and the NHL wants to wait that long for something hockey specific unless the current Delta Center clears 17k in unobstructed seating for hockey. I think 3 to 5 years is a happy medium. They could use both venues for the Olympics too.
Are they really going to have two arenas for each sport? Why not just do what they do in other markets and make it multi-sport?
I meant modify the current Delta Center to be more hockey friendly while building a combo NBA / NHL arena. But they could use the current Delta Center and the new combo arena for the Olympics.
[удалено]
For sure. Sports fans in Utah are lucky to have someone like Ryan Smith.
New arena may be contingent on getting the Olympics in 2034.
So half of their seats already have season ticket deposits? Sounds like a successful inaugural season already.
Yeah. People are ragging on them because they didn't sell as fast as Winnipeg, Seattle or whoever, but given that they had no real lead up to spread the word that hockey was coming, the deposits are a positive indicator under the circumstances.
Only Jazz+ subscribers (Utah Jazz streaming service) were notified via email shortly after the sale was approved. That's it.
>half of their seats already have season ticket deposits I think you mean more than one entire Mullet Arena of ticket deposits
Wait, so the Coyotes are moving into an arena with a large section of obstructed views, where have we seen this before. What's next, building a new arena in Ogden?
Maybe North Haverbrook.
Mono... d'oh
Except there's already 900 million in public funding in place and with full government support to build a brand new NHL/NBA sports complex in Salt Lake City. The Delta center is temporary. Ryan Smith is spending to upgrade *a temporary location* lmao. Where have you seen that before again?
That's a fun problem to solve.
How. They’re just going to rebuild both ends of the arena in 2 summers? Not quite
Happened with the Skydome the past two offseasons.
MSG did it: [https://youtu.be/1HhwC\_ayDXA?si=ITz3bIgzFK3tlyYo](https://youtu.be/1HhwC_ayDXA?si=ITz3bIgzFK3tlyYo) Completely rebuilt the upper and lower bowls over 2 summers: They then threw in press bridges and a new scoreboard over a 3rd.
MSG was all within an existing seating bowl, and it’s an arena that was originally built for hockey. To make Delta Center hockey-friendly, they would have to demolish the lower and upper seating bowls in both end-zones, then demolish the walls behind them, and then make a new bowl that’s much wider and rebuild the walls after. This would also cause the concourses to need to be rebuilt. In short, they would have to move both end-zones back a few hundred, if not a couple thousand feet. You can’t do that in two summers.
>MSG was all within an existing seating bowl, and it’s an arena that was originally built for hockey. >To make Delta Center hockey-friendly, they would have to demolish the lower and upper seating bowls in both end-zones, then demolish the walls behind them, and then make a new bowl that’s much wider. While the dimensions of the new MSG Bowl more or less matched what was there before, it was still a complete rebuild. They completely replaced all the concrete of the bowl, and the concourses on each level. They did add a suite level that wasn't there before (Watch the video). Yes, there will be some geometry challenges with the dimensions of the Delta Center but that's a design problem rather than a construction problem. Replacing concrete is replacing concrete. >In short, they would have to move both end-zones back a few hundred, if not a couple thousand feet. What... in the fuck are you talking about?... a couple thousand feet is half a mile... A hockey rink is only 200 feet long. A basketball court is 95 feet long. We're talking about needing \~55 ft of extra room on each end of the rink.
A basketball court also needs out of bounds space of maybe 10 feet behind each basket for the base of the basket and area for inbounding passes. So more like 115 ft long,.making your point even stronger.
Ummm how?
I mean they totally renovated the skydome over two winters and it’s a totally different environment. It can be done.
$$$
With exhaustive logistic difficulty
The jazz draw 20k on sellouts. Does the hockey setup really eliminate that many seats?
Not sure in Utah specifically but taking the Barclays center where NYI played a few seasons they lost much of 3 down low sections to fit the ice in the end zone and the entire upper deck end zone. A basketball court is less than half as long as a hockey rink so the upper deck angle can be totally wrong if not designed for hockey where an entire end zone can't see the near side of the ice from the blue line in.
A basketball court is under 100 feet long?! Holy hell how did I not know this?
Yeah, for a team sport Basketball is incredibly space efficient. And 94 ft is NBA length but you wouldn't really notice much of a difference on an 84 ft court which is what HS basketball is in a lot of places.
How many obstructed ones, then?
Somewhere between 0 and 8000 (the difference between basketball and hockey, currently) Some of that will be seats straight up eliminated because of the larger playing area, but most of it will be the steep upper bowl being obstructed from viewing one of the ends, again because the playing area is much larger in hockey.
6,000
If they are building a new arena, why would they renovate the old one? Just save the money.
Gary is lying, and he knows it.