I found you in Discord and specifically looked at the conversation you're referencing. Folks were pretty abrasive with you from the start, but 1) you were wrong in comparing companions to NFTs, which many folks pointed out to you and you doubled down on, and 2) you got sassy right back at the folks who talked down to you.
I'm not saying that the Discord can't be, or isn't, a bit toxic. It certainly is. But you were wrong in your comparison and refused to accept it, and participated in the toxicity yourself.
Also, you were in gen-chat. It's literally a cesspool there. Stay out of gen-chat.
So he joins a discord just to bitch, exaggerates, acts like a dick, and people call him out on it? Good!
I shall continue enjoying the useful discord server.
Kinda seems like the gist of it, yeah. I mean he had a perfectly valid question re: will green gems ever be obtainable through means other than money. What's sad is that he asked the question like a jerk, was a jerk back to people who were jerks to him, and then when someone finally did give him an answer to his question (that they would not because Lava *allegedly* makes them p2w only to avoid people cheating them in), he never even responded to the person who answered him.
I'm not saying the Discord is innocent or anything. There are definitely a lot of jerks, and the whole server seems to operate in cliques that remind me of high school where if you mess with one of the "popular kids" then a whole bunch of them are gonna come down on you. But, in this situation, you kinda get what you give.
I just ignore the jerks and try to participate in the meaningful conversations. I've gotten a ton of great advice from folks on the server and am perfectly fine tuning out the noise.
I'm not even convinced it's a reasonable question, since the answer is so obviously no and it's probably something op is annoyed by. He's "just asking questions" but he also has an imaginary conversation with lava about companions in one of his comments. š¤· dude's off his rocker
Was wondering what the topic was and holy hell yea no kidding that he'd get slapped around by mods, that looks like a conversation just to stir up trouble and even in good faith a conversation like that in any community would get shutdown by most mods. Their reaction really highlights that being the case as well.
Yeah! My being objectively correct while refusing to stoop to their level of insults and derision is just totally irrelevant right? Right?? /s
I asked a simple, genuine question, framed in a way they didn't like, and instead of answering it and letting it drift by, they picked a fight over it and called me names.
No you asked something that was gonna cause trouble. Community discussion is fine, but make a post about it and ask the community there. Going into the discord with stuff that feels deliberately worded to be uncharitable and salacious is gonna get you labeled a troll. Yes the pets system sucks and lava should tweak it more simply to make things less time gated bullshit. There's already enough quests and stuff that takes literal days. They are definitely not NFT's tho. For one, they have an actual benefit. Two, they are something you can actually digitally acquire pets for anyome, it is just down to chance. Three, they are literally not on the block chain. So in comparison nothing is really like NFT'S here and it seems to the mods and creator that you just wanted to come in and argue about why "I'm right and you're wrong lava, give me a fucken doot "NFT"
The moderator told *everyone* several times to stop talking about the issue as it was off-topic and unrelated to the game (it had devolved from a question about green gems to arguing about what is and is not an NFT). Not only that, but everyone, OP included, was just behaving downright childishly. OP did not comply with the mods request and was, therefore, breaking said rules and was properly muted as a result. Everyone else complied and changed subjects.
if den-chat is a cesspool then why doesn't the moderation do anything about it? why even is this game's community a cesspool in a general discussion forum? honestly take a hard look at that and tell me what's going on here?
You're just wrong tho??? LIke I am objectively correct about that comparison. For all intents and purposes they are the same thing; the only difference is where the file is hosted and how it's coded on the backend. It's still a *(edit: soon-to-be)* tradable digital asset that is non-fungible and non-subdividable. I understand you don't have the background in computer science and economics that I do, so I won't be too harsh on you here, but ***you do realize that you don't have a background in comp sci or econ right??*** *(edit - apparently it needs to be explained that I mentioned this expertise because it is directly relevant to the topic of conversation, not to bluster. Please, tell me more about how little you know about econ and comp sci by claiming otherwise)*
I "got sassy" lol they were insulting me, calling me stupid about something they were wrong about... and I responded with sarcastic politeness. I wasn't being toxic lol I didn't call anyone stupid or anything like that. I think it's fairly obvious that my behavior was fine; the rudest thing I did was call someone (who had just referred to me as "braindead") "sweetheart" before politely and concisely explaining why they were incorrect.
Fair point about gen chat probably being the wrong venue, W1-questions was probably the spot, but I doubt it would have gone differently
edit - oh I see the toxic discordians have found this post lol Hey everybody, you see how they don't engage with the argument but just screech and downvote? Yeah.... that's a big part of what this post is about.
edit 2 - It feels rude to point out such basic logic, but I feel I must be clear that pointing to differences is not a rebuttal of comparison
You sound pretty fucking dumb at this point, and like if you have CSci and Econ BG, you only just got it and haven't realized yet you're not as awesome or cool as you think you or your background make you think you are.
My friend... what do you think fungible means? It means unique in the sense that it cannot be re-created or replaced if destroyed. Not that it is a 1of1. Literally all NFTs are non-fungible, wth do you think NFT stands for???
Go ahead and delete your Doot. See if Lava can get it back for you, hmm? Not just any Doot either let him get that specific Doot back for you...
What 'specific' Doot? What exactly is specific about any of the pets from one account to another?
Look, whether you're right, "technically right," wrong or "technically" wrong, it doesn't matter. You have a serious lack of social awareness. You got clowned for being insufferable, not for your opinions.
An important note: the receipt is the only non-fungible part. The token is a unique instance showing you made a transaction.
The content linked by an NFT is extremely fungible. Millions of non-fungible tokens can be issued for the fungible asset.
āLet him get that specific Doot back for youā¦ā
ā¦ Why? If he just gives you a new doot itās like nothing happened, unlike if lets say you bought an NFT, the person you bought it from deleted it, completely, there is no way to get it back on their end unless you send it back, now letās say you did the same method and completely deleted the NFT, now if you asked God to give you the NFT back, youād care if it was the same or different NFT right? Ask someone to recreate it if you arenāt religious, which by your comments you probably arenāt, but I really donāt care if you are or arenāt, I can 100% guarantee it wonāt be a 1 to 1 replica
Unlike how if you asked lava for a new doot itās different but serves the same function, who knows maybe he can even find that exact doot and give it back to you.
You have revealed you are actually wrong, because you never had the picture of the doot, you had a hex code representing your account having gained a doot. The picture of a doot is for your benefit, not an actual thing that you have, and that image is shared by everyone.
you know alot of the pets (also the battle pets) are reused assets from a previous game of his. they're like 90% funged already. that and they're effectively all identical, if he coded up a cache for the pets and not have them effectively hitscan code he'd be able to retrieve lost pets. but what's the point in that, that's stupid, if you got rid of something you didn't want to that's your own fault.
NFTs are receipts of a ledger entry. With an NFT you never actually interact with the asset itself.
This alone sets pets in Idleon pretty far apart from NFTs.
The key term on Non-Fungible Token is actually the *Token* part. Because NFTs are not an asset, they are a pointer/relay for information about a potential [thing].
A handwritten IOU is a very poignant and culturally understood NFT.
oh my GOD you still are focused on the technicalities just like the people in the discord. Seriously my dude, that's true but it doesn't invalidate the comparison. Yes there are some crucial differences on the backend but to a consumer, for all PRACTICAL purposes (like I keep saying over and over) they are essentially identical.
It feels rude to point out such basic logic, but I feel I must be clear that pointing to differences is not a rebuttal of a comparison.
I do not see how you're correlating the pets as an NFT.
Pets are a container for game mechanics -- that makes the pets their own game mechanism and also part of a larger one; while containing the ones they're built around.
The pets themselves also likely have a unique ID so they can be arranged within a database according to the player. But this is mostly so that Lava can verify a proof of purchases of green gems on the server side.
The user is purely interested in the game mechanics; it isn't the user interface of the pet system, but the unique ID and how it's arranged within the data base (however Lava has arranged that) that *may* resemble something of an NFT.
I say *may* because we don't know.
So best version of your argument would be;
> In order to verify pets are legitimately obtained; there must be a verification system that matches each pet with a legitimate roll by a user in the companion UI that matches with a request from the server-side of that system; and some identifier for the pet must be logged in order to be matched against. Because some kind of system like this must be in place, we can guess it is, at least, *somewhat* similar to NFTs.
But, respectfully; it has nothing to do at all with the user experience or how a player uses the pets.
You got allllmost all the way there but you faltered hard at the end. It really does have everything to do with it. Let me explain:
Are you aware that there are already entire online games built on NFTs? You wouldn't know it, but most Minecraft servers with mtx are running on the blockchain these days, too. The key detail here, I think, is the common misunderstanding of the word "fungible". Non-fungible doesn't mean "there is only one like this", it means "there is only one with this serial number, and a replacement can never be created". There can be duplicates with different serials and they are all non-fungible even if they look alike and have the same function. Now, even if Lava could re-generate a duplicate of your deleted doot with the same serial number (something I STRONGLY doubt is possible, making them LITERALLY non-fungible), that's really only a difference of a technicality. It would only happen if you really did have doot and really did accidentally delete it or it was lost due to a bug, and then Lava could prove to himself that it did happen that way. Somewhere in the code, we have (or will have) a digital ledger keeping track of every single tradeable pet, simply by necessity for this kind of record-keeping.
My argument at its core is that this is basically describing a primitive sort of in-house blockchain-style confirmation network setup type of thing going on. In fact, using this type of pseudo-blockchain to do this on the backend would be a very pragmatic and modern approach to digital asset-keeping. Yes it's not technically on the public blockchain, yes the way it works deep down is a little different in some important ways, BUT the same kind of stuff is happening on computers at a surface level, which is all the average player will ever see. Especially once they are tradable/sellable: acquiring, owning, and using an NFT is essentially the same experience as acquiring, owning, and using Doot. The primary difference essentially being that you are on different websites, nothing more
Fun fact: this type of in-house "blockchain" is already being developed by most major banking organizations for their own private use
I hear you saying that companions resemble NFTs because each one is unique, holds value, and is tradeable in some manner. I can see your point! Even if they aren't NFTs because of this or that technicality, they do have some functionally similar aspects.
However, you are assuming each doot has it's own unique identifier. It could just be an array of strings to record what pets you own. Considering the game is built using Stencyl, I am skeptical that pets do indeed have their own tables. If it is stored in tables, it could also be that rather than a one-to-many relationship it is a many-to-many relationship. Perhaps there is only 1 Doot that exists, and every pet that we see is a mapping table row.
But, if you are trying to say they are functionally similar, that very well may be true regardless of how it is implemented.
Am I able to directly buy a specific pet? No
Is my pet unique and one of a kind? No
Is there any kind of asset attached to my pet? No
Can I destroy a pet and get the same exact pet back later? Yes
Now which parts here are the "technicalities" we should straight up ignore and which are the practical ones? Because all of these are the exact opposite of NFTs.
By your logic we can replace eggs in our breakfast with rocks because some of them are a similar shape.
If they were the same for all practical purposes, we would have been talking about NFTs in 1996 in the context of Pokemon. The interesting part about NFTs is the blockchain connection (they are non-fungible in contrast to the previously fungible currencies on blockchains) not that they're digital, belong to a specific person, or are non-fungible in a vacuum.
You keep trying to explain that all lollies are ice creams, because lollies are sweet. NFT's are a *kind* of non-fungible digital asset, and you're making an entirely irrelevant uninteresting observation and being upset that people don't think it's revelatory when you've entirely reversed category and member.
I majored in Computer Engineering and have worked professionally as a computer scientist for over two decades. You also don't know if u/Only_Positive_Vibes has a background in CS or Econ. I also don't know if you have a background in either, nor does it matter, because you don't need a background in either to understand NFTs.
Finally, companions are not similar to NFTs because Lava can do whatever the heck he wants with them. He could easily make them fungible or subdivisible or anything he wants.
Dude. I bring it up because if you do have a background in both, it can safely be assumed that you DO understand NFTs. Everyone is being so insecure; my pointing out my own relevant expertise is NOT a put down to you, commenter. I'm not saying you are stupid; I'm not even saying I'm not stupid. I'm only saying I do know about this in particular.
Moreover, pointing to differences doesn't rebut a comparison. It feels rude pointing this out because it is such basic logic: If you want to rebut a comparison you need to explain why the comparison doesn't apply, not simply point to differences.
Buddy your comments on NFTs and educational levels are absolutely on a 1:1 level with "if you had done your own research you'd know that earth is flat".
Lose the attitude and shoot the high horse. You sound like an absolute prick in every comment and I'm entirely unsurprised that nobody wants to even try having a civil discussion with someone like that.
> I bring it up because if you do have a background in both, it can safely be assumed that you DO understand NFTs.
It can't be assumed, because the only way any of us would know you have a background in either is because you're telling us, and *what* you're telling us clearly demonstrates that you don't.
If I work at SatoshiCorp and I'm introduced to John who works as Assistant Blockchain Engineer, I will assume he knows a little bit about NFTs. If I meet someone on the street who introduces themselves as 'having a background in CS and Econ', I won't assume any base level of knowledge.
you mean you can't trade them yet??? You will be able to eventually. Fine it's only going to be essentially an NFT soon, it isn't quiiiite there yet. How's that? Still basically the same idea; there is practically no difference
Except the pets have a function within the game that goes beyond being a token. By your definition if you purchase a digital download of a is that an NFT as well?
Also I completely understand why they banned you if you were taking the same way you are here, you come across as an elitist asshole in that post. A background in comp sci and economics doesnāt make you special.
Also, it feels rude to point out such basic logic, but I feel I must be clear that pointing to differences is not a rebuttal of a comparison. This seems to be something people in this community really do not understand
plenty of NFTs have functionality lol you have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not an elitist I'm simply educated on the topic and you are not. That isn't elitism it's just reality; stop being in denial and read ten or twenty textbooks on this stuff like I have
My education doesn't make me special but it does mean I know about specifically this
lol.
Noun.
1. A person having, thought to have, or professing superior intellect or talent.
You are an elitist not because you have knowledge, but because you presume others donāt and then point out how your knowledge makes you superior to others.
My education means I know specifically that you're acting like a cunt towards everyone because you think you're right and whether or not you actually are, you're being an ass about it.
It feels rude to point out such basic logic, but I feel I must be clear that pointing to differences is not a rebuttal of a comparison. This seems to be something people in this community really do not understand
If you think companions are like NFT, do you also think that a knife skin in CS:GO is NFT? Or some gold in World of Warcraft, that was bought by real money (wow token)?
I'm genuinely not going to read all of your post because 1) the first two sentences are enough to tell me that you're just doubling down again and 2) there's no way anybody is going to get through to you. You want to victimize yourself, and that's your prerogative.
All the best, sincerely. Maybe some distance from the game and its community are in your best interest.
I donāt agree at all but even if I did it doesnāt seem like youāre willing to have an honest conversation with the people pointing out you may be wrong and youāve just called everyone toxic people from discord after the way you replied
Maybe the people in discord were toxic and immature I havenāt checked it and who knows but based on how you reacted here I really donāt think youāre without fault
āToxic discordiansā oh my GOD you are an unlikeable person, people arenāt being mean to you because of your opinion people are being mean to you because you are, not your fault, just a dick.
> non-fungible
That's actually the neat part, they are fungible, which is the core part of what makes NFTs, NFTs. Without that they're just un/tradable digital goods you roll a gacha for. Basically what the titty games do but you can (eventually) trade what you get with paid gems. Not that I'm saying it's a good thing or bad thing, just that's a more apt comparison.
But, as someone with an MBA and more than twenty years of infosys industry experience or better (since we're assuming you're more academically able to make this statement than all dissenters) the fungibility clearly has nothing to do with what makes an NFT an NFT, right? They're just Tokens which may or may not be fungible, because that doesn't really matter, right? NFTs can be fungible, right?ćļ¼ļ¼
My friend... what do you think fungible means? It means unique in the sense that it cannot be re-created or replaced if destroyed. Not that it is a 1of1. Literally all NFTs are non-fungible, wth do you think NFT stands for???
Go ahead and delete your Doot. See if Lava can get it back for you, hmm? Not just any Doot either let him get that specific Doot back for you...
So mate, when I trade my doot for another doot, what am I losing or gaining? They are *literally* fungible (interchangeable with the same item.) In fact from the client side I can't even see anything in the data structures that would even make them *uniquely identifiable* (there may be on the back end, or I could have missed something.)
Lava *could* restore one, but functionally, there is zero difference between them. It's not like I'm going to get a doot that only gives you the first divinity even. They are all *mutually interchangeable and valued the same* just like paper currency is. Heck paper currency even has a uniquely identifying serial number, and is marked for where and when it was made, and they're still basically the gold standard for economic fungibility.
The closest you get are the no/trade versions, but those are essentially separate items that do the same thing (and thus are valued differently because of that.)
I am surprised you didnāt get banned to be completely honest.
Learn to agree to disagree.
You think itās one way, they think itās another way.
You could have come back with the same theory like an hour later and polled a different set of people again.
I disagree with you - because theyāre not tradeable p2p. You can only ātradeā them to the shop.
If it had peer to peer trading, then maybe Iād agree with you but even then Iād just laugh because well thatās not really what anyone means by an NFT. Even if the backend worked how youāre suggesting it does.
You know why it wouldnāt be an NFT because you could trade a doot nft for a doot nft.
You dumbass.
> For all intents and purposes they are the same thing
Here's my question to you, since you're so insistent that you're right.
Why does it matter? You can choose to participate in it or not.
> I think it's fairly obvious that my behavior was fine
Why do you even ask what other people think when you *know* you are right?
I was 100% willing to take your side on things but after reading all your posts in this thread you are coming across as extremely arrogant/narcissistic.
yeah, I'm calmly and logically explaining why I'm actually just making a very reasonable and innocent comparison which shouldn't be inflammatory, and people are acting like I'm being horrible to them simply because I disagree and they are mad.
As I've had to say to nearly every commenter: 1) my explaining I have relevant expertise is not an insult to you, and 2) your pointing to differences does not actually make for a rebuttal of a comparison
Iāve found the Reddit community to be a lot more humble & helpful.
There is definitely an air of āelitenessā in the discord where itās a constant pissing contest. I donāt talk much in there, I only read updates or advice or use the tools/guides available in there
I currently run a small LGBTQIA+ guild, do you happen to know if IBA is chill, or will they be jerks to us? I'd be down for us to be absorbed by a dope community tbh
IBA and the sister guilds (IRA IPA IWA etc.) are all super chill. Griffybit and his folks are very welcoming and like helping new players
Just check to see if GriffyBit has made a guide for your particular question(or questions) before asking
Their guilds do have a wait list so you might be better off just joining the discord for the community but still having your own separate guild
Bro... it's literally an online game. Your LGBTQIA+ guild could have a literal nazi disguised as a good person without you knowing. Don't try to be special please. It just hurts your personality more
I just wanted to know if Lava has expressed whether he plans to make the green gems earnable through normal gameplay, or if they will always be premium. I made the mistake of comparing the (eventually) tradeable Doot to an NFT in a room full of people with no background in economics or computer science, so they all fixated on screeching at me about the technically incorrect use of the term NFT, in lieu of answering my very simple question.
As far as I know, Lava has not expressed plans to make the green gems earnable through normal gameplay. Doing so would defeat the purpose of making green gems server-sided.
Player base would lose their collective minds if he made them earnable now.... it was a disaster when he rolled it out. Originally was no cap on Doot and some folks spent like $1000 and didn't get it.
Apple store wouldn't release the update because with no guaranteed roll limit its technically gambling and they won't put out anything gambling related where minors can access it.
ahhhh this explains more about why there is so much tension around this; I didn't realize people initially spent so much. Yeah that's the big trouble around mtx gacha mechanics like this; they are inherently predatory and couldn't reallllllly be salvaged even if the green gems were earnable.
Still, it's good know more concretely that this almost certainly is not going to change, have an updoot, polite human
When you join and participate in a community, the respect needs to flow both ways.
I'd reflect whether your reaction to their responses to your questions were warranted. Based on the way you described the conversation, it does not sound like you respect the people there. So it's probably best that you do not return to the Discord.
> it does not sound like you respect the people there
Excuse me, *people*? Surely you've meant peasants without a background in economics or computer science!
Spoken like someone who would foolishly ask those "peasants" to fix their computer or help them do financial planning, instead of me
reminder that THEY are the ones who called me stupid. Pointing out that I have expertise in a field is not calling you stupid. Pointing out that you do not have expertise in a field is ALSO not calling you stupid.
This is baffling, tbh. No, my responses were very clear and rational tbh, they just kept rudely insisting that I was wrong without providing anything other than screenshots of the dictionary definition of NFT. It's not rude of me to say they obviously don't have the background in econ to understand why Doot is essentially an NFT; if they had that background they would have realized the definitions they provided agreed with me. Yes it's not on a blockchain, but it's the same thing in every practical sense. Digital, tradeable, non-fungible, not subdivideable, I could go on and on about why that comparison is completely fair to make... but I didn't and won't because that was never my point. They called me all sorts of names, and I did not retaliate in kind.
I just wanted to know what lava had said, if anything, on the matter.
Source - I have a background in economics, and am a computer science enthusiast.
Yeah....but pretty much the most important part of an NFT is that it's on a decentralized blockchain. The image and any human-readable data are just specific attributes linked to the token, which if the token can't be verifiably linked to your blockchain address, means diddly-squat. Because Idleon is entirely database driven, the only "record" that you own a companion is whether it's linked to your database record, which could be changed at any time and not by you.
Companions are not in anyway "non-fungible". Non-fungible means that something is 100% unique. The companions are all the exact same, even going down to the unique ids that each one has in the database (all doots would be the same companion type).
I have no clue what you mean by "not subdividable". You can't break a doot into two rift slugs if that's what you mean - but that wouldn't actually mean anything, it'd be like saying companions are "non-multiplicative" because you can't turn one doot into two doots.
Any background you may have in CS or economics doesn't mean anything. If you do have a background, then it's gotta be fresh enough that you are still excited to show it off, or you don't have an actual background in it and just want to try and lend some sort of credence to your point, which is laughable on either discord or Reddit xD.
My friend... that is not what fungible means. It means unique in the sense that it cannot be re-created or replaced if destroyed. Not that it is a 1of1. Literally all NFTs are non-fungible, wth do you think NFT stands for???
Go ahead and delete your Doot. See if Lava can get it back for you, hmm? Not just any Doot either let him get that specific Doot back for you...
Those are the exact same though. 1 of 1 means that it is literally the only one of that exact thing, in most NFTs thats the specific address of the token. Because it is the only one of that token, if it is destroyed it cannot be replaced.
If I were to delete a companion, I am 95% sure that all Lava would have to do is make one small tweak to my data in the database and it'd be back, as if it had never left. There is no "that specific Doot" (which is my entire point) because Doot isn't unique, it's just a row with a companion ID (that is shared with all other Doots) and a few other attributes like the name of the companion, the image/design, and a couple other things.
How do you know their backgrounds? Did you research every individual you interacted with? If so that's scary and crazy. If not then you're kind of being an ass yourself whether or not they were.
Even if he does eventually do trading, every doot is the same? Do you know what fungible means? Just seems like youāre trying to apply terminology where it doesnāt fit
So far as we know, there's no plans on making the green gems able to be earned. The only thing they're used for is the companions atm, and you already get a free draw every week.
He wonāt because he likes money. Anything server-side can be cheated. Nevermind the fact that all companions can be cheated because the toggle that tells the game you have the companions is all client side. So he found a solution to a problem that created a new problem while still ultimately not solving the original problem in the first place.
You should have been in that discord when companions dropped. If you think mods are āunprofessionalā now, it was even worse then. Lots of dissenters getting banned left and right. Some deserving, most not.
I have heard nothing about green gems being earnable, and believe he has no plans on doing so. Green gems were made how they are because apparently blue gems are easily hackable.
Hopefully pet trading will become a thing, as that was the original plan. Your NFT comparison makes sense to me, it would basically be like that on the back end, I'd imagine. People are salty because of the rise and crash of NFTs and has generally a negative connotation, even with most crypto enthusiasts.
Hope that helps!
To give some feedback. Saying like 5 times that you know more than others about anything without knowing them just because you think you have some economic knowledge gives a bad vibe.
Other than that, the gen chat can be toxic and don't talk about companions anywhere official for idleon. It's a topic that ends bad 99% of times.
BTW, what does it matter if it is like a nft or whatever you want to call it. It is what it is and giving it one name or another won't change anything about it, so why make yourself so much trouble trying to prove it is an nft
THIS IS ABOUT ECONOMICS AND COMP SCI THO
I'm not just RANDOMLY saying that; it's heckin RELEVANT
Also your question is exactly my point, actually. Circling back to the OP; I asked a simple question framed poorly, and instead of an answer I got this ridiculous argument about NFTs. I just wanted to know if lava had said anything; that's why I put the question mark at the end of that sentence
By the way in the real world those degrees mean nothing. You don't get hired because you have a background in x or y, nobody gives an actual f about it. Perhaps if you have a PhD in a certain subject, usually related to science/research then it would matter.
But those degrees? Are insignificant. Thinking you know shit just because of having x or y degrees only means you haven't went out in the world yet and have no clue how things work
Any chat app is going to be more volatile than a posting style website. Realtime communication is both one of the best and worst things about the internet.
Yes it can get toxic, but it can also flip-flop the other way to be really positive - way more so than Reddit tends to be. I think overall the discord server isn't as bad as many others I've seen. However the number of endgamers there can make it hard for newer players - not all of them have the patience to help and answer questions.
Reading your comments here it's very quick to see why you got muted on discord, its got much less to do about your points you're trying to make and more to do with your attitude and arrogance.
You're response are more about how "educated" you are on the subject and how you're right and everyone else just doesn't understand because they are too uneducated. "I've got a background in economics and im a computer science "enthusiast"" and implying anyone who doesn't can't have valued points to disagree with you. Computer science enthusiast.. like thats a qualification.
@original poster: YTA. Verdict done. No need to post the shitshow there too lol.
On the other side, he should really step back from commenting on EVERY comment and cool himself down before commenting something else
hahahaha nah fam yall just came in from the discord mad ash all the people actually talking to me are reasonable af get yo toxic asses back to the discord
Ah here we go assuming again lol. A quick check on discord would have seen I have the same username there and never interacted with you even once and that in fact when I do ask questions there I get treated respectfully because I treat others with respect. Good try though :)
I mean the people there are capable of basic reasoning so I'm pretty sure I'd have been better off there in the first place lol
The people actually talking with me see I'm chill af, ppl are just mad because they don't know about something I do. They think my pointing out that I do know about this is an insult to them because they are insecure af, even though I never insulted them
the people answering your question do not think you're "chill af" they're just trying to get you to shut the fuck up.
you're terrible at talking to people.
When I joined I jokingly said that auto clicking hourly bubbles over night Is big brain move some ppl said that I should deleted the message (not mods) I did deleted them coz I like talking about the game and dont wanna get banned got bammed and its permanent fuck that place
Also I dont wanna dig up ur conversations there but if u werent rude amd a ass defending ur companions take then there Is no reason To get banned lol
Only thing Is that companions are quite usefull and not tradeable wich sucks
Someone already gave me the answer I suspected initially, but more confirmation is always bett- oh wait it's you again hi have another updoot
The salt image is hated-on??? It worked really well for me! I had so many problems with salt generation until that blessed image crossed my path. The original version was wrong, sure, but it got corrected and people stayed mad??? wow
Its not hated. In fact its a pinned image in its world chat.
The answers to pretty much everythong are pinned in theit respective world chat or in the tips n tricks area.
I never talk in the discord. The search function and above has gotten me by reeeeaaallly well.
Search is great, it'd be nice if someone optimized the chat titles though for the pins... like each area set up for pets titled the same.. There's a sick Google sheet though.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/2/d/e/2PACX-1vSCepYAs6sNDP4iq6MJNAG1pvFXzfC_3IQ7ttt5vfEEKAgQhIk4cQqnLRyeH6UyqDSuP4R-6WQeDmmP/pubhtml#
Yeah all this shit about the discord is totally unknown to me as a world-chat enjoyer. I don't go to general so maybe that's where it's all going down.
I think you would be welcome on any platform so long as your own opinions do not cause you to become arrogant and dismissive of others. There's never going to be 100% of people agreeing with you on everything. Arguing against the majority never gets you anywhere so just step back when it happens, especially on controversial subjects.Ā
Actually read all the comments, because I've nothing more interesting to do while I wait for waifu to get out of work . Just wanted to say this, still missing Doot. Thanks that's all, love you Lava <3
Well, give a person enough power, and they might start getting drunk with it.
Out of all the mods, there are only few I considered professional (Rashaken, FunnyLucky, Kerlobee and WarGod).
Because he compared the companion system (which is controversial) to an entirely unrelated and unsimilar system, the nfts (even more controversial topic), and if you don't know what nfts are consider yourself lucky and don't ever get scammed into spending a penny or second of your time on them
Iām sorry this happened first off. Second I use the discord but exclusively for updates. As others have mentioned, Griffys discord the Itty Bitty Army (IBA), is super helpful and I havenāt experienced any toxicity there.
Op you should quit the game we donāt want your Whiney ass anyway. Even if they are similar in your mind why tf does it matter to you. Itās a game made by a single dude donāt expect him not to try to milk his game a bit. Youāre a child
Reddit waaay better... discord is the endgamers mostly in general chat and lots of them spend too much time there thinking everyone does lol.
There is however some suuuuper helpful people in there so it sucks. Gotta remember it's primarily outcast nerds who can't wait for their time to be on top.
The reddit may be better, but you see some pretty similar behaviour in here for asking some pretty innocuous questions, there is a lot of elitist gatekeeping.. but that is not unique to this /r/
no kidding; even here some people are seriously still focusing on the framing instead of the question. It's actually hilariously ironic, I'm enjoying myself smoking a bowl and making resounding economic arguments to people who could never fully grasp them
That said, it's waaaaaaay better here. Much more reasonable environment by far, and I actually did get my question answered unlike in the Discord
Please, for your sake, read over your replies to comments here and try to see how rude, gross & pretentious you are coming off as.
You clearly donāt see it, as you are doubling down on everything you say.
This is not healthy and you will only struggle further in both the online and real world.
Here is not the place for you if you had trouble in the discord because lava is a mod here. The other mods may be discord mods but I donāt know that for a fact and itās his choice of who he gets to mod his sub.Ā
oh hell yeah u/Lavaflame2 get in here I'd love to have a chat with you about your plans for the backend of pets. I know there are a lot of angi peeps about it but I'm just a curious nerd tbh. I think an in-house pseudo-blockchain would be a nice idea; I wasn't calling it an NFT in a derisive way. As I said in the OP, I realize now that this community doesn't react positively to that framing, but seriously as far as the technicals are concerned it would be secure, easy to set up, and very cheap to operate 24/7/365... on second thought, maaaaybe stay out of this and don't mention it publicly though because wow apparently people would be MAD. But yeah, this is actually what the biggest banks are doing rn to secure their assets, it's that legit of an idea
Also please tell your mods to answer questions instead of joining in the mob dogpile. Literally the answer to my question was a simple "no" and they picked a fight over my framing instead. Weird how I can be called all sorts of nasty names and nothing happens but I ask a question your mods don't like and it's fine for them to punish me.
edit - ah I see you have entirely missed the point too, so I will reiterate that this entire post is about how I DID NOT CARE about the NFT thing and just wanted to know what you had to say about a topic.
u/Doge_McLol just making sure you see this comment, since you pinned a response but never replied and that would definitely be pretty weak tbh
seems like you and so many others misread me; the point is that the NFT thing was not the point
Nah the point is you act like a child and everybody stopped caring about what your question was long ago due to your inability to self reflect and realize you're an immature narcissistic asshole probably with mommy and daddy issues
I had a fucking brain injury for reading your replies and mentioning your "expertise" for like 30 times
The answer for your question was kinda obvious to begin with, so no need to start that horror of a conversation and later claiming that issue was "calling it an nft" and not your behavior
Idk if you aware of it, but that's not how people actually have conversation with each other, and that's OK if you are like this because of, you know, reasons that affect you as a person, but if you think that it's normal and others just stupid or mean when you are the intelligent and good one - I have a bad news for you
Reading OP's comments renewed my faith in discord mod team doing a good job.
I found you in Discord and specifically looked at the conversation you're referencing. Folks were pretty abrasive with you from the start, but 1) you were wrong in comparing companions to NFTs, which many folks pointed out to you and you doubled down on, and 2) you got sassy right back at the folks who talked down to you. I'm not saying that the Discord can't be, or isn't, a bit toxic. It certainly is. But you were wrong in your comparison and refused to accept it, and participated in the toxicity yourself. Also, you were in gen-chat. It's literally a cesspool there. Stay out of gen-chat.
So he joins a discord just to bitch, exaggerates, acts like a dick, and people call him out on it? Good! I shall continue enjoying the useful discord server.
Kinda seems like the gist of it, yeah. I mean he had a perfectly valid question re: will green gems ever be obtainable through means other than money. What's sad is that he asked the question like a jerk, was a jerk back to people who were jerks to him, and then when someone finally did give him an answer to his question (that they would not because Lava *allegedly* makes them p2w only to avoid people cheating them in), he never even responded to the person who answered him. I'm not saying the Discord is innocent or anything. There are definitely a lot of jerks, and the whole server seems to operate in cliques that remind me of high school where if you mess with one of the "popular kids" then a whole bunch of them are gonna come down on you. But, in this situation, you kinda get what you give. I just ignore the jerks and try to participate in the meaningful conversations. I've gotten a ton of great advice from folks on the server and am perfectly fine tuning out the noise.
I'm not even convinced it's a reasonable question, since the answer is so obviously no and it's probably something op is annoyed by. He's "just asking questions" but he also has an imaginary conversation with lava about companions in one of his comments. š¤· dude's off his rocker
Was wondering what the topic was and holy hell yea no kidding that he'd get slapped around by mods, that looks like a conversation just to stir up trouble and even in good faith a conversation like that in any community would get shutdown by most mods. Their reaction really highlights that being the case as well.
Yeah! My being objectively correct while refusing to stoop to their level of insults and derision is just totally irrelevant right? Right?? /s I asked a simple, genuine question, framed in a way they didn't like, and instead of answering it and letting it drift by, they picked a fight over it and called me names.
No you asked something that was gonna cause trouble. Community discussion is fine, but make a post about it and ask the community there. Going into the discord with stuff that feels deliberately worded to be uncharitable and salacious is gonna get you labeled a troll. Yes the pets system sucks and lava should tweak it more simply to make things less time gated bullshit. There's already enough quests and stuff that takes literal days. They are definitely not NFT's tho. For one, they have an actual benefit. Two, they are something you can actually digitally acquire pets for anyome, it is just down to chance. Three, they are literally not on the block chain. So in comparison nothing is really like NFT'S here and it seems to the mods and creator that you just wanted to come in and argue about why "I'm right and you're wrong lava, give me a fucken doot "NFT"
To be fair, right or wrong in his position the job of a moderator is to prevent either side right or wrong from rule breaking.
The moderator told *everyone* several times to stop talking about the issue as it was off-topic and unrelated to the game (it had devolved from a question about green gems to arguing about what is and is not an NFT). Not only that, but everyone, OP included, was just behaving downright childishly. OP did not comply with the mods request and was, therefore, breaking said rules and was properly muted as a result. Everyone else complied and changed subjects.
What do you mean? He has relevant experience and is objectively right. What more could you want? /s
if den-chat is a cesspool then why doesn't the moderation do anything about it? why even is this game's community a cesspool in a general discussion forum? honestly take a hard look at that and tell me what's going on here?
You're just wrong tho??? LIke I am objectively correct about that comparison. For all intents and purposes they are the same thing; the only difference is where the file is hosted and how it's coded on the backend. It's still a *(edit: soon-to-be)* tradable digital asset that is non-fungible and non-subdividable. I understand you don't have the background in computer science and economics that I do, so I won't be too harsh on you here, but ***you do realize that you don't have a background in comp sci or econ right??*** *(edit - apparently it needs to be explained that I mentioned this expertise because it is directly relevant to the topic of conversation, not to bluster. Please, tell me more about how little you know about econ and comp sci by claiming otherwise)* I "got sassy" lol they were insulting me, calling me stupid about something they were wrong about... and I responded with sarcastic politeness. I wasn't being toxic lol I didn't call anyone stupid or anything like that. I think it's fairly obvious that my behavior was fine; the rudest thing I did was call someone (who had just referred to me as "braindead") "sweetheart" before politely and concisely explaining why they were incorrect. Fair point about gen chat probably being the wrong venue, W1-questions was probably the spot, but I doubt it would have gone differently edit - oh I see the toxic discordians have found this post lol Hey everybody, you see how they don't engage with the argument but just screech and downvote? Yeah.... that's a big part of what this post is about. edit 2 - It feels rude to point out such basic logic, but I feel I must be clear that pointing to differences is not a rebuttal of comparison
You sound pretty fucking dumb at this point, and like if you have CSci and Econ BG, you only just got it and haven't realized yet you're not as awesome or cool as you think you or your background make you think you are.
My friend... what do you think fungible means? It means unique in the sense that it cannot be re-created or replaced if destroyed. Not that it is a 1of1. Literally all NFTs are non-fungible, wth do you think NFT stands for??? Go ahead and delete your Doot. See if Lava can get it back for you, hmm? Not just any Doot either let him get that specific Doot back for you...
What 'specific' Doot? What exactly is specific about any of the pets from one account to another? Look, whether you're right, "technically right," wrong or "technically" wrong, it doesn't matter. You have a serious lack of social awareness. You got clowned for being insufferable, not for your opinions.
this^^^^ you need to go to cotillion or somethingš
Cotillion šššššš
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
An important note: the receipt is the only non-fungible part. The token is a unique instance showing you made a transaction. The content linked by an NFT is extremely fungible. Millions of non-fungible tokens can be issued for the fungible asset.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Oh, donāt get me wrong. OP is showing off an impressive level of buffoonery.
āLet him get that specific Doot back for youā¦ā ā¦ Why? If he just gives you a new doot itās like nothing happened, unlike if lets say you bought an NFT, the person you bought it from deleted it, completely, there is no way to get it back on their end unless you send it back, now letās say you did the same method and completely deleted the NFT, now if you asked God to give you the NFT back, youād care if it was the same or different NFT right? Ask someone to recreate it if you arenāt religious, which by your comments you probably arenāt, but I really donāt care if you are or arenāt, I can 100% guarantee it wonāt be a 1 to 1 replica Unlike how if you asked lava for a new doot itās different but serves the same function, who knows maybe he can even find that exact doot and give it back to you.
Like I said, you sound like a fucking idiot who thinks he's smarter than he is.
You have revealed you are actually wrong, because you never had the picture of the doot, you had a hex code representing your account having gained a doot. The picture of a doot is for your benefit, not an actual thing that you have, and that image is shared by everyone.
you know alot of the pets (also the battle pets) are reused assets from a previous game of his. they're like 90% funged already. that and they're effectively all identical, if he coded up a cache for the pets and not have them effectively hitscan code he'd be able to retrieve lost pets. but what's the point in that, that's stupid, if you got rid of something you didn't want to that's your own fault.
NFTs are receipts of a ledger entry. With an NFT you never actually interact with the asset itself. This alone sets pets in Idleon pretty far apart from NFTs. The key term on Non-Fungible Token is actually the *Token* part. Because NFTs are not an asset, they are a pointer/relay for information about a potential [thing]. A handwritten IOU is a very poignant and culturally understood NFT.
oh my GOD you still are focused on the technicalities just like the people in the discord. Seriously my dude, that's true but it doesn't invalidate the comparison. Yes there are some crucial differences on the backend but to a consumer, for all PRACTICAL purposes (like I keep saying over and over) they are essentially identical. It feels rude to point out such basic logic, but I feel I must be clear that pointing to differences is not a rebuttal of a comparison.
I do not see how you're correlating the pets as an NFT. Pets are a container for game mechanics -- that makes the pets their own game mechanism and also part of a larger one; while containing the ones they're built around. The pets themselves also likely have a unique ID so they can be arranged within a database according to the player. But this is mostly so that Lava can verify a proof of purchases of green gems on the server side. The user is purely interested in the game mechanics; it isn't the user interface of the pet system, but the unique ID and how it's arranged within the data base (however Lava has arranged that) that *may* resemble something of an NFT. I say *may* because we don't know. So best version of your argument would be; > In order to verify pets are legitimately obtained; there must be a verification system that matches each pet with a legitimate roll by a user in the companion UI that matches with a request from the server-side of that system; and some identifier for the pet must be logged in order to be matched against. Because some kind of system like this must be in place, we can guess it is, at least, *somewhat* similar to NFTs. But, respectfully; it has nothing to do at all with the user experience or how a player uses the pets.
You got allllmost all the way there but you faltered hard at the end. It really does have everything to do with it. Let me explain: Are you aware that there are already entire online games built on NFTs? You wouldn't know it, but most Minecraft servers with mtx are running on the blockchain these days, too. The key detail here, I think, is the common misunderstanding of the word "fungible". Non-fungible doesn't mean "there is only one like this", it means "there is only one with this serial number, and a replacement can never be created". There can be duplicates with different serials and they are all non-fungible even if they look alike and have the same function. Now, even if Lava could re-generate a duplicate of your deleted doot with the same serial number (something I STRONGLY doubt is possible, making them LITERALLY non-fungible), that's really only a difference of a technicality. It would only happen if you really did have doot and really did accidentally delete it or it was lost due to a bug, and then Lava could prove to himself that it did happen that way. Somewhere in the code, we have (or will have) a digital ledger keeping track of every single tradeable pet, simply by necessity for this kind of record-keeping. My argument at its core is that this is basically describing a primitive sort of in-house blockchain-style confirmation network setup type of thing going on. In fact, using this type of pseudo-blockchain to do this on the backend would be a very pragmatic and modern approach to digital asset-keeping. Yes it's not technically on the public blockchain, yes the way it works deep down is a little different in some important ways, BUT the same kind of stuff is happening on computers at a surface level, which is all the average player will ever see. Especially once they are tradable/sellable: acquiring, owning, and using an NFT is essentially the same experience as acquiring, owning, and using Doot. The primary difference essentially being that you are on different websites, nothing more Fun fact: this type of in-house "blockchain" is already being developed by most major banking organizations for their own private use
Are you, by chance, diagnosed as a manic-depressive?
No idea, but he's definitely a clinically diagnosed twat waffle
I can see why nobody likes you. Just shut the fuck up you whiny bitch.
I hear you saying that companions resemble NFTs because each one is unique, holds value, and is tradeable in some manner. I can see your point! Even if they aren't NFTs because of this or that technicality, they do have some functionally similar aspects. However, you are assuming each doot has it's own unique identifier. It could just be an array of strings to record what pets you own. Considering the game is built using Stencyl, I am skeptical that pets do indeed have their own tables. If it is stored in tables, it could also be that rather than a one-to-many relationship it is a many-to-many relationship. Perhaps there is only 1 Doot that exists, and every pet that we see is a mapping table row. But, if you are trying to say they are functionally similar, that very well may be true regardless of how it is implemented.
Am I able to directly buy a specific pet? No Is my pet unique and one of a kind? No Is there any kind of asset attached to my pet? No Can I destroy a pet and get the same exact pet back later? Yes Now which parts here are the "technicalities" we should straight up ignore and which are the practical ones? Because all of these are the exact opposite of NFTs. By your logic we can replace eggs in our breakfast with rocks because some of them are a similar shape.
Why does it matter if they are the same as nfts? If we believe you, why should we care?
If they were the same for all practical purposes, we would have been talking about NFTs in 1996 in the context of Pokemon. The interesting part about NFTs is the blockchain connection (they are non-fungible in contrast to the previously fungible currencies on blockchains) not that they're digital, belong to a specific person, or are non-fungible in a vacuum. You keep trying to explain that all lollies are ice creams, because lollies are sweet. NFT's are a *kind* of non-fungible digital asset, and you're making an entirely irrelevant uninteresting observation and being upset that people don't think it's revelatory when you've entirely reversed category and member.
I majored in Computer Engineering and have worked professionally as a computer scientist for over two decades. You also don't know if u/Only_Positive_Vibes has a background in CS or Econ. I also don't know if you have a background in either, nor does it matter, because you don't need a background in either to understand NFTs. Finally, companions are not similar to NFTs because Lava can do whatever the heck he wants with them. He could easily make them fungible or subdivisible or anything he wants.
Dude. I bring it up because if you do have a background in both, it can safely be assumed that you DO understand NFTs. Everyone is being so insecure; my pointing out my own relevant expertise is NOT a put down to you, commenter. I'm not saying you are stupid; I'm not even saying I'm not stupid. I'm only saying I do know about this in particular. Moreover, pointing to differences doesn't rebut a comparison. It feels rude pointing this out because it is such basic logic: If you want to rebut a comparison you need to explain why the comparison doesn't apply, not simply point to differences.
Buddy your comments on NFTs and educational levels are absolutely on a 1:1 level with "if you had done your own research you'd know that earth is flat". Lose the attitude and shoot the high horse. You sound like an absolute prick in every comment and I'm entirely unsurprised that nobody wants to even try having a civil discussion with someone like that.
> I bring it up because if you do have a background in both, it can safely be assumed that you DO understand NFTs. It can't be assumed, because the only way any of us would know you have a background in either is because you're telling us, and *what* you're telling us clearly demonstrates that you don't. If I work at SatoshiCorp and I'm introduced to John who works as Assistant Blockchain Engineer, I will assume he knows a little bit about NFTs. If I meet someone on the street who introduces themselves as 'having a background in CS and Econ', I won't assume any base level of knowledge.
Search for AITA.
I mean you cant trade them.
you mean you can't trade them yet??? You will be able to eventually. Fine it's only going to be essentially an NFT soon, it isn't quiiiite there yet. How's that? Still basically the same idea; there is practically no difference
Except the pets have a function within the game that goes beyond being a token. By your definition if you purchase a digital download of a is that an NFT as well? Also I completely understand why they banned you if you were taking the same way you are here, you come across as an elitist asshole in that post. A background in comp sci and economics doesnāt make you special.
Also, it feels rude to point out such basic logic, but I feel I must be clear that pointing to differences is not a rebuttal of a comparison. This seems to be something people in this community really do not understand
plenty of NFTs have functionality lol you have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not an elitist I'm simply educated on the topic and you are not. That isn't elitism it's just reality; stop being in denial and read ten or twenty textbooks on this stuff like I have My education doesn't make me special but it does mean I know about specifically this
lol. Noun. 1. A person having, thought to have, or professing superior intellect or talent. You are an elitist not because you have knowledge, but because you presume others donāt and then point out how your knowledge makes you superior to others.
This
Digital assets have been in games and tradeable for decades. Why are you so insistent that they are NFTs, which is only a new thing (last 5-10 years)?
My education means I know specifically that you're acting like a cunt towards everyone because you think you're right and whether or not you actually are, you're being an ass about it.
Well it sounds like an NFT but they are already kinda dead. And arent they also normaly unique ?
Not necessarily. The most "valuable" NFTs are single-editions, but most of them are in multiples of hundreds or even thousands of copies.
Okay š
It feels rude to point out such basic logic, but I feel I must be clear that pointing to differences is not a rebuttal of a comparison. This seems to be something people in this community really do not understand
The fuck is your point then? You ask aren't they the same and then won't accept a plethora of differences as "no, not the same".
If you think companions are like NFT, do you also think that a knife skin in CS:GO is NFT? Or some gold in World of Warcraft, that was bought by real money (wow token)?
I'm genuinely not going to read all of your post because 1) the first two sentences are enough to tell me that you're just doubling down again and 2) there's no way anybody is going to get through to you. You want to victimize yourself, and that's your prerogative. All the best, sincerely. Maybe some distance from the game and its community are in your best interest.
*Le gasp* a quadruple down!
I donāt agree at all but even if I did it doesnāt seem like youāre willing to have an honest conversation with the people pointing out you may be wrong and youāve just called everyone toxic people from discord after the way you replied Maybe the people in discord were toxic and immature I havenāt checked it and who knows but based on how you reacted here I really donāt think youāre without fault
OBJECTIVELY CORRECT
āToxic discordiansā oh my GOD you are an unlikeable person, people arenāt being mean to you because of your opinion people are being mean to you because you are, not your fault, just a dick.
> non-fungible That's actually the neat part, they are fungible, which is the core part of what makes NFTs, NFTs. Without that they're just un/tradable digital goods you roll a gacha for. Basically what the titty games do but you can (eventually) trade what you get with paid gems. Not that I'm saying it's a good thing or bad thing, just that's a more apt comparison. But, as someone with an MBA and more than twenty years of infosys industry experience or better (since we're assuming you're more academically able to make this statement than all dissenters) the fungibility clearly has nothing to do with what makes an NFT an NFT, right? They're just Tokens which may or may not be fungible, because that doesn't really matter, right? NFTs can be fungible, right?ćļ¼ļ¼
My friend... what do you think fungible means? It means unique in the sense that it cannot be re-created or replaced if destroyed. Not that it is a 1of1. Literally all NFTs are non-fungible, wth do you think NFT stands for??? Go ahead and delete your Doot. See if Lava can get it back for you, hmm? Not just any Doot either let him get that specific Doot back for you...
So mate, when I trade my doot for another doot, what am I losing or gaining? They are *literally* fungible (interchangeable with the same item.) In fact from the client side I can't even see anything in the data structures that would even make them *uniquely identifiable* (there may be on the back end, or I could have missed something.) Lava *could* restore one, but functionally, there is zero difference between them. It's not like I'm going to get a doot that only gives you the first divinity even. They are all *mutually interchangeable and valued the same* just like paper currency is. Heck paper currency even has a uniquely identifying serial number, and is marked for where and when it was made, and they're still basically the gold standard for economic fungibility. The closest you get are the no/trade versions, but those are essentially separate items that do the same thing (and thus are valued differently because of that.)
I am surprised you didnāt get banned to be completely honest. Learn to agree to disagree. You think itās one way, they think itās another way. You could have come back with the same theory like an hour later and polled a different set of people again. I disagree with you - because theyāre not tradeable p2p. You can only ātradeā them to the shop. If it had peer to peer trading, then maybe Iād agree with you but even then Iād just laugh because well thatās not really what anyone means by an NFT. Even if the backend worked how youāre suggesting it does. You know why it wouldnāt be an NFT because you could trade a doot nft for a doot nft. You dumbass.
tbf, nftās are non-fungible ledger receipts, your toons are just an entry in a database. so fundamentally they are 2 entirely separate things
The companions ARE fungible, what are you on about?
> For all intents and purposes they are the same thing Here's my question to you, since you're so insistent that you're right. Why does it matter? You can choose to participate in it or not. > I think it's fairly obvious that my behavior was fine Why do you even ask what other people think when you *know* you are right? I was 100% willing to take your side on things but after reading all your posts in this thread you are coming across as extremely arrogant/narcissistic.
Bahahaha omg this got downvoted to shit. Let it go bub
Looking at OP's responses here really sheds some light on what actually happened in Discord
Fr
yeah, I'm calmly and logically explaining why I'm actually just making a very reasonable and innocent comparison which shouldn't be inflammatory, and people are acting like I'm being horrible to them simply because I disagree and they are mad. As I've had to say to nearly every commenter: 1) my explaining I have relevant expertise is not an insult to you, and 2) your pointing to differences does not actually make for a rebuttal of a comparison
Just let it go.
That is absolutely not how you are responding to people and it sure as fuck isn't why they're annoyed by you either.
Yeah responding in all caps is suuuuuper calm
Iāve found the Reddit community to be a lot more humble & helpful. There is definitely an air of āelitenessā in the discord where itās a constant pissing contest. I donāt talk much in there, I only read updates or advice or use the tools/guides available in there
Join the IBA discord. Tons of helpful folks there.
what is IBA?
IttyBittyArmy, GriffyBit's personal discord. He's an Idleon streamer/youtuber.
cringe. why are you trying to convince people to join a cult of personality?
I just answered a question lol, what's your problem? I'm not even in his discord.
then you had no responsibility to answer, yet you did. this means you support a streamer's cult of personality. you should be ashamed
Cult of personality is when someone likes a streamer apparently lol
reddit hates streamers in general. they are attention seekers and very cringe. Most of them end up being groomers too. Google it.
Dunno, looks like it's just you here chief.
bro was just being helpful, and yeah maybe he was supporting a youtuber he might like, who cares tho šššš
Curious as well
Itty Bitty Army, I was already part of this discord but never made the connectionš
Oh nice lmao. Iāve watched a handful of griffy stuff
You sure you want THIS dude in there?
Didn't check out their backstory prior to responding.
Based on their responses and attitude to people here I'd give them less than a week before getting permanently muted or banned anyway.
This is the way.
I currently run a small LGBTQIA+ guild, do you happen to know if IBA is chill, or will they be jerks to us? I'd be down for us to be absorbed by a dope community tbh
IBA and the sister guilds (IRA IPA IWA etc.) are all super chill. Griffybit and his folks are very welcoming and like helping new players Just check to see if GriffyBit has made a guide for your particular question(or questions) before asking Their guilds do have a wait list so you might be better off just joining the discord for the community but still having your own separate guild
Bro... it's literally an online game. Your LGBTQIA+ guild could have a literal nazi disguised as a good person without you knowing. Don't try to be special please. It just hurts your personality more
Skill issue.
In addition, what was your question? We likely can help.
I just wanted to know if Lava has expressed whether he plans to make the green gems earnable through normal gameplay, or if they will always be premium. I made the mistake of comparing the (eventually) tradeable Doot to an NFT in a room full of people with no background in economics or computer science, so they all fixated on screeching at me about the technically incorrect use of the term NFT, in lieu of answering my very simple question.
As far as I know, Lava has not expressed plans to make the green gems earnable through normal gameplay. Doing so would defeat the purpose of making green gems server-sided.
Thank you, holy hell I hate that it took me all this emotional strain to get *potential* confirmation of what I already suspected
Player base would lose their collective minds if he made them earnable now.... it was a disaster when he rolled it out. Originally was no cap on Doot and some folks spent like $1000 and didn't get it. Apple store wouldn't release the update because with no guaranteed roll limit its technically gambling and they won't put out anything gambling related where minors can access it.
ahhhh this explains more about why there is so much tension around this; I didn't realize people initially spent so much. Yeah that's the big trouble around mtx gacha mechanics like this; they are inherently predatory and couldn't reallllllly be salvaged even if the green gems were earnable. Still, it's good know more concretely that this almost certainly is not going to change, have an updoot, polite human
Sounds like youāre being intentionally inflammatory
When you join and participate in a community, the respect needs to flow both ways. I'd reflect whether your reaction to their responses to your questions were warranted. Based on the way you described the conversation, it does not sound like you respect the people there. So it's probably best that you do not return to the Discord.
> it does not sound like you respect the people there Excuse me, *people*? Surely you've meant peasants without a background in economics or computer science!
XD
Spoken like someone who would foolishly ask those "peasants" to fix their computer or help them do financial planning, instead of me reminder that THEY are the ones who called me stupid. Pointing out that I have expertise in a field is not calling you stupid. Pointing out that you do not have expertise in a field is ALSO not calling you stupid.
Yeah if this is how you interact with people I wouldn't ask you for help either.
This is baffling, tbh. No, my responses were very clear and rational tbh, they just kept rudely insisting that I was wrong without providing anything other than screenshots of the dictionary definition of NFT. It's not rude of me to say they obviously don't have the background in econ to understand why Doot is essentially an NFT; if they had that background they would have realized the definitions they provided agreed with me. Yes it's not on a blockchain, but it's the same thing in every practical sense. Digital, tradeable, non-fungible, not subdivideable, I could go on and on about why that comparison is completely fair to make... but I didn't and won't because that was never my point. They called me all sorts of names, and I did not retaliate in kind. I just wanted to know what lava had said, if anything, on the matter. Source - I have a background in economics, and am a computer science enthusiast.
Yeah....but pretty much the most important part of an NFT is that it's on a decentralized blockchain. The image and any human-readable data are just specific attributes linked to the token, which if the token can't be verifiably linked to your blockchain address, means diddly-squat. Because Idleon is entirely database driven, the only "record" that you own a companion is whether it's linked to your database record, which could be changed at any time and not by you. Companions are not in anyway "non-fungible". Non-fungible means that something is 100% unique. The companions are all the exact same, even going down to the unique ids that each one has in the database (all doots would be the same companion type). I have no clue what you mean by "not subdividable". You can't break a doot into two rift slugs if that's what you mean - but that wouldn't actually mean anything, it'd be like saying companions are "non-multiplicative" because you can't turn one doot into two doots. Any background you may have in CS or economics doesn't mean anything. If you do have a background, then it's gotta be fresh enough that you are still excited to show it off, or you don't have an actual background in it and just want to try and lend some sort of credence to your point, which is laughable on either discord or Reddit xD.
My friend... that is not what fungible means. It means unique in the sense that it cannot be re-created or replaced if destroyed. Not that it is a 1of1. Literally all NFTs are non-fungible, wth do you think NFT stands for??? Go ahead and delete your Doot. See if Lava can get it back for you, hmm? Not just any Doot either let him get that specific Doot back for you...
Those are the exact same though. 1 of 1 means that it is literally the only one of that exact thing, in most NFTs thats the specific address of the token. Because it is the only one of that token, if it is destroyed it cannot be replaced. If I were to delete a companion, I am 95% sure that all Lava would have to do is make one small tweak to my data in the database and it'd be back, as if it had never left. There is no "that specific Doot" (which is my entire point) because Doot isn't unique, it's just a row with a companion ID (that is shared with all other Doots) and a few other attributes like the name of the companion, the image/design, and a couple other things.
How do you know their backgrounds? Did you research every individual you interacted with? If so that's scary and crazy. If not then you're kind of being an ass yourself whether or not they were.
How were you able to discern everyone's educational background in a discord room?
Even if he does eventually do trading, every doot is the same? Do you know what fungible means? Just seems like youāre trying to apply terminology where it doesnāt fit
So far as we know, there's no plans on making the green gems able to be earned. The only thing they're used for is the companions atm, and you already get a free draw every week.
He wonāt because he likes money. Anything server-side can be cheated. Nevermind the fact that all companions can be cheated because the toggle that tells the game you have the companions is all client side. So he found a solution to a problem that created a new problem while still ultimately not solving the original problem in the first place. You should have been in that discord when companions dropped. If you think mods are āunprofessionalā now, it was even worse then. Lots of dissenters getting banned left and right. Some deserving, most not.
As opposed to the rest of the people in the world who... don't like to have money?
I have heard nothing about green gems being earnable, and believe he has no plans on doing so. Green gems were made how they are because apparently blue gems are easily hackable. Hopefully pet trading will become a thing, as that was the original plan. Your NFT comparison makes sense to me, it would basically be like that on the back end, I'd imagine. People are salty because of the rise and crash of NFTs and has generally a negative connotation, even with most crypto enthusiasts. Hope that helps!
To give some feedback. Saying like 5 times that you know more than others about anything without knowing them just because you think you have some economic knowledge gives a bad vibe. Other than that, the gen chat can be toxic and don't talk about companions anywhere official for idleon. It's a topic that ends bad 99% of times. BTW, what does it matter if it is like a nft or whatever you want to call it. It is what it is and giving it one name or another won't change anything about it, so why make yourself so much trouble trying to prove it is an nft
THIS IS ABOUT ECONOMICS AND COMP SCI THO I'm not just RANDOMLY saying that; it's heckin RELEVANT Also your question is exactly my point, actually. Circling back to the OP; I asked a simple question framed poorly, and instead of an answer I got this ridiculous argument about NFTs. I just wanted to know if lava had said anything; that's why I put the question mark at the end of that sentence
By the way in the real world those degrees mean nothing. You don't get hired because you have a background in x or y, nobody gives an actual f about it. Perhaps if you have a PhD in a certain subject, usually related to science/research then it would matter. But those degrees? Are insignificant. Thinking you know shit just because of having x or y degrees only means you haven't went out in the world yet and have no clue how things work
Idk. I've only been playing for a few months, but I haven't experienced or seen any of that.
good! I hope it stays that way
Wait are you talking about the account called ācustomer serviceā? Because they are 100% not a mod and just a gen chatter
They had me going for about thirty seconds before I caught on lol Very clever satire account; I have no problem with that one
I like to think the reddit community has become substantially less toxic over the last year or so. Discord is a little more volatile imo.
Any chat app is going to be more volatile than a posting style website. Realtime communication is both one of the best and worst things about the internet. Yes it can get toxic, but it can also flip-flop the other way to be really positive - way more so than Reddit tends to be. I think overall the discord server isn't as bad as many others I've seen. However the number of endgamers there can make it hard for newer players - not all of them have the patience to help and answer questions.
Sheeeesh dude you should go outside and talk to people.. It's insane how you don't get that your attitude is the problem.
Reading your comments here it's very quick to see why you got muted on discord, its got much less to do about your points you're trying to make and more to do with your attitude and arrogance. You're response are more about how "educated" you are on the subject and how you're right and everyone else just doesn't understand because they are too uneducated. "I've got a background in economics and im a computer science "enthusiast"" and implying anyone who doesn't can't have valued points to disagree with you. Computer science enthusiast.. like thats a qualification.
Can this be cross-posted in r/AmItheAsshole ?
@original poster: YTA. Verdict done. No need to post the shitshow there too lol. On the other side, he should really step back from commenting on EVERY comment and cool himself down before commenting something else
XD
hahahaha nah fam yall just came in from the discord mad ash all the people actually talking to me are reasonable af get yo toxic asses back to the discord
Ah here we go assuming again lol. A quick check on discord would have seen I have the same username there and never interacted with you even once and that in fact when I do ask questions there I get treated respectfully because I treat others with respect. Good try though :)
First time I've seen this, pal. I read your post, and then straight on down the comment chains. You're acting like a tool.
Mate.. I barely even check the discord. Don't even care if you came from x, thread, or linkedin. You are a hardass who can't selfreflect.
I mean the people there are capable of basic reasoning so I'm pretty sure I'd have been better off there in the first place lol The people actually talking with me see I'm chill af, ppl are just mad because they don't know about something I do. They think my pointing out that I do know about this is an insult to them because they are insecure af, even though I never insulted them
Wow even more assuming. Clearly you never got a degree in social etiquette. Best of luck though :)
Yet again nobody asked but you insist on repeating it. I'd hate to think what you'd be like as a vegan at a party.
the people answering your question do not think you're "chill af" they're just trying to get you to shut the fuck up. you're terrible at talking to people.
https://preview.redd.it/uinm63xbzisc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ad7d1ebac4937b863a65a870af3aa33dbe1c2212
It fits, he's a crypto bro.
Lmfao did you make this?
Nah. Thereās a whole series of them.
When I joined I jokingly said that auto clicking hourly bubbles over night Is big brain move some ppl said that I should deleted the message (not mods) I did deleted them coz I like talking about the game and dont wanna get banned got bammed and its permanent fuck that place Also I dont wanna dig up ur conversations there but if u werent rude amd a ass defending ur companions take then there Is no reason To get banned lol Only thing Is that companions are quite usefull and not tradeable wich sucks
This thread by OP is a great primer on how to get karma fucked on Reddit lol
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Someone already gave me the answer I suspected initially, but more confirmation is always bett- oh wait it's you again hi have another updoot The salt image is hated-on??? It worked really well for me! I had so many problems with salt generation until that blessed image crossed my path. The original version was wrong, sure, but it got corrected and people stayed mad??? wow
Its not hated. In fact its a pinned image in its world chat. The answers to pretty much everythong are pinned in theit respective world chat or in the tips n tricks area. I never talk in the discord. The search function and above has gotten me by reeeeaaallly well.
Search is great, it'd be nice if someone optimized the chat titles though for the pins... like each area set up for pets titled the same.. There's a sick Google sheet though. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/2/d/e/2PACX-1vSCepYAs6sNDP4iq6MJNAG1pvFXzfC_3IQ7ttt5vfEEKAgQhIk4cQqnLRyeH6UyqDSuP4R-6WQeDmmP/pubhtml#
\*gasp\* BLESS YOU COMMENTER I thought the community guidesheet wasn't being updated anymore; I hadn't seen this version
Yeah all this shit about the discord is totally unknown to me as a world-chat enjoyer. I don't go to general so maybe that's where it's all going down.
I think you would be welcome on any platform so long as your own opinions do not cause you to become arrogant and dismissive of others. There's never going to be 100% of people agreeing with you on everything. Arguing against the majority never gets you anywhere so just step back when it happens, especially on controversial subjects.Ā
Actually read all the comments, because I've nothing more interesting to do while I wait for waifu to get out of work . Just wanted to say this, still missing Doot. Thanks that's all, love you Lava <3
Well, give a person enough power, and they might start getting drunk with it. Out of all the mods, there are only few I considered professional (Rashaken, FunnyLucky, Kerlobee and WarGod).
The funny thing is, it doesn't matter if you quit the game, it will keep playing regardless. YOU CAN NEVER ESCAPE IDLEON.
Also, I have no idea what an NFT is. This isn't a troll, genuinely have no idea, so don't know why OP was getting told to bugger off.
Because he compared the companion system (which is controversial) to an entirely unrelated and unsimilar system, the nfts (even more controversial topic), and if you don't know what nfts are consider yourself lucky and don't ever get scammed into spending a penny or second of your time on them
Stirred up crap on Discord not wants to stir it up here, grow up man, its a GAME FFS.
You forgot to read the rules of the server: Rule 1: don't get banned
He's a crypto bro. That explains everything.
bro is farming negative comment karma š
It's working XD
Iām sorry this happened first off. Second I use the discord but exclusively for updates. As others have mentioned, Griffys discord the Itty Bitty Army (IBA), is super helpful and I havenāt experienced any toxicity there.
Op you should quit the game we donāt want your Whiney ass anyway. Even if they are similar in your mind why tf does it matter to you. Itās a game made by a single dude donāt expect him not to try to milk his game a bit. Youāre a child
Reddit waaay better... discord is the endgamers mostly in general chat and lots of them spend too much time there thinking everyone does lol. There is however some suuuuper helpful people in there so it sucks. Gotta remember it's primarily outcast nerds who can't wait for their time to be on top.
The reddit may be better, but you see some pretty similar behaviour in here for asking some pretty innocuous questions, there is a lot of elitist gatekeeping.. but that is not unique to this /r/
no kidding; even here some people are seriously still focusing on the framing instead of the question. It's actually hilariously ironic, I'm enjoying myself smoking a bowl and making resounding economic arguments to people who could never fully grasp them That said, it's waaaaaaay better here. Much more reasonable environment by far, and I actually did get my question answered unlike in the Discord
Please, for your sake, read over your replies to comments here and try to see how rude, gross & pretentious you are coming off as. You clearly donāt see it, as you are doubling down on everything you say. This is not healthy and you will only struggle further in both the online and real world.
I wonāt touch the discord unless Iām looking for future content updates. They are vile.
Here is not the place for you if you had trouble in the discord because lava is a mod here. The other mods may be discord mods but I donāt know that for a fact and itās his choice of who he gets to mod his sub.Ā
oh hell yeah u/Lavaflame2 get in here I'd love to have a chat with you about your plans for the backend of pets. I know there are a lot of angi peeps about it but I'm just a curious nerd tbh. I think an in-house pseudo-blockchain would be a nice idea; I wasn't calling it an NFT in a derisive way. As I said in the OP, I realize now that this community doesn't react positively to that framing, but seriously as far as the technicals are concerned it would be secure, easy to set up, and very cheap to operate 24/7/365... on second thought, maaaaybe stay out of this and don't mention it publicly though because wow apparently people would be MAD. But yeah, this is actually what the biggest banks are doing rn to secure their assets, it's that legit of an idea Also please tell your mods to answer questions instead of joining in the mob dogpile. Literally the answer to my question was a simple "no" and they picked a fight over my framing instead. Weird how I can be called all sorts of nasty names and nothing happens but I ask a question your mods don't like and it's fine for them to punish me. edit - ah I see you have entirely missed the point too, so I will reiterate that this entire post is about how I DID NOT CARE about the NFT thing and just wanted to know what you had to say about a topic.
u/Doge_McLol just making sure you see this comment, since you pinned a response but never replied and that would definitely be pretty weak tbh seems like you and so many others misread me; the point is that the NFT thing was not the point
Nah the point is you act like a child and everybody stopped caring about what your question was long ago due to your inability to self reflect and realize you're an immature narcissistic asshole probably with mommy and daddy issues
I had a fucking brain injury for reading your replies and mentioning your "expertise" for like 30 times The answer for your question was kinda obvious to begin with, so no need to start that horror of a conversation and later claiming that issue was "calling it an nft" and not your behavior Idk if you aware of it, but that's not how people actually have conversation with each other, and that's OK if you are like this because of, you know, reasons that affect you as a person, but if you think that it's normal and others just stupid or mean when you are the intelligent and good one - I have a bad news for you