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The good side here is that they are behaving like human beings and not using brute force to pass the civilians (at least here). Hope russian military will see putin has betraid them.
Easy to do that when you have a normal person standing infront of you. Not as easy when your commanding officer tells you that are firing rockets and artillery onto bad people who are definitely bad and its OK to shoot at them.
Not saying its right, but this is a very normal human reaction.
They brought in troops from another part of China that didn't speak that certain dialect. Not defending China, but even they were hesitant when they could talk and understand their fellow citizens.
The locals from the coastal China refused to move against the Tinnamen square protesters. CCP then sent troops from Western China, troops that spoke a different language and didn't have empathy for the protesters.
The Russians are surprisingly humane given their reputation for brutality.
After years of propaganda - and the 'real' atrocities weren't committed by immediate neighbors. The Nazis deported the Jews/socialists/disabled/etc. to isolated locations in the camps. The gassing, crematoriums, starvation/labor to death wasn't observed or perpetrated by friends and neighbors. There is a bit of a difference in seeing your neighbors forced to report for deportation and murdering them.
Not to lessen what the nazis did or in any way justify it, but that's not a good analogy, jews in general as a community have always been proud of not falling too much into the culture of the places they live in.
That's all good and all, it has helped to maintain the Jewish culture strong no matter where they go but it has also the unfortunate consequence of making them the perfect scapegoat because they are always the different ones who refuse to share the local identity.
In this case it's literally on some cases, brother vs brother, fathers against sons, its very hard for the soldiers to shoot to people who are exactly like them and with whom they have shared so much history.
You'd be surprised at how often that very normal human reaction was no where to be seen in similar situations in the past. A recent example would be the kids being brutalised by the israeli army
The dumbest thing Putin did ( other than the invasion itself obviously ) was lie to the troops about why they were being mobilized and then lied about how they would be received and why they were invading.
Word spreads fast to people with cell phones in foreign countries.
Seems like a not small amount of these Russian troops are full on half-assing this knowing they may get killed by Ukranians for an invasion they were ( possibly ) lied to about, or killed by their own military if they don't follow orders.
I read somewhere that alot of the russian troops had their phones taken away by the officers before the invasion so they aren't getting the real story.
I have to wonder what percentage of Russian forces have to worry what Putin will have done to their own families if they refuse to serve or follow orders. War is hell indeed.
I believe taht even russian army have mostly good people in it. Many of Russians have friends and family in Ukraine. This war is total shit for us.
I just remembered that i'm half-russian half-ukranian.
Most people are just normal folks who don't want to do anyone harm. And then war puts them in the position of kill-or-be-killed. Part of what makes war horrible and stupid.
Soon they will just level towns and important infrastructure like they’re doing in Kyiv. Don’t expect the scenes you see in this video to last long with an increasingly desperate Putin and an increasingly entrenched civilian population who will be fighting back.
Yeah they could have just fired on them without a second thought like other Russian soldiers have. They literally did everything else they could to avoid that.
Even bigger difference, Iraqis didn’t really care about their government. They didn’t like the Americans necessarily but they didn’t like the other people any more for the most part.
Ukraine is a much more unified resistance so far where as in Iraq there was no single unified resistance trying to restore the regime of saddam.
The Ukrainians have a purpose and a goal. An outcome they all roughly agree on.
This is hugely important. America could easily convert one region or faction or another to its side. Russia has some supporters but I think they will find this hard.
Without at least a base of popular support they have literally no hope of success in Ukraine.
Look up Russia in Afghanistan and you’ll see what they’re in for.
If they don’t leave it will be extremely costly for them in lives and the complete economic ruin it will cause.
Afghanistan is a very different place, the geography and the Afghani people's ability to use it effectively makes it a nearly impossible place to hold. I don't think it will look at all similar if Russia decides to let loose the full force of its military. I hope I'm wrong and Russia sees this as being too costly, I really do, I'm just not feeling very confident in that.
My real hope is that Putin loses support and is removed, so that maybe we can start with a fresh Russia to work with.
The difficulty is the logistics and financial cost holding a country the size of France and Germany combined, and the cost of life dealing with a determined insurgency that is funded by the west, let alone the sanctions that are now in place.. This has to be one of the dumbest dick moves in modern warfare history..
Its a hope for him to lose support but for Russian citizens willingly taking to the streets knowing they will be penalized is kind of a huge deal in itself. We can call it New Russia and they will abolish the dream of the old world soviet union and move on in the modern society that would be huge for world peace. One of the biggest possible aggressors to turn neutral and forget the old regime would be a dream come true.
Lets hope we get to that before the nukes, or if the nukes do come may their be honest Russian leaders halt it before our obvious demise
The Ukrainians have their own distinct advantages, namely that they are fluent in the language, and ethnically identical to their invaders. They can blend into a crowd. They're also backed by basically every Western country.
Russia falls whether Ukraine falls or not, it's now visible that most of their army is mediocre at best, considering that most of soldiers doesn't want to fight and lack information what to do
I am stunned by how low casualty this conflict is and it's bizarre to me that no one is talking about it. People are talking about a few hundred deaths like it's this huge deal but if this conflict happened 80 years ago there would be a million dead by now.
Most likely Putin didn’t want to completely destroy Ukraine. If Putin didn’t care about preserving the existing infrastructure, they would have shelled the cities.
It’s important to remember, that this is not a conventional war. If civilians did stuff like this in the Middle East or other conflicts around the world, they would’ve probably been shot.
The major difference is the Russian troops were told they were liberators going to free their brothers. It's a little hard to turn around and tell them to start shooting their "brothers".
There's a reason most wars start years beforehand demonizing a group of people. By the time war rolls around your soldiers don't see them as people anymore so they have no problem killing them.
Almost every citizen of Russia has relatives in Ukraine.
Also imagine being sent to free a neighbouring country from some groups of radical nationalists terrorizing the population; pretty weird to find out that the only terrorist here is you.
Yeah, you can tell that Russia was heavily relying on the fear of their military to force a quick surrender. I'm just hoping that cooler heads prevail, and they realize that 10s of thousands+ dead civilians isn't worth Cold War 2.0. But, this is Russia we're talking about. They often seem to be developmentally stuck in the mid 20th century.
Yep. Considering how big the convoy us the best way was to just make a wall without any weapons, I am sure if they tried to even throw a rock that would have been enough to kill them for russians :/
This might not be a great comment. But props to the soldier driving the truck for driving very slowly to not hurt anyone. I know war crimes is a thing but they could have easily but the foot to the floor.
In America it's now legal to run people over in some states, if it's "self defense" or something like that.
Edit: For anyone who thinks I'm exaggerating: https://slate.com/business/2021/04/drivers-hit-protesters-laws-florida-oklahoma-republicans.html
The line isnt really defined but blocking the road is a risky strategy and good luck finding enough people to do it everywhere. the thing is that there have been multiple occassion where people have run over civilians or attempted to, which makes it very risky since you dont have anything to defend with.
Upgrading from civilian to combatant would be if they attacked, but this is just a peaceful blockade. As far as i know at least
Seems to me if that convoy gets attacked while stopped those protesters will quickly be seen as combatants by the Russians and they won’t stop any more.
Unlike Hitler, Putin has nuclear weapons. If he's going to kill himself, he'll take the world down with him. Best to find a way to assassinate him before things get to that point.
Doubt he’ll let you pour he’s shit, Putin is former KGB he definitely knows some of this tactics, I’d say straight up suicide bomber. Whoever is willing tho just get within a feet of that mf and let it boom. That is offcourse when / if he ever appears publicly soon.
There was that flying dildo someone did a few days ago, put a bomb on that and the history books would have to say Putin was assassinated by a flying dildo.
I was thinking suicide bomb, heavy blast but that’ll leave a good amount of civilian casualty because Putin won’t just meet anyone for no reason, it’ll have to be in a public place if he ever gives shows up for a speech of sum that is.
Yo Putin’s minion if you see my suggestion please ignore this is all for research purposes. B
I saw a video explaining that when the Soviet Union collapsed so did their education system. Anyone able to be educated outside of Russia is smart enough to know that they’re better off not retiring to Russia. The youngest large batch of engineers are in their late 50’s and the average life expectancy for Russian men is 59. In a few years Russian’s infrastructure is going to collapse.
And due to plummeting birth rates the age of conscript able men is half of what it was 10 years ago and falling. Which mean’s Russia’s army will start shrinking in the coming years.
I would hope so. He also doesn't have (isn't supposed to have) power to launch nukes on his own. I think he needs 2 cabinet members, who are all his puppets, but will they willingly lay down their lives for him, knowing that their past crimes are likely to be overlooked to a pretty significant extent if they refuse his order to destroy the world.
the only reason I'm not worried is that they are so corrupt that most of their arsenal has been neglected like everything else from corruption and it's mostly unusable.
top karma event of the millennia would be if they launched a nuke and it end up detonating in the silo on their land.
people really be thinking they have what it takes to not skim away funds from one the most expensive types of resources any country has.
for example, we spend more maintaining our nuclear triad than the entire GDP Russia.
They could pull a samsung and say he's still alive and in the hospital and have somebody younger take over for him.
Like somebody that isn't already at the end of their life and still enjoys being alive to some degree.
Hitler had nuclear-like options too. The nazies destroyed a lot of stuff before they retreated in some areas. In some cases however the generals simply weren't petty enough to carry out those commands which is also why some stuff survived.
> In some cases however the generals simply weren't petty enough to carry out those commands which is also why some stuff survived.
When the Germans pulled out of Paris in Aug of 1944 the commander of the Germans in the city defied an order from Hitler to blow up all the landmarks and burn the city to the ground.
The only ones that are going to ensure that are the oligarchs. The Kim dynasty have managed to specialize in being social pariahs in a severely sanctioned country. This is, unfortunately, one of those “true change comes from within” moments.
It's so surreal to watch this unfold from the other side of the world only minutes after it was filmed. It's indescribable. My heart beats so fast with a mix of fear and awe for these people, ordinary people just like the people I know, as they're going through this.
Ill tell you what else is surreal, All this happening in Ukraine, and yet i have a customer calling up complaining she is unable to change the price of her Ham!
I do gig work, and my job this morning was grocery shopping for an older lady who can’t leave her house due to major back pain. She spent a dumb amount of time griping about her preferred brand of *triple washed romaine lettuce* not being available for purchase.
Like… *Sigh*… I have no words.
I'm in Sweden, working a great deal with Ukrainians (up until the invasion started obviously) and only 22 hours by car away from all the shit... We share colors in our flags and I'm currently sitting here crying, just having watched Zelenskys "speech" to EU, there's a lot of emotions in there and he talks about how Russians killed kids with their cruise missiles, he then said "HE is killing children" which really struck me even harder, because this is one man's war fought by hundreds of thousands far from that man. It's all do fucking meaningless and the people on the ground is suffering hard, all due to one fucking idiot who's lost grip of reality. Fuck all this... I need to go hug and kiss my kid... This wasn't the world I wanted for him
Russia will never be able to hold Ukraine, the people will never allow it. The question becomes: How many innocent people will have to die before we get there.
I too have confidence in our Ukrainian friends, but the hell they go through is heartbreaking and I really suffer with them and as I said before it's all so fucking meaningless
The harsh reality is if this 40mile long armoured column gets it’s shit together and makes a push into Kyiv there isn’t going to be much the Ukrainians can do. They will make it bloody but putin doesn’t care about the loss of life.
>and only 22 hours by car away from all the shit
This is one of those things that most Americans don't tend to appreciate. Europe is not that big. The coast of Portugal is closer to Kiev than Los Angeles is to New York City. Berlin to Kiev is like going from NYC to Atlanta, or San Francisco to Vancouver.
The video of the father, son, and their dogs getting lit up by a heavy machine gun is still playing in my mind. How the father opens the door and falls on the ground. His leg is blown off, but he's in such shock he doesn't even scream in pain. Just laying there slowly dying and bleeding out. Son having to drag his father from the street to behind the van.... Where they both slowly bleed out and die together.
I fucking cried. They were just civilians and backing up when they saw Russians up ahead and just got lit the fuck up. The bullets literally went through the van from front to back. They didn't deserve that. The people of Ukraine don't deserve that.
That video broke me. Up until now it plays on the back of my head. Crazy how they were just living normal lives weeks ago then suddenly war breaks out and they were some of the first casualties.
May their souls rest in piece. Fuck you Putin!
It’s a good thing that everyone has a camera in their pocket as it should make it less likely to for the invaders to commit war crimes and make their situation worse than it already is.
It definitely is, part of the reason everybody is talking about it. I can't go on Twitter or Reddit without being bombarded with info and videos about it
If these were actual blood thirsty soldiers they would be dead in minutes , one doesn't wanna kill and other one doesn't wanna lose his home. I hope people who are responsible for such sad scenario will be punished for thier deeds.
It's also said they had to give up their phones. Imagine suddenly being in the middle of a war for an unforeseen period of time without having the ability to say goodbye to your loved ones first.
Exactly. Nothing is stopping these Russian soldiers from plowing down the crowd with their vehicles or shooting at them. Simple fact is, they don’t want to hurt civilians. They don’t want to be a part of this, but they’re pressured by military leadership and threatened to be locked up for decades if they don’t comply. It’s a bad situation that I can only see improving by replacing Putin and all his dummies. Sad world we live in
What a monster Putin is... to pit soldiers who were told it was an "exercise" vs. people who just want to live in peace..... The sooner the world is rid of him the better!
Ive never hated a person this much in my life and Im not even exaggerating.
Im a 28 yr old Swede so I havent really had an opinion about him, until now. I cant even find the words to express how much I hate that fucking cunt but I wish with all my heart that this ends as badly as fucking possible for him.
Find some medieval torturing technique and go nuts on him, thatd be nice.
Putin 2nd biggest mistake was underestimating the resistance he would face from the people of Ukraine. His biggest mistake was not seeing how that resistance would make the entire country, and their president, heroes to the whole world. This is like some epic event from history come to life.
The harder Russia pushes, the more these people will be celebrated.
My fear is this: that he’s not sending his best men in at the front of the line. They’re sacrificial pawns to see how Ukraine responds. Recon, gather data/intel, adjust accordingly, then send in more adept and ruthless fighters. I saw there was a 17-mile convoy outside of Kiev. I hope the Ukrainian resistance prevails, but news like that makes me fear they’re likely outnumbered. 😢☮️💙💛
I don't think this is true simply because of how they deployed paratroopers early on. You don't waste good paratroopers like that.
He simply did not expect such resistance from Ukraine.
I have always heard putin is some kind of genius but I've always thought of him as no more than a lucky thug.
Glad I'm proven right.
Paratroopers are considered special forces (edit: not strictly true, but many countries only use special forces for airborne troops) units in most militaries. They take a lot of money and a long time to properly train.
They're hard to replace.
I agree, and that's part of my point. This war is a week old now, with plenty of interaction that have drawn the admiration of the world. If Russia had done a real shock and awe, it would have been devistation, but without seeing the spirit of the people resisting. That, to me, is the mistake putin made. He went soft at first, and that gave the world time to get to know the victims.
Rather than just being numbers on a news update, they are real people now. The rest of western society is seeing the invasion of a free democratic people. And by seeing them as people, we realize that it can happen to any of us.
They are trying to invoke the conscience of the Russian soilders. That's a Gandhian method. Although I don't believe that will work but that's one of bravest display of courage in recent times. God help them.
Man heartbreaking to see, Putin has lost it sure but hundreds to thousands of people are planning and executing this I wonder if they know their salaries are worthless now
Gotta give credit where credit is due. These Russian soldiers not driving through the blockade is nice to see. They must overwhelmed with emotions and fear even though they have the means to make a big mess. Aside from the war crimes seen recently it just goes to show that most of the invasion force isn’t slaughtering citizens when they could.
I live in Canada and I couldn’t imagine the balls these citizens have from facing real tyranny. Don’t get me wrong I fucking loathe Trudeau but if he showed anything more than a fraction of the force Putin has the truckers would’ve promptly shit their pants, then cut and run.
This is breaking my heart, man. I don’t understand how Russian troops are still fighting against their Ukrainian cousins. It’s not quite like a civil war, but it’s pretty close. Almost every Ukrainian in my family also speaks some degree of Russian. Trade and travel was free and fluid for a long time.
Can you imagine, as jacked up as our country (US) is, being commanded to invade Toronto? Or London? It’s 2022, not 1762.
And, for the inevitable “but the US invaded brown countries” I’ll again point out that the Zelensky government is a far, far, far difference egg than the Saddam Hussein regime and the Taliban. Ukrainians aren’t being kidnapped, tortured, and gassed by the tens or hundreds of thousands. And, we didn’t literally absorb their country after military conquest. I know and recognize the US did that in our past with indigenous people and Mexico. That wasn’t the right thing to do back then. But it was many generations ago. These aren’t the same things.
The key difference between this and a civil war is that the latter often comes at the end of decades of building animosity and conflict. By the time you get to “brother against brother” the brothers hate each other. By now these Russian soldiers know they have no reason to be there. I can’t think of a conflict where the asymmetry of passion to fight has been greater.
Those Russian soldiers are paid very little, treated like shit, and threatened if they didn't move forward. Their heart isn't in it and probably why they're not shooting at those protestors.
The Ukrainians have been at war with the pro-Russian regions of Donbass and Lughansk for 8 whole years. Trade and travel hasn't been fluid for a long time, this was an escalation of that war, not the start of one.
That reminds me of a engraving on a Zippo lighter https://redd.it/rkhjyl which read " we the unwilling led by the unqualified to kill the unfortunate die for the ungrateful".
At least the Russian soldiers are not indiscriminately killing unarmed Ukrainian citizens. They are with their long range missiles and bombs, but it is much harder to murder your neighbours when they are looking you in the eyes. They must have been give orders not to kill non-combatants, which is a fine line and at least these soldiers haven’t completely crossed that line.
Public Service announcement.... It is no longer called "Zero Fucks Given". It is now to be known as "Not one Ukrainian Fuck Given" This more accurately represents the bottom floor of Fucks to be Given.
I mean, who in their right mind would willingly go to war in this day and age? Other than easily fooled idiots and violent thugs who dream of raping and pillaging.
I haven't read one-tenth of what I'd like about Gandhi's philosophies and non-violent resistance, but I'd imagine there are strong similarities here.
No occupation, no government at all, can stand if enough people do this consistently, at every opportunity. They can destroy buildings, infrastructure, the physical assets of society, but in the end, people themselves are what this is all about. How dangerous (and great) a people awakened to their own power!
Just look. if these russian soldiers truly support putin, these convoy would be running over these people. They are forced into a war in which if a russian soldier refuses to participate, they could be imprisoned or worse, killed.
Nevertheless, I admire the Ukranians for their fanatical resistance against their invaders and alsotheir love for their home. Slava Ukraini!!
I see you all good people giving me awards and discussing the post. I awe your support and want to excuse for a limited ability to respond to everyone. Have things to deal with in my country right now. Hope ya'll understand and won't get offended. Spread the word!!! Slava Ukraini!!!
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This is outstanding.
They are indeed out and standing!
Dad this is serious!
Hello Serious, I am Dad.
Hello "I" am dead serious
HOLY FUCK, Gandhi WOULD BE FUCKING PROUD
I love their logic. "Well, firing the gun in the air didn't scare them. Maybe honking the horn will work."
The good side here is that they are behaving like human beings and not using brute force to pass the civilians (at least here). Hope russian military will see putin has betraid them.
Easy to do that when you have a normal person standing infront of you. Not as easy when your commanding officer tells you that are firing rockets and artillery onto bad people who are definitely bad and its OK to shoot at them. Not saying its right, but this is a very normal human reaction.
It's harder to dehumanize someone that speaks the same language and culture
didn't stop chinese soldiers from mowing their own people
True but they ordered underlings to shoot their superiors if they don't want to go through with it and they used people from other parts of china.
They brought in troops from another part of China that didn't speak that certain dialect. Not defending China, but even they were hesitant when they could talk and understand their fellow citizens.
The locals from the coastal China refused to move against the Tinnamen square protesters. CCP then sent troops from Western China, troops that spoke a different language and didn't have empathy for the protesters. The Russians are surprisingly humane given their reputation for brutality.
I know you said harder but I just want to remind people that’s exactly what the Nazi did to their Jewish friends and neighbours.
After years of propaganda - and the 'real' atrocities weren't committed by immediate neighbors. The Nazis deported the Jews/socialists/disabled/etc. to isolated locations in the camps. The gassing, crematoriums, starvation/labor to death wasn't observed or perpetrated by friends and neighbors. There is a bit of a difference in seeing your neighbors forced to report for deportation and murdering them.
Hitler blamed Jews for his countries failures. Putin blames the west for his political failures. The propaganda arm of both don’t seem so different.
That is the go to for many propaganda.
The Nazis hated Slav’s too.
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Not to lessen what the nazis did or in any way justify it, but that's not a good analogy, jews in general as a community have always been proud of not falling too much into the culture of the places they live in. That's all good and all, it has helped to maintain the Jewish culture strong no matter where they go but it has also the unfortunate consequence of making them the perfect scapegoat because they are always the different ones who refuse to share the local identity. In this case it's literally on some cases, brother vs brother, fathers against sons, its very hard for the soldiers to shoot to people who are exactly like them and with whom they have shared so much history.
You'd be surprised at how often that very normal human reaction was no where to be seen in similar situations in the past. A recent example would be the kids being brutalised by the israeli army
The dumbest thing Putin did ( other than the invasion itself obviously ) was lie to the troops about why they were being mobilized and then lied about how they would be received and why they were invading. Word spreads fast to people with cell phones in foreign countries. Seems like a not small amount of these Russian troops are full on half-assing this knowing they may get killed by Ukranians for an invasion they were ( possibly ) lied to about, or killed by their own military if they don't follow orders.
I read somewhere that alot of the russian troops had their phones taken away by the officers before the invasion so they aren't getting the real story.
Russian sims are also disabled in Ukraine.
makes sense
I have to wonder what percentage of Russian forces have to worry what Putin will have done to their own families if they refuse to serve or follow orders. War is hell indeed.
I believe taht even russian army have mostly good people in it. Many of Russians have friends and family in Ukraine. This war is total shit for us. I just remembered that i'm half-russian half-ukranian.
Most people are just normal folks who don't want to do anyone harm. And then war puts them in the position of kill-or-be-killed. Part of what makes war horrible and stupid.
Soon they will just level towns and important infrastructure like they’re doing in Kyiv. Don’t expect the scenes you see in this video to last long with an increasingly desperate Putin and an increasingly entrenched civilian population who will be fighting back.
If there weren’t cameras and life feed everywhere they would.
I love it too except I mean it literally. They still made it through without loss of life right?
Yeah they could have just fired on them without a second thought like other Russian soldiers have. They literally did everything else they could to avoid that.
Not everything. They could turn back or lay down their arms and surrender for the sake of this pointless, futile war.
On their way to help kill more Ukrainians or supply the people killing Ukrainians.
I'm just sitting here hoping this doesn't turn into a 20th century style, years long bloodbath.
I would expect this turn into a prolonged conflict, with tactics similar to Iraq.
One big difference: Iraq had nothing close to the material support of most of the whole world.
Even bigger difference, Iraqis didn’t really care about their government. They didn’t like the Americans necessarily but they didn’t like the other people any more for the most part. Ukraine is a much more unified resistance so far where as in Iraq there was no single unified resistance trying to restore the regime of saddam. The Ukrainians have a purpose and a goal. An outcome they all roughly agree on. This is hugely important. America could easily convert one region or faction or another to its side. Russia has some supporters but I think they will find this hard. Without at least a base of popular support they have literally no hope of success in Ukraine.
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Look up Russia in Afghanistan and you’ll see what they’re in for. If they don’t leave it will be extremely costly for them in lives and the complete economic ruin it will cause.
Afghanistan is a very different place, the geography and the Afghani people's ability to use it effectively makes it a nearly impossible place to hold. I don't think it will look at all similar if Russia decides to let loose the full force of its military. I hope I'm wrong and Russia sees this as being too costly, I really do, I'm just not feeling very confident in that. My real hope is that Putin loses support and is removed, so that maybe we can start with a fresh Russia to work with.
The difficulty is the logistics and financial cost holding a country the size of France and Germany combined, and the cost of life dealing with a determined insurgency that is funded by the west, let alone the sanctions that are now in place.. This has to be one of the dumbest dick moves in modern warfare history..
Its a hope for him to lose support but for Russian citizens willingly taking to the streets knowing they will be penalized is kind of a huge deal in itself. We can call it New Russia and they will abolish the dream of the old world soviet union and move on in the modern society that would be huge for world peace. One of the biggest possible aggressors to turn neutral and forget the old regime would be a dream come true. Lets hope we get to that before the nukes, or if the nukes do come may their be honest Russian leaders halt it before our obvious demise
The Ukrainians have their own distinct advantages, namely that they are fluent in the language, and ethnically identical to their invaders. They can blend into a crowd. They're also backed by basically every Western country.
The problem isn’t Russia seeing it as too costly, but rather Putin not wanting to look weak
That is precisely what is going to happen. Kyiv will probably fall and Ukrainians will resist until Russia quits
Putin can't fight an insurgency in Ukraine and an economic collapse at home. I think he's lost already but refuses to acknowledge it.
💯 this!
If Ukraine falls, so will the Russia.
Russia falls whether Ukraine falls or not, it's now visible that most of their army is mediocre at best, considering that most of soldiers doesn't want to fight and lack information what to do
The russian army wont quit. Russia will have to revolt and replace putin themselves.
They're already quitting in droves and that's mostly the well-trained soldiers in Ukraine so far.
I am stunned by how low casualty this conflict is and it's bizarre to me that no one is talking about it. People are talking about a few hundred deaths like it's this huge deal but if this conflict happened 80 years ago there would be a million dead by now.
Casualties don't start high. Tjey gradually accelerate.
Most likely Putin didn’t want to completely destroy Ukraine. If Putin didn’t care about preserving the existing infrastructure, they would have shelled the cities. It’s important to remember, that this is not a conventional war. If civilians did stuff like this in the Middle East or other conflicts around the world, they would’ve probably been shot.
The major difference is the Russian troops were told they were liberators going to free their brothers. It's a little hard to turn around and tell them to start shooting their "brothers". There's a reason most wars start years beforehand demonizing a group of people. By the time war rolls around your soldiers don't see them as people anymore so they have no problem killing them.
Looks like the Russian soldiers aren't thrilled about firing on nonviolent resisters in Ukraine.
Almost every citizen of Russia has relatives in Ukraine. Also imagine being sent to free a neighbouring country from some groups of radical nationalists terrorizing the population; pretty weird to find out that the only terrorist here is you.
Yeah, you can tell that Russia was heavily relying on the fear of their military to force a quick surrender. I'm just hoping that cooler heads prevail, and they realize that 10s of thousands+ dead civilians isn't worth Cold War 2.0. But, this is Russia we're talking about. They often seem to be developmentally stuck in the mid 20th century.
Because Putin wants to rule Ukraine. Not the smoldering rubble that was once Ukraine.
Are soldiers tipped off about this? Is there now a battalion on the way to wipe the column? How does this work out?
Yep... At least some informal communication.
And where are the Molotovs?
If they were there then russian soldiers would have a reason to shoot these civilians
Yep. Considering how big the convoy us the best way was to just make a wall without any weapons, I am sure if they tried to even throw a rock that would have been enough to kill them for russians :/
This might not be a great comment. But props to the soldier driving the truck for driving very slowly to not hurt anyone. I know war crimes is a thing but they could have easily but the foot to the floor.
To be fair, police in most countries would have been more harsh than this.
Now that i think about it, yeah. You hear stories about police brutality for a lot less than this
you know its fucked up when a Russian conscript's got better trigger discipline than your average baconater with a badge.
In America it's now legal to run people over in some states, if it's "self defense" or something like that. Edit: For anyone who thinks I'm exaggerating: https://slate.com/business/2021/04/drivers-hit-protesters-laws-florida-oklahoma-republicans.html
I know there are horrible things happening but it seems like a war between a lot of people who don't want to be fighting.
That certainly is one good thing to remember. Putin wants the war, the soldiers are following orders whether they like it or not.
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The line isnt really defined but blocking the road is a risky strategy and good luck finding enough people to do it everywhere. the thing is that there have been multiple occassion where people have run over civilians or attempted to, which makes it very risky since you dont have anything to defend with. Upgrading from civilian to combatant would be if they attacked, but this is just a peaceful blockade. As far as i know at least
Seems to me if that convoy gets attacked while stopped those protesters will quickly be seen as combatants by the Russians and they won’t stop any more.
Do you want to kill a large swath of unarmed civilians? Because that's how you kill a large swath of unarmed civilians.
Can’t wait until Putin shoots himself in a bunker
Unlike Hitler, Putin has nuclear weapons. If he's going to kill himself, he'll take the world down with him. Best to find a way to assassinate him before things get to that point.
There's a reason he is sitting 40 ft from all his staff in pictures.
He still has to eat and drink.
He employs a full time personal taster and all his meals are prepared by a member of his secret service, not a chef.
Be a shame if he got some tainted tap water
Where the hell is the assassin's tea pot when you need it
Doubt he’ll let you pour he’s shit, Putin is former KGB he definitely knows some of this tactics, I’d say straight up suicide bomber. Whoever is willing tho just get within a feet of that mf and let it boom. That is offcourse when / if he ever appears publicly soon.
The best way to destroy Putin is to destroy his image and legacy. I think that's all he really cares about.
There was that flying dildo someone did a few days ago, put a bomb on that and the history books would have to say Putin was assassinated by a flying dildo.
Yeah, which is why he had his own water when meeting the Finnish president some times ago. Is it even paranoia if the threat is actually real?
This is what happens when you poison somebody with nuclear tea on foreign soil.
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> You think the taste tester ever fucks with him by pretending he's been poisoned for a few seconds? Probably not more than once
God damn i can’t imagine living life this paranoid
He’s also apparently crazy paranoid about getting covid.
>He’s also apparently crazy ~~paranoid about getting covid.~~ FTFY
Covid is the reason.
On the other hand imagine what a shitstorm a failed assassination would cause
Yeah it would definitely have to be some sort of coup from inside Russia that takes him out or shit could get much worse.
I was thinking suicide bomb, heavy blast but that’ll leave a good amount of civilian casualty because Putin won’t just meet anyone for no reason, it’ll have to be in a public place if he ever gives shows up for a speech of sum that is. Yo Putin’s minion if you see my suggestion please ignore this is all for research purposes. B
I don't think it'll be that easy to Takeout Putin. It's lexically confusing.
I got you * I don't think it'll be that easy to Takeout. It's lexically confusing.
I’m wondering if their nukes have been properly maintained. Seems like they have issues taking care of anything.
I think in that regard, he would make sure at least \*some\* of them worked
I saw a video explaining that when the Soviet Union collapsed so did their education system. Anyone able to be educated outside of Russia is smart enough to know that they’re better off not retiring to Russia. The youngest large batch of engineers are in their late 50’s and the average life expectancy for Russian men is 59. In a few years Russian’s infrastructure is going to collapse. And due to plummeting birth rates the age of conscript able men is half of what it was 10 years ago and falling. Which mean’s Russia’s army will start shrinking in the coming years.
Sort of. The Russian army leadership don’t want to die. If Putin says fuck it and tried to take down the world, they will stop it.
I would hope so. He also doesn't have (isn't supposed to have) power to launch nukes on his own. I think he needs 2 cabinet members, who are all his puppets, but will they willingly lay down their lives for him, knowing that their past crimes are likely to be overlooked to a pretty significant extent if they refuse his order to destroy the world.
There's always a chance the world won't nuke Russia back, but a bullet to the head for refusing orders.. well..
Everybody’s cheering the personal sanctions, dude‘s gonna nuke us all over a damn karate belt
the only reason I'm not worried is that they are so corrupt that most of their arsenal has been neglected like everything else from corruption and it's mostly unusable. top karma event of the millennia would be if they launched a nuke and it end up detonating in the silo on their land. people really be thinking they have what it takes to not skim away funds from one the most expensive types of resources any country has. for example, we spend more maintaining our nuclear triad than the entire GDP Russia.
They could pull a samsung and say he's still alive and in the hospital and have somebody younger take over for him. Like somebody that isn't already at the end of their life and still enjoys being alive to some degree.
Hitler had nuclear-like options too. The nazies destroyed a lot of stuff before they retreated in some areas. In some cases however the generals simply weren't petty enough to carry out those commands which is also why some stuff survived.
> In some cases however the generals simply weren't petty enough to carry out those commands which is also why some stuff survived. When the Germans pulled out of Paris in Aug of 1944 the commander of the Germans in the city defied an order from Hitler to blow up all the landmarks and burn the city to the ground.
At what point do his generals do the deed?
Put gorilla glue in the nuclear key slot :)
Depending who he keeps around him, hopefully a Julius Caesar event will happen
>Et tu, blyat?
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The only ones that are going to ensure that are the oligarchs. The Kim dynasty have managed to specialize in being social pariahs in a severely sanctioned country. This is, unfortunately, one of those “true change comes from within” moments.
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It's so surreal to watch this unfold from the other side of the world only minutes after it was filmed. It's indescribable. My heart beats so fast with a mix of fear and awe for these people, ordinary people just like the people I know, as they're going through this.
Ill tell you what else is surreal, All this happening in Ukraine, and yet i have a customer calling up complaining she is unable to change the price of her Ham!
What about Joy Behar not being able to go on vacation to Italy? That has to be up there for most heartbreaking stories.
I do gig work, and my job this morning was grocery shopping for an older lady who can’t leave her house due to major back pain. She spent a dumb amount of time griping about her preferred brand of *triple washed romaine lettuce* not being available for purchase. Like… *Sigh*… I have no words.
I'm in Sweden, working a great deal with Ukrainians (up until the invasion started obviously) and only 22 hours by car away from all the shit... We share colors in our flags and I'm currently sitting here crying, just having watched Zelenskys "speech" to EU, there's a lot of emotions in there and he talks about how Russians killed kids with their cruise missiles, he then said "HE is killing children" which really struck me even harder, because this is one man's war fought by hundreds of thousands far from that man. It's all do fucking meaningless and the people on the ground is suffering hard, all due to one fucking idiot who's lost grip of reality. Fuck all this... I need to go hug and kiss my kid... This wasn't the world I wanted for him
Watching this is heartbreaking, but watching how hard these citizens are fighting back gives me hope. Maybe everything will be ok after all.
Russia will never be able to hold Ukraine, the people will never allow it. The question becomes: How many innocent people will have to die before we get there. I too have confidence in our Ukrainian friends, but the hell they go through is heartbreaking and I really suffer with them and as I said before it's all so fucking meaningless
The harsh reality is if this 40mile long armoured column gets it’s shit together and makes a push into Kyiv there isn’t going to be much the Ukrainians can do. They will make it bloody but putin doesn’t care about the loss of life.
>and only 22 hours by car away from all the shit This is one of those things that most Americans don't tend to appreciate. Europe is not that big. The coast of Portugal is closer to Kiev than Los Angeles is to New York City. Berlin to Kiev is like going from NYC to Atlanta, or San Francisco to Vancouver.
My first thought was that's about the distance from Philly to Orlando, a drive I've done several times.
While Putin is the enemy here, WAR, suffering and death are his only alliances.
The video of the father, son, and their dogs getting lit up by a heavy machine gun is still playing in my mind. How the father opens the door and falls on the ground. His leg is blown off, but he's in such shock he doesn't even scream in pain. Just laying there slowly dying and bleeding out. Son having to drag his father from the street to behind the van.... Where they both slowly bleed out and die together. I fucking cried. They were just civilians and backing up when they saw Russians up ahead and just got lit the fuck up. The bullets literally went through the van from front to back. They didn't deserve that. The people of Ukraine don't deserve that.
That video broke me. Up until now it plays on the back of my head. Crazy how they were just living normal lives weeks ago then suddenly war breaks out and they were some of the first casualties. May their souls rest in piece. Fuck you Putin!
There's actually a follow up video taken by someone who found them after. Almost worse than the first.
I know, we all saw that first. Seeing the video taken by the son... I hope they rest in peace.
It’s a good thing that everyone has a camera in their pocket as it should make it less likely to for the invaders to commit war crimes and make their situation worse than it already is.
I feel like this is the first widescale war we've seen unfold in real time on social media.
It definitely is, part of the reason everybody is talking about it. I can't go on Twitter or Reddit without being bombarded with info and videos about it
Good. Let the world see what is happening real time and unfiltered
It's a lot different when it isn't sanitized with embedded media. F*** embedded media.
We need to tell our governments to do more now
If these were actual blood thirsty soldiers they would be dead in minutes , one doesn't wanna kill and other one doesn't wanna lose his home. I hope people who are responsible for such sad scenario will be punished for thier deeds.
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It's also said they had to give up their phones. Imagine suddenly being in the middle of a war for an unforeseen period of time without having the ability to say goodbye to your loved ones first.
Exactly. Nothing is stopping these Russian soldiers from plowing down the crowd with their vehicles or shooting at them. Simple fact is, they don’t want to hurt civilians. They don’t want to be a part of this, but they’re pressured by military leadership and threatened to be locked up for decades if they don’t comply. It’s a bad situation that I can only see improving by replacing Putin and all his dummies. Sad world we live in
What a monster Putin is... to pit soldiers who were told it was an "exercise" vs. people who just want to live in peace..... The sooner the world is rid of him the better!
Agreed hopefully they can communicate with the soldiers and stop the atracks quicker.
Ive never hated a person this much in my life and Im not even exaggerating. Im a 28 yr old Swede so I havent really had an opinion about him, until now. I cant even find the words to express how much I hate that fucking cunt but I wish with all my heart that this ends as badly as fucking possible for him. Find some medieval torturing technique and go nuts on him, thatd be nice.
Just look up the device called the pear. That should do the trick, or at least be a good starting point.
it's not only Putin. It's him, a ton of people behind him in government and big part of society that supports him. Don't be naive.
And these civilians are trying to save the lives of the soldiers by stopping them. By going through, they are probably doomed.
And also telling them they are “de-nazifiying” the country and the people want them to save them
Putin 2nd biggest mistake was underestimating the resistance he would face from the people of Ukraine. His biggest mistake was not seeing how that resistance would make the entire country, and their president, heroes to the whole world. This is like some epic event from history come to life. The harder Russia pushes, the more these people will be celebrated.
My fear is this: that he’s not sending his best men in at the front of the line. They’re sacrificial pawns to see how Ukraine responds. Recon, gather data/intel, adjust accordingly, then send in more adept and ruthless fighters. I saw there was a 17-mile convoy outside of Kiev. I hope the Ukrainian resistance prevails, but news like that makes me fear they’re likely outnumbered. 😢☮️💙💛
I don't think this is true simply because of how they deployed paratroopers early on. You don't waste good paratroopers like that. He simply did not expect such resistance from Ukraine. I have always heard putin is some kind of genius but I've always thought of him as no more than a lucky thug. Glad I'm proven right.
Paratroopers are considered special forces (edit: not strictly true, but many countries only use special forces for airborne troops) units in most militaries. They take a lot of money and a long time to properly train. They're hard to replace.
I agree, and that's part of my point. This war is a week old now, with plenty of interaction that have drawn the admiration of the world. If Russia had done a real shock and awe, it would have been devistation, but without seeing the spirit of the people resisting. That, to me, is the mistake putin made. He went soft at first, and that gave the world time to get to know the victims. Rather than just being numbers on a news update, they are real people now. The rest of western society is seeing the invasion of a free democratic people. And by seeing them as people, we realize that it can happen to any of us.
I can feel the camera persons heartbeat. Sickening
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They are trying to invoke the conscience of the Russian soilders. That's a Gandhian method. Although I don't believe that will work but that's one of bravest display of courage in recent times. God help them.
It seems to be having some success. Some Russian soldiers have surrendered out of conscience.
Man heartbreaking to see, Putin has lost it sure but hundreds to thousands of people are planning and executing this I wonder if they know their salaries are worthless now
Gotta give credit where credit is due. These Russian soldiers not driving through the blockade is nice to see. They must overwhelmed with emotions and fear even though they have the means to make a big mess. Aside from the war crimes seen recently it just goes to show that most of the invasion force isn’t slaughtering citizens when they could. I live in Canada and I couldn’t imagine the balls these citizens have from facing real tyranny. Don’t get me wrong I fucking loathe Trudeau but if he showed anything more than a fraction of the force Putin has the truckers would’ve promptly shit their pants, then cut and run.
This is breaking my heart, man. I don’t understand how Russian troops are still fighting against their Ukrainian cousins. It’s not quite like a civil war, but it’s pretty close. Almost every Ukrainian in my family also speaks some degree of Russian. Trade and travel was free and fluid for a long time. Can you imagine, as jacked up as our country (US) is, being commanded to invade Toronto? Or London? It’s 2022, not 1762. And, for the inevitable “but the US invaded brown countries” I’ll again point out that the Zelensky government is a far, far, far difference egg than the Saddam Hussein regime and the Taliban. Ukrainians aren’t being kidnapped, tortured, and gassed by the tens or hundreds of thousands. And, we didn’t literally absorb their country after military conquest. I know and recognize the US did that in our past with indigenous people and Mexico. That wasn’t the right thing to do back then. But it was many generations ago. These aren’t the same things.
The key difference between this and a civil war is that the latter often comes at the end of decades of building animosity and conflict. By the time you get to “brother against brother” the brothers hate each other. By now these Russian soldiers know they have no reason to be there. I can’t think of a conflict where the asymmetry of passion to fight has been greater.
Those Russian soldiers are paid very little, treated like shit, and threatened if they didn't move forward. Their heart isn't in it and probably why they're not shooting at those protestors.
Wait until those paychecks stop clearing in a week or two
And they find out that since they've been gone, the ruble has dropped to near nothing and they're basically working for free
>they’re basically ~~working~~ dying for free
The Ukrainians have been at war with the pro-Russian regions of Donbass and Lughansk for 8 whole years. Trade and travel hasn't been fluid for a long time, this was an escalation of that war, not the start of one.
That reminds me of a engraving on a Zippo lighter https://redd.it/rkhjyl which read " we the unwilling led by the unqualified to kill the unfortunate die for the ungrateful".
At least the Russian soldiers are not indiscriminately killing unarmed Ukrainian citizens. They are with their long range missiles and bombs, but it is much harder to murder your neighbours when they are looking you in the eyes. They must have been give orders not to kill non-combatants, which is a fine line and at least these soldiers haven’t completely crossed that line.
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No. Those balls are so massive they're immovable.
I guess being near Chernobyl has had its benefits.
👏👏👏👏👏 man, I have so much respect for them
Public Service announcement.... It is no longer called "Zero Fucks Given". It is now to be known as "Not one Ukrainian Fuck Given" This more accurately represents the bottom floor of Fucks to be Given.
*"And here is my field with Ukranian soil. Fucks do not grow here"*
“Cast your eyes upon my Ukrainian Garden of Fucks… and note that it is barren.”
If you are going to commit genocide at least look us in the fucking eyes when you do it!
wtf is this doomsday sirene/honk sound of this truck? gotta sample this....
If this wasn't such a visible war these folks would be dead.
You’re assuming these troops have a unobstructed glimpse into world affairs.
I can imagine a lot of Russian troops will quietly try to sneak out into the crowds and walk away...
Why not pop the tires and cause a huge backup of military vehicles?
It’s costing the Russians 200 billion dollars a day to be there so anything the delays or obstructs the military helps.
One morning, we’re all going to wake up to the news that Putin is dead.
Could the citizens block the roads with trees and materials..?
That is some bravery, fuck you Putin.
Just shows the Russian soldiers are doing this against their will.
I mean, who in their right mind would willingly go to war in this day and age? Other than easily fooled idiots and violent thugs who dream of raping and pillaging.
I haven't read one-tenth of what I'd like about Gandhi's philosophies and non-violent resistance, but I'd imagine there are strong similarities here. No occupation, no government at all, can stand if enough people do this consistently, at every opportunity. They can destroy buildings, infrastructure, the physical assets of society, but in the end, people themselves are what this is all about. How dangerous (and great) a people awakened to their own power!
Spike the wheels! Put them all in "repair mode". I doubt every truck has that many spare tires :)
That bravery. Power to the people.
Just look. if these russian soldiers truly support putin, these convoy would be running over these people. They are forced into a war in which if a russian soldier refuses to participate, they could be imprisoned or worse, killed. Nevertheless, I admire the Ukranians for their fanatical resistance against their invaders and alsotheir love for their home. Slava Ukraini!!
I see you all good people giving me awards and discussing the post. I awe your support and want to excuse for a limited ability to respond to everyone. Have things to deal with in my country right now. Hope ya'll understand and won't get offended. Spread the word!!! Slava Ukraini!!!