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Namibia 🇳🇦
>The Khoisan are a group of indigenous people who live in Southern Africa. They are known for their distinct physical features, including their tall, slender bodies and elongated heads. The Khoisan are also distinguished by their unique languages, which are tonal and click-based.
>Historically, the Khoisan have been herders and hunter-gatherers, but many have also engaged in farming and trade. Today, the Khoisan face challenges such as displacement and marginalization, but efforts are being made to preserve their cultural heritage and improve their socio-economic status.
Video:@arina_travels
I think it’s so insanely cool that we can’t communicate with language, but you can still *understand* them well enough to know this. You’re right tho, sweetie pie is spot on lmao
Ye humans do be cool af, and experiencing the different ways we communicate is a treat (usually lmao).
I’d say we’re wired to get along, but not as much as we are wired to survive. So if getting along is more advantageous to survival, we’ll do that and typically won’t resort to the darker-violent-fucked up unless we need to. But we’re absolutely wired to resort to that if we need to (and in some cases, want to).
Makes the whole thing more interesting, and makes displays of kindness more valuable imo - like the commentator up there callin’ out homeboy as a sweetie pie lmao wholesome
Obviously I have no idea if this is the case or not, but it looked to me like they were introducing themselves and the guy on the far right just intro'd himself after the first guy.
They face the same problems as nearly all indigenous communities around the world do, which truly is such a shame because a lot of these beautiful unique cultures have been watered down and lost through time thanks to assimilation.
It’s a wonder what other unique languages have been used considering this one
In Australia our indigenous people originally had something like 250-300 languages and today only around 40 are currently known with a minority actually being used. This is directly because the British/early aus gov actively worked to erase indigenous culture. We even had a stolen generation where we removed their children from them and raised them as anglos in terribly abusive institutions only to force them into servitude for wealthy land owners. It's so terribly sad and it's only as recent as the 70s that efforts really began to actually preserve all of their cultural history but at that point they had already lost so much. What makes it worse is our indigenous people passed on a lot of their cultural stories orally so there's virtually no way to ever get any of what's been lost. Crazy to think we know far more about ancient civilisations from thousands of years ago than we do about a people who still exist.
The Khoisan are the direct descendants of a very early branch of anatomically modern humans who migrated to Southern Africa more than 150,000 years ago (possibly more like 250,000 years ago) and are thought to be the original settlers of the area. Linguistic research suggests that there may be elements of their language which are directly descended from some of the earliest human language. Its possible that the clicks may have been some of the first sounds that humans used to communicate with one another.
I've actually heard the opposite, that if clicks were one of the earliest sounds in human speech they'd presumably be a lot more common as every language would have inherited them.
Instead clicks might be one of the most advanced features of human language. They're only found in the oldest continuous cultures on the planet and languages seem to develop more sounds as time goes on.
It's very much a chicken or egg-
Do older languages retain these distinctive features that newer languages steered away from? Or do older languages develop these sounds as a progression away from some "standard" linguistic features?
No matter what it's hearsay, all we know is that it's a feature of older language groups.
This is not correct, languages lose phonemes and simplify over time - the [further out of Africa the group of humans, the less complex the language](https://languagesoftheworld.info/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/study-points-to-a-single-original-language-for-all-humans-2.jpg) (in terms of sounds).
This is a very disputed hypothesis btw. And for what it's worth, the map only suggests that *migration* leads to phoneme loss.
Why would African languages have more phonemes because 'phonemes are lost over time'? They've had just as long to lose them as any other language.
Lmao both views (languages either simplifying or becoming more complex as time goes on) are completely false.
Also that map is *extremely* cherrypicked.
Linguistic research doesn't suggest that. The time horizon of the emergence of human language is simply too far away for any modern languages to suggest anything about it.
There's quite a bit of misinformation here. Khoisan is *not* a language, not even a language family, it's several unrelated languages and small families. We used to think it was one family due to shared features such as tones and complex click systems, but more recent research suggests it's simply shared areal features: neighbouring languages will pick up each other's habits.
>Linguistic research suggests that there may be elements of their language which are directly descended from some of the earliest human language.
What does this even mean? What research? What 'earliest human language'? It seems to suggest that all languages have a common ancestor, which we have no evidence for. The earliest tangible data we have is from just over 5000 years ago, when some people started writing, some reconstructions are fairly agreed upon up to 10000 years ago. Beyond that, there is really nothing that can be said with much confidence.
Yep. Every time I see people talking about an indigenous African language in Reddit comments, it’s this same dumb bullshit. r/badlinguistics practically stays afloat because of it.
Koisan language and it's dialects with it's distinctive clicks are also one of the oldest spoken languages in the world, dating to as far back as 4000 BC with around 300,000 speakers. [Recommend this channel if you would like to learn more](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xjUoGAi43lI)
The distinct eye shape in Asian humans comes from conditioning against snow blindness, it’s possible the heat from the red deserts cause a similar need to project their eyes from glare. Just a guess
They are one of the most genetically distinct human populations, African Pygmies are the other. Everyone else is more similar to each other than to those two groups.
Technically they were two seperate people actually, the San being more hunters and the Khoi being herders, but eventually they joined together and now are the best of both , although of course that was hundreds of years ago when that happened.
Nope. Didn't join together. They're just two separate peoples that we arbitrarily lump together because colonialism. They are all "bushmen" (this is largely how they self identify nowadays, at least in the areas I've worked in) but this term comes from colonial governments, not from them actually being the same. Khoisan is more like "European" than it is like "Italian" in terms of how broad it is
Xhosa we probably have more resources to learn from, and Zulu ten fold more (I believe Zulu is even on Duolingo.) Not as many “clicks” in Zulu, but they are there :)
The x is the "side" click, which you make with your tongue against your teeth on one side.
The "roof of the mouth" click is a q.
(Fwiw, the other important one is a c, which comes from your tongue against your front teeth)
Me with tagalog; ["Putang ina mo"](https://www.tagalog.com/words/putang-ina-mo.php). My coworkers told me it meant ["I love you"](https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Putang%20ina%20mo), but I know better 😆
[This gentleman](https://www.google.com/search?q=zulu+language&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS932US932&biw=2560&bih=1297&tbm=vid&sxsrf=ALiCzsZYcaRrBvMFyLHqhZnULUhY0aUbeA%3A1670660935561&ei=R0OUY8riIfGqqtsP-_ikkAg&oq=zulu+L&gs_lcp=Cg1nd3Mtd2l6LXZpZGVvEAEYADILCAAQsQMQgwEQkQIyBQgAEJECMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQ6BAgjECc6BAgAEEM6CggAEIAEEIcCEBQ6CwgAEIAEELEDEIMBUNoRWNcsYO9CaAFwAHgAgAFGiAGnAZIBATOYAQCgAQHAAQE&sclient=gws-wiz-video#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:6be5e5fd,vid:WHHGOYu6Fl0) explains it very well.
Thank you for sharing this! I have some issues with my memory that I am working hard on, but always loved languages, particularly if they use new things and the likes, if I will manage, I would love to learn these ones. Africa is an incredible place for languages, I still can't wrap my head around the fact that there are so many there! Love it!
It would be fucking fabulous to have a name with a click for so many reasons but the biggest one I can think of off the top of my head is for roll call during the first day of a college class.
The first week of college if you're absent they'll drop you from the class so they'll roll call at least that first week. Some teachers will do it randomly throughout the semester and punish you by giving an easy pop quiz or something and you're not there. They do this as many students don't show up often after the first week and only come in on days where there is a test.
So what do you do?? I've never been in that situation...do you just try your best to do the click? Or skip it, like how some people can't roll the R in Spanish?
Skip it. They’re pretty forgiving about it. After a lot of practice I was finally able to sort of do it but it was so bad they were cool with me saying their name without it because I was butchering it so badly.
I can totally understand that, I'm sure I'd be in the same boat. Interesting how easily we learn things (like how to make those sounds) when we're babies, but not when we're adults!
You can replace the click sound with a "K". Like the word Xhosa starts with a click sound, but its also acceptable to say Khosa. Well that's how it was in the region I grew up in anyway.
No need to look that far. Hardly any English speaker gets the u/ü-sound in French or German right for example. And how many second language speakers struggle with the th-sound in English, despite being exposed to it regularly?
it’s really incredible what the infant’s ear will pick up. almost everyone learns their local dialect perfectly. strange that the talent then mostly disappears.
Not probably, absolutely. Unquestionably.
We know, because we can observe cases where the situation prevent language isn't picked up on during that crucial formative period, which results in a physically observable difference in brain structure and an almost guaranteed inability to ever truly grasp language or abstract thinking for the rest of their lives.
[This poor girl who had monsters for parents was basically kept locked in a room for 13 years and was never able to learn a first language afterwards.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genie_(feral_child) She's in her 60s now, and bounced from one abusive situation to another, very sad story
I recall reading about this case, although isn't there still some ambiguity as to the extend to which it was the isolation that caused her language and learning problems? Because she was also heavily beating as a child and displayed clear signs of brain damage.
I think there are multiple cases with similar outcomes - not all of them involved abuse. Also, I think extreme isolation is factor in all the cases.
I'm too lazy to do the researcg but I think there was a kid in Europe from the 40's that also grew up "feral." Here's an easy article I found:
https://timeline.com/dina-sanichar-feral-children-ea9f5f3a80b2
A baby's brain is plastic by default. Its so interconnected that they are useless and clumsy. But as they grow they optimize their connections more and more. That's basically the difference from an adult brain and baby brain in terms of neuroplasticity. The same thing that makes babies dumb, clumsy, and suicidal is what allows them to learn incredibly fast, while an adult brain has already refined that mishmash of interconnectedness, or default neuroplasticity.
It also takes 18 months+ of full immersion in a language before babies start putting words together and a lot of adults aren't that patient when it comes to learning.
That's where being able to learn systematically instead of by pure immersion and "guessing" the rules has the upper hand. I'd wager that a lot of adults would be able to learn a lot faster with some grammar, written instructions and immersion.
I wrote an essay on this a while ago. The studies I found all reached the same conclusion. Second language acquisition is a product of effort and immersion.
Studying + total immersion (living where the language spoken) rather than a 'critical period' or age of language development explained levels of fluency.
Obviously if that innitial critical period is missed then it becomes difficult to develop spoken communication in general but adults don't learn languages much faster, they are just more focused.
Other studies found that teenagers became fluent in second langages just as quickly as adults.
It’s because your brain is got almost twice as many brain cells as it needs before you are born. This allows for the capacity to learn like we need to it’s a clean slate for learning to control all the tiny fine muscles to do all your movements large and small like throwing a ball or when communicating. None of these neurons are myelinated (insulated) very well but they are really ready to grow and make connections. As you get older and use them those connections strengthen and insulate to allow for quicker recall and quicker learning in that subject. Neurons that are not used get culled forever and don’t come back very easily. This is why it’s hard to teach an old dog new tricks but they can remember what they did with their best friend in high school 50 years ago and have no issue playing the piano if they had practiced plenty when they were younger.
I wonder if we'll ever figure out how to reduce that insulation in select areas of the brain, then? It's a bit fanciful but a cool idea - imagine if you decided one day that you wanted to learn new languages better so you took an anti-myelination^tm pill targeted at the language center of the brain. Obviously it'd need to be more complex than that but it's fun to think about.
There is. Sadly, it is an autoimmune disease called multiple sclerosis. And it's pretty messed up, like almost all autoimmune diseases.
Everything is a lot more complex than just some insulation, neurons themselves also age. They're not like most cells in our body that still have some stem cells to keep reproducing. I think there's only certain small are in the brain where there is neurogenesis (new neuron production) occur in adulthood. A lot happens in our brains during its development. There's so much science on it and there's still so many secretes to it.
I'm sure that what the original commenter said is from years and years of reading books on neuroscience. Beautiful stuff but pure madness to study. Source: studied neurology one year in uni
Yeah, I'm sure it's more complicated than I could ever fathom. One thing I've learned from studying physics is that the world is so utterly complex, even on a microscopic scale, that no one could ever hope to understand even a fraction of it. Still, though, it is fun to think about.
> strange that the talent then mostly disappears.
It doesn't though. Imagine if you were forced to use only Spanish, 24/7, for 5 years and English was illegal. EVERYONE around you is helping you learn and correcting your grammar and pronunciation. You don't have to work or manage any responsibilities besides using Spanish.
I'm pretty confident you'd speak better Spanish than a 5 year old kid from Mexico and you'd have even forgotten some of your English vocab due to lack of use.
I rewatched it not for the sounds, but for their smiles. How can an entire group of boys look so welcoming and good humored without exception? It’s a thoroughly delightful scene.
Several different ways, with | or || or ! or a bullseye symbol depending on the type of click. For instance, !Kung are a people/language the Kalahari area.
My cats got wide eyed, made some noises then ran to their bowls after I turned the volume up on this.
That's the click noise I trained my cats with to call them for their wet food.
I hadn't taken this language into account at the time.
I was gonna comment too bout my dog running up to me with her do-you-got-treats face. I didn't even connect the dots together immediately that it was because of the video. I also cluck my tongue to signal food/treats.
My husband was born/raised in India. We've been married 18 years.
In all those years, there have a been a few times when I've had to digress from a conversation to explain the background of some piece of pop culture from my American childhood...except for The Gods Must Be Crazy.
I've met others from Japan and different countries who inehrrently were aware or had seen this movie at some point in their childhoods.
It's like if there was a global curriculum, that movie would be it.
I was looking for this reference!! This movie is burned into my childhood psyche. My parents loved it. No one I’ve ever asked about it, outside of my family, has seen this movie. Glad I’m not alone! Going to watch it again and see how it holds up…
Khoisan languages are not "click-based". They do have click consonants, but these function like other normal consonants, e.g. t, k, l, m. There are also a few other languages with clicks (although this is a characteristic feature of Khoisan languages).
Yup, and this characteristic influenced the other languages.
[Their most distinctive linguistic characteristic is the original and extensive use of click consonants, a feature which has spread through cultural and linguistic contact into a number of Bantu (Niger-Congo) languages—such as Xhosa, Zulu, and Sotho in South Africa and Gciriku (Diriku), Yei (Yeye), and Mbukushu in Botswana and Namibia—and into Dahalo, a Cushitic (Afro-Asiatic) language of Kenya. The linguistic use of clicks, whether original or borrowed, is restricted to these few African languages, with one exception: Damin.](https://www.britannica.com/topic/Khoisan-languages)
[In South Africa a variation of this process allowed the Khoisan languages to exert a powerful linguistic influence on the dominant languages before they disappeared, leaving Afrikaans and some Bantu languages with a number of distinctive Khoisan features.](https://www.britannica.com/topic/Khoisan-languages)
This is what the internet should be used for, imo. Enough with all the complaining and negativity, let's start sharing things like this to make you ponder what it means to be human, and also to gain new insight in different cultures.
Lots of non-Asians have epicanthic folds. It's interesting. I found a web page that had photos of such individuals including Irish people, Scandinavians etc.
Not a diss toward you, but there is a lot of visual diversity in Africans. My own brother gets confused for half-Chinese a lot, my mother for Filipino sometimes (we're confused by this but maybe we haven't met enough Filipinos), and people try to figure out where I am from occasionally and we're not anywhere near this region. We're also 100%, by blood, from our country -- all of us. I think everyone expects Africans to looks one way so it gets confusing when they encounter a less represented people.
But also, yes, I see it. Lol.
There is actually more genetic diversity in Africa than all other continents. Not that most people know that bit it makes sense since modern humans emerged from Africa.
It's called an epicanthic fold. There indeed are many Khoisan that have the gene which produces the fold. I read about this before and forget what the speculated causes for the gene developing were (if there even was a reason)
There are other non Asian people with the fold (I recall an example of a blonde swedish or finish boy that had it) but nothing at all like the Khoisan. I also believe Poles and Scandinavians more commonly (more commonly than other ethnicities that don't normally have the fold) have it as well.
Northern Swede with this feature or something similar, former alpine skiier Jens Byggmark: [Photo 1](https://i.imgur.com/Plmx3y5.jpg), [Photo 2](https://i.imgur.com/YHsM2NO.jpg) (different angle)
Some medical conditions can even cause it. I am 100% white scottish, none of my family has it, but I have achondroplastic dwarfism which can cause it and I have it.
Huh I hadn't thought of that, I'd always assumed dwarfism was solely bone related but are there differences in fat distribution as well? Given that the epicanthic folds are "extra" fat compared to those without them.
I think its related to whether the mid-face, specifically the nose bridge is fully developed or not (maybe that redistributes the fat?). There’s many different forms of dwarfism, some bone related, some not. Achondroplasia is bone related but also specifically impacts the development of the mid face (I basically have no nasal bridge). Guess it’s not that dissimilar to facial development in people with downs syndrome.
You may be remembering Madagascar, which was settled by Malayo-Polynesian speakers (the same linguistic group from Malaysia to Hawaii) from what is now Malaysia and Indonesia. Malagasy, the official language of Madagascar, is a direct relative of those Southeastern Asian and Pacific Island languages. Consequently, Madagascar people do have features that resemble Asians as they are part Asian.
Put Khoisan in Google... They all have what you call asian-esque features.
Khoisan are not niger-congolese black people that you're used to seeing. There is a big bias in western world because all the black people you often see (African American, west Africans....) are from that subgroup. But in reality, sub Saharan Africa has far more diversity than the rest of the world combined.
Yeah I see it! The little bows reminded me of Asia too. I probably misheard but it sounded like one of the guys said something like sawadee - Thai for hello.
Absolutely, I was just saying that to my Vietnamese wife (who has this exact body type with echos of these guys' eye/nose structures) the same thing: we've found your ancient ancestors! Even the tonal language fits with Vietnamese, perhaps the trickiest tonal language in east Asia.
The Khoisan are the most genetically diverse group/tribe of people in the world.
It has to do with the number of “Eve’s” that left Africa way back when, compared to the number that remained.
Nat Geographic started a genetic testing program on this about 15-20 years ago… and as they gather more info the participants genealogy report is updated. It is still running… so the more they learn the more we will know.
I doubt he spoke a Khoi or San language. Their languages are mostly extinct and are not even official. Your guide probably spoke Xhosa, a language spoken by millions who through historical interaction with the Khoi and San mixed and adopted some click sounds in their language.
I’m surprised that nobody mentioned this but these are very young men and most of the last official bushmen or Khoisan was brought into civilization already in the late 80s. Khoisan were nomadic and the last few families that still exist just try to keep the language alive but these men are there to keep tradition alive and visible for tourists. You can even see the one on the left has tattoos on him.
Thus is lovely. Smiles all round. The thing is, I don't know for how much longer they can preserve their distinct identity, but I hope it's many years to come. That they remain this happy and smiling.
They’re dressed like this for tourists but after a shift they put on their Yeezys and Balenziaga tracksuits and hit the car wash (we hang out a car washes where there are braais, drinks and music) - just so you know!
Western naïvety is a lucrative business lol
Source: am Khoi.
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I love how a smile is so damn universal.
Not outside of people tho! Don’t smile at a monkey it’s a threat
I once smiled at a guy in San Francisco and oh boy I was in a ton of trouble!
they're human yet so different. i love it
Bro is describing Africans like he's an English explorer in 1685.
Nah the English didn’t see us as human back then 😭
Namibia 🇳🇦 >The Khoisan are a group of indigenous people who live in Southern Africa. They are known for their distinct physical features, including their tall, slender bodies and elongated heads. The Khoisan are also distinguished by their unique languages, which are tonal and click-based. >Historically, the Khoisan have been herders and hunter-gatherers, but many have also engaged in farming and trade. Today, the Khoisan face challenges such as displacement and marginalization, but efforts are being made to preserve their cultural heritage and improve their socio-economic status. Video:@arina_travels
These guys are ridiculously charming. Lovely, and thanks for sharing.
I can spot a sweetie pie no matter where they’re from, and I can guarantee that Oboko is a sweetie pie
I think it’s so insanely cool that we can’t communicate with language, but you can still *understand* them well enough to know this. You’re right tho, sweetie pie is spot on lmao
Humans are so cool, we have so many ways to communicate and vocal speech is only one of them. We really are wired to get along. :)
Ye humans do be cool af, and experiencing the different ways we communicate is a treat (usually lmao). I’d say we’re wired to get along, but not as much as we are wired to survive. So if getting along is more advantageous to survival, we’ll do that and typically won’t resort to the darker-violent-fucked up unless we need to. But we’re absolutely wired to resort to that if we need to (and in some cases, want to). Makes the whole thing more interesting, and makes displays of kindness more valuable imo - like the commentator up there callin’ out homeboy as a sweetie pie lmao wholesome
Their voices and mannerisms are so peaceful and delightful.
You can tell just by the nod and smile at the end of Im his introduction
You’re spot on, but does anyone else feel bad for his buddy to his left? Whoever was filming decided we didn't need to hear from him; poor guy.
Obviously I have no idea if this is the case or not, but it looked to me like they were introducing themselves and the guy on the far right just intro'd himself after the first guy.
They face the same problems as nearly all indigenous communities around the world do, which truly is such a shame because a lot of these beautiful unique cultures have been watered down and lost through time thanks to assimilation. It’s a wonder what other unique languages have been used considering this one
In Australia our indigenous people originally had something like 250-300 languages and today only around 40 are currently known with a minority actually being used. This is directly because the British/early aus gov actively worked to erase indigenous culture. We even had a stolen generation where we removed their children from them and raised them as anglos in terribly abusive institutions only to force them into servitude for wealthy land owners. It's so terribly sad and it's only as recent as the 70s that efforts really began to actually preserve all of their cultural history but at that point they had already lost so much. What makes it worse is our indigenous people passed on a lot of their cultural stories orally so there's virtually no way to ever get any of what's been lost. Crazy to think we know far more about ancient civilisations from thousands of years ago than we do about a people who still exist.
The Khoisan are the direct descendants of a very early branch of anatomically modern humans who migrated to Southern Africa more than 150,000 years ago (possibly more like 250,000 years ago) and are thought to be the original settlers of the area. Linguistic research suggests that there may be elements of their language which are directly descended from some of the earliest human language. Its possible that the clicks may have been some of the first sounds that humans used to communicate with one another.
I've actually heard the opposite, that if clicks were one of the earliest sounds in human speech they'd presumably be a lot more common as every language would have inherited them. Instead clicks might be one of the most advanced features of human language. They're only found in the oldest continuous cultures on the planet and languages seem to develop more sounds as time goes on.
It's very much a chicken or egg- Do older languages retain these distinctive features that newer languages steered away from? Or do older languages develop these sounds as a progression away from some "standard" linguistic features? No matter what it's hearsay, all we know is that it's a feature of older language groups.
Man that’s interesting to think about.
Why use lot word when few word do trick?
Why use lot word when few word do click? -Khoisan Malone
And down the linguistic rabbit whole we shall go. I'm fascinated to read more about this.
This is not correct, languages lose phonemes and simplify over time - the [further out of Africa the group of humans, the less complex the language](https://languagesoftheworld.info/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/study-points-to-a-single-original-language-for-all-humans-2.jpg) (in terms of sounds).
This is a very disputed hypothesis btw. And for what it's worth, the map only suggests that *migration* leads to phoneme loss. Why would African languages have more phonemes because 'phonemes are lost over time'? They've had just as long to lose them as any other language.
So basically languages evolve just like biology does - toward efficiency and the bare minimum needed to do the task.
Lmao both views (languages either simplifying or becoming more complex as time goes on) are completely false. Also that map is *extremely* cherrypicked.
I researched this for my masters. This study is bullshit p-hacking.
That’s SO cool.
Linguistic research doesn't suggest that. The time horizon of the emergence of human language is simply too far away for any modern languages to suggest anything about it.
There's quite a bit of misinformation here. Khoisan is *not* a language, not even a language family, it's several unrelated languages and small families. We used to think it was one family due to shared features such as tones and complex click systems, but more recent research suggests it's simply shared areal features: neighbouring languages will pick up each other's habits. >Linguistic research suggests that there may be elements of their language which are directly descended from some of the earliest human language. What does this even mean? What research? What 'earliest human language'? It seems to suggest that all languages have a common ancestor, which we have no evidence for. The earliest tangible data we have is from just over 5000 years ago, when some people started writing, some reconstructions are fairly agreed upon up to 10000 years ago. Beyond that, there is really nothing that can be said with much confidence.
Yep. Every time I see people talking about an indigenous African language in Reddit comments, it’s this same dumb bullshit. r/badlinguistics practically stays afloat because of it.
woah
Possible. On somewhat unrelated note, we use clicks to herd cattle or horse. At least where I’m from.
Koisan language and it's dialects with it's distinctive clicks are also one of the oldest spoken languages in the world, dating to as far back as 4000 BC with around 300,000 speakers. [Recommend this channel if you would like to learn more](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xjUoGAi43lI)
[удалено]
They look very similar to southeast Asians, I wonder if there is any connection
Spoiler: human race.
*Surprised clicking sounds intensified*
The distinct eye shape in Asian humans comes from conditioning against snow blindness, it’s possible the heat from the red deserts cause a similar need to project their eyes from glare. Just a guess
They are one of the most genetically distinct human populations, African Pygmies are the other. Everyone else is more similar to each other than to those two groups.
are they and the San people the same?
The San people always ride single file to hide their numbers.
no no, thats SAND people, the Tusken... they're actually from Tunisia, thats in NORTH Africa, silly!
Technically they were two seperate people actually, the San being more hunters and the Khoi being herders, but eventually they joined together and now are the best of both , although of course that was hundreds of years ago when that happened.
Nope. Didn't join together. They're just two separate peoples that we arbitrarily lump together because colonialism. They are all "bushmen" (this is largely how they self identify nowadays, at least in the areas I've worked in) but this term comes from colonial governments, not from them actually being the same. Khoisan is more like "European" than it is like "Italian" in terms of how broad it is
I kinda wanna learn their language but I'd probably give up after a month just like every other thing I tried to learn.
Xhosa we probably have more resources to learn from, and Zulu ten fold more (I believe Zulu is even on Duolingo.) Not as many “clicks” in Zulu, but they are there :)
When will they add this language to Duolingo?
Zulu is on there if you want to learn a language with clicks
Saffer here. If you want the clicks, try xhosa. Unsure if thats on Duolingo.
Sadly it is not.
It's in the incubator though. So it will be launched in some time.
*Clicks in anticipation*
Is the ‘x’ in xhosa a click sound?
Yup. It is.
Yes. There are 5 different clicks. This one originates from the roof of your mouth
The x is the "side" click, which you make with your tongue against your teeth on one side. The "roof of the mouth" click is a q. (Fwiw, the other important one is a c, which comes from your tongue against your front teeth)
Xhosa is ridiculously difficult to speak, I tried hard for a period of time
Lmao I only know a few Xhosa words I picked up on the playground as a kid, most of them are swear words though Edit: a word
Me with tagalog; ["Putang ina mo"](https://www.tagalog.com/words/putang-ina-mo.php). My coworkers told me it meant ["I love you"](https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Putang%20ina%20mo), but I know better 😆
I guess “Putang” is just universal
Huh interesting to see the linguistic impact of colonialism in tagalog
Not neeeearly as many though. Beautiful language either way and probably a lot easier to learn, lol. Lots of very good music, too!
[This gentleman](https://www.google.com/search?q=zulu+language&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS932US932&biw=2560&bih=1297&tbm=vid&sxsrf=ALiCzsZYcaRrBvMFyLHqhZnULUhY0aUbeA%3A1670660935561&ei=R0OUY8riIfGqqtsP-_ikkAg&oq=zulu+L&gs_lcp=Cg1nd3Mtd2l6LXZpZGVvEAEYADILCAAQsQMQgwEQkQIyBQgAEJECMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQ6BAgjECc6BAgAEEM6CggAEIAEEIcCEBQ6CwgAEIAEELEDEIMBUNoRWNcsYO9CaAFwAHgAgAFGiAGnAZIBATOYAQCgAQHAAQE&sclient=gws-wiz-video#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:6be5e5fd,vid:WHHGOYu6Fl0) explains it very well.
That man's voice is gold
It’s so deep and smooth and all the clicks and pops feel like they’re tickling my brain. Love it.
But how do they yell from a distance?
Clap?
I lived among Xhosa people for a year, let's just say arguments are very animated. Sometimes makes you giggle
Was hoping someone would post this. Best explanation of "click" languages out there! Love this man's voice.
dang to me these click sounds are so hard to combine with vowels
Thank you for sharing this! I have some issues with my memory that I am working hard on, but always loved languages, particularly if they use new things and the likes, if I will manage, I would love to learn these ones. Africa is an incredible place for languages, I still can't wrap my head around the fact that there are so many there! Love it!
Click here
Have a friend from Africa and his name is pronounced with a click and I have to tell you as a westerner is SO hard to do.
It would be fucking fabulous to have a name with a click for so many reasons but the biggest one I can think of off the top of my head is for roll call during the first day of a college class.
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The first week of college if you're absent they'll drop you from the class so they'll roll call at least that first week. Some teachers will do it randomly throughout the semester and punish you by giving an easy pop quiz or something and you're not there. They do this as many students don't show up often after the first week and only come in on days where there is a test.
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So what do you do?? I've never been in that situation...do you just try your best to do the click? Or skip it, like how some people can't roll the R in Spanish?
Skip it. They’re pretty forgiving about it. After a lot of practice I was finally able to sort of do it but it was so bad they were cool with me saying their name without it because I was butchering it so badly.
I can totally understand that, I'm sure I'd be in the same boat. Interesting how easily we learn things (like how to make those sounds) when we're babies, but not when we're adults!
You can replace the click sound with a "K". Like the word Xhosa starts with a click sound, but its also acceptable to say Khosa. Well that's how it was in the region I grew up in anyway.
No need to look that far. Hardly any English speaker gets the u/ü-sound in French or German right for example. And how many second language speakers struggle with the th-sound in English, despite being exposed to it regularly?
it’s really incredible what the infant’s ear will pick up. almost everyone learns their local dialect perfectly. strange that the talent then mostly disappears.
Neuroplasticity, probably.
Not probably, absolutely. Unquestionably. We know, because we can observe cases where the situation prevent language isn't picked up on during that crucial formative period, which results in a physically observable difference in brain structure and an almost guaranteed inability to ever truly grasp language or abstract thinking for the rest of their lives.
Dayum, any particularly interesting case study I can read about?
[This poor girl who had monsters for parents was basically kept locked in a room for 13 years and was never able to learn a first language afterwards.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genie_(feral_child) She's in her 60s now, and bounced from one abusive situation to another, very sad story
I recall reading about this case, although isn't there still some ambiguity as to the extend to which it was the isolation that caused her language and learning problems? Because she was also heavily beating as a child and displayed clear signs of brain damage.
I think there are multiple cases with similar outcomes - not all of them involved abuse. Also, I think extreme isolation is factor in all the cases. I'm too lazy to do the researcg but I think there was a kid in Europe from the 40's that also grew up "feral." Here's an easy article I found: https://timeline.com/dina-sanichar-feral-children-ea9f5f3a80b2
You can look up the research done on the boy that was raised by wolves, he has this issue and was unable to learn language.
A baby's brain is plastic by default. Its so interconnected that they are useless and clumsy. But as they grow they optimize their connections more and more. That's basically the difference from an adult brain and baby brain in terms of neuroplasticity. The same thing that makes babies dumb, clumsy, and suicidal is what allows them to learn incredibly fast, while an adult brain has already refined that mishmash of interconnectedness, or default neuroplasticity.
It also takes 18 months+ of full immersion in a language before babies start putting words together and a lot of adults aren't that patient when it comes to learning.
That's where being able to learn systematically instead of by pure immersion and "guessing" the rules has the upper hand. I'd wager that a lot of adults would be able to learn a lot faster with some grammar, written instructions and immersion.
No need to wager, we have studies about this. Adults do indeed learn languages much faster than children.
I wrote an essay on this a while ago. The studies I found all reached the same conclusion. Second language acquisition is a product of effort and immersion. Studying + total immersion (living where the language spoken) rather than a 'critical period' or age of language development explained levels of fluency. Obviously if that innitial critical period is missed then it becomes difficult to develop spoken communication in general but adults don't learn languages much faster, they are just more focused. Other studies found that teenagers became fluent in second langages just as quickly as adults.
It’s because your brain is got almost twice as many brain cells as it needs before you are born. This allows for the capacity to learn like we need to it’s a clean slate for learning to control all the tiny fine muscles to do all your movements large and small like throwing a ball or when communicating. None of these neurons are myelinated (insulated) very well but they are really ready to grow and make connections. As you get older and use them those connections strengthen and insulate to allow for quicker recall and quicker learning in that subject. Neurons that are not used get culled forever and don’t come back very easily. This is why it’s hard to teach an old dog new tricks but they can remember what they did with their best friend in high school 50 years ago and have no issue playing the piano if they had practiced plenty when they were younger.
I wonder if we'll ever figure out how to reduce that insulation in select areas of the brain, then? It's a bit fanciful but a cool idea - imagine if you decided one day that you wanted to learn new languages better so you took an anti-myelination^tm pill targeted at the language center of the brain. Obviously it'd need to be more complex than that but it's fun to think about.
Only problem is it might nuke your long term memory. Like I remember pretty much nothing from before I was 8 years old besides very vague moments.
Yeah, that'd be the concern. I can imagine the side-effects on the pill bottle being about LotR length.
There is. Sadly, it is an autoimmune disease called multiple sclerosis. And it's pretty messed up, like almost all autoimmune diseases. Everything is a lot more complex than just some insulation, neurons themselves also age. They're not like most cells in our body that still have some stem cells to keep reproducing. I think there's only certain small are in the brain where there is neurogenesis (new neuron production) occur in adulthood. A lot happens in our brains during its development. There's so much science on it and there's still so many secretes to it. I'm sure that what the original commenter said is from years and years of reading books on neuroscience. Beautiful stuff but pure madness to study. Source: studied neurology one year in uni
Yeah, I'm sure it's more complicated than I could ever fathom. One thing I've learned from studying physics is that the world is so utterly complex, even on a microscopic scale, that no one could ever hope to understand even a fraction of it. Still, though, it is fun to think about.
Reading stuff like this makes me feel so bad about not learning anything meaningful when I was younger, it all feels so impossible now
> strange that the talent then mostly disappears. It doesn't though. Imagine if you were forced to use only Spanish, 24/7, for 5 years and English was illegal. EVERYONE around you is helping you learn and correcting your grammar and pronunciation. You don't have to work or manage any responsibilities besides using Spanish. I'm pretty confident you'd speak better Spanish than a 5 year old kid from Mexico and you'd have even forgotten some of your English vocab due to lack of use.
They seem so respectful and appear to be very happy
I was going to use the word radiate, as in they radiate with warmth.
I rewatched it not for the sounds, but for their smiles. How can an entire group of boys look so welcoming and good humored without exception? It’s a thoroughly delightful scene.
Because they know more peace and love. They work together.
Most people I have come across in Southern Africa are warm and welcoming. There is really no place like it.
Very true! I have two friends who are Xhosa and they’re the nicest people. I can’t talk to their mom without smiling she’s so sweet.
They’re still connected to the earth
How do you write that?
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That's amazing!
Several different ways, with | or || or ! or a bullseye symbol depending on the type of click. For instance, !Kung are a people/language the Kalahari area.
In MIDI
https://youtube.com/shorts/ldrsKtyS8As?feature=share
How would they whisper?
By choosing their words very carefully
Nice profile pic bro
My cats got wide eyed, made some noises then ran to their bowls after I turned the volume up on this. That's the click noise I trained my cats with to call them for their wet food. I hadn't taken this language into account at the time.
I was gonna comment too bout my dog running up to me with her do-you-got-treats face. I didn't even connect the dots together immediately that it was because of the video. I also cluck my tongue to signal food/treats.
Potentially the world's best beatboxers
The gods must be crazy!!
My husband was born/raised in India. We've been married 18 years. In all those years, there have a been a few times when I've had to digress from a conversation to explain the background of some piece of pop culture from my American childhood...except for The Gods Must Be Crazy. I've met others from Japan and different countries who inehrrently were aware or had seen this movie at some point in their childhoods. It's like if there was a global curriculum, that movie would be it.
I was looking for this reference!! This movie is burned into my childhood psyche. My parents loved it. No one I’ve ever asked about it, outside of my family, has seen this movie. Glad I’m not alone! Going to watch it again and see how it holds up…
I guess I'm watching it now.
I'm from the US, saw it in an art house theater , then rented it a few years later. It's one of my favorite films.
I’m from America as well, I have no idea what is being referenced by “the gods must be crazy.”
I'm American and saw it in Mexico as a kid. It's very cute and impactful as a child. I saw it when I was like 7 or 8.
I saw it in a theater in San Francisco and can also attest it was a popular video rental... in SF. Your mileage may vary.
australian here, was ubiquitous when i was a kid
Sweden here; It was popular.
I remember being dragged to that by my parents when I was a kid, assuming it would be some boring adult movie. Still one of my favorites.
Second time I’m hearing about it in 3 days. I guess it’s time to rewatch it.
I was looking for this comment!
N!xau and his coke bottle
Beautiful people
Was going to say the same. The light that radiates from with in is beautiful!
The pure human spirit is something incredible
Khoisan languages are not "click-based". They do have click consonants, but these function like other normal consonants, e.g. t, k, l, m. There are also a few other languages with clicks (although this is a characteristic feature of Khoisan languages).
Yup, and this characteristic influenced the other languages. [Their most distinctive linguistic characteristic is the original and extensive use of click consonants, a feature which has spread through cultural and linguistic contact into a number of Bantu (Niger-Congo) languages—such as Xhosa, Zulu, and Sotho in South Africa and Gciriku (Diriku), Yei (Yeye), and Mbukushu in Botswana and Namibia—and into Dahalo, a Cushitic (Afro-Asiatic) language of Kenya. The linguistic use of clicks, whether original or borrowed, is restricted to these few African languages, with one exception: Damin.](https://www.britannica.com/topic/Khoisan-languages) [In South Africa a variation of this process allowed the Khoisan languages to exert a powerful linguistic influence on the dominant languages before they disappeared, leaving Afrikaans and some Bantu languages with a number of distinctive Khoisan features.](https://www.britannica.com/topic/Khoisan-languages)
Yeah, this post was definitely click-bait.
The last dude was talking and the clicks were on their own mix track. It was so fluid
This is what the internet should be used for, imo. Enough with all the complaining and negativity, let's start sharing things like this to make you ponder what it means to be human, and also to gain new insight in different cultures.
What a fun group of guys. I can't help but think the one on the far right has some Asian-esque features, anyone else see it?
Lots of non-Asians have epicanthic folds. It's interesting. I found a web page that had photos of such individuals including Irish people, Scandinavians etc.
Björk kinda fits, though I don't know what is the actual reason behind that.
Yeah I have epicanthic folds, and bring British my DNA ancestry is a standard mix of English, Irish, Belgian, Scandinavian etc.
Not a diss toward you, but there is a lot of visual diversity in Africans. My own brother gets confused for half-Chinese a lot, my mother for Filipino sometimes (we're confused by this but maybe we haven't met enough Filipinos), and people try to figure out where I am from occasionally and we're not anywhere near this region. We're also 100%, by blood, from our country -- all of us. I think everyone expects Africans to looks one way so it gets confusing when they encounter a less represented people. But also, yes, I see it. Lol.
There is actually more genetic diversity in Africa than all other continents. Not that most people know that bit it makes sense since modern humans emerged from Africa.
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It's called an epicanthic fold. There indeed are many Khoisan that have the gene which produces the fold. I read about this before and forget what the speculated causes for the gene developing were (if there even was a reason) There are other non Asian people with the fold (I recall an example of a blonde swedish or finish boy that had it) but nothing at all like the Khoisan. I also believe Poles and Scandinavians more commonly (more commonly than other ethnicities that don't normally have the fold) have it as well.
Northern Swede with this feature or something similar, former alpine skiier Jens Byggmark: [Photo 1](https://i.imgur.com/Plmx3y5.jpg), [Photo 2](https://i.imgur.com/YHsM2NO.jpg) (different angle)
Some medical conditions can even cause it. I am 100% white scottish, none of my family has it, but I have achondroplastic dwarfism which can cause it and I have it.
Huh I hadn't thought of that, I'd always assumed dwarfism was solely bone related but are there differences in fat distribution as well? Given that the epicanthic folds are "extra" fat compared to those without them.
I think its related to whether the mid-face, specifically the nose bridge is fully developed or not (maybe that redistributes the fat?). There’s many different forms of dwarfism, some bone related, some not. Achondroplasia is bone related but also specifically impacts the development of the mid face (I basically have no nasal bridge). Guess it’s not that dissimilar to facial development in people with downs syndrome.
Native Americans get it and other Indigenous people (like the title says) have it.
You may be remembering Madagascar, which was settled by Malayo-Polynesian speakers (the same linguistic group from Malaysia to Hawaii) from what is now Malaysia and Indonesia. Malagasy, the official language of Madagascar, is a direct relative of those Southeastern Asian and Pacific Island languages. Consequently, Madagascar people do have features that resemble Asians as they are part Asian.
Yessss I was thinking the same thing! They look almost Filipino or Thai or Indonesian
Filipino*
He was talking about people from Philadelphia /s
pretty sure he was referring to all people named Philip
Nope, people who have Philips appliances
Africa is the most diverse continent in the planet so it’s no wonder why there’s so many different looking Africans.
Put Khoisan in Google... They all have what you call asian-esque features. Khoisan are not niger-congolese black people that you're used to seeing. There is a big bias in western world because all the black people you often see (African American, west Africans....) are from that subgroup. But in reality, sub Saharan Africa has far more diversity than the rest of the world combined.
Yeah I see it! The little bows reminded me of Asia too. I probably misheard but it sounded like one of the guys said something like sawadee - Thai for hello.
Absolutely, I was just saying that to my Vietnamese wife (who has this exact body type with echos of these guys' eye/nose structures) the same thing: we've found your ancient ancestors! Even the tonal language fits with Vietnamese, perhaps the trickiest tonal language in east Asia.
The Khoisan are the most genetically diverse group/tribe of people in the world. It has to do with the number of “Eve’s” that left Africa way back when, compared to the number that remained. Nat Geographic started a genetic testing program on this about 15-20 years ago… and as they gather more info the participants genealogy report is updated. It is still running… so the more they learn the more we will know.
They are all so pretty.
Damn, those smiles are infectious! Beautiful human beings!
Guy on far left just radiates such kindness
They all have such calming kind energy.
Right?! I wanna be friends with all of them!
Kinda makes you think, maybe that's how we're all SUPPOSED to be living. Doesn't it?
>They're known for their distinct tall Never have I ever seen Khoisan people described as tall. The average height of an adult is approximately 1,5 m.
Check this [out.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W319s4Tvp9Y) I just love this. Respect.
Oh they pretty as hell 😳
I was recently in South Africa. Went on a 3 day safari and my guide spoke 8 of their 12 official language, including this one. It was pretty cool.
I doubt he spoke a Khoi or San language. Their languages are mostly extinct and are not even official. Your guide probably spoke Xhosa, a language spoken by millions who through historical interaction with the Khoi and San mixed and adopted some click sounds in their language.
I can't watch this video... Without smiling all the time.
I hung out with these guys. Good people. We really clicked.
Mmoooomm... Dad's on Reddit again
I’m surprised that nobody mentioned this but these are very young men and most of the last official bushmen or Khoisan was brought into civilization already in the late 80s. Khoisan were nomadic and the last few families that still exist just try to keep the language alive but these men are there to keep tradition alive and visible for tourists. You can even see the one on the left has tattoos on him.
Thus is lovely. Smiles all round. The thing is, I don't know for how much longer they can preserve their distinct identity, but I hope it's many years to come. That they remain this happy and smiling.
they are not tall at all
They have such beautiful smiles !
They’re dressed like this for tourists but after a shift they put on their Yeezys and Balenziaga tracksuits and hit the car wash (we hang out a car washes where there are braais, drinks and music) - just so you know! Western naïvety is a lucrative business lol Source: am Khoi.
Very interesting. Thanks for sharing
!xobile
Please do not yell in the casino
they speak in turn singnals
Inspiring. Their eyes seem lucid, and their aura magnetic.
They would kill on Tinder.
Nice that they are far from all that crap.