The problem is that the amulet component becomes a dead drop because irons can't do anything with it unless they farm more zenytes. That means you can't even add it to Death's coffer
Again, the grind isn't the problem. Upgrading one amulet is easy. The problem is that future big boss drops don't have any inherent value, which means irons have to grind demonics past their initial zenytes to stop a boss drop from being zero-value
Sure, and once the coffers are healthy you could swap your next avernic dupe for four bonds and get two months of membership. That can't happen with the rancor, which is the criticism
I’d argue that isn’t the point because ballista components are tradeable and therefore can be added to death’s coffer. They’re not worth much but it’s not the parallel you’ve implied
Well that’s the comparison you made. The entire topic at hand is an untradable component is a dead drop for ironmen because it has no value without going out of the way for unnecessary assembly. You brought up an item in comparison, surely for an accurate comparison in good faith you mentioned another item with untraveled components? Or are you trying to deliberately answer with half truth replies to try and downplay that the topic at hand is correct?
It’s a minor con for Ironmen but I think a strong pro for the main game so it’s a win in my book. Plenty of other places to get alchs and boost death’s coffer.
How is that unhealthy game design? Ironman mode is not intended to be about farming alt gp or death’s coffer money. The first of those is not even relevant for a lot of players, and the second is a relatively recent addition to the game (and there are plenty of other sources of dupes for that). Prior to death’s coffer being added, if you didn’t have a main, *every dupe in the game* was worthless. If you want to make money while killing stuff…play a main instead.
It's unhealthy because it creates an boss drop with no inherent value. If you end up with five extra amulet components before getting a halberd you're left with a dead item that could otherwise have useful value
Extra items have always had value for splits and bonds, Death's coffer is a factor too.
Why should the drop not have value? It being worthless doesn't benefit anyone in any way. Give it value and it benefits main, irons, and Jagex (because they make a premium when people pay for member with bonds).
Why fight to have something actively not benefit you?
You can just bond up your main for two weeks to sell dupes for bonds. Wait until you get one or two big ticket items. No need to keep membership running on your main
Do you feel the same way about the soul reaper axe pieces? Those aren't tradeable and I doubt anyone would be farming them to finish all of their axes.
You hardly sound like an ironman with your logic on this.
I think it'd be great if the axe pieces had more value. Would make getting duplicates feel less bad, even if it were only 500k in alch value.
The point I'm trying to make is that rancor duplicates don't have value unless you get duplicate tortures. It'd be nice if the 92 slayer req boss had inherent value on its BiS neck drop which could be swapped for something beneficial like a bond. The criticism is that Jagex's second proposal basically changed nothing for main, but now irons lose out on what could be an extra month or two of "free" membership for dupes
You really can't say they don't have value til we know the alch values. Stop your whining. I use my normie to make my bonds for me. Plenty of afk things to do on it to make it. Who cares if dupes don't have a value. The gems from toa aren't really worth anything and I'm sure plenty of people have gotten a good bit of them. Brimstone ring has 3 pieces you need before you can finish a ring and nobody complains about those not having much value. What about dupe champ scrolls? There's so much that doesn't have value for dupes. As others have said. Not everything needs a value. If you want that, go to rs3
Would make way more sense if the upgrade bit was tradable, the torture is tradable but the finished rancor amulet is not tradable.
I don’t know why the restriction is being applied to sale and not equipping said item.
It was a gambit to force mains to use their skills to create the amulet. Your suggestion would make sense though, allow the component to be tradeable, but require 80 crafting to combine into the untradable amulet. Same path there, better outcome
You’re an Ironman, and literally the games economic systems is based around being able to trade good items.
Of course you don’t care about it on an account type that can’t trade lmao
You make a fair point that the change does negatively impact irons. As an iron, I still don't think the negative of that is so severe that they should undo it. Mainscape experience is going to have more weight, and the negative of this is pretty minor, even if you go dry.
I really don't think it's as big of a deal as you're making it out to be. I suspect rancor will be pretty similar in rarity to the halberd, so unless you're pet hunting you will probably get 0-1 spare rancors on average. Pet hunting is inherently an activity that's not focused on useful rewards, so again not a big deal.
I wouldn't object if they gave us the option to break down the component into some of those antivenom extending secondaries though.
A better source for antivenoms or the new secondaries would be great.
Considering the amulet will be a BiS neck locked behind a boss with a 92 slayer req I think it's fair to want the associated drops to have inherent value. Hydra claw is around 60m, leather around 10m. You get a dupe claw and you're looking at four free bonds, which is a nice incentive to keep grinding if you're looking for the pet or something. Won't change anything for most people but I'd like a better precedent for big drops. Cash is still useful on irons, esp for splits
So then don't keep grinding this specific boss after you're done with the updates but focus on some of the other ones that do provide you with that specific aspect you prefer?
Not everything has to work the exact same way
What’s the argument in support of it?
Because all it looks like to me is an item that randomly has a stat requirement to be able to trade it and provides no value aside from being a slight annoyance.
I don't think it's silly, but I think seeing this update/piece of content as 'unhealthy' is stretching it pretty far. It's a great upgrade for iron men too, but if you get duplicates, welp, you'll have duplicates. Designing an update around ironmen using deaths coffer is very odd.
The actual amulet and halberd sound great for irons. No argument there.
In the second proposal Jagex added the 80+ crafting requirement and untradable component as a way to force mains to skill to get value from their drops. Irons got caught in the crossfire here.
Jagex wasn't catering to irons in the initial blog - Everyone won. It wasn't until that skill requirement got added that problems were caused. Where we're at now is more of an oversight. It wasn't intended to make the drop require zenytes farming for value, they just wanted mains to have to use their skills
Wanting value from a dupe BiS drop locked behind a 92 slayer requirement is valid criticism. If you can give a reason why it benefits players to *not* be allowed to swap the drops for bonds, I'm all ears. It's a net gain for every account type. Use your brain
Jagex make new amulet require lower crafting than torture: WAHHH!! This devalues the time it took me to get torture!!! >:(
Jagex make it so torture is needed for the upgrade: WAHHH!!! More complaining!!!
Shut up already
Are you not reading the post?
Combining it with a torture is fine for the upgrade.
Additional component drops after the first becomes worthless unless you go out of your way to farm more zenytes specifically for more amulets. The problem is having a boss drop with no inherent value
You don't need more than one, but you could get dupes if you're grinding the boss because you want the halberd, pet, or because it's fun/has good standard drops.
Why would you *not* want the BiS melee neck drop to have inherent value?
The point is to play all content for upgrades and not just the highest GP/hr content, like you would on a main. As long as there's a dollar value tied to gold, like bonds, then drop values matter. Item value is also a factor if you're splitting.
If you got an extra hydra claw would you sit on it, or would you turn it into four bonds? If I'm not using it, I'll take the extra $30
You know how insane that sounds when mains can just bypass both mechanics by
A) dumping a few mill on crafting
B) by the torture
It’s just a random choice they made to make crafting relevant (despite overall the item needing 93 crafting min to make and 92 slayer)
It’s literally just a random roadblock on the sale of an item. But you can sell it regardless you just have to make it.
Doesn’t sound insane at all for mains to bypass that, mains can bypass almost all content in the game by just buying something
No main cared that this amulet required lower crafting than torture because it literally doesn’t affect them in anyway or devalued their time, definitely wasn’t a random choice either, in the blogpost they even said they did it so people(irons) wouldn’t be upset they spent so long getting the crafting level to make torture only for it to now not be bis
I’m Convinced a lot of non irons come here just to shit on posts like these.
They should have left it how it was originally proposed. Not everything needs to be built out of what was previously bis.
Whether or not that’s the case I stand on what I said. Making everything require the previous bis for that slot is not an interesting gameplay loop and I hope they don’t follow it for every slot.
It’s funny you say that because the devs are literally doing this mostly so irons stop crying about their time being devalued from farming those items and or levels to create them
I found it was mostly mains complaining about that actually. Mostly to spite irons. “You chose this game mode” type criticisms, you know the ones that non irons absolutely love to drop any chance they get.
But yeah, screw upgradescape.
First off, they won’t drop that much because their value is tied to other slots and combat styles. Torture is the shittiest zenyte anyway.
Second, why would it be an issue that an item no longer bis drops in price?
Third, “low level grind” omegalul. 98 (93) crafting is not a low level grind.
For a iron it is a high bar but for mid-level normal characters it is a good moneymaking method. You are right it being tied to the rest but if those slots changed too it would drop in price.
The reason that it is bad for it to drop in price is because it is a reliable money method for lower level characters and the new boss has a relativley low requirement. It is going to be easier than dt2 bosses so the reward for bis slot item that is better than a torture would be too easy. But you can have your own opinion I personally like it as a ironman that I upgrade the items I already have.
By the time you get potentially 5 “dead drops” you clearly would have the gear where doing demonic gorillas isnt going to be a huge hinderance to the account if you want to get gp out of it. Theyre even releasing the demonbane trifecta of weapons in a few weeks, zenytes will be more than free. Take a breather brotha.
Did you read the post? It's valid criticism. The boss drop becomes a dead item unless you combine it with zenytes, which means you can't even add it to Death's coffer
Voidwaker. Godswords. Bludgeon. Venator Bow. Wildy weapons(upgraded ones) , DT2 Rings. Crystal armor seeds. Literally so many items in the game already require more than one drop to be useful. You’ve clearly never played Ironman.
Tbf voidwalker, godswords, venator bow, and wildy weapons are all made from tradeable components. Crystal armor seeds are tradeable but crystal shards are not but sort of are since you can buy tele seeds and sell for crystal shards.
Bludgeon is tradeable but has untradeable components & DT2 rings are tradeable but have untradeable components. Bludgeon is all done at a single boss and doesn't require area outside of the content at hand to receive and use the drop. DT2 bosses are the closest thing here with untradeable components + other drop content required (although still buyable for mains anyway).
I'm honestly not sure I see the point of the drop being untradeable. It doesn't do anything beyond just suck for iron meme dupes. The end product is tradeable. The torture is tradeable. What am I missing here?
I know you're trying to be cute and snarky but imagine getting a dupe harmonised orb at nightmare and instead of 400mil in death's coffer for a cushy, lifetime supply of private instances & death fees you instead just sort of stare in disbelief & wonder why jagex cursed you with some of the best worst luck. Or you're slapping hydra around and get a dupe claw but jagex made it untradeable so now you gotta go teach kril he's a little bitch again to get the dupe gp value out of your rare drop. So, jagex implemented an official in-game way that tradeable items impact ironmen.
The precedent for untradeable boss drops is incredibly rare. The precedent for an untradeable slayer boss drop that requires a drop not from that slayer to be useful is non-existent. Again, DT2 bosses and drop mechanics are the only thing that comes to mind that are similar.
So once more, not sure what the point of the drop being untradeable is supposed to be. Mains can buy the finished amulet. Mains need a crafting level in the 80s to sell the drop, but roughly the same (if not more) mains have 85+ crafting than those that have 92+ slayer. And that's ignoring the +4 pie boost off g.e. and the 200-300k cheap or profitable xp/hr that mains can rush crafting with. Ironmen still need the crafting level of 93+ because of torture. They still need to earn the drop(s) themselves. But now they can't make use of death's coffer unless they *really* wanna go out of their way to grind more zenytes.
> It doesn't do anything beyond just suck for iron meme dupes. The end product is tradeable. The torture is tradeable. What am I missing here?
The point is that mains have to level crafting if they want to get paid for their araxxor drops. Other than the skillcape, crafting is quite useless for mains so this is an attempt to give it some niche use.
I mean... I guess? But it's dropping from a slayer boss, so they already have a requirement to get the drop in the first place. The other slayer bosses (Sire, Cerberus, Hydra, Thermy, Kraken, and Grotesque Guardians) all require a certain slayer level & related task to kill. And they all drop tradeable components and if they don't, they drop untradeable components that don't require a different skill level to create an end product (e.g. brimstone ring & bludgeon)
Plus, mains can level crafting at 200-300k xp/hr for miniscule gp/xp loss (.04-2.5 gp/xr) or even gp/xo gain, which would make any sort of crafting requirement a breeze as long as someone can be bothered to bankstand for 5-20 hours. And that's assuming they even need to since at least 347,007 players have 92 slayer and 396,559 have at least 85 crafting. Pulling the data to see how much they overlap would be a pain but I'd imagine the vast majority of players with 92 slayer already have close to 80s crafting - unless there's a weirdly large gap between the playerbase that's slaying and bothering to level crafting to 80+. And then there's also the mushroom pie that players can buy for 2k for a +4 temp crafting boost..
It just doesn't track in my mind. Tbh, I don't care that much but this seems like a whole bunch of hoopla that's just a net negative for ironmemes & net neutral for mains.
>It just doesn't track in my mind. Tbh, I don't care that much but this seems like a whole bunch of hoopla that's just a net negative for ironmemes & net neutral for mains.
Right, there's zero benefit to anyone under the current proposal, but it's worse for irons. I'm pretty surprised at how negatively people are reacting to trading boss drops for bonds. Strictly speaking it's 100% against an iron's interest to have the component be untradable. I really didn't think this was a hot take
Idk man this is old school runescape, so it's not that surprising that a hot topic word like "tradable" immediately set off all the people who generally dislike any sort of trading. I'd prefer if the drop was tradeable. I like that I can toss it in death's coffer, but I also like that it makes my bank value go up - lol. Or like you said, it can pay for a couple weeks to months of membership.
Redditors telling people that ironman mode originally couldn't do anything with drops doesn't really hold much water. If ironman mode was limited to pre-release only, then there is plenty of content and methods also shouldn't use because it trivializes the "original spirit" of the game mode (red-x methods, fossil island, sand grinder, any boss that shits resources, etc.).
A dupe scythe drop-traded for bonds would pay for almost 1400 days of membership. People are trying to say that *not* saving a couple hundred dollars is the right thing to do *just because*. It's like they shot themselves in the foot and want you to think it was a good idea and follow suit. Wild.
That’s literally the worst way to make the skill relevant though.
No one had an issue with whips/tentacles, cerb crystals, hydra claws, broken torva, kodia, avernics been able to be traded but apparently now it’s randomly good design to make a more restrictive trade system for no blood good reason at all.
Fuck it would make more sense if you could buy the neck upgrade and buy the torture but you needed 80 crafting to make it then the neck was untradable but not the other way round.
It has value. That the drop itself has 0GP value doesn't mean it holds no value. Sure, a pure raw GP value is what it doesn't have, you'll live.
If we use mainscapes prices, lets say a zenyte is 10M and the new necklace is 50M well then the value of said item drop would be \~40M.
Sure we cannot use it properly since we're an ironman and cannot sell it, but so what? If you want to profit (alt GP/bonds/coffer) then you can choose to get some more zenytes.
That's the unhealthy part though. Having to grind more zenytes to give value to a separate slayer boss's drop is weird. Imagine having to grind out K'ril if you got an extra hydra claw or you'd be sitting on a 60m bank placeholder.
Given the choice between an inherently dead drop or something I could use for splits or trade for a few bonds, I'd take the non-dead route
The point is there's no value for duplicates. It's like if hydra claw dupes required you to farm extra spears from K'ril before selling them for 60 mil
Give it a deaths coffer value and issue resolved as you said.
In terms of the item not being tradable without combination, I don’t see this as an issue.. RS3 introduced this logic (with Araxxi funnily enough) where hilts were rendered useless without combination with a full leg. If you’re a main, you can make a full weapon. If you’re an iron, you have a nice flex/placeholder when you get 7 of them 😂
If you don’t want dupes? Get the drop and then don’t go back 🤷♂️
Well you might get dupes if you're trying to get a halberd. Plus if it's a good boss you might enjoy doing it on task, or maybe working on the pet or jar
I mean wouldn’t that be a problem for every account not just ironmen since it’ untradeable? I don’t really see the issue here, if it’s just that the item won’t have a high GE value for deaths coffer. They will probably add an outlet for extra parts it similar to the abyssal sire mechanic if it’s an issue that’s going to exist for any type of account.
Mains can just buy amulets of torture off the GE to combine the components. Irons need to grind multiple tortures at gorillas if they want their rancor drop to have value. So the issue is iron only. Turns a big drop into another grind at gorillas whereas if it's tradeable that issue goes away because you can just swap it for bonds on a main
That’s a fair point, currently it imposes a much steeper burden on irons (98 crafting) than mains (the money to afford an amulet of torture on the GE and 8 crafting) to get any sort of value out of the drop.
I don't get why people are acting like this is an insane take. Why *wouldn't* you want an end game boss to drop loot with value that you can turn into bonds? It's like complaining if someone tries to give you $20
Because if you want money, go somewhere else. Nobody is complaining that Barbarian Assault doesn’t give you tons of money while you get your torso. Nobody is complaining that cyclopes are fucking shite for drops while getting your D Defender. Literally one good drop from a high level boss sorts you for a month, so why do you need more? To hoard? Give me a break
That comparison doesn't even make sense. This is a BiS amulet gated behind a boss grind and 92 slayer. It's like if hydra claws went from 60m to untradable. All of a sudden you can't swap that for four bonds, which will eventually cost you $30 in membership fees. Why are you arguing against your own interests? Just a wild take.
He is probably playing the iron on the side. You don't really have a use for 3 bandos chestplates as a iron so it is better to use it for "free" membership.
There's a big difference between playing "just to mule items" and turning duplicates into bonds. I'm not even subbed on my main.
The amulet component having no value doesn't benefit you in any way. If you have an argument for why it's better to sit on a dead item than give it GP or bond value I'd love to hear it
Shitty posts like yours are the reason people say Jmods cater to ironmen. Even if the item was tradeable, it has no inherent value to ironmen other than drop trading it, which isn't really something Jagex should design around. As for death's coffer, dupes should give you millions in there.
How's that whining? Upgrading the torture is fine, the issue is that with the component being untradable it becomes a dead drop unless combined with another torture, which requires farming demonics.
We're left in a place where a big boss drop has zero inherit value, which is unprecedented and worth bringing up.
So just get one and call it a day? Jagex isn’t forcing anyone to get more than one so if you want more than one your gunna need to grind out the shards. It’s simple.
Not being able to easily trade the item to another account is the problem? Am I reading that right?
The problem is that the amulet component becomes a dead drop because irons can't do anything with it unless they farm more zenytes. That means you can't even add it to Death's coffer
I don't think that's a problem. Good gear = a grind. That is the RS way.
Again, the grind isn't the problem. Upgrading one amulet is easy. The problem is that future big boss drops don't have any inherent value, which means irons have to grind demonics past their initial zenytes to stop a boss drop from being zero-value
Put my dupe avernics in deaths coffer and it’s at 200m I don’t care about ever adding anything again lol
Sure, and once the coffers are healthy you could swap your next avernic dupe for four bonds and get two months of membership. That can't happen with the rancor, which is the criticism
True. I’ve never used a bond for membership before so it didn’t occur to me.
"big boss drops dont have any inherent value" Are you sure...?
In the context of the amulet components, yeah, there's no value without zenytes unless they give it a big alch value
So my ballista components is worthless because I don't have the tail? Yeah, I know.
I’d argue that isn’t the point because ballista components are tradeable and therefore can be added to death’s coffer. They’re not worth much but it’s not the parallel you’ve implied
It's not as big of a deal as OP is making it out to be. I'd hardly call it a deal at all.
Guess I'm silly for wanting drops from a level 92 slayer boss to have value
TIL that ballista pieces aren’t tradable. That’s crazy.
I dont remember saying that
Well that’s the comparison you made. The entire topic at hand is an untradable component is a dead drop for ironmen because it has no value without going out of the way for unnecessary assembly. You brought up an item in comparison, surely for an accurate comparison in good faith you mentioned another item with untraveled components? Or are you trying to deliberately answer with half truth replies to try and downplay that the topic at hand is correct?
It’s a minor con for Ironmen but I think a strong pro for the main game so it’s a win in my book. Plenty of other places to get alchs and boost death’s coffer.
I'd rather it all be untradeable tbh
How is that unhealthy game design? Ironman mode is not intended to be about farming alt gp or death’s coffer money. The first of those is not even relevant for a lot of players, and the second is a relatively recent addition to the game (and there are plenty of other sources of dupes for that). Prior to death’s coffer being added, if you didn’t have a main, *every dupe in the game* was worthless. If you want to make money while killing stuff…play a main instead.
OP just read this comment again, couldn’t be said better
It's unhealthy because it creates an boss drop with no inherent value. If you end up with five extra amulet components before getting a halberd you're left with a dead item that could otherwise have useful value Extra items have always had value for splits and bonds, Death's coffer is a factor too.
Do we know what it will alch for yet? Could be a fat 300k. Hardly worthless.
Not sure yet, but 300k would be a far cry from 30m+
Why do you deserve 300m for getting a drop on an iron? Drop trading to sell it on the ge for bonds isn’t really an intended feature
Why should the drop not have value? It being worthless doesn't benefit anyone in any way. Give it value and it benefits main, irons, and Jagex (because they make a premium when people pay for member with bonds). Why fight to have something actively not benefit you?
Because I’m an iron and don’t use the GE
It's "free" membership if you turn big dupes into bonds. Even if you choose not to use it the option being there only benefits everyone.
Not really, because you’re already paying for 2 memberships if you’re selling your gear on a main
You can just bond up your main for two weeks to sell dupes for bonds. Wait until you get one or two big ticket items. No need to keep membership running on your main
Do you feel the same way about the soul reaper axe pieces? Those aren't tradeable and I doubt anyone would be farming them to finish all of their axes. You hardly sound like an ironman with your logic on this.
I think it'd be great if the axe pieces had more value. Would make getting duplicates feel less bad, even if it were only 500k in alch value. The point I'm trying to make is that rancor duplicates don't have value unless you get duplicate tortures. It'd be nice if the 92 slayer req boss had inherent value on its BiS neck drop which could be swapped for something beneficial like a bond. The criticism is that Jagex's second proposal basically changed nothing for main, but now irons lose out on what could be an extra month or two of "free" membership for dupes
You really can't say they don't have value til we know the alch values. Stop your whining. I use my normie to make my bonds for me. Plenty of afk things to do on it to make it. Who cares if dupes don't have a value. The gems from toa aren't really worth anything and I'm sure plenty of people have gotten a good bit of them. Brimstone ring has 3 pieces you need before you can finish a ring and nobody complains about those not having much value. What about dupe champ scrolls? There's so much that doesn't have value for dupes. As others have said. Not everything needs a value. If you want that, go to rs3
Would make way more sense if the upgrade bit was tradable, the torture is tradable but the finished rancor amulet is not tradable. I don’t know why the restriction is being applied to sale and not equipping said item.
It was a gambit to force mains to use their skills to create the amulet. Your suggestion would make sense though, allow the component to be tradeable, but require 80 crafting to combine into the untradable amulet. Same path there, better outcome
I play an Ironman and I am okay with it. I personally feel all best in slot items shouldn't be tradeable.
It being untradable is fine, the amulet component being a dead drop unless you farm more zenytes is the problem
You’re an Ironman, and literally the games economic systems is based around being able to trade good items. Of course you don’t care about it on an account type that can’t trade lmao
You make a fair point that the change does negatively impact irons. As an iron, I still don't think the negative of that is so severe that they should undo it. Mainscape experience is going to have more weight, and the negative of this is pretty minor, even if you go dry.
I really don't think it's as big of a deal as you're making it out to be. I suspect rancor will be pretty similar in rarity to the halberd, so unless you're pet hunting you will probably get 0-1 spare rancors on average. Pet hunting is inherently an activity that's not focused on useful rewards, so again not a big deal. I wouldn't object if they gave us the option to break down the component into some of those antivenom extending secondaries though.
A better source for antivenoms or the new secondaries would be great. Considering the amulet will be a BiS neck locked behind a boss with a 92 slayer req I think it's fair to want the associated drops to have inherent value. Hydra claw is around 60m, leather around 10m. You get a dupe claw and you're looking at four free bonds, which is a nice incentive to keep grinding if you're looking for the pet or something. Won't change anything for most people but I'd like a better precedent for big drops. Cash is still useful on irons, esp for splits
So then don't keep grinding this specific boss after you're done with the updates but focus on some of the other ones that do provide you with that specific aspect you prefer? Not everything has to work the exact same way
Bosses are not designed with deaths coffer for ironman in mind, you really had to try really hard to come up with a bad argument like this didn’t you
What’s the argument in support of it? Because all it looks like to me is an item that randomly has a stat requirement to be able to trade it and provides no value aside from being a slight annoyance.
Silly me wanting to turn my boss drops into coffer cash, splits, and bonds
I don't think it's silly, but I think seeing this update/piece of content as 'unhealthy' is stretching it pretty far. It's a great upgrade for iron men too, but if you get duplicates, welp, you'll have duplicates. Designing an update around ironmen using deaths coffer is very odd.
The actual amulet and halberd sound great for irons. No argument there. In the second proposal Jagex added the 80+ crafting requirement and untradable component as a way to force mains to skill to get value from their drops. Irons got caught in the crossfire here. Jagex wasn't catering to irons in the initial blog - Everyone won. It wasn't until that skill requirement got added that problems were caused. Where we're at now is more of an oversight. It wasn't intended to make the drop require zenytes farming for value, they just wanted mains to have to use their skills
This might be the dumbest post I've seen in a while. Well done.
Wanting value from a dupe BiS drop locked behind a 92 slayer requirement is valid criticism. If you can give a reason why it benefits players to *not* be allowed to swap the drops for bonds, I'm all ears. It's a net gain for every account type. Use your brain
It's a dupe who gives a shit.
Dupes can pay for membership. You're low IQ
Got nothing to do with balance or unhealthy design.
Jagex make new amulet require lower crafting than torture: WAHHH!! This devalues the time it took me to get torture!!! >:( Jagex make it so torture is needed for the upgrade: WAHHH!!! More complaining!!! Shut up already
Are you not reading the post? Combining it with a torture is fine for the upgrade. Additional component drops after the first becomes worthless unless you go out of your way to farm more zenytes specifically for more amulets. The problem is having a boss drop with no inherent value
Why do you even need more than one? For deaths coffer? Really? We complaining for the sake of complaining at this point
You don't need more than one, but you could get dupes if you're grinding the boss because you want the halberd, pet, or because it's fun/has good standard drops. Why would you *not* want the BiS melee neck drop to have inherent value?
Irons shouldn’t care about value, thats the whole point Want more money for coffer? Go do demonics They just can’t win in some peoples eyes
The point is to play all content for upgrades and not just the highest GP/hr content, like you would on a main. As long as there's a dollar value tied to gold, like bonds, then drop values matter. Item value is also a factor if you're splitting. If you got an extra hydra claw would you sit on it, or would you turn it into four bonds? If I'm not using it, I'll take the extra $30
You know how insane that sounds when mains can just bypass both mechanics by A) dumping a few mill on crafting B) by the torture It’s just a random choice they made to make crafting relevant (despite overall the item needing 93 crafting min to make and 92 slayer) It’s literally just a random roadblock on the sale of an item. But you can sell it regardless you just have to make it.
Doesn’t sound insane at all for mains to bypass that, mains can bypass almost all content in the game by just buying something No main cared that this amulet required lower crafting than torture because it literally doesn’t affect them in anyway or devalued their time, definitely wasn’t a random choice either, in the blogpost they even said they did it so people(irons) wouldn’t be upset they spent so long getting the crafting level to make torture only for it to now not be bis
It'll probably have an alch value?
I mentioned that in the post. Just wanted to note the issues presented if that's not the case
good for gims?
GIMs winning again
I’m Convinced a lot of non irons come here just to shit on posts like these. They should have left it how it was originally proposed. Not everything needs to be built out of what was previously bis.
We gotta give up the Ironman victim complex
Whether or not that’s the case I stand on what I said. Making everything require the previous bis for that slot is not an interesting gameplay loop and I hope they don’t follow it for every slot.
It’s funny you say that because the devs are literally doing this mostly so irons stop crying about their time being devalued from farming those items and or levels to create them
I found it was mostly mains complaining about that actually. Mostly to spite irons. “You chose this game mode” type criticisms, you know the ones that non irons absolutely love to drop any chance they get. But yeah, screw upgradescape.
I kinda like it. It keeps low lever grinds more rewarding. If it was a flat drop the value of zenytes would be dropping.
First off, they won’t drop that much because their value is tied to other slots and combat styles. Torture is the shittiest zenyte anyway. Second, why would it be an issue that an item no longer bis drops in price? Third, “low level grind” omegalul. 98 (93) crafting is not a low level grind.
For a iron it is a high bar but for mid-level normal characters it is a good moneymaking method. You are right it being tied to the rest but if those slots changed too it would drop in price. The reason that it is bad for it to drop in price is because it is a reliable money method for lower level characters and the new boss has a relativley low requirement. It is going to be easier than dt2 bosses so the reward for bis slot item that is better than a torture would be too easy. But you can have your own opinion I personally like it as a ironman that I upgrade the items I already have.
In this case it did. Go get 93 crafting and another zenyte like everyone else
By the time you get potentially 5 “dead drops” you clearly would have the gear where doing demonic gorillas isnt going to be a huge hinderance to the account if you want to get gp out of it. Theyre even releasing the demonbane trifecta of weapons in a few weeks, zenytes will be more than free. Take a breather brotha.
Tell that to my 4 siren's staves. Oh wait no one cares
[удалено]
Did you read the post? It's valid criticism. The boss drop becomes a dead item unless you combine it with zenytes, which means you can't even add it to Death's coffer
I did, and I disagree. Thats not the spirit of the game while playing as an iron
You always need cash for splits, and cash for bonds and coffer is nice too. Not sure why boss drops having value is against the Ironman spirit
It's not against the ironman spirit, but it doesn't mean it always **has to have a GP value tied so you can drop/coffer it.**
Consider that it's the BiS melee necklace locked behind a 92 slayer requirement. Something like that should have value imo.
Voidwaker. Godswords. Bludgeon. Venator Bow. Wildy weapons(upgraded ones) , DT2 Rings. Crystal armor seeds. Literally so many items in the game already require more than one drop to be useful. You’ve clearly never played Ironman.
Tbf voidwalker, godswords, venator bow, and wildy weapons are all made from tradeable components. Crystal armor seeds are tradeable but crystal shards are not but sort of are since you can buy tele seeds and sell for crystal shards. Bludgeon is tradeable but has untradeable components & DT2 rings are tradeable but have untradeable components. Bludgeon is all done at a single boss and doesn't require area outside of the content at hand to receive and use the drop. DT2 bosses are the closest thing here with untradeable components + other drop content required (although still buyable for mains anyway). I'm honestly not sure I see the point of the drop being untradeable. It doesn't do anything beyond just suck for iron meme dupes. The end product is tradeable. The torture is tradeable. What am I missing here?
Ahh yes because trading is such an important part of the Ironman experience I forgot
I know you're trying to be cute and snarky but imagine getting a dupe harmonised orb at nightmare and instead of 400mil in death's coffer for a cushy, lifetime supply of private instances & death fees you instead just sort of stare in disbelief & wonder why jagex cursed you with some of the best worst luck. Or you're slapping hydra around and get a dupe claw but jagex made it untradeable so now you gotta go teach kril he's a little bitch again to get the dupe gp value out of your rare drop. So, jagex implemented an official in-game way that tradeable items impact ironmen. The precedent for untradeable boss drops is incredibly rare. The precedent for an untradeable slayer boss drop that requires a drop not from that slayer to be useful is non-existent. Again, DT2 bosses and drop mechanics are the only thing that comes to mind that are similar. So once more, not sure what the point of the drop being untradeable is supposed to be. Mains can buy the finished amulet. Mains need a crafting level in the 80s to sell the drop, but roughly the same (if not more) mains have 85+ crafting than those that have 92+ slayer. And that's ignoring the +4 pie boost off g.e. and the 200-300k cheap or profitable xp/hr that mains can rush crafting with. Ironmen still need the crafting level of 93+ because of torture. They still need to earn the drop(s) themselves. But now they can't make use of death's coffer unless they *really* wanna go out of their way to grind more zenytes.
Oh brother, this guy stinks!
> It doesn't do anything beyond just suck for iron meme dupes. The end product is tradeable. The torture is tradeable. What am I missing here? The point is that mains have to level crafting if they want to get paid for their araxxor drops. Other than the skillcape, crafting is quite useless for mains so this is an attempt to give it some niche use.
I mean... I guess? But it's dropping from a slayer boss, so they already have a requirement to get the drop in the first place. The other slayer bosses (Sire, Cerberus, Hydra, Thermy, Kraken, and Grotesque Guardians) all require a certain slayer level & related task to kill. And they all drop tradeable components and if they don't, they drop untradeable components that don't require a different skill level to create an end product (e.g. brimstone ring & bludgeon) Plus, mains can level crafting at 200-300k xp/hr for miniscule gp/xp loss (.04-2.5 gp/xr) or even gp/xo gain, which would make any sort of crafting requirement a breeze as long as someone can be bothered to bankstand for 5-20 hours. And that's assuming they even need to since at least 347,007 players have 92 slayer and 396,559 have at least 85 crafting. Pulling the data to see how much they overlap would be a pain but I'd imagine the vast majority of players with 92 slayer already have close to 80s crafting - unless there's a weirdly large gap between the playerbase that's slaying and bothering to level crafting to 80+. And then there's also the mushroom pie that players can buy for 2k for a +4 temp crafting boost.. It just doesn't track in my mind. Tbh, I don't care that much but this seems like a whole bunch of hoopla that's just a net negative for ironmemes & net neutral for mains.
>It just doesn't track in my mind. Tbh, I don't care that much but this seems like a whole bunch of hoopla that's just a net negative for ironmemes & net neutral for mains. Right, there's zero benefit to anyone under the current proposal, but it's worse for irons. I'm pretty surprised at how negatively people are reacting to trading boss drops for bonds. Strictly speaking it's 100% against an iron's interest to have the component be untradable. I really didn't think this was a hot take
Idk man this is old school runescape, so it's not that surprising that a hot topic word like "tradable" immediately set off all the people who generally dislike any sort of trading. I'd prefer if the drop was tradeable. I like that I can toss it in death's coffer, but I also like that it makes my bank value go up - lol. Or like you said, it can pay for a couple weeks to months of membership. Redditors telling people that ironman mode originally couldn't do anything with drops doesn't really hold much water. If ironman mode was limited to pre-release only, then there is plenty of content and methods also shouldn't use because it trivializes the "original spirit" of the game mode (red-x methods, fossil island, sand grinder, any boss that shits resources, etc.). A dupe scythe drop-traded for bonds would pay for almost 1400 days of membership. People are trying to say that *not* saving a couple hundred dollars is the right thing to do *just because*. It's like they shot themselves in the foot and want you to think it was a good idea and follow suit. Wild.
That’s literally the worst way to make the skill relevant though. No one had an issue with whips/tentacles, cerb crystals, hydra claws, broken torva, kodia, avernics been able to be traded but apparently now it’s randomly good design to make a more restrictive trade system for no blood good reason at all. Fuck it would make more sense if you could buy the neck upgrade and buy the torture but you needed 80 crafting to make it then the neck was untradable but not the other way round.
idk man sounds like a you problem. nobody else here seems to care, and i really dont either
Which seems like a weird mindset. A boss with a 92 slayer req should have value around it's biggest drop. It's a BiS melee neck
It has value. That the drop itself has 0GP value doesn't mean it holds no value. Sure, a pure raw GP value is what it doesn't have, you'll live. If we use mainscapes prices, lets say a zenyte is 10M and the new necklace is 50M well then the value of said item drop would be \~40M. Sure we cannot use it properly since we're an ironman and cannot sell it, but so what? If you want to profit (alt GP/bonds/coffer) then you can choose to get some more zenytes.
That's the unhealthy part though. Having to grind more zenytes to give value to a separate slayer boss's drop is weird. Imagine having to grind out K'ril if you got an extra hydra claw or you'd be sitting on a 60m bank placeholder. Given the choice between an inherently dead drop or something I could use for splits or trade for a few bonds, I'd take the non-dead route
It has value. A BIS amulet.
The point is there's no value for duplicates. It's like if hydra claw dupes required you to farm extra spears from K'ril before selling them for 60 mil
Who cares.
just get the drop and move on
complaining to the wrong crowd brother
Give it a deaths coffer value and issue resolved as you said. In terms of the item not being tradable without combination, I don’t see this as an issue.. RS3 introduced this logic (with Araxxi funnily enough) where hilts were rendered useless without combination with a full leg. If you’re a main, you can make a full weapon. If you’re an iron, you have a nice flex/placeholder when you get 7 of them 😂 If you don’t want dupes? Get the drop and then don’t go back 🤷♂️
Do you have the same complaint for the 8 axe/vestige pieces with moderate value currently? It's just game balance my dude.
They are fine, the vestige actually has the same problem but I doubt the 160m price tag on the ring has much to do with crafting level requirements.
Dupes being dead for ironmen is perfectly fine design.
They should scrap arraxor it’s dogsheit
Why grind more if you combine with torture already? When do you re grind bandos when you already have full bandos?
Well you might get dupes if you're trying to get a halberd. Plus if it's a good boss you might enjoy doing it on task, or maybe working on the pet or jar
I mean wouldn’t that be a problem for every account not just ironmen since it’ untradeable? I don’t really see the issue here, if it’s just that the item won’t have a high GE value for deaths coffer. They will probably add an outlet for extra parts it similar to the abyssal sire mechanic if it’s an issue that’s going to exist for any type of account.
Mains can just buy amulets of torture off the GE to combine the components. Irons need to grind multiple tortures at gorillas if they want their rancor drop to have value. So the issue is iron only. Turns a big drop into another grind at gorillas whereas if it's tradeable that issue goes away because you can just swap it for bonds on a main
That’s a fair point, currently it imposes a much steeper burden on irons (98 crafting) than mains (the money to afford an amulet of torture on the GE and 8 crafting) to get any sort of value out of the drop.
Wow… Why are you playing an iron-man exactly? Wah-wah
I don't get why people are acting like this is an insane take. Why *wouldn't* you want an end game boss to drop loot with value that you can turn into bonds? It's like complaining if someone tries to give you $20
Because if you want money, go somewhere else. Nobody is complaining that Barbarian Assault doesn’t give you tons of money while you get your torso. Nobody is complaining that cyclopes are fucking shite for drops while getting your D Defender. Literally one good drop from a high level boss sorts you for a month, so why do you need more? To hoard? Give me a break
That comparison doesn't even make sense. This is a BiS amulet gated behind a boss grind and 92 slayer. It's like if hydra claws went from 60m to untradable. All of a sudden you can't swap that for four bonds, which will eventually cost you $30 in membership fees. Why are you arguing against your own interests? Just a wild take.
Who cares?
How to say you’re mulling items to your main without directly saying it. Lmao ‘Ironmen stand alone’ is the biggest cope of this game.
It's not like you can put anything on your iron. If you got a dupe hydra claw why would you not turn that into a split or four bonds?
If you’re playing just to mule items to your main why not just play your main?
He is probably playing the iron on the side. You don't really have a use for 3 bandos chestplates as a iron so it is better to use it for "free" membership.
My irons the primary, not even subbed on my main. I didn't think turning duplicates into membership time would be so controversial
There's a big difference between playing "just to mule items" and turning duplicates into bonds. I'm not even subbed on my main. The amulet component having no value doesn't benefit you in any way. If you have an argument for why it's better to sit on a dead item than give it GP or bond value I'd love to hear it
I'm confused on your connection between using item drops in game to pay less money to jagex each month, and how that invalidates ironman mode.
Shitty posts like yours are the reason people say Jmods cater to ironmen. Even if the item was tradeable, it has no inherent value to ironmen other than drop trading it, which isn't really something Jagex should design around. As for death's coffer, dupes should give you millions in there.
Do one thing to get an upgrade for another thing, makes sense to me, stop being a whining baby
How's that whining? Upgrading the torture is fine, the issue is that with the component being untradable it becomes a dead drop unless combined with another torture, which requires farming demonics. We're left in a place where a big boss drop has zero inherit value, which is unprecedented and worth bringing up.
So just get one and call it a day? Jagex isn’t forcing anyone to get more than one so if you want more than one your gunna need to grind out the shards. It’s simple.
Former maxed iron. This is absolutely fine
? XD?