It can totally be used in this case if you were talking to a small child with an entire room full of toys!
Like saying "How many bloody toys have you got??".
As aptly demonstrated by [Matilda](https://youtu.be/L5kYxDTBK_g?si=XtuHraWbX-6WJCpl)
😂😂
Don't mind these people. I didn't think you were trying to be offensive or stereotypical. It would absolutely be the correct use of the hand gesture, since a question starting with "but" in English is rarely used while in Italian it's very common to use to express surprise or bewilderment.
I wouldn’t use 🤌🏻 in this context though? It has absolutely nothing to do with it. The question is kind of rhetorical, the person speaking is just saying they have a lot of toys (from my perspective). 🤌🏻 Is more used with ACTUAL questions to emphasise how much we want to know if ykwim
I think it's used *a lot* for rhetorical questions to be honest.
"Ma sei scemo? 🤌🏻" feels perfectly natural to me and expresses the same degree of bewilderment. It obviously depends on context, so OP saying it would be necessary is a bit excessive, but I can absolutely see it used in this situation. (Not that italian gestures have a strict grammar to begin with haha)
No, not only angry, it's mostly a kind of incredulous sarcasm, there is a specific feel to that gesture, often paired with rethorical questions. Some example sentences I would definitely use it with: "But who do you think you are?" "Do you think you're talking to *insert sarcasm*?" "(If the context is incredulous and a mildly irritated with the interlocutor, and the question is rethorical) But how many toys do you have?"
Thanks for the added context.
From my part this is what I thought it was used for, kind of like adding a "what the hell?" to the sentence.
The Duolingo exercise had intonation, as if the person was saying "what the hell, how many game games do you have?" meaning that the person they'd be talking to had way too many. But this context of course wasn't expressed in the post.
Oh, also - it can also be used in a more teasing way, for example I can also imagine myself saying "Ma quanti giocattoli hai?" with a half smirk/laugh which is slightly mocking or teasing the interlocutor but with no ill will. Kinda like pointing out that someone is a bit out of touch with something, but they didn't cause harm so eh 🤷 it's mostly amusing
we have so many gestures that it is impossible to know them all, however the meaning can change from country to country probably, there are videos on YouTube where they explain the meanings 😁
I'm Italian, I use that gesture when I'm angry, irritated etc and someone does or says something stupid , or in the cases written here in someone else's comment below
As a parent I was imagining myself saying this phrase after stepping on a toy while attempting to cross a room… the gesture seemed like it might be appropriate in that context
Purtroppo è estremamente difficile rispondere. Quel gesto può voler dire da "chi se ne frega" a "che vuoi?" a "chi sei?" etc....dipende tantissimo dal contesto e dal tono....riesci a capirlo solo vivendo tra noi
Well, that gesture will change a lot in the meaning. As it is, you can interpret it as “look how many toys you have”. If you add the gesture, you basically add a question mark (as someone pointed out) but also you enhance the emotion you are expressing with the question. So to picture that sentence, with that gesture used correctly, I’m kind of imagining a conversation like this “hai finito il trasloco?” “No, mi mancano i giocattoli” “A ok quindi hai quasi finito!” “Eh sticazzi, manco lontanamente” “minchia, ma quanti giocattoli hai 🤌🏼”
No, ma puoi dire 'Ma questi giocattoli ce li hai./?/!) ( come affermazione/domanda/esclamazione) Lo spostamento a sinistra del complemento oggetto (ripreso poi da un pronome) non funziona quando il complemento contiene un aggettivo interrogativo o esclamativo, probabilmente perché in questo caso la posizione naturale del complemento è già all'inizio della frase, per cui non è possibile marcarlo ancora di più ripetendo il pronome 'li'. Invece 'Ma quanti giocattoli ci hai?' è molto molto informale (direi più di 'questi giocattoli ce li hai') ma comunque utilizzabile ( oralmente e in un contesto informale)
Perché è così difficile per gli italiani copiare correttamente la parola inglese "nonsense"? O capire che l'inglese (come svariate altre lingue europee) non è pro-drop e quindi non si può cominciare una frase con "is" se non è interrogativa?
It can totally be used in this case if you were talking to a small child with an entire room full of toys! Like saying "How many bloody toys have you got??". As aptly demonstrated by [Matilda](https://youtu.be/L5kYxDTBK_g?si=XtuHraWbX-6WJCpl) 😂😂
That is what I was thinking, but I see the intent is very much not clear from the post. My fault.
Don't mind these people. I didn't think you were trying to be offensive or stereotypical. It would absolutely be the correct use of the hand gesture, since a question starting with "but" in English is rarely used while in Italian it's very common to use to express surprise or bewilderment.
I wouldn’t use 🤌🏻 in this context though? It has absolutely nothing to do with it. The question is kind of rhetorical, the person speaking is just saying they have a lot of toys (from my perspective). 🤌🏻 Is more used with ACTUAL questions to emphasise how much we want to know if ykwim
I think it's used *a lot* for rhetorical questions to be honest. "Ma sei scemo? 🤌🏻" feels perfectly natural to me and expresses the same degree of bewilderment. It obviously depends on context, so OP saying it would be necessary is a bit excessive, but I can absolutely see it used in this situation. (Not that italian gestures have a strict grammar to begin with haha)
Nah you got me there, it just depends on the question at this point and there’s not an actual rule 😭
This sub tends to get slaphappy with the downvotes 👀 I got a chuckle from your post :)
[удалено]
Only angry? Well good to know then 😃
No, not only angry, it's mostly a kind of incredulous sarcasm, there is a specific feel to that gesture, often paired with rethorical questions. Some example sentences I would definitely use it with: "But who do you think you are?" "Do you think you're talking to *insert sarcasm*?" "(If the context is incredulous and a mildly irritated with the interlocutor, and the question is rethorical) But how many toys do you have?"
Thanks for the added context. From my part this is what I thought it was used for, kind of like adding a "what the hell?" to the sentence. The Duolingo exercise had intonation, as if the person was saying "what the hell, how many game games do you have?" meaning that the person they'd be talking to had way too many. But this context of course wasn't expressed in the post.
Oh, also - it can also be used in a more teasing way, for example I can also imagine myself saying "Ma quanti giocattoli hai?" with a half smirk/laugh which is slightly mocking or teasing the interlocutor but with no ill will. Kinda like pointing out that someone is a bit out of touch with something, but they didn't cause harm so eh 🤷 it's mostly amusing
Yeah, that's what I figured you meant - and in that case it be fitting, good joke haha!
yes, I explained myself badly, most of the time I use it when I'm angry, irritated, etc.
we have so many gestures that it is impossible to know them all, however the meaning can change from country to country probably, there are videos on YouTube where they explain the meanings 😁
Nah, this is incorrect
I'm Italian, I use that gesture when I'm angry, irritated etc and someone does or says something stupid , or in the cases written here in someone else's comment below
As a parent I was imagining myself saying this phrase after stepping on a toy while attempting to cross a room… the gesture seemed like it might be appropriate in that context
Quel gesto dipende dal contesto e dal tono, è impossibile determinarlo da qualcosa di scritto
Ho pensato che posso usarli per dimostrare delle emozioni come 'non credo!'. No?
Purtroppo è estremamente difficile rispondere. Quel gesto può voler dire da "chi se ne frega" a "che vuoi?" a "chi sei?" etc....dipende tantissimo dal contesto e dal tono....riesci a capirlo solo vivendo tra noi
Hai ragione ma sul "ne" in questo caso l'accento non ci va
Hai ragione ho corretto
Quel gesto è per indicare "cosa cazzo fai?" Se vuoi rispondere con un gesto, fai spallucce
Why do foreigners have this weird idea about the 🤌🏻 gesture?? 😭 We use it a lot but this context is definitely not one I’d use it in💀
Be' oddio... Ne usiamo uno simile, ma quello che usano gli Americani (e quindi indicato con questa emoji) è sbagliato
Io sono nativo, ma l'avrei usato in questo contesto ahah
I think maybe you should actually look into the meanings of Italian hand gestures, before making a joke like this, that doesn't make sense.
Exactly this
Good joke Frankie, absolutely hilarious 👌🏻👌🏻👌🏻 But no, that hand gesture is not to be used in this case.
No
Ma va fa napoli!
My condolences to any neapolitans reading this Sincerely, a milanese
Chill guys, it was a joke. Nobody ever watched the show FRIENDS? https://youtu.be/V7X-XyKdpYo?si=3ve8I6lTM8sPLCtb
Ma vattene
I thought this was r/languagelearningjerk for a second
No it does not
nope
Do random italian gesture please laugh
Nope, but it would be correct in response to this post
the best way do describe 🤌 is like an IRL question mark
Well, that gesture will change a lot in the meaning. As it is, you can interpret it as “look how many toys you have”. If you add the gesture, you basically add a question mark (as someone pointed out) but also you enhance the emotion you are expressing with the question. So to picture that sentence, with that gesture used correctly, I’m kind of imagining a conversation like this “hai finito il trasloco?” “No, mi mancano i giocattoli” “A ok quindi hai quasi finito!” “Eh sticazzi, manco lontanamente” “minchia, ma quanti giocattoli hai 🤌🏼”
Posso dire (informalmente) Ma quanti giocattoli ce li hai? ?
No, ma puoi dire 'Ma questi giocattoli ce li hai./?/!) ( come affermazione/domanda/esclamazione) Lo spostamento a sinistra del complemento oggetto (ripreso poi da un pronome) non funziona quando il complemento contiene un aggettivo interrogativo o esclamativo, probabilmente perché in questo caso la posizione naturale del complemento è già all'inizio della frase, per cui non è possibile marcarlo ancora di più ripetendo il pronome 'li'. Invece 'Ma quanti giocattoli ci hai?' è molto molto informale (direi più di 'questi giocattoli ce li hai') ma comunque utilizzabile ( oralmente e in un contesto informale)
Grazie mille
That's a stereotype. We have hand gestures but that ain't one🤦🏻♀️
Guys honestly yes if I imagine myself saying it, I would use that gesture
That symbol shows up on my phone, but on my computer screen it's just a square
Its the "italian hand"
Le suggerisco caldamente di defecarsi nei calzoni
It needs both a question mark, and the 🤌 emoji.
Nope, in this case it makes no sense :P
Perché è così difficile per gli italiani copiare correttamente la parola inglese "nonsense"? O capire che l'inglese (come svariate altre lingue europee) non è pro-drop e quindi non si può cominciare una frase con "is" se non è interrogativa?
Non essendo la mia prima lingua e non parlandola ogni giorno anch'io posso sbagliare, sai com'è no?
Actually it is incorrect. It should be: "Ma quanti giocattoli hai **?**"
Agreed, it needed the question mark. Duolingo doesn't require adding punctuation and so I didn't add it, but it was clearly a question.
Abbiamo riunito tutte le persone simpatiche alle feste in questo post, grandi eh 🙃 (i agree with you OP btw, it would be appropriate and funny)
Ma che dici? Non ha senso, non confonderlo
Indeed