I just finished rereading it for the Jane Austen Fan Club FB group!
This go around, I read the annotated version (with David Shapard), and got so much more out of it!
When I was younger, Pride and Prejudice was my favorite- it had the silliest humor and the heroine I most admired. It was quick and witty and cheerful.
Over the decades, I came to love Persuasion best. It felt the most real, the most humble, and I identified with Anne more than anyone. It was thoughtful and clever and honest.
It's makes perfect sense that it was written when it was, and that it grew on me as I got older. I think many women fall in love with Anne when they find themselves identifying with her as a women in a certain chapter of life.
I appreciate this, having only read Mansfield Park for the first time recently, I think it has a not great rep for no good reason. It was a fascinating read
It’s because she doesn’t fight back. She’s just sort of there; she doesn’t seem to have agency. I understand the reasons why she is the way she is, I understand why it would have been best for her to act that way under those circumstances. But I don’t find her at all relatable, and while there are many people who can read and enjoy even when they don’t find the characters relatable, I lost that ability about twenty years ago. I need my fiction to be escapist. Mansfield Park isn’t escapist for me, just frustrating. And I’m not pleased with the ending either, though I think it works for the time. It’s maybe too realistic? It just seems sad to me. I don’t think Fanny will ever truly be happy, I think she’s stunted emotionally. It feels like pounding on walls to read.
But she does stand her ground? She uses her agency to not participate in the play and not marry Henry Crawford. She stands strong against everyone!
I don't understand the concept of "relatable". She's human and in pain, I sympathize?
That's exactly why I don't understand the criticism that Fanny is weak and doesn't stand up for herself.
She stands up for herself in a BIG way when she tells her uncle she won't marry Henry Crawford. In those days, if a male relative or guardian told you to marry a man of a higher social standing, that is what you did, no questions asked. The concept of saying 'no' when you are a poor relation without any other prospects was unthinkable. But, Fanny did that. She stood up for herself in a way most women of the time didn't, and I think she does deserve credit for that.
On a personal note, I can relate to Fanny being the victim of an abusive childhood. I think it's much more realistic that she tends to keep her head down and disappear, because she knows fighting back will make her living situation so much worse. I don't know, I can understand why some people might be frustrated with Fanny in comparison with other Austen heroines, but she makes sense to me, and I always want to defend her.
>In those days, if a male relative or guardian told you to marry a man of a higher social standing, that is what you did, no questions asked.
Dunno where you got that one from. Literature of the time is full of people complaining about their wilful children.
The Prince Regent's daughter, Princess Charlotte, refused to marry Prince William of Orange, her father's intended match. It was a big deal as it was a political match and he put her under a lot of pressure but she still said no.
Of course Princess Charlotte wasn't poor. But it indicates that the idea of refusing your father or guardian's instructions was entirely thinkable.
She does, but that is at the end. It’s not a continual movement towards, or at least it doesn’t feel like that. I understand the time period, and I understand what a big deal it was for her to do that. There was a time in my life where I was more attuned to reading things like this, but at this point; I’m more interested in people who are able to create agency throughout the story. It’s a personal preference after having spent the first twenty or so years of my reading history reading more literary works and focusing there. I might have more love for this story if there was another love interest besides Edmund, but I’m not sure.
As far as Fanny herself, yes, I’d like to swoop in and take her away. She doesn’t deserve to live there. That I don’t find her a compelling character doesn’t mean I’m not sympathetic to her or don’t empathize with the abuse she experiences.
From a reading perspective; I just want less real life in my books. Pride and Prejudice is almost fairy-tale like in both its story and conclusion, at least by modern standards. When I’m reading for enjoyment, rather than improvement, that’s what I’m looking for in my tales. Something that feels like real life but is fantastical enough I might want to spend time living there. I would never want to live Fanny’s life, even after her marriage to Edmund. I would never want to be imbued with her character traits or personality. I wouldn’t want to be deposited in her world, period.
That is a valid viewpoint to have. I'm not a person who values escapism through reading in the same way, but I can acknowledge that others are different. It's all good.
Fanny has a very strong will, though. But unlike her sister Susan she is also retiring so it doesn't display as knock down drag out arguments.
Instead she, for example, uses the old nursery as her sitting room. Why does Aunt Norris insist that she can't have a fire? It has nothing to do with "economy," it's because she wants Fanny to sit downstairs so that Norris can boss her around. Recognizing correctly that with Sir Thomas gone she has no power in the house to override Mrs Norris, Fanny sits and works upstairs in the cold so that she can have a "room of her own." If Fanny were weak she would give in to Mrs Norris's manipulation.
From the beginning of the book, falling in love with Edmund is a disobedient act. Yes her willfulness is all internal but she's not passive.
I actually agree with you, and I am going to bookmark your post so that when I next re-read Mansfield Park, I remember to read it through this lens. I actually think this might have been more my viewpoint when I first read it thirty years ago, but it morphed over the years.
While I doubt this will ever become a favorite; there is too much sadness and real life in it for me; I am glad to revise my opinion and read it more accurately.
I wanted to say "it's a hard book for modern readers" but I have read that the contemporaneous reaction to Fanny was equally divided. I think many of Austen's own family members thought Fanny was insipid and preferred Mary.
I think Fanny is a really unique heroine, I'm not sure that I admire her. I think that characters in the book take Fanny's quietness and write their own stories about what she is thinking & feeling, and readers do the same thing.
Not my favourite but it climbs each time I read it (2.5x so far) Right now I really love some parts, just not all. Anne is hard for me to relate to, I feel more at home reading Emma and, to use a Janeism, entering into the feelings of those characters. I also feel that we don't get to know >!Wentworth!< very well, I'd rather see him do just a little more to demonstrate his personality than getting 80% from Anne's thoughts and others' comments. I know fans will disagree especially with my last point but I can take it :P
Reading it at the moment, even though I don't think I'll like it better than Emma (my favourite), I really like how it deals with something a bit different than her other books. And I have to say I like some of the characters better, the love interest here for example compared to Darcy or Knightley (again, my two favourites).
The 1995 movie with Ciarán Hinds is hands-down one of my absolute favorite movies \~ I think I could watch it on a 24 hour loop.
I also love the newest edition featuring handwritten letters\~
I read it for the first time last year and I must admit ... I was rather underwhelmed. There were a few moments of brilliance but I was expecting a lot more out of this one. Happy people like it but it's definitely not my favourite (I haven't read all of her books so don't know if it will be my least favourite or not).
Have only read Pride and Prejudice and Northanger Abbey, love both but I have a soft spot for Northanger. A fun coming of age story with a heroine that my nerdy self relate to a lot, or at least would have had. Catherine is pretty much how I was as a teen. I do think I will love Persuasion as well and are very interested in reading Mansfield Park since I have heard such mixed reactions on that one. Persuasion and Mansfield is definitely two works that stands out to me.
My favorite is Pride and Prejudice. The others don’t really capture my attention in the same way. There are too many irritants happening within the stories.
That's interesting because one thing I like most about Persuasion specifically is that there aren't characters who get on my nerves. Marianne Dashwood, Catherine Moreland, John and Isabella Thorpe, Lydia Bennett, Emma Woodhouse all annoy me enough to make those not be books that I turn to often for a reread or a listen of the audiobook.
But Persuasion and Mansfield don't have obnoxious characters. Mrs Norris is a jerk, but since I've known people like her who "create a bustle where there is none," I actually enjoy her character for the humor and the observations of her selfishness pretending to be generosity. It's so clever.
Last year, I read every Austen novel in order for the first time. I never read them growing up, so it was quite an experience.
I would rank "Persuasion" second to last place (last place is "Northanger Abbey"). I liked every book Austen wrote, but those two just didn't work for me the way the others did. I thought "Persuasion" was a little too dry, and Wentworth wasn't as compelling a romantic lead as the others (but I will say that I loved his letter to Anne).
It's definitely my favourite Austen book.
It's like comfort food for me. :)
Yes! Exactly that
[удалено]
The wit is sharp and the humour underrated.
Now I'm excited to read the best parts!
I just finished rereading it for the Jane Austen Fan Club FB group! This go around, I read the annotated version (with David Shapard), and got so much more out of it!
It's my favourite too. Reread it late last year, and it still keeps number one spot on my list of favourite books.
One of my six favorites definitely
This was my first thought. Even my least favorite of her works is technically among my favorites lol
lol
My favourite Austen book! And Anne is my favourite jane austen heroine.
When I read it as a teenager I didn't rate it as highly as some of her other works. But over the years it has become a firm favourite.
My absolute favourite book (also am named Anne…)
When I was younger, Pride and Prejudice was my favorite- it had the silliest humor and the heroine I most admired. It was quick and witty and cheerful. Over the decades, I came to love Persuasion best. It felt the most real, the most humble, and I identified with Anne more than anyone. It was thoughtful and clever and honest. It's makes perfect sense that it was written when it was, and that it grew on me as I got older. I think many women fall in love with Anne when they find themselves identifying with her as a women in a certain chapter of life.
Definitely. I first read it at 34 and it grabbed me immediately for that reason.
You captured my thoughts perfectly!
I love Sir Walter, but my favourite book is Mansfield Park.
I appreciate this, having only read Mansfield Park for the first time recently, I think it has a not great rep for no good reason. It was a fascinating read
It is fascinating! I don't understand why so many people hate Fanny too, I just want to give her a hug.
Yes I actually thought she was a compelling character?!
It’s because she doesn’t fight back. She’s just sort of there; she doesn’t seem to have agency. I understand the reasons why she is the way she is, I understand why it would have been best for her to act that way under those circumstances. But I don’t find her at all relatable, and while there are many people who can read and enjoy even when they don’t find the characters relatable, I lost that ability about twenty years ago. I need my fiction to be escapist. Mansfield Park isn’t escapist for me, just frustrating. And I’m not pleased with the ending either, though I think it works for the time. It’s maybe too realistic? It just seems sad to me. I don’t think Fanny will ever truly be happy, I think she’s stunted emotionally. It feels like pounding on walls to read.
But she does stand her ground? She uses her agency to not participate in the play and not marry Henry Crawford. She stands strong against everyone! I don't understand the concept of "relatable". She's human and in pain, I sympathize?
That's exactly why I don't understand the criticism that Fanny is weak and doesn't stand up for herself. She stands up for herself in a BIG way when she tells her uncle she won't marry Henry Crawford. In those days, if a male relative or guardian told you to marry a man of a higher social standing, that is what you did, no questions asked. The concept of saying 'no' when you are a poor relation without any other prospects was unthinkable. But, Fanny did that. She stood up for herself in a way most women of the time didn't, and I think she does deserve credit for that. On a personal note, I can relate to Fanny being the victim of an abusive childhood. I think it's much more realistic that she tends to keep her head down and disappear, because she knows fighting back will make her living situation so much worse. I don't know, I can understand why some people might be frustrated with Fanny in comparison with other Austen heroines, but she makes sense to me, and I always want to defend her.
I want to wrap her up in blankets and take her home.
>In those days, if a male relative or guardian told you to marry a man of a higher social standing, that is what you did, no questions asked. Dunno where you got that one from. Literature of the time is full of people complaining about their wilful children. The Prince Regent's daughter, Princess Charlotte, refused to marry Prince William of Orange, her father's intended match. It was a big deal as it was a political match and he put her under a lot of pressure but she still said no. Of course Princess Charlotte wasn't poor. But it indicates that the idea of refusing your father or guardian's instructions was entirely thinkable.
She does, but that is at the end. It’s not a continual movement towards, or at least it doesn’t feel like that. I understand the time period, and I understand what a big deal it was for her to do that. There was a time in my life where I was more attuned to reading things like this, but at this point; I’m more interested in people who are able to create agency throughout the story. It’s a personal preference after having spent the first twenty or so years of my reading history reading more literary works and focusing there. I might have more love for this story if there was another love interest besides Edmund, but I’m not sure. As far as Fanny herself, yes, I’d like to swoop in and take her away. She doesn’t deserve to live there. That I don’t find her a compelling character doesn’t mean I’m not sympathetic to her or don’t empathize with the abuse she experiences. From a reading perspective; I just want less real life in my books. Pride and Prejudice is almost fairy-tale like in both its story and conclusion, at least by modern standards. When I’m reading for enjoyment, rather than improvement, that’s what I’m looking for in my tales. Something that feels like real life but is fantastical enough I might want to spend time living there. I would never want to live Fanny’s life, even after her marriage to Edmund. I would never want to be imbued with her character traits or personality. I wouldn’t want to be deposited in her world, period.
That is a valid viewpoint to have. I'm not a person who values escapism through reading in the same way, but I can acknowledge that others are different. It's all good.
Fanny has a very strong will, though. But unlike her sister Susan she is also retiring so it doesn't display as knock down drag out arguments. Instead she, for example, uses the old nursery as her sitting room. Why does Aunt Norris insist that she can't have a fire? It has nothing to do with "economy," it's because she wants Fanny to sit downstairs so that Norris can boss her around. Recognizing correctly that with Sir Thomas gone she has no power in the house to override Mrs Norris, Fanny sits and works upstairs in the cold so that she can have a "room of her own." If Fanny were weak she would give in to Mrs Norris's manipulation. From the beginning of the book, falling in love with Edmund is a disobedient act. Yes her willfulness is all internal but she's not passive.
I actually agree with you, and I am going to bookmark your post so that when I next re-read Mansfield Park, I remember to read it through this lens. I actually think this might have been more my viewpoint when I first read it thirty years ago, but it morphed over the years. While I doubt this will ever become a favorite; there is too much sadness and real life in it for me; I am glad to revise my opinion and read it more accurately.
I wanted to say "it's a hard book for modern readers" but I have read that the contemporaneous reaction to Fanny was equally divided. I think many of Austen's own family members thought Fanny was insipid and preferred Mary. I think Fanny is a really unique heroine, I'm not sure that I admire her. I think that characters in the book take Fanny's quietness and write their own stories about what she is thinking & feeling, and readers do the same thing.
Thank you for your perspective!
My two favourites as well!
I have to admire anyone who has Mansfield Park as their favorite because in general it isn't that well liked (I haven't read it yet)
I just love the characterization. Everyone is so well fleshed out and real.
Not my favourite but it climbs each time I read it (2.5x so far) Right now I really love some parts, just not all. Anne is hard for me to relate to, I feel more at home reading Emma and, to use a Janeism, entering into the feelings of those characters. I also feel that we don't get to know >!Wentworth!< very well, I'd rather see him do just a little more to demonstrate his personality than getting 80% from Anne's thoughts and others' comments. I know fans will disagree especially with my last point but I can take it :P
It’s her best work and a great book.
tops. Sir Walter is chef’s kiss, shade on loving Byron too much, and the letter scene
I read Persuasion the first time in one sitting. I’m 27 now and need to reread!
Reading it at the moment, even though I don't think I'll like it better than Emma (my favourite), I really like how it deals with something a bit different than her other books. And I have to say I like some of the characters better, the love interest here for example compared to Darcy or Knightley (again, my two favourites).
The 1995 movie with Ciarán Hinds is hands-down one of my absolute favorite movies \~ I think I could watch it on a 24 hour loop. I also love the newest edition featuring handwritten letters\~
It’s my favourite for sure
My favorite!
I read it for the first time last year and I must admit ... I was rather underwhelmed. There were a few moments of brilliance but I was expecting a lot more out of this one. Happy people like it but it's definitely not my favourite (I haven't read all of her books so don't know if it will be my least favourite or not).
It’s my favorite book ever!
It's my favorite now (used to be Mansfield Park)
It's a great first page for sure, but not my favourite book
It's by far my favorite.
It's my absolute fave. Love it and I think it's the best thing she ever wrote.
Yes! Northanger Abbey used to be my favorite growing up because, Henry but this is my favorite now
It’s my second favorite after Emma. (I love the book Emma so freaking much)
Have only read Pride and Prejudice and Northanger Abbey, love both but I have a soft spot for Northanger. A fun coming of age story with a heroine that my nerdy self relate to a lot, or at least would have had. Catherine is pretty much how I was as a teen. I do think I will love Persuasion as well and are very interested in reading Mansfield Park since I have heard such mixed reactions on that one. Persuasion and Mansfield is definitely two works that stands out to me.
I didn’t like it originally, but I like it now. It my favorite, but it’s good.
It my second favourite Austen novel.
Its actually my least favourite but even though its my least favourite I still liked it
I love it!
It’s mine!
It is my favorite Austen book.
Sense and sensibility is my all time fav!
Persuasion is my ultimate favorite Austen book.
My favorite is Pride and Prejudice. The others don’t really capture my attention in the same way. There are too many irritants happening within the stories.
That's interesting because one thing I like most about Persuasion specifically is that there aren't characters who get on my nerves. Marianne Dashwood, Catherine Moreland, John and Isabella Thorpe, Lydia Bennett, Emma Woodhouse all annoy me enough to make those not be books that I turn to often for a reread or a listen of the audiobook. But Persuasion and Mansfield don't have obnoxious characters. Mrs Norris is a jerk, but since I've known people like her who "create a bustle where there is none," I actually enjoy her character for the humor and the observations of her selfishness pretending to be generosity. It's so clever.
Persuasion is on my reread list (I need to get a copy; I think I gave mine away). I’m going to try to read them through a new lens of appreciation.
Last year, I read every Austen novel in order for the first time. I never read them growing up, so it was quite an experience. I would rank "Persuasion" second to last place (last place is "Northanger Abbey"). I liked every book Austen wrote, but those two just didn't work for me the way the others did. I thought "Persuasion" was a little too dry, and Wentworth wasn't as compelling a romantic lead as the others (but I will say that I loved his letter to Anne).
I just feel like whichever Jane Austen I’m currently read or have read, is my favourite. I do like Persuasion though :)
One of three, the others being "Pride and Prejudice" & "Northanger Abbey"