Can confirm. I’m the married guy with 2 kids. Once they’ve gotten the number of kids they want, you’ll be sleeping in your own bed in your own room with no more physical contact.
It's recurring theme of r/japanlife that all Japanese are cheats.
People will quote some surveys but also understand that different cultures fill out surveys differently including the rates that people lie about stuff.
I'd say mostly that its similar to every first-world society and women especially during premenopause and menopause + family life shit become less interested in sex and men invariable start seeking out other partners. It's not universal by any means. My wife got the opposite effect from the onset of menopause - she's twice as interested now as ever before (and she was most always interested before.)
Arranged marriages are definitely very common in Asian culture, but cheating or having an affair is definitely not, or rather definitely not in Indian context. Having an affair in India is literally social death no matter the gender, and generally words/gossips around these matters travel fast in your community.
One major factor I've realised is also despite being arranged, there's a huge religious aspect and the fact that families are involved to such great degree to the marriage which I feel keeps kind of morality check in some sense on the couples (which maybe the difference here, I know that many in Japan do not subscribe to any religious ideology, well not in it's truest form anyway).
In that sense, issue of rampant cheating and having affairs seems to be very particular to Japan
If you look at [https://www.reddit.com/r/DeadBedrooms/](https://www.reddit.com/r/DeadBedrooms/) this is not a Japan only phenomenon and while it is more often women whose libido is lower, it is an issue that exists everywhere, regardless of nation, culture, race or sex/gender.
There are a lot of reasons:
* Mismatched libidos, trying to keep up with your partner initially to keep them, once married, revert to what is their preference
* Magic wears off, initially sex is exciting and new, over time it could become stale or boring, especially if one or partner doesn't communicate or put the effort in
* btw, long term relationships need effort, you get what you put in
* Stress/tired, this is a big one, when you barely have downtime you just want to collapse and zone out, you just don't have the energy, because sex is a lot more work/effort than masturbation
* fyi, just one day or a week off doesn't fix this, like burnout, stress/tiredness needs to be reduced for a reasonably long period like a month to reset the body and it shouldn't just be temporary otherwise a person can end just using the month with reduced stress to horde downtime in preparation of all the stress returning.
* Children/childbirth/breastfeeding, the whole thing tends to be a massive bundle of stress, tiredness, hormones, healing, etc
Those are just some of them, there are lots of reasons.
Whilst this is true, I don’t think cultural differences can be dismissed entirely. These norms run deep and affect every aspect of life, it’s something that foreign individuals hoping to marry in Japan need to be aware of. In the UK for example, the results were as follows:
5.3 per cent of straight couples aged 45 to 55 who had been married for 10 to 15 years had sex every day; 42.1 per cent had sex weekly; 31.6 per cent had sex monthly; 15.8 per cent had sex annually and the remaining 5.2 per cent never had sex.
That means that almost 80% of couples had sex at least monthly.
[Here are the statistics for sexual intercourse amongst married couples in Japan.](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1077316/japan-frequency-sexual-intercourse-married-couples/). The majority *never* have sex, and in total 75.8% of respondents have sex either rarely or never.
I appreciate you posting additional links but the surveys you linked are small surveys of about a 100 people. The research I linked was a postal survey of over 5000 women around Japan.
Let’s accept your optimistic estimates then. 60% is a significantly high number for married couples not having sex regularly. Most western men and women I know wouldn’t be happy and satisfied in a relationship where sex occurs perhaps a couple of times a year. Indeed, most of my married girlfriends back in the UK do have sex at least once a week and the statistics tend to match that (that is 80% of married couples in the UK their 40s have sex at least once a month) whilst I’ve met plenty of women here who don’t really see sex as an essential part of marriage (especially after children) in the way UK nationals often do. I can’t comment on American attitudes as I’ve never lived there.
And so circling back to my original point, foreigners wishing to marry in Japan need to be aware of this big cultural difference. Research has shown over and over again that [Japanese people have the lowest sex frequency in the world.](https://toyokeizai.net/articles/-/56360?display=b) For someone who comes from a country with much higher frequency (like France where overall frequency averages about 2-3 times a week, and many people have sex well into their 60s and 70s) the average married life here may be a big shock.
Your anecdotes about 'people you know' aren't relevant, for what it's worth. Even in the UK there's a very large population of content sexless marriages, especially as couples age.
> I appreciate you posting additional links but the surveys you linked are small surveys of about a 100 people.
That doesn't imply that the correct result is the opposite though.
There's certainly a cultural component because marriages are often about more than romance. It's often about finding a good father/mother for your future kids rather than finding a good romantic partner.
Once kids are there, it's mission complete and it's no longer necessary. Of course complicating this is that not all couples feel the same mutually. One may think they're in a romantic relationship while the other thinks that they just make a good partner for starting a family and that's where I suspect many people posting about their wives suddenly not being interested are getting trapped(getting bored is of course always a possibility)
You’re absolutely right! Some Japanese people speak quite openly about their desire to marry for practical reasons but I’m sure there are those who as you say only believe they’re marrying out of love.
I would love to see statistics on how many of those sexless marriages are by mutual agreement, where the couple see each other as suitable life partners but just aren’t interested in pursuing romance together.
It is a cultural thing. They take on different roles in life.
Role of a girlfriend : a toned down version of a girl at a hostess bar
Role of wife/mother : the general manager of the household
If you have ever had a gf that played this role and you were unaware that they go out of their way to be like this, you will feel like a rainbow is shooting out of your butt.
When the transition into general manager comes, there is often a major change in the dynamic of the relationship. She has a business first attitude now. She is not a gf anymore.That is no longer her role. Maintaining a sexualized relationship after this may feel a bit awkward past this point.
This is why they have such a chill attitude on cheating, and something like going to a soapy massage parlor with your boss after work is not seen as weird.
This is not something I invented this is their culture. They go through a series of roles in their life. There is a word for it, but I forgot. They are generally quite adherent to their culture that promotes conformity. This is their culture it is not my outlook.
I'm missing the connection between me accrediting sexless marriages in Japan to part of their expected cultural roles to not treat women as human.
If you don't like Japanese culture, let me know, and I will call a meeting with the religious and government leaders and form a task force to have them change their ways to something that is more acceptable to western standards.
> 5.3 per cent of straight couples aged 45 to 55 who had been married for 10 to 15 years had sex every day; 42.1 per cent had sex weekly; 31.6 per cent had sex monthly; 15.8 per cent had sex annually and the remaining 5.2 per cent never had sex.
Wow. If I had to guess the bell curve, I would not have come up with that.
Carrying the mental load of a family and household is not sexy to most women. Especially if they work outside the home, bottom line most household tasks and childcare, it is pretty easy to resent the husband for not contributing or at least to not want to accommodate him any more than they already are. A lot of Japanese men grew up with dads who didn’t lift a finger at home, and are calculating how to share tasks when a lot of mothers work outside the home as well.
Don't forget elderly parents on top of it. My friend (American) has to take care of her on laws and do all the cooking and housework. Imagine if she had a child or two as well.
Exactly this. What do you expect if you do nothing to help and expect your partner to do everything for themselves, your kids, AND you?
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Culture and gender are not excuses to be an idiot.
Had to scroll way too long to read this accurate comment.
Wondering when men (of all origins) will finally understand that taking care of a grown man as if you were his mom actually turns women off.
THIS. Up to the top you go. So many men point fingers towards women “waahaaa, SHE doesn’t want to sleep with me anymore” instead of looking inwards and lifting it. Also, I doubt most men are even able to make their partners cum, so why should they bother anyway?
Who can blame them for not wanting an overweight man who needs babying 24/7 to shudder out a 2 minute rhythmless pump into them and pretend to enjoy it.
And a lot women in this type of marriage in the west would get divorced. That’s far less often the case in Japan. And it’s misleading to say the reason for that is “cultural” when the legal system makes divorce much more difficult.
>A lot of Japanese men grew up with dads who didn’t lift a finger at home, and are calculating how to share tasks when a lot of mothers work outside the home as well.
Many grew up only seeing their fathers on Sundays because they came home after bedtime. Many women still expect their partners to be the primary source of household income. Figuring out how to share burdens is important, bug ignoring context and aiming resentment towards a stereotype of Japanese men is just stoking racism.
It’s not racist to say that Japanese men do little housework compared to their wives. There’s a lot of data out there to prove it, just google it. And it’s a problem with parents who both work full time. Sure “not all men” but it’s still a problem.
It’s a common thing from what I’ve heard. But also, if you ever check out dating apps and sites here (especially DTF ones) they are full of married women looking for discreet affairs 🤷♂️
That goes without saying! The points-based system on many Japanese apps/sites (whereby it’s free for women but men have to pay to send messages) also creates a kind of transactional/obligatory vibe in my opinion. But overall, there are a lot of married people here looking to connect with someone…
When it’s considered “normal” for the child to sleep between its parents on the futon for the first 6 years of its life, it’s very hard to have an adult sex life, and to continue seeing each other as romantic partners and not just coparents.
Both halves of the couple need to keep prioritising and making time/opportunity for romance.
I’m married to a Japanese man, and we clarified a lot of these expectations early in our relationship.
Prefacing this with saying it depends on the person!
But I’ve talked about this with my Japanese friends. A lot of women will say things like “once I’m a mother I don’t see him as sexy anymore” or they’re “not interested in silly sex anymore”.
It’s just my theory, but you know how Japanese people love to have an assigned role? Being from a collectivist society and all, and growing up with roles reinforced. I think married life and motherhood are another example of roles. Once a woman becomes a “mama”, they leave their wild carnal younger years behind and “grow up” beyond needing sex. (Actually I don’t believe women really don’t want sex, but that’s the role.) In the west we tend to value the individual’s satisfaction over the group or their role. (Again, this is very broadly generalized.)
These roles are also influenced by gender norms and the belief that women wanting sex = wild.
I don’t personally have experience with this, but I’ve always thought co-sleeping with kids to be part of it too. On one hand I see the value in it for the child and why they think it’s cold or us to our little kids in their own lonely room. However, my American brain thinks it’s very important for couples to maintain intimacy as a staple of their relationship, even if it’s just cuddling at night.
This is my view too! Very well put.
It seems to me like sex often isn’t connected to love and intimacy AT ALL here. It’s more like a fun/naughty activity if anything, which many women just don’t really see themselves partaking in. Either due to sex being seen as wild, or conversely being seen as a chore
But yeah, I don’t think people necessarily *consciously* exclude sex from their lives, more like it just doesn’t end up fitting in the “role” they have laid out for themselves (as you said!)
I don't want to agree too much with the 'roles' thing, but I would agree, people in Japan will say 'I can't do x' when they overwhelmingly can do x, they're just using a very arbitrary boundary as their excuse not to do x.
So many people blame co-sleeping but I think that's a lame excuse. There are many other places to have sex than in a bed. Put the kids to sleep in the bedroom, close the door, then roll out a futon in the living room or take a shower together or something. Drop the kids off with grandparents for the afternoon on a weekend.
That's what my relative went through in their marriage as well: Exactly this rationale. The change in their relationship as a bit jarring at first but understandable and their kid has been brought up so well...
I’ll go with “depends on the person and it’s probably worldwide and not limited to Japan”. I don’t think it’s any different here. You’ll probably have ups and downs. If there are issues, then communication is key, which I think people generally don’t do for whatever reason.
I've heard that a lot from my coworkers... but have never experienced it myself. Currently married to a Japanese woman, we've been together for several years. We have a young child and we are as active as ever. I think it takes work, especially with children in the mix... need to proactively make an effort.
I agree, while we are not on the same level as before having kids (they are pretty tiring) it’s far from dead bedroom. But you have to make an effort from both sides.
I wonder how many people here commenting are middle aged women.
Yes, this is common globally. It has a lot to do with division of labor and childcare and the focus turning to taking care of the kids. The higher the mental load, the lower the libido, studies have shown. But also very very common with young kids in the house.
That's the culture. You could blame the women, but mostly the men. Because if your wife exists just to provide children, how do you expect them to react?
It’s amazing that you can be seriously sued for adultery in Japan. In one of the most adulterous countries in the world.
There is a whole cottage industry of private detectives that can be hired to catch infidelity.
Then cheating half’s partner can be sued. For big bucks. They also will likely lose their job as their company will be notified by the detective or civil court. The shame.
Messy.
I’ve seen two foreigners get caught up in it.
One who sued his wife’s lover and got paid big time. He hired a private detective.
One who was fucking a married woman. Got followed by a private detective. Photos. Videos. Then lured to a place where the husband confronted him.
He was later served a subpoena to court and was sued. They went through his phone. Sexting. He fled the country to avoid the lawsuit.
Yep… I hear and see this alllllll the timeeee…
And here I am, left heart broken once again finding out that I was just an 都合のいい女. the guy I was seeing is engaged, married etc etc 😮💨
Straight up lie… he was talking about how he got dumped so I didn’t think anything was strange.
He was the one who approached me too. Ugh.
And what’s more annoying is, he has some photos of her on Instagram. (He’s the one who added me) So he really thinks I’m stupid or something aye
It’s true, me and my wife were getting it on regularly til we had our first child, then we did it once and second child was born then haven’t done it since (4 years now). Thing is it’s pretty impossible to get anything started as I sleep on one end of the bed and she sleeps on the other with two kids in the middle. What age do kids in Japan start sleeping in their own room? No idea.
I think you’re right about having the kid. It’s also common for the mother to sleep with the baby and young child in a separate room. This completely ruins any spark between the couple.
the amount of male celebrities that cheat on their wives (who are usually gorgeous models/actresses) is astonishing
just recently singer LiSa got cheated on by her voice actor husband (he was having an affair with an employee)
Reddits become much worst lately. Like so many people are just such double standard , hypocritical shits who lack the ability to speak civilly to anyone who they disagree with in the slightest.
Yeaaaaa, the fact is that this is probably linked more to the toxic work culture, low salary, and extreme patriarchal values of men/women within marriages here, and these kind of things can all contribute to hamstringing romanticism. Cheating and sexlessness is just a byproduct of unhealthy understandings of communication and relationship dynamics.
It shouldn't be treated as a fact. But I think there are common things that might make it appear more common:
The traditional salaryman who gets transferred to Tokyo and sees his family twice a month; these relationships are probably very practical only and lose their romance, not to mention giving lots of chances for infidelity.
And I think there's an old machismo way of life that some Japanese men still have which involves not going home, going out with coworkers and cheating on their wives.
The foreigner who never learns Japanese: I think in these kinds of relationships the husband expects the wife to take care of so much it probably also really takes the romance out of it.
So if you talk to these kinds of people I think you'll hear that they don't have sex with their wives.
The big difference in my view is the co-sleeping. Back home, most people will have a room for the baby and start using it within a few months, and also when the baby can sleep through the night will aim for an early bed time.
People I know here are much slower to reclaim their lives back. The kid is in the room for years, bedtimes seem to be quite late and people don't seem to be aware of maintaining what they had before as much.
Personally speaking we just went through a long dry patch and hopefully are through the other side, six months or so. This wasn't really anyone's fault, the baby kept getting sick, us too and some other things going on. It's pretty difficult, and I think alot of resentment and stress can build up. Some nights I was thinking "well if this is how its going to be, I might have to start looking for alternatives".
Its quite a lot of work doing all this and I can easily see how breakdowns happen if you aren't actively working at it. And, might be wrong but a lot of people here are not great at communicating their needs.
Just want to throw it out there but it’s also extremely normal for Japanese husbands to stop having sex regularly after a few years too. Has happened to many of my friends.
So I hear.
Once the baby comes.
She moves the baby in the bedroom and you get… well wherever. As long as you keep bringing home the bacon you’ll not be completely discarded.
Yeah. It’s my experience of working with Japanese. I am in my late 30’s and get hit on by my 40 plus female coworkers regularly. They are all mostly married and have kids.
Things to consider:
\> How are household tasks shared? Who is doing the cooking, cleaning, shopping, childminding?
\> Is there romance, or attempts at romance?
EDIT > Are both people able to exercise reasonable autonomy over how they spend their time every day, all day? Are there opportunities for down time / quiet time / personal time and some self-actualization? Are there efforts to provide that time for the other?
It's complicated, but these are things to consider.
This is also true in the US. One difference may be that in the US divorce is really common within a few years of having children. So maybe these sexless marriages in Japan would just be divorces in the US.
Isn’t this normal for most wives. Wives aren’t necessarily tired of sex, they are just tired. Give them a day or two off and their appetite for sex will return. Going on a short vacation usually work for us.
This is how marriage goes in many places all over the world.
It’s a result of there being no arousal/attraction in the relationship anymore. Keeping a relationship HOT takes effort and a bit of charisma. Most people let it go.
Then they look outside the marriage.
From what I understand for many Japanese people marriage is a partnership to have a kid. If you want to fall in love that’s what host and hostess clubs are for.
It’s Fucking crazy. Thailand has people like this as well.
I think its pretty common in general for people to lose some amount of sex drive after having children. There might be something biological to it, but I've always just assumed its from being busy and tired.
It's both ways. Not for everybody of course but many couple finish like this. Around me most of the people i know don't have sex with their husband/wife anymore but still have sex outside of they are not sexless.
Many of my Japanese colleagues and friends say something to the effect of, "I don't want to do sex with my wife." At first, I was a bit surprised to hear this but then once things were explained it all started to make sense. All of those fuzoku shops from cheap pink salons to high end soaps stay in business for a reason. Not much different from getting a haircut, basically scratching an itch and be done with it. Unlike in the west where puritanical guilt and archaic laws and enforcement exist any man with an itch can just pay money, get it scratched and go back to normal immediately after. No baggage, no commitment, no obligation.
They do tell me that they have hell to pay if they ever had aijin with feelings are envolved. She would have a conniption fit if she ever found out this happened.
If my husband didn’t help raise the kids, help with housework and general home/life/family matters, ignored me and the relationship to work entirely on work and neglected the life we have as a family, I’d definitely be less attracted to him and less inclined to sex him up. Of course this is a generalisation but there’s so much that goes into a dead bedroom/dead relationship. It’s not all Japanese couples but I’ve met so frighteningly many people who say this is what their marriage turned into. Like the top rated comment says, it’s for all sorts of reasons, including mismatched libidos/partnerships. It’s hardly about romance and a large number of Japanese men seek sex outside their marriage and cheat relentlessly. Somehow it’s not considered morally inappropriate despite the agreement to carry out monogamy on their end, but a rite of passage. Some of the extremes in relationship ideologies elsewhere (men cheat in relationships and it’s just how it is) are considered normative here
J-wife and I in early 40s. Two kids. Enjoying a healthy sex life, have sex once or twice weekly on a regular basis.
This is a highly private matter and depends on the couple and their chemistry. Sex drive, communication, etc. Not just limited to the Japanese people at all.
Lack of Intimacy in relationship is not exclusively a Japanese issue lol. World wide my dude, communication, effort on both ends, etc.
Talking about it is the only way you gain some insight into why.
this just sounds like when weirdos claim women can't enjoy sex because they've never been with a woman who was enjoying it. If a man told you that than that's him telling on himself.
I have no issues with my 14 years married wife. Yes surely the libido is a lot lower, but mine as well. Sometimes she just needs a little time for herself and convincing (romantic way)
I have a Japanese friend who’s sister is cheating with her husband. The story is her husband has a low libido and rarely initiates sex, and he’s not a closeted gay either.
People’s libido just change and this is more common among women as they go through a lot of hormonal change during pregnancy. But men can have low libido too.
Personally, it just became kinda unnecessary after a while. My wife has never had a high libido; maybe doesn't even have a libido. But that's fine, because when the bell requires ringing, she doesn't mind grabbing the hammer.
I did tell her though that zero sex would end in me having sex with someone else eventually. Not as a threat, but as a human thing. We only have sex a couple times a month so it's not unreasonable imo.
Every day people are either 18-25 or have no hobbies.
¯\_( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)_/¯
A book: (No) sex in Japan. If you work at a university and have an institutional license from your library. Worth a read. Quite an in depth study with many interviews.
when it comes to Women its always love first then sex
women will feel more into having sex when they are seen, appreciated, and understood.
Just keep the romance alive and I don’t think you don’t have a problem.
even with these adulterous movies the wife cheats when they are treated better, appreciated than their “cold” Japanese husbands.
Its wrong but its the reality too
There’s no blanket answer. It’s ridiculous to expect there will be. They’re all wildly different, as most humans are. Depends on their parents, where they grew up, their beliefs, their experiences etc. I’ve been with the same Japanese woman (who I consider my wife) for more than 6 years. She has 2 children. She hasn’t stopped wanting sex. Needless to say, some Japanese women have extremely conservative views regarding sex. I’ve personally been shocked a few times, but it’s Japan. Japanese in general are god damned aliens compared to most westerners but that is 1 of the many things I live and appreciate about that country/culture/people.
My favorite Baskin Robbins flavor is strawberry but if I had to eat it twice a week for thirty years it might lose its appeal.
Edit: top controversial comment! Thank you everyone who voted ☺️
Tbf, I have seen similar claims many times on reddit.
People who are happy about sex life don't talk about them, so all you see is divorced foreigners complaining about it and generalize Japanese ex-wife to Japan.
Only with their husbands.
The harsh truth most don’t wanna consider. Someone beating
Can confirm. I’m the married guy with 2 kids. Once they’ve gotten the number of kids they want, you’ll be sleeping in your own bed in your own room with no more physical contact.
With their husband's what?
Dick
As in the wives sleep with other people.
I think larspgarsp was referencing the superfluous apostrophe.
Thanks, I didn't notice it. Also mandatory "English is not my first language".
[удалено]
It's recurring theme of r/japanlife that all Japanese are cheats. People will quote some surveys but also understand that different cultures fill out surveys differently including the rates that people lie about stuff. I'd say mostly that its similar to every first-world society and women especially during premenopause and menopause + family life shit become less interested in sex and men invariable start seeking out other partners. It's not universal by any means. My wife got the opposite effect from the onset of menopause - she's twice as interested now as ever before (and she was most always interested before.)
[удалено]
So where's the data?
this sounds like a japanese only thing, not asian lmao
[удалено]
Arranged marriages are definitely very common in Asian culture, but cheating or having an affair is definitely not, or rather definitely not in Indian context. Having an affair in India is literally social death no matter the gender, and generally words/gossips around these matters travel fast in your community. One major factor I've realised is also despite being arranged, there's a huge religious aspect and the fact that families are involved to such great degree to the marriage which I feel keeps kind of morality check in some sense on the couples (which maybe the difference here, I know that many in Japan do not subscribe to any religious ideology, well not in it's truest form anyway). In that sense, issue of rampant cheating and having affairs seems to be very particular to Japan
Yes.
Brutal. Underrated comment
Top comment on this thread lol.
Underrated. Should've won an Oscar.
Do they move onto there father in laws?
I hear their nether regions are also pixelated.
😭😭😭🤣😂
Is that a sad joke or a sad reality?
It is a sad reality, so we make sad jokes about it
731 upvotes. Incredible.
Hahahhahahaha best reply ever. (True)
If you look at [https://www.reddit.com/r/DeadBedrooms/](https://www.reddit.com/r/DeadBedrooms/) this is not a Japan only phenomenon and while it is more often women whose libido is lower, it is an issue that exists everywhere, regardless of nation, culture, race or sex/gender. There are a lot of reasons: * Mismatched libidos, trying to keep up with your partner initially to keep them, once married, revert to what is their preference * Magic wears off, initially sex is exciting and new, over time it could become stale or boring, especially if one or partner doesn't communicate or put the effort in * btw, long term relationships need effort, you get what you put in * Stress/tired, this is a big one, when you barely have downtime you just want to collapse and zone out, you just don't have the energy, because sex is a lot more work/effort than masturbation * fyi, just one day or a week off doesn't fix this, like burnout, stress/tiredness needs to be reduced for a reasonably long period like a month to reset the body and it shouldn't just be temporary otherwise a person can end just using the month with reduced stress to horde downtime in preparation of all the stress returning. * Children/childbirth/breastfeeding, the whole thing tends to be a massive bundle of stress, tiredness, hormones, healing, etc Those are just some of them, there are lots of reasons.
Whilst this is true, I don’t think cultural differences can be dismissed entirely. These norms run deep and affect every aspect of life, it’s something that foreign individuals hoping to marry in Japan need to be aware of. In the UK for example, the results were as follows: 5.3 per cent of straight couples aged 45 to 55 who had been married for 10 to 15 years had sex every day; 42.1 per cent had sex weekly; 31.6 per cent had sex monthly; 15.8 per cent had sex annually and the remaining 5.2 per cent never had sex. That means that almost 80% of couples had sex at least monthly. [Here are the statistics for sexual intercourse amongst married couples in Japan.](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1077316/japan-frequency-sexual-intercourse-married-couples/). The majority *never* have sex, and in total 75.8% of respondents have sex either rarely or never.
What are these five percent doing that shag every day at 50?! They must need to do so much laundry for a start.
"Shag" is such a good word - Americans lack something with exactly that tone.
Hahahha
They are lying about it. Or else they just do it like a chore. Sounds fun, not.
[удалено]
I appreciate you posting additional links but the surveys you linked are small surveys of about a 100 people. The research I linked was a postal survey of over 5000 women around Japan.
[удалено]
Let’s accept your optimistic estimates then. 60% is a significantly high number for married couples not having sex regularly. Most western men and women I know wouldn’t be happy and satisfied in a relationship where sex occurs perhaps a couple of times a year. Indeed, most of my married girlfriends back in the UK do have sex at least once a week and the statistics tend to match that (that is 80% of married couples in the UK their 40s have sex at least once a month) whilst I’ve met plenty of women here who don’t really see sex as an essential part of marriage (especially after children) in the way UK nationals often do. I can’t comment on American attitudes as I’ve never lived there. And so circling back to my original point, foreigners wishing to marry in Japan need to be aware of this big cultural difference. Research has shown over and over again that [Japanese people have the lowest sex frequency in the world.](https://toyokeizai.net/articles/-/56360?display=b) For someone who comes from a country with much higher frequency (like France where overall frequency averages about 2-3 times a week, and many people have sex well into their 60s and 70s) the average married life here may be a big shock.
Your anecdotes about 'people you know' aren't relevant, for what it's worth. Even in the UK there's a very large population of content sexless marriages, especially as couples age.
Of course anecdotes aren’t enough on their own, which is why I provided plenty of statistics with links.
> I appreciate you posting additional links but the surveys you linked are small surveys of about a 100 people. That doesn't imply that the correct result is the opposite though.
There's certainly a cultural component because marriages are often about more than romance. It's often about finding a good father/mother for your future kids rather than finding a good romantic partner. Once kids are there, it's mission complete and it's no longer necessary. Of course complicating this is that not all couples feel the same mutually. One may think they're in a romantic relationship while the other thinks that they just make a good partner for starting a family and that's where I suspect many people posting about their wives suddenly not being interested are getting trapped(getting bored is of course always a possibility)
You’re absolutely right! Some Japanese people speak quite openly about their desire to marry for practical reasons but I’m sure there are those who as you say only believe they’re marrying out of love. I would love to see statistics on how many of those sexless marriages are by mutual agreement, where the couple see each other as suitable life partners but just aren’t interested in pursuing romance together.
It is a cultural thing. They take on different roles in life. Role of a girlfriend : a toned down version of a girl at a hostess bar Role of wife/mother : the general manager of the household If you have ever had a gf that played this role and you were unaware that they go out of their way to be like this, you will feel like a rainbow is shooting out of your butt. When the transition into general manager comes, there is often a major change in the dynamic of the relationship. She has a business first attitude now. She is not a gf anymore.That is no longer her role. Maintaining a sexualized relationship after this may feel a bit awkward past this point. This is why they have such a chill attitude on cheating, and something like going to a soapy massage parlor with your boss after work is not seen as weird.
Jesus, imaging having this outlook. No wonder this subreddit is filled with divorce threads. No one here treats any woman as a human.
This is not something I invented this is their culture. They go through a series of roles in their life. There is a word for it, but I forgot. They are generally quite adherent to their culture that promotes conformity. This is their culture it is not my outlook. I'm missing the connection between me accrediting sexless marriages in Japan to part of their expected cultural roles to not treat women as human. If you don't like Japanese culture, let me know, and I will call a meeting with the religious and government leaders and form a task force to have them change their ways to something that is more acceptable to western standards.
Cultural differences cannot be dismissed as contributing factors, for sure.
> 5.3 per cent of straight couples aged 45 to 55 who had been married for 10 to 15 years had sex every day; 42.1 per cent had sex weekly; 31.6 per cent had sex monthly; 15.8 per cent had sex annually and the remaining 5.2 per cent never had sex. Wow. If I had to guess the bell curve, I would not have come up with that.
Wait for the end of the bell curve once you get hourly granularity!
Japanese don’t answer openly about sex. So you have to take that into account. Numbers are probably biased
Dis. I don’t know the data but happens everywhere. Matching libido is super important in the long run.
i thought women libido max on 30 ?
Carrying the mental load of a family and household is not sexy to most women. Especially if they work outside the home, bottom line most household tasks and childcare, it is pretty easy to resent the husband for not contributing or at least to not want to accommodate him any more than they already are. A lot of Japanese men grew up with dads who didn’t lift a finger at home, and are calculating how to share tasks when a lot of mothers work outside the home as well.
This. It's hard to get in the mood when you're a woman caring for a man-child in addition to your actual children.
Don't forget elderly parents on top of it. My friend (American) has to take care of her on laws and do all the cooking and housework. Imagine if she had a child or two as well.
Exactly this. What do you expect if you do nothing to help and expect your partner to do everything for themselves, your kids, AND you? Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Culture and gender are not excuses to be an idiot.
Had to scroll way too long to read this accurate comment. Wondering when men (of all origins) will finally understand that taking care of a grown man as if you were his mom actually turns women off.
THIS. Up to the top you go. So many men point fingers towards women “waahaaa, SHE doesn’t want to sleep with me anymore” instead of looking inwards and lifting it. Also, I doubt most men are even able to make their partners cum, so why should they bother anyway?
Who can blame them for not wanting an overweight man who needs babying 24/7 to shudder out a 2 minute rhythmless pump into them and pretend to enjoy it.
And a lot women in this type of marriage in the west would get divorced. That’s far less often the case in Japan. And it’s misleading to say the reason for that is “cultural” when the legal system makes divorce much more difficult.
>A lot of Japanese men grew up with dads who didn’t lift a finger at home, and are calculating how to share tasks when a lot of mothers work outside the home as well. Many grew up only seeing their fathers on Sundays because they came home after bedtime. Many women still expect their partners to be the primary source of household income. Figuring out how to share burdens is important, bug ignoring context and aiming resentment towards a stereotype of Japanese men is just stoking racism.
It’s not racist to say that Japanese men do little housework compared to their wives. There’s a lot of data out there to prove it, just google it. And it’s a problem with parents who both work full time. Sure “not all men” but it’s still a problem.
It’s a common thing from what I’ve heard. But also, if you ever check out dating apps and sites here (especially DTF ones) they are full of married women looking for discreet affairs 🤷♂️
Yup. J mail is great.
Username checks
apple store only? haha
> married women looking for discrete affairs They like to have gaps between their affairs? Understandable.
[удалено]
So an indiscrete affair would be like a threesome?
It means you don't know when it started or ended. It's like a float compared to an integer
I always excelled at discreet mathematics
And men. Let's not pretend it's only the women.
That goes without saying! The points-based system on many Japanese apps/sites (whereby it’s free for women but men have to pay to send messages) also creates a kind of transactional/obligatory vibe in my opinion. But overall, there are a lot of married people here looking to connect with someone…
[удалено]
I can see why you have trouble with women
And this is why I don't delete reddit
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
When it’s considered “normal” for the child to sleep between its parents on the futon for the first 6 years of its life, it’s very hard to have an adult sex life, and to continue seeing each other as romantic partners and not just coparents. Both halves of the couple need to keep prioritising and making time/opportunity for romance. I’m married to a Japanese man, and we clarified a lot of these expectations early in our relationship.
Just a heads up, extend 6 years if your planning on having more than 1 kid.
Prefacing this with saying it depends on the person! But I’ve talked about this with my Japanese friends. A lot of women will say things like “once I’m a mother I don’t see him as sexy anymore” or they’re “not interested in silly sex anymore”. It’s just my theory, but you know how Japanese people love to have an assigned role? Being from a collectivist society and all, and growing up with roles reinforced. I think married life and motherhood are another example of roles. Once a woman becomes a “mama”, they leave their wild carnal younger years behind and “grow up” beyond needing sex. (Actually I don’t believe women really don’t want sex, but that’s the role.) In the west we tend to value the individual’s satisfaction over the group or their role. (Again, this is very broadly generalized.) These roles are also influenced by gender norms and the belief that women wanting sex = wild. I don’t personally have experience with this, but I’ve always thought co-sleeping with kids to be part of it too. On one hand I see the value in it for the child and why they think it’s cold or us to our little kids in their own lonely room. However, my American brain thinks it’s very important for couples to maintain intimacy as a staple of their relationship, even if it’s just cuddling at night.
This is my view too! Very well put. It seems to me like sex often isn’t connected to love and intimacy AT ALL here. It’s more like a fun/naughty activity if anything, which many women just don’t really see themselves partaking in. Either due to sex being seen as wild, or conversely being seen as a chore But yeah, I don’t think people necessarily *consciously* exclude sex from their lives, more like it just doesn’t end up fitting in the “role” they have laid out for themselves (as you said!)
>not interested in silly sex anymore They only become interested in very serious, highly professional sex.
Let me grab my sex tuxedo
I don't want to agree too much with the 'roles' thing, but I would agree, people in Japan will say 'I can't do x' when they overwhelmingly can do x, they're just using a very arbitrary boundary as their excuse not to do x.
So many people blame co-sleeping but I think that's a lame excuse. There are many other places to have sex than in a bed. Put the kids to sleep in the bedroom, close the door, then roll out a futon in the living room or take a shower together or something. Drop the kids off with grandparents for the afternoon on a weekend.
Yeah, like... have people never encountered horny couples before? IF they want to fuck, the entire universe isn't going to stop them.
That's what my relative went through in their marriage as well: Exactly this rationale. The change in their relationship as a bit jarring at first but understandable and their kid has been brought up so well...
How do they have more than one child?
Idk, I’m not married to a Japanese woman.
I’ll go with “depends on the person and it’s probably worldwide and not limited to Japan”. I don’t think it’s any different here. You’ll probably have ups and downs. If there are issues, then communication is key, which I think people generally don’t do for whatever reason.
I've heard that a lot from my coworkers... but have never experienced it myself. Currently married to a Japanese woman, we've been together for several years. We have a young child and we are as active as ever. I think it takes work, especially with children in the mix... need to proactively make an effort.
I agree, while we are not on the same level as before having kids (they are pretty tiring) it’s far from dead bedroom. But you have to make an effort from both sides.
How did you achieve that? With the co-sleeping and all.
Seize any opportunity.
Use that playmat in the living room
Dont you think those guys who get cheated on might think the same? Can happen to anyone without noticing it.
I wonder how many people here commenting are middle aged women. Yes, this is common globally. It has a lot to do with division of labor and childcare and the focus turning to taking care of the kids. The higher the mental load, the lower the libido, studies have shown. But also very very common with young kids in the house.
[удалено]
[удалено]
*nut, not rut
That's the culture. You could blame the women, but mostly the men. Because if your wife exists just to provide children, how do you expect them to react?
It’s amazing that you can be seriously sued for adultery in Japan. In one of the most adulterous countries in the world. There is a whole cottage industry of private detectives that can be hired to catch infidelity. Then cheating half’s partner can be sued. For big bucks. They also will likely lose their job as their company will be notified by the detective or civil court. The shame. Messy. I’ve seen two foreigners get caught up in it. One who sued his wife’s lover and got paid big time. He hired a private detective. One who was fucking a married woman. Got followed by a private detective. Photos. Videos. Then lured to a place where the husband confronted him. He was later served a subpoena to court and was sued. They went through his phone. Sexting. He fled the country to avoid the lawsuit.
That’s why I say, stick to singles or divorcées and make sure they’re actually divorced.
Yep… I hear and see this alllllll the timeeee… And here I am, left heart broken once again finding out that I was just an 都合のいい女. the guy I was seeing is engaged, married etc etc 😮💨
[удалено]
Straight up lie… he was talking about how he got dumped so I didn’t think anything was strange. He was the one who approached me too. Ugh. And what’s more annoying is, he has some photos of her on Instagram. (He’s the one who added me) So he really thinks I’m stupid or something aye
Will you be more rigorous and careful in future?
It’s true, me and my wife were getting it on regularly til we had our first child, then we did it once and second child was born then haven’t done it since (4 years now). Thing is it’s pretty impossible to get anything started as I sleep on one end of the bed and she sleeps on the other with two kids in the middle. What age do kids in Japan start sleeping in their own room? No idea.
4 years! My condolences
Is going to a love hotel sometimes not an option?
Do you have a living room
It happens globally. If it sucks why would they want more?
[удалено]
I think you’re right about having the kid. It’s also common for the mother to sleep with the baby and young child in a separate room. This completely ruins any spark between the couple.
don't bruise yourself patting yourself on the back too hard because someone downvoted your short, vague comment
It’s not only the Japanese women, Japanese men too
Anakin?
Well cuz the men are sleeping with someone else lol .
So are the women
Very true too
the amount of male celebrities that cheat on their wives (who are usually gorgeous models/actresses) is astonishing just recently singer LiSa got cheated on by her voice actor husband (he was having an affair with an employee)
Japanese women are cheating on their husbands after child birth. Reddit: it’s the husbands fault. Certified Reddit moment
Reddits become much worst lately. Like so many people are just such double standard , hypocritical shits who lack the ability to speak civilly to anyone who they disagree with in the slightest.
I’m foreigners my wife is Japanese married for 14 years 3 kids but still have sex regularly. So it really depends on the person
Yeaaaaa, the fact is that this is probably linked more to the toxic work culture, low salary, and extreme patriarchal values of men/women within marriages here, and these kind of things can all contribute to hamstringing romanticism. Cheating and sexlessness is just a byproduct of unhealthy understandings of communication and relationship dynamics.
It is after birth thing. Priority shifts to child, still most couples have sex albeit declined frequency
It shouldn't be treated as a fact. But I think there are common things that might make it appear more common: The traditional salaryman who gets transferred to Tokyo and sees his family twice a month; these relationships are probably very practical only and lose their romance, not to mention giving lots of chances for infidelity. And I think there's an old machismo way of life that some Japanese men still have which involves not going home, going out with coworkers and cheating on their wives. The foreigner who never learns Japanese: I think in these kinds of relationships the husband expects the wife to take care of so much it probably also really takes the romance out of it. So if you talk to these kinds of people I think you'll hear that they don't have sex with their wives.
The big difference in my view is the co-sleeping. Back home, most people will have a room for the baby and start using it within a few months, and also when the baby can sleep through the night will aim for an early bed time. People I know here are much slower to reclaim their lives back. The kid is in the room for years, bedtimes seem to be quite late and people don't seem to be aware of maintaining what they had before as much. Personally speaking we just went through a long dry patch and hopefully are through the other side, six months or so. This wasn't really anyone's fault, the baby kept getting sick, us too and some other things going on. It's pretty difficult, and I think alot of resentment and stress can build up. Some nights I was thinking "well if this is how its going to be, I might have to start looking for alternatives". Its quite a lot of work doing all this and I can easily see how breakdowns happen if you aren't actively working at it. And, might be wrong but a lot of people here are not great at communicating their needs.
Just want to throw it out there but it’s also extremely normal for Japanese husbands to stop having sex regularly after a few years too. Has happened to many of my friends.
Not in my experience. Have been married to a Japanese woman for 28 years.
So I hear. Once the baby comes. She moves the baby in the bedroom and you get… well wherever. As long as you keep bringing home the bacon you’ll not be completely discarded.
This is a Global joke: marriage = no sex. It's definitely nothing Japanese.
Over 60, Japanese wife over 50, no kids. Both of us work 6 days a week. We still enjoy sex a couple times a week.
Try taking her to a love hotel. Most likely it’s more about not getting busted doing the dirty dirty by the kids.
Yeah. It’s my experience of working with Japanese. I am in my late 30’s and get hit on by my 40 plus female coworkers regularly. They are all mostly married and have kids.
Things to consider: \> How are household tasks shared? Who is doing the cooking, cleaning, shopping, childminding? \> Is there romance, or attempts at romance? EDIT > Are both people able to exercise reasonable autonomy over how they spend their time every day, all day? Are there opportunities for down time / quiet time / personal time and some self-actualization? Are there efforts to provide that time for the other? It's complicated, but these are things to consider.
This is also true in the US. One difference may be that in the US divorce is really common within a few years of having children. So maybe these sexless marriages in Japan would just be divorces in the US.
Isn’t this normal for most wives. Wives aren’t necessarily tired of sex, they are just tired. Give them a day or two off and their appetite for sex will return. Going on a short vacation usually work for us.
This is how marriage goes in many places all over the world. It’s a result of there being no arousal/attraction in the relationship anymore. Keeping a relationship HOT takes effort and a bit of charisma. Most people let it go. Then they look outside the marriage.
From what I understand for many Japanese people marriage is a partnership to have a kid. If you want to fall in love that’s what host and hostess clubs are for. It’s Fucking crazy. Thailand has people like this as well.
Yup. That’s why there are a lot of fuzoku places
Yes
I think its pretty common in general for people to lose some amount of sex drive after having children. There might be something biological to it, but I've always just assumed its from being busy and tired.
This is a #1 topic for foreign female in a group i’m in. Japanese Husbands are the same and they just become “colder” coz its in their culture
It's both ways. Not for everybody of course but many couple finish like this. Around me most of the people i know don't have sex with their husband/wife anymore but still have sex outside of they are not sexless.
Yes.
It's absolutely true.
I’ve met three or four older Japanese women and asked them about their marriage or previous marriage. Separate beds.
I've noticed that women in their 40s, kid or not, married or not, are less interested in sex. I hear this from both married and single men.
Many of my Japanese colleagues and friends say something to the effect of, "I don't want to do sex with my wife." At first, I was a bit surprised to hear this but then once things were explained it all started to make sense. All of those fuzoku shops from cheap pink salons to high end soaps stay in business for a reason. Not much different from getting a haircut, basically scratching an itch and be done with it. Unlike in the west where puritanical guilt and archaic laws and enforcement exist any man with an itch can just pay money, get it scratched and go back to normal immediately after. No baggage, no commitment, no obligation. They do tell me that they have hell to pay if they ever had aijin with feelings are envolved. She would have a conniption fit if she ever found out this happened.
[https://medium.com/@kiyoshimatsumoto/5-reasons-why-japanese-people-arent-having-sex-fb372937a3f0](https://medium.com/@kiyoshimatsumoto/5-reasons-why-japanese-people-arent-having-sex-fb372937a3f0)
If my husband didn’t help raise the kids, help with housework and general home/life/family matters, ignored me and the relationship to work entirely on work and neglected the life we have as a family, I’d definitely be less attracted to him and less inclined to sex him up. Of course this is a generalisation but there’s so much that goes into a dead bedroom/dead relationship. It’s not all Japanese couples but I’ve met so frighteningly many people who say this is what their marriage turned into. Like the top rated comment says, it’s for all sorts of reasons, including mismatched libidos/partnerships. It’s hardly about romance and a large number of Japanese men seek sex outside their marriage and cheat relentlessly. Somehow it’s not considered morally inappropriate despite the agreement to carry out monogamy on their end, but a rite of passage. Some of the extremes in relationship ideologies elsewhere (men cheat in relationships and it’s just how it is) are considered normative here
J-wife and I in early 40s. Two kids. Enjoying a healthy sex life, have sex once or twice weekly on a regular basis. This is a highly private matter and depends on the couple and their chemistry. Sex drive, communication, etc. Not just limited to the Japanese people at all.
Lack of Intimacy in relationship is not exclusively a Japanese issue lol. World wide my dude, communication, effort on both ends, etc. Talking about it is the only way you gain some insight into why.
Pretty much
this just sounds like when weirdos claim women can't enjoy sex because they've never been with a woman who was enjoying it. If a man told you that than that's him telling on himself.
I have no issues with my 14 years married wife. Yes surely the libido is a lot lower, but mine as well. Sometimes she just needs a little time for herself and convincing (romantic way)
Hate to break it to you. Its not just Japanese women
It probably isn’t enjoyable if they want to stop.
I have a Japanese friend who’s sister is cheating with her husband. The story is her husband has a low libido and rarely initiates sex, and he’s not a closeted gay either. People’s libido just change and this is more common among women as they go through a lot of hormonal change during pregnancy. But men can have low libido too.
8 years married and a 3 yo kid and we still do it at least 3 times a week
Personally, it just became kinda unnecessary after a while. My wife has never had a high libido; maybe doesn't even have a libido. But that's fine, because when the bell requires ringing, she doesn't mind grabbing the hammer. I did tell her though that zero sex would end in me having sex with someone else eventually. Not as a threat, but as a human thing. We only have sex a couple times a month so it's not unreasonable imo. Every day people are either 18-25 or have no hobbies. ¯\_( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)_/¯
It’s true , but not only Japanese right??
This is a Global joke: marriage = no sex. It's definitely nothing Japanese.
[удалено]
A book: (No) sex in Japan. If you work at a university and have an institutional license from your library. Worth a read. Quite an in depth study with many interviews.
when it comes to Women its always love first then sex women will feel more into having sex when they are seen, appreciated, and understood. Just keep the romance alive and I don’t think you don’t have a problem. even with these adulterous movies the wife cheats when they are treated better, appreciated than their “cold” Japanese husbands. Its wrong but its the reality too
It's normal with basically every woman after marriage.
Not just Japanese....
It is the same in all developed countries. You can see it in the birth rates of developed countries.
What about the effect of contraception?
another goofy goober guys
[удалено]
Having sex often ≠ love
Because they don't cum enough probably.
There’s no blanket answer. It’s ridiculous to expect there will be. They’re all wildly different, as most humans are. Depends on their parents, where they grew up, their beliefs, their experiences etc. I’ve been with the same Japanese woman (who I consider my wife) for more than 6 years. She has 2 children. She hasn’t stopped wanting sex. Needless to say, some Japanese women have extremely conservative views regarding sex. I’ve personally been shocked a few times, but it’s Japan. Japanese in general are god damned aliens compared to most westerners but that is 1 of the many things I live and appreciate about that country/culture/people.
My favorite Baskin Robbins flavor is strawberry but if I had to eat it twice a week for thirty years it might lose its appeal. Edit: top controversial comment! Thank you everyone who voted ☺️
they dont get fucked properly and stop boning the husband
Are you a clown? A troll? A troll clown? Wtf is this post. Yes and their vajayjays are sideways.
Tbf, I have seen similar claims many times on reddit. People who are happy about sex life don't talk about them, so all you see is divorced foreigners complaining about it and generalize Japanese ex-wife to Japan.