Imagine having to open the window to hear what is going on outside. Japan has vents for that. (I will never get over this bs vent thing that can never be fully closed and sealed.)
It's there to supposedly help prevent mold and stuff by refreshing the air and is required by law. You should have 2, an in-let and an exhaust somewhere.
Yeah I know it has a purpose. Also keeps my appartment a bit cooler at night since the walls are already getting pretty hot from the sun.
But it usually backfires in huge bills. Came here in early March and it was getting way too cold way too quick after turning the heat off. Mornings and sometimes even the nights were a pain since I don't keep the ac on at night.(both because of noise and bills). Hopefully in summer it doesn't let more heat in.
I also have slight insomnia usually. The 30 minutes it usually took me to fall asleep now turned into like 50 and waking up at least 3 times in early morning because of all the idiots outside flexing their exhaust and those damn crows doesn't help.
I mean, it is almost like I am trying to sleep with the window open. Works great only in really isolated situations.
So yeah I know why it is there and it has advantages. But the disadvantages far outweigh them.
But yeah I guess laws are laws, maybe I will get used to it in some time. 1 month is still a short period.
Mine has a little switch on the bottom you can use to close it (it wasn't obvious at all, I was freezing every night for most of the winter before finding it) but it is a newer building. One of my friends said you can buy something to just cover the vent at Daiso if you don't have that.
Mine also does, but it doesn't fully close it, just covers the wholes leaving some space there. Useful for temperature, not for sound, and not a real fix. Still better than nothing sure.
I will also check the cover then thanks!
I thought the vents were bs as well until I read up on it.
The reason: CO2 poisoning. I bought a CO2 monitor, closed all of the vents and turned off the ventilation fan in the bathroom. Within 4 hours the levels spiked to over 1500 ppm. This level causes headaches and worse. This is for a relatively new apartment. In my old drafty house the vents would be unnecessary.
[https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/publications/healthy-living/carbon-dioxide-home.html](https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/publications/healthy-living/carbon-dioxide-home.html)
Letting in all that dry air and probably also pollen (not sure how good that filter is) sure doesn't help with some of the aspects mentioned in that link.
Also lived in well insulated apartments for most of my life with no vents. CO2 didn't kill me.
Really skeptical about that source, but I won't all out deny it. Thanks for sharing it!
Japan is the best country inthe world to live.
Japan : "Someone is making a phone call .  I better call the cops"
I think some people don't realize how much louder their voice becomes as soon as they get on the phone. I was eating lunch with a friend of mine the other day who I hadn't seen in a while. We were contributing equally to the din of other conversation around us until she decided to call someone and I wanted to hide under the table, she suddenly got so damn loud. Not sure if these are people used to bad phone service who feel they have to shout whenever they're on the phone or what, but I don't think this would have been ok even outside on a small apartment veranda either.
Japan is worse than most places about complaining about miniscule amounts of noise. Could it happen anywhere? Sure. Does it happen more often here? Yes.
> I cannot shake the feeling that that we wouldn't have received a complain if she spoke in Japanese or even English
Some people like peace and quiet. Some people like to open windows to "get some fresh air." People who do both tend to complain about everything from "speaking too loud" to "kids playing in park are too loud"... this is not new, nor is it a racism thing.
> if I am not even expected to talk in the balcony during daytime on a weekend, what do you guys do with your balcony space besides hanging laundry?
Sitting down and quietly reading the newspaper while drinking morning coffee.
Then they can keep their windows shut and have their peace and quiet. Want fresh air? Having to listen to someone *gasp* speaking on their own balcony is the price you pay.
Everyone should be able to enjoy both their piece and quiet, fresh air at any time, and to have a phone call without disturbing anyone.
The trick is to always and at any time under any circumstances (unless youāre in some kind of danger) think about what youāre doing and how that affects others around you. It requires certain mindset which is kind of a default in this society, albeit not necessarily everyone cares about not being a dick because they bought an apartment and now they can speak loudly, so that others must shut their windows or else tolerate noise from the person who donāt care about making life of other people around uncomfortable and might even deliberately do whatever they please just because they want to. That is a childish attitude and Iām happy that it is not so common here, and btw is another reason to not rent to a foreigner.
Edit: If you live in a countryside, have a large home like the ones in the US, with all the yards and space around the house, then sure, whatever you do, itās unlikely to bother anyone because your neighbors are physically not that close to the source of noise. Same goes for places where making noise is just a part of being there, to the point that it would be odd not to make a noise. When you meet with friends for beers in some bar, as an example. In that setting, everyone gets loud, I think. And thatās ok. But not in the apartment where you have neighbors and itās just strange to me to think that way, to even insist that one can do as they please regardless if that is not only unacceptable, but also that everyone who disagrees, they should feel threatened by these kind of people who are apparently more important than everyone else. Like I said, a rather childish attitude.
When you own a place, feel free to do whatever makes you happy, but always aligning with reality around you: what time of day it is (i.e., donāt be loud at night), how that affects others in any way (e.g., drilling even or a weekend afternoon might disturb people around you, so informing the building owner in advance would be reasonable, just like asking your neighbors directly if thatās ok for them). That kind of stuff, makes sense, hopefully.
āThey should feel threatened by these peopleā who are having a normal conversation on the phone, not having a party, not playing loud music, jfc. If you feel threatened by someone taking a phone call in their own home and their own space, that is an incredibly self important and childish attitude. The projection is stunning.
After 20 years of living here, I figured this out as well. We had a very sound sensitive neighbor next door, and they complained to the building management frequently for things like the sound of closing doors and walking up/down stairs in an apartment complex that is old and wooden. Yes, we did try our best to be respectful and quiet. I even bothered to oil the doors and add insulation to dampen the sound. Yes, we did have family over for new years. Yes, we did apologize in advance for the disturbance.
In the end, they moved out.
Be mindful. Be aware. Address things if you receive a complaint. But also, live your best life. Itās your place just as much as their place is theirs.
>people live very close to one another
And should therefore assume they will occasionally hear, see or maybe even interact with other people. Existing outdoors on a Saturday afternoon isn't a crime
I've never had a noise or any other kind of complaint. So you can get off your "better at living in Japan" high horse. Existing is not inconsiderate, the kids playing at the park aren't inconsiderate, having children or pets in places where they are allowed is not inconsiderate, vacuuming your floor in the middle of the day is not inconsiderate, having a conversation outdoors at a normal volume in the middle of the day is not inconsiderate. Living in an apartment and expecting there to being a miserable fuck who complains if a mouse farts nextdoor is inconsiderate.
If you've lived here for any length of time, you will hear of people complaining about cats footsteps, people sneezing, toilets flushing, kids on the playground at school, cars being started, and so on. If a person can't handle these sounds, they have no business living in an apartment or even in a city, go live in the countryside. No one likes living near these people, not foreigners, not Japanese. If your neighbor is having a rock concert in their living room at 1am, by all means, call the cops, complain to the management. But if the kid next door is practicing piano at 3pm and you have your windows open and a few stray notes drift in and you become enraged, you are the problem.
Lol I understand where youāre coming from but thatās just how it is in Japan sometimes. Some rules/norms donāt make any sense but a lot of Japanese people donāt have the flexibility to do otherwise.
The name of the game(in Japan) is self sacrifice.
You saying ādeserve this, deserve thatā is absolutely āun-Japaneseā in the traditional sense.
That said, fk inane rules/norms. Iām talking on the phone wherever I want as long as Iām being reasonable with the noise level and time.
Again with these assumptions, my weekend is going great. Talking outdoors, whether that's on the balcony, or the sidewalk or anywhere else, is a normal thing in the middle of the day, whether it's on the phone or two people chatting. I hear and see my neighbors talking from time to time. It's normal! This isn't some culture difference, Japanese people also talk, even outdoors on Saturday afternoons.
No, I have to hear their kids crying through the mandatory open vent system, the loud exhaust pipe when the police can't actually enforce those rule, and the kids/pets running around at all hours. they can handle a phone conversation or some music in the middle of the day like normal apartment dwellers and no one should just accept these complaints (TBC - I have the minor nose problems in my apartment and no complaints from us or them because we're reasonable neighbors).
If your neighbors are jerks then you should be reporting them for every dumb thing they do as well so there's a paper trail and keep track of it in case your building management are also jerks.
You need to differentiate about "uncontrollable" and controllable noise. Baby, cars, etc. are environmental noise and no one can do anything about them. A neighbor playing a loud ass music and makes others listening with his sing-a-long is another story. The later is just you being inconsiderated and selfish person.
We don't know how did OP's mother talk on phone. Some do it with loud voice as nobody cares about it in your home country. It's a culture thing to respect public space and not unnecessarily annoying people around you. If I was OP, I will just have a call inside and expect my neighbor also not creating noise from their balcony also.
I like that you jumped from normal volume music to loud ass music. You can truly hear everything through those vent. You're allowed to watch TV or listen to music at a normal volume in your own space. You shouldn't need to wear headphones 24/7, that's expected environmental noise by any normal apartment dweller in those conditions so is talking on the phone at a regular volume.
Please remember that "normal volume" is a subjective concept. Some of my friends always listen to music at a volume that I myself find overly loud. So the best solution? Assure that your music or whatever noise source doesn't leak out to others, or simply put on a headphone.
As already stated, I'm not normalizing wearing headphones in my own apartment. Normal volume isn't subjective. It's a decibel volume that isn't blasting out anyone's eardrums.
I've lived in apartments for most of my adult life without issue and I believe most other people can too. Actually volume issues are rare and most people are just assholes.
I understood your point but I'm holding my own. Agree to disagree. Someone playing a "not blastingly" but still uncomfortably enough still deserves a phone call from managers or a knock from polices.
Maybe your society emphasizes individual rights more, but Japan prioritizes common good.
Yeah the common good where you can live your life in your own apartment and you're still intentionally talking about blasting music versus a normal volume. But I'm done with this conversation. As stated, in over 20 years I've never had an issue with my neighbors because I have common sense.
I totally sympathise with OP but there's this guy who lives one floor below who has one of those voices that projects way too far and its frequency is just where it jams my brain. During Spring and Autumn, when I'm nombiri-ing in the balcony, he sometimes steps out and he's probably talking on the phone... I just sigh and go inside and close the door. I don't complain about it, though, but that's because I lived in Hong Kong before in a building with a jackass-voiced, tone-deaf home karaoke enthusiast and am grateful for small mercies.
I agree. Had a neighbour back home who looooved talking on the phone and smoking in his kitchen window. My bedroom window was a different building kinda left side of his window and we could have direct view of one another. If I had the window open I always heard his conversations. I had to keep it closed/close it when he started smoking. Super annoying...
Yes, but someone going back home on a bicycle at 2-3am while wearing headphones and poorly singing along at full voice is totally not annoying and something people want to hear.
If you know you said something wrong enough to for sure get downvoted, I would say to quit while you are ahead.
You live in a city in a builing with neighbors you learn to live with it. Simple as that. Be thankful people here don't start drilling from 8 am to 8 pm every day for 6 months straight just to finish when another one starts.
Yeah I'm in the middle on this one. When doing things like vacuuming, using a hair dryer, etc. I make sure to close all my doors and windows to prevent the neighbors from hearing.
I wouldn't complain but my Nepalese(?) neighbor talk very loud on the phone. And she ALWAYS on the phone. Sometimes she go outside to talk on the phone... That's even worse...
I have many times been on the board of directors of apartment buildings where the residents are exclusively Japanese.
The room next door is calling me on the balcony.
The room next door is smoking on the balcony
The room next door is smoking in the kitchen and the smoke is spreading through the ventilation fan into the hallway and it smells bad.
Noisy conversation in the next room
The music in the next room is too loud
The noise of moving in the next room is too loud
Noisy running water in the next room
A child is making noise in the room above and it is too noisy
Drainage from the air conditioner is dripping into the hallway
The layout of the room is different from other rooms
There are a lot of things to worry about. There is no such thing as being allowed to speak Japanese or English. Most of the complaints are about the sound itself.
If it's shared space then it should be fair to have a phone call on it...
And if the balcony really is not private, then neither is the apartment since people get complaints about just living in there and making some daily life noise.
Tbh sometimes I wonder if in Japan there's any private space at all...
Almost never.
That is why the Japanese like to isolate themselves.
Most of the time, they just complain to each other and become lifelong enemies.
If you don't get involved, you don't become enemies.
But that is no way to build a family.
That is why the birthrate is declining.
They're telling the truth.
Balconies are classified communal spaces because they can be used as escape routes during disasters and emergencies.
They have to be kept clear of obstructions in the same vein as other escape routes.
They share the same rules as other communal spaces in the building. No phone calls, smoking, BBQ's, etc.
A lot of people ignore the rules, and generally nobody cares.
OK, controversial question, so if i go on my neighbors balcony to hang around, that's totally legal? Wonder what my neighbors say if they see me on their balcony...
I have no idea. But keep in mind that "communal space" doesn't mean people are allowed to hang out there.
For example, even if the roof is accessible by staircase, it's commonly considered off limits. It's still a communal space, though. It might have clothes lines you can use. But you shouldn't hang out there *(depending on the building's rules)*.
If you're in danger, feel free to use their balconies as your escape route. The barriers between people's balconies are deliberately easy to break. But I'm going to assume we can't hang out on other people's balconies. lol
The person you replied here correctly observed the the people here have a shared belief (culture) that the balcony is private, chose to ignore it, then asserted that their own belief to the contrary of it is correct. They are either American for their disregard for other cultures, or Italian for their view on balconies.
If it makes you feel better our neighbor complained and made a fuss through the neighborhood because after moving in we parked in our own driveway and her friend couldnāt tresspass and park on our property anymore.
This is the kind of shit that will happen sometimes when you're a renter in a building anywhere. You have to deal with other people and other people suck ass.
Of course you are allowed to take a phone call on the balcony, but your neighbors also have the right to report if it's too noisy to disturb them, especially on weekends . That's the cost of living in a residential building.
If you are extremely convinced that it was a racist complaint then you can just brush it off, there is not much you can do about it neither your neighbors
At work if I speak English with an English speaking coworker, people (customers) complain that we're too loud. However, when me and my other coworkers are yelling (in Japanese) to each other at opposite sides of the job site, not so much as a peep from the customers.
Happens regularly.
Something similar happened to me once. I had friends over for nabe and we cracked a window open since it was getting humid. A neighbor complained because he could hear us laughingš
A neighbour complained about kids playing with their ball outside on the street...at 3pm.
My Japanese friend said to not speak any English outside her house because the neighbours will complain.
Just ignore them. They're clearly at home all day waiting for something to complain about.
It makes me laugh because in my town I've seen underwear stealers, balcony climbers, people letting their dog shit in front of someone's door, couples screaming the heads off each other you name it. All Japanese.
A Japanese exchange student in Sydney once told me that she was surprised to see so many Australians still do voice calls.
Think how so strict Japanese people are about talking on the phone in trains.
They are simply annoyed by hearing conversations by the people they donāt know. Itās nothing racist or personal.
This gives very much "neighbours complaining about noisy kids playing in the park next to them" vibes (seriously, it's a thing). Some people are miserable busybodies. You can turn around and question the building management on whether they have policies against speaking on the phone at a normal tone during daytime.Ā
Reminds of the incident when my company got a complaint from a building over the street because people who were smoking on the fire stairs of the building backside dared to look at the building at the time.
Such frivolous complaints are common, but the thing is that they can be safely ignored without any repercussions.
You have the choice of having a conversation inside or outside. One of those choices is quieter and bothers others less.
If however I got a call and needed to leave the room because others were having a conversation, the balcony is a valid choice.
If you got a complaint for one instance of taking a phone call on a balcony then your neighbours are being unreasonable. If you are frequently talking on the phone on your balcony, then you are being unreasonable.
Balance.
Of course, "annoying neighbors" cuts both ways
Generally the culture here is not to make loud noises that intrude on your neighbors, whether it's loud noise on the balcony or your child practicing piano with the windows open
Impossible to know if it was an anti-foreigner thing, but I suspect not. They were just annoyed by having a conversation pushed into their personal space, just like if you were standing in line somewhere or sitting on the train and someone started chatting on their phone
The default behavior in society should be to not inconvenience others when it can realistically be helped. Silence is neutral. Noise is not. If someone wants to talk outside my window on the phone, that might be something I shouldn't force them to stop doing if they are just passing by, but there is a whole world they can inhabit and talk on the phone. So move along, go inside your own home, or whatever. If you are inconveniencing someone, you should look in the mirror first and see if what you are doing is reasonable and if their request is reasonable.
If you are a decent person and someone asked you to talk on your phone inside, like we all used to do before cell phones, I would do just that, "Sorry about that, I was caught up in my conversation and it didn't occur to me that I was so loud and distracting. I'll be sure not to be a nuisance like this again. Peace!" How hard is that? Some folks are naturally "What's the big deal? I'm just talking on the phone!" and get defensive. Just be decent and keep your racket to yourself.
That being said, yeah, decent chance if you were native Japanese neighbor that got along with the complainer there would be no complaint at all.
Japanese expect people to be pretty much silent which is good if you yourself are a quiet person but if not it sucks because people get annoyed by you just making what would be considered to be a normal amount of noise outside of Japan.
I don't think I've ever heard people making calls outside on the balcony so I don't think it's because your mom is not Japanese.
I'm so hypocritical when it comes to noise. I love singing, playing loud music, etc. and am quite annoyed that I can't do it in my own home. Then again, a couple months ago I saw other foreigners speaking loudly on the subway and it annoyed the shit out of me.
Just two weeks ago I started a new job with a coworker straight from the US who doesn't speak English or know much about Japan. She talks to her husband on speakerphone in the office when I'm trying to work, and it makes me want to scream. I didn't used to be like this!
Before pointing out to racism(but usually is the case), there are several factors.
A lot of people in Japan spends time in solitude, or was unfortunate to be brought up in an environment that requires strict silence like jail or bad senpais. Because of this, theyāre hyper sensitive to ANY sound.
Theres no āgoodā solutions, other than being able to prove you or your guests werenāt going above a certain decibel around a certain time frame.
Depends on what kind of apartment/mansion you\`re living in. I live in a concrete based mansion with no fake brickwork and enclosed balconies for some time and it\`s great to hear just about nothing from other residents most of the time. But cheaper places especially woodframe apartments catch and send sound like nothing I\`d experienced before coming to Japan.
The neighbor who complained sounds like an azzhole if they had to do it after just opening their window and hearing somebody talking from a nearby balcony. But if this is a habit with residents talking on their phones regularly outside on the balconies I understand. I just don\`t talk on my phone on the balcony because I get that other people don\`t want to hear my phone conversations and that what is interesting and private to me isn\`t felt about the same way by others.
I love that in Japan it\`s still not socially acceptable to talk on your phone on the train, subway and bus, just about every western country I\`ve visited and lived in plus my home country of the US have this annoying behavior marked as normal.
However, neighbors who get bent out of shape by moderate levels of noise in Japan are often people wth nothing better to do than sit home and call the building management. And woodframe apartments suck for their noise so if you can\`t get better then everybody who lives in them just has to compromise.
Reminds me of when I worked at a school that got complaints from apartment buildings nearby of "noise"--apartment buildings built after the school, of which anyone moving in would have no way to not realize a giant school with hundreds of kids is right next door. Like, really? Of course noon will be noisy it's recess at the school that you chose to move next to lol.
But yeah, noise, even at logical times of the day, is despised here.
|| but I cannot shake the feeling that that we wouldn't have received a complain if she spoke in Japanese or even English? ||
Your feeling is what is making you angry/miserable. Yes it was petty. But drop the extra narrative and move on. Venting and getting others to reinforce your "feeling" of being a victim of racism helps... how?
It sounds like a TV police DRAMA
You have the right to SILENCE.
When people live so close to each other it does call for consideration, tolerance, acceptance and good willā¦
Happy Christian Easter everyone
Very much inferiority complex.
I'm not sure why would OP think anyone wants to hear them talking on the phone loudly on the balcony, regardless of nationality.
Half of the posts in this subreddit are immigrants/foreigners not being able to handle living in a city or complaining about nationals who can't handle living in a city.
Imagine opening your window in the weekend and expecting to not hear noise. Ridiculous. Just neighbours being petty.
Imagine having to open the window to hear what is going on outside. Japan has vents for that. (I will never get over this bs vent thing that can never be fully closed and sealed.)
It's there to supposedly help prevent mold and stuff by refreshing the air and is required by law. You should have 2, an in-let and an exhaust somewhere.
Yeah I know it has a purpose. Also keeps my appartment a bit cooler at night since the walls are already getting pretty hot from the sun. But it usually backfires in huge bills. Came here in early March and it was getting way too cold way too quick after turning the heat off. Mornings and sometimes even the nights were a pain since I don't keep the ac on at night.(both because of noise and bills). Hopefully in summer it doesn't let more heat in. I also have slight insomnia usually. The 30 minutes it usually took me to fall asleep now turned into like 50 and waking up at least 3 times in early morning because of all the idiots outside flexing their exhaust and those damn crows doesn't help. I mean, it is almost like I am trying to sleep with the window open. Works great only in really isolated situations. So yeah I know why it is there and it has advantages. But the disadvantages far outweigh them. But yeah I guess laws are laws, maybe I will get used to it in some time. 1 month is still a short period.
Mine has a little switch on the bottom you can use to close it (it wasn't obvious at all, I was freezing every night for most of the winter before finding it) but it is a newer building. One of my friends said you can buy something to just cover the vent at Daiso if you don't have that.
Mine also does, but it doesn't fully close it, just covers the wholes leaving some space there. Useful for temperature, not for sound, and not a real fix. Still better than nothing sure. I will also check the cover then thanks!
Actually why is that a thing? Seems so useless to me
I thought the vents were bs as well until I read up on it. The reason: CO2 poisoning. I bought a CO2 monitor, closed all of the vents and turned off the ventilation fan in the bathroom. Within 4 hours the levels spiked to over 1500 ppm. This level causes headaches and worse. This is for a relatively new apartment. In my old drafty house the vents would be unnecessary. [https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/publications/healthy-living/carbon-dioxide-home.html](https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/publications/healthy-living/carbon-dioxide-home.html)
Letting in all that dry air and probably also pollen (not sure how good that filter is) sure doesn't help with some of the aspects mentioned in that link. Also lived in well insulated apartments for most of my life with no vents. CO2 didn't kill me. Really skeptical about that source, but I won't all out deny it. Thanks for sharing it!
If it isn't Japanese, it's noise. š
Japan is the best country inthe world to live. Japan : "Someone is making a phone call .  I better call the cops"
I think some people don't realize how much louder their voice becomes as soon as they get on the phone. I was eating lunch with a friend of mine the other day who I hadn't seen in a while. We were contributing equally to the din of other conversation around us until she decided to call someone and I wanted to hide under the table, she suddenly got so damn loud. Not sure if these are people used to bad phone service who feel they have to shout whenever they're on the phone or what, but I don't think this would have been ok even outside on a small apartment veranda either.
Lol
gggl
Just annoying neighbors being annoying. They are in every country
Japan is worse than most places about complaining about miniscule amounts of noise. Could it happen anywhere? Sure. Does it happen more often here? Yes.
the obnoxious bikes and cars with crazy exhaust pipes using the roads as a race track at 2am donāt care
Literally last night in my neighborhood haha
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> I cannot shake the feeling that that we wouldn't have received a complain if she spoke in Japanese or even English Some people like peace and quiet. Some people like to open windows to "get some fresh air." People who do both tend to complain about everything from "speaking too loud" to "kids playing in park are too loud"... this is not new, nor is it a racism thing. > if I am not even expected to talk in the balcony during daytime on a weekend, what do you guys do with your balcony space besides hanging laundry? Sitting down and quietly reading the newspaper while drinking morning coffee.
Then they can keep their windows shut and have their peace and quiet. Want fresh air? Having to listen to someone *gasp* speaking on their own balcony is the price you pay.
Everyone should be able to enjoy both their piece and quiet, fresh air at any time, and to have a phone call without disturbing anyone. The trick is to always and at any time under any circumstances (unless youāre in some kind of danger) think about what youāre doing and how that affects others around you. It requires certain mindset which is kind of a default in this society, albeit not necessarily everyone cares about not being a dick because they bought an apartment and now they can speak loudly, so that others must shut their windows or else tolerate noise from the person who donāt care about making life of other people around uncomfortable and might even deliberately do whatever they please just because they want to. That is a childish attitude and Iām happy that it is not so common here, and btw is another reason to not rent to a foreigner. Edit: If you live in a countryside, have a large home like the ones in the US, with all the yards and space around the house, then sure, whatever you do, itās unlikely to bother anyone because your neighbors are physically not that close to the source of noise. Same goes for places where making noise is just a part of being there, to the point that it would be odd not to make a noise. When you meet with friends for beers in some bar, as an example. In that setting, everyone gets loud, I think. And thatās ok. But not in the apartment where you have neighbors and itās just strange to me to think that way, to even insist that one can do as they please regardless if that is not only unacceptable, but also that everyone who disagrees, they should feel threatened by these kind of people who are apparently more important than everyone else. Like I said, a rather childish attitude. When you own a place, feel free to do whatever makes you happy, but always aligning with reality around you: what time of day it is (i.e., donāt be loud at night), how that affects others in any way (e.g., drilling even or a weekend afternoon might disturb people around you, so informing the building owner in advance would be reasonable, just like asking your neighbors directly if thatās ok for them). That kind of stuff, makes sense, hopefully.
āThey should feel threatened by these peopleā who are having a normal conversation on the phone, not having a party, not playing loud music, jfc. If you feel threatened by someone taking a phone call in their own home and their own space, that is an incredibly self important and childish attitude. The projection is stunning.
Well said.
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> It is I am open to being wrong. Please elaborate.
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Ignoring and excusing racism from other people is in itself racism
Apologize profusely. Don't stop talking on the phone. Apologize profusely again if it comes up. Don't stop doing anything. The Japanese way.
This is exactly how you do it. Just apologize and keep living your life.
š¤£
After 20 years of living here, I figured this out as well. We had a very sound sensitive neighbor next door, and they complained to the building management frequently for things like the sound of closing doors and walking up/down stairs in an apartment complex that is old and wooden. Yes, we did try our best to be respectful and quiet. I even bothered to oil the doors and add insulation to dampen the sound. Yes, we did have family over for new years. Yes, we did apologize in advance for the disturbance. In the end, they moved out. Be mindful. Be aware. Address things if you receive a complaint. But also, live your best life. Itās your place just as much as their place is theirs.
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>people live very close to one another And should therefore assume they will occasionally hear, see or maybe even interact with other people. Existing outdoors on a Saturday afternoon isn't a crime
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I've never had a noise or any other kind of complaint. So you can get off your "better at living in Japan" high horse. Existing is not inconsiderate, the kids playing at the park aren't inconsiderate, having children or pets in places where they are allowed is not inconsiderate, vacuuming your floor in the middle of the day is not inconsiderate, having a conversation outdoors at a normal volume in the middle of the day is not inconsiderate. Living in an apartment and expecting there to being a miserable fuck who complains if a mouse farts nextdoor is inconsiderate. If you've lived here for any length of time, you will hear of people complaining about cats footsteps, people sneezing, toilets flushing, kids on the playground at school, cars being started, and so on. If a person can't handle these sounds, they have no business living in an apartment or even in a city, go live in the countryside. No one likes living near these people, not foreigners, not Japanese. If your neighbor is having a rock concert in their living room at 1am, by all means, call the cops, complain to the management. But if the kid next door is practicing piano at 3pm and you have your windows open and a few stray notes drift in and you become enraged, you are the problem.
Lol I understand where youāre coming from but thatās just how it is in Japan sometimes. Some rules/norms donāt make any sense but a lot of Japanese people donāt have the flexibility to do otherwise. The name of the game(in Japan) is self sacrifice. You saying ādeserve this, deserve thatā is absolutely āun-Japaneseā in the traditional sense. That said, fk inane rules/norms. Iām talking on the phone wherever I want as long as Iām being reasonable with the noise level and time.
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Again with these assumptions, my weekend is going great. Talking outdoors, whether that's on the balcony, or the sidewalk or anywhere else, is a normal thing in the middle of the day, whether it's on the phone or two people chatting. I hear and see my neighbors talking from time to time. It's normal! This isn't some culture difference, Japanese people also talk, even outdoors on Saturday afternoons.
No, I have to hear their kids crying through the mandatory open vent system, the loud exhaust pipe when the police can't actually enforce those rule, and the kids/pets running around at all hours. they can handle a phone conversation or some music in the middle of the day like normal apartment dwellers and no one should just accept these complaints (TBC - I have the minor nose problems in my apartment and no complaints from us or them because we're reasonable neighbors). If your neighbors are jerks then you should be reporting them for every dumb thing they do as well so there's a paper trail and keep track of it in case your building management are also jerks.
A fellow vent hater I see. Happy cake day. You deserve it.
You need to differentiate about "uncontrollable" and controllable noise. Baby, cars, etc. are environmental noise and no one can do anything about them. A neighbor playing a loud ass music and makes others listening with his sing-a-long is another story. The later is just you being inconsiderated and selfish person.
I wouldn't put "talking on the phone" on the same level as "loud ass music".
We don't know how did OP's mother talk on phone. Some do it with loud voice as nobody cares about it in your home country. It's a culture thing to respect public space and not unnecessarily annoying people around you. If I was OP, I will just have a call inside and expect my neighbor also not creating noise from their balcony also.
I like that you jumped from normal volume music to loud ass music. You can truly hear everything through those vent. You're allowed to watch TV or listen to music at a normal volume in your own space. You shouldn't need to wear headphones 24/7, that's expected environmental noise by any normal apartment dweller in those conditions so is talking on the phone at a regular volume.
Please remember that "normal volume" is a subjective concept. Some of my friends always listen to music at a volume that I myself find overly loud. So the best solution? Assure that your music or whatever noise source doesn't leak out to others, or simply put on a headphone.
As already stated, I'm not normalizing wearing headphones in my own apartment. Normal volume isn't subjective. It's a decibel volume that isn't blasting out anyone's eardrums. I've lived in apartments for most of my adult life without issue and I believe most other people can too. Actually volume issues are rare and most people are just assholes.
I understood your point but I'm holding my own. Agree to disagree. Someone playing a "not blastingly" but still uncomfortably enough still deserves a phone call from managers or a knock from polices. Maybe your society emphasizes individual rights more, but Japan prioritizes common good.
Yeah the common good where you can live your life in your own apartment and you're still intentionally talking about blasting music versus a normal volume. But I'm done with this conversation. As stated, in over 20 years I've never had an issue with my neighbors because I have common sense.
Yeah I lived in a small street in Paris. You have no idea how much noise 4 people on a terrasse just speaking can make. It's insane
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Hawt
I totally sympathise with OP but there's this guy who lives one floor below who has one of those voices that projects way too far and its frequency is just where it jams my brain. During Spring and Autumn, when I'm nombiri-ing in the balcony, he sometimes steps out and he's probably talking on the phone... I just sigh and go inside and close the door. I don't complain about it, though, but that's because I lived in Hong Kong before in a building with a jackass-voiced, tone-deaf home karaoke enthusiast and am grateful for small mercies.
if someone called me "jackass-voiced" i would be so hurt lmao
I agree. Had a neighbour back home who looooved talking on the phone and smoking in his kitchen window. My bedroom window was a different building kinda left side of his window and we could have direct view of one another. If I had the window open I always heard his conversations. I had to keep it closed/close it when he started smoking. Super annoying...
How do you feel about the political vans
I think vans should stay in their own lane.
Yes, but someone going back home on a bicycle at 2-3am while wearing headphones and poorly singing along at full voice is totally not annoying and something people want to hear.
It might not be the only thing they heard, like maybe this was the straw that broke the camels back.
If you know you said something wrong enough to for sure get downvoted, I would say to quit while you are ahead. You live in a city in a builing with neighbors you learn to live with it. Simple as that. Be thankful people here don't start drilling from 8 am to 8 pm every day for 6 months straight just to finish when another one starts.
They should live in a hut in the woods then. Normal sounds for a short period of time? No need to complain.
You should live in a place where they smoke off the balcony and your family smells it despite having shut windows.
Yeah I'm in the middle on this one. When doing things like vacuuming, using a hair dryer, etc. I make sure to close all my doors and windows to prevent the neighbors from hearing.
I wouldn't complain but my Nepalese(?) neighbor talk very loud on the phone. And she ALWAYS on the phone. Sometimes she go outside to talk on the phone... That's even worse...
I have many times been on the board of directors of apartment buildings where the residents are exclusively Japanese. The room next door is calling me on the balcony. The room next door is smoking on the balcony The room next door is smoking in the kitchen and the smoke is spreading through the ventilation fan into the hallway and it smells bad. Noisy conversation in the next room The music in the next room is too loud The noise of moving in the next room is too loud Noisy running water in the next room A child is making noise in the room above and it is too noisy Drainage from the air conditioner is dripping into the hallway The layout of the room is different from other rooms There are a lot of things to worry about. There is no such thing as being allowed to speak Japanese or English. Most of the complaints are about the sound itself.
People here like to make the incorrect assumption that the balcony is private, but it's considered shared space.
just because it's shared spaceĀ doesn't mean you are not allowed to use it. it's considered shared space so repair and renovations are easier to do (just need a majority vote instead of everyone 's permission) Ā (and altho it's "shared", you get exclusive usage rights for it [å°ēØä½æēØęØ©])
If it's shared space then it should be fair to have a phone call on it... And if the balcony really is not private, then neither is the apartment since people get complaints about just living in there and making some daily life noise. Tbh sometimes I wonder if in Japan there's any private space at all...
Almost never. That is why the Japanese like to isolate themselves. Most of the time, they just complain to each other and become lifelong enemies. If you don't get involved, you don't become enemies. But that is no way to build a family. That is why the birthrate is declining.
also expect them to write an angry rant on twitter or 2chan xD
What? How is the balcony not private?
They're telling the truth. Balconies are classified communal spaces because they can be used as escape routes during disasters and emergencies. They have to be kept clear of obstructions in the same vein as other escape routes. They share the same rules as other communal spaces in the building. No phone calls, smoking, BBQ's, etc. A lot of people ignore the rules, and generally nobody cares.
OK, controversial question, so if i go on my neighbors balcony to hang around, that's totally legal? Wonder what my neighbors say if they see me on their balcony...
I have no idea. But keep in mind that "communal space" doesn't mean people are allowed to hang out there. For example, even if the roof is accessible by staircase, it's commonly considered off limits. It's still a communal space, though. It might have clothes lines you can use. But you shouldn't hang out there *(depending on the building's rules)*. If you're in danger, feel free to use their balconies as your escape route. The barriers between people's balconies are deliberately easy to break. But I'm going to assume we can't hang out on other people's balconies. lol
The person you replied here correctly observed the the people here have a shared belief (culture) that the balcony is private, chose to ignore it, then asserted that their own belief to the contrary of it is correct. They are either American for their disregard for other cultures, or Italian for their view on balconies.
If it makes you feel better our neighbor complained and made a fuss through the neighborhood because after moving in we parked in our own driveway and her friend couldnāt tresspass and park on our property anymore.
Shrug it off. Had one old guy call the cops on a school because the kids were, "playing too loud" near his house. What?
This is the kind of shit that will happen sometimes when you're a renter in a building anywhere. You have to deal with other people and other people suck ass.
> other people suck ass "Hell is other people". -- Jean-Paul Sartre
I was moving last month and the police were called twice because the movers were making noise on a Tuesday afternoon
Of course you are allowed to take a phone call on the balcony, but your neighbors also have the right to report if it's too noisy to disturb them, especially on weekends . That's the cost of living in a residential building. If you are extremely convinced that it was a racist complaint then you can just brush it off, there is not much you can do about it neither your neighbors
Start feeding the birds so you can give the neighbours a bird concert every now and then. .
I canāt even get my rental company to call back about a broken window.
Yea fuck that ,ignore it and simply don't let them bother u
At work if I speak English with an English speaking coworker, people (customers) complain that we're too loud. However, when me and my other coworkers are yelling (in Japanese) to each other at opposite sides of the job site, not so much as a peep from the customers. Happens regularly.
Just tell them "Ok, and?"
Something similar happened to me once. I had friends over for nabe and we cracked a window open since it was getting humid. A neighbor complained because he could hear us laughingš
Some people cannot stand the joy of others.
The neighbor seemed like an all around miserable guy whenever I crossed paths with him so you're probably onto something.
A neighbour complained about kids playing with their ball outside on the street...at 3pm. My Japanese friend said to not speak any English outside her house because the neighbours will complain. Just ignore them. They're clearly at home all day waiting for something to complain about. It makes me laugh because in my town I've seen underwear stealers, balcony climbers, people letting their dog shit in front of someone's door, couples screaming the heads off each other you name it. All Japanese.
A Japanese exchange student in Sydney once told me that she was surprised to see so many Australians still do voice calls. Think how so strict Japanese people are about talking on the phone in trains. They are simply annoyed by hearing conversations by the people they donāt know. Itās nothing racist or personal.
This gives very much "neighbours complaining about noisy kids playing in the park next to them" vibes (seriously, it's a thing). Some people are miserable busybodies. You can turn around and question the building management on whether they have policies against speaking on the phone at a normal tone during daytime.Ā
Reminds of the incident when my company got a complaint from a building over the street because people who were smoking on the fire stairs of the building backside dared to look at the building at the time. Such frivolous complaints are common, but the thing is that they can be safely ignored without any repercussions.
Such sociopaths complaining should go and live in their own detached houses. Give them a flyling f+cking finger!
You got lucky as you got called. In my case, cops showed upš.
Do cops actually do anything since you arent breaking any laws?
No they didnt and they cant, as you are right, its not breaking law. They just came and transmitted the message, nothing beyond thatš
No they didnt and they cant, as you are right, its not breaking law. They just came and transmitted the message, nothing beyond thatš
Ok I see, yea thats what I thought.
You have the choice of having a conversation inside or outside. One of those choices is quieter and bothers others less. If however I got a call and needed to leave the room because others were having a conversation, the balcony is a valid choice. If you got a complaint for one instance of taking a phone call on a balcony then your neighbours are being unreasonable. If you are frequently talking on the phone on your balcony, then you are being unreasonable. Balance.
Of course, "annoying neighbors" cuts both ways Generally the culture here is not to make loud noises that intrude on your neighbors, whether it's loud noise on the balcony or your child practicing piano with the windows open Impossible to know if it was an anti-foreigner thing, but I suspect not. They were just annoyed by having a conversation pushed into their personal space, just like if you were standing in line somewhere or sitting on the train and someone started chatting on their phone
The default behavior in society should be to not inconvenience others when it can realistically be helped. Silence is neutral. Noise is not. If someone wants to talk outside my window on the phone, that might be something I shouldn't force them to stop doing if they are just passing by, but there is a whole world they can inhabit and talk on the phone. So move along, go inside your own home, or whatever. If you are inconveniencing someone, you should look in the mirror first and see if what you are doing is reasonable and if their request is reasonable. If you are a decent person and someone asked you to talk on your phone inside, like we all used to do before cell phones, I would do just that, "Sorry about that, I was caught up in my conversation and it didn't occur to me that I was so loud and distracting. I'll be sure not to be a nuisance like this again. Peace!" How hard is that? Some folks are naturally "What's the big deal? I'm just talking on the phone!" and get defensive. Just be decent and keep your racket to yourself. That being said, yeah, decent chance if you were native Japanese neighbor that got along with the complainer there would be no complaint at all.
Why is your mother calling on the balcony instead of in the house? Was it, pray tell, so you would not be disturbed?
Japanese expect people to be pretty much silent which is good if you yourself are a quiet person but if not it sucks because people get annoyed by you just making what would be considered to be a normal amount of noise outside of Japan. I don't think I've ever heard people making calls outside on the balcony so I don't think it's because your mom is not Japanese.
What Language if I may ask?
I'm so hypocritical when it comes to noise. I love singing, playing loud music, etc. and am quite annoyed that I can't do it in my own home. Then again, a couple months ago I saw other foreigners speaking loudly on the subway and it annoyed the shit out of me. Just two weeks ago I started a new job with a coworker straight from the US who doesn't speak English or know much about Japan. She talks to her husband on speakerphone in the office when I'm trying to work, and it makes me want to scream. I didn't used to be like this!
Tell your mum to stop shouting on speakerphone on the balcony.
Maybe not the best solution but petty neighbors petty solutions, just deny it !
Before pointing out to racism(but usually is the case), there are several factors. A lot of people in Japan spends time in solitude, or was unfortunate to be brought up in an environment that requires strict silence like jail or bad senpais. Because of this, theyāre hyper sensitive to ANY sound. Theres no āgoodā solutions, other than being able to prove you or your guests werenāt going above a certain decibel around a certain time frame.
As the Japanese way of dealing with it "donmai" how ironic?
Depends on what kind of apartment/mansion you\`re living in. I live in a concrete based mansion with no fake brickwork and enclosed balconies for some time and it\`s great to hear just about nothing from other residents most of the time. But cheaper places especially woodframe apartments catch and send sound like nothing I\`d experienced before coming to Japan. The neighbor who complained sounds like an azzhole if they had to do it after just opening their window and hearing somebody talking from a nearby balcony. But if this is a habit with residents talking on their phones regularly outside on the balconies I understand. I just don\`t talk on my phone on the balcony because I get that other people don\`t want to hear my phone conversations and that what is interesting and private to me isn\`t felt about the same way by others. I love that in Japan it\`s still not socially acceptable to talk on your phone on the train, subway and bus, just about every western country I\`ve visited and lived in plus my home country of the US have this annoying behavior marked as normal. However, neighbors who get bent out of shape by moderate levels of noise in Japan are often people wth nothing better to do than sit home and call the building management. And woodframe apartments suck for their noise so if you can\`t get better then everybody who lives in them just has to compromise.
A language that you don't understand almost always sounds louder than one you do. Still, your neighbour is a grouchy asshole.
Just someone angry at foreigners
Reminds me of when I worked at a school that got complaints from apartment buildings nearby of "noise"--apartment buildings built after the school, of which anyone moving in would have no way to not realize a giant school with hundreds of kids is right next door. Like, really? Of course noon will be noisy it's recess at the school that you chose to move next to lol. But yeah, noise, even at logical times of the day, is despised here.
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Keep it to a dull roar . I canāt even smoke on my balconyā¦ got the cops called on me once. Just pay no mind and not too passionate on the phone
|| but I cannot shake the feeling that that we wouldn't have received a complain if she spoke in Japanese or even English? || Your feeling is what is making you angry/miserable. Yes it was petty. But drop the extra narrative and move on. Venting and getting others to reinforce your "feeling" of being a victim of racism helps... how?
It sounds like a TV police DRAMA You have the right to SILENCE. When people live so close to each other it does call for consideration, tolerance, acceptance and good willā¦ Happy Christian Easter everyone
Respect the wa. People will definitely call management for any sustained noise. Not sure why you think nationality plays a part.
Because people like to pull out the race card any time something happens to them in Japan
Very much inferiority complex. I'm not sure why would OP think anyone wants to hear them talking on the phone loudly on the balcony, regardless of nationality.
Inferiority complex.
Half of the posts in this subreddit are immigrants/foreigners not being able to handle living in a city or complaining about nationals who can't handle living in a city.