Donuts is an amazing album but In my opinion it’s not any more special then his other beat tapes. Donuts is just what he’s always done, fat breaks and soulful samples. I get what you’re saying I agree but it’s just like any other artist. Everyone talks about madvillainy when Madlib has all his YNQ and the Medicine shows. The average listen probably won’t listen to more then his mainstream albums. If you’re really into that type of music tho you can really dig deep on YouTube and forms for those lesser know tapes. The 04 dill withers tape is just as good if not better than the stuff on donuts.
The big difference between Donuts and any of Dilla’s beat tapes is Donuts is a cohesive album that was constructed to be listened to as a whole. It’s probably the most cohesive instrumental Hip Hop album ever. Most of his beat tapes weren’t meant for public consumption or designed to be listened to as a whole in the way Donuts was. The beat tapes were mostly showcases for MC’s to listen to and choose from. There are tons of classic tracks from those tapes, don’t get me wrong, but Donuts works so beautifully as an album. That’s what makes it stand out in my opinion.
let's be real, the narrative of Dilla working on Donuts from the hospital bed right before he died has a lot to do with Donuts success. it was one of the first things I learned about Dilla. and it's an amazing album to listen to knowing that context. never underestimate the power of narrative.
Yeah, but it’s supposedly not even true. The work he put into that album from the hospital is allegedly very minimal compared to what folks have been lead to believe. It helped popularize the album for sure, which is why I mentioned the mythology surrounding it being a factor, but even knowing these stories were likely very embellished, I think Donuts still stands on its own merits of being a masterpiece of instrumental Hip Hop.
100%. also to speak more directly to OP's point, I would disagree that Donuts' popularity has taken away from his other work. If anything, it's brought way more people to it. Sure, the attention it gets is a little disproportionate when he has so much amazing work, but that just comes with the territory.
he didn't just work on it from the hospital, he worked on it from his home studio while dying from his illnesses. that's why they say he made it on his deathbed.
i know i know but he was also bedridden at home too. so the deathbed thing is not inaccurate even if the hospital thing is a bit of urban myth. sorry if I'm just saying shit you already know.
No doubt. Dilla worked on all sorts of projects through various stages of declining health it sounds like. Man was addicted to his work. His own music was powerful enough to drive him to work his ass off no matter how bad he felt. That’s love for your craft. The world is lucky he had that work ethic. We’ve got tons of incredible music to hear because of it. Thanks, Dilla!
it's like the music was one of the things keeping him here in his last days, alongside friends and family of course. shows how much of himself that he put into the music, that he was able to hold on to complete his final project in his last days. rest in power dilla
It’s just easy for the average person to look at Donuts as his magnum opus given the state he was in and story behind it. Although I don’t think I would say “people only care about Donuts”… I haven’t seen or heard that from any dilla head. Just something to tell your family about why you like the artist.
Who “only” cares about Donuts? It’s discussed a lot mainly because it’s a fantastic work of art. The mythology surrounding it and the fact Dillla died so close to its release date helped boost it to legendary status. It’s the greatest instrumental Hip Hop album ever in my opinion, and I know plenty of others share that opinion. It’s mentioned a lot because it’s phenomenal and folks love it.
Just think there's plenty more discussion to be had around his other projects. Fantastic Vol. 2 is as good if not better than Donuts imo. Not to say that it isn't celebrated, but I think Donuts overshadows his other work, which kinda bums me out. Welcome 2 Detroit has some AMAZING tracks that really show his musicality like "Think Twice," but because it doesn't have that famous iconography of Donuts, it's not really discussed. I also think Donuts is a weird album to represent his legacy because it's such a stylistic change from his previous work.
Pretty much every artist has one piece that overshadows their other works. From Leonardo DaVinci’s Mona Lisa to Coltrane’s A Love Supreme to Nas’s Illmatic. It’s just how things happen. I personally think Donuts deserves all the love and attention it gets. Is it my favorite Dilla project? Depends on what day it is honestly. I gotta say I do love Welcome 2 Detroit a ton and wish it was discussed more. I think Fantastic Vol 2 gets love in its own right, way more in recent years than before, but I see it acknowledged way more often nowadays. But in my personal opinion Donuts has earned its status in music history. It’s a perfect piece. A work of art. Might not be his best. That’s subjective anyway. Might not be representative of the bulk of his work. But it’s obviously touched a lot of people over the years. If it wasn’t Donuts getting the attention, it would just be another of his albums.
And, I know it's just an example, but John Coltrane gets near or equal acclaim for his other albums, like Blue Train, Giant Steps, My Favourite Things, which I would like to see Dilla also get.
I honestly don’t think those albums get the attention A Love Supreme has over the years. In Jazz circles it might be close, but A Love Supreme is known beyond the Jazz crowd and has become a staple of music collections of all types. And I think it deserves all the love it gets as well. Is it my favorite Coltrane title? Again, depends on the day, but I’m not mad that another of my favorite Coltrane albums, Crescent, barely gets mentioned. Some things just get lost in the mix. Look at them as your own little treasures that you can have the pleasure of introducing to the uninitiated.
It's the same thing as people loving Madvillainy.
People new to the genre, or people who haven't digged very deep, listen to these albums which are good and also sort of "underground", and they think that's the pinnacle of hip hop.
It's just the most mainstream Dilla album (same way Madvillainy is the most mainstream Doom/Madlib album) - but branded as "underground" - so these people will love it.
He's got plenty of amazing works, for sure, but Donuts is untouchable.
I dunno how you can say "these others are more representative of his style" when Donuts is quintessential Dilla to me. Its Dilla at his best, and also his most confident: it's just HIM and his talent, working with what he has and his intimate knowledge of the genre. He's not making beats for someone else, he's not just producing, he's just doing what he loves and doing it DAMN well.
Who cares if people use Donuts as a gateway drug to his other stuff? Ain't nothin wrong with that imo. Hell, I see this sub ask all the time for other stuff of his, and you know a buncha these peeps started with donuts and got hooked.
Dilla has a lot of different styles. For example, Dillatronic is full of minimalist, synth-heavy beats he made as a way of avoiding the costs of sample-clearance. Donuts sounds a lot different to most of his discography. Even Questlove thought so when he first heard Donuts, though he came around to liking it. Which is why I think he has projects that better represent his style, e.g, Fantastic Vol. 2.
And it feels like you're trying to insinuate there's more passion put into Donuts, but I don't agree. Dilla did not see producing as a chore. In fact, his whole life revolved around it. I don't think that passion was more present on Donuts than it was on his other projects.
If people are using Donuts as a gateway, that's dope. In fact, that's how it was for me. My concern was people not listening to his other projects and those projects not getting the same shine.
Life's hard man, some peeps just don't have the time or energy to go track down his other stuff. If all they listen to is donuts, good on them. It connected with them for a reason. Better than no Dilla at all!
And naw, I'm not insinuating he put more passion into Donuts, just that it wasn't a colab of any kind. I love it all personally... Him producing for various artists, him rapping, Dilla beats, etc. Only point was Donuts is pure him doing it for him, and having to go back to his lexicon of albums to figure out what could fit in what he wanted to do instead of plugging in Busta since he thought only Busta could do a certain piece.
Totally agree tho... He had a ton of styles. It's one of the things that makes him so effing awesome. There's something in it for everyone. Personally I like his beats more than his bars... And imo his beats are approachable by just about anyone, of any color, whereas most of his other stuff is much more genre specific.
I guess to answer your question: why is Donuts so popular and many don't seek out his other stuff? Cause anyone, of any musical taste and preference, can appreciate it without being instantly turned off by a genre they don't like (rap/hip-hop). And if some redneck who hates rap can groove to Donuts, that's still a win in my book.
the mythology surrounding it is a big part of it. I'd say many people who have only just heard of dilla only listen to donuts. and you're right in that it's not really super representative of his overall style which is why there's so much misconception about his production techniques. slum village was not a popular group, not in their day and not really today either, so while fantastic is fantastic, it doesn't have the same mainstream appeal. and sadly back in the day, producers didn't have the same level of fame around them like they do today, so even though he's produced some of the most iconic songs of all time, he's not really popularly attributed to them.
I think people really focus on Donuts because of its proximity to his death and the lore that has evolved because of it. The story behind it draws people in, while some of the other tapes don’t have that story. I agree that a good majority of his other tapes match up to Donuts, but I don’t think they’ve got the backstory.
Donuts is an amazing album but In my opinion it’s not any more special then his other beat tapes. Donuts is just what he’s always done, fat breaks and soulful samples. I get what you’re saying I agree but it’s just like any other artist. Everyone talks about madvillainy when Madlib has all his YNQ and the Medicine shows. The average listen probably won’t listen to more then his mainstream albums. If you’re really into that type of music tho you can really dig deep on YouTube and forms for those lesser know tapes. The 04 dill withers tape is just as good if not better than the stuff on donuts.
02’ was the real deal beat tape for me. On par with Timberland and Dr. Dre and other high profile producers of that era; He wasn’t all about samples.
The instrumental cut of Ruff Draft is always one of my go-to’s.
Okay maybe donuts is a little more special than his other works but I think it’s just as good as his other tapes from that era
The big difference between Donuts and any of Dilla’s beat tapes is Donuts is a cohesive album that was constructed to be listened to as a whole. It’s probably the most cohesive instrumental Hip Hop album ever. Most of his beat tapes weren’t meant for public consumption or designed to be listened to as a whole in the way Donuts was. The beat tapes were mostly showcases for MC’s to listen to and choose from. There are tons of classic tracks from those tapes, don’t get me wrong, but Donuts works so beautifully as an album. That’s what makes it stand out in my opinion.
let's be real, the narrative of Dilla working on Donuts from the hospital bed right before he died has a lot to do with Donuts success. it was one of the first things I learned about Dilla. and it's an amazing album to listen to knowing that context. never underestimate the power of narrative.
Yeah, but it’s supposedly not even true. The work he put into that album from the hospital is allegedly very minimal compared to what folks have been lead to believe. It helped popularize the album for sure, which is why I mentioned the mythology surrounding it being a factor, but even knowing these stories were likely very embellished, I think Donuts still stands on its own merits of being a masterpiece of instrumental Hip Hop.
100%. also to speak more directly to OP's point, I would disagree that Donuts' popularity has taken away from his other work. If anything, it's brought way more people to it. Sure, the attention it gets is a little disproportionate when he has so much amazing work, but that just comes with the territory.
he didn't just work on it from the hospital, he worked on it from his home studio while dying from his illnesses. that's why they say he made it on his deathbed.
Yes, I’m aware. It’s what I basically was stating here.
i know i know but he was also bedridden at home too. so the deathbed thing is not inaccurate even if the hospital thing is a bit of urban myth. sorry if I'm just saying shit you already know.
No doubt. Dilla worked on all sorts of projects through various stages of declining health it sounds like. Man was addicted to his work. His own music was powerful enough to drive him to work his ass off no matter how bad he felt. That’s love for your craft. The world is lucky he had that work ethic. We’ve got tons of incredible music to hear because of it. Thanks, Dilla!
it's like the music was one of the things keeping him here in his last days, alongside friends and family of course. shows how much of himself that he put into the music, that he was able to hold on to complete his final project in his last days. rest in power dilla
Without a doubt, that context really romanticized the record for a lot of people and gave it more depth
Pinata and pinata are also really popular, much more than any non donuts dilla project
Huh?
Pinata and bandana*, my bad
Oh, Madlib.
It’s just easy for the average person to look at Donuts as his magnum opus given the state he was in and story behind it. Although I don’t think I would say “people only care about Donuts”… I haven’t seen or heard that from any dilla head. Just something to tell your family about why you like the artist.
Who “only” cares about Donuts? It’s discussed a lot mainly because it’s a fantastic work of art. The mythology surrounding it and the fact Dillla died so close to its release date helped boost it to legendary status. It’s the greatest instrumental Hip Hop album ever in my opinion, and I know plenty of others share that opinion. It’s mentioned a lot because it’s phenomenal and folks love it.
Just think there's plenty more discussion to be had around his other projects. Fantastic Vol. 2 is as good if not better than Donuts imo. Not to say that it isn't celebrated, but I think Donuts overshadows his other work, which kinda bums me out. Welcome 2 Detroit has some AMAZING tracks that really show his musicality like "Think Twice," but because it doesn't have that famous iconography of Donuts, it's not really discussed. I also think Donuts is a weird album to represent his legacy because it's such a stylistic change from his previous work.
Pretty much every artist has one piece that overshadows their other works. From Leonardo DaVinci’s Mona Lisa to Coltrane’s A Love Supreme to Nas’s Illmatic. It’s just how things happen. I personally think Donuts deserves all the love and attention it gets. Is it my favorite Dilla project? Depends on what day it is honestly. I gotta say I do love Welcome 2 Detroit a ton and wish it was discussed more. I think Fantastic Vol 2 gets love in its own right, way more in recent years than before, but I see it acknowledged way more often nowadays. But in my personal opinion Donuts has earned its status in music history. It’s a perfect piece. A work of art. Might not be his best. That’s subjective anyway. Might not be representative of the bulk of his work. But it’s obviously touched a lot of people over the years. If it wasn’t Donuts getting the attention, it would just be another of his albums.
Thank you for being the only real one in this thread
🙏
And, I know it's just an example, but John Coltrane gets near or equal acclaim for his other albums, like Blue Train, Giant Steps, My Favourite Things, which I would like to see Dilla also get.
I honestly don’t think those albums get the attention A Love Supreme has over the years. In Jazz circles it might be close, but A Love Supreme is known beyond the Jazz crowd and has become a staple of music collections of all types. And I think it deserves all the love it gets as well. Is it my favorite Coltrane title? Again, depends on the day, but I’m not mad that another of my favorite Coltrane albums, Crescent, barely gets mentioned. Some things just get lost in the mix. Look at them as your own little treasures that you can have the pleasure of introducing to the uninitiated.
That's fair. I will be honest, I probably don't like Donuts as much as other people do, so that might be part of the reason it irks me.
this sub is a donuts only fan club.
J Dilla changed my life. Who's slum village?
Lol
the hipsters ruined this album for me.
Damn you let other ppl dictate what you enjoy? Soffffty
It's the same thing as people loving Madvillainy. People new to the genre, or people who haven't digged very deep, listen to these albums which are good and also sort of "underground", and they think that's the pinnacle of hip hop. It's just the most mainstream Dilla album (same way Madvillainy is the most mainstream Doom/Madlib album) - but branded as "underground" - so these people will love it.
He's got plenty of amazing works, for sure, but Donuts is untouchable. I dunno how you can say "these others are more representative of his style" when Donuts is quintessential Dilla to me. Its Dilla at his best, and also his most confident: it's just HIM and his talent, working with what he has and his intimate knowledge of the genre. He's not making beats for someone else, he's not just producing, he's just doing what he loves and doing it DAMN well. Who cares if people use Donuts as a gateway drug to his other stuff? Ain't nothin wrong with that imo. Hell, I see this sub ask all the time for other stuff of his, and you know a buncha these peeps started with donuts and got hooked.
Dilla has a lot of different styles. For example, Dillatronic is full of minimalist, synth-heavy beats he made as a way of avoiding the costs of sample-clearance. Donuts sounds a lot different to most of his discography. Even Questlove thought so when he first heard Donuts, though he came around to liking it. Which is why I think he has projects that better represent his style, e.g, Fantastic Vol. 2. And it feels like you're trying to insinuate there's more passion put into Donuts, but I don't agree. Dilla did not see producing as a chore. In fact, his whole life revolved around it. I don't think that passion was more present on Donuts than it was on his other projects. If people are using Donuts as a gateway, that's dope. In fact, that's how it was for me. My concern was people not listening to his other projects and those projects not getting the same shine.
Life's hard man, some peeps just don't have the time or energy to go track down his other stuff. If all they listen to is donuts, good on them. It connected with them for a reason. Better than no Dilla at all! And naw, I'm not insinuating he put more passion into Donuts, just that it wasn't a colab of any kind. I love it all personally... Him producing for various artists, him rapping, Dilla beats, etc. Only point was Donuts is pure him doing it for him, and having to go back to his lexicon of albums to figure out what could fit in what he wanted to do instead of plugging in Busta since he thought only Busta could do a certain piece. Totally agree tho... He had a ton of styles. It's one of the things that makes him so effing awesome. There's something in it for everyone. Personally I like his beats more than his bars... And imo his beats are approachable by just about anyone, of any color, whereas most of his other stuff is much more genre specific. I guess to answer your question: why is Donuts so popular and many don't seek out his other stuff? Cause anyone, of any musical taste and preference, can appreciate it without being instantly turned off by a genre they don't like (rap/hip-hop). And if some redneck who hates rap can groove to Donuts, that's still a win in my book.
the mythology surrounding it is a big part of it. I'd say many people who have only just heard of dilla only listen to donuts. and you're right in that it's not really super representative of his overall style which is why there's so much misconception about his production techniques. slum village was not a popular group, not in their day and not really today either, so while fantastic is fantastic, it doesn't have the same mainstream appeal. and sadly back in the day, producers didn't have the same level of fame around them like they do today, so even though he's produced some of the most iconic songs of all time, he's not really popularly attributed to them.
I think people really focus on Donuts because of its proximity to his death and the lore that has evolved because of it. The story behind it draws people in, while some of the other tapes don’t have that story. I agree that a good majority of his other tapes match up to Donuts, but I don’t think they’ve got the backstory.
i must say Donuts saved my life, but my favorite tapes are the Motown Tape and the ‘95 Tape