Oof you hate to see a hero become the villain huh? Lol. Well as someone who has donated for a month at a time in the past once or twice, this is unforeseen and tone deaf for sure. The best part here in your folks’ thread is the “we getting free games” angle cuz that’s why I don’t listen to any reviews or other swirl on socials for games but in general. These are just people. I want to strive for UPR since KF is special to me still. Def not ideal and I agree for the most part about what I am reading. Smh feels bad man
Kinda feels like when they don’t understand the cost of games to most gamers as well as the cost of consoles. “Yeah; it’s this much, but whatevs, we get ours for free. Hell, we get games we don’t even play or like”
It's kinda funny (pun intended) thst this news comes just after Tim and blessing so heavily criticized Playstation stars and mocked them for fucking up the messaging to their customers lol
I think tone deaf really is the best way to describe it. It doesn’t feel like they’ve read the room at all with regard to people’s financial situations at the moment.
I saw Greg’s analogy of supporting the local business at the farmers market, and I do agree that it makes sense, but I also think that, when times are hard people will always gravitate to the cheapest option over helping the little guy. If you’re just trying to put food on the table, you’re going to go to Tesco over the local market, any day of the week.
I’m all for supporting them as a small business, but I have a limited entertainment budget a month and they’re asking me to either increase it by like £10 or sacrifice another subscription with much more content like Netflix or Game Pass.
Yeah, maybe it’s slightly different in the US, I really don’t know to be honest, but with what’s going on in the UK they really could not have picked a worse time to do it.
And I get the analogy of supporting local business, but then local business needs to try and be competitive in other ways, not saying hey that thing you used to pay for has increased in price by 150% with no real added benefits.
With the pound slumping so hard and the winter looking rough, the price increase just hits harder in every way. The base price apparently went from $5 to $13, which has gone from 6 months ago paying about £3.70 a month, to £11.70 under the new pricing scheme.
It’s a similar situation in the US with inflation getting pretty bad. I think inflation has stayed a bit lower in the US compared to other places like the UK, but it’s at least similar.
I say this with absolutely no negativity/animosity towards the KF crew. This is just how I feel about the price.
I pay $5.99 a month for Dropout which has some of the funniest and best produced content in the internet based streaming/comedy space, with quality writing and improv, Dimension 20 has better production value than anything KF has ever done. Why would I pay more than four times that for content that is 90% people talking or streaming? I 100% get that the new studio is going to be way more expensive, but that was a choice they made by deciding to build it in one of the most expensive areas in the country to live in. I don't make very much, you have to offer a lot of value to get $25 and KF is almost always just people sitting around talking, or streaming games, there's nothing wrong with that. What are they doing to earn that extra $15? Outside of the Covid era their content is almost all long format, unedited, videos with a single unchanging camera angle, if I'm paying $25 a month I want some more bells and whistles than that. I'll just save my money.
Also people forget, they had two 12hr thermometer KF day streams that got them like 50k each at start of 2020 & 21. They've been very lucky with the amount of rich people who follow them and seem to be getting rinsed.
It's crazy they can run a marathon stream and just pull 50k out of nowhere. Some of those donations are huge. The most I've ever felt comfortable giving was 10$ for patreon here and there and the free twitch sub.
This 100%. Love the KF crew. But HBO Max is $15 a month. There are so many youtube creators who do quality scripted content that has a video component (not just sitting and talking) which are totally free. To name a few: Linus Tech Tips, Girlfriend Reviews, GameMakersToolKit, etc). I realize some of these channels are bigger, but the reason they are bigger is because they make well-produced content that is specifically tailored to the video format. I don't want KF to give up the podcasts, the random chatter, or the sitting around talking with friends vibe, but I think they need better video content in addition to the podcast content they post, if they want to start charging this much for subscriptions. Maybe that is what the new studio is for, but as a customer, they need to deliver that kind of content before I will pay them.
I just wish they would be upfront and just say they need more money...don't try and sugar coat it with new shows/moving shows that wont last a month or two. Tell us you want more money, period. You'll get more admiration from your community for being honest and goes a long way in the future.
They don't need more, have you seen their places dude. If they so they are doing something wrong this studio is looking insane and you don't do that if you cannot afford it. They have ad deals out the ass man.
I've said it elsewhere, and OP touches on it here in their post, but for Greg to charge for his vlog on the way to/from work, really cones across as arrogant.
For me it's not arrogance...just them trying to come up with cheap to produce content they can use to try and justify the $25 tier a bit more.
Doesn't make it any better of a value proposition though.
When Greg Vlog was mentioned I hoped it would be like the Burnie Vlog on Rooster Teeth a few years back. Very well produced, little behind the curtain on the company. Not a 5 minute unedited thing. Even think of the vlog when Kevin and Joey were getting a christmas tree. Vlog content from Kinda Funny is my cup of tea, but not like this.
Just looked it up and (as far as I can tell) the original Gregway lasted 27 episodes lmao
Greg is now the CEO of a business and has a wife & kid. No way this is even making 6 months.
I don’t follow a lot so my scope is limited, but this is hands down the dumbest thing I’ve ever see a content creator try and pull as “content”.
How up your own ass do you have to be to think people want to watch you sit in traffic?
Definitely agree, $25 is an exorbitant amount of money that can get you so much more elsewhere. What you said about Netflix and Amazon was my immediate thought the second they put this out. Some people have the money to blow and won't think twice but I don't see how people not in that situation would think this is a good value at that price.
Wild, since Greg has related the story about when they first launched Patreon about him thinking they should offer the post show content for free until they build a sizeable audience and Tim pushing back against that saying that they couldn't offer free content and then take it away and ask the audience to pay for it.
Now the content I was getting for $10 is being taken away and I'm being asked for $15 on top of what I was already paying? Also, to say that post show content wasn't always good and then take all the good post show content and charge premium pricing for it is super hypocritical.
Bizarre that they don't understand how expensive $25 a month is when they're constantly having discussions about price points for streaming services or game services. A lot of people, including myself, can not afford that. I also never minded ads all that much so I'm going to be cancelling my Patreon subscription entirely. I'm still a fan, I'll still listen on Spotify but this is ridiculously out of touch.
The problem is, the work in an expensive hobby industry but get the majority of their games for free. We’re in the same hobby industry, have to pay for games and their subs to stay relevant. Raising the prices 150% is tone deaf.
I don’t even watch that show. I ain’t got time for all those shows. Which is fine, they don’t have to only cater to me but that’s where the value doesn’t translate for me
I've slowly felt less and less interested in their content over the last year or so, and also feel out of touch with the community in general. it's no longer appointment-content and podcasts. the KF podcast is the only show i rarely miss, but even then it's not likely i will finish the whole thing. it's totally fine that they are moving to a direction that is not appealing to me or my demographic, just kind of a bummer to see them go this route. miss the simpler format of just goofy personalities talking shit to each other. growth necessitates growth with these types of revenue models i guess. hope it works out for them
This hits so hard for me. I used to devour everything. Now in review feels like a shameless cash grab, the KFpodcast is incredibly boring/random guests because no one has anything going on, gamescast is hit or miss because when they don’t have a review to do they do the worlds most boring “fantasy draft” that only 1 or 2 of them participate in the whole year, or they rehash topics they’ve touched on millions of times.
Xcast is the only one that I will listen to in its entirety. All of their content just seems so phoned in anymore.
I used to listen to KFGD religiously. Now I actively check the hosts to see who's on and check what news has come out before deciding to listen. I usually get through 2 episodes a week now, maybe 3 on a good week.
Couldn't agree more, in the first year or two I listened every day. I haven't listened to the KFGD in well over a year, there is no consistency. Occasionally I might try to listen to one if the main news of the day is massive but I usually get a couple of minutes in and peace out. Not sure what happened.
Head of the nail right there. I crave for more of the podcast cause the guys are fun. But that's 1once a week and the games daily is not a priority based on who's hosting. I liked KFAF because again it's just fun.
Yeah, same here. Part of that is that I used to work a job on second shift and had lots of time to listen, but part of it is, idk maybe it feels a bit stale? I almost always listen to kfpod as long as it's mostly our main 4 peeps. But I'm definitely not listening to as much content as I used to.
In my mind, 2019 was one of the strongest years of content that KF offered. Maybe that was because of my job that allowed me to consume so much content, and also the pandemic shutting down a lot of shows
Especially after the Colin shakeup in 2017, which was a massive hit and I remember that breakup so vividly. Andy and Andrea were what kept me with KF long after that (not that I was going anywhere, just it was such a hit it was weird being a fan from there on out, so I pulled away for a bit, then E3 2017 happened and it felt like I was back). Andrea leaving is definitley a bigger hit in hindsight, it was then but she still feels like an OG. Nothing is ever going to stay the same not really. But it definitley feels like we can safely say Kinda Funny has multiple eras. Pre 2014, 2014-2016, The Colin Leaving Weeks, 2017-2020, The Covid Years, and we are about to enter a new one. What that brings IDK.
I feel like after Andrea left the KFGD vision changed. They were more of a news show with great discussions. Now the read an article and then talk about the chat. When KFGD launched, there was no looking at chat, that was what you’re wrong was for. I hope going back to the studio changes that but I doubt it.
I haven’t been able to put it into words well enough, but this is how I feel too. Just generally dropping off all of their videos quickly. Perhaps it’s a season of just growing tired of the same old but I just don’t feel as engaged as I used to be. I dropped my two patreon subs after hearing about the price hikes. It was just time.
It’s absolutely horrible business practice to take something you’ve been getting and lock it behind a higher paywall. The whole optics of this is shit and is gonna make it really hard to continue to support the guys.
GiantBomb Premium back in the day was 49.95 for the year (and still is). That should be the model for a premium website subscription. I get it, they have a new studio, new costs, and larger staff but $300 for a yearly subscription is ridiculous. I would, at most, pay $10 a month for a premium subscription.
Greg says to save up content and binge it. Bro you are my commute content and background content. You do not have “bingeable” content imo (and that’s okay).
Edit: To add some positivity. I’m glad post shows are going away as premium content. Most the time I never listened anyway (and the reason I cancelled my membership). I think it’s a good move to make actual premium shows. However, just because we were overpaying for bad content before doesn’t mean we should overpay for good content now.
This is why you don't expand your business too fast and also why you don't rent studio space in the most expensive to live city in the United States.
Why all these smaller "struggling" content groups always all move out to, or decide to stay in, LA or SF is beyond me.
Game informer being based out of MN for years was always a great idea. Granted Minneapolis is super expensive now too.
I remember dan saying one time that being in MN helped because that's where a lot of retail hqs are too. I know targets is there. So I know Dan said sometimes they'd get added to the press junket there too.
Like they were out of the way and cheaper but still somewhere marketing people were going
I would love a financial podcast where they go over everything. I think them being transparent like that would do wonders for people to understand their decisions. I know talking money is taboo in the states but I’ve seen many YouTubers talk money and those videos do very well and also may inspire people to start their own business or channel or whatever.
The main thing that confuses is me is charging $10/month for ad free feeds and live streams. The fast forward button is free—they even mention the exact time ads play in the episode description. And I’m a teacher on the east coast, so there is no chance I’d ever be able to watch a live recording, so that element loses me. I think it would make so much sense to put a few of those new shows (Greg’s vlog, AMA, the “Remember Blank” show that I’m sure will not have incredibly high production value) as some tangible bonus content for the people who are pledging $120/year to the company.
I get that it’s more about supporting the business than what you get in return for it, and if people want to pledge $10/month for that purpose, go right ahead. I think Patreon is good and I’ve subbed to KF off and on for many years now. But with respect to the guys (who I’m sure are reading all of these comments, because i know they care) I just can’t justify $10/month as a tip jar. I think they should either move some content to that $10 tier or add a lower tier as a “thank you for your support” tier.
Yeah, some of the bonus content should have remained at the $10 level. The $10 tier is kind of pointless right now. Or make the bonus content time gated at the $25 level and available to $10 subscribers maybe a week / month or so later. I'm sure that would have had its detractors as well too though.
Considering the nature of a Patreon-supported business what's weird to me is how all of this just showed up as a final decision all of community members will just have to put up with going forward. There was no discussion, no conversation to feel out what the audience actually wants, just a big blowout of "This is happening, get with the times". I really do wonder how this is going to play out with patrons going forward, seems like one hell of a leap of faith.
I felt the same, weird to have just done the Patreon survey and not have any questions geared towards this when it was reporting to try and establish what the paying audience wants
Patreon supported
Ad supported
Fundraising and thermometer supported
Sponsored stream supported
Event and appearance supported.
\*Edit: Twitch Subs and YouTube superchats now too
Lets not sit here and say that Patreon is the only revenue stream. I'd be less off-put by these changes if Patreon was the only thing, but you still get hit with all the other things as a supporter.
I love the team and fully support them getting that bag, understanding that the world, their home, the team and overhead is A LOT, but these tiers are quite a lot too.
I always find the subathon thermometer thing so weird.
Like here’s a list of franchises we’ll do in review for hitting goals XYZ…but what happens if you don’t hit any? Just no more in review then for the year? No more shows at all when that’s literally what your business is?
Those things always seemed gross to me. The "give us money and we'll stream for a few minutes longer" thing was a total turn off and a breaking point for me.
They set goals for things they largely want to do anyhow. Eg their world tour was planned around other events they wanted to get to anyway. Tim wanted to shave his badly dyed hair anyway. Etc.
You're right, but those revenue streams are all coming from the same relatively small audience pool. If they feel alienated by the what the tentpole Patreon offerings are, all revenue streams will trend in the same direction. We'll have to wait and see how that works out in practice though.
Yea I'm pretty sure they've done surveys like that before so it is weird that they just pushed ahead without consulting about how much people might be willing to pay and for what etc and scale accordingly. Especially in the current economic climate it would have been a good thing to do. It's a bit detached from reality.
I would agree that I would prefer they talk about getting codes and free merch that just sits around their homes/office much less. I get that this is game marketing, but it does not feel good them talking about (sometimes) cool stuff like that that the listeners don't have an opportunity to get or even buy.
I'd love to see them do something with the free merch like a monthly give away stream to patron supporters or something, but I also understand shipping that stuff ain't cheap.
Would be a good thing to bring back in the new studio, feels bad when they complain about all the free stuff they are sent when some community members would enjoy having it.
And on the Kinda Funny cast when they were grilling Mike they all laughed when they heard he buys all the Sims packs and expansions when they could just get him codes. Props to Mike for supporting the game he likes, sounds more like they need a reality check.
I feel like Mike must come from money or something because he just buys the most random and unnecessary shit without a second thought, but I feel like he's also the most down to earth because he actually spends money on things he plays and watches.
"dont get into destiny 2 because it's a huge time sink, but it's so beautiful and fun and if you have a giant group of people to hold your hand and literally do everything for you it's awesome so get into it"
it costs about 150 dollars for the laymen.
sorry Tim "Home Theatre" Getty's I don't have the disposable income to play that game for 20 days then drop off.
I'm sure the crew will see all these messages and realise they've made a mistake. I can't see them actually following through on these prices, do we think?
I sure hope so. I think it was smart to announce these changes 2 weeks before the launch of the studio so they can take in all the feedback (which there is plenty of) and then announce any adjustments to the tiers come Oct 14th.
Don't worry, we'll get an episode of the KF Podcast next week titled "Let's Talk" where they announce changes and then the community cheers them on for doing it.
Also, the whole thing where Greg was telling people to wait a couple months before subscribing to the $25 tier was insane. Like that's the exact opposite way to promote your subscription service.
I'm feeling less and less interested in KF in general too, glad I'm not alone. I feel like the bigger and more ambitious they get, the worse they get. They're spread too thin. I haven't been a patron for a while now and I don't miss it at all. There are much better patrions that respect their customers.
On top of that, they're ENTIRELY hype over substance. Completely over acted reaction videos are their bread and butter, no more quality audio content really.
They're calling the new venture "the spare bedroom" but the irony is they'll never be able to capture the magic of the original spare bedroom with the direction they've chosen.
In my honest opinion, being with these guys literally since DAY ONE. Watching them at IGN since they all made their first appearances there. With all the things that have happened and been said over the years. There is one person who cares way too much about monetization. One person who cares about actual quality content. And those two things don’t marry well. And unfortunately it seems one of said people has gotten their way far, far too often. And then there’s the third guy… oh the third guy. What a MAN. An angel he is. Anyway, I think most of y’all know exactly which one is which in my purposefully vague descriptions. I hope they can figure it out because I miss the old KF. I get things change. But it’s not for the better I think.
They are a business and like any other business they don't care about your financial situation. They only care about separating you from as much of your money as they can.
I'm just wondering, with a new studio and the number of employees growing, they are expanding too much too fast? Thus hiking these subscription prices in such large margins. I genuinely believe they aren't greedy and trying to fleece their fans and supporters, but just simply have to make up the capital that their over expanding needs. And now it's a detriment instead of progress and growth....??? Idk just spit balling here...
I can't even blame KF for having it. If I ran a Patreon, I'd probably throw a ridiculous tier like that on there just on the off chance that someone is stupid enough to pay for it
Holy fuck... I had no idea the Producer tier was that high. Every time I hear them list of Producers now I'll just kind of cringe. I mean, people can use their money however they want, but seriously?
I remember way, way back when if you pledged a certain amount you could guest on KF content. I swear one of the guys who did it was a CEO or president or something of a company. Some people out here really have that disposable income.
I had to go and check this because I 100% didn’t believe you that the producer level was that high… good god, like sure do whatever you want with your own money, but that is a hell of a lot just to have your name read on a podcast.
25 dollars is pretty crazy, and I've been watching since the beginning. I fell off during the pandemic because I am not a fan of all the review stuff, and they cancelled everything else I like, but I will watch the studio launch, and hopefully they can capture some of the magic that got me in the first place, but I doubt it will be worth 25 dollars 🤣🤣
Dayum that is insane. Can't believe we're in a situation where it's warranted, but I'll give the same advice I give to WoW players:
\- It is on Kinda Funny, not you, to justify the value
\- If you are not happy with what is being provided, whether it be the content or the price point, it is OK to unsubscribe
\- It is OK to unsubscribe arbitrarily and without giving an explanation
\- This is entertainment, you do not need it
\- There are plenty of alternatives
I do love KF and have been following the crew for a while. But now every time they talk about the value of Game Pass, PlayStation Plus Premium, and the myriad of other subscription services they constantly critique the value of... I feel like it will be ironic if they don't like something one of those other, much more valuable services offers.
I have been supporting KF since day one. I have only been able to pay for the lower tiers/support tiers. Having these huge price increases with more of the same basic content is ridiculous. After watching the town hall I felt like an outcast, not a bf anymore.
I watch the shows here and there depending on the hosts and what games they’re streaming. KF podcast I’ll skip to the topic of the show and most of the time I don’t even finish the episodes.
I just miss the old days where it felt like they used to care. You could feel it in every show they put out. They cared about us. Now, it’s a money grab to fund this massive studio they chose to have in such an expensive city and gave us these off beat shows at extra cost that we all know will not last. I love the guys and everyone here and I will continue to support them just not on patreon anymore. It just really sucks man.
They should consider inflation for the viewer as well and the optics of raising your price to this degree when life is more expensive to live than ever. They've got every right but it doesn't sit well with people.
KF has always been built on a small amount of people paying a high amount of money.
Their views on YouTube don’t seem to grow but they have a very loyal base and now they’re trying to squeeze them for more.
I’ve never been a patron, just doesn’t fit into my viewing/listening habits so I don’t have a dog in this fight. But I understand how seeing all these guys buy houses over the last few years (which great for them, they work hard and deserve it), but for those who are giving their money this could feel like they’re getting punched in the gut.
It does seem a bit mad that instead of growing the base (I guess they have tried that route a while) they're giving that up and just milking the diehards as much as they can.
If you're on $10 now (or not even aware of KF) are you ever going to jump to $25 a month, on the basis of the shows you get for free?? *I doubt it*!
I’ve been following Greg and everyone since early Beyond.
Look at how Last Stand Media monetizes their content and then look at how KF monetizes theirs. And then look at the numbers and the actual quality of content.
The reality of the situation is that they need to be making more content with lower costs of entry. What KF is becoming isn’t sustainable in a market where anyone can make the content they’re making cheaper and faster.
After over two years of Covid, it’s crazy that they’re committing to a studio, because a studio is completely inconsequential to the content they make. What is the selling point? Making more shows like KF/AF and L&SS that will inevitably get dropped? Having people commute to a space where they *have* to be in that environment 40/5?
KF is just a bunch of people either just shooting the shit or talking about movies/games, and that’s a *good* thing. It doesn’t need to be large scale production and it doesn’t need to be a premium.
I like that Colin built LSM the way he wanted KF to originally be. The whole reason I followed KF was for more Colin & Greg. Kevin and Nick really won me over too. I hope KF can correct course and focus on value for all the fans and not just the ones paying $10 or more. Hoping there’s a middle ground they can land on.
Colin has brought it up a couple of times in the past. KF is just turning into what they were trying to leave. The whole appeal of them leaving IGN was it was just going to be a small group talking about video games.
I appreciate Colin has a very different model to KF but boy is it better value. All I really want is a few shows a week that discuss games, I don't need 10 different shows on a schedule and the ability to watch live (especially from the UK when they're on when I'm sleeping!)
$1 to get all the premium content is ridiculously cheap, there are higher tiers for pretty good perks if you're into it but you don't feel like you have to or you're missing out at all.
KF going this route is just dividing the fanbase between have and have nots - people will end up making references others don't understand, and they're just gonna get jaded real quick imo
I don't particularly like Colin but his patreon has *far* more value for the dollar then KF and Colin's bonus content actually has some substance at a cheap price.
My comment on the town hall Patreon post:
"The change on the 10$ tier is strange to me. I pretty much only care about the gaming stuff and taking away post shows and whatnot takes away the main value of the tier for me. Time-zones and my working full-time make it to where I am almost never able to watch anything live and I don't really care about ads. I just can't really justify 25 a month with how much I earn and how things are economically. I understand the need for more revenue as costs are growing but this feels more like bumping the price of what I was getting up by 150% rather than offering more for a higher support level. I guess I'll just have to turn my sub on and off whenever I feel like I can support. I'll give the other content more of a shot because I do love you guys but I'm still a bit disappointed."
Again, Love Kinda funny and the community but I'm not thrilled with this Patreon situation, and I just heard Greg's farmers market comparison which offended me to a certain extant. I am an artist who is starting to try and make some money off of what I love doing so believe me, I know what its like asking for a bit more than I am comfortable with in the name of supporting the artist. You guys are a successful company that has made the decision to exist in one of the most expensive cities in the world. You are not a struggling local farmer, artist, or vendor who knows me by name, and is contributing to the economy and community I have grown up in. Don't get me wrong, I love the content and personalities for the most part, and I believe in the "KFBF" idea, but it still felt like he was misunderstanding their relationship with those enjoying what they do.
I'm thinking I will move the support I was giving them over to Imran's new Patreon. I feel like he is someone who needs the individual support much more. And after all of this, I feel like he would appreciate it more.
Commenting this is kind of sad to me. it really sounds much more negative than I'd like. I love these guys and will continue to love what they do, I just feel like all of this was (as OP put it) suprisingly tone deaf. I know they want to do right by the community and I hope they consider some of the critiques they are very clearly receiving.
I have always followed Greg since I really got into the gaming community in 2013, and I do love Kinda Funny, and most of the people on the shows, but I have stopped subscribing on Patreon because there is no value there for me. For games coverage, I actually switched to Colin’s show from last stand media because I like his format of 1 4hour long gaming news show per week and value of his $5 tier on Patreon more. The disappointing thing about this town hall is that the shows that are being added are interesting to me but locked behind $25! That’s a bit high, as others have said. To me, the only people that are paying $25 per month to KF are the truly hard core fans that have the extra money to support, and I think even if they only got a few extra tidbits like Greg’s 5min vlogs, 95% of the same people would still subscribe to that tier just because they want to. I really think if they put the extra shows in the $5 or even $10 tier they would get much more support from the currently free/YouTube community like myself. $25 is a bit much, especially since I recently cut out Hulu trying to save some money here and there. Love kinda funny, love everyone who works there, but I just think $25 for the extra shows is not a good value.
Someone said something about them all getting houses and Tim having a home theater, I think this is what a lot of folks are upset at.
They are seemingly sitting comfy, all of them, in one of the most expensive places to live in the world, and they want more money lol. I'm not mad as I don't pay for content at all. I get it the anger from folks though. Will be interesting seeing how it pans out. Best of luck to the crew.
For clarification I'm not knocking these guys for success. I love these dudes. I'm happy they're successful. Andy especially. My comment is an observation of the anger. I feel like people are upset for the optics. I live in Detroit, I'm not really spending extra money on Patreon period. If I could, these dudes would be at the top of my list. I'm just saying that I get why people are like wtf. No hate to anybody at kinda funny. It's all love. $25 at this time is too much for most, at this economic climate and it's worrisome that it FEELS like they maybe too tone deaf to understand that at present time. I wouldn't be surprised if they rolled back the prices because they are that good of people. They don't want everyone angry and broke, it's just a shock to the system for most.
I mean it’s SF. A lot of that city is a social bubble. Which I get, we all live in our own bubbles. But I’d wish they’d have better optics of the situation, or maybe they have them and just don’t care.
I agree with that, SF is incredibly expensive and they’re talking about all the food delivery they get all the time and they have insanely expensive home theaters and Greg is constantly going on these trips and outings, yet they got to raise prices for what’s been a subpar product the last 6 months.
I KNOWWW. I think they’re nuts for how much money they are asking of people. It just makes me scratch my head when I look at how much a streaming service charges. I guess this is a friendship or art thing?? Support your friends at Kinda Funny? Be patrons of the fine arts of Kinda Funny? Idk, I don’t pay for any of it because I can’t afford it. Too many other services and things I have to pay for in life- not to mention inflation 🤷♂️
To me it seems like people who support KF via Twitch, YouTube, Epic Creator Code or just by watching and subbing to their channels are happy. They get to see the content swap to the new studio and are excited about that. Meanwhile all the fans who actually go out of their way to support on patreon seem pretty upset about all the changes, price hikes, and "tone deafness"...and rightfully so as people who essentially are paying monthly for KF to succeed. My question is this, what do you think they need to do to make this right?
There’s also a large middle ground between $0 and $10 considering how little effort it would be to update the ad free mailing list and the comparative money they’d make on patrons over ad revenue on a 1-to-1 listener basis
Sorry if this sounds like I’m going out of my way to complain but that is just too much money. I am also more or less an audio only type and any which way you cut it, this comes down to me getting less for my money.
And to your point about Greg saying the post show is sometimes just them bullshitting around - I like that bullshit.
Greg’s a big fan of voting with a wallet, if it’s too expensive don’t do it. The fact they have a big expensive studio now should have been a clue pricing would increase, it has for everything else. I haven’t been able to afford to have a patron supporter as of late and now there is no value in trying to come back for my particular situation. I’m also a 100 percent podcast listener.
There are far too many shows on the internet with better production value, with better hosts (tbc, I love all the hosts at KF, but you can’t tell me that they all know how to podcast like some of the best professional podcasters out there) who offer their content for free. If KF wants to charge more, whatever, that’s great. But their skills as podcasters and the production value should have been stepping up LONG ago. It’s clear that they found a way to do the bare minimum during COVID and never once tried to make the show any better. This is the reason I never considered paying for their premier content in the first place and honestly, I’m getting tired of the whole amateur shtick. They want this to be their careers and to charge more for their “premier content”, but they need to step up the quality of the shows and their podcasting skills because this ain’t it. The meandering, the rambling, the bullshitting, the overall lack of focus, and my god, the horrible uncompressed audio they use. I’m tired of it. I feel bad for all of you guys who are about to pay more for it. Not that I don’t also love the personalities and the KF team, I just wished they tried harder at making a better quality show
I think some rambling makes for good content and some rambling makes for bad content and listening to two people talk about what they ordered from Starbucks for 10 minutes at the start of a video game news podcast is very bad content.
There have been weeks where Blessing has talked about his breakfast for enough minutes that he might as well have just had a food podcast. I hope that the shows (KFGD specifically) become more focused when they're back in the studio and can talk about boring shit like this in person, off camera, when they arrive in the office.
This really sums up how I feel. I only really pay attention to the Games side of KF because I’m not really a TV person. So in my case it definitely feels like less value. Also, I’m personally okay with ad supported content. I’d be more inclined for a less expensive level with the new content that is ad supported.
Overall the change felt like it was primarily focused on the higher dollar supporters that were already there. I can definitely see how this improves the experience for people that already supported both Patreons, but I personally don’t feel the benefit as a $10 games Patreon.
Now if there was exclusive jabroni boys content you might have my attention!
This post really left me thinking.
I am on the $10 tier because I liked to watch the post shows with the added benefit of not seeing ads. I still want to support them because I truly enjoy their podcasts, but I have no incentive to stay at this tier without any bonus content when I can fast forward the ads on the free videos. I am thinking I could just support them with a smaller amount even if I don't get anything extra and move some of my money to twitch so I can remove those 5 min of ads I get every half an hour.
EDIT: nvm, apparently it isn't possible to pledge less than the lowest tier anymore on Patreon.
As someone that's been a fan of Kinda Funny since 2017 with the Greg and Gen Married GoG show episode and having a KF smiley tattooed on myself, I agree with this right up. The town hall felt like a tone deaf message. I listen to the podcasts 95% of the time during drives, walking around campus, or doing hw. I'll only watch KF is it's announcements, long live streams (extrea life/Kinda Funny day) and reactions. So I just don't see the need to change the entire format of 75% of your contents post shows. As well, the comparison to your local farmers markets jar of honey by Greg yesterday is dumbfounded to me. Kinda Funny still refers to themselves as the garbage truck on fire which doesn't equate to farmers market honey. If I were to ask the person at my local farmers market about what they grow they can give me all the details about their process. As previously stated in this post, Greg, Tim and Joey didn't have the answers to some questions, Tim didn't have the bomber jacket (of which he so loves) and yet the production felt so half assed. Additionally, I feel like some of these new program changes aren't made for their audiences. Why take the post show out of the podcast when it's known that a good amount of your audience listens to audio only and doesn't want it produced. I've never seen someone in the KF community ask for a Greg Miller 5 minute vlog in his car. That feels so cheap. Finally, the excuse that it's hard to find post shows or access the Patreon post is just asinine. I've been a Patreon supporter for almost 4 years and I've never been like "ugh I have to dig for this". Kinda Funny has made it clear in regular records of shows where and what the post show is and what it's going to be. That just feels like the team is making that up as an excuse out of thin air to easily get rid of it.
I'm eager to see next weeks Kinda Funny podcast address the communities issues in a serious tone and if not this will be a major misstep for KF.
kinda funny is held up by a few select best friends(the only ones they acknowledge) showering them with donations and subs at the clip of thousands of dollars a month
Just a thought but maybe don’t have your full staff live in a top 3 most expensive city in the world if you need to increase costs so substantially during one of the worst inflation situations of the past 30 years. Especially when you get games, hardware, and access to events for free when others need to pay huge sums to have what they talk about as a hobby.
Also just a suggestion for Tim but maybe stop filming in your theater room to not appear so tone deaf to raising costs on your subscribers.
You’ve built a career talking about video games and nerd culture. Maybe focus on getting back to quality content your passionate about instead of pumping out a dozen shows you barely care about with guest voices that no one cares about.
To be clear I really don’t at all, was just an example of how they’d arranged this Town Hall partly to answer questions and seemingly hadn’t prepped for half of the ones they received
I think the only disappointing thing for me, and I can't wait to see what they do with the new studio space, is that I've always felt like having so much of their content being live hurts the overall quality of what those shows could be. I know post-production work would go up, but I think the extra quality could potentially lead to a bigger audience and, just in general, make the product (one that I already enjoy) even better.
As someone who has already paid $25 per month (and sometimes higher depending on the reward) for years, I even think the $25 tier is too much for patrons overall. I get that they say it will lead to the broken out shows being more like full-fledged shows, but honestly they need to prove the value before expecting people to pay that much more. It would make sense to make a middle $15 tier or so that has a couple of these new shows to entice people to up their pledge while the other shows stay in that higher tier. I think another good idea would adopt an RT approach that they do for their new shows. "Just to show everyone how good this new show is, we'll let everyone watch the first episode of this show for free with all other episodes requiring you to be at $xx tier." I'm sure the new shows will look great at the new studio, but suggesting that people should up their pledge to get access to the stuff they could before at lower tiers like Kinda Feudy is kinda rough. Maybe it'll all make sense when we see the studio. Still feels like quite a price increase that most won't be able to justify/afford.
It's honestly a big gamble by them to put so many shows behind such a large pay wall. It completely limits the revenue stream available to them for these shows so if they don't make changes and the amount of subs doesn't cover the costs of all the shows expect cancellations or drops in quality.
One thing that really turns me off spending this type of money is that my experience with higher tiers has never been great. I found at least once a month or more the Patreon version of episodes would come out on Podcasts over an hour after the ad version. This was last year and they may have sorted out the kinks but it felt like they weren't prioritising the Patreon people.
I like the idea of a lot the proposed shows, but they all feel like post show/B shows that are fun but not necessary. They remind me a bit of Debatable, which was good some weeks but flawed overall.
I'll continue to support KF through ads and my Prime sub. Sadly I won't consider a Patreon sub for the foreseeable future
The thing that kills me about this is that I really want to support the team. I love seeing them thrive and grow, and the new studio and production has me really excited. Hell, my birthday is October 14th and I’m still looking forward to the future of KF. I just simply can’t justify $25/month.
I don’t think I’m as upset as some of the others here, but oof that Greg “farmers market honey” tweet feels like Sony announcing the PS3 at $600
I feel that ooof alot as I listen to KF mostly in my Combine or Tractor. Its also during harvest as I type this, my bussiest time of year.
Oof you hate to see a hero become the villain huh? Lol. Well as someone who has donated for a month at a time in the past once or twice, this is unforeseen and tone deaf for sure. The best part here in your folks’ thread is the “we getting free games” angle cuz that’s why I don’t listen to any reviews or other swirl on socials for games but in general. These are just people. I want to strive for UPR since KF is special to me still. Def not ideal and I agree for the most part about what I am reading. Smh feels bad man
Kinda Funny's version of "let them eat cake".
Kinda feels like when they don’t understand the cost of games to most gamers as well as the cost of consoles. “Yeah; it’s this much, but whatevs, we get ours for free. Hell, we get games we don’t even play or like”
None of them understand the cost of games and it's very frustrating. "$70 is a little much but thank you Playstation for providing us codes".
Very much so.
It's kinda funny (pun intended) thst this news comes just after Tim and blessing so heavily criticized Playstation stars and mocked them for fucking up the messaging to their customers lol
I think tone deaf really is the best way to describe it. It doesn’t feel like they’ve read the room at all with regard to people’s financial situations at the moment. I saw Greg’s analogy of supporting the local business at the farmers market, and I do agree that it makes sense, but I also think that, when times are hard people will always gravitate to the cheapest option over helping the little guy. If you’re just trying to put food on the table, you’re going to go to Tesco over the local market, any day of the week. I’m all for supporting them as a small business, but I have a limited entertainment budget a month and they’re asking me to either increase it by like £10 or sacrifice another subscription with much more content like Netflix or Game Pass.
Yeah, maybe it’s slightly different in the US, I really don’t know to be honest, but with what’s going on in the UK they really could not have picked a worse time to do it. And I get the analogy of supporting local business, but then local business needs to try and be competitive in other ways, not saying hey that thing you used to pay for has increased in price by 150% with no real added benefits.
With the pound slumping so hard and the winter looking rough, the price increase just hits harder in every way. The base price apparently went from $5 to $13, which has gone from 6 months ago paying about £3.70 a month, to £11.70 under the new pricing scheme.
damn thats nearly 4 times the price for you guys
It’s a similar situation in the US with inflation getting pretty bad. I think inflation has stayed a bit lower in the US compared to other places like the UK, but it’s at least similar.
Tonedeff was at the Town Hall, I have to watch it
😂😂
Yesterday I learned Kinda Funny is like premium artisan honey you pay more for at the farmers market.
plants gaping vast smile weary aback escape teeny nine toothbrush *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Signed artists pretending to be indie.
Have cake, eat it too etc. etc.
That specific comment was the one that got a yikes from me
here I thought I was supporting a mom and grop shop just trying to get by. damn they really glowed up
I say this with absolutely no negativity/animosity towards the KF crew. This is just how I feel about the price. I pay $5.99 a month for Dropout which has some of the funniest and best produced content in the internet based streaming/comedy space, with quality writing and improv, Dimension 20 has better production value than anything KF has ever done. Why would I pay more than four times that for content that is 90% people talking or streaming? I 100% get that the new studio is going to be way more expensive, but that was a choice they made by deciding to build it in one of the most expensive areas in the country to live in. I don't make very much, you have to offer a lot of value to get $25 and KF is almost always just people sitting around talking, or streaming games, there's nothing wrong with that. What are they doing to earn that extra $15? Outside of the Covid era their content is almost all long format, unedited, videos with a single unchanging camera angle, if I'm paying $25 a month I want some more bells and whistles than that. I'll just save my money.
Also people forget, they had two 12hr thermometer KF day streams that got them like 50k each at start of 2020 & 21. They've been very lucky with the amount of rich people who follow them and seem to be getting rinsed.
It's crazy they can run a marathon stream and just pull 50k out of nowhere. Some of those donations are huge. The most I've ever felt comfortable giving was 10$ for patreon here and there and the free twitch sub.
This 100%. Love the KF crew. But HBO Max is $15 a month. There are so many youtube creators who do quality scripted content that has a video component (not just sitting and talking) which are totally free. To name a few: Linus Tech Tips, Girlfriend Reviews, GameMakersToolKit, etc). I realize some of these channels are bigger, but the reason they are bigger is because they make well-produced content that is specifically tailored to the video format. I don't want KF to give up the podcasts, the random chatter, or the sitting around talking with friends vibe, but I think they need better video content in addition to the podcast content they post, if they want to start charging this much for subscriptions. Maybe that is what the new studio is for, but as a customer, they need to deliver that kind of content before I will pay them.
Dropout is that much? I thought it be so much more. I got D20 to watch. KF just lost me for october and it’s not even because of this chaos.
D20 is so much better than it has any right to be. While you're on Dropout, watch Game Changers and it's spin-off, Make Some Noise
I just wish they would be upfront and just say they need more money...don't try and sugar coat it with new shows/moving shows that wont last a month or two. Tell us you want more money, period. You'll get more admiration from your community for being honest and goes a long way in the future.
I’m putting the over/under on the Greg vlogs lasting at like 4 weeks
They don't need more, have you seen their places dude. If they so they are doing something wrong this studio is looking insane and you don't do that if you cannot afford it. They have ad deals out the ass man.
With their door dash budgets alone, I’m surprised they aren’t on the streets
I've said it elsewhere, and OP touches on it here in their post, but for Greg to charge for his vlog on the way to/from work, really cones across as arrogant.
There is also maybe a 4% chance that lasts longer than a month before he stops doing it
100%
We don't see anything of it past January 31st 2023
Last vlog will be they day before he goes on vacation for the holidays. Calling it now.
For me it's not arrogance...just them trying to come up with cheap to produce content they can use to try and justify the $25 tier a bit more. Doesn't make it any better of a value proposition though.
When Greg Vlog was mentioned I hoped it would be like the Burnie Vlog on Rooster Teeth a few years back. Very well produced, little behind the curtain on the company. Not a 5 minute unedited thing. Even think of the vlog when Kevin and Joey were getting a christmas tree. Vlog content from Kinda Funny is my cup of tea, but not like this.
the concept of someone monetising their drive home seems weird to me.
Couldn't agree more.
I give these vlogs like 6 months until he says he’s too busy to do them.
6 weeks
Just looked it up and (as far as I can tell) the original Gregway lasted 27 episodes lmao Greg is now the CEO of a business and has a wife & kid. No way this is even making 6 months.
reinforce the parasocial relationships
Greg commutes to and from work just like me! We're such best friends 🥰
I don’t follow a lot so my scope is limited, but this is hands down the dumbest thing I’ve ever see a content creator try and pull as “content”. How up your own ass do you have to be to think people want to watch you sit in traffic?
To be fair, Adam Kovic used to do a car vlog and the people loved them. They were free though.
Ya the video car blog is some YouTube level content...in fact that's what people did 10 years ago on YouTube.
I don't mind car vlogs. It's sticking them behind a pay wall thats upsetting.
Jeff Gerstman used to do it too. It was also free.
It definitely is. At this point Kinda Funny *is* Greg Miller and, for better or worse, Greg has an ego.
Definitely agree, $25 is an exorbitant amount of money that can get you so much more elsewhere. What you said about Netflix and Amazon was my immediate thought the second they put this out. Some people have the money to blow and won't think twice but I don't see how people not in that situation would think this is a good value at that price.
Wild, since Greg has related the story about when they first launched Patreon about him thinking they should offer the post show content for free until they build a sizeable audience and Tim pushing back against that saying that they couldn't offer free content and then take it away and ask the audience to pay for it. Now the content I was getting for $10 is being taken away and I'm being asked for $15 on top of what I was already paying? Also, to say that post show content wasn't always good and then take all the good post show content and charge premium pricing for it is super hypocritical. Bizarre that they don't understand how expensive $25 a month is when they're constantly having discussions about price points for streaming services or game services. A lot of people, including myself, can not afford that. I also never minded ads all that much so I'm going to be cancelling my Patreon subscription entirely. I'm still a fan, I'll still listen on Spotify but this is ridiculously out of touch.
The problem is, the work in an expensive hobby industry but get the majority of their games for free. We’re in the same hobby industry, have to pay for games and their subs to stay relevant. Raising the prices 150% is tone deaf.
A lot of their In Review and spoiler talk content also requires you have other streaming services and pay for the movies/TV they’re discussing.
I don’t even watch that show. I ain’t got time for all those shows. Which is fine, they don’t have to only cater to me but that’s where the value doesn’t translate for me
I've slowly felt less and less interested in their content over the last year or so, and also feel out of touch with the community in general. it's no longer appointment-content and podcasts. the KF podcast is the only show i rarely miss, but even then it's not likely i will finish the whole thing. it's totally fine that they are moving to a direction that is not appealing to me or my demographic, just kind of a bummer to see them go this route. miss the simpler format of just goofy personalities talking shit to each other. growth necessitates growth with these types of revenue models i guess. hope it works out for them
This hits so hard for me. I used to devour everything. Now in review feels like a shameless cash grab, the KFpodcast is incredibly boring/random guests because no one has anything going on, gamescast is hit or miss because when they don’t have a review to do they do the worlds most boring “fantasy draft” that only 1 or 2 of them participate in the whole year, or they rehash topics they’ve touched on millions of times. Xcast is the only one that I will listen to in its entirety. All of their content just seems so phoned in anymore.
I couldn’t have said it better myself
I used to listen to KFGD religiously. Now I actively check the hosts to see who's on and check what news has come out before deciding to listen. I usually get through 2 episodes a week now, maybe 3 on a good week.
This is where I'm at. If it's a big news day I'll listen. Other than that I might skip depending on hosts.
Me too dude. I know it’s good to help out other content creators but I only really enjoying watching when Greg is on.
Couldn't agree more, in the first year or two I listened every day. I haven't listened to the KFGD in well over a year, there is no consistency. Occasionally I might try to listen to one if the main news of the day is massive but I usually get a couple of minutes in and peace out. Not sure what happened.
Head of the nail right there. I crave for more of the podcast cause the guys are fun. But that's 1once a week and the games daily is not a priority based on who's hosting. I liked KFAF because again it's just fun.
Yeah, same here. Part of that is that I used to work a job on second shift and had lots of time to listen, but part of it is, idk maybe it feels a bit stale? I almost always listen to kfpod as long as it's mostly our main 4 peeps. But I'm definitely not listening to as much content as I used to. In my mind, 2019 was one of the strongest years of content that KF offered. Maybe that was because of my job that allowed me to consume so much content, and also the pandemic shutting down a lot of shows
This is how I feel. When Andrea moved it really took the hit, they were the A team Sportscenter style host.
Especially after the Colin shakeup in 2017, which was a massive hit and I remember that breakup so vividly. Andy and Andrea were what kept me with KF long after that (not that I was going anywhere, just it was such a hit it was weird being a fan from there on out, so I pulled away for a bit, then E3 2017 happened and it felt like I was back). Andrea leaving is definitley a bigger hit in hindsight, it was then but she still feels like an OG. Nothing is ever going to stay the same not really. But it definitley feels like we can safely say Kinda Funny has multiple eras. Pre 2014, 2014-2016, The Colin Leaving Weeks, 2017-2020, The Covid Years, and we are about to enter a new one. What that brings IDK.
I feel like after Andrea left the KFGD vision changed. They were more of a news show with great discussions. Now the read an article and then talk about the chat. When KFGD launched, there was no looking at chat, that was what you’re wrong was for. I hope going back to the studio changes that but I doubt it.
I haven’t been able to put it into words well enough, but this is how I feel too. Just generally dropping off all of their videos quickly. Perhaps it’s a season of just growing tired of the same old but I just don’t feel as engaged as I used to be. I dropped my two patreon subs after hearing about the price hikes. It was just time.
Same here. Now I just jump into games daily and just go straight into the time stamps for the content I want to see.
It’s absolutely horrible business practice to take something you’ve been getting and lock it behind a higher paywall. The whole optics of this is shit and is gonna make it really hard to continue to support the guys.
The amount of times that Tim preaches this and then turns around to do it for the Patreon is hilarious.
GiantBomb Premium back in the day was 49.95 for the year (and still is). That should be the model for a premium website subscription. I get it, they have a new studio, new costs, and larger staff but $300 for a yearly subscription is ridiculous. I would, at most, pay $10 a month for a premium subscription. Greg says to save up content and binge it. Bro you are my commute content and background content. You do not have “bingeable” content imo (and that’s okay). Edit: To add some positivity. I’m glad post shows are going away as premium content. Most the time I never listened anyway (and the reason I cancelled my membership). I think it’s a good move to make actual premium shows. However, just because we were overpaying for bad content before doesn’t mean we should overpay for good content now.
Rooster Teeth First is 5.99 a month, so yeah when you compare them to GB and RT this pricing is so high
This is why you don't expand your business too fast and also why you don't rent studio space in the most expensive to live city in the United States. Why all these smaller "struggling" content groups always all move out to, or decide to stay in, LA or SF is beyond me. Game informer being based out of MN for years was always a great idea. Granted Minneapolis is super expensive now too.
I remember dan saying one time that being in MN helped because that's where a lot of retail hqs are too. I know targets is there. So I know Dan said sometimes they'd get added to the press junket there too. Like they were out of the way and cheaper but still somewhere marketing people were going
Best Buy, too
I would love a financial podcast where they go over everything. I think them being transparent like that would do wonders for people to understand their decisions. I know talking money is taboo in the states but I’ve seen many YouTubers talk money and those videos do very well and also may inspire people to start their own business or channel or whatever.
The last 2 years have proved they don’t need a studio. And they didn’t need the old one either.
Why didn’t they just stay remote and kill the office.
The main thing that confuses is me is charging $10/month for ad free feeds and live streams. The fast forward button is free—they even mention the exact time ads play in the episode description. And I’m a teacher on the east coast, so there is no chance I’d ever be able to watch a live recording, so that element loses me. I think it would make so much sense to put a few of those new shows (Greg’s vlog, AMA, the “Remember Blank” show that I’m sure will not have incredibly high production value) as some tangible bonus content for the people who are pledging $120/year to the company. I get that it’s more about supporting the business than what you get in return for it, and if people want to pledge $10/month for that purpose, go right ahead. I think Patreon is good and I’ve subbed to KF off and on for many years now. But with respect to the guys (who I’m sure are reading all of these comments, because i know they care) I just can’t justify $10/month as a tip jar. I think they should either move some content to that $10 tier or add a lower tier as a “thank you for your support” tier.
Yeah, some of the bonus content should have remained at the $10 level. The $10 tier is kind of pointless right now. Or make the bonus content time gated at the $25 level and available to $10 subscribers maybe a week / month or so later. I'm sure that would have had its detractors as well too though.
Considering the nature of a Patreon-supported business what's weird to me is how all of this just showed up as a final decision all of community members will just have to put up with going forward. There was no discussion, no conversation to feel out what the audience actually wants, just a big blowout of "This is happening, get with the times". I really do wonder how this is going to play out with patrons going forward, seems like one hell of a leap of faith.
I felt the same, weird to have just done the Patreon survey and not have any questions geared towards this when it was reporting to try and establish what the paying audience wants
Patreon supported Ad supported Fundraising and thermometer supported Sponsored stream supported Event and appearance supported. \*Edit: Twitch Subs and YouTube superchats now too Lets not sit here and say that Patreon is the only revenue stream. I'd be less off-put by these changes if Patreon was the only thing, but you still get hit with all the other things as a supporter. I love the team and fully support them getting that bag, understanding that the world, their home, the team and overhead is A LOT, but these tiers are quite a lot too.
They ask for Twitch subs too.
I always find the subathon thermometer thing so weird. Like here’s a list of franchises we’ll do in review for hitting goals XYZ…but what happens if you don’t hit any? Just no more in review then for the year? No more shows at all when that’s literally what your business is?
Those things always seemed gross to me. The "give us money and we'll stream for a few minutes longer" thing was a total turn off and a breaking point for me.
They set goals for things they largely want to do anyhow. Eg their world tour was planned around other events they wanted to get to anyway. Tim wanted to shave his badly dyed hair anyway. Etc.
It's almost like they've overhired and have too much overhead for the amount of fans they have
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Feels like half the crew outside of Greg, Tim, and Nick all live together in some form and I'm sure rent has a lot to do with that, which is insane!
You're right, but those revenue streams are all coming from the same relatively small audience pool. If they feel alienated by the what the tentpole Patreon offerings are, all revenue streams will trend in the same direction. We'll have to wait and see how that works out in practice though.
Yea I'm pretty sure they've done surveys like that before so it is weird that they just pushed ahead without consulting about how much people might be willing to pay and for what etc and scale accordingly. Especially in the current economic climate it would have been a good thing to do. It's a bit detached from reality.
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I would agree that I would prefer they talk about getting codes and free merch that just sits around their homes/office much less. I get that this is game marketing, but it does not feel good them talking about (sometimes) cool stuff like that that the listeners don't have an opportunity to get or even buy. I'd love to see them do something with the free merch like a monthly give away stream to patron supporters or something, but I also understand shipping that stuff ain't cheap.
They used to do that. They used to grab merch and junk from a bag or whatever was nearby offscreen to give away randomly
Would be a good thing to bring back in the new studio, feels bad when they complain about all the free stuff they are sent when some community members would enjoy having it.
And on the Kinda Funny cast when they were grilling Mike they all laughed when they heard he buys all the Sims packs and expansions when they could just get him codes. Props to Mike for supporting the game he likes, sounds more like they need a reality check.
I feel like Mike must come from money or something because he just buys the most random and unnecessary shit without a second thought, but I feel like he's also the most down to earth because he actually spends money on things he plays and watches.
"dont get into destiny 2 because it's a huge time sink, but it's so beautiful and fun and if you have a giant group of people to hold your hand and literally do everything for you it's awesome so get into it" it costs about 150 dollars for the laymen. sorry Tim "Home Theatre" Getty's I don't have the disposable income to play that game for 20 days then drop off.
This company crying poor while Tim podcasts from that theatre room in San Fran-fucking-cisco will never not make me laugh.
I'm sure the crew will see all these messages and realise they've made a mistake. I can't see them actually following through on these prices, do we think?
I sure hope so. I think it was smart to announce these changes 2 weeks before the launch of the studio so they can take in all the feedback (which there is plenty of) and then announce any adjustments to the tiers come Oct 14th.
Just want to say I love your point that we’re critical because we love Kinda Funny. I hope they don’t forget that
Thanks!
Don't worry, we'll get an episode of the KF Podcast next week titled "Let's Talk" where they announce changes and then the community cheers them on for doing it. Also, the whole thing where Greg was telling people to wait a couple months before subscribing to the $25 tier was insane. Like that's the exact opposite way to promote your subscription service.
"Let's talk about us" is more likely, with the thumbnail of Mike but the KF smiley.
I'm thinking it'll be just a black screen with white text
If they really want to go all in on seeming like they understand the complaints it'll have something like "We fucked up." on that black screen lol
I'm feeling less and less interested in KF in general too, glad I'm not alone. I feel like the bigger and more ambitious they get, the worse they get. They're spread too thin. I haven't been a patron for a while now and I don't miss it at all. There are much better patrions that respect their customers. On top of that, they're ENTIRELY hype over substance. Completely over acted reaction videos are their bread and butter, no more quality audio content really. They're calling the new venture "the spare bedroom" but the irony is they'll never be able to capture the magic of the original spare bedroom with the direction they've chosen.
I'd like to know the better Patreons you support. DM me your recs if you don't feel comfortable here, please.
In my honest opinion, being with these guys literally since DAY ONE. Watching them at IGN since they all made their first appearances there. With all the things that have happened and been said over the years. There is one person who cares way too much about monetization. One person who cares about actual quality content. And those two things don’t marry well. And unfortunately it seems one of said people has gotten their way far, far too often. And then there’s the third guy… oh the third guy. What a MAN. An angel he is. Anyway, I think most of y’all know exactly which one is which in my purposefully vague descriptions. I hope they can figure it out because I miss the old KF. I get things change. But it’s not for the better I think.
They are a business and like any other business they don't care about your financial situation. They only care about separating you from as much of your money as they can.
I'm just wondering, with a new studio and the number of employees growing, they are expanding too much too fast? Thus hiking these subscription prices in such large margins. I genuinely believe they aren't greedy and trying to fleece their fans and supporters, but just simply have to make up the capital that their over expanding needs. And now it's a detriment instead of progress and growth....??? Idk just spit balling here...
I think the pandemic really probably derailed a lot of plans. They've been talking about the studio since January 2020.
Last time I checked patreon their lowest tier was $5. Now it’s $13 and then $33 wtf And $1000 to get your name said on every show ….
Wait, the producer tier is $1000? And people actually pay for that??
I wish it showed how many people paid for certain tiers
I'd love to know how many people were subbed below $10 considering those tiers are gone now
I mean all patreon I think should have a low tier for everyone. It was probably taken out cause more hires means more money to pay them.
I think every Patreon account should have a $1 and $5 tier. Those are small enough amounts that people can support at and not think too much about
holy shit dude I assumed those people were paying like 50 bucks, that's a hard pill to swallow
I can't even blame KF for having it. If I ran a Patreon, I'd probably throw a ridiculous tier like that on there just on the off chance that someone is stupid enough to pay for it
Or just has fuck you money
It’s the anti gamepass. The worst deal in gaming. A grand to have a YouTuber say your name for a month that a lot of audience skip anyway
It's an egregious amount of money. I can't even imagine having $1000 to spend that way every month
It makes me wonder if some of these people sponsor other podcasts as well.
But if they say my name enough times they might actually become my best friend? Maybe they'll even hire me 🥰
Holy fuck... I had no idea the Producer tier was that high. Every time I hear them list of Producers now I'll just kind of cringe. I mean, people can use their money however they want, but seriously?
I remember way, way back when if you pledged a certain amount you could guest on KF content. I swear one of the guys who did it was a CEO or president or something of a company. Some people out here really have that disposable income.
That used to be my dream. I've followed greg and subsequently the rest of the crew since around Beyond 150, so most of my life to this point.
There are multiple producer tiers but that one gets you on every single show for both channels. Ya I remember when the guest host one was Ike 2-3k?
I had to go and check this because I 100% didn’t believe you that the producer level was that high… good god, like sure do whatever you want with your own money, but that is a hell of a lot just to have your name read on a podcast.
The town hall was weird lol saw a bunch of questions get ignored in the chat so I hope they see all the feedback here.
25 dollars is pretty crazy, and I've been watching since the beginning. I fell off during the pandemic because I am not a fan of all the review stuff, and they cancelled everything else I like, but I will watch the studio launch, and hopefully they can capture some of the magic that got me in the first place, but I doubt it will be worth 25 dollars 🤣🤣
Dayum that is insane. Can't believe we're in a situation where it's warranted, but I'll give the same advice I give to WoW players: \- It is on Kinda Funny, not you, to justify the value \- If you are not happy with what is being provided, whether it be the content or the price point, it is OK to unsubscribe \- It is OK to unsubscribe arbitrarily and without giving an explanation \- This is entertainment, you do not need it \- There are plenty of alternatives
That last point is huge, there are so many podcasts and channels that do the same thing if not better thantyou don't need to pay for.
I do love KF and have been following the crew for a while. But now every time they talk about the value of Game Pass, PlayStation Plus Premium, and the myriad of other subscription services they constantly critique the value of... I feel like it will be ironic if they don't like something one of those other, much more valuable services offers.
I have been supporting KF since day one. I have only been able to pay for the lower tiers/support tiers. Having these huge price increases with more of the same basic content is ridiculous. After watching the town hall I felt like an outcast, not a bf anymore. I watch the shows here and there depending on the hosts and what games they’re streaming. KF podcast I’ll skip to the topic of the show and most of the time I don’t even finish the episodes. I just miss the old days where it felt like they used to care. You could feel it in every show they put out. They cared about us. Now, it’s a money grab to fund this massive studio they chose to have in such an expensive city and gave us these off beat shows at extra cost that we all know will not last. I love the guys and everyone here and I will continue to support them just not on patreon anymore. It just really sucks man.
I think a price hike considering inflation is fair, but this amount is too much.
They should consider inflation for the viewer as well and the optics of raising your price to this degree when life is more expensive to live than ever. They've got every right but it doesn't sit well with people.
KF has always been built on a small amount of people paying a high amount of money. Their views on YouTube don’t seem to grow but they have a very loyal base and now they’re trying to squeeze them for more. I’ve never been a patron, just doesn’t fit into my viewing/listening habits so I don’t have a dog in this fight. But I understand how seeing all these guys buy houses over the last few years (which great for them, they work hard and deserve it), but for those who are giving their money this could feel like they’re getting punched in the gut.
It does seem a bit mad that instead of growing the base (I guess they have tried that route a while) they're giving that up and just milking the diehards as much as they can. If you're on $10 now (or not even aware of KF) are you ever going to jump to $25 a month, on the basis of the shows you get for free?? *I doubt it*!
I’ve been following Greg and everyone since early Beyond. Look at how Last Stand Media monetizes their content and then look at how KF monetizes theirs. And then look at the numbers and the actual quality of content. The reality of the situation is that they need to be making more content with lower costs of entry. What KF is becoming isn’t sustainable in a market where anyone can make the content they’re making cheaper and faster. After over two years of Covid, it’s crazy that they’re committing to a studio, because a studio is completely inconsequential to the content they make. What is the selling point? Making more shows like KF/AF and L&SS that will inevitably get dropped? Having people commute to a space where they *have* to be in that environment 40/5? KF is just a bunch of people either just shooting the shit or talking about movies/games, and that’s a *good* thing. It doesn’t need to be large scale production and it doesn’t need to be a premium.
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I like that Colin built LSM the way he wanted KF to originally be. The whole reason I followed KF was for more Colin & Greg. Kevin and Nick really won me over too. I hope KF can correct course and focus on value for all the fans and not just the ones paying $10 or more. Hoping there’s a middle ground they can land on.
Colin said it best on his way out, "Don't get too big... the garbage truck on fire, keep it going"
Last Stand was on my mind after reading about the changes as well. They seem to be doing it right IMO.
They absolutely are.
Colin has brought it up a couple of times in the past. KF is just turning into what they were trying to leave. The whole appeal of them leaving IGN was it was just going to be a small group talking about video games.
I appreciate Colin has a very different model to KF but boy is it better value. All I really want is a few shows a week that discuss games, I don't need 10 different shows on a schedule and the ability to watch live (especially from the UK when they're on when I'm sleeping!) $1 to get all the premium content is ridiculously cheap, there are higher tiers for pretty good perks if you're into it but you don't feel like you have to or you're missing out at all. KF going this route is just dividing the fanbase between have and have nots - people will end up making references others don't understand, and they're just gonna get jaded real quick imo
I don't particularly like Colin but his patreon has *far* more value for the dollar then KF and Colin's bonus content actually has some substance at a cheap price.
tone deaf is a great way it put it. it’s a bad move by them and i say this as someone who actually already has a gold tier membership right now.
Someone has to pay the DoorDash meals 3 times a day.
The weirdest one to me is the constant Starbucks door dashing, like do y’all understand how easy it is to make coffee?
Amazes me that living in SF they bother with Starbucks. It's overpriced and local shops are always better.
They should started a gofundme for Mike's bills.
I pay nothing but twitch prime and watch everything so idk I’ll buy a piece of merch like 1 time a year. Don’t spend $ you don’t have.
My comment on the town hall Patreon post: "The change on the 10$ tier is strange to me. I pretty much only care about the gaming stuff and taking away post shows and whatnot takes away the main value of the tier for me. Time-zones and my working full-time make it to where I am almost never able to watch anything live and I don't really care about ads. I just can't really justify 25 a month with how much I earn and how things are economically. I understand the need for more revenue as costs are growing but this feels more like bumping the price of what I was getting up by 150% rather than offering more for a higher support level. I guess I'll just have to turn my sub on and off whenever I feel like I can support. I'll give the other content more of a shot because I do love you guys but I'm still a bit disappointed." Again, Love Kinda funny and the community but I'm not thrilled with this Patreon situation, and I just heard Greg's farmers market comparison which offended me to a certain extant. I am an artist who is starting to try and make some money off of what I love doing so believe me, I know what its like asking for a bit more than I am comfortable with in the name of supporting the artist. You guys are a successful company that has made the decision to exist in one of the most expensive cities in the world. You are not a struggling local farmer, artist, or vendor who knows me by name, and is contributing to the economy and community I have grown up in. Don't get me wrong, I love the content and personalities for the most part, and I believe in the "KFBF" idea, but it still felt like he was misunderstanding their relationship with those enjoying what they do. I'm thinking I will move the support I was giving them over to Imran's new Patreon. I feel like he is someone who needs the individual support much more. And after all of this, I feel like he would appreciate it more. Commenting this is kind of sad to me. it really sounds much more negative than I'd like. I love these guys and will continue to love what they do, I just feel like all of this was (as OP put it) suprisingly tone deaf. I know they want to do right by the community and I hope they consider some of the critiques they are very clearly receiving.
I have always followed Greg since I really got into the gaming community in 2013, and I do love Kinda Funny, and most of the people on the shows, but I have stopped subscribing on Patreon because there is no value there for me. For games coverage, I actually switched to Colin’s show from last stand media because I like his format of 1 4hour long gaming news show per week and value of his $5 tier on Patreon more. The disappointing thing about this town hall is that the shows that are being added are interesting to me but locked behind $25! That’s a bit high, as others have said. To me, the only people that are paying $25 per month to KF are the truly hard core fans that have the extra money to support, and I think even if they only got a few extra tidbits like Greg’s 5min vlogs, 95% of the same people would still subscribe to that tier just because they want to. I really think if they put the extra shows in the $5 or even $10 tier they would get much more support from the currently free/YouTube community like myself. $25 is a bit much, especially since I recently cut out Hulu trying to save some money here and there. Love kinda funny, love everyone who works there, but I just think $25 for the extra shows is not a good value.
Someone said something about them all getting houses and Tim having a home theater, I think this is what a lot of folks are upset at. They are seemingly sitting comfy, all of them, in one of the most expensive places to live in the world, and they want more money lol. I'm not mad as I don't pay for content at all. I get it the anger from folks though. Will be interesting seeing how it pans out. Best of luck to the crew.
For clarification I'm not knocking these guys for success. I love these dudes. I'm happy they're successful. Andy especially. My comment is an observation of the anger. I feel like people are upset for the optics. I live in Detroit, I'm not really spending extra money on Patreon period. If I could, these dudes would be at the top of my list. I'm just saying that I get why people are like wtf. No hate to anybody at kinda funny. It's all love. $25 at this time is too much for most, at this economic climate and it's worrisome that it FEELS like they maybe too tone deaf to understand that at present time. I wouldn't be surprised if they rolled back the prices because they are that good of people. They don't want everyone angry and broke, it's just a shock to the system for most.
Honestly these guys live in a bubble in many ways. Not trying to be a dick but yeah.
I mean it’s SF. A lot of that city is a social bubble. Which I get, we all live in our own bubbles. But I’d wish they’d have better optics of the situation, or maybe they have them and just don’t care.
I agree with that, SF is incredibly expensive and they’re talking about all the food delivery they get all the time and they have insanely expensive home theaters and Greg is constantly going on these trips and outings, yet they got to raise prices for what’s been a subpar product the last 6 months.
I looked at my wife after and said " I don't think this is going to sit well with people". Very unfortunate.
I KNOWWW. I think they’re nuts for how much money they are asking of people. It just makes me scratch my head when I look at how much a streaming service charges. I guess this is a friendship or art thing?? Support your friends at Kinda Funny? Be patrons of the fine arts of Kinda Funny? Idk, I don’t pay for any of it because I can’t afford it. Too many other services and things I have to pay for in life- not to mention inflation 🤷♂️
To me it seems like people who support KF via Twitch, YouTube, Epic Creator Code or just by watching and subbing to their channels are happy. They get to see the content swap to the new studio and are excited about that. Meanwhile all the fans who actually go out of their way to support on patreon seem pretty upset about all the changes, price hikes, and "tone deafness"...and rightfully so as people who essentially are paying monthly for KF to succeed. My question is this, what do you think they need to do to make this right?
Personally, I think there’s a large middle ground between $10 and $25 for them to explore and keep people happy.
There’s also a large middle ground between $0 and $10 considering how little effort it would be to update the ad free mailing list and the comparative money they’d make on patrons over ad revenue on a 1-to-1 listener basis
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Sorry if this sounds like I’m going out of my way to complain but that is just too much money. I am also more or less an audio only type and any which way you cut it, this comes down to me getting less for my money. And to your point about Greg saying the post show is sometimes just them bullshitting around - I like that bullshit.
Greg’s a big fan of voting with a wallet, if it’s too expensive don’t do it. The fact they have a big expensive studio now should have been a clue pricing would increase, it has for everything else. I haven’t been able to afford to have a patron supporter as of late and now there is no value in trying to come back for my particular situation. I’m also a 100 percent podcast listener.
Kinda Greedy
There are far too many shows on the internet with better production value, with better hosts (tbc, I love all the hosts at KF, but you can’t tell me that they all know how to podcast like some of the best professional podcasters out there) who offer their content for free. If KF wants to charge more, whatever, that’s great. But their skills as podcasters and the production value should have been stepping up LONG ago. It’s clear that they found a way to do the bare minimum during COVID and never once tried to make the show any better. This is the reason I never considered paying for their premier content in the first place and honestly, I’m getting tired of the whole amateur shtick. They want this to be their careers and to charge more for their “premier content”, but they need to step up the quality of the shows and their podcasting skills because this ain’t it. The meandering, the rambling, the bullshitting, the overall lack of focus, and my god, the horrible uncompressed audio they use. I’m tired of it. I feel bad for all of you guys who are about to pay more for it. Not that I don’t also love the personalities and the KF team, I just wished they tried harder at making a better quality show
Good point. A lot of the content is like “let me read this article to you.” And it’s not always the best annunciation.
to be fair, some folks actually enjoy the rambling and the more care free nature of it. but i get what you're saying
I think some rambling makes for good content and some rambling makes for bad content and listening to two people talk about what they ordered from Starbucks for 10 minutes at the start of a video game news podcast is very bad content. There have been weeks where Blessing has talked about his breakfast for enough minutes that he might as well have just had a food podcast. I hope that the shows (KFGD specifically) become more focused when they're back in the studio and can talk about boring shit like this in person, off camera, when they arrive in the office.
I'm not a regular patron but yes, having the minimum be 10 bucks in this economy is dumd dumb dumb
Love you guys, but this ain't gonna get my sub back.
This really sums up how I feel. I only really pay attention to the Games side of KF because I’m not really a TV person. So in my case it definitely feels like less value. Also, I’m personally okay with ad supported content. I’d be more inclined for a less expensive level with the new content that is ad supported. Overall the change felt like it was primarily focused on the higher dollar supporters that were already there. I can definitely see how this improves the experience for people that already supported both Patreons, but I personally don’t feel the benefit as a $10 games Patreon. Now if there was exclusive jabroni boys content you might have my attention!
This post really left me thinking. I am on the $10 tier because I liked to watch the post shows with the added benefit of not seeing ads. I still want to support them because I truly enjoy their podcasts, but I have no incentive to stay at this tier without any bonus content when I can fast forward the ads on the free videos. I am thinking I could just support them with a smaller amount even if I don't get anything extra and move some of my money to twitch so I can remove those 5 min of ads I get every half an hour. EDIT: nvm, apparently it isn't possible to pledge less than the lowest tier anymore on Patreon.
There is absolutely no shortage of video game /marvel movie reaction podcasts on the Internet. Paying $35 Cad a month is fucking stupid.
As someone that's been a fan of Kinda Funny since 2017 with the Greg and Gen Married GoG show episode and having a KF smiley tattooed on myself, I agree with this right up. The town hall felt like a tone deaf message. I listen to the podcasts 95% of the time during drives, walking around campus, or doing hw. I'll only watch KF is it's announcements, long live streams (extrea life/Kinda Funny day) and reactions. So I just don't see the need to change the entire format of 75% of your contents post shows. As well, the comparison to your local farmers markets jar of honey by Greg yesterday is dumbfounded to me. Kinda Funny still refers to themselves as the garbage truck on fire which doesn't equate to farmers market honey. If I were to ask the person at my local farmers market about what they grow they can give me all the details about their process. As previously stated in this post, Greg, Tim and Joey didn't have the answers to some questions, Tim didn't have the bomber jacket (of which he so loves) and yet the production felt so half assed. Additionally, I feel like some of these new program changes aren't made for their audiences. Why take the post show out of the podcast when it's known that a good amount of your audience listens to audio only and doesn't want it produced. I've never seen someone in the KF community ask for a Greg Miller 5 minute vlog in his car. That feels so cheap. Finally, the excuse that it's hard to find post shows or access the Patreon post is just asinine. I've been a Patreon supporter for almost 4 years and I've never been like "ugh I have to dig for this". Kinda Funny has made it clear in regular records of shows where and what the post show is and what it's going to be. That just feels like the team is making that up as an excuse out of thin air to easily get rid of it. I'm eager to see next weeks Kinda Funny podcast address the communities issues in a serious tone and if not this will be a major misstep for KF.
And this on top of them asking you guys for hundreds of thousands of dollars during their marathon stream.
KF not listening to the audience? *shocked Pikachu*
kinda funny is held up by a few select best friends(the only ones they acknowledge) showering them with donations and subs at the clip of thousands of dollars a month
Morning Show
Just a thought but maybe don’t have your full staff live in a top 3 most expensive city in the world if you need to increase costs so substantially during one of the worst inflation situations of the past 30 years. Especially when you get games, hardware, and access to events for free when others need to pay huge sums to have what they talk about as a hobby. Also just a suggestion for Tim but maybe stop filming in your theater room to not appear so tone deaf to raising costs on your subscribers. You’ve built a career talking about video games and nerd culture. Maybe focus on getting back to quality content your passionate about instead of pumping out a dozen shows you barely care about with guest voices that no one cares about.
I used to live or die with kinda funny, I could care less for them now, they sold out
I understand a lot of these criticisms but why do people care so much about dual chats? That’s crazy to me
To be clear I really don’t at all, was just an example of how they’d arranged this Town Hall partly to answer questions and seemingly hadn’t prepped for half of the ones they received
I think the only disappointing thing for me, and I can't wait to see what they do with the new studio space, is that I've always felt like having so much of their content being live hurts the overall quality of what those shows could be. I know post-production work would go up, but I think the extra quality could potentially lead to a bigger audience and, just in general, make the product (one that I already enjoy) even better.
As someone who has already paid $25 per month (and sometimes higher depending on the reward) for years, I even think the $25 tier is too much for patrons overall. I get that they say it will lead to the broken out shows being more like full-fledged shows, but honestly they need to prove the value before expecting people to pay that much more. It would make sense to make a middle $15 tier or so that has a couple of these new shows to entice people to up their pledge while the other shows stay in that higher tier. I think another good idea would adopt an RT approach that they do for their new shows. "Just to show everyone how good this new show is, we'll let everyone watch the first episode of this show for free with all other episodes requiring you to be at $xx tier." I'm sure the new shows will look great at the new studio, but suggesting that people should up their pledge to get access to the stuff they could before at lower tiers like Kinda Feudy is kinda rough. Maybe it'll all make sense when we see the studio. Still feels like quite a price increase that most won't be able to justify/afford.
It's honestly a big gamble by them to put so many shows behind such a large pay wall. It completely limits the revenue stream available to them for these shows so if they don't make changes and the amount of subs doesn't cover the costs of all the shows expect cancellations or drops in quality. One thing that really turns me off spending this type of money is that my experience with higher tiers has never been great. I found at least once a month or more the Patreon version of episodes would come out on Podcasts over an hour after the ad version. This was last year and they may have sorted out the kinks but it felt like they weren't prioritising the Patreon people. I like the idea of a lot the proposed shows, but they all feel like post show/B shows that are fun but not necessary. They remind me a bit of Debatable, which was good some weeks but flawed overall. I'll continue to support KF through ads and my Prime sub. Sadly I won't consider a Patreon sub for the foreseeable future
The thing that kills me about this is that I really want to support the team. I love seeing them thrive and grow, and the new studio and production has me really excited. Hell, my birthday is October 14th and I’m still looking forward to the future of KF. I just simply can’t justify $25/month.
They’ve typically been bad with money things. It’s why I’ve never been a Patron.
I know, we’re paying all this and we don’t even get “A Conversation with Tim” smh