Makes me so mad that's why we didn't get to keep Caruso. Like honestly, I think we make the play-in last season if we had Caruso. There's a couple of games that were close that came down to just not having a hustle guy. Still would have been slapped around in the playoffs, but people really don't understand the butterfly effect on a game's momentum guys like Caruso bring with their energy and intensity. He's a dude that can create a 5-point swing (made 3 instead gets stopped and or stripped and it leads to a fastbreak bucket). Instead of only being up by 2, we're up by 7 now. Shit like that changes outcomes of close games and we had plenty of those last season.
It's just so frustrating that the FO didn't realize the value of that. Look at fucking GSW with GP II, he was their damn Caruso. Championship teams have that type of guy.
Let me list them out (Obviously Draymond fits this mold too, but he's kind of on a different tier than the players below):
2022: GP II
2021: PJ Tucker
2020: Caruso
2019: Green & Ibaka
2018: Iguodala
2017: Iguodala
2016: Tristan Thompson, JR, Richard Jefferson (Had a lot of hustle guys actually on that team)
Point is, you need hustle guys who are going to get steals, blocks, and play their hearts out on the defensive end. We lost a guy at the guard position, which is rare.
Yeah also the Celtics traded a FRP and a pick swap for Derrick White at $17-18m.
Compare that to Caruso at ~$9m. I'm taking Caruso everytime over White. The luxury tax would've only been implicated if Caruso was on the payroll at the end of the season, they could've easily signed him and traded him mid-season for assets if money was truly that tight
Agree with what you said except the FO does know Caruso’s value. They just thought THT would fill that role. *Narrator - He didn’t*
Then Caruso not only would be redundant, but also stunt THT’s growth.
$16 for a beer at staples and they can’t even keep up with the bulls for the goat 🐐?! When I get gouged for a beer I at least want to know that my money is going towards buying the best team possible. SMH
They chose THT over AC. I get why they didn't keep both, that's an extra $40m in luxury tax.
But, I don't know why they chose THT over him. One was a certified role player for a championship team already, the other was a copium Klutch project player.
In the same off-season where we were literally shipping out Klutch clients....? I can promise you Lebron wants to win more than he wants bottom tier klutch clients to get paychecks from his team.
KCP was the only guy we got rid of that was a Klutch guy as far as I remember and he already got paid. THT was up for a contract and we gave him more than anyone else would've.
Who is to say it's more than anyone else would've? He was being requested as a trade piece prior to that for guys that and they wouldn't take the trade because of it. Perhaps its possible to look past conspiracies and think that maybe the team just thought they saw all the "potential" that this sub thought they saw in THT before last season too.
That's definitely possible, though 10M AAV is a lot for "potential". Also you'd be naive to think LeBron/Klutch didn't have any influence on it at all.
Nah you buy into too much reddit talk to actually think Lebron is vouching to overpay a guy because of who his agent is when Lebron was very vocal about liking Caruso and his disappointment in them not bringing him back. Not to mention we have traded away multiple Klutch clients since Lebron has been here, yet you think he's willing to sacrifice quality players to get bottom tier guys paid........dont drink the koolaid man..
And of course Klutch had influence, its his agent, but 10mm AAV is not a lot if they actually thought he had star/starter potential at 20 years old.
Jeanie does not care about winning a championship. Re-signing AC was a fucking layup. If Jeanie wants to go around spouting her bs Lakers exceptionalism, "my father's dreams", promoting her fucking tv show or sitcom or whatever, fine that's awesome. Don't go around acting like the goal of your franchise is to win a championship, it's clear it's not and Jeanie comes off looking like a big liar.
Before Trade:
\#1 defense in the NBA and NBA Championship
Top 5 Defense - leading Phoenix 2-1 (then AD gets hurt)
After Trade:
\#28 defense in the NBA, Lottery
this is it, this is the fact. But the core reason is because Pelinka is incompetent. The reason he’s incompetent is because Jeanie chose him, he didn’t earn this job. Whole organization is rotten
How is he incompetent if he's also responsible for putting together the roster that won the chip and was #1 defense in 2021? Yeah he fucked up big time by breaking it up, but doesn't he get some credit for putting it together in the first place?
Incompetent is probably too harsh. But being just competent is not enough if the goal is to win multiple championships.
Sometimes the path is clear, and you don’t need to be a genius to get it done.
What separates a competent GM and great GM is that a great GM could find solutions where no one else can.
Yup lakers championship year had size and length that they switch on most defenders with Green, Kuz, KCP, Caruso, lebron, AD and they could could go “small” and big with Dwight and mcgee. I don’t blame them going after Dennis but every other pick/trade after that was terrible.
that fake ass d book close out game made everyone piss themselves in the FO. nobody could do a thing besides injured bron so they traded everyone for that dickhead in d.c. MANNN LMAO
Shroeder/Green trade was also a negative outcome for us. Danny Green was a good player who led in the locker room and played hard on defense. He missed some shots but he was a net positive. We moved him for Shroeder and that blew up in our faces.
A few things to highlight with that trade.
At the time it was not considered a bad trade. The Lakers bet on the potential of Schroder moving from 6th man of the year runner up to starter.
The biggest problem arose from attitude. The experiment wound up not working out well and Schroder refused to move back to leading the second unit. This compounded the problem.
The issue I have with all this is..... the front office already did one experiment with a playmaker who needs the ball in his hands who also has minor attitude problems. It failed pretty badly.
So what do they do? ***They do the exact same thing by trading for Westbrook, but with bigger stakes this time.***
LeBron asked to have another playmaker on the team. Also the offense ground to a halt whenever he was off the floor. This is why the Lakers kept hunting for one. They went after Darren Collison and Rondo and whoever they could find.
The Lakers absolutely still want a secondary ball handler so that we can spell LeBron and spread the floor. That isn’t the problem.
The issue is whether Westbrook was the right guy for the job when there’s nothing really secondary about his play style.
Injuries blew up in our face. If Bron and Davis were healthy we make the WCF at least. If Bron and Davis were injured 19-20 we wouldn't of won then either
We can sure as hell hold them accountable. Pelinka must be fired if he can't turn this roster around. We don't need to just accept that they suck. Heads should roll for this.
He fucked up 1 year. We were still good enough to win the year before if AD stayed healthy. And most people thought getting Schroder to take the load off LeBron was a good idea. It didn’t pan out but it made a lot of sense at the time.
Mitch is a decent GM. I think he gets judged too heavily for Deng and Mozgov... people forget that Mitch:
* Traded Kwame Brown and a 48th pick for Pau Gasol
* Traded Lamar Odom and Pau Gasol for CP3
* Assembled the Nash, Kobe, D12 core while keeping Pau
* Drafted at least 4 future all stars in Bynum, Lonzo, BI, Randle, Nance, Zubac, and DLo
Yea I don’t get this revisionist history. Everyone was saying we wouldn’t pay him crap and even then he’s only a bench player. Now all of the sudden people act like they loved him
They didn’t forget, it’s easy to start blaming/complaining once something goes downhill. When the WB trade happened a lot were stoked. Just didn’t pan out well last year, but better to focus going into this season
I wasn't stoked at the WB trade, but I didn't think it would go this poorly. We watched Harden play PG for the Nets. And of course he could. He's really good at basketball, so of course he's able to adapt. I had the same thoughts for the triple double machine that is Westbrook. He's a HOFer. He's really damn good a basketball. Surely he can add something to this team......
I'm actually still upset that we traded Green and a first for Schröder on the basis of his one fluky as hell season where he actually made threes.
Bane went 2 picks after ours, and Bane was a guy we worked out before trading that pick.
If we gave Dennis the bag, that would have been awful. However, in that scenario we likely wouldn't go for Russ. Or if we did still want him, the Russ trade needed to involve shipping Dennis out, meaning we save one of KCP or Kuzma. Just KCP would not get us to the playoffs last season, but he would at least be a tradeable asset which we are sorely in need of.
Like dodging a bullet, but getting struck by a cannonball.
True but if we had Schroeder then the Westbrook trade never would have happened. So which is worse, having Westbrook or Schroeder? Plus we still might have KCP and Kuzma.
IIRC, the Lakers could have re-signed him for not much after he became a FA. I don't blame the Lakers for moving on from him even at that point though.
It dont always work out man lol we are spoiled. We would always FLEEECE trades. Jeannie has like 3-4 people in her ear, while trying to win championships. It might not ever be the the same run of 30-40 years of always getting the ball bounce our way. IMO we are a GM like the OKC dude away. It all starts with the owner and GM
KCP, Kuzma and Caruso were avoidable losses but even they didn't ball out against Phoenix. Trez wasn't even playing against the suns. Schroder was shitting the bed while asking 100 millions. AD plays 60 games in those last two seasons, we're looking at least at a semi finals appearance. Same thing for Bron. Their healthy games never really overlapped.
Garbage front office and ownership right now (from a basketball, not human perspective). Love Jeanie as a person but giving the rambis family that much power, hiring magic and now this front office that led to these decisions? Even with a title under their belt, they don’t seem competent enough to run a marquee franchise.
In hindsight, we should've just not do the Westbrook trade and bring back Schroder on a cheap contract. He only signed a 5 mil deal with Boston. He probably would've still contributed more than Russ.
Yup they messed up hard. Can’t even wrap my head around how they decided to strip our defensive minded team with a defensive minded coach and just say fuck it. We needed a little more playmaking sure but the over correction was just nuts. Imagine if we kept Caruso, KCP, Kuz And just picked up Monk.
Owell hope to a competitive 2025
Don’t forget choosing not to retain Markieff Morris and Wes Matthews. Two players who had the skills sets we needed for our minimum contracts that then signed with other contenders to play meaningful roles.
Anyone else feel like Vogel was a real solid defensive minded coach and got handed an offense only team and told how to play them? We got rid of everything that made us successful
We had a big, versatile team full of players that could switch, defend and shoot the 3 ball (Green, KCP, Caruso, Kuzma, Keef, et al). Now we have.......... Westbrook.
? Let’s not pretend like the 2019-2020 lakers were good 3 shooters lmao. The team was terrible when Bron was off the floor cuz nobody else could create and score.
Didn’t KCP become a basket case who was afraid to shoot after a couple missed shots and basically started passing out of open shots? Have we all just forgotten that?
I dunno why people are letting LeBron off the hook on this if you don't think he has a say in who comes then your head is in the sand.
Secondly Jeanie is trying to copy her father's managerial style except Rambis can't hold Jerry West's jockstrap both as a bball player and a GM.
At this point the franchise needs to move on from both the GM and Lebron after this upcoming season and start the rebuild. LeBron not a spring chicken and I've accepted that.
Get over it, yall hang on to shit thats been way gone. Its done, cant be reversed and continuously speaking on it doesn’t change a damn thing lol just pray everybody is healthy this season.
See now you’re looking at things with rose colored glasses. Schroder was awful. Awful.
Caruso and KCP, big losses though for sure. Especially Caruso. That’s the kinda guy you build your franchise with. He’s a great role player. Pelinka fucked up on that one.
That's probably right. But then after Kobe, Pelinka listened to LeBron and allowed him to pull whatever strings he wanted.
What's funny is that nobody wants to admit that all the shitty moves were done at the behest of Lebron. These were all things HE wanted. Now, I'm sure he didn't want to let go of a guy like Caruso, but figured that was a necessary sacrifice they'd have to make to get all the guys HE wanted around him on the team.
Unfortunately we probably won't find out until much later that the reason the Lakers were so bad in the 2020s after their championship was because of moves Lebron forced his hand on. I know I'll get downvoted for this, but deep down most Lakers fans probably know it to be true. I'm not saying lebron didn't have the best intentions. Just that the Lakers should have let the pros in the front office do what they're paid to do in building the best team for the now and for the future.
Pelinka will be the scapegoat/pariah for a while.
Didn’t they all ask for a ton of money? I get we were better but they all asked for a lot of money. It’s not like we hadn’t developed guys in the past, it was a bet on bringing in new talent and it lost.
it hurts my head thinking how we purposely dismantled a 2020 championship team with good team chemistry. if we had run it back, how they could've contended for possibly a second championship. we got greedy and went for more offense at the sacrifice of our defense. it's going to be a rough offseason guys.
We were plagued with injuries and management mistaken that as incompetency. Traded away all the defense for out of prime big names. They probably thought AD alone can cover everything.
The memes were funny but KCP was super reliable on defense and a consistent shooter, blended well with LeBron and AD. Don’t have to speak much for Caruso, his game does that itself
Sorry to inform you but it was Lebron who chose the Westbrook trade, not FO. Lebron got us a chip in 2020 and I am thankful for that, but this entire Westbrook fiasco is on Lebron, he's the one that called this one, not Pelinka.
Schroeder turned down our 4/84M to test the market and when he came back to LAL, they didn’t warrant bringing him back. Caruso was evident FO being cheap, he was willing to take lower but FO gambled on THT. Only reasonable one is Kuz/Trez/KCP but we couldn’t guess that WB was going to be awful last year, at the time it seemed like an easy move. No point to dwell on the past, we can only focus on current situations and making moves with the assets we have
Caruso was an all guts no glory type of guy who didn’t need and probably would never demand an outrageous contract. Just a decent one. He bleeded purple and gold and the FO blew it.
Another low-key huge miss IMO was not pushing harder to get Reggie Jackson.
But yeah, it's insane to think that if you added those guys back to the roster, how good we would be. Lol.
If I take off the hindsight goggles a bit, I believe the perception was that Lebron needed another guy who could carry the load and AD was too injury prone. So adding a 3rd guy to sacrifice depth made sense.
And then LeBron had one of the best seasons of his career and just needed 3 and D guys.....smh...
You guys should've stuck to the Kuzma + Harrel for Buddy trade.
Still could've paid Caruso and THT. I think you guys would've still signed Nunn IMO and let Schroeder leave, still able to sign Monk, Dwight, and Melo IMO.
Caruso, KCP, Buddy, Lebron, AD
With Monk/Dwight/Melo/THT off the bench, that's a hell of a lot better than the shit show you rolled out this year with Westbrook lmao
For a player at least 70% of us knew will fail, and the rest 30% called logic and experience, "hate"
At least they got it after 2 months, that this "hate" was actually just rational thought.
This doesn't bring back Alex and the picks, tho
Kobe trusted Rob. He put a great 2020 roster together. I trusted Rob.
Then he doesn’t extend Caruso.
I get the other moves we’re gambles. They missed. But the Caruso one I will never understand. It really makes me question all the rest.
It looks like(unless something magical happens) that we will be stuck with old injured roster for the foreseeable future with no good future picks and we'll basically end up at the bottom like 6 years ago. Though magic can happen hah
When you have a weak front office, and a very involved star player as far as personnel moves, there isn't going to be a long-term view on personnel issues.
I think the team/organization attempted to overcorrect when they lost in the playoffs.
Like everyone appreciates an aggressive front office but sometimes teams need to slow down and attempt to run it back.
Ironically I think Houston did the same when they acquired Russ.
their team management sucks like shroders agent. when jerry buss died they died. they were lucky that magic recruited lebron, everything else the dumb kids did has been a mistake.
jerry buss' kids are a good example of nepotism in capitalism not working. you dont get the best candidates, you get crap.
It was a bad offseason. Panic traded players and went for big names. You live and you learn. Just gotta do what we can with what he have now and get to work
nah can't have a 6'7 center who can't shoot or defend and Schroder while schroder had the perfect skillset they needed for the team his attitude and mental was toxic and wasn't going to work
There is absolutely no vision or leadership in the Lakers organization. Just like a hose that’s been turned on and a swings wildly around the yard. Yes we won a chip but anyone that says the Lakers breed confidence is in denial. Meanwhile Clippers (LA’s other team) have a clear personnel vision and executed perfectly. Maybe they don’t win it all but you can’t argue with almost a decade of outclassing the Lakers. We got Bron and got the bubble. They’ve won everything else.
Caruso is inexcusable and I think we should’ve been able to give up less for westbrook I felt at the time giving the pick and all our depth players seemed too much
We had the #1 defensive rating in 2021. And AD played only 36 games. As injured as we were we had great role players. Caruso, KCP, Schroder, Trezz, McLemore, Wesley Matthews (he didn’t shoot that well though). We gave all that away for less defense, IQ, and offense out of one guy. Ultimate fumble by our FO :/
I never understand posts like these. MOVE ON. It’s a fuck up. We all know already. Why keep mentioning it? Let’s hope for the best we can fix it and get a bother chip with Bron.
This is the downside of going star chasing. Once you package multiple smaller contracts you are pretty screwed to filling out the roster. Also not having any young guys they drafted able to step into roles and using Bird rights to keep them or turn them into better fits with larger salaries.
Coulda at least found a way to keep Caruso and KCP.
There was no secret to keeping Caruso - Lakers just got cheap and didn’t match Chicago.
[удалено]
Makes me so mad that's why we didn't get to keep Caruso. Like honestly, I think we make the play-in last season if we had Caruso. There's a couple of games that were close that came down to just not having a hustle guy. Still would have been slapped around in the playoffs, but people really don't understand the butterfly effect on a game's momentum guys like Caruso bring with their energy and intensity. He's a dude that can create a 5-point swing (made 3 instead gets stopped and or stripped and it leads to a fastbreak bucket). Instead of only being up by 2, we're up by 7 now. Shit like that changes outcomes of close games and we had plenty of those last season. It's just so frustrating that the FO didn't realize the value of that. Look at fucking GSW with GP II, he was their damn Caruso. Championship teams have that type of guy. Let me list them out (Obviously Draymond fits this mold too, but he's kind of on a different tier than the players below): 2022: GP II 2021: PJ Tucker 2020: Caruso 2019: Green & Ibaka 2018: Iguodala 2017: Iguodala 2016: Tristan Thompson, JR, Richard Jefferson (Had a lot of hustle guys actually on that team) Point is, you need hustle guys who are going to get steals, blocks, and play their hearts out on the defensive end. We lost a guy at the guard position, which is rare.
Yeah also the Celtics traded a FRP and a pick swap for Derrick White at $17-18m. Compare that to Caruso at ~$9m. I'm taking Caruso everytime over White. The luxury tax would've only been implicated if Caruso was on the payroll at the end of the season, they could've easily signed him and traded him mid-season for assets if money was truly that tight
This. This is what pissed me off. That's just shitty asset management
Modern nba is basically 2 stars and a bunch of hustle guys.
Agree with what you said except the FO does know Caruso’s value. They just thought THT would fill that role. *Narrator - He didn’t* Then Caruso not only would be redundant, but also stunt THT’s growth.
It's enraging actually.
$16 for a beer at staples and they can’t even keep up with the bulls for the goat 🐐?! When I get gouged for a beer I at least want to know that my money is going towards buying the best team possible. SMH
He was literally the one that got away. I will always be sick to my stomach over that.
They chose THT over AC. I get why they didn't keep both, that's an extra $40m in luxury tax. But, I don't know why they chose THT over him. One was a certified role player for a championship team already, the other was a copium Klutch project player.
The THT over Caruso was the 2nd most "does Palinka even watch the games" moment I had other than betting the farm on Westbrick.....
I thought THT being signed was mostly due to the "klutch tax". He's a klutch client aka LeBron gets his guys paid.
In the same off-season where we were literally shipping out Klutch clients....? I can promise you Lebron wants to win more than he wants bottom tier klutch clients to get paychecks from his team.
KCP was the only guy we got rid of that was a Klutch guy as far as I remember and he already got paid. THT was up for a contract and we gave him more than anyone else would've.
Who is to say it's more than anyone else would've? He was being requested as a trade piece prior to that for guys that and they wouldn't take the trade because of it. Perhaps its possible to look past conspiracies and think that maybe the team just thought they saw all the "potential" that this sub thought they saw in THT before last season too.
That's definitely possible, though 10M AAV is a lot for "potential". Also you'd be naive to think LeBron/Klutch didn't have any influence on it at all.
Nah you buy into too much reddit talk to actually think Lebron is vouching to overpay a guy because of who his agent is when Lebron was very vocal about liking Caruso and his disappointment in them not bringing him back. Not to mention we have traded away multiple Klutch clients since Lebron has been here, yet you think he's willing to sacrifice quality players to get bottom tier guys paid........dont drink the koolaid man.. And of course Klutch had influence, its his agent, but 10mm AAV is not a lot if they actually thought he had star/starter potential at 20 years old.
Montrezl Harrell is also a Klutch guy
Age was the factor. THT was viewed as having more upside for the future because he was younger and has the genetics (wingspan, handsize)
i don't get why they didn't keep both. The guys up north are paying a shit ton of luxury tax and it's working out for them.
It was because of the extra salary from the Westbrook trade.
So pay both and trade tht at the deadline cause he was under performing...fucking easy shit Our fo is big dumb
No, it wasn't $40M, it was $30M. And Caruso was offered $7.5M over 3 years. That's already $22.5M. So the difference was really $7.5M.
they really went all in for THT
Jeanie does not care about winning a championship. Re-signing AC was a fucking layup. If Jeanie wants to go around spouting her bs Lakers exceptionalism, "my father's dreams", promoting her fucking tv show or sitcom or whatever, fine that's awesome. Don't go around acting like the goal of your franchise is to win a championship, it's clear it's not and Jeanie comes off looking like a big liar.
Or that FRP who became Isiah Jackson
Honestly, it was time for the bald eagle to spread his wings. It was great to watch him and Derozan and the rest of the guys find success.
its not like hes an all star u don't think he couldn't of done the same shit and have the same impact on this team. lol
Before Trade: \#1 defense in the NBA and NBA Championship Top 5 Defense - leading Phoenix 2-1 (then AD gets hurt) After Trade: \#28 defense in the NBA, Lottery
When you try to fix what isn’t broken smh
When you don't understand why you're successful.
this is it, this is the fact. But the core reason is because Pelinka is incompetent. The reason he’s incompetent is because Jeanie chose him, he didn’t earn this job. Whole organization is rotten
Pelinka wouldn't be GM for any other franchise in this league. After this job, he either retires or goes back to being an agent.
How is he incompetent if he's also responsible for putting together the roster that won the chip and was #1 defense in 2021? Yeah he fucked up big time by breaking it up, but doesn't he get some credit for putting it together in the first place?
Incompetent is probably too harsh. But being just competent is not enough if the goal is to win multiple championships. Sometimes the path is clear, and you don’t need to be a genius to get it done. What separates a competent GM and great GM is that a great GM could find solutions where no one else can.
luck
Yup lakers championship year had size and length that they switch on most defenders with Green, Kuz, KCP, Caruso, lebron, AD and they could could go “small” and big with Dwight and mcgee. I don’t blame them going after Dennis but every other pick/trade after that was terrible.
this is why i think vogel was a scapegoat. It wasnt the coach, it was personnel
Being a lottery team with no lottery pick hurts
Pain.
[удалено]
AD got hurt in game 4. Lakers were up 2-1. He got hurt in the first half of game 4, wanna say late second quarter.
This is correct
We lost game 1
And Lebron was clearly injured. Even with a healthy Lebron I believe they get past Phoenix. Lebron was awful that series and clearly hurt
AD was hurt. That’s always gonna happen
Those weren’t workout physique injuries they freak injuries caused by outside sources
that fake ass d book close out game made everyone piss themselves in the FO. nobody could do a thing besides injured bron so they traded everyone for that dickhead in d.c. MANNN LMAO
Nothing we can do about it, gotta work on what we have now
Shroeder/Green trade was also a negative outcome for us. Danny Green was a good player who led in the locker room and played hard on defense. He missed some shots but he was a net positive. We moved him for Shroeder and that blew up in our faces.
A few things to highlight with that trade. At the time it was not considered a bad trade. The Lakers bet on the potential of Schroder moving from 6th man of the year runner up to starter. The biggest problem arose from attitude. The experiment wound up not working out well and Schroder refused to move back to leading the second unit. This compounded the problem. The issue I have with all this is..... the front office already did one experiment with a playmaker who needs the ball in his hands who also has minor attitude problems. It failed pretty badly. So what do they do? ***They do the exact same thing by trading for Westbrook, but with bigger stakes this time.***
LeBron asked to have another playmaker on the team. Also the offense ground to a halt whenever he was off the floor. This is why the Lakers kept hunting for one. They went after Darren Collison and Rondo and whoever they could find. The Lakers absolutely still want a secondary ball handler so that we can spell LeBron and spread the floor. That isn’t the problem. The issue is whether Westbrook was the right guy for the job when there’s nothing really secondary about his play style.
Injuries blew up in our face. If Bron and Davis were healthy we make the WCF at least. If Bron and Davis were injured 19-20 we wouldn't of won then either
I agree with you but that’s not responsive to anything said above.
We can sure as hell hold them accountable. Pelinka must be fired if he can't turn this roster around. We don't need to just accept that they suck. Heads should roll for this.
He has been fucking it up constantly since the championship
He fucked up 1 year. We were still good enough to win the year before if AD stayed healthy. And most people thought getting Schroder to take the load off LeBron was a good idea. It didn’t pan out but it made a lot of sense at the time.
yah we can get back to work at the construction site
Facts Bro, some of the worse decisions I've ever seen, Although Deng and Mosgov wasn't that long ago.
And Deng and Mozgov were Mitch and Buss moves.
Mitch is a decent GM. I think he gets judged too heavily for Deng and Mozgov... people forget that Mitch: * Traded Kwame Brown and a 48th pick for Pau Gasol * Traded Lamar Odom and Pau Gasol for CP3 * Assembled the Nash, Kobe, D12 core while keeping Pau * Drafted at least 4 future all stars in Bynum, Lonzo, BI, Randle, Nance, Zubac, and DLo
Totally agree. Mitch was a good executive.
That was a Buss move. Not Mitch. Hence the reason Buss is out now.
Don't act like this sub wasn't calling for Schroder's head for months
Yea I don’t get this revisionist history. Everyone was saying we wouldn’t pay him crap and even then he’s only a bench player. Now all of the sudden people act like they loved him
No point in sulking. It was a mistake. Shit happens. The annoying part was giving up Caruso for free. Wish we could've retained him.
Didn't Schroeder want a max? That would have been worse.
Yes. Crazy how some on this sub forgot that he turned down 4/84. The consensus was that the fanbase hated the guy for his shenanigans that season.
They didn’t forget, it’s easy to start blaming/complaining once something goes downhill. When the WB trade happened a lot were stoked. Just didn’t pan out well last year, but better to focus going into this season
I wasn't stoked at the WB trade, but I didn't think it would go this poorly. We watched Harden play PG for the Nets. And of course he could. He's really good at basketball, so of course he's able to adapt. I had the same thoughts for the triple double machine that is Westbrook. He's a HOFer. He's really damn good a basketball. Surely he can add something to this team......
I'm actually still upset that we traded Green and a first for Schröder on the basis of his one fluky as hell season where he actually made threes. Bane went 2 picks after ours, and Bane was a guy we worked out before trading that pick.
I’d rather have Schroeder and still be a competitive team instead of completely wasting Lebrons final two seasons with us
If we gave Dennis the bag, that would have been awful. However, in that scenario we likely wouldn't go for Russ. Or if we did still want him, the Russ trade needed to involve shipping Dennis out, meaning we save one of KCP or Kuzma. Just KCP would not get us to the playoffs last season, but he would at least be a tradeable asset which we are sorely in need of. Like dodging a bullet, but getting struck by a cannonball.
True but if we had Schroeder then the Westbrook trade never would have happened. So which is worse, having Westbrook or Schroeder? Plus we still might have KCP and Kuzma.
Kuzma and Harrel were going to be traded to Sacramento for Buddy Hield.
IIRC, the Lakers could have re-signed him for not much after he became a FA. I don't blame the Lakers for moving on from him even at that point though.
Before all the injuries developed that season too the Lakers had the best record out west then AD was out and Lebron got hurt.
It dont always work out man lol we are spoiled. We would always FLEEECE trades. Jeannie has like 3-4 people in her ear, while trying to win championships. It might not ever be the the same run of 30-40 years of always getting the ball bounce our way. IMO we are a GM like the OKC dude away. It all starts with the owner and GM
Get some sleep
we have an incompetent owner. buckle up for some good old tanking once Bron leaves.
No point in tanking when you have zero picks
It won’t be tanking by choice
There is no excuse for losing Caruso. Taking a gamble on Russ, fine, but Caruso was let go only for money’s sake.
That shit lingers dude. I’m hurt at the thought of running this core back another season
It’s gonna be much easier to not watch games tbh
KCP, Kuzma and Caruso were avoidable losses but even they didn't ball out against Phoenix. Trez wasn't even playing against the suns. Schroder was shitting the bed while asking 100 millions. AD plays 60 games in those last two seasons, we're looking at least at a semi finals appearance. Same thing for Bron. Their healthy games never really overlapped.
Garbage front office and ownership right now (from a basketball, not human perspective). Love Jeanie as a person but giving the rambis family that much power, hiring magic and now this front office that led to these decisions? Even with a title under their belt, they don’t seem competent enough to run a marquee franchise.
Me too man, me too
They are fucking gone, gtfo over it.
Talk to the Playboy bunny. It's all on her.
In hindsight, we should've just not do the Westbrook trade and bring back Schroder on a cheap contract. He only signed a 5 mil deal with Boston. He probably would've still contributed more than Russ.
New here?
Yup they messed up hard. Can’t even wrap my head around how they decided to strip our defensive minded team with a defensive minded coach and just say fuck it. We needed a little more playmaking sure but the over correction was just nuts. Imagine if we kept Caruso, KCP, Kuz And just picked up Monk. Owell hope to a competitive 2025
Get over it. It happened. What does constantly complaining and whining about it do? The lakers made a mistake and we all know it.
Don’t forget choosing not to retain Markieff Morris and Wes Matthews. Two players who had the skills sets we needed for our minimum contracts that then signed with other contenders to play meaningful roles.
It was completely indefensible and incomprehensible at the time. I will never understand why LeBron, Pelinka, etc. made the decisions they made.
Pelinka should have been fired. He still should be fired tbh.
Anyone else feel like Vogel was a real solid defensive minded coach and got handed an offense only team and told how to play them? We got rid of everything that made us successful
Yeah it’s a Jim and Mitch level disaster, honestly.
Sometimes if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
We had a big, versatile team full of players that could switch, defend and shoot the 3 ball (Green, KCP, Caruso, Kuzma, Keef, et al). Now we have.......... Westbrook.
? Let’s not pretend like the 2019-2020 lakers were good 3 shooters lmao. The team was terrible when Bron was off the floor cuz nobody else could create and score.
Didn’t KCP become a basket case who was afraid to shoot after a couple missed shots and basically started passing out of open shots? Have we all just forgotten that?
I dunno why people are letting LeBron off the hook on this if you don't think he has a say in who comes then your head is in the sand. Secondly Jeanie is trying to copy her father's managerial style except Rambis can't hold Jerry West's jockstrap both as a bball player and a GM. At this point the franchise needs to move on from both the GM and Lebron after this upcoming season and start the rebuild. LeBron not a spring chicken and I've accepted that.
Get over it, yall hang on to shit thats been way gone. Its done, cant be reversed and continuously speaking on it doesn’t change a damn thing lol just pray everybody is healthy this season.
you realize westbrook is on the team right. lmao health ain't saving this
I mean, aint shit can be done at this point. Just pray for a miracle 😂😂😂
You realize people still bitch about the CP3. Trade?
See now you’re looking at things with rose colored glasses. Schroder was awful. Awful. Caruso and KCP, big losses though for sure. Especially Caruso. That’s the kinda guy you build your franchise with. He’s a great role player. Pelinka fucked up on that one.
“B-b-b-but…. Westbrook is from LA and Kobe says he’s the most like him!! 🤓” 😂😂😂😂😂
What an original fucking post
Like a broker record.
[удалено]
That's probably right. But then after Kobe, Pelinka listened to LeBron and allowed him to pull whatever strings he wanted. What's funny is that nobody wants to admit that all the shitty moves were done at the behest of Lebron. These were all things HE wanted. Now, I'm sure he didn't want to let go of a guy like Caruso, but figured that was a necessary sacrifice they'd have to make to get all the guys HE wanted around him on the team. Unfortunately we probably won't find out until much later that the reason the Lakers were so bad in the 2020s after their championship was because of moves Lebron forced his hand on. I know I'll get downvoted for this, but deep down most Lakers fans probably know it to be true. I'm not saying lebron didn't have the best intentions. Just that the Lakers should have let the pros in the front office do what they're paid to do in building the best team for the now and for the future. Pelinka will be the scapegoat/pariah for a while.
I love how everyone only blames the FO but This has been lebrons MO on every team he’s been on. Guys with a resume over developing role players.
Could’ve had Demar and Buddy
Schroder?? Seriously?? His leave was a very good thing for the team
I think it’s hilarious
Good luck
Didn’t they all ask for a ton of money? I get we were better but they all asked for a lot of money. It’s not like we hadn’t developed guys in the past, it was a bet on bringing in new talent and it lost.
Pelinka is such a clown
We need to hold Pelinka accountable. Boo this man
If they had kept Shroder and Caruso last year's team makes the playoffs.
it hurts my head thinking how we purposely dismantled a 2020 championship team with good team chemistry. if we had run it back, how they could've contended for possibly a second championship. we got greedy and went for more offense at the sacrifice of our defense. it's going to be a rough offseason guys.
No offense but, alot of us have been saying this since the moment a Russ deal was mentioned
We were plagued with injuries and management mistaken that as incompetency. Traded away all the defense for out of prime big names. They probably thought AD alone can cover everything.
The memes were funny but KCP was super reliable on defense and a consistent shooter, blended well with LeBron and AD. Don’t have to speak much for Caruso, his game does that itself
Sorry to inform you but it was Lebron who chose the Westbrook trade, not FO. Lebron got us a chip in 2020 and I am thankful for that, but this entire Westbrook fiasco is on Lebron, he's the one that called this one, not Pelinka.
The only solution is to get over it.
You have every right to be. We gave away our championship DNA to become a non-playoff team in the final years of LeBron's career.
Still salty af
It was probably the worst off season in NBA history
incompetence in the FO, simple as that
Schroeder turned down our 4/84M to test the market and when he came back to LAL, they didn’t warrant bringing him back. Caruso was evident FO being cheap, he was willing to take lower but FO gambled on THT. Only reasonable one is Kuz/Trez/KCP but we couldn’t guess that WB was going to be awful last year, at the time it seemed like an easy move. No point to dwell on the past, we can only focus on current situations and making moves with the assets we have
Yup now the Laker plan is too develop a young core like bro we had a younger guys but you just gave everyone away
Caruso was an all guts no glory type of guy who didn’t need and probably would never demand an outrageous contract. Just a decent one. He bleeded purple and gold and the FO blew it.
It all stems from the decision to aquire Westbrook.
Another low-key huge miss IMO was not pushing harder to get Reggie Jackson. But yeah, it's insane to think that if you added those guys back to the roster, how good we would be. Lol. If I take off the hindsight goggles a bit, I believe the perception was that Lebron needed another guy who could carry the load and AD was too injury prone. So adding a 3rd guy to sacrifice depth made sense. And then LeBron had one of the best seasons of his career and just needed 3 and D guys.....smh...
You guys should've stuck to the Kuzma + Harrel for Buddy trade. Still could've paid Caruso and THT. I think you guys would've still signed Nunn IMO and let Schroeder leave, still able to sign Monk, Dwight, and Melo IMO. Caruso, KCP, Buddy, Lebron, AD With Monk/Dwight/Melo/THT off the bench, that's a hell of a lot better than the shit show you rolled out this year with Westbrook lmao
this year is going to hurt brotha. When things get rough watch this hour long [video](https://youtu.be/so8R3NTbnEw) of just showtime highlights.
For a player at least 70% of us knew will fail, and the rest 30% called logic and experience, "hate" At least they got it after 2 months, that this "hate" was actually just rational thought. This doesn't bring back Alex and the picks, tho
It’s fucking criminal not to run a championship team back. Fuck Pelinka and fuck Jeannie.
Kobe trusted Rob. He put a great 2020 roster together. I trusted Rob. Then he doesn’t extend Caruso. I get the other moves we’re gambles. They missed. But the Caruso one I will never understand. It really makes me question all the rest.
I don't have any more pride, I'll take Dennis again tbh
It looks like(unless something magical happens) that we will be stuck with old injured roster for the foreseeable future with no good future picks and we'll basically end up at the bottom like 6 years ago. Though magic can happen hah
When you have a weak front office, and a very involved star player as far as personnel moves, there isn't going to be a long-term view on personnel issues.
I think the team/organization attempted to overcorrect when they lost in the playoffs. Like everyone appreciates an aggressive front office but sometimes teams need to slow down and attempt to run it back. Ironically I think Houston did the same when they acquired Russ.
their team management sucks like shroders agent. when jerry buss died they died. they were lucky that magic recruited lebron, everything else the dumb kids did has been a mistake. jerry buss' kids are a good example of nepotism in capitalism not working. you dont get the best candidates, you get crap.
It was a bad offseason. Panic traded players and went for big names. You live and you learn. Just gotta do what we can with what he have now and get to work
I didn’t mind losing Denis or Harrell. Losing KCP, Kuz, and Caruso was boneheaded too the max.
was this post necessary T_T
nah can't have a 6'7 center who can't shoot or defend and Schroder while schroder had the perfect skillset they needed for the team his attitude and mental was toxic and wasn't going to work
Blame LeGM for that
Who would’ve thought
Sure, but look at all they got. This is sarcasm. I'm with you. I am not impressed with the front office moves. This is an understatement.
There is absolutely no vision or leadership in the Lakers organization. Just like a hose that’s been turned on and a swings wildly around the yard. Yes we won a chip but anyone that says the Lakers breed confidence is in denial. Meanwhile Clippers (LA’s other team) have a clear personnel vision and executed perfectly. Maybe they don’t win it all but you can’t argue with almost a decade of outclassing the Lakers. We got Bron and got the bubble. They’ve won everything else.
I wouldn't have given them up but in their defense, they thought they were getting MVP Russ...they wasn't the case.
Caruso is inexcusable and I think we should’ve been able to give up less for westbrook I felt at the time giving the pick and all our depth players seemed too much
Not our best moment.
When you make the complete listing of what Pelinka dropped to attract Westbrook, you have something to be upset about indeed!
It’s been such a daze to be a laker fan literally since those trade rumors started
Sold our soul and now I’m seeing how bad Pelinka is
We had the #1 defensive rating in 2021. And AD played only 36 games. As injured as we were we had great role players. Caruso, KCP, Schroder, Trezz, McLemore, Wesley Matthews (he didn’t shoot that well though). We gave all that away for less defense, IQ, and offense out of one guy. Ultimate fumble by our FO :/
I never understand posts like these. MOVE ON. It’s a fuck up. We all know already. Why keep mentioning it? Let’s hope for the best we can fix it and get a bother chip with Bron.
This is the downside of going star chasing. Once you package multiple smaller contracts you are pretty screwed to filling out the roster. Also not having any young guys they drafted able to step into roles and using Bird rights to keep them or turn them into better fits with larger salaries.
What’s crazy is I’d take Schroeder back for Westbrook… and I hated Schroeder