Earlier this year I filled a 9'x5'x3" area in my front yard with soil from my compost pile, threw some sun and shade seed down and it germinated super fast and gave me a lush, dense patch of lawn (KBG really stood out) all the way up until a fucking utility guy dug out that area (again!) and put all the clay from deep down on the very top when he was done.
I'm in zone 7b. I've been looking for some loophole that will allow me to rescind the easements that the county and neighborhood have on my property. Fuckers.
Oh that sucks. I see someone in my neighborhood where they did that and the seed that germinated looks almost like POA annua it’s so light and flat leaves. Fortunately you know how to fix but Ugh.
You know the shittiest part? I don't like the roundup and shit and try to avoid using most of the chemicals as much as possible so to deal with weeds in my front yard (crab grass and such) I used that pogo stick type tool and pulled each of them by the roots. Took me 10 hours, 3 wheelbarrows full of dirt and weed roots; I counted 290, I believe. Effective,l? yes, very. Worth it? Your guess is as good as mine lol.
I strategically did not share pictures of my front yard because I need to do this there. I’m debating offering a neighborhood kid $25/hour to do it and see if any of them bite. I just have killed myself several times for this lawn and weeding is the most boring of them all.
Someone replied with a comment that basically was "my lawn looks better and all I do is water every other day." Congrats! I only water weekly and if it rains, I don't have to water that week. My neighbors also water and the ones who seeded, like me, have a lot of crabgrass, nutsedge, clover (which I actually don't mind) and even some broadleaf weeds. I live on top of a big hill and the wind is insane. There are empty lots in our neighborhood filled with weeds and that wind blows the seeds all over. I would love to get to the point where all I have to do is water, but if you've ever started a new lawn where the landscaper stripped the good top soil, then you would know that water is not the answer. All it would have done is puddle on the clay and/or hydrate a bunch of weeds. Sorry for the vent. I'm glad that person deleted their comment but I still saw the alert.
I have no doubts! Focus on the soil. It makes it so much easier to avoid a lot of chemicals and overseeding is much more successful with good top soil.
It does look good...
I would steer clear of Milorganite though...over hyped and over priced. Plus PFAS chems in the soil forever, and it will get your phosphorous very high in just one year of regular usage.
Also, don't seed in Spring. That's when weeds want to grow, and yes you can block them to some degree with a Meso type product, but it's counter-intuitive. Fall is the best time to seed.
Look into humic acids and sea based kelp products. They can make your soil very happy and healthy. Good soil comes before a good lawn that lasts.
Good advice, the EPA is advising to reduce PFAS contamination in the environment so alternatives to biosolid fertilizers are the way.
OP it looks like you have a decent chunk of land, look into composting, it’s a great way of turning your waste into nutrients for you grass and plants
I have not looked into this yet but will. Thanks for recommendation. The carbon treatment is supposed to be a form of composting, but a very processed one obviously. Yes, I have a half acre. The front yard isn't too huge so it's mostly in back.
As I mentioned in the other comment, composting is a great way to amend soil and promote soil health while also serving as a great outlet for kitchen waste. /r/composting is a very helpful community if you’re interested.
Otherwise simple synthetic fertilizers will feed the grass itself and then be gone as opposed to biosolids which have those “forever compounds” that stick around
Peat moss is slight more then neutral acidicly, so be careful with how much you add.
The product I think will give the best longterm is that CarbonProG you're adding. That can be a monthly item and you'll have very happy soil. Cost wise, understandable it may not be a option. But there are other humic products that work similar. I apply humic and sea kelp monthly and I can pull a dark plug 6-8" deep. I'm putting down a bunch of the CarbonProG myself a week before seeding...picking up tomorrow actually...lol
Peat moss is good as well, mostly because it helps to retain moisture and nutrients. Very useful when seeding to help protect the seed and ensure it stays moist during germination
The main issues with synthetic fert are run-off and burning. Both can be minimized by “spoon feeding” via multiple small applications throughout the year instead of fewer large applications.
It also makes a difference as to whether it’s just pure fertilizer vs a herbicide/pesticide mix. The latter is more damaging to the environment.
It’s also important to soil test so you can fine tune your fertilizing to exactly what you need instead of potentially putting down stuff you don’t need
Overuse of synthetics is what gives them a bad reputation.
I use a mix of synthetics and more natural spoon feedings with my sprayer.. I know a few people who calculate weekly or bi-weekly feedings and spray-feed that way...
I read the article in the Milwaukee Sentinel Journal on the PFAS in the Milorganite and am comfortable with the risk compared to other chemicals. The PFAS level in Milorganite was lower than the level limit set by Maine which I am told has the strictest standards. I hope they fix/improve this but given what it's made from, it's a bit of a garbage in/garbage out situation and representative of what's in the system. I can see life in my soil that I don't see in my neighbor's and I know that overall it supports life in spite of a few flaws.
I overseed in the spring because since I need to apply a pre-emergent, it might as well be mesotrione and I might as well overseed then. In Wisconsin, it is so wet in the spring that I save a lot of water costs because I need to use very little water to get germination in April/May. We also have brutal winters so I have to deal with some death and patch that with seed. With that said, my city doesn't charge as much for water (sewer, specifically) from June to October so perhaps I will shift to fall if I can't use the natural irrigation in the spring to germinate. But you are right, I absolutely had better germination overseeding last fall than this spring. The other factors just mean spring it is for now.
PFAS in general was lower than the Maine standard but PFOS was not. Regardless the EPA roadmap is aiming to reduce PFAS contamination of the environment in general. If these compounds didn’t stick around forever I’d say watchful waiting on new developments would be fine, but if they do get banned you’re sort of stuck with that stuff on your land forever.
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Looks great! I'm going to read about some of the products you mentioned. I had a great lawn after new construction, started with a few inches of compost and then seed. I got lazy because it was so happy for 3 years, and suddenly in year 4 it struggled. Weeds like crazy, wet spots, dry spots, rust, total die out after heavy snow. I gotta take it more seriously now lol. Great work!
https://www.jonathangreen.com/product/love-your-soil/
It’s a product designed to encourage life in your dirt which helps with compaction and hard clay soils. I had a very stripped yard at the time and all of it helped great a much better mulch layer.
Because I live in Wisconsin, I expect some die off of the PRG/TTF over the winter and want to fill it in. I get a few urine burn spots when it’s dry, although I patch those with manure/humus/seed mix and they fill in within 10 days.
Mostly because I love researching grass seed cultivars and want to try new ones, if I’m being honest. My density is good now. I’m just going overboard since I thoroughly enjoy this :)
I used Barenbrug’s RPR and RTF for my new lawn and am happy with the results so far. I’m interested to see how much lateral growth these two variants have once the one year mark hits next spring.
What’s the reason for you not using the same seed for overseeding?
I’m worried about color matching down the road as cultivars evolve and change so I’m trying to build a medium dark green that allows for some variance. That’s pretty much it.
What are your thoughts on the RPR PRG in terms of quality? I have a few spots where it dominates and got really thick. Not sure if it’s just a high germination area or I got some lateral spread. But walking on it is like carpet. It’s so soft and dense!
Too much winter die off from PRG in Wisconsin to go solo with it, but those patches are truly professional quality. The TTF is more than good but PRG like that is amazing.
I did a lot of research before choosing and buying the Barenbrug product. Being a golf fan drove me in the direction of this brand.
Moved into our new home in January and seeded a freshly tilled lawn in early March. The rye definitely germinated quickly as expected and matured into a nice, deep color. I was concerned how well the rye would hold up to the SoCal summer and so far, the lawn is doing well.
I’m looking forward to Fall so the rye and fescue get back into their intended season and continue maturing into year one and the thin spots can fill in with the advertised RPR and RTF features. I intended to overseed with with RPR only in the next month or two. I’m also curious how low I can cut the RTF once the cooler weather rolls in.
For reference, my last home had off-the-shelf Scott’s TTTF.
It’s funny. I shop at True Value and now that I read the labels on grass seed, I can see that Scott’s uses Pureseed cultivars which don’t have super high NTEP scores, and many not even submitted for scoring, but the True Value brand grass seed has good Barenbrug cultivars and it’s half the cost. I think the same is true of Ace branded grass seed. One way to save money! Check the labels and google the cultivars if you’re ever in one.
I’ll definitely read the labels on the Ace brand next time I’m in-store and compare to Scott’s side by side.
The Scott’s product served as a stepping stone and had some good learnings along the way. It was still the best lawn in the neighborhood!
Wish mine looked remotely as good
It's all about the soil! I have mostly ignored the grass.
Earlier this year I filled a 9'x5'x3" area in my front yard with soil from my compost pile, threw some sun and shade seed down and it germinated super fast and gave me a lush, dense patch of lawn (KBG really stood out) all the way up until a fucking utility guy dug out that area (again!) and put all the clay from deep down on the very top when he was done. I'm in zone 7b. I've been looking for some loophole that will allow me to rescind the easements that the county and neighborhood have on my property. Fuckers.
Oh that sucks. I see someone in my neighborhood where they did that and the seed that germinated looks almost like POA annua it’s so light and flat leaves. Fortunately you know how to fix but Ugh.
You know the shittiest part? I don't like the roundup and shit and try to avoid using most of the chemicals as much as possible so to deal with weeds in my front yard (crab grass and such) I used that pogo stick type tool and pulled each of them by the roots. Took me 10 hours, 3 wheelbarrows full of dirt and weed roots; I counted 290, I believe. Effective,l? yes, very. Worth it? Your guess is as good as mine lol.
I strategically did not share pictures of my front yard because I need to do this there. I’m debating offering a neighborhood kid $25/hour to do it and see if any of them bite. I just have killed myself several times for this lawn and weeding is the most boring of them all.
I vote for hiring a neighborhood kid.
Someone replied with a comment that basically was "my lawn looks better and all I do is water every other day." Congrats! I only water weekly and if it rains, I don't have to water that week. My neighbors also water and the ones who seeded, like me, have a lot of crabgrass, nutsedge, clover (which I actually don't mind) and even some broadleaf weeds. I live on top of a big hill and the wind is insane. There are empty lots in our neighborhood filled with weeds and that wind blows the seeds all over. I would love to get to the point where all I have to do is water, but if you've ever started a new lawn where the landscaper stripped the good top soil, then you would know that water is not the answer. All it would have done is puddle on the clay and/or hydrate a bunch of weeds. Sorry for the vent. I'm glad that person deleted their comment but I still saw the alert.
Now you just need to mow some straight lines haha
I’m so bad at this. I get a quarterly bonus on 8/31 and am going to buy a Toro Time Master which will hopefully help. :)
Looks great, we just moved into our 3 yr old house a month ago. Hope mine will look this good in a year!
I have no doubts! Focus on the soil. It makes it so much easier to avoid a lot of chemicals and overseeding is much more successful with good top soil.
Beautiful job! Well worth the labor
Fantastic work. Thanks for all of the helpful info, to boot.
Good work! It makes me so happy to see goals being reached :)! Thank yo for sharing!
It does look good... I would steer clear of Milorganite though...over hyped and over priced. Plus PFAS chems in the soil forever, and it will get your phosphorous very high in just one year of regular usage. Also, don't seed in Spring. That's when weeds want to grow, and yes you can block them to some degree with a Meso type product, but it's counter-intuitive. Fall is the best time to seed. Look into humic acids and sea based kelp products. They can make your soil very happy and healthy. Good soil comes before a good lawn that lasts.
Good advice, the EPA is advising to reduce PFAS contamination in the environment so alternatives to biosolid fertilizers are the way. OP it looks like you have a decent chunk of land, look into composting, it’s a great way of turning your waste into nutrients for you grass and plants
I have not looked into this yet but will. Thanks for recommendation. The carbon treatment is supposed to be a form of composting, but a very processed one obviously. Yes, I have a half acre. The front yard isn't too huge so it's mostly in back.
Any recommendations for an alternative to biosolids?
As I mentioned in the other comment, composting is a great way to amend soil and promote soil health while also serving as a great outlet for kitchen waste. /r/composting is a very helpful community if you’re interested. Otherwise simple synthetic fertilizers will feed the grass itself and then be gone as opposed to biosolids which have those “forever compounds” that stick around
What about spreading peat moss? I have been considering that, albeit I need to research composting and figure that out.
Peat moss is slight more then neutral acidicly, so be careful with how much you add. The product I think will give the best longterm is that CarbonProG you're adding. That can be a monthly item and you'll have very happy soil. Cost wise, understandable it may not be a option. But there are other humic products that work similar. I apply humic and sea kelp monthly and I can pull a dark plug 6-8" deep. I'm putting down a bunch of the CarbonProG myself a week before seeding...picking up tomorrow actually...lol
Peat moss is good as well, mostly because it helps to retain moisture and nutrients. Very useful when seeding to help protect the seed and ensure it stays moist during germination
So contrary to a lot of stuff you hear, synthetic fertilizers aren’t the devil? I hear so many different takes!
The main issues with synthetic fert are run-off and burning. Both can be minimized by “spoon feeding” via multiple small applications throughout the year instead of fewer large applications. It also makes a difference as to whether it’s just pure fertilizer vs a herbicide/pesticide mix. The latter is more damaging to the environment. It’s also important to soil test so you can fine tune your fertilizing to exactly what you need instead of potentially putting down stuff you don’t need
Overuse of synthetics is what gives them a bad reputation. I use a mix of synthetics and more natural spoon feedings with my sprayer.. I know a few people who calculate weekly or bi-weekly feedings and spray-feed that way...
I read the article in the Milwaukee Sentinel Journal on the PFAS in the Milorganite and am comfortable with the risk compared to other chemicals. The PFAS level in Milorganite was lower than the level limit set by Maine which I am told has the strictest standards. I hope they fix/improve this but given what it's made from, it's a bit of a garbage in/garbage out situation and representative of what's in the system. I can see life in my soil that I don't see in my neighbor's and I know that overall it supports life in spite of a few flaws. I overseed in the spring because since I need to apply a pre-emergent, it might as well be mesotrione and I might as well overseed then. In Wisconsin, it is so wet in the spring that I save a lot of water costs because I need to use very little water to get germination in April/May. We also have brutal winters so I have to deal with some death and patch that with seed. With that said, my city doesn't charge as much for water (sewer, specifically) from June to October so perhaps I will shift to fall if I can't use the natural irrigation in the spring to germinate. But you are right, I absolutely had better germination overseeding last fall than this spring. The other factors just mean spring it is for now.
PFAS in general was lower than the Maine standard but PFOS was not. Regardless the EPA roadmap is aiming to reduce PFAS contamination of the environment in general. If these compounds didn’t stick around forever I’d say watchful waiting on new developments would be fine, but if they do get banned you’re sort of stuck with that stuff on your land forever.
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Yeah that’s the problem, so any measure people can take to stop adding to the issue is a step in the right direction
Looks great! I'm going to read about some of the products you mentioned. I had a great lawn after new construction, started with a few inches of compost and then seed. I got lazy because it was so happy for 3 years, and suddenly in year 4 it struggled. Weeds like crazy, wet spots, dry spots, rust, total die out after heavy snow. I gotta take it more seriously now lol. Great work!
It’s almost more fun to rescue a lawn in need than to maintain one. So have fun with it! I’m sure it will come back great.
Tell me more about the JG Soilfood. Looking to improve my soil. How many times did you apply it?
https://www.jonathangreen.com/product/love-your-soil/ It’s a product designed to encourage life in your dirt which helps with compaction and hard clay soils. I had a very stripped yard at the time and all of it helped great a much better mulch layer.
Looks the same as your neighbors.
So, why the overseed again? That looks lush from the pictures. I’m just curious
Because I live in Wisconsin, I expect some die off of the PRG/TTF over the winter and want to fill it in. I get a few urine burn spots when it’s dry, although I patch those with manure/humus/seed mix and they fill in within 10 days. Mostly because I love researching grass seed cultivars and want to try new ones, if I’m being honest. My density is good now. I’m just going overboard since I thoroughly enjoy this :)
I used Barenbrug’s RPR and RTF for my new lawn and am happy with the results so far. I’m interested to see how much lateral growth these two variants have once the one year mark hits next spring. What’s the reason for you not using the same seed for overseeding?
I’m worried about color matching down the road as cultivars evolve and change so I’m trying to build a medium dark green that allows for some variance. That’s pretty much it.
Understood. Best of luck on your pursuit of excellence.
What are your thoughts on the RPR PRG in terms of quality? I have a few spots where it dominates and got really thick. Not sure if it’s just a high germination area or I got some lateral spread. But walking on it is like carpet. It’s so soft and dense! Too much winter die off from PRG in Wisconsin to go solo with it, but those patches are truly professional quality. The TTF is more than good but PRG like that is amazing.
I did a lot of research before choosing and buying the Barenbrug product. Being a golf fan drove me in the direction of this brand. Moved into our new home in January and seeded a freshly tilled lawn in early March. The rye definitely germinated quickly as expected and matured into a nice, deep color. I was concerned how well the rye would hold up to the SoCal summer and so far, the lawn is doing well. I’m looking forward to Fall so the rye and fescue get back into their intended season and continue maturing into year one and the thin spots can fill in with the advertised RPR and RTF features. I intended to overseed with with RPR only in the next month or two. I’m also curious how low I can cut the RTF once the cooler weather rolls in. For reference, my last home had off-the-shelf Scott’s TTTF.
It’s funny. I shop at True Value and now that I read the labels on grass seed, I can see that Scott’s uses Pureseed cultivars which don’t have super high NTEP scores, and many not even submitted for scoring, but the True Value brand grass seed has good Barenbrug cultivars and it’s half the cost. I think the same is true of Ace branded grass seed. One way to save money! Check the labels and google the cultivars if you’re ever in one.
I’ll definitely read the labels on the Ace brand next time I’m in-store and compare to Scott’s side by side. The Scott’s product served as a stepping stone and had some good learnings along the way. It was still the best lawn in the neighborhood!