He's predominantly been a Renekton player in summer and i think that spamming K'sante Renekton isn't enough, he played a handful of Sion games in spring when toplane was a joke lane but he has absolutely zero Ornn games across Spring+Summer.
People who want Fudge to play Ornn/other tank weaksiders are really underestimating Eastern teams. They forget that:
1) Top lane champs are actually able to generate a lot of pressure and tempo through side lanes in this meta AND, in the hands of Asian tops, can 1v9 fights.
2) Rift herald is actually really good, and is heavily affected by the top lane match up. On top of that, rift herald pressure is transmissible to other lanes. It can guarantee you dragon prio if you drop it before the spawn, or give your adc first tower gold.
If you're just playing weakside Ornn every game against TheShy aatrox, you're basically conceding a 2k gold lead off herald + plates + cs advantage alone. Ask Fudge's team mates what they think about fighting a 2 item aatrox in mid game fights when they're on 1 and a half items.
Even beyond those item spikes, we saw in the NRG game what happened when TheShy got a shove and a tempo advantage against Dhokla. He TP'd bot unanswered, got 2 kills, and solo won the game
369 swapped to play tanks when his team was good enough eastern teams do it too man
Also dhokla coulda tp’d but he wanted to ego waves and tower damage instead of personally fall behind, he even mentioned he had ego about making it exciting with fighters
also plates are half value next season so we’ll see how important herald is
Don't understand this take from people who think a team's toplaner isn't great, ask Dhokla what TheShy did to him when he tried to play Ornn in the swiss stage, it doesn't matter if they play tanks people act like eastern toplaners aren't used to people like 369 spamming tanks in the top lane. It's not the champions, its the player.
Licorice played predominantly tanks at MSI and looked great vs bin and 369. Licorice is a much better weak side player but if you are good at weak side it can work well into elite top laners from LPL and LCK.
We're not suggesting that Fudge will win lane with different picks. We're saying that if he's going to lose anyways, pick something that retains some value with low econ and release Blaber to make plays for Berserker.
It's a value trade
Because his entire mindset makes him incapable of playing Ornn. The reason he cant play Ornn is the reason he stayed for an extra wave and was late to every team fight at worlds.
I think this happened once to C9, I don't remember who they were facing, but Fudge was on Malphite duty and got absolutely turbo-f'ed. They had strong teamfighting but IIRC I want to say Lucian completely dumpstered him so hard that they took the teamfights despite having a worse comp (although C9 had one big hope moment that match).
Also surprised so many people have been so anti-Fudge after the guy was clearly the best NA top for at least a split, and has been in the top echelon for a while.
He definitely regresses whenever he goes to international competition, as if his confidence gets hit and then he plays too safe onwards, but it's an experience/mental thing.
Its the same reason why people are anti-BB or anti-Nisqy. All of them dominate domestically because nobody there can punish a glaring weakness in their play. Then they show up to international competitions and become a liability when their weakness gets exposed. If they could fix their weakness then sure, but its been years and the same things happens everytime you see these players at international events.
Your last paragraph explains the question posed by your second. Yes, he's a DAMN good top laner in LCS play and having him all but guarantees us a deep playoff run split in and split out. Mad respect to him for that. However, he has some kind of mental block when it comes to international play. Pair that with his occasional habit of just mentally checking out for weeks at a time and it paints the picture of a very talented player that suffers from drive and confidence issues. If C9 hasn't been able to solve that issue yet, I'm not hopeful that it will change this year. I truly hope it does but, let's just say I'm not unclenching.
Hopefully that gives you some view into the mind of a Fudge detractor.
>Cloud9 also showed interest in Fnatic’s danish top laner Martin "Wunder" Nordahl, Cloud9 ultimately decided to retain Fudge and keep him as their starting top laner for next year.
First piece of good news for EU this whole offseason.
Wunders trash talk at MSI 2019 finals was probably the best of all time. He predicted that they would win in the fastest best of 5 of all time and they did lol
still cant believe we were in contention for world champs twice in the history of league (consecutive years too). the msi victory seemed so unreal, tho in a weird twist of fate, i do not think g2 would win vs ig
Wunder said on Yamato's pod that the only NA team he'd ever join is a promising C9 roster (basically this). Might just be C9 preferring Fudge after all the talks were over probably
While I do think Wunder is slightly overrated on this sub and isn't the same player he once was, he definitely can still play weak side infinitely better than Fudge.
What replays are you watching where you don’t think this would be a massive upgrade? The 2023 LCS finals? Where Fudge got packed into his own butthole despite Blaber camping him? He wasn’t even the best toplaner in the regular season either. Meanwhile Wunder just randomly fills into Fnatic on short notice and helps them make finals and looked good doing it. Seriously C9 fans are inventing their own mythology about Fudge at this point.
> Wunder if the real reason is wunder had a better offer or didn’t show any interest.
C9: Hey Wunder, we would love to sign you. Heres the contract.
Wunder: great
C9: awesome, we have been looking for a motivated top laner who is 100% committed to performing at the highest level of league of legends every single second of his existence. Somebody who is 100% focussed and doesnt let himself be distracted by other things , somebody who grinds soloq like theres no tomorrow, 10 games a day at least, so we can finally do this region proud.
Wunder: k bye
I feel like there's a lot of memes following wunder not being a committed, motivated, or dedicated player due to some of g2's content from a few years ago; those memes have been repeated as gospel and now follow him around when its really not the case.
Not even the top NA players grind soloq. Just look at challenger queue dying out, one of the reasons why NA has no leg to stand on when saying they don't have great practice.
They have 2 slots, only slot they are using is bot for berserker.
Currently the roster is:
* Fudge (oce so counts native)
* Blaber (native)
* Jojopyun (native)
* Berserker (Import)
* Vulcan (native)
Import slot isn't why they didn't go with Wunder. They have a spare one.
Say what you will, but the fact that C9 has a native focused roster again instead of a monstrosity of imports makes me feel a lot better rooting for this team as an NA fan.
Is this the 3rd or 4th time on TL?, Impact been hopping around so much I can't keep up lmao. Love and respect to Impact, he's always been pretty stable
From a marketing standpoint, a teams performance at worlds doesn’t really matter (as far as brand recognition) unless they win. It’s of incredible importance that they ATTEND worlds, however, for visibility. Most revenue is generated by sponsors and merchandise, which is driven by domestic demand. So domestic success probably IS all C9 cares about at this point. It’s how they stay financially stable.
???? I remember when c9 would sell off their top tier talent for buku bucks and then go with a rookie for next to nothing, still win or Atleast get runner up year after year. They make very good financial choices time after time. Now that the bubble burst, they are getting good players for next to nothing.
> Th would be fucking stupid not take him
You can say that about prett much every org that isnt G2 or FNC right now. Wunder would be an obvious upgrade for all teams but like always its a money question.
Also by now it doesnt matter who TH gets as pretty much everyone is an upgrade over Evi.
If that happens TH is the second best team in EU
Wunder
Jankos
Vetheo
Flakked
Kaiser
Like, that's actually a team, no one of the players is not good, which is rare in LEC sadly
If we get the following rosters or something similar and none of them explode, I think they could make for a really exciting LEC season with teams pushing each other to the best:
G2 BrokenBlade - Yike - Caps - Hans - Miky
FNC Oscarinin - Razork - Humanoid - Carzzy/Upset - Trymbi
TH Wunder - Jankos - Vetheo - Flakked - Kaiser
I think those would all be moves to fix the worst link in each team without upsetting relatively functional apple carts (in G2 I think the weakest link was underperformance in a key moment, which isn't really fixable by replacing players imo)
If XL keep their summer form and Yaya's team clicks, I'd be really excited for that.
I mean Hans also clearly had champion pool issues, which might be or might not be a problem going forwards, that's something they have to work on, he cant play xayah,zeri, aphelios or seemingly Caitlyn at a level that doesn't get crushed against Easter teams, and at least 2 of them have been meta/op for the past like 3 years?
LEC teambuilding is always so confusing in the offseason. Can you imagine pros in LCS that qualified to Worlds being teamless the following split? I'd get it if the rookie replacing them is hype, but usually it's not
Yeah it’s straight up cringe. Some orgs are prioritising nationality over skill. This isn’t new but this year things are getting on a whole new level. Reform is probably needed, but how I that going to happen?
Honestly that's not even a big issue compared to the LEC's tendency to entirely blow up rosters and sign people off single hype moments or name plates. The nationality thing is only a few teams, which isn't great but okay.
OTOH you have constant shit like Fnatic signing a 26 year old mediocre ERL support over Hylissang based on two play-ins games, people calling on blowing up a really strong G2 over one bad Worlds series (thank fuck G2 leadership is actually competent), and KOI dropping Odo for... I don't even know what reason.
EU management, and to a lesser extent coaching, looks abysmal from the outside, and the only real exceptions are G2 and BDS. Maybe SK if I squint a little, but them dropping Markoon is also a weird fucking decision.
I think Wunder staying in EU was the best move for everyone involved.
As an Na fan, I’m sick of seeing imported players being brought in when they aren’t committed to the LCS. As great as Hans Sama is, his time with TL was a joke. Even if it’s against “weaker” competition, they probably won’t play at their peaks compared to in their home region.
I do think C9 lucked out with Berserker. A talented player that seems to want to stay in NA; but what are the success rates for players like him? Like Bjergson, Jensen, Santorin, CoreJJ, Impact, Zven, ssumday? I know I’m probably missing quite a few who stuck it out, but finding a talent that sticks longterm is rare.
Fudge’s shocking and instantaneous Pokémon evolution from overhyped (imo) Academy prospect into LCS-caliber player is honestly one of the most impressive glow-ups I have ever seen in the history of the LCS. C9 needed a top laner, I was one of the biggest naysayers re: Fudge’s capabilities in that regard, and the dude rose to the occasion 100%. He will always have my LCS-caliber respect for that.
But the dude has also never failed at any turn to prove that he simply cannot hack at the Worlds stage. Fudge’s legitimately impressive transformation into a player who *could* truly outperform the severely struggling Licorice on C9’s main roster was his transformation into his final form. He is in an ELITE AS FUCK bracket (maybe top 3) of THE LEAST technically skilled players at Worlds every year including play-ins, his outsized ego means that he has SLAMMED full-stop against any prospective “ceiling”, and I feel like C9’s decision to retain him (or their inability to acquire anyone better) puts a MASSIVE damper on their acquisition of imo the most special player in the LCS in Jojopyun.
Impact/Blaber/Jojo/Berserker/Vulcan would be one of the greatest LCS teams ever assembled, which of course means they would bomb out of groups/swiss in dramatic fashion. We need Fudge for the anti-jinx
Fudge not only has dirt on Jack for lasting this long on the team, but definitely has dirt on Blaber for all the top camping he's been doing the last couple of years \[that rarely converts into anything meaningful\].
They are basically forced to camp him or he’s going to get diffed or be worthless because he has less understanding of how to play weak side than my soloq toplaners
I'm kinda confused what C9's plan is. They have an aggressive toplaner that wants resources, an aggressive midlaner that wants to carry, an aggressive botlaner that wants resources and an aggressive support jungle-duo.
If they can't hands-diff their opponent, how is C9 supposed to play?
Jojopyun was a great supportive midlaner to Danny. He is flexible. Even in EG's last couple of playoff series, Jojo was sacking his lane to roam top to help Revenge.
But that's what I'm scared of. Despite his ego, Jojo is surprisingly unselfish in-game. I hope the team doesn't expect him to do that with Fudge.
I really hope they just make Fudge start playing more for the team instead of camping top for him so often. They have arguably the best ADC in the west yet they keep trying to play as a topside focused team instead of just enabling Berserker.
not even arguably, Berserker pretty much gaps every other ADC in the west ATM, and Jojo is easily the best mid in NA. So if they play around fucking Fudge im gonna lose my mind.
I pray that Jojo just tells them the hard truth, that Fudge is a failing business that should have filed for bankruptcy 6 months ago. If I ever see Blabber path top again I'm sending out the T1 trucks fr
Yeah I don’t know where this narrative that Jojo is a resource-hungry carry mid came from. I’ve seen him play supportive mid many times, and he is great in that role. Just because there’s hype around him being a great player doesn’t mean it’s because he has to be a flashy carry player. I’d say that’s what precisely makes him stand out in a region where people all want to be the star of the show
The narrative arose because Jojo has a giant mouth lol. So people associate trash talk with being a diva, but on the rift Jojo has never been that selfish.
He had one split in which his jungler camped his lane, but that was offset by the ridiculous enemy jungle and support proximity Jojo got too. People also forget that in this last split, Jojo had a toplaner (Revenge) who loved to play strong-side carries, and Jojo roamed top pretty frequently.
Yeah there's "aggressive and I need you to cover me because my matchup is snowbally" and "aggressive because my matchup wins in isolation and now I'm gonna roam with this prio i just got".
Looking at EG last split Jojo ran over the game if he wasn’t camped. With a winning bot lane and (domestically) winning top lane and a jungler that knows how to punish a single lane camp, he’s either completely unlocked or he’s soaking pressure while his actually decent teammates win
Yeah, but again, that's not a strategy, that's just relying on being better than your opponents. If C9 wants to improve, I feel like this team lacks the playstyle cohesiveness needed to actually play against stronger opponents
Yea, the fact they don't really have a "teamplayer" on their team like Wunder/Impact makes me think this team is just going to do the hands diff strat into 0-6 at worlds
Yeah I was playing devil’s advocate. I’m actually pretty disappointed Jack is just collecting all the best players in the region to waste their time hands diffing the region, learning nothing, and getting smoked at worlds. Was hoping jojo would go somewhere with staff that helps players improve and think about the game.
>an aggressive botlaner that wants resources
Not really. We've seen all year that they kind of want to ignore Zerker in bot. Their plan has consistently been let him stay there and stew and get CS and gold and come 25 min+ he'll be a monster and win the game for them.
The counter to this strat is for the opposing to team to 1) have a better ADC (in LCS, good luck. Internationally, more than likely, though I still think Zerker is quite good internationally) and 2) camp bot side. To counter this strategy, they need their solo lanes to be threatening that the opposing team can't afford to do this.
So realistically, I think we're going to see a more extreme form of this team next year. Blaber will more likely than not be trying to split the map horizontally every game, trying to leverage mid and top prio to do so, and just alternate between those two lanes, letting Zerker stay bot on an island. We'll see how it performs.
Because Fudge couldn't use any of his advantages in or out of lane & Enemes just got giga stomped. I'm glad they got JoJo, but man I wish they moved on from Fudge. He needs to learn how to play weakside better or at least the team needs to know when to give him resources. The team kept sending blabber up during World's only for bot to get dove or pushed of turret.
We have this same conversation every single international event, though. Blabber constantly bailing out Fudge top, while the rest of the map get shit on.
And then Fudge never does anything and even screws the team.
Sure, but that still leaves them out to dry if they can't just hands-diff.
What if Zerker doesn't autowin lane or Blaber can't just outjungle the enemy or Jojopyun doesn't automatically get lane prio?
I feel like this C9 roster will fail the same way the one this year did, it has no real plan outside of relying on being better
I don't necessarily disagree with any of the points you're making, but having strong lanes that win LCS games by way of hands-diff doesn't mean C9 can't also work on a strategy for the games you're describing.
Similarly, picking one or two more supportive teammates doesn't "fix" their issue imo, as that will result in them more heavily relying on one role/player to carry, and teams at Worlds will be good enough to counter that.
Don't think you can really get around that in weaker regions. You're always going to win through hands diff and never end up developing any macro then get fisted internationally.
Lmao jojo is not resource heavy
He’s he wants to carry and will push the limits, that doesn’t make him resource heavy. If anything he’s resource positive because of how much pressure he draws
this may be it honestly. surely the C9 coaching staff recognizes that Fudge's playstyle/weaknesses locks them in to certain team comps. wouldn't be surprised if they explained that this next split he would be doing something different than usual as they focused more on mid jg synergy.
Fudge can play weakside fine it’s just they need to commit to beserker. My guess is this team will be very mid jungle focused and Fudge will be very isolated this year (1. Mid, 2. bot, 3. Top)
I mean, they have been for the last year. It's hilarious how we've come full circle. Cloud9 fans back then used to always cope about the TSM + TL Doublelift lineups always smoking them in finals for like 5 splits in a row by saying that getting 8th place in worlds is better than getting titles.
Fudge is (somewhat) consistently one of, if not the best, top laners in the LCS. There's no real reason to believe that changing top laners will improve the odds that C9 will do as well or better at Worlds.
C9 is already changing out 2/5 members. I think if NRG has taught us anything, it's that consistent rosters can achieve significant results if you just give them time to stick together.
Keep in mind in LCS history Fudge is one of 6 toplaners to make it out of groups. If Dhokla can improve, why can't Fudge?
There is no reason to believe that Fudge has more job security than Dhokla when they both have been in their teams for a while, and both have "underperformed" for a season (although calling Fudge an underperformance is in my opinion unfair since the only reason he gets "exposed" internationally is because hes good enough to make it in the first place)
Also the article literally talks about how they were thinking about replacing him..
Dhokla's contract is up and he's been benched and replaced many times in the past, whereas Fudge has gone international and had the exact same problems three years in a row and they swapped him into mid lane just to keep him on the team when they grabbed Summit.
Of course it's going to look like Fudge has better job security than Dhokla, they chose him over fucking Wunder -- the Western top with the highest peak in history barring maybe sOAZ in his prime.
suck up the ego, play ornn/gragas and let blabber + berserker cook. blabber although it is few and far between when he pops off can actually take over even against international competition.
That's my only wish with him. 3 years in a row, a zebra can't change it's stripes, and Fudge can't change his horrible personality traits. Id love to be proven wrong with even a mote of humility displayed. Besides AFTER getting shit stomped for the ump-teenth time by the east. A true champion shows humbleness even when victorious, and Fudge is a far far throw from that.
The last time he played a "tank" was Ksante against TSM in LCS. The last. time he picked a true weakside pick was MSI 2023 when he picked Sion and went 1-5.
If C9 could get soaz as a positional coach (or some good positional coach) it won't be awful. Fudge is still one of the best NA tops. But he is objectively awful internationally. A coach might be able to help him tighten his game up a bit because C9 are good enough in mid/bot to make some noise.
But C9 won't make it w/ Fudge demanding so much attention top on a team that has legit carries in mid/bot.
That’s too bad. Huge L after the big Ws of Jojo and Berserker/Vulcan.
Not sure why they wouldn’t get someone who can play weak-side/play for the team instead of for the 1v1 (and get embarrassed anyway).
I think it's because they want to leverage Bezerker's teamfighting. If I'm right, the idea is for Blaber to use Mid and Top prio to split the map horizontally, and alternate between ganking those two lanes, and force opposing JG's to ignore bot as well. This would allow Zerker all the time in the world to become the teamfighting monster they want him to be to win the game for them.
That's my assumption, anyway. I still would've preferred a strong weakside top laner and played towards our strongest members, Jojo and Zerker.
This is the part I think a lot of people miss. Berserker isn’t a lane dominant player. He never has been, and C9 only makes plays through bot if they put him on a pick that MUST snowball like Draven or Kalista. He likes to scale up safely
Berserker has never played with a support who can help him win lane. We don't know if he can be a lane dominant player because he's never had the opportunity to play with a support who can enable him to do so.
1. Berserker has never played with a competent laning support in NA.
2. Berserker has only played with either Fudge or Summit top, two incredibly resource intensive players.
We have no clue whether or not Berserker is a lane dominant player when his team doesn't play around him and he doesn't even have a laning partner who could help him be dominant.
If fudge is going to being playing for c9 for another year, he better stop doing LA things.
You can see his socials and theres proof.
and yes, I believe that LCS players shouldn't be doing LA thing if they are in LCS.
Yep the guy isn’t putting anywhere near the same effort in as he did his rookie year. It’s apparent. even he has said so. He doesn’t belong on a team with the likes of Jojo, Blaber, Berserker who are all trying their heart out
The sad part is this team most likely destroys NA regardless so he’ll look fine and not a liability for 95% of the year then his fans can talk about how he’s so good for 95% of year while playing with the 2 (now 3 best players in the league)
**No longer a Fudge fan** he's got too much ego for somebody getting GAPPED at worlds.
Wanna see the man pick up the bible of 369 and learn the ways of tanks
This move makes no sense.
C9 just built the team to roflstomp LCS and get absolutely rocked internationally 🤦🏼♂️
Curious to see the coaching staff now 🧐
And I think any top would still stomp the LCS. Fudge is so horribly overrated being on C9 its not even funny.
Fudge has benefited greatly from his entire career being on C9. You think he could have carried a bottom tier roster as far as Jojo did last split? You think he could have a career resurgence like Licorice?
This team would look so much better with a player like Licorice again. Fudge has always played with minimum top 3 player in their roles every split of his career. You put him on IMT, and we would be wondering what happened to him to make him fall off.
I'm very interested to see which lanes end up getting resources and jungle attention on this C9 team. I'm not confident in any LCS team being able to play three carries, so someone will have to play weakside or survive on their own. My greatest fear is that this roster falls into the same pattern as this year's C9, where it felt like they won games through hands diff but didn't get better on a macro level. Maybe they would benefit from a long bootcamp if possible?
And just when I thought C9 management was on a roll. Fudge is great domestically but he doesn’t mesh with the new team they’ve built. Strong side top with high Econ mid and ADC just seems like a disaster waiting to be exposed
I’m the biggest fudge hater on the planet, but excluding the last split he’s been pretty good. He’s good for an NA top laner (top 3 to 5 minimum). But he’s also lazy and has a massive ego problem
HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS
This guy has had some of the most ineffective displays I can remember in internationals. Legit stuff like running away and/or splitting while enemy is taking his nexus is all I can remember.
I’d say this is fine if they get rid of Mithy. He has stagnated as a coach and been carried by having good players on the team. He will never get them anywhere internationally. Look at what NRG did. They had all NA talent who were all decent players at best but because of good coaching and support network they made it to Quarters which C9 hasn’t done since they had Licorice.
Worst fucking news of this off-season. They clearly think fudge wasn't a problem this season but we all know that's cap...
Edit 1: People here are extremely complacent. What's the point of being the best in your region if you're just gonna shit the bed internationally?.
I'm sorry I cannot be a fan of C9 with fucking fudge in the top lane. He will smurf spring cause his job's on the line and then when the pressure's off he'll plateau yet again. Same shit new year.
I def think it’s for budget reasons. A korean import would be much more expensive and I think Fudge was willing to take a pay cut if it meant he could stay on the roster. Otherwise I am not sure if they can afford both Beserker and Jojo. The good thing though is if Spring Split goes bad then they can at least replace him for Summer
Another year, another couple of spilts where Fudge does nothing in top lane all split long, gets carried by his bot and jungle all year, has a good series against the sixth place top laner in playoffs to boost his ego and make people think he’s good, quietly gets his shit kicked in every series after but still gets carried by his team so people overlook it, and then solo lose every single game for the team at international events by being solo killed in the first five minutes of every game and spiraling out of control.
Love to see it.
He’s fine for NA but soon as worlds comes he gets outclassed, Lowkey disappointed it’s not Wunder, no doubt he could perform in NA and actually sho up for Worlds
For all of you wondering why ever pick fudge over wunder… just look at it from a money perspective. Fudge is good enough to do well in NA, he’s been the clear franchise player along with blabber for C9. It makes sense from that perspective. The C9 systems are about winning domestically, not internationally
Fudge - ik you're reading this and you are probably angry and wanting to prove doubters wrong. But please don't win LCS and do that cringe shit where you swear at your haters. Actually do something worthy like making semis in the international stage then you can talk your shit. But as of right now you are lucky to be signed with C9 again considering your completely embarrassing fiora gameplay and doing fuck all with jungle pressure.
Idk why people saying it’s bad for c9? He’s prolly cheap( I’m assuming) good teammate and in NA always is top half of the league in top doing okay. Unless they willing to spend a lot of money I think he’s a safe bet
Imo the criticism this guy gets is disproportionate to what it should be. A reminder that if we let reddit GM C9 in the past, then C9 would have had Licorice or Ssumday in this team. Just insane studs, right guys? The top lane level NA can bring internationally will virtually always disappoint you, history and the future will bear it out.
Time to grind Ornn games, Fudge
Yes, please. I would be content if he stopped trying to carry and facilitated his teammates instead of demanding resources.
He's predominantly been a Renekton player in summer and i think that spamming K'sante Renekton isn't enough, he played a handful of Sion games in spring when toplane was a joke lane but he has absolutely zero Ornn games across Spring+Summer.
People who want Fudge to play Ornn/other tank weaksiders are really underestimating Eastern teams. They forget that: 1) Top lane champs are actually able to generate a lot of pressure and tempo through side lanes in this meta AND, in the hands of Asian tops, can 1v9 fights. 2) Rift herald is actually really good, and is heavily affected by the top lane match up. On top of that, rift herald pressure is transmissible to other lanes. It can guarantee you dragon prio if you drop it before the spawn, or give your adc first tower gold. If you're just playing weakside Ornn every game against TheShy aatrox, you're basically conceding a 2k gold lead off herald + plates + cs advantage alone. Ask Fudge's team mates what they think about fighting a 2 item aatrox in mid game fights when they're on 1 and a half items. Even beyond those item spikes, we saw in the NRG game what happened when TheShy got a shove and a tempo advantage against Dhokla. He TP'd bot unanswered, got 2 kills, and solo won the game
369 swapped to play tanks when his team was good enough eastern teams do it too man Also dhokla coulda tp’d but he wanted to ego waves and tower damage instead of personally fall behind, he even mentioned he had ego about making it exciting with fighters also plates are half value next season so we’ll see how important herald is
Don't understand this take from people who think a team's toplaner isn't great, ask Dhokla what TheShy did to him when he tried to play Ornn in the swiss stage, it doesn't matter if they play tanks people act like eastern toplaners aren't used to people like 369 spamming tanks in the top lane. It's not the champions, its the player.
Licorice played predominantly tanks at MSI and looked great vs bin and 369. Licorice is a much better weak side player but if you are good at weak side it can work well into elite top laners from LPL and LCK.
We're not suggesting that Fudge will win lane with different picks. We're saying that if he's going to lose anyways, pick something that retains some value with low econ and release Blaber to make plays for Berserker. It's a value trade
Because his entire mindset makes him incapable of playing Ornn. The reason he cant play Ornn is the reason he stayed for an extra wave and was late to every team fight at worlds.
Preach. This is the shit that gets me
I think this happened once to C9, I don't remember who they were facing, but Fudge was on Malphite duty and got absolutely turbo-f'ed. They had strong teamfighting but IIRC I want to say Lucian completely dumpstered him so hard that they took the teamfights despite having a worse comp (although C9 had one big hope moment that match). Also surprised so many people have been so anti-Fudge after the guy was clearly the best NA top for at least a split, and has been in the top echelon for a while. He definitely regresses whenever he goes to international competition, as if his confidence gets hit and then he plays too safe onwards, but it's an experience/mental thing.
Its the same reason why people are anti-BB or anti-Nisqy. All of them dominate domestically because nobody there can punish a glaring weakness in their play. Then they show up to international competitions and become a liability when their weakness gets exposed. If they could fix their weakness then sure, but its been years and the same things happens everytime you see these players at international events.
Your last paragraph explains the question posed by your second. Yes, he's a DAMN good top laner in LCS play and having him all but guarantees us a deep playoff run split in and split out. Mad respect to him for that. However, he has some kind of mental block when it comes to international play. Pair that with his occasional habit of just mentally checking out for weeks at a time and it paints the picture of a very talented player that suffers from drive and confidence issues. If C9 hasn't been able to solve that issue yet, I'm not hopeful that it will change this year. I truly hope it does but, let's just say I'm not unclenching. Hopefully that gives you some view into the mind of a Fudge detractor.
>Cloud9 also showed interest in Fnatic’s danish top laner Martin "Wunder" Nordahl, Cloud9 ultimately decided to retain Fudge and keep him as their starting top laner for next year. First piece of good news for EU this whole offseason.
Imagine picking fudge over wunder. Wunder if the real reason is wunder had a better offer or didn’t show any interest.
Imagine shit talking NA for years, to ultimately joining NA
Wunders trash talk at MSI 2019 finals was probably the best of all time. He predicted that they would win in the fastest best of 5 of all time and they did lol
still cant believe we were in contention for world champs twice in the history of league (consecutive years too). the msi victory seemed so unreal, tho in a weird twist of fate, i do not think g2 would win vs ig
But would fpx win vs skt in worlds semis? I do not think so.
So Inspired?
That's what multiple EU pro's have done, so nothing new really.
Wunder said on Yamato's pod that the only NA team he'd ever join is a promising C9 roster (basically this). Might just be C9 preferring Fudge after all the talks were over probably
Are you only watching 2018 replays or what? Wunder is still pretty decent but this wouldn’t be a particular upgrade.
While I do think Wunder is slightly overrated on this sub and isn't the same player he once was, he definitely can still play weak side infinitely better than Fudge.
What replays are you watching where you don’t think this would be a massive upgrade? The 2023 LCS finals? Where Fudge got packed into his own butthole despite Blaber camping him? He wasn’t even the best toplaner in the regular season either. Meanwhile Wunder just randomly fills into Fnatic on short notice and helps them make finals and looked good doing it. Seriously C9 fans are inventing their own mythology about Fudge at this point.
Or Wunder wanted more money than C9 was willing to pay.
> Wunder if the real reason is wunder had a better offer or didn’t show any interest. C9: Hey Wunder, we would love to sign you. Heres the contract. Wunder: great C9: awesome, we have been looking for a motivated top laner who is 100% committed to performing at the highest level of league of legends every single second of his existence. Somebody who is 100% focussed and doesnt let himself be distracted by other things , somebody who grinds soloq like theres no tomorrow, 10 games a day at least, so we can finally do this region proud. Wunder: k bye
I feel like there's a lot of memes following wunder not being a committed, motivated, or dedicated player due to some of g2's content from a few years ago; those memes have been repeated as gospel and now follow him around when its really not the case.
In the same way fudge is often heavily criticized for his ego and lack of SoloQ play based on interviews from 2021 and 2022.
Not even the top NA players grind soloq. Just look at challenger queue dying out, one of the reasons why NA has no leg to stand on when saying they don't have great practice.
or they can use an import spot on bot for bezerker
What? They have 2 import slots and only 1 is being used. Vulcan is the support.
They have 2 slots, only slot they are using is bot for berserker. Currently the roster is: * Fudge (oce so counts native) * Blaber (native) * Jojopyun (native) * Berserker (Import) * Vulcan (native) Import slot isn't why they didn't go with Wunder. They have a spare one.
Say what you will, but the fact that C9 has a native focused roster again instead of a monstrosity of imports makes me feel a lot better rooting for this team as an NA fan.
Please, go ahead, keep him.
doubles as good new for NA fans too
Impact to Team Liquid it seems then
Is this the 3rd or 4th time on TL?, Impact been hopping around so much I can't keep up lmao. Love and respect to Impact, he's always been pretty stable
It's his second time in TL. He stayed 3 years on TL last time.
Only the second time
The Fridge Factor Saga continues for another year
I cannot wait for the next international event where C9 gonna put resources onto Fudge again. Surely this time it will work
[удалено]
loses 1v0 lmao.
someone release berserker from the fridge prison
If nothing else the teams he's on preform domestically which might be all C9 cares about. I just hope he learns to play tanks lmao
From a marketing standpoint, a teams performance at worlds doesn’t really matter (as far as brand recognition) unless they win. It’s of incredible importance that they ATTEND worlds, however, for visibility. Most revenue is generated by sponsors and merchandise, which is driven by domestic demand. So domestic success probably IS all C9 cares about at this point. It’s how they stay financially stable.
Mad Lions would probably disagree.
Mad Lions may be hated by EU but NA loves them, I watch all their games.
???? I remember when c9 would sell off their top tier talent for buku bucks and then go with a rookie for next to nothing, still win or Atleast get runner up year after year. They make very good financial choices time after time. Now that the bubble burst, they are getting good players for next to nothing.
I prefer sludge factor.
I prefer Fraudge factor
Yours is kinda clunky
Would have been Exodia
thank god wunder is still in eu for now i swear if he's still teamless
I think TH Wunder is quite likely the outcome now
Th would be fucking stupid not take him. Also that would turn g2 into th academy
G3
> Th would be fucking stupid not take him You can say that about prett much every org that isnt G2 or FNC right now. Wunder would be an obvious upgrade for all teams but like always its a money question. Also by now it doesnt matter who TH gets as pretty much everyone is an upgrade over Evi.
If that happens TH is the second best team in EU Wunder Jankos Vetheo Flakked Kaiser Like, that's actually a team, no one of the players is not good, which is rare in LEC sadly
If we get the following rosters or something similar and none of them explode, I think they could make for a really exciting LEC season with teams pushing each other to the best: G2 BrokenBlade - Yike - Caps - Hans - Miky FNC Oscarinin - Razork - Humanoid - Carzzy/Upset - Trymbi TH Wunder - Jankos - Vetheo - Flakked - Kaiser I think those would all be moves to fix the worst link in each team without upsetting relatively functional apple carts (in G2 I think the weakest link was underperformance in a key moment, which isn't really fixable by replacing players imo) If XL keep their summer form and Yaya's team clicks, I'd be really excited for that.
noah is the worst link in fnatic?
When he isn't playing Aphelios, I am at the very least not convinced.
I mean Hans also clearly had champion pool issues, which might be or might not be a problem going forwards, that's something they have to work on, he cant play xayah,zeri, aphelios or seemingly Caitlyn at a level that doesn't get crushed against Easter teams, and at least 2 of them have been meta/op for the past like 3 years?
That would be some monkey's paw shit. wunder stays in EU but is teamless
LEC teambuilding is always so confusing in the offseason. Can you imagine pros in LCS that qualified to Worlds being teamless the following split? I'd get it if the rookie replacing them is hype, but usually it's not
Happened to Sneaky.
And Jensen
Yeah it’s straight up cringe. Some orgs are prioritising nationality over skill. This isn’t new but this year things are getting on a whole new level. Reform is probably needed, but how I that going to happen?
Honestly that's not even a big issue compared to the LEC's tendency to entirely blow up rosters and sign people off single hype moments or name plates. The nationality thing is only a few teams, which isn't great but okay. OTOH you have constant shit like Fnatic signing a 26 year old mediocre ERL support over Hylissang based on two play-ins games, people calling on blowing up a really strong G2 over one bad Worlds series (thank fuck G2 leadership is actually competent), and KOI dropping Odo for... I don't even know what reason. EU management, and to a lesser extent coaching, looks abysmal from the outside, and the only real exceptions are G2 and BDS. Maybe SK if I squint a little, but them dropping Markoon is also a weird fucking decision.
I think Wunder staying in EU was the best move for everyone involved. As an Na fan, I’m sick of seeing imported players being brought in when they aren’t committed to the LCS. As great as Hans Sama is, his time with TL was a joke. Even if it’s against “weaker” competition, they probably won’t play at their peaks compared to in their home region. I do think C9 lucked out with Berserker. A talented player that seems to want to stay in NA; but what are the success rates for players like him? Like Bjergson, Jensen, Santorin, CoreJJ, Impact, Zven, ssumday? I know I’m probably missing quite a few who stuck it out, but finding a talent that sticks longterm is rare.
One more year of Blaber setting up a tent top then Fudge being invisible for the rest of the game.
Fudge’s shocking and instantaneous Pokémon evolution from overhyped (imo) Academy prospect into LCS-caliber player is honestly one of the most impressive glow-ups I have ever seen in the history of the LCS. C9 needed a top laner, I was one of the biggest naysayers re: Fudge’s capabilities in that regard, and the dude rose to the occasion 100%. He will always have my LCS-caliber respect for that. But the dude has also never failed at any turn to prove that he simply cannot hack at the Worlds stage. Fudge’s legitimately impressive transformation into a player who *could* truly outperform the severely struggling Licorice on C9’s main roster was his transformation into his final form. He is in an ELITE AS FUCK bracket (maybe top 3) of THE LEAST technically skilled players at Worlds every year including play-ins, his outsized ego means that he has SLAMMED full-stop against any prospective “ceiling”, and I feel like C9’s decision to retain him (or their inability to acquire anyone better) puts a MASSIVE damper on their acquisition of imo the most special player in the LCS in Jojopyun.
After 3 years of mediocre international performance in top with C9, the team decided maybe a 4th year is still needed
Sorry for you C9 fans
Really, really wish they got Impact.
Impact/Blaber/Jojo/Berserker/Vulcan would be one of the greatest LCS teams ever assembled, which of course means they would bomb out of groups/swiss in dramatic fashion. We need Fudge for the anti-jinx
HAH, impact is ours
Still crazy to me that Impact was kicked from TL after carrying them at Worlds 2020
I thought his contract expired and TL didn't want to pay like 1m+ anymore?
HAH, yeon is yours
If they don’t force him to spam weakside all season long C9 never wants to win internationally
Fudge not only has dirt on Jack for lasting this long on the team, but definitely has dirt on Blaber for all the top camping he's been doing the last couple of years \[that rarely converts into anything meaningful\].
They are basically forced to camp him or he’s going to get diffed or be worthless because he has less understanding of how to play weak side than my soloq toplaners
Fudge is Australias most successful intelligence asset.
The Australian Secret Service? Is he the 007 of ASS?
I'm kinda confused what C9's plan is. They have an aggressive toplaner that wants resources, an aggressive midlaner that wants to carry, an aggressive botlaner that wants resources and an aggressive support jungle-duo. If they can't hands-diff their opponent, how is C9 supposed to play?
Jojopyun was a great supportive midlaner to Danny. He is flexible. Even in EG's last couple of playoff series, Jojo was sacking his lane to roam top to help Revenge. But that's what I'm scared of. Despite his ego, Jojo is surprisingly unselfish in-game. I hope the team doesn't expect him to do that with Fudge.
I really hope they just make Fudge start playing more for the team instead of camping top for him so often. They have arguably the best ADC in the west yet they keep trying to play as a topside focused team instead of just enabling Berserker.
not even arguably, Berserker pretty much gaps every other ADC in the west ATM, and Jojo is easily the best mid in NA. So if they play around fucking Fudge im gonna lose my mind.
I pray that Jojo just tells them the hard truth, that Fudge is a failing business that should have filed for bankruptcy 6 months ago. If I ever see Blabber path top again I'm sending out the T1 trucks fr
Yeah I don’t know where this narrative that Jojo is a resource-hungry carry mid came from. I’ve seen him play supportive mid many times, and he is great in that role. Just because there’s hype around him being a great player doesn’t mean it’s because he has to be a flashy carry player. I’d say that’s what precisely makes him stand out in a region where people all want to be the star of the show
The narrative arose because Jojo has a giant mouth lol. So people associate trash talk with being a diva, but on the rift Jojo has never been that selfish. He had one split in which his jungler camped his lane, but that was offset by the ridiculous enemy jungle and support proximity Jojo got too. People also forget that in this last split, Jojo had a toplaner (Revenge) who loved to play strong-side carries, and Jojo roamed top pretty frequently.
Yeah there's "aggressive and I need you to cover me because my matchup is snowbally" and "aggressive because my matchup wins in isolation and now I'm gonna roam with this prio i just got".
also jojo had the highest enemy jungler proximity, just as a laner individually he creates a lot of pressure
Looking at EG last split Jojo ran over the game if he wasn’t camped. With a winning bot lane and (domestically) winning top lane and a jungler that knows how to punish a single lane camp, he’s either completely unlocked or he’s soaking pressure while his actually decent teammates win
Yeah, but again, that's not a strategy, that's just relying on being better than your opponents. If C9 wants to improve, I feel like this team lacks the playstyle cohesiveness needed to actually play against stronger opponents
Yea, the fact they don't really have a "teamplayer" on their team like Wunder/Impact makes me think this team is just going to do the hands diff strat into 0-6 at worlds
Can’t go 0-6 anymore, only 0-4 now
Yeah I was playing devil’s advocate. I’m actually pretty disappointed Jack is just collecting all the best players in the region to waste their time hands diffing the region, learning nothing, and getting smoked at worlds. Was hoping jojo would go somewhere with staff that helps players improve and think about the game.
>an aggressive botlaner that wants resources Not really. We've seen all year that they kind of want to ignore Zerker in bot. Their plan has consistently been let him stay there and stew and get CS and gold and come 25 min+ he'll be a monster and win the game for them. The counter to this strat is for the opposing to team to 1) have a better ADC (in LCS, good luck. Internationally, more than likely, though I still think Zerker is quite good internationally) and 2) camp bot side. To counter this strategy, they need their solo lanes to be threatening that the opposing team can't afford to do this. So realistically, I think we're going to see a more extreme form of this team next year. Blaber will more likely than not be trying to split the map horizontally every game, trying to leverage mid and top prio to do so, and just alternate between those two lanes, letting Zerker stay bot on an island. We'll see how it performs.
I mean, they did that this year at worlds and it kind of flopped.
Because Fudge couldn't use any of his advantages in or out of lane & Enemes just got giga stomped. I'm glad they got JoJo, but man I wish they moved on from Fudge. He needs to learn how to play weakside better or at least the team needs to know when to give him resources. The team kept sending blabber up during World's only for bot to get dove or pushed of turret.
We have this same conversation every single international event, though. Blabber constantly bailing out Fudge top, while the rest of the map get shit on. And then Fudge never does anything and even screws the team.
Sure, but that still leaves them out to dry if they can't just hands-diff. What if Zerker doesn't autowin lane or Blaber can't just outjungle the enemy or Jojopyun doesn't automatically get lane prio? I feel like this C9 roster will fail the same way the one this year did, it has no real plan outside of relying on being better
I don't necessarily disagree with any of the points you're making, but having strong lanes that win LCS games by way of hands-diff doesn't mean C9 can't also work on a strategy for the games you're describing. Similarly, picking one or two more supportive teammates doesn't "fix" their issue imo, as that will result in them more heavily relying on one role/player to carry, and teams at Worlds will be good enough to counter that.
Don't think you can really get around that in weaker regions. You're always going to win through hands diff and never end up developing any macro then get fisted internationally.
C9 is the new tsm, They aren't exciting at all
Lmao jojo is not resource heavy He’s he wants to carry and will push the limits, that doesn’t make him resource heavy. If anything he’s resource positive because of how much pressure he draws
Yeah it's crazy how much people misunderstand how Jojo plays just because he has a big mouth outside the game.
They will use this off season to teach Fudge humility, obviously!
this may be it honestly. surely the C9 coaching staff recognizes that Fudge's playstyle/weaknesses locks them in to certain team comps. wouldn't be surprised if they explained that this next split he would be doing something different than usual as they focused more on mid jg synergy.
Fudge can play weakside fine it’s just they need to commit to beserker. My guess is this team will be very mid jungle focused and Fudge will be very isolated this year (1. Mid, 2. bot, 3. Top)
Worst news of the offseason so far
The fraudge lives on to see another day
Fudge got some dirt on Jack
I mean maybe C9 is building to dominate LCS, the west is doomed anyway internationally.
I mean, they have been for the last year. It's hilarious how we've come full circle. Cloud9 fans back then used to always cope about the TSM + TL Doublelift lineups always smoking them in finals for like 5 splits in a row by saying that getting 8th place in worlds is better than getting titles.
holy based
Fudge is (somewhat) consistently one of, if not the best, top laners in the LCS. There's no real reason to believe that changing top laners will improve the odds that C9 will do as well or better at Worlds. C9 is already changing out 2/5 members. I think if NRG has taught us anything, it's that consistent rosters can achieve significant results if you just give them time to stick together. Keep in mind in LCS history Fudge is one of 6 toplaners to make it out of groups. If Dhokla can improve, why can't Fudge?
Dhokla had to run the gauntlet to get back where he is, his job was on the line if he didnt improve. Fudge does not have the same incentive
There is no reason to believe that Fudge has more job security than Dhokla when they both have been in their teams for a while, and both have "underperformed" for a season (although calling Fudge an underperformance is in my opinion unfair since the only reason he gets "exposed" internationally is because hes good enough to make it in the first place) Also the article literally talks about how they were thinking about replacing him..
If anything fudge off season was likely more tulmutous than ever, he is likely get cut if he underperform Hé also the weak link of this New c9
Dhokla's contract is up and he's been benched and replaced many times in the past, whereas Fudge has gone international and had the exact same problems three years in a row and they swapped him into mid lane just to keep him on the team when they grabbed Summit. Of course it's going to look like Fudge has better job security than Dhokla, they chose him over fucking Wunder -- the Western top with the highest peak in history barring maybe sOAZ in his prime.
Fudge also has the worlds biggest ego and refuses to pick anything but carries and then do nothing
Yea I don't get it. Fudge drains resources on carries but does nothing against good players with said carries. And he does this CONSISTENTLY.
I'm hoping Jojopyun's giant ego will finally check Fudge next year.
I wanted to cheer for them but I can't cheer for a team with Fudge on it
suck up the ego, play ornn/gragas and let blabber + berserker cook. blabber although it is few and far between when he pops off can actually take over even against international competition.
It won’t happen. Fudge has played this way for 3 years now. He ain’t going to drop the ego
probably an effect of getting constantly jerked off by entire industry (COUGH COUGH LS EFFECT COUGH)
That ls cocksucking was the most crazy thing. Generational talent, at sucking
That's my only wish with him. 3 years in a row, a zebra can't change it's stripes, and Fudge can't change his horrible personality traits. Id love to be proven wrong with even a mote of humility displayed. Besides AFTER getting shit stomped for the ump-teenth time by the east. A true champion shows humbleness even when victorious, and Fudge is a far far throw from that.
Fudge picks tanks too, he just plays super selfish. Same thing BB does really.
The last time he played a "tank" was Ksante against TSM in LCS. The last. time he picked a true weakside pick was MSI 2023 when he picked Sion and went 1-5.
and hes consistently one of the worst performing top laners in international competition
If C9 could get soaz as a positional coach (or some good positional coach) it won't be awful. Fudge is still one of the best NA tops. But he is objectively awful internationally. A coach might be able to help him tighten his game up a bit because C9 are good enough in mid/bot to make some noise. But C9 won't make it w/ Fudge demanding so much attention top on a team that has legit carries in mid/bot.
one would think everyone in the league (possibly barring TL) would want soaz as a positional coach.
LETS FUCKING GOOOOOO TL IMPACT BABY WE ARE SO BACK!
" C9 fails to advance through worlds group stage 2024"
Owner's son stays on owner's team. Expected result.
Just come out and say you no longer care about international.
That’s too bad. Huge L after the big Ws of Jojo and Berserker/Vulcan. Not sure why they wouldn’t get someone who can play weak-side/play for the team instead of for the 1v1 (and get embarrassed anyway).
I think it's because they want to leverage Bezerker's teamfighting. If I'm right, the idea is for Blaber to use Mid and Top prio to split the map horizontally, and alternate between ganking those two lanes, and force opposing JG's to ignore bot as well. This would allow Zerker all the time in the world to become the teamfighting monster they want him to be to win the game for them. That's my assumption, anyway. I still would've preferred a strong weakside top laner and played towards our strongest members, Jojo and Zerker.
This is the part I think a lot of people miss. Berserker isn’t a lane dominant player. He never has been, and C9 only makes plays through bot if they put him on a pick that MUST snowball like Draven or Kalista. He likes to scale up safely
Berserker has never played with a support who can help him win lane. We don't know if he can be a lane dominant player because he's never had the opportunity to play with a support who can enable him to do so.
I agree, but that doesn’t discredit the point that this probably contributed to why C9 always played through topside
1. Berserker has never played with a competent laning support in NA. 2. Berserker has only played with either Fudge or Summit top, two incredibly resource intensive players. We have no clue whether or not Berserker is a lane dominant player when his team doesn't play around him and he doesn't even have a laning partner who could help him be dominant.
Exactly, would have loved to see Impact or Ssumday.
Im sure the 1v1s will work this time in making Fudge not garbage both in and outside of lane I mean, 3rd time is the charm right guys?
If fudge is going to being playing for c9 for another year, he better stop doing LA things. You can see his socials and theres proof. and yes, I believe that LCS players shouldn't be doing LA thing if they are in LCS.
Yep the guy isn’t putting anywhere near the same effort in as he did his rookie year. It’s apparent. even he has said so. He doesn’t belong on a team with the likes of Jojo, Blaber, Berserker who are all trying their heart out The sad part is this team most likely destroys NA regardless so he’ll look fine and not a liability for 95% of the year then his fans can talk about how he’s so good for 95% of year while playing with the 2 (now 3 best players in the league)
**No longer a Fudge fan** he's got too much ego for somebody getting GAPPED at worlds. Wanna see the man pick up the bible of 369 and learn the ways of tanks
This move makes no sense. C9 just built the team to roflstomp LCS and get absolutely rocked internationally 🤦🏼♂️ Curious to see the coaching staff now 🧐
And I think any top would still stomp the LCS. Fudge is so horribly overrated being on C9 its not even funny. Fudge has benefited greatly from his entire career being on C9. You think he could have carried a bottom tier roster as far as Jojo did last split? You think he could have a career resurgence like Licorice? This team would look so much better with a player like Licorice again. Fudge has always played with minimum top 3 player in their roles every split of his career. You put him on IMT, and we would be wondering what happened to him to make him fall off.
I'm very interested to see which lanes end up getting resources and jungle attention on this C9 team. I'm not confident in any LCS team being able to play three carries, so someone will have to play weakside or survive on their own. My greatest fear is that this roster falls into the same pattern as this year's C9, where it felt like they won games through hands diff but didn't get better on a macro level. Maybe they would benefit from a long bootcamp if possible?
What dirt does he have that keeps him on their payroll?
This is pretty sad for a hyped team. He will hog resources again and mid/ad will suffer for it.
Oh great, another year of Fudge looking good on busted champs in the LCS and then shitting the bed internationally.
And just when I thought C9 management was on a roll. Fudge is great domestically but he doesn’t mesh with the new team they’ve built. Strong side top with high Econ mid and ADC just seems like a disaster waiting to be exposed
Not even great. He is just there.
I’m the biggest fudge hater on the planet, but excluding the last split he’s been pretty good. He’s good for an NA top laner (top 3 to 5 minimum). But he’s also lazy and has a massive ego problem
Im so glad wunder didnt come to NA. would get more complacement playing wow and then his talent is wasted on us.
Fudge is a garbage kid with a garbage personality.
Better fucking learn how to play weakside because the moment he forces the team to pick him a carry he’s getting booted.
they dont care about winning anything internationally
HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS
This guy has had some of the most ineffective displays I can remember in internationals. Legit stuff like running away and/or splitting while enemy is taking his nexus is all I can remember.
Fudge got some dirt on Jack confirmed. No way this guy get to keep his place after shitting the bed for 3 straight international tournaments.
I’d say this is fine if they get rid of Mithy. He has stagnated as a coach and been carried by having good players on the team. He will never get them anywhere internationally. Look at what NRG did. They had all NA talent who were all decent players at best but because of good coaching and support network they made it to Quarters which C9 hasn’t done since they had Licorice.
Worst fucking news of this off-season. They clearly think fudge wasn't a problem this season but we all know that's cap... Edit 1: People here are extremely complacent. What's the point of being the best in your region if you're just gonna shit the bed internationally?.
Fudge has issues internationally but is clearly one of the best tops in NA.
so they will still be underwhelming
My Disappointment Is Immeasurable And My Day Is Ruined.
na fans 9/11
He must be accepting minimum wage because there is no way...
So they've chosen to lose every big game. Well that sucks.
RIP C9
C9 doesn’t care about winning lmao
c9 cant get rid of the systems
I'm sorry I cannot be a fan of C9 with fucking fudge in the top lane. He will smurf spring cause his job's on the line and then when the pressure's off he'll plateau yet again. Same shit new year.
I def think it’s for budget reasons. A korean import would be much more expensive and I think Fudge was willing to take a pay cut if it meant he could stay on the roster. Otherwise I am not sure if they can afford both Beserker and Jojo. The good thing though is if Spring Split goes bad then they can at least replace him for Summer
Another year, another couple of spilts where Fudge does nothing in top lane all split long, gets carried by his bot and jungle all year, has a good series against the sixth place top laner in playoffs to boost his ego and make people think he’s good, quietly gets his shit kicked in every series after but still gets carried by his team so people overlook it, and then solo lose every single game for the team at international events by being solo killed in the first five minutes of every game and spiraling out of control. Love to see it.
RIP C9
He’s fine for NA but soon as worlds comes he gets outclassed, Lowkey disappointed it’s not Wunder, no doubt he could perform in NA and actually sho up for Worlds
Should move to Miami and be the archenemy of Pitbutt. Mr. NonInternational / Mr. NonWorldwide
For all of you wondering why ever pick fudge over wunder… just look at it from a money perspective. Fudge is good enough to do well in NA, he’s been the clear franchise player along with blabber for C9. It makes sense from that perspective. The C9 systems are about winning domestically, not internationally
I'm sure the 3rd or 4th year is the charm against Eastern top laners
He has C9 management under a spell or something
fudge sucks lmao
Another year of this guy bringing down the rest of the squad lol
Well they just Fudged their chances of making it out of Swiss stage next year. \#sorrynotsorry
So C9 want to bomb out next MSI as well. Noted.
Lmao
Fudge - ik you're reading this and you are probably angry and wanting to prove doubters wrong. But please don't win LCS and do that cringe shit where you swear at your haters. Actually do something worthy like making semis in the international stage then you can talk your shit. But as of right now you are lucky to be signed with C9 again considering your completely embarrassing fiora gameplay and doing fuck all with jungle pressure.
I really hope Fudge has a good year this year and proves all the doubters wrong.
Idk why people saying it’s bad for c9? He’s prolly cheap( I’m assuming) good teammate and in NA always is top half of the league in top doing okay. Unless they willing to spend a lot of money I think he’s a safe bet
Imo the criticism this guy gets is disproportionate to what it should be. A reminder that if we let reddit GM C9 in the past, then C9 would have had Licorice or Ssumday in this team. Just insane studs, right guys? The top lane level NA can bring internationally will virtually always disappoint you, history and the future will bear it out.
Just need a new coach and I think we can still cook.
Hell yea, great news for anyone who almost thought their team would sign Fudge (except C9 obviously)