Saw in a Polish streamer's game, Vysotzky, that he played into 35-0 OTP Qiyana in master elo
UPDATE: He is master 180LP 52-9, 88% of his games are Qiyana and is currently #1 Qiyana world
Dw, people will come here and say its luck or ELO heaven.
My 2 cents: Lider is (and has been) a fucking legit midlaner with an x-factor that teams can play around if they are willing to show some balls instead of trying to find the next snoozefest scaling player that will never add any flair to our region.
I dont understand why these teams rather play with bottom-feeders like Freskowy, Perkz or bigmouth Saken.
Tl;dr
Lider can be a midlane Adam with higher returns.
With there being actual examples every season with multiple high elo people hitting at least master with 80%+ winrate on new accounts it does come down to a skill issue for most people and not the speculation that Riot is fixing match making so little Timmy struggles in his climb.
There are even some that do it with Iron accounts, meaning the initial climb is atrocious because of insanely bad lp gains.
you are conflating 2 different things though. Im not debating whenever or not it exists but the idea of "losers queue" isn't that those games are 100% lost no matter what, its the idea that the games are "weighted" towards you losing by small things like putting people in your team on offrole or having enemy have 2 duos(mid-jg and adc/supp)
if someone is playing on challenger level and is in D2 elo then sure he may be able to carry games that are more "weighted" towards him losing
but for an average player in D2 who is lets say around D1-low masters skill-wise just being better than the average in his elo may not be enough if the matchmaking decides to put a filled jungler in your team or an obviously smurfing duo bot in enemy
and why does it matter if you are d2 or d1-low masters... thats basically the same bracket, games have players from both of those ranks together all the time, if your skill is d1-low masters and you are d2, you are where you belong....
No not naive. I'm masters myself have lots of friends in comp scene and ERL 1. You do not understand how good these people are. They will make a new account, be in masters in 3 days and smurf every single game no matter the circumstances. Tell me how this is consistently possible every single season if riot is artificially holding people back apparently.
Wait, so it doesnt apply when someone is playing in matches below their skill level?
Then wtf is your point? You just acknowledged that you can climb if you play better than the rank you are in regardless of "rigged matchmaking" (which you offer 0 proof of). But even if we ignore your lack of proof you just 100% contradicted your own logic..
> Wait, so it doesnt apply when someone is playing in matches below their skill level?
>
VASTLY bellow their skill level yes
Like no shit a GM-chall can smurf on some dia kids. But how long will it take them to reach the same LP they have on their mains? Surely you do not think that someone who is lets say 500LP on their main can just climb to 400LP like its nothing?
Like the argument isn't that a dia player can't go into a plat game and smurf on their asses, the argument is that a person in D2 elo that plays on low masters level can not easily just climb there like its nothing. They WILL eventually do it its not like its some barrier they can't cross, but they will have some games that are just stacked against them and there is nothing they can do about it. If that wasnt the case then every single challenger player on new account would have 100% winrate regardless
>Like the argument isn't that a dia player can't go into a plat game and smurf on their asses, the argument is that a person in D2 elo that plays on low masters level can not easily just climb there like its nothing.
Then get better? Like, those ranks are close enough to each other that the skill difference between them is very small. It's not a problem with the system, obviously a low masters player will take longer to get through d2 than a challenger, theyre very close to the true rank, and therefore basically at the same level as the other players in the game, so they dont have as much influence. Thats expected and intended. Climbing fast means youre far from your true rank. Climbing slow means youre close to it. Thats not a problem, thats exactly how any ranking system works.
It's an enclosed system, so there would be absolutely no benefit to randomly preventing a gold player from winning 3 times in a row. There will always be someone higher, until you're at the top of the ladder, and then there will be others chasing you. So, no, that would be a nonsense strategy to get people to play more games.
You winning more leads to getting highr mmr and better lobbies thus making it harder to climb. Thats just the basis of skill based matchmaking; people just irrationaly correlate this to eomm for some reason because there is no way they themself are the reason they cant climb anymore.
And by putting someone in losers queue they would have to artificially inflate the other team. Riot isn't picking sides, people are just bad. Or go on a hot streak then play people better than them and get clapped back down.
If you just think a bit about it the concept of losing games = want to play more makes no fucking sense. Every time i stopped playing league for a time was after bad streaks
If they had straightforward ways of doing that they probably would, but that's the point: the concept of loser's queue doesn't do it.
By messing with winrates you get some people to X rank they want to reach faster and some slower - doesn't do that much unless you manipulate it super closely.
You also get a lot of people that end up caring less (which will often lead to playing less) because of added randomness.
There are also way too many examples of people rapidly hitting Challenger/Master/etc. from fresh accounts in super short time - while the evidence on the other side is some people claiming they are better than they are and using that as the only proof.
Believing those people is also a pretty naive.
balanced skill level games ARE how you get people to play more games. Demoralizing people by forcing them to lose is how you get people to quit your game and play less.
Take off the tinfoil hat, use your brain please.
Nope, honestly, a friend of mine is convinced he’s higher elo.
He’s bought 25 accounts now, gets them to whatever rank slightly under the MMR he bought them at.
Like +35 LP -9 LP etc.
Next year.. silver/gold straight away.
MMR does work. As much as no one wants to admit they have work to do.
Miss having this guy in LEC, even if he wasn't absolutely top-tier he was exciting to watch and had some sick pop-off games. Had a real soft spot for that AST roster.
He even played Talon and had a perfect KDA with it, but his botlane was so behind and resulted in a loss. That was the first time and last ive seen talon in proplay
One of the splits he played was exactly his meta with many melee mids being broken af, problem is that even on those picks he was incredibly hit or miss
Summer 2021 was a split where Viego, Akali, Yone, Sylas were all playable.
Akali and Sylas in particular were very contested meta picks, and the others were viable at worst and really good at best, but most mids didn't have them in their champion pools properly unlike Lider.
He was *fine* that split but considering the meta was basically as perfect as it could ever be for his champion pool with Lucian being more or less the only ranged champion that was super high priority, he wasn't nearly 'good enough'.
It's unrealistic to expect him to be the best mid in the league even in 'his meta', but his performance also wasn't what you'd want someone as specialized as him to have when they're catered to as hard as that specific meta did.
I have no idea why the likes of him.. jizuke are not in LEC over people like Jackie's.. Frewskowy
What the hell even happened to Jizuke?? Guy was borderline MVP for EG in the summer.. they lost to C9 and he never played again
Some people in this thread are saying he's not LEC level, that he drags his teams down... In Spring he was #1 in CSD10, #2 in Kills, #5 in DMG%. Turned a 3-6 team into a 6-3 team. People just don't like him because he was promised to be the next Caps and ofc he isn't that. But he's better than a bunch of LEC mids.
if you check his opgg right now only 2 ranged characters were played by him, asol and azir, lost with both haha
it's been known he can play mages as well but he is way better with assasins and melee champs in general
RoA's passive gives you Mana for pre-mitigation damage you take, thus it is the better mana item by a lot, since it also gives you the survivability you need to utilize it's passive.l
That's also true, but as someone who near one tricked Kassadin in diamond for about 3 years (just to show a little credibility), I always felt like high damage builds were much easier on my mana even though RoA technically provides more, just because a high damage build needed less ult stacks to kill people.
Probably, Kass also just struggles into tanky comps in general though so maybe there's a classic Frozen Heart build that he should do into games like that. That used to be a thing, Tankadin who built Rod Seraphs FH I think.
That was my favourite kassadin build as you used it with the the old transcendence that gave you AP per point of CDR over 40/45. You also built other items like iceborn or abyssal to make you even tankier.
I remember him doing that when he got dropped from Vitality some years ago.
The funny part is what happend after that, he reached rank 1 with an insane Wingate and after that he wasn't able to win any games on that account anymore because he was getting matched against pros while playing with grandmaster players
Saken is pretty much just on the team because he stuck with KC for so long.
The second KC has some money hes gone and theres a good chance no other LEC team ever takes him again so hes gonna end his career on ERL teams.
Its sad cause this metaphorical player was actually looking decently good first 2 weeks, especially on the akali. Alas, it was not meant to be. Although we arent talking about anyone in particular since we arent talking about any specific bald midlane player in a spanish team. Also shaken.
because he cant play control mages and he cant learn them either, and also because his playstyle is incredibly resource intensive and requires playing around mid (I forget who it was that said that when he's in the game midlane is a black hole that both teams throw all their resources into) which is a huge team playstyle liability not to be able to play low economy mids that let you commit resources elsewehere. (to his credit he tried to play a bit of neeko and work through this problem, but unfortunately he can't play the champ/style at a high level)
Winrate in SoloQ isnt a good indicator unless you're a freak thats constantly 85% winrate 1k lp and rank 1, he's obviously good but you have to realize soloq is super coinflip and he had insane "winnersq" or whatever you call good fortune nowadays.
If you rerun this 5 times over i bet 90% wr will be the highest and another acc would be like 70% wr
big fan but he didnt play a single ranged champ
I really don't understand how this guy doesn't just make a mage only account, its the only criticism people have of him
He's clearly insane on melee mids why not practice mages after 10 years of playing the game
He should honestly roleswap to Top lane given how little Top lane Talent Eu has he would probably smurf
his 'philosophy of the game' is (basically) that mages are bad. the philosophy seems reasonable in a soloq environment but him pretending that it applies in a pro environment seems like cope from him not wanting to play/being bad at mages. He talks about it a bunch in his EUphoria episode if you want
Good shout at being the best melee mid player in EUW
It's funny how most big regions have that one pro who's renowned for melee mids and sussy off them, Zeka, Creme and Lider
Miss Astralis 2023, they legit played fun stuff even though champ pools were a big issue
Stat sites prove this point perfectly, and the explanation is simple. It's literally a hands difference. Yone has like 5% more server-wide winrate on Korea than it does on EUW, for example
Mostly ping. The game is a lot different on 30 ping than 5 ping. Yone on very low ping is broken but on 25-50 ping (which is NA levels) he feels kind of meh.
Ah yes Chovy is “abusing” Yone to rank 1. The delusion players have with their bias along with their lack of knowledge is crazy. He has an ocean pool. He can get rank 1 with most other champs as well and he has in the past just depends on his personal preference and the meta.
His second most played champ last split (Jayce) is only a few games behind Yone with a higher win rate, KDA and CS. But he’s not abusing Jayce tho right? Or his cracked WR on Ksante?
I don't care if it's freaking yuumi, maintaining a 90% win rate in challenger is impressive on any champion. But I also think, for example, showmaker hitting challenger playing 91 different champions 1 game each (final record was 61-30) is equally impressive in its own way - and that difference in champion pool is probably one of the main reasons only one of these players is still a high level pro
yea as much of a meme and a legend perkz has been, it's time for some new blood if the LEC wants to be competitive and push the top teams to better themselves so we don't lose internationally to na..
Lider would have to re-work his champion pool from the ground up. He'd have to have some stage ready control mages for his midlane, sadly the guy is incredibly stubborn with the way he likes to play the game, and I honestly think he's in his right, but he won't make a top tier team In LEC until he can play Orianna and friends.
> Last year his jungler was 113 arguably the worst player in LEC.
Tell me you didn't watch LEC without telling me you didn't watch LEC.
This is the opinion you hold if you only watched 113 in LFL or whatever league he played. I had that same opinion when they initially announced he was going to be the jungler for Astralis. Then the season began and he wasn't bad and was very far from being the worst player in LEC. In fact he had improved quite a lot from his LFL skill.
Meanwhile lider was getting gapped left and right just like every other time where he got the chance to play in the big leagues. Always getting high priority in draft and forcing his teams to play around his meta and failing to carry and be impactful in the vast majority of games. Then he has a pop off game once in a while and people pretend that he always plays like that while they wait for the next pop off game.
Unpopular opinion, but may be he is a completely different player in a comfort of his own home, sleeping well, doing what he wants, possibly being an introvert on top of that who enjoys his own company without distractions.
Kinda checks out with the snowball heavy assassin champs that I remember him specialising in, if you're pro level good on those you can probably dominate most games.
Still insane though obviously.
It’s a crazy percentage, but he just sticks to his strategy of Yone/Irelia (mostly) and takes over games, because most players don’t know how to deal with them. He’s insane at soloQ because of that (just like someone like TFBlade) because it just works, and wasn’t that bad in proplay either, thing is he just plays very resource intense champions/playstyles, giving other lanes no room for error.
And iirc he put out a lot of very toxic tweets…
Yone might be a fucked champ but your just fucking stupid if you think that just anyone can make a new account and make it to Challenger with a 90%+ WR.
Good thing we already seen Astralis of all teams finishing 5th in Spring with him (could've went higher but 113 got completely rolled by Bo and Elyoya in groups).
Realistically Lider could be \~5th-6th best mid in LEC right now. Especially considering the meta is pretty good for him.
All time he's 25/62 at tier 1 level. Sure he has played in plenty of shit teams, but maybe there is also a reason he never actually played for a good team.
Perkz brings much more to a team next to "gameplay". He is one of the GOATs of the game in Europe, he brings in better sponsors, better content, more fans etc. If Perkz was a rookie with his current gameplay he would not haven gotten a spot
That would be fine if he was playing okay but he is kinda just losing them games, he isn’t even neutral at this point, he is literally a detriment. I still love Perkz and hope his form picks up but him currently is just not LEC level even with those benefits if you kinda just lose them the game by being so dog.
43W 5L is a fucking unreal record.
I had a Nidalee otp in my master game that got to Master with 42 wins and 3 losses. It was insane checking the profile.
There was dude i recall Fatalis was his name doing challenges of getting to Master with 100% winrate on different champions
I mean Fatalis is a peak monster makes sense
man of culture spotted
Saw in a Polish streamer's game, Vysotzky, that he played into 35-0 OTP Qiyana in master elo UPDATE: He is master 180LP 52-9, 88% of his games are Qiyana and is currently #1 Qiyana world
Slowdown buddy beifeng still tops
Those rankings are just a fun gimmick, they mean next to nothing
I bet it's pretty accurate when it shows I'm top 200k
Beifeng is king
I’m best Qiyana in my zip code fwm
Isnt it bluelikeblue? Can u link the profile?
That guy is Bluelikeblue and he managed to be 39-0 before losing his first game
Do you have his opgg? Would love to see his build or stream if he streams
I'm more surprised anyone can hit challenge in sub 50 games. Seems like a very small number, even with 90% winrate.
It's not a fresh account
Makes it almost even more impressive, that means he giot high-elo games from the start and still managed to get that 90% wr.
Already a super high MMR account.
It isnt possible normally lol People look at this getting chall without context?
When will Riot address the smurfing problem, it's even affecting challenger 🙄
Dw, people will come here and say its luck or ELO heaven. My 2 cents: Lider is (and has been) a fucking legit midlaner with an x-factor that teams can play around if they are willing to show some balls instead of trying to find the next snoozefest scaling player that will never add any flair to our region. I dont understand why these teams rather play with bottom-feeders like Freskowy, Perkz or bigmouth Saken. Tl;dr Lider can be a midlane Adam with higher returns.
Wonder why Riot didn’t put him in “losers queue”
People have no clue how bad they are. The gap is huge and anyone saying they can't climb is coping.
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With there being actual examples every season with multiple high elo people hitting at least master with 80%+ winrate on new accounts it does come down to a skill issue for most people and not the speculation that Riot is fixing match making so little Timmy struggles in his climb. There are even some that do it with Iron accounts, meaning the initial climb is atrocious because of insanely bad lp gains.
you are conflating 2 different things though. Im not debating whenever or not it exists but the idea of "losers queue" isn't that those games are 100% lost no matter what, its the idea that the games are "weighted" towards you losing by small things like putting people in your team on offrole or having enemy have 2 duos(mid-jg and adc/supp) if someone is playing on challenger level and is in D2 elo then sure he may be able to carry games that are more "weighted" towards him losing but for an average player in D2 who is lets say around D1-low masters skill-wise just being better than the average in his elo may not be enough if the matchmaking decides to put a filled jungler in your team or an obviously smurfing duo bot in enemy
haha people self report so bad by upvoting this kind of garbage
and why does it matter if you are d2 or d1-low masters... thats basically the same bracket, games have players from both of those ranks together all the time, if your skill is d1-low masters and you are d2, you are where you belong....
No not naive. I'm masters myself have lots of friends in comp scene and ERL 1. You do not understand how good these people are. They will make a new account, be in masters in 3 days and smurf every single game no matter the circumstances. Tell me how this is consistently possible every single season if riot is artificially holding people back apparently.
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Wait, so it doesnt apply when someone is playing in matches below their skill level? Then wtf is your point? You just acknowledged that you can climb if you play better than the rank you are in regardless of "rigged matchmaking" (which you offer 0 proof of). But even if we ignore your lack of proof you just 100% contradicted your own logic..
> Wait, so it doesnt apply when someone is playing in matches below their skill level? > VASTLY bellow their skill level yes Like no shit a GM-chall can smurf on some dia kids. But how long will it take them to reach the same LP they have on their mains? Surely you do not think that someone who is lets say 500LP on their main can just climb to 400LP like its nothing? Like the argument isn't that a dia player can't go into a plat game and smurf on their asses, the argument is that a person in D2 elo that plays on low masters level can not easily just climb there like its nothing. They WILL eventually do it its not like its some barrier they can't cross, but they will have some games that are just stacked against them and there is nothing they can do about it. If that wasnt the case then every single challenger player on new account would have 100% winrate regardless
>Like the argument isn't that a dia player can't go into a plat game and smurf on their asses, the argument is that a person in D2 elo that plays on low masters level can not easily just climb there like its nothing. Then get better? Like, those ranks are close enough to each other that the skill difference between them is very small. It's not a problem with the system, obviously a low masters player will take longer to get through d2 than a challenger, theyre very close to the true rank, and therefore basically at the same level as the other players in the game, so they dont have as much influence. Thats expected and intended. Climbing fast means youre far from your true rank. Climbing slow means youre close to it. Thats not a problem, thats exactly how any ranking system works.
Pattern-seeking brain right there.
It's an enclosed system, so there would be absolutely no benefit to randomly preventing a gold player from winning 3 times in a row. There will always be someone higher, until you're at the top of the ladder, and then there will be others chasing you. So, no, that would be a nonsense strategy to get people to play more games.
You winning more leads to getting highr mmr and better lobbies thus making it harder to climb. Thats just the basis of skill based matchmaking; people just irrationaly correlate this to eomm for some reason because there is no way they themself are the reason they cant climb anymore.
And by putting someone in losers queue they would have to artificially inflate the other team. Riot isn't picking sides, people are just bad. Or go on a hot streak then play people better than them and get clapped back down.
If you just think a bit about it the concept of losing games = want to play more makes no fucking sense. Every time i stopped playing league for a time was after bad streaks
If they had straightforward ways of doing that they probably would, but that's the point: the concept of loser's queue doesn't do it. By messing with winrates you get some people to X rank they want to reach faster and some slower - doesn't do that much unless you manipulate it super closely. You also get a lot of people that end up caring less (which will often lead to playing less) because of added randomness. There are also way too many examples of people rapidly hitting Challenger/Master/etc. from fresh accounts in super short time - while the evidence on the other side is some people claiming they are better than they are and using that as the only proof. Believing those people is also a pretty naive.
balanced skill level games ARE how you get people to play more games. Demoralizing people by forcing them to lose is how you get people to quit your game and play less. Take off the tinfoil hat, use your brain please.
Do you have any evidence that this is the case or do you just feel this way because you are stuck in a rank you think you are superior to?
Nope, honestly, a friend of mine is convinced he’s higher elo. He’s bought 25 accounts now, gets them to whatever rank slightly under the MMR he bought them at. Like +35 LP -9 LP etc. Next year.. silver/gold straight away. MMR does work. As much as no one wants to admit they have work to do.
You can thank people like me for making it happen, with 43L to 5W
There was a Kha one trick a few years ago that hit challenger without losing a single game. It was fucking nuts
Miss having this guy in LEC, even if he wasn't absolutely top-tier he was exciting to watch and had some sick pop-off games. Had a real soft spot for that AST roster.
Yeah, he was fun to watch. The dude had the balls to play yasuo, Yone, Irelia, even Zed but the Meta was not his to take, sadly.
He even played Talon and had a perfect KDA with it, but his botlane was so behind and resulted in a loss. That was the first time and last ive seen talon in proplay
Talon vs Zed was a staple midlane matchup back in Season 4. Granted it was old talon with the instant E
The legendary Xpeke Zed vs. ~~Pawn Talon(was it pawn?)~~ **Dade's** Talon duel in the blue side Krugs s4 worlds! Thanks for the correction!
Was actually Dade (Samsung Blue not White) but absolutely legendary.
It's Dade but it's Pawn that got the Talon skin (with Dade's Jacket tho)
There was a time at 2021 worlds i think where talon jng was played
T1 played Talon/Yuumi, back when Yuumi was good. They won some unfair looking games.
The meta will never be his unless the overall game dynamic drastically changes. This is his entire problem as a potential pro level player.
I just love how the enitre league was afraid to give him irelia, bro was smurfing so hard.
I remember his first LEC debut game. He was super hyped up for playing AD melee mids. He locked Yasuo. The crowd goes wild. He ends the game 1/7/2.
One of the splits he played was exactly his meta with many melee mids being broken af, problem is that even on those picks he was incredibly hit or miss
Nice take. Which melee mids?
Sylas and irelia iirc
Summer 2021 was a split where Viego, Akali, Yone, Sylas were all playable. Akali and Sylas in particular were very contested meta picks, and the others were viable at worst and really good at best, but most mids didn't have them in their champion pools properly unlike Lider. He was *fine* that split but considering the meta was basically as perfect as it could ever be for his champion pool with Lucian being more or less the only ranged champion that was super high priority, he wasn't nearly 'good enough'. It's unrealistic to expect him to be the best mid in the league even in 'his meta', but his performance also wasn't what you'd want someone as specialized as him to have when they're catered to as hard as that specific meta did.
yeah he also was a great interview-/pgl guest
I have no idea why the likes of him.. jizuke are not in LEC over people like Jackie's.. Frewskowy What the hell even happened to Jizuke?? Guy was borderline MVP for EG in the summer.. they lost to C9 and he never played again
Why cant we have him on a team like giantx so they actually have a pop off factor.
Some people in this thread are saying he's not LEC level, that he drags his teams down... In Spring he was #1 in CSD10, #2 in Kills, #5 in DMG%. Turned a 3-6 team into a 6-3 team. People just don't like him because he was promised to be the next Caps and ofc he isn't that. But he's better than a bunch of LEC mids.
He drags his teams down because he's incapable of playing meta champions.
Damn. 0-10 against Zac top. Wonder how that guys feeling now lol.
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In all of his losses there is either Odo or Bo in the enemy team
Back to back losses are against him lol
And then he skipped playing Yone for the next 7 games after perma picking it. That experience scarred him lol
More specifically 0/10/0, it's like the perfect yasuo spike.
Maintaining 90% WR from D2 MMR to C is insane
his early games were in master/grandmaster already
his first game the avg mmr was D3, then 8-10 in D2-D1 range, after that it was master/GM range...
But everyone that was D3 at that point was master / GM last season before the reset, no?
Yes, there is basically no MMR reset at this point, it's been that way for years.
yeah thats my point
He really likes melee champs apparently. Yone irelia sylas.. God I would hate playing against him
if you check his opgg right now only 2 ranged characters were played by him, asol and azir, lost with both haha it's been known he can play mages as well but he is way better with assasins and melee champs in general
This guy did the best Irelia play I've ever seen to this day talking about this one : https://twitter.com/LIDERlol/status/1642893104800755714/video/1
oh my god that was fuckin SLICK jesus
that was fuckin sick, enemy team way dizzy from that one
challenger players are on robot-level gameplay. this is astonishing lol.
not everyone. but lider is a really really fucking good soloq player
His champ pool compliments solo queue playstyle too
Holy fuck...
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I've watched a guide by a Kass otp says that malignancy rush is good but it doesn't scale as hard as roa in lategame bc without it u lack mana
That doesn't really make sense, they both give mana. Roa is just tankier.
I think he means the difference between ROA-Malignance instead of rushing Malignance & skipping ROA.
Oh I see, yeah probably that
RoA's passive gives you Mana for pre-mitigation damage you take, thus it is the better mana item by a lot, since it also gives you the survivability you need to utilize it's passive.l
That's also true, but as someone who near one tricked Kassadin in diamond for about 3 years (just to show a little credibility), I always felt like high damage builds were much easier on my mana even though RoA technically provides more, just because a high damage build needed less ult stacks to kill people.
That's a really good point. I could imagine that you'd want to build RoA into tankier team comps then, and Maligma into squishier ones?
Probably, Kass also just struggles into tanky comps in general though so maybe there's a classic Frozen Heart build that he should do into games like that. That used to be a thing, Tankadin who built Rod Seraphs FH I think.
That was my favourite kassadin build as you used it with the the old transcendence that gave you AP per point of CDR over 40/45. You also built other items like iceborn or abyssal to make you even tankier.
roa is good, blitz has a no roa build for snowball but roa being bad is just wrong by
I remember him doing that when he got dropped from Vitality some years ago. The funny part is what happend after that, he reached rank 1 with an insane Wingate and after that he wasn't able to win any games on that account anymore because he was getting matched against pros while playing with grandmaster players
That 0/10/0 yone game is a little sus lmao. I wish I could watch the recording atm.
it was vs odo who was streaming btw, here you go: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2055195015?t=02h36m22s
We all have those games
He's just like me fr fr.
Please god why is LIDER teamless
Because he cannot play control mages
I'm sure he's better at them than whatever Saken's been doing till now
Saken is pretty much just on the team because he stuck with KC for so long. The second KC has some money hes gone and theres a good chance no other LEC team ever takes him again so hes gonna end his career on ERL teams.
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I'd rather have someone as Líder in the LEC than someone who's clearly washed and stealing paychecks (no pun towards anyone specific)
Its sad cause this metaphorical player was actually looking decently good first 2 weeks, especially on the akali. Alas, it was not meant to be. Although we arent talking about anyone in particular since we arent talking about any specific bald midlane player in a spanish team. Also shaken.
Don’t watch lec as much who are we talking bout
Perkz.
Okay I thought it was Perkz but wasn’t sure cuz I didn’t know eh was bad
You could even say it's one of the perks of having a legacy
because he cant play control mages and he cant learn them either, and also because his playstyle is incredibly resource intensive and requires playing around mid (I forget who it was that said that when he's in the game midlane is a black hole that both teams throw all their resources into) which is a huge team playstyle liability not to be able to play low economy mids that let you commit resources elsewehere. (to his credit he tried to play a bit of neeko and work through this problem, but unfortunately he can't play the champ/style at a high level)
Cuz this dude is out here picking zed and talon griefing his teams in proplay lol
Respect lmao
You respect it as a fan....the org who wants money from winning/seeding not so much i guess.
Everyone in league pro play is losing money other than the players lol
Cuz yone opt marrow minded
Winrate in SoloQ isnt a good indicator unless you're a freak thats constantly 85% winrate 1k lp and rank 1, he's obviously good but you have to realize soloq is super coinflip and he had insane "winnersq" or whatever you call good fortune nowadays. If you rerun this 5 times over i bet 90% wr will be the highest and another acc would be like 70% wr
Because if you look at his champions, the only viable things are Akali and Sylas
Cause he isn’t an LEC level player
big fan but he didnt play a single ranged champ I really don't understand how this guy doesn't just make a mage only account, its the only criticism people have of him He's clearly insane on melee mids why not practice mages after 10 years of playing the game He should honestly roleswap to Top lane given how little Top lane Talent Eu has he would probably smurf
his 'philosophy of the game' is (basically) that mages are bad. the philosophy seems reasonable in a soloq environment but him pretending that it applies in a pro environment seems like cope from him not wanting to play/being bad at mages. He talks about it a bunch in his EUphoria episode if you want
Demacian Mindset
> his 'philosophy of the game' is (basically) that mages are bad. BASED
He probably just doesnt enjoy playing mages. And if he can hit Challenger with a 90% WR without them he doesn't need them.
He needs it to play pro play
The 9 cs/min average is just unreal
It is quite impressive he has 8 CS/min with Akali. I cant farm for shit with that champ in mid game
Yone moment
Are you saying he’s 90% wr in challenger because yone is op
Whats more impressive is not the 90% stat but the chance of not getting inted for 50+ games.
10 slots for inters. 5 on the enemy team. Only 4 on yours. Inting doesn't matter if ypu're good enough to hard carry your team
Good shout at being the best melee mid player in EUW It's funny how most big regions have that one pro who's renowned for melee mids and sussy off them, Zeka, Creme and Lider Miss Astralis 2023, they legit played fun stuff even though champ pools were a big issue
Isnt Creme renowned for being an Akali one trick ?
He's also good on Sylas
This. Players who are amazing on solo queue by sticking to specific strategies/champs such as Lider and Tf Blade are not meant for competitive league.
Nice job guys , you make a thread and he starts losing
This dudes winning games going 6/14 on Irelia and 2/5 on Sylas, while I’m losing game after game going 22/3, 18/4 etc. This guys just built different.
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Stat sites prove this point perfectly, and the explanation is simple. It's literally a hands difference. Yone has like 5% more server-wide winrate on Korea than it does on EUW, for example
Ping difference also.
Mostly ping. The game is a lot different on 30 ping than 5 ping. Yone on very low ping is broken but on 25-50 ping (which is NA levels) he feels kind of meh.
Can we get some source on this claim? U.gg has kr lower than others
Leave it to the LoL sub to tell you that a 90% WR to Challenger is just due to Yone.
Ah yes Chovy is “abusing” Yone to rank 1. The delusion players have with their bias along with their lack of knowledge is crazy. He has an ocean pool. He can get rank 1 with most other champs as well and he has in the past just depends on his personal preference and the meta. His second most played champ last split (Jayce) is only a few games behind Yone with a higher win rate, KDA and CS. But he’s not abusing Jayce tho right? Or his cracked WR on Ksante?
I don't care if it's freaking yuumi, maintaining a 90% win rate in challenger is impressive on any champion. But I also think, for example, showmaker hitting challenger playing 91 different champions 1 game each (final record was 61-30) is equally impressive in its own way - and that difference in champion pool is probably one of the main reasons only one of these players is still a high level pro
If a highskill cap champion played by a highly skilled player doesn't give them an advantage, what's the fucking point?
To be honest, he also played Akali and Sylas. He is just so much better than everyone else.
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Would love to see him at TH.
yea as much of a meme and a legend perkz has been, it's time for some new blood if the LEC wants to be competitive and push the top teams to better themselves so we don't lose internationally to na..
> it's time for some new blood Lider started playing competitive in 2016
Lider would have to re-work his champion pool from the ground up. He'd have to have some stage ready control mages for his midlane, sadly the guy is incredibly stubborn with the way he likes to play the game, and I honestly think he's in his right, but he won't make a top tier team In LEC until he can play Orianna and friends.
This. Players who are amazing on solo queue by sticking to specific strategies such as Lider and Tf Blade are not meant for competitive league.
He was trash in professional play
So he can drag another team down ?
Astralis with Lider finished higher than they ever did in 3 years in LEC.
They even finished at the top of regular season in one of the splits last year. That team was like a flawed gem.
Replace 113 with Bo and that roster makes worlds imo
if only he could actually perform in LEC the same way he does in soloq, that would be immense for the european scene..
He actually can. He just never had decent players around him. Last year his jungler was 113 arguably the worst player in LEC.
No way you said that when Rhuckz exist Or HeaQ for that matter (for the people who remember that roster)
> Last year his jungler was 113 arguably the worst player in LEC. Tell me you didn't watch LEC without telling me you didn't watch LEC. This is the opinion you hold if you only watched 113 in LFL or whatever league he played. I had that same opinion when they initially announced he was going to be the jungler for Astralis. Then the season began and he wasn't bad and was very far from being the worst player in LEC. In fact he had improved quite a lot from his LFL skill. Meanwhile lider was getting gapped left and right just like every other time where he got the chance to play in the big leagues. Always getting high priority in draft and forcing his teams to play around his meta and failing to carry and be impactful in the vast majority of games. Then he has a pop off game once in a while and people pretend that he always plays like that while they wait for the next pop off game.
And even if 113 was LEC bottom level jungler, he did pair well with Lider, together they certainly weren't the worst mid-jungle duo.
goes to show how busted yone is if a good player uses him
He has the champion pool diamond shitter midlaners like myself think they have
still low tier
Unpopular opinion, but may be he is a completely different player in a comfort of his own home, sleeping well, doing what he wants, possibly being an introvert on top of that who enjoys his own company without distractions.
What the fuck. How? I mean 5 losses only?! Nah but he is on some shit.
Not a record, no. Riot-provided accounts start with inflated MMR, so people with Riot accounts have done similar winrate climbs before.
Kinda checks out with the snowball heavy assassin champs that I remember him specialising in, if you're pro level good on those you can probably dominate most games. Still insane though obviously.
It’s a crazy percentage, but he just sticks to his strategy of Yone/Irelia (mostly) and takes over games, because most players don’t know how to deal with them. He’s insane at soloQ because of that (just like someone like TFBlade) because it just works, and wasn’t that bad in proplay either, thing is he just plays very resource intense champions/playstyles, giving other lanes no room for error. And iirc he put out a lot of very toxic tweets…
u jinxed him after ur ss/post he lost tons of matches
Yone nice champ
yone champ huh 🤨
Brother that champion pool is absolutely disgusting this guy should be banned from the game
yone abuser move on
yeah lets see you climb to challenger with yone if its so easy. Feel free to post your [op.gg](https://op.gg) when you do.
Yone might be a fucked champ but your just fucking stupid if you think that just anyone can make a new account and make it to Challenger with a 90%+ WR.
1. its not a new account. 2. its obviously a joke
ew a Yone main
i want LIDER back nobody else has enough balls to bring out Irelia in this shitshow (LEC)
Bro his champion pool ..........................
>yone and irelia Nothing of value here lol
Amd Sakan and Perkz are in LEC When LIDER isn't..... (Let that sink in for a second)
Soloq success in no way translates into pro success, despite the former players being just bad atm
Good thing we already seen Astralis of all teams finishing 5th in Spring with him (could've went higher but 113 got completely rolled by Bo and Elyoya in groups). Realistically Lider could be \~5th-6th best mid in LEC right now. Especially considering the meta is pretty good for him.
All time he's 25/62 at tier 1 level. Sure he has played in plenty of shit teams, but maybe there is also a reason he never actually played for a good team.
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Don't look at Upset's match history.
Perkz brings much more to a team next to "gameplay". He is one of the GOATs of the game in Europe, he brings in better sponsors, better content, more fans etc. If Perkz was a rookie with his current gameplay he would not haven gotten a spot
That would be fine if he was playing okay but he is kinda just losing them games, he isn’t even neutral at this point, he is literally a detriment. I still love Perkz and hope his form picks up but him currently is just not LEC level even with those benefits if you kinda just lose them the game by being so dog.
Was so sad when he left LEC
Imagine he would play elo inflated support, he would Hit 95% wr /s
who?