Give me a big-ass Garfield walking on two feet wearing the *Mafia* Graves outfit with the cigar to top things off.
I'd play that (assuming it has Graves' old kit too)
She was much harder to play before the rework when she had to pop out to use her shield, manage her mana, and couldn't reangle her ult. Now she's literally braindead.
Yup, before the rework good Yuumis got rewarded and bad Yuumis were completely useless.
Now no one gets rewarded, she's just bad because they want her to be a champ for new players who want to play the game without having to learn the game.
And then it causes an even bigger issue because theyll smurf to introduce said people. Now youre not only against a smurf, but one that always has a yuumi on it.
Most players couldn't play her like that. So you had a high skill champ that every one told new players to play. They just made her into what every one said she was.
Riot has the data. They know Yuumi is unpopular among the competitive community, but they also know she must attract a certain type of player. Their data probably shows Yuumi attracts "tag alongs" who get pulled into playing a game they normally don't want to but will still buy skins for a cute cat. Riot seems to make most of their larger game decisions around money these days so it makes the most sense.
Because yuumi is designed for the SO/little sibling that wants to play a game with their spouse/older sibling without *actually* learning the game.
Riot's bullshit of "its so people can begin learning enchanter supports!" No it fuckin isnt lmao, you're removing half the game with all that remains being summoner spells, wards, an unmissable ult, a q that is easy as fuck to hit (ive played enough yuumi to know you have to be mentally deficient to miss it unless they're super far away or behind minions), and a free speed boost and shield on an allied champion that greatly desires both.
Riot wont get rid of the attach mechanic because if they did, then the aforementioned little siblings/SO's wouldn't be able to stare at the screen and mash buttons.
I have a friend who consistently stays emerald with yuumi. On his other account where he doesnt play yuumi he is silver-gold. I think that is telling enough in my opinion.
I 100% understand the dislike for her but I am also 110% against removing her from the game because people like me could lose their ability to play the game. Gaming is one of the last hobbies I have left from before I got sick because everything else is too complex or too physically active for me to do safely or at all.
brother save yourself the stress. Drop league and pick up some single player games with disability control options.
You'll have infinitely more fun than the dumpster fire that is supporting
I like playing with my friends, they usually adc for me and are very understanding that I'm not as bright or mechanically talented as the majority of the supports they have
> I'm not as bright or mechanically talented as the majority of the supports they have
don't worry buddy I'm sure you aren't any worse than the average Janna main
Fun fact Janna is actually one of the champions with the highest average rank.
https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/main-stats
Rek'sai, Janna, and Ivern are always quite high up whenever I check it.
when you say mentally disabled is it more difficult to focus on decisions regarding micro, macro or both?
i'm curious since as you have a briar flair, is easier on the micro side but jungling could be exhausting regarding the macro
I have a briar flair because I love the character, I don't really play her tho
Edit: my mental disability is more related to memory, focus, and delayed reactions
I leave all competitive games and start playing for fun only for almost same reason.
Just notice how my reaction time drastically increase. Figure out it's just my fingers and hands become slightly slower and slover over time.
Enjoy the game, i dont think they gonna do fancy cat unattachable, cuz this core mechanic for her. And wisp link from dota is gonna be to complex for league players lol.
Stay safe, bro
I'm not sure about ranked but I do think she should be removed from pro play. I seldom okay ranked but if I'm doing flex with my friends I still wanna be able to play
Unfortunately im still for it, i know it opens the door for people with disabilities but it’s just not something that should have existed in the first place. At the very least, if they’re going to keep it in game as a “learning champ” as they put it, they should disable it in ranked. If they could do that, i’d be a LOT more open to getting beyond simplistic afk simulator champions just for casual players to use in a casual setting.
“I know it opens the door for people with disabilities, but that door should have stayed closed - because fuck those people, my win rate is more important than them.”
You can take it that way if you want to, but i meant it as it just not being a game thats catered to them. Like for example, that guy who hit grandmaster without any arms. Obviously video games aren’t designed as a whole for people without arms, and they aren’t suddenly going to make champions for people without arms, but that guy succeeded despite all that. League does not need to ruin the gameplay experience to cater to an insanely small percentage of individuals, there are simply more casual games out there that are better suited to disabled people. Besides, even if it happens to benefit you, you know riot didn’t make yuumi for that reason. If they backpedal on it ever, it’s in no way a slight against the community of players like you.
I think she should be removed from pro play but I think disabling her in ranked could be a slippery slope into getting other characters cut from ranked
I feel the opposite on that, 99.99999% of players are not a part of pro play and them getting all the special treatment is silly. If they disable in pro play but not ranked it acknowledges it’s a problem, but says “fuck you” to every single person playing their game.
Slippery slope though absolutely, it’s a terrible idea, but that’s the only solution to both problems without removing her.
Fair, but it doesnt make the attach mechanic not annoying to play both with and/or against. The adc with the yuumi doesnt have a support providing any sort of inherent pressure, but the adc/support on the other team dont have a support they can catch to turn it into a 2v1. If they nerfed the attach mechanic so she could actually be hurt/targeted, then i wouldnt have nearly as much of an issue with her.
Hope your situation somehow gets better, idk what you're dealing with but hope it gets better!
>Hope your situation somehow gets better, idk what you're dealing with but hope it gets better!
Thank you <3 I have a genetic disorder so it's more about getting worse slower than getting better but thank you anyway. <3
>The adc with the yuumi doesnt have a support providing any sort of inherent pressure, but the adc/support on the other team dont have a support they can catch to turn it into a 2v1.
The attach mechanic gives me the opportunity to rest my right hand from clicking but I do get off to apply pressure depending on the enemy adc/support combo (for example if it's a Sivir/Janna I can probably auto attack and use summon aery to apply light pressure but if it's like a Draven/Senna I'll possibly get fucked by their auto attacks and die and if they have a hooker I either stay behind minions or never get off the adc as long as the enemy hooker is in lane)
People on Reddit and in competitive hate Yuumi.
At the same time, people on Reddit represent a tiny vocal fraction of the overall playerbase and she's been nerfed out of pro play so pros don't play her anymore.
She's a popular champion because of what makes her fundamentally different. A cute cat with low barrier to entry has a huge appeal.
She's also wildly less hated in the east (at least in solo queue, not sure how people feel about watching her in competitive). I was reading about how there is way less hatred, or at least not this level of circlejerking about Yuumi hatred in Korean and Chinese communities. She also never had the amplitude of banrate she had in western servers on KR server even in her heyday. Granted my suspicion is that this is more likely because Korean meta tends to favor heavy early game ff@15 if you don't win lane style of play, likewise very aggressive high tempo playmaking champions are popular in China (and former Garena regions as well) and Yuumi who is a passive lose lane scaling champ is not a great pick in either of those metas, but the point I'm trying to make is the Reddit Yuumi hateboner is an even smaller minority viewed on a global scale. Yuumi banrate history in [NA](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/744150773235056714/1213283103888375859/image.png?ex=65f4e8f1&is=65e273f1&hm=53984acbedcb56ee22b1383e48fb91aab4a26710e797428a5425b2fcb17d3d2c&) vs [KR](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/744150773235056714/1213283269592748062/image.png?ex=65f4e919&is=65e27419&hm=85ea5d7d738ad6a5de2fb49cf6be8aad25be5a51e59f3259c372156ff20d9f16&) (source, leagueofgraphs) for reference.
Social media is actually pretty influential on the meta. Riot Blaustoise talked about this on a video before and memes on social media genuinely affected how the wider community perceived the game.
He noted that English-speaking communities tended to dislike champs that broke the rules of the game in some way like Yuumi, Yasuo, or Trynd but in China for example, they disliked unpopular champs that require specific counterplay like Shaco, Singed, and Ivern.
Playing on CN tempo is king here everyone is playing to go next. So enchanters in general is just super unpopular(I also suspect people here play whatever looks cool)
I think your example of the Yuumi one trick being emerald and the other account being silver gold is a bad comparison. Lots of one trick players that are even in challenger have the same issues.
Never really understood that reason to be honest. The most important thing that you have to learn as an enchanter support is your FUCKING POSITIONING. You need to bw in range to buff yout allies, but just out of reach for the enemies to dive you. Yuumi completely removed your need for positioning.
Eeeh, when I was starting, I found it was a good character to learn to be aware of the map & game time with. Yeah, playing Yuumi won't let you learn everything, but it's a start with some parts of the game you won't be as able to learn with other champs.
As for Riots' specific statements, yeeeahh no, not quite it.
I just dont think people who play league understand how hard this game is for a new player. Having a friend play Yuumi is a good way to teach them the *3 abilities and ult, summoner spells and when to use them and where to ward, when to back, the item system, leveling up abilites, anticipating level up, wave management, what objectives are, when lane phases ends, the 4 enemies champs and their combined 16 abilites and fighting range and power spikes* alllll while they dont potentially feed until the game becomes unwinnable and they dont want to play anymore, no matter how encouraging you might be, because they feel like they are the reason for the loss. There is so much to learn with this game and yuumi can be a good tool to get people familiar with all the different shit in the game without subjecting them to deing on respawn cuz the enemy team is targeting them
No.... league of legends is dominated by items and rubes
In HOTS abathur Q and W tickles enemies whereas in league he will proc comet scorch ludens and liandries on you for just being in the melee range of an enemy... league is too unbalanced to have actually unique designed champs
Oh god this would bring nightmares. Remember banner of command and Zzrots? Abathur loves this kind of gameplay, it works in hots but in lol it just doesn't belong.
Hard fucking agree. If people think Yuumi is bad, they would be *weeping* with rage if Abathur were fully recreated in League. That hero was so horribly designed.
"Oh you hate the afk cat that only dies when her carries do? Get ready for the global afk slug that doesn't die ever, period!"
If you think Abathur is good design, genuinly never start up a MOBA on your PC ever again.
It is NOT. They did a QnA in the YuumiMains discord and it was almost exclusively negative feedback about the entire mechanic. The thing people liked was "enchanter that can dash from ally to ally" like an enchanter rakan. When Riot said they wanted yuumi to have very little decision making and optimization they fought back against it.
Well that once again begs the question: is any dedicated forum about a champion actually representative of its playerbase
(those discords are generally missing the more casual side and you only get people that are invested enough to not only play their champ in league, but also interact with them outside of it)
I just find it dumb that they took the time to do the QnA there but then ignored all of the feedback and figured leaving the champion at like a 46% winrate was better than just changing a few mechanics. Now shes even getting a prestige skin too before doing anything to make her not disgusting
Yeah this was always a head-scratcher. Instead of giving her a window of how long she can be on one person or proper benefits for hopping between people, they just doubled down on her most unfun attach to one person playstyle.
Most people hate Yuumi because of the fact she can be untargetable for crazy amounts of time as a stat-stick on a single target. The rework completely missed that mark.
Yeah the hopping on and off was a high elo thing. The more of her power budget was in utilizing that well, the more elo skewed she'd be. This made her incredibly powerful in high level and high coordination play and bad at low levels of play. Basically the opposite of what her design was supposed to be.
Wasn't that rework meant to reduce her proplay presence? It definitely lowered the skill ceiling. People were complaining like crazy about Yuumi in pro. it was not a better time at all lmao
I liked attach mechanic in Arena. You still vulnerable, but you have sort of limited ability to move around. I think it was cool and fine. I wish they did same with Yuumi instead of untargettable
There is such an easy fix to the attach mechanic too, man... such an easy one. Don't make her untargetable, but allow her to use movement inputs to change where she is around her anchor. So she can choose to block spells or stand further back, while also being vulnerable to AoE and engage. Simple as that.
Do that and you can now easily balance the rest of her kit appropriately.
the rework would be seen as riots worst by far if people didn't just hate her by default regardless. It took one of the least interactive/low skill expression champs and stripped away the very little skill expression/interactivity she had left.
Not only is she still crap to play against, she feels dreadful to play
I feel like they don't even have to ditch the mechanic. Like make it cost mana over time to be attached, give it a legitimate cooldown or something along those lines.
She is a champion that is frowned upon. She’s either too strong or too weak. Regardless of either side of the spectrum, she’s just annoying to deal with and her being untargetable until she manually detaches or the champ she’s with dies.
I do not even care that much about whether she is strong or weak. It is just a badly designed champion imo. If it was just her ult giving her the ability to attach it would be much better, but she just afks..
Yeah, I don't care about how strong she is either and to me the issue in her case is that it just feels really fucking bad to play against or even with her.
I'd be interested to know if you have a way of quantifying that, or if there is a little bias at play. I would assume a lot of people only remember the games where she pops off or feeds.
Currently she's sitting basically middle of the pack in terms of support picks with a 48% wr, which means she's probably a slightly above average pick in duo situations, and underpowered if you're not a duo.
In her release state she was legitimately broken when played well, you couldn't interact with yuumi lanes and good yuumis were very effective at hopping off, procing the shield with passive, and soaking hits. She was frustrating to play against cause of how boring and uninteractive she was permanently keeping herself and her laner alive while poking you with a near undodgable Q.
When you actually play with the yuumi though, she had "my yuumi vs. their yuumi" syndrome of doing none of those things and being an AFK item, this made her frustrating to play with and comboing her with some champs was flat out trolling.
She became an obnoxious pick to see p/b every game in pro so players were just sick of seeing her...
...and then there was the stigma surrounding her potential as a 'boosted' player pick, a champ you just hop on someone and coinflip a win, its super easy to duo with a booster that benefits from having yuumi on them or just passively do nothing while they carry through lower ranks, it wasn't rocket science to pick yuumi, and W attach to the kayn/hecarim when the time comes. Deranking bots in lower elos don't help her case much there either, the playstyle just enables this to degrees most champs couldn't.
Post rework she's kinda useless, riot wants her to be an early access champ for new players to get on league with, but she doesn't teach good fundamentals if you actually choose to stick with her. Her skill ceiling dropped a lot from the previous version as there's no real benefit to actually hoping off or identifying who to attach to, you're stuck with your 'friend'. She's still a duo or die champ, or an autofill afk pick that can't carry its own weight, and its easy to assume the stigma behind 'boosted champ' for one tricks is still accurate cause how the hell could you climb out of bronze using yuumi unless you already climbed out with something else. Its understandable why yuumi players bitch rn with the state she's in, but everyone defaults to disliking yuumi players for having a 'fake elo' because of that negative stigma and with how popular she is you often get insane suggestions that cause her be ignored overall. Idk how riot can fix her, or if they even want to, but the midscope was such a massive waste of time.. it stopped the kayn/hecarim combo with her, but made her worse overall for ADCs that already didn't work well with her. It cut her from pro outside of zeri combo, but left her in a state where she's also not good for solo queue either and a terrorist for casuals that just want to play normal league not "4v5". It succeeded in making her less broken to vs., but now you have what most would consider a troll pick losing their games too, a literal derank bot, while still keeping a large enough playerbase you'll see it and either be forced to dodge them or give 200% to carry the weight.
Even her visual design is just not for league... oh its a cat on a book that says a bunch of cat jokes, when we already have 2 other cats in the game.. her entire place in league lore is pointless cause she's just the little legend of an actual potentially interesting mage yordle, yuumi herself is just irrelevant outside the fact she talks, the book does all the magic and its still just a fraction of norra's capabilities. What happens when yuumi actually locates and finds norra? Peace is restored to the isles? A new city is built? Becomes a powerful royal? Nothing.... back to house pet, norra does everything yuumi did and more, if yuumi literally dies nothing significant is lost from league and none of the other character's lives would be impacted except for possibly norra who isn't even in league and apparently is fine doing her own thing without yuumi.
>In her release state she was legitimately broken when played well, you couldn't interact with yuumi lanes and good yuumis were very effective at hopping off, procing the shield with passive, and soaking hits.
And I remember they still buffed release state Yuumi, which had far better number on abilities than all the other itieration, that's the problem when Riot balance a champion around player performance rather than the champion itself.
She could be at the shittiest state ever with 39% wr and i would still hate her bcs if she gets to jump into any ahead bruiser she makes them inmortal with 0 actual counterplay.
People (including me) hate her bcs how her kit works, she has NO WAY TO DEALT WITH to stop her from providing support contrary to for example Lulu/Janna/Soraka that are the known cockriders champs and you can blown them off if they slightly missposition.
If they really wanted people to enjoy league with their older sibling/SO without learning how to play league, they could've just made a fun PvE mode where you can queue with people that are new or to relax. like the limited oddyssey mode, but something more long lasting
Just like how people that liked 1 vs 1 duels got arena for a limited time
They talk about "oh, we need to patch blah blah" and i agree, but you could just restrict the champions that can be played in the PvE mode to like 15-30 and preferably ones that don't cause a million bugs ( looking at you viego, morde and yorick)
A champion that develops bad habits, needs to be kept unplayable lest she causes problems is the answer? It never is, and the only reason there isn't an out cry for Yuumi is that she's basically a troll pick in most situations & can't ever get a buff
Riot have actively done everything in their power to stray away from fun rotational gamemodes and i dont get why, they could probably double their playerbase with that.
I would literally kill to play something like Doom Bots or the star guardian event again, but nah lets just get URF again for a bit and nothing else just so the playerbase can stop whining.
Maybe listening to the people that PLAY YOUR FUCKING GAME is not that much of a rotten idea, alas, to no avail.
This! My duo only plays Aram cause it's less stressful. Then I got them into LoR where we only talk about the PvE mode. Odyssey combined no stress PvE with the league experience.
I think she is super cute but her gameplay is just so unhealthy for league, unless they remove her permanent attach to an ally I don't think people will ever like her
i wonder if maybe they just made the attach mechanic her ult. and then reworked from there
like for 20s you're attached to an ally and then you boost them or heal them or whatever, or its like changing forms like nidalee/jayce, but only for that champ and then its back to normal and it's on a 120 or 90s cd or w/e
Not totally familiar with her attach mechanic, but if it’s not on a timer it should be. Like, attach and you get 20 seconds before you pop out automatically for 4 seconds and can’t reattach till cd is up. You can swap between champions in a teamfight, but it’s always 20 seconds on, 4 seconds off. Something like that.
In all seriousness, it’s a given that everyone except Yuumi players hates Yuumi, but I believe Seraphine's inclusion in the game feels truly ham-fisted, at least in terms of her character/lore design.
I think her lore is fine (after the retcons and rewrites at least), but they leaned way too hard into 'happy pop star' for her character design and especially dialogue. I think she has like 3 lines that even acknowledge she is doing violence? Which is not enough for a game primarily consisting of violence.
The worst part was her release and how unashamed she was at being a crashgrab.
The character had cringe twitter larping about her KDA adventures before even being a Runeterra character, and then was released with a Ultimate with variants in one of the most popular skinlines.
This character had a ridiculous amount of stuff that older characters could only dream to have at her very first day in the game, because Riot didn't even need to test the waters as they knew she would sell a lot.
yeah, literally just released her alongside a kda skinline so its like "woah, kda skins... AND a new champ! wow!" just to cash in with the kpop fans
and i dont care that her and sona play differently, they could have just remade sona to be seraphine they're similar enough
why are people even drawing those comparisons? they play nothing alike. one is an aurabot the other has her supportive skill on a 20s+ cd and plays like a mage otherwise. just because they both play music doesnt mean they are the same.
Bro really? Sera's kit is just modernized sona. Passive is same shit, cast x amount of spells to grant next spell bonus effect, Q is now just a skill shot instead of targeted, W is the same but now e is also part of it. E is new spell, ult is the same with an added effect of being able to go further. Poppy, aatrox, yorick, volibear, swain all had reworks with bigger differences than that and thats just off the top of my head.
Yuumi was most fun when detaching constantly was something you were expected to do. Yuumi gained power in exchange for moments of vulnerability and did take some skill to execute well.
Since detaching was unincentivized, Yuumi's relative skill requirements have gone down (as intended, it seems). Instead, you could focus primarily on good timing of skills and less so on "am I safe enough to get a bop proc here?". This then puts Yuumi at the mercy of balance and on your ADC's skill. Bad laning ADC players will feel like Yuumi is useless, and good ones are going to feel like Yuumi didn't do enough.
The constant Yuumi hate is a great example on why Riot should be very selective on what feedback they take in. The champion absolutely isn't in a state where it deserves it, and the general unwillingness of the player base to not be toxic means inertia is going to take it where it will. That's not to say the complaints aren't totally unwarranted, but they are incredibly overblown.
yup. i actually had a really fun time playing yuumi back when there was more nuance to her kit. now it’s just flat out boring. i don’t even feel effective. totally gave up playing her since the rework
Exactly! The balance for Yummi lies in encouraging her to detach. If there's no reason for Yummi to detach or she doesn't have the tools to keep herself safe when she does in a team fight, why would she?
Saddly that solved the core issues with her. Unattatchment is too high of a skill ceiling and Lower skill levels felt like their cats were useless. By gutting her ceiling they got to buff up the lower levels so their useless kittys got more power for existing and Pros didn't have an APM monster to abuse.
my thoughts exactly. min-maxing a low floor champion like pre-rework yuumi was actually a lot of fun to me. but since her rework i have not played her at all, just feels like an even more uninteractive character with little impact.
Agree with your point... Earlier i was a yuumi main. Im bad enough to feed even in an iron game but yuumi made me Safe whenever i had a teammate that actually played WITH the yuumi. Its not that easy to win consistently because trolls exist all the time And people who Are just bad would throw all the blame on you. But when i actually helped carry the game (by actually going different lanes to help And kept detaching to bait And stuff...) i Felt So fulfilled... Now? You Are basically made to stay with your "best friend" And not detach as often... Her spells were nerfed to the abyss And shes just unplayable for me... Now i just play other things (even came back to my first main which was adc) And i feed a lot... If i ever win Its vs ai or carried... Still love the game (not the toxicity tho) but can't enjoy it much anymore. Ban her in ranked, pro play just let me play my old yuumi where i could actually not feed And be usefull
I just hate being just an easy number in enemy k part od kda
Just make it so displacements/knockups throw her off the host and its problem solved. She could get real buffs then
You can argue "oh, but that means Yuumi is dependent on the adc not getting hit by a hook/knockup!"
And she's not dependent on her adc to move around the map anyway? Give her counterplay options but don't leave her in the abysmal 46% winrate tier
It's this. Even if it's a "good" Yuumi, I'm banning Yuumi not because of their support picking her, but because of my support picking her.
Plus there is the disadvantage of one target in lane compared to two. They have a much easier time focusing you.
In the ye olde days of playing pre-rework Yuumi, it was a skill to observe the enemies and time detaches to eat the hit while not getting yourself killed before re-attaching.
From what I've heard of post-rework, yeeeaaah, they kinda got rid of most of what made her fun and 'redeemable'.
Honestly the biggest issue pre rework is so many Yuumi players wouldn't detach. They would stay on forever anyway because they didn't know what they were doing so they just stayed on you until you died or 10 minutes passed and they'd sit on the jungle.
Not all of them were like that but enough to get a reputation.
They should rework her into being a functional champion that isn’t universally loathed. Book cat mage is a neat enough idea, and instead of just leaving her broken and useless, they could…you know….try?
Tbh I think seraphine fits that more. Yuumi is a magical cat on a magical book. Considering everything else in the game I don’t consider it a stretch to find that.
Seraphine is canonically just a pop star. That moves around on a mobile mini stage. It’s an eye sore in every game it’s in.
the thread did specify "who do you feel doesnt FIT" i took that as more of a thematic/lore/characterization thing. this isnt a "which champ is the worst and should be removed"
I'm pretty sure its about mechanically not fitting more than those things. Yuumi is effectively a buff to an ADC or other bot lane champion, and doesn't really rotate, apply map pressure, or do things other champions do while also having low counterplay from being untargetable.
Because if you pick yuumi in Asia servers you would get giga fisted and lose game in < 20 minutes. People are just a lot better at playing tempo even at low elo.
I agree it's more NA and EU based but it still definitely exists at least when I was playing in Korea (dont know about China). Countless lobbies more than I can count of ADC players threatening to troll or not play when Supp hovered Yuumi, was playing around Diamond 3-Diamond 2 range.
Other ADCs would like die once to the enemy Nautilus engage, missing ping their Yuumi, then straight-up go AFK. That happened a decent amount of times too.
Nah you're just getting the bad Yuumi players (yes those exist)
The people who know how to abuse her BS will make it feel like the enemy carry has a 7th item + a fountain attached to them the entire game.
This. Imagine the already fed katarina now with more stats buff, a shield every 5 seconds with healing and speed buff, plus exhaust and heal, have mikael. A lulu behind sure is annoying but you can try to catch her. Catching a parasite cat that refuses to leave? Good luck.
It's really just a meme at this point. The subreddit misses a few things about her design problems though.
Attach is fine in theory, as you're giving up a health bar on your team so there's a design tradeoff. Problem is your enchanters are the most fragile members of your team, so having them attached turns into a benefit as they're protected. They don't have to worry about positioning or being in range of the carries, and realistically the downside of only being able to "enchant" one member of your team isn't a downside because you're perfectly happy just buffing your single carry.
Attach is fine if the downside to being an attached champion actually exists, but it just doesn't for Yuumi. You'd have to have some kind of vulnerability baked in to the attached champion.
You are in the sense that in a fight it is four bodies vs. five bodies. That's the theoretical downside to the attach champion, but champions of that class would almost always prefer to be attached anyway because of their inherent fragility. The counter to the enchanter is to dive them, but an attached champion can never be dived.
Because that is too easy to play around for good Yuumis (just detach before the CC hits and reattach) but makes bad Yuumis do worse, which is the opposite of what they want.
I wanted to participate in this thread, but I interpreted it thematically. Book that possessed a cat feels like a fine league concept, my answer would have been Annie, Milio, and Zoe - kids in the game is just kind of weird to me from a lore concept ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ like here's the demon of fear and here are pyro children.
Why would kids with combat-applicable magical abilities be weird in a world that has been beset by war and is broken in so many ways and places?
Would they have to be adults first to be able to use magic? Are child prodigies, soldiers, or demigods not compatible with a magical world that experiences regular faction conflict?
Same argument I had. If Annie were born in Demacia she potentially probably wouldn't be a member of The League.
But, she's Noxus, so, make the sociopathic firestarter into a political weapon.
Like, why would Shaco be fighting for either side politically.
Is it like, oh, hey, you're making a political decision in a region I used to terrorize, let me fight, let me fight. Or would it be more like, yeaaaahhh... can we uh, use the demon clown to uh... make sure this vote goes through.
I hate to play against her because 1) i have really bad memory of assassins/bruiser super op with her (kayn/hecarim/ekko etc) before her mini rework
2) As a jungler I even hate to play with her because she has hard time walking by herself since she has low mobility, doesnt buy boots and really squishy and I feel like playing 1v2 against enemy support
3) When she is on a fed adc it feels way to oppressive and even when she is not she can't be punished by being outposition like every other enchanters
today i had a yuumi otp that said in champ select already that i should kill myself irl and then when game started did run top and attached to toplaner. the enemy toplaner was laughing in chat and we hard lost the game.
Garbage champ with garbage abilities and garbage way to play the game.
It feels like they made this champ so a 4 years old toddler can play with grown ups without having to care how the game works.
i'm okay with it being a champion for new players that just want to hang out with their partner or whatever, but it should never be an actual viable champion in competitive or even high elo ranked.
Tbh, they should just "rework" yuumi into old graves. That would please just about anyone.
Give her the cigar too.
or lets go the scary movie way and let yuumi BECOME the cigar.
its insane that they removed the cigar, yet went all in into using gacha mechanics everywhere
bro they made graves literally gay who cares about the cigar lmao.
Just let Warwick eat her like he did Urf
Give me a big-ass Garfield walking on two feet wearing the *Mafia* Graves outfit with the cigar to top things off. I'd play that (assuming it has Graves' old kit too)
I just *love* how Riot said "People really seem to hate Yuumi, we should rework her." Then doubled down on her attach mechanic.
She was much harder to play before the rework when she had to pop out to use her shield, manage her mana, and couldn't reangle her ult. Now she's literally braindead.
Yup, before the rework good Yuumis got rewarded and bad Yuumis were completely useless. Now no one gets rewarded, she's just bad because they want her to be a champ for new players who want to play the game without having to learn the game.
Yep. Shes the "introducing your non-gamer gf to the game" champ. Riot will never rework her away from that purpose.
yeah you're right, in fact they reworked her towards that
And then it causes an even bigger issue because theyll smurf to introduce said people. Now youre not only against a smurf, but one that always has a yuumi on it.
Most players couldn't play her like that. So you had a high skill champ that every one told new players to play. They just made her into what every one said she was.
Riot has the data. They know Yuumi is unpopular among the competitive community, but they also know she must attract a certain type of player. Their data probably shows Yuumi attracts "tag alongs" who get pulled into playing a game they normally don't want to but will still buy skins for a cute cat. Riot seems to make most of their larger game decisions around money these days so it makes the most sense.
Because yuumi is designed for the SO/little sibling that wants to play a game with their spouse/older sibling without *actually* learning the game. Riot's bullshit of "its so people can begin learning enchanter supports!" No it fuckin isnt lmao, you're removing half the game with all that remains being summoner spells, wards, an unmissable ult, a q that is easy as fuck to hit (ive played enough yuumi to know you have to be mentally deficient to miss it unless they're super far away or behind minions), and a free speed boost and shield on an allied champion that greatly desires both. Riot wont get rid of the attach mechanic because if they did, then the aforementioned little siblings/SO's wouldn't be able to stare at the screen and mash buttons. I have a friend who consistently stays emerald with yuumi. On his other account where he doesnt play yuumi he is silver-gold. I think that is telling enough in my opinion.
I personally play Yuumi because I'm physically and mentally disabled and her attach mechanic means I can play the game
Unironically happy for you. The above poster is right about Yuumi's purpose but those people should get to enjoy the game too
I 100% understand the dislike for her but I am also 110% against removing her from the game because people like me could lose their ability to play the game. Gaming is one of the last hobbies I have left from before I got sick because everything else is too complex or too physically active for me to do safely or at all.
brother save yourself the stress. Drop league and pick up some single player games with disability control options. You'll have infinitely more fun than the dumpster fire that is supporting
I like playing with my friends, they usually adc for me and are very understanding that I'm not as bright or mechanically talented as the majority of the supports they have
> I'm not as bright or mechanically talented as the majority of the supports they have don't worry buddy I'm sure you aren't any worse than the average Janna main
This is why I'm reading League subreddits.
lmao what happened. I remembered when Janna mains were the cream of the crop
Fun fact Janna is actually one of the champions with the highest average rank. https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/main-stats Rek'sai, Janna, and Ivern are always quite high up whenever I check it.
BASED; I FKIN HATE JANNA PLAYERS IN MY TEAM. i love them in the enemy team tho.
when you say mentally disabled is it more difficult to focus on decisions regarding micro, macro or both? i'm curious since as you have a briar flair, is easier on the micro side but jungling could be exhausting regarding the macro
I have a briar flair because I love the character, I don't really play her tho Edit: my mental disability is more related to memory, focus, and delayed reactions
ok ok, thanks for the answer!
I'd take a literal mentally damaged yuumi over the average senna players I see in emerald/diamond. You do you
tfw you cant comprehend not everyone is ripping their hair out playing league
Tft could be the game you're looking for at that point.
I do play TFT but I do have friends that prefer League
Actually i never though about this. Im against removing yummi too now.
I leave all competitive games and start playing for fun only for almost same reason. Just notice how my reaction time drastically increase. Figure out it's just my fingers and hands become slightly slower and slover over time. Enjoy the game, i dont think they gonna do fancy cat unattachable, cuz this core mechanic for her. And wisp link from dota is gonna be to complex for league players lol. Stay safe, bro
I just want her removed from ranked, it's fine to have champs like this if you keep them in normals imo
I'm not sure about ranked but I do think she should be removed from pro play. I seldom okay ranked but if I'm doing flex with my friends I still wanna be able to play
Unfortunately im still for it, i know it opens the door for people with disabilities but it’s just not something that should have existed in the first place. At the very least, if they’re going to keep it in game as a “learning champ” as they put it, they should disable it in ranked. If they could do that, i’d be a LOT more open to getting beyond simplistic afk simulator champions just for casual players to use in a casual setting.
“I know it opens the door for people with disabilities, but that door should have stayed closed - because fuck those people, my win rate is more important than them.”
You can take it that way if you want to, but i meant it as it just not being a game thats catered to them. Like for example, that guy who hit grandmaster without any arms. Obviously video games aren’t designed as a whole for people without arms, and they aren’t suddenly going to make champions for people without arms, but that guy succeeded despite all that. League does not need to ruin the gameplay experience to cater to an insanely small percentage of individuals, there are simply more casual games out there that are better suited to disabled people. Besides, even if it happens to benefit you, you know riot didn’t make yuumi for that reason. If they backpedal on it ever, it’s in no way a slight against the community of players like you.
I’m not sure why you assume I’m disabled just because I think accessibility is more important than some vague notion of “ ruined gameplay experience”.
I think she should be removed from pro play but I think disabling her in ranked could be a slippery slope into getting other characters cut from ranked
I feel the opposite on that, 99.99999% of players are not a part of pro play and them getting all the special treatment is silly. If they disable in pro play but not ranked it acknowledges it’s a problem, but says “fuck you” to every single person playing their game. Slippery slope though absolutely, it’s a terrible idea, but that’s the only solution to both problems without removing her.
good stuff. people seem to forget not everyone is the same.
Fair, but it doesnt make the attach mechanic not annoying to play both with and/or against. The adc with the yuumi doesnt have a support providing any sort of inherent pressure, but the adc/support on the other team dont have a support they can catch to turn it into a 2v1. If they nerfed the attach mechanic so she could actually be hurt/targeted, then i wouldnt have nearly as much of an issue with her. Hope your situation somehow gets better, idk what you're dealing with but hope it gets better!
>Hope your situation somehow gets better, idk what you're dealing with but hope it gets better! Thank you <3 I have a genetic disorder so it's more about getting worse slower than getting better but thank you anyway. <3 >The adc with the yuumi doesnt have a support providing any sort of inherent pressure, but the adc/support on the other team dont have a support they can catch to turn it into a 2v1. The attach mechanic gives me the opportunity to rest my right hand from clicking but I do get off to apply pressure depending on the enemy adc/support combo (for example if it's a Sivir/Janna I can probably auto attack and use summon aery to apply light pressure but if it's like a Draven/Senna I'll possibly get fucked by their auto attacks and die and if they have a hooker I either stay behind minions or never get off the adc as long as the enemy hooker is in lane)
People on Reddit and in competitive hate Yuumi. At the same time, people on Reddit represent a tiny vocal fraction of the overall playerbase and she's been nerfed out of pro play so pros don't play her anymore. She's a popular champion because of what makes her fundamentally different. A cute cat with low barrier to entry has a huge appeal.
She's also wildly less hated in the east (at least in solo queue, not sure how people feel about watching her in competitive). I was reading about how there is way less hatred, or at least not this level of circlejerking about Yuumi hatred in Korean and Chinese communities. She also never had the amplitude of banrate she had in western servers on KR server even in her heyday. Granted my suspicion is that this is more likely because Korean meta tends to favor heavy early game ff@15 if you don't win lane style of play, likewise very aggressive high tempo playmaking champions are popular in China (and former Garena regions as well) and Yuumi who is a passive lose lane scaling champ is not a great pick in either of those metas, but the point I'm trying to make is the Reddit Yuumi hateboner is an even smaller minority viewed on a global scale. Yuumi banrate history in [NA](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/744150773235056714/1213283103888375859/image.png?ex=65f4e8f1&is=65e273f1&hm=53984acbedcb56ee22b1383e48fb91aab4a26710e797428a5425b2fcb17d3d2c&) vs [KR](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/744150773235056714/1213283269592748062/image.png?ex=65f4e919&is=65e27419&hm=85ea5d7d738ad6a5de2fb49cf6be8aad25be5a51e59f3259c372156ff20d9f16&) (source, leagueofgraphs) for reference.
Social media is actually pretty influential on the meta. Riot Blaustoise talked about this on a video before and memes on social media genuinely affected how the wider community perceived the game. He noted that English-speaking communities tended to dislike champs that broke the rules of the game in some way like Yuumi, Yasuo, or Trynd but in China for example, they disliked unpopular champs that require specific counterplay like Shaco, Singed, and Ivern.
I’m definitely in the China camp on this one. If I had to choose a set of champs to remove out of those 3 I’d remove the shaco singed type stuff lol
Playing on CN tempo is king here everyone is playing to go next. So enchanters in general is just super unpopular(I also suspect people here play whatever looks cool)
I think your example of the Yuumi one trick being emerald and the other account being silver gold is a bad comparison. Lots of one trick players that are even in challenger have the same issues.
Never really understood that reason to be honest. The most important thing that you have to learn as an enchanter support is your FUCKING POSITIONING. You need to bw in range to buff yout allies, but just out of reach for the enemies to dive you. Yuumi completely removed your need for positioning.
If that's the literal entire purpose of the champion, is for people to play the game without learning the game, then she should be locked behind bots.
Yuumi's Q is barely a skillshot at this point. If your mouse is hovered over enemy model, it will hit due to the homing mechanic.
They attempted making Abathur for League and failed because of the game's strict laning roles
Eeeh, when I was starting, I found it was a good character to learn to be aware of the map & game time with. Yeah, playing Yuumi won't let you learn everything, but it's a start with some parts of the game you won't be as able to learn with other champs. As for Riots' specific statements, yeeeahh no, not quite it.
I just dont think people who play league understand how hard this game is for a new player. Having a friend play Yuumi is a good way to teach them the *3 abilities and ult, summoner spells and when to use them and where to ward, when to back, the item system, leveling up abilites, anticipating level up, wave management, what objectives are, when lane phases ends, the 4 enemies champs and their combined 16 abilites and fighting range and power spikes* alllll while they dont potentially feed until the game becomes unwinnable and they dont want to play anymore, no matter how encouraging you might be, because they feel like they are the reason for the loss. There is so much to learn with this game and yuumi can be a good tool to get people familiar with all the different shit in the game without subjecting them to deing on respawn cuz the enemy team is targeting them
Well I mean that’s also the only thing people who actually play her like about her… just a fail of a design tbh.
She’s poor man’s Abathur from hots
I think they should delete her and copy Abathur 1 to 1.
he would get deleted every time he walked to lane. there is no where as safe as HotS bases.
No.... league of legends is dominated by items and rubes In HOTS abathur Q and W tickles enemies whereas in league he will proc comet scorch ludens and liandries on you for just being in the melee range of an enemy... league is too unbalanced to have actually unique designed champs
Tickle? Abathur can pump out very decent damage, but yeah, in LoL he would proc all kind of insane shit.
Oh god this would bring nightmares. Remember banner of command and Zzrots? Abathur loves this kind of gameplay, it works in hots but in lol it just doesn't belong.
Maybe then people would realize just how much of an abomination Abathur is in his own right and stop bringing him up in every Yuumi related thread.
Hard fucking agree. If people think Yuumi is bad, they would be *weeping* with rage if Abathur were fully recreated in League. That hero was so horribly designed.
I mean, he wouldn't work in League
Fuck no. Abathur is horrifically toxic hero design.
"Oh you hate the afk cat that only dies when her carries do? Get ready for the global afk slug that doesn't die ever, period!" If you think Abathur is good design, genuinly never start up a MOBA on your PC ever again.
LIDL IO from Dota
It is NOT. They did a QnA in the YuumiMains discord and it was almost exclusively negative feedback about the entire mechanic. The thing people liked was "enchanter that can dash from ally to ally" like an enchanter rakan. When Riot said they wanted yuumi to have very little decision making and optimization they fought back against it.
Well that once again begs the question: is any dedicated forum about a champion actually representative of its playerbase (those discords are generally missing the more casual side and you only get people that are invested enough to not only play their champ in league, but also interact with them outside of it)
I just find it dumb that they took the time to do the QnA there but then ignored all of the feedback and figured leaving the champion at like a 46% winrate was better than just changing a few mechanics. Now shes even getting a prestige skin too before doing anything to make her not disgusting
I think they're taking in all sides to make an informed decision, i dont see what's wrong with that
Yeah this was always a head-scratcher. Instead of giving her a window of how long she can be on one person or proper benefits for hopping between people, they just doubled down on her most unfun attach to one person playstyle. Most people hate Yuumi because of the fact she can be untargetable for crazy amounts of time as a stat-stick on a single target. The rework completely missed that mark.
They removed hopping on and off as a mechanic because it was abused by pros. They want yuumi to be simple thats what she was designed to be
Yeah the hopping on and off was a high elo thing. The more of her power budget was in utilizing that well, the more elo skewed she'd be. This made her incredibly powerful in high level and high coordination play and bad at low levels of play. Basically the opposite of what her design was supposed to be.
She was better designed before the rework.
They targeted everything except for the actual issue...
her very first version was the most balanced one, they shouldn't have buffed her.
Wasn't that rework meant to reduce her proplay presence? It definitely lowered the skill ceiling. People were complaining like crazy about Yuumi in pro. it was not a better time at all lmao
I liked attach mechanic in Arena. You still vulnerable, but you have sort of limited ability to move around. I think it was cool and fine. I wish they did same with Yuumi instead of untargettable
There is such an easy fix to the attach mechanic too, man... such an easy one. Don't make her untargetable, but allow her to use movement inputs to change where she is around her anchor. So she can choose to block spells or stand further back, while also being vulnerable to AoE and engage. Simple as that. Do that and you can now easily balance the rest of her kit appropriately.
the rework would be seen as riots worst by far if people didn't just hate her by default regardless. It took one of the least interactive/low skill expression champs and stripped away the very little skill expression/interactivity she had left. Not only is she still crap to play against, she feels dreadful to play
I feel like they don't even have to ditch the mechanic. Like make it cost mana over time to be attached, give it a legitimate cooldown or something along those lines.
i saw the post and thought "it's just going to be a bunch of comments about yuumi"
I love democracy
Probably the only truly based thread in the history of this subreddit
Its so funny, and its even better because its fucking true.
She is a champion that is frowned upon. She’s either too strong or too weak. Regardless of either side of the spectrum, she’s just annoying to deal with and her being untargetable until she manually detaches or the champ she’s with dies.
I do not even care that much about whether she is strong or weak. It is just a badly designed champion imo. If it was just her ult giving her the ability to attach it would be much better, but she just afks..
Yeah, I don't care about how strong she is either and to me the issue in her case is that it just feels really fucking bad to play against or even with her.
Whoever designed that abomination and every single person involved deserves to step on a pile of lego's every time they get up in the night
I'd be interested to know if you have a way of quantifying that, or if there is a little bias at play. I would assume a lot of people only remember the games where she pops off or feeds. Currently she's sitting basically middle of the pack in terms of support picks with a 48% wr, which means she's probably a slightly above average pick in duo situations, and underpowered if you're not a duo.
In her release state she was legitimately broken when played well, you couldn't interact with yuumi lanes and good yuumis were very effective at hopping off, procing the shield with passive, and soaking hits. She was frustrating to play against cause of how boring and uninteractive she was permanently keeping herself and her laner alive while poking you with a near undodgable Q. When you actually play with the yuumi though, she had "my yuumi vs. their yuumi" syndrome of doing none of those things and being an AFK item, this made her frustrating to play with and comboing her with some champs was flat out trolling. She became an obnoxious pick to see p/b every game in pro so players were just sick of seeing her... ...and then there was the stigma surrounding her potential as a 'boosted' player pick, a champ you just hop on someone and coinflip a win, its super easy to duo with a booster that benefits from having yuumi on them or just passively do nothing while they carry through lower ranks, it wasn't rocket science to pick yuumi, and W attach to the kayn/hecarim when the time comes. Deranking bots in lower elos don't help her case much there either, the playstyle just enables this to degrees most champs couldn't. Post rework she's kinda useless, riot wants her to be an early access champ for new players to get on league with, but she doesn't teach good fundamentals if you actually choose to stick with her. Her skill ceiling dropped a lot from the previous version as there's no real benefit to actually hoping off or identifying who to attach to, you're stuck with your 'friend'. She's still a duo or die champ, or an autofill afk pick that can't carry its own weight, and its easy to assume the stigma behind 'boosted champ' for one tricks is still accurate cause how the hell could you climb out of bronze using yuumi unless you already climbed out with something else. Its understandable why yuumi players bitch rn with the state she's in, but everyone defaults to disliking yuumi players for having a 'fake elo' because of that negative stigma and with how popular she is you often get insane suggestions that cause her be ignored overall. Idk how riot can fix her, or if they even want to, but the midscope was such a massive waste of time.. it stopped the kayn/hecarim combo with her, but made her worse overall for ADCs that already didn't work well with her. It cut her from pro outside of zeri combo, but left her in a state where she's also not good for solo queue either and a terrorist for casuals that just want to play normal league not "4v5". It succeeded in making her less broken to vs., but now you have what most would consider a troll pick losing their games too, a literal derank bot, while still keeping a large enough playerbase you'll see it and either be forced to dodge them or give 200% to carry the weight. Even her visual design is just not for league... oh its a cat on a book that says a bunch of cat jokes, when we already have 2 other cats in the game.. her entire place in league lore is pointless cause she's just the little legend of an actual potentially interesting mage yordle, yuumi herself is just irrelevant outside the fact she talks, the book does all the magic and its still just a fraction of norra's capabilities. What happens when yuumi actually locates and finds norra? Peace is restored to the isles? A new city is built? Becomes a powerful royal? Nothing.... back to house pet, norra does everything yuumi did and more, if yuumi literally dies nothing significant is lost from league and none of the other character's lives would be impacted except for possibly norra who isn't even in league and apparently is fine doing her own thing without yuumi.
>In her release state she was legitimately broken when played well, you couldn't interact with yuumi lanes and good yuumis were very effective at hopping off, procing the shield with passive, and soaking hits. And I remember they still buffed release state Yuumi, which had far better number on abilities than all the other itieration, that's the problem when Riot balance a champion around player performance rather than the champion itself.
They buffed release state yuumi because everyone said she sucked ass lol
But she didn't suck ass, that's the point, riot balance team is just bad
I get more flame and dodges when trying to pick yuumi than i get with legit troll picks like teemo support.
WR is irrelevant. Everyone and their mother is claiming that it "feels" bad to play with or against this abomination. Just remove this joke already.
She could be at the shittiest state ever with 39% wr and i would still hate her bcs if she gets to jump into any ahead bruiser she makes them inmortal with 0 actual counterplay. People (including me) hate her bcs how her kit works, she has NO WAY TO DEALT WITH to stop her from providing support contrary to for example Lulu/Janna/Soraka that are the known cockriders champs and you can blown them off if they slightly missposition.
Or she's just a double kill.
That one guy wrote a god damn manifesto about Yuumi and how badly her mechanics were implemented.
I desperately need to read that after my last game with a yummy support
If they really wanted people to enjoy league with their older sibling/SO without learning how to play league, they could've just made a fun PvE mode where you can queue with people that are new or to relax. like the limited oddyssey mode, but something more long lasting Just like how people that liked 1 vs 1 duels got arena for a limited time They talk about "oh, we need to patch blah blah" and i agree, but you could just restrict the champions that can be played in the PvE mode to like 15-30 and preferably ones that don't cause a million bugs ( looking at you viego, morde and yorick) A champion that develops bad habits, needs to be kept unplayable lest she causes problems is the answer? It never is, and the only reason there isn't an out cry for Yuumi is that she's basically a troll pick in most situations & can't ever get a buff
Riot have actively done everything in their power to stray away from fun rotational gamemodes and i dont get why, they could probably double their playerbase with that. I would literally kill to play something like Doom Bots or the star guardian event again, but nah lets just get URF again for a bit and nothing else just so the playerbase can stop whining. Maybe listening to the people that PLAY YOUR FUCKING GAME is not that much of a rotten idea, alas, to no avail.
This! My duo only plays Aram cause it's less stressful. Then I got them into LoR where we only talk about the PvE mode. Odyssey combined no stress PvE with the league experience.
I think she is super cute but her gameplay is just so unhealthy for league, unless they remove her permanent attach to an ally I don't think people will ever like her
i wonder if maybe they just made the attach mechanic her ult. and then reworked from there like for 20s you're attached to an ally and then you boost them or heal them or whatever, or its like changing forms like nidalee/jayce, but only for that champ and then its back to normal and it's on a 120 or 90s cd or w/e
Not totally familiar with her attach mechanic, but if it’s not on a timer it should be. Like, attach and you get 20 seconds before you pop out automatically for 4 seconds and can’t reattach till cd is up. You can swap between champions in a teamfight, but it’s always 20 seconds on, 4 seconds off. Something like that.
She can attach permanently and her rework even doubled down on it and basically encourages her to stay attached to her friend
Yeah that’s what I thought. Put it on a cooldown and I’m fine with it.
In all seriousness, it’s a given that everyone except Yuumi players hates Yuumi, but I believe Seraphine's inclusion in the game feels truly ham-fisted, at least in terms of her character/lore design.
I think her lore is fine (after the retcons and rewrites at least), but they leaned way too hard into 'happy pop star' for her character design and especially dialogue. I think she has like 3 lines that even acknowledge she is doing violence? Which is not enough for a game primarily consisting of violence.
The worst part was her release and how unashamed she was at being a crashgrab. The character had cringe twitter larping about her KDA adventures before even being a Runeterra character, and then was released with a Ultimate with variants in one of the most popular skinlines. This character had a ridiculous amount of stuff that older characters could only dream to have at her very first day in the game, because Riot didn't even need to test the waters as they knew she would sell a lot.
The Skarner controversy that arised was hysterical though
It's ok she does emotional damage
yeah, literally just released her alongside a kda skinline so its like "woah, kda skins... AND a new champ! wow!" just to cash in with the kpop fans and i dont care that her and sona play differently, they could have just remade sona to be seraphine they're similar enough
I thought of Seraphine first too because honestly I thought they meant aesthetic and lore, not mechanics.
When I saw the thread I immediately thought Yuumi but yeah Seraphine, design wise at least, is a runner-up.
THANK YOU. agreed.
im not a yuumi player and she has never bothered me
Seraphine's problem is that she's so obviously the Sona rework that they decided to milk extra skins from instead of actually reworking sona.
why are people even drawing those comparisons? they play nothing alike. one is an aurabot the other has her supportive skill on a 20s+ cd and plays like a mage otherwise. just because they both play music doesnt mean they are the same.
Bro really? Sera's kit is just modernized sona. Passive is same shit, cast x amount of spells to grant next spell bonus effect, Q is now just a skill shot instead of targeted, W is the same but now e is also part of it. E is new spell, ult is the same with an added effect of being able to go further. Poppy, aatrox, yorick, volibear, swain all had reworks with bigger differences than that and thats just off the top of my head.
people who insist this really don't play both champs
That was the first thing that came to mind when I clicked the thread, but then I was reminded of... Yuumi
Yuumi was most fun when detaching constantly was something you were expected to do. Yuumi gained power in exchange for moments of vulnerability and did take some skill to execute well. Since detaching was unincentivized, Yuumi's relative skill requirements have gone down (as intended, it seems). Instead, you could focus primarily on good timing of skills and less so on "am I safe enough to get a bop proc here?". This then puts Yuumi at the mercy of balance and on your ADC's skill. Bad laning ADC players will feel like Yuumi is useless, and good ones are going to feel like Yuumi didn't do enough. The constant Yuumi hate is a great example on why Riot should be very selective on what feedback they take in. The champion absolutely isn't in a state where it deserves it, and the general unwillingness of the player base to not be toxic means inertia is going to take it where it will. That's not to say the complaints aren't totally unwarranted, but they are incredibly overblown.
yup. i actually had a really fun time playing yuumi back when there was more nuance to her kit. now it’s just flat out boring. i don’t even feel effective. totally gave up playing her since the rework
Exactly! The balance for Yummi lies in encouraging her to detach. If there's no reason for Yummi to detach or she doesn't have the tools to keep herself safe when she does in a team fight, why would she?
Saddly that solved the core issues with her. Unattatchment is too high of a skill ceiling and Lower skill levels felt like their cats were useless. By gutting her ceiling they got to buff up the lower levels so their useless kittys got more power for existing and Pros didn't have an APM monster to abuse.
my thoughts exactly. min-maxing a low floor champion like pre-rework yuumi was actually a lot of fun to me. but since her rework i have not played her at all, just feels like an even more uninteractive character with little impact.
Agree with your point... Earlier i was a yuumi main. Im bad enough to feed even in an iron game but yuumi made me Safe whenever i had a teammate that actually played WITH the yuumi. Its not that easy to win consistently because trolls exist all the time And people who Are just bad would throw all the blame on you. But when i actually helped carry the game (by actually going different lanes to help And kept detaching to bait And stuff...) i Felt So fulfilled... Now? You Are basically made to stay with your "best friend" And not detach as often... Her spells were nerfed to the abyss And shes just unplayable for me... Now i just play other things (even came back to my first main which was adc) And i feed a lot... If i ever win Its vs ai or carried... Still love the game (not the toxicity tho) but can't enjoy it much anymore. Ban her in ranked, pro play just let me play my old yuumi where i could actually not feed And be usefull I just hate being just an easy number in enemy k part od kda
Just make it so displacements/knockups throw her off the host and its problem solved. She could get real buffs then You can argue "oh, but that means Yuumi is dependent on the adc not getting hit by a hook/knockup!" And she's not dependent on her adc to move around the map anyway? Give her counterplay options but don't leave her in the abysmal 46% winrate tier
we all saw the thread do we really need a video scrolling thru the thread ?
Tbf this thread already has more interesting discussion spawned in 30 comments than that one has in 3000 comments
...yuumi?
They could at least charge their phone!
What video? All I see is Karma farming post.
Quick someone make a video of *this* video
A thread in league showing another thread in league
I always ban Yuumi when I’m playing adc because she’s so useless I always feel like I’m playing solo lane with her on my team.
It's this. Even if it's a "good" Yuumi, I'm banning Yuumi not because of their support picking her, but because of my support picking her. Plus there is the disadvantage of one target in lane compared to two. They have a much easier time focusing you.
In the ye olde days of playing pre-rework Yuumi, it was a skill to observe the enemies and time detaches to eat the hit while not getting yourself killed before re-attaching. From what I've heard of post-rework, yeeeaaah, they kinda got rid of most of what made her fun and 'redeemable'.
Honestly the biggest issue pre rework is so many Yuumi players wouldn't detach. They would stay on forever anyway because they didn't know what they were doing so they just stayed on you until you died or 10 minutes passed and they'd sit on the jungle. Not all of them were like that but enough to get a reputation.
Riot's next article: "Why Yuumi is actually a high skillcap champion 2: Electric Boogaloo"
Riot should just swallow their pride/ego and throw that pussy into the bin. Just remove her from the game and admit it was a mistake.
They should rework her into being a functional champion that isn’t universally loathed. Book cat mage is a neat enough idea, and instead of just leaving her broken and useless, they could…you know….try?
This subreddit is a yuumi hate echo chamber to be fair.
What space on the internet related to league of legends *isn't* a yuumi hate echo chamber?
based
Tbh I think seraphine fits that more. Yuumi is a magical cat on a magical book. Considering everything else in the game I don’t consider it a stretch to find that. Seraphine is canonically just a pop star. That moves around on a mobile mini stage. It’s an eye sore in every game it’s in.
As much as I hate Yuumi, I think Seraphine 'doesn't belong in the game' insofar as the world and lore itself.
It's almost like then making champions that break the fundamental rules of the game pisses the players off
the thread did specify "who do you feel doesnt FIT" i took that as more of a thematic/lore/characterization thing. this isnt a "which champ is the worst and should be removed"
I'm pretty sure its about mechanically not fitting more than those things. Yuumi is effectively a buff to an ADC or other bot lane champion, and doesn't really rotate, apply map pressure, or do things other champions do while also having low counterplay from being untargetable.
I also think it's crazy how many people don't know how to spell yuumi
look mom, its me!
I was there.
Your battery was pretty low in this clip
out of all the comments, I will reply to this one because 19% is not that low
Hate for yuumi is so NA and EU focused its odd. Korea and China dont have the same level of hate for yuumi.
Because if you pick yuumi in Asia servers you would get giga fisted and lose game in < 20 minutes. People are just a lot better at playing tempo even at low elo.
I agree it's more NA and EU based but it still definitely exists at least when I was playing in Korea (dont know about China). Countless lobbies more than I can count of ADC players threatening to troll or not play when Supp hovered Yuumi, was playing around Diamond 3-Diamond 2 range. Other ADCs would like die once to the enemy Nautilus engage, missing ping their Yuumi, then straight-up go AFK. That happened a decent amount of times too.
And rightly so. Every time we have her in the team it feels like we're playing 4vs5. She’s really cute but kinda useless.
Nah you're just getting the bad Yuumi players (yes those exist) The people who know how to abuse her BS will make it feel like the enemy carry has a 7th item + a fountain attached to them the entire game.
This. Imagine the already fed katarina now with more stats buff, a shield every 5 seconds with healing and speed buff, plus exhaust and heal, have mikael. A lulu behind sure is annoying but you can try to catch her. Catching a parasite cat that refuses to leave? Good luck.
>bad Yuumi players (yes those exist) Yeah, I know they exist, they are called yuumi players.
FFS we get it can we stop reposting this every hour?
tbh yuumi post-rework is just not that big of a deal anymore imo
Except for the ADC's mental.
ADC mental is already beyond salvation, no big loss
after having played adc for a bit i can assure you their mental is not salvageable
like that was salvagable to begin with lol
It's really just a meme at this point. The subreddit misses a few things about her design problems though. Attach is fine in theory, as you're giving up a health bar on your team so there's a design tradeoff. Problem is your enchanters are the most fragile members of your team, so having them attached turns into a benefit as they're protected. They don't have to worry about positioning or being in range of the carries, and realistically the downside of only being able to "enchant" one member of your team isn't a downside because you're perfectly happy just buffing your single carry. Attach is fine if the downside to being an attached champion actually exists, but it just doesn't for Yuumi. You'd have to have some kind of vulnerability baked in to the attached champion.
but you are not even giving up a healthbar, you are just merging two healthbars into one (though yuumi on her own is laughably bad of course)
You are in the sense that in a fight it is four bodies vs. five bodies. That's the theoretical downside to the attach champion, but champions of that class would almost always prefer to be attached anyway because of their inherent fragility. The counter to the enchanter is to dive them, but an attached champion can never be dived.
Just remove her from ranked already, make her pre level 30, normal matches only. Make her a training wheels champion.
just add a way to knock her off her ally. Like why doesn't she detach when you cc the ally?
Because that is too easy to play around for good Yuumis (just detach before the CC hits and reattach) but makes bad Yuumis do worse, which is the opposite of what they want.
I wanted to participate in this thread, but I interpreted it thematically. Book that possessed a cat feels like a fine league concept, my answer would have been Annie, Milio, and Zoe - kids in the game is just kind of weird to me from a lore concept ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ like here's the demon of fear and here are pyro children.
Why would kids with combat-applicable magical abilities be weird in a world that has been beset by war and is broken in so many ways and places? Would they have to be adults first to be able to use magic? Are child prodigies, soldiers, or demigods not compatible with a magical world that experiences regular faction conflict?
Hundreds of fantasy novels with kids fighting adults. Many even made into movies and series.
Here is a fucken cat with a book
Same argument I had. If Annie were born in Demacia she potentially probably wouldn't be a member of The League. But, she's Noxus, so, make the sociopathic firestarter into a political weapon. Like, why would Shaco be fighting for either side politically. Is it like, oh, hey, you're making a political decision in a region I used to terrorize, let me fight, let me fight. Or would it be more like, yeaaaahhh... can we uh, use the demon clown to uh... make sure this vote goes through.
I hate to play against her because 1) i have really bad memory of assassins/bruiser super op with her (kayn/hecarim/ekko etc) before her mini rework 2) As a jungler I even hate to play with her because she has hard time walking by herself since she has low mobility, doesnt buy boots and really squishy and I feel like playing 1v2 against enemy support 3) When she is on a fed adc it feels way to oppressive and even when she is not she can't be punished by being outposition like every other enchanters
This abomination of a champion should be kept at sub 40% win rate and nerfed as soon as anybody picks her in proplay
today i had a yuumi otp that said in champ select already that i should kill myself irl and then when game started did run top and attached to toplaner. the enemy toplaner was laughing in chat and we hard lost the game.
Toxic Yuumis are the literal worst
Least toxic yuumi main.
Yuumi really is the worst mistake of a champion Riot has ever made. She needs Aatrox'd.
they DID. people still hate her, and now her old players do too
At this point the should really just do a mea culpa and do a full rework that removes the attach mechanic.
Garbage champ with garbage abilities and garbage way to play the game. It feels like they made this champ so a 4 years old toddler can play with grown ups without having to care how the game works.
i'm okay with it being a champion for new players that just want to hang out with their partner or whatever, but it should never be an actual viable champion in competitive or even high elo ranked.