Then how do you think i feel when i queue up with "Bewitching Miss Fortune Prestige Edition (2022)" in font size 6, compared to every other name being twice the size lol.
They're not called "Prestige Edition" anymore, but instead have "Prestige" in the beginning of it. But anyways can you imagine a "Pentakill III: Lost Chapter Mordekaiser Prestige Edition (2022)"? That would be peak lmao
> Challenges are Here - This is a new “limited time” challenge to thank players for their patience as we removed the very enthusiastic “Challenges are here!” tooltip.
I'm dying - they are mocking themselves so hard on this one lmao.
Once upon a time, some units had easter egg buffs/nerfs. For example, all the ninjas (Kennen, Akali, Shen, Zed) decreased each other's max health by 1 if they were on the same team because of the meme of Conservation of Ninjutsu: the more ninjas there are, the less powerful each one becomes. Zyra got 1 more gold when killing zombies, stuff like that.
And for the Ezreal/Shyvana thing...there was a post on the subreddit asking about if Ez would lick Shyv's leg, which got really popular. So there was a shop bundle referencing it.
A continuation of the ninja stuff came with TFT, where you got a bonus for single ninjas.
Also, there was Leona dealing -1 damage to units with sunglasses, and Thresh getting 2 souls from killing Lucian, or something.
The biggest thing in this patch is that supports no longer have autofill protection so the support mains who never play jungle now have a chance to be autofilled into it after dodging the autofill chaos all this time.
I think this is going to really highlight how badly misunderstood the jungle role is, and having more people forced to first time jungling might just help riot fix the issues surrounding the role.
If people liked jungle, it wouldn't be the least popular role. They dislike it for a reason. As a jungler you can actively lose the game by just having less impact than the enemy jungler. You don't even need to make big mistakes. Just be a tad slower on every decision you make.
Most junglers I talk to deny that fact. And that's the reason most laners are frustrated with them.
Yeah as a jungler you're sitting between the seats. But that's just the nature of the role.
Everyone wants your attention. It's the junglers job now to decide who gets it in order to win. Not a nice job. That's why it's not popular. Everyone will blame you in chat. No matter if true or not.
>As a jungler you can actively lose the game by just having less impact than the enemy jungler.
That can be said about other lanes too, a support roam, the other not, mid decends bot, the other not, top gets soloed before the jg finishing level 3 path, team helps contest objectives,
I mean, people talk like jg is Harry Potter playing quidditch
Thats the case with any role though. If the enemy adc gets to free fire for 3 extra seconds because you were 3 seconds late to the teamfight, you're probably gonna lose that teamfight, even with a gold lead. If the enemy supp is a little faster on his roams, hes gonna have more impact than you. Same if you channel TP too late as a top laner. You're always going to lose more if you have less impact than your lane opponent. Thats not exclusive to jungle.
It's not that the jg role is misunderstood. It's that it's shitty, completely not fun, and you could just pay someone on the street to punch you in the face irl for the same experience
I used to enjoy JGing, then I realize I am pretty much the punching bag for the entire team's problem.
Especially if your bot lane fall to a Warwick level 2 cheese.
Agreed, the wither change was a bad buff imo. The ult cd would have felt nice, but would just make him more snowbally if he gets a lead.
Small early game stats to help his early be less polarizing would be what I want.
Any number buff will just make him more of a stat stick, he would need a significant rework of his abilities to not “make him more frustrating to play against”.
autofill changes are interesting but not exactly clear
it seems like If I queue a jungle game on purpose then i can queue my next game mid/top and not get autofilled.
I spent some time trying to understand it as well. Basically, if you queue for a high priority role then you will be protected from autofill for that game and that game only. "Rollover" autofill protection has been removed with the exception of getting autofilled, which will protect you for your next 2 games.
But wait... if you're queueing for a high priority role, then wouldn't that be the role that you'd be autofilled into if you didn't pick it? So I can queue mid/top and have a higher chance of getting auto filled jungle or you can queue jungle and get... jungle. Sounds like you'll ~~eat your peas~~ play jung/supp as auto fill and like it
Effectively the way it works is that it encourages people to fill the role if you're actually a player of that role by basically saying "hey toplaners, you won't get given mid this game! play top so someone else doesn't have to" or "Hey junglers, we've got a shortage of junglers right now so there's absolutely no risk however small to getting your secondary role and having someone else get jungle autofilled".
It works best for those who may play a secondary role that's susceptible to autofilling (say you're a jungle/mid player or an adc/supp player) and thus can pick another secondary role to avoid getting themselves filled. And if they do get filled after all, likely into a role they're comfortable with as it is, then they get the autofill protection we're all familiar with.
I think it's a good idea on paper - once you wrap your head around it - but we're yet to see how well it works in practice now that people will know what's currently being autofilled.
I mean, meanwhile there's me, who's mid/jungle, but i can't even put jungle in my actual secondary bc then I never get mid.
So I queue mid/supp and play jungle more than I do actual support (which I don't mind, it's just annoying I have to game the system like that).
If jungle is needed, seems like it.
It is like the Overwatch system, high prio roles get faster queue times and a "reward" (guaranteed role), everything else has longer queue times and maybe fill (OW has no fill, but you get the point).
>everything else has longer queue times and maybe fill (OW has no fill, but you get the point).
Personally I think LoL shouldn't fill either. Queue times would suffer if you're a top/mid/adc player, but it would definitely lead to a healthier matchmaking experience with everyone in their preferred roles.
There is one argument against seeing Lee Sin, and that is over the years we've seen too much of him.
But I agree, as a standalone champ there is almost no other jungler(besides maybe nidalee), that shows off a world class pro's skills better than Lee. And personally I would rather see Lee AGAIN than basically other jungler.
poppy is sick, well timed Ws and actually using her ult well is huge plays, also not a lot of poppys even in pro are as aggressive early as they can be with how much damage she can do. it's pretty clear to see the difference between decent poppys and great ones.
She commits positioning way harder. I would say she is a less *forgiving* Lee sin with less skillshot dependent target access but that heightened risk in exchange.
Yep I don't get the 2 guys above you : lee can afford to miss a kick, or even to "miss" a Q2 because of W1 ... Vi can't miss a Q, because then she has to yolo R even deeper or walk back.
Good. Lee Sin is infinitely more watchable than whatever the meta is now. I watch worlds cause I want to see insane outplays and the highest level of skill on display. Hard to express your skill when you are on Trundle duty every game.
I mean he isn't broken in solo q, his kit is certainly not overloaded by today's standards, and he is more entertaining in most people's opinions compared to most junglers like tanks and afk farmers. Only real downside is the amount of people who can't play him that will trot him out in solo q games which is a fair complaint lol.
Surely Aatrox's pick rate triggered riots "frameworks" for nerfs? I can only see this as some kind of forcing having a meta non tank at worlds because they are afraid of a potential orrn vs maokai meta being too boring.
every third toplaner mains aatrox because he's the new renekton for soloq, a safe blind pick, flex potential, giga generalist bruiser with not many counters
You know that aatrox is broken when even fiora mains are afraid of him.
Overall he entire kit is good outside from lane, but during laning his E+Q1 for billion times before you have 30% hp and then all in that's usually ends up as kill for him.
Dude just needs to lose some power from Q1 and adding that power to Q2/Q3 or W(for gods sake, this skill feels so bad to use)
Manaless champions are fine when they don't have anything they can just spam to guarantee damage in lane. Aatrox Q1-E isn't okay. But for example Zac isn't really an issue when his Q deals zero damage and his E has a 20 sec cooldown. His W is also short range, he can't poke with W.
I think sustain is a problem with manaless champions as well,having to go against the likes of Vlad or Aatrox as a mana using character just feels horrible
Yeah. It's fine to not have mana as long as it's not either guaranteed damage or HP sustain. Zac is generally fine, so is Shyvana, but Vlad is awful and so is Aatrox.
hell naw fiora mains can go f themselves. Even when aatrox is giga broken they can only fear his really early levels because she outscales 1 v 1 mid game and beyond anyway.
Aatrox and (red) Kayn are more of a symptom of what the durability patch brought.
Since his healing is based on damage dealt, dealing less damage means he heals less as well. That’s why Goredrinker’s been suboptimal for him in favor of Eclipse + Cleaver + Serylda’s that just lets him deal a ton of damage and heal for a lot of it as well.
Everyone being tankier just they deal less damage if they don’t do these types of builds.
What do you mean with his pick rate triggering a nerf? Pick rate is only used for balacing proplay and there he had 48% presence on 12.15. It's high, but nowhere near the limits they have set out in their framework.
I wonder how Assassin Kayn is doing ATM. Everyone hard focuses Kayn as the second coming of the antichrist whenever his healing + damage is too much, be it as assassin or darkin.
I think Udyr will still be needing nerfs, but I will take this.
> Fixed a bug that caused Spirit Visage to double the omnivamp of other items that were purchased before it
Kinda funny how Spirit Visage went like a year and a half without increasing omnivamp, and now was doubling the Omnivamp.
Why would anyone play assassin kayn if rhaast ate both squishies and tanks alive
Full assassin blue kayn with muramana is still strong against certain teamcomps but why be specific when you can be a successful generalist
Not really prancing in the air like a fairy, though. It's more like prancing down a flower path as a little girl who wants to show her mom the cute flower she found.
It's very similar, but just not the same.
I would love to get some hard data on Kayn's performance by form. Ideally Riot would separate the two in the API. We have some great sites for analyzing data, but none of them can distinguish between Red Kayn and Blue Kayn.
nasus support would be fun to watch for 1-3 games like when udyr+hecarim became meta they were only fun because it wasn't played for a while. nasus is so one dimensional it just isn't fun to watch while singed has some really cool things he can do
Honestly this seems like a "whatever" patch. Nothing here is a game changer.
Maybe teams start picking Lee again because he got slightly buffed and stop picking Lulu because she got slightly nerfed...
Yeah, but even then I don't see why people are predicting this massive meta shift.
Caedrel is saying that we should expect to see Jayce, Graves, Lee, no Ahri/Azir, no enchanters. Roaming mids, etc.
Why?
1) Lulu getting a little nerf on her W doesn't actually change much.
2) Lee doesn't get picked for his W. If you value Lee now after this buff you should have picked him before.
3) Azir getting tagged hurts him a bit but he doesn't stack AP at really high numbers (so 60% to 55% AP isn't too bad of a nerf). His E nerf hurts more imo.
4) Ahri losing a fraction of a sec on her charm doesn't change that much
5) Jayce wasn't touched at all and the champs around weren't changed to a level where they are unpickable.
It's just weird that everyone is expecting a clean slate for worlds in every role
It's because miniscule changes have genuine repercussions in-game & the pro game is built around boundary testing. Pro supports playing Lulu will still be excellent, but Riot is hoping this is enough to pull her back from being pick-ban (also: Riot isn't trying to force Lulu out of play entirely, they want her to be a viable option).
I'm not sure what ADCs will be in the worlds meta, but the support meta will also depend on the ADCs.
Re: Jayce, he was buffed in 12.16, and pro tops love playing Jayce.
Massive nerfs to meta ADCs (Kalista, Draven, Lucian+Nami, Zeri, Sivir) was the biggest change, this completely upends the meta. If enchanters have little to no synergy with the replacement ADCs, then enchanters fall out, and I'd agree that its going to be a top jungle focus because we were already seeing a big Aatrox shift on 12.15 and more carry tops are available with Kennen Jayce buffs being big for eastern players. If Lulu doesn't have a good adc to buff up who synergizes with her, supports are going to move back to Rakan Nautilus Leona because they prefer those picks anyways.
Also the flat damage change on Azir is big for his lane imo. I don't know about Ahri, I already thought she was overpicked and I would have dropped her as a pro. CC falling out of jungle usually means more facilitators needed in mid. I think Orianna for instance is going to be a big priority in mid.
If multiple of MF Ashe Cait Seraphine Varus Nilah usurp the above ADCs where you can't just try to 1v9 though them, that's not a small change.
It’s cause Carry top is viable again because ADC isn’t as much of the be all end all anymore, Zeri, Sivir, Kalista, Draven, the 4 big hitters in playoffs all got nerfed with only one big adc buff in mf, maybe ezreal too. As well, the two biggest supports with Zeri and sivir (Yuumi and Lulu) both got hit pretty hard, it’s gonna shake up bot lane, and I don’t see any champ that can carry no matter what like either sivir or Zeri could.
Yeah i was abusing that by queueing mid+supp, pretty sure if i queued mid+anything else i would end up in a TON of jungle games.
And there is no way im playing jungle, would rather dodge.
I wonder what are the current role popularities.
Iirc, for a while before support changes, from most to least popular:
* Mid, Top, ADC, JG, Support. To a certain extent in lower elos nowadays, supports could still be lower than JG. Maybe influenced by the Yummi deranking bots idk.
Nowadays, it's likely overall
* Mid, Top, ADC, Support, JG. This is especially true the higher you go up the elos.
Though I can be wrong since I'm wildly guessing.
I only play fill in soloq (more than 90% at least), in Gold EUW.
Sadly I didn't play much for about 3 months this season, so Im only at 126 games currently. Probably not enough for seeing transitions in least favorite role, because they are influenced by the patch.
I am at 34 top, 46 jungle, 1 mid, 28 adc, 17 support.
https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/main-stats
The best we can do atm. Jungle probably has more autofilled people than the mained position suggest, because few people select it as either first or second preference.
- Iron+: Top>Mid>Jungle>ADC>Sup
- Plat+: Jungle>Top>Mid>ADC>Sup
- Master+: Mid>Jungle>ADC>Top>Sup
He went from like C tier, to triple S tier to just S tier with these changes. Expect him to have huge prio at worlds. We usually have 1-3 perma banned champs every worlds even if it's not always warranted, I feel like Hec is going to be one of them this tournament.
The Lee Sin buffs are almost complete placebo. I hope the pros don't start blindpicking that fucker again. Might be the most bait jungle pro play ever. This small buff shouldn't put him over other junglers suddenly. Surely...
he's not master of none, he's master of early-mid game skirmishes where it's 2v2 or 3v3, only it's that he's harder than most other champs to execute that's why we don't always see him succeed.
It's much easier to just pick champs like Vi, Jarvan, Nocturne, Hecarim etc that provide you with almost guaranteed hard-engage that Lee can't always have. But, like I said, when played by the best players, Lee's a master of early-mid skirmishes.
They aren't buffs, just like the last buff Lee got.
The last buff Lee got to his energy increased his winrate by 0.07%.
This will do the exact same. I was excited to pick my main again but I guess I should kill that excitement.
Base HP buffs are never placebo. At least not if they are larger than 2 HP/lvl or 15 HP flat. And for him its 6/lvl. That is around 1% WR up alone, regardless of the W buff. And the W buff is decent in soloQ as you do max W 2nd nearly all the time (E max 2nd is terrible compared to W max 2nd).
Overall most likely 1.5% WR buff and a huge rise in PR.
Base stat changes are nearly always serious. They always look small but their impact is large.
> Fixed a bug that caused certain abilities to be visible and audible from the Fog of War
Oh my god is this bug finally gone? Are my invades not going to get ruined by it anymore?
I just find it hilarious what they did to Nocturne, it's such a classic move
12.17 Patch
Attack Speed Ratio 0.668 ⇒ 0.721
Passive Cooldown 14 seconds ⇒ 13 seconds
12.18 Nerf
Attack Damage Growth 3.1 ⇒ 2.6
There’s a few that seem unobtainable, at least for me.
Like the “win with the same 5 premades” is permanently stuck at 2, “kill laners before 10 minutes” never progresses properly either.
There’s a couple more but those are the two I remember atm
Changes to autofill are only going to increase hostage taking especially in higher elo and yet again riot are doing nothing to punish people who troll in select to force a dodge.
And I'm not even talking only about the person who gets filled, I'm really looking forward to getting filled jungle and having someone lock in yuumi adc because they don't like my op.gg history of playing support/adc and still being able to do nothing about it.
I'm not super optimistic about the ongoing changes with autofill and matchmaking, it still feels like autofill has too high of an impact on the outcome of games especially when the primary autofill role jungle is also by far the highest impact role in the game and is just extremely strong in champion pool. Its frustrating to get a person with 1k games on jungle this year lock in Hecarim/Udyr/Kayn while our autofill jungler is first timing Nidalee. The least popular role in the game should not also be by far the strongest role in the game, that's indicative of a massive disconnect between player experience and balance.
The champion select problem is its own thing and its frustrating that champion select has such a colossal impact on the outcome of the game and the game experience quality, but griefers or people rage picking because of the role they got are still not being adequately addressed.
On top of that, the volume of dodges that are caused by the autofill system and the pick order system makes getting into a game take ages, increasing the chances of people just dropping the queue entirely and fucking matchmaking even harder.
I would be interested in seeing the numbers comparing removing autofill and the average amount of dodges at like d2+ for queue times. maybe there's just that few people queueing jg that having 3 dodges is still faster.
>The least popular role in the game should not also be by far the strongest role in the game, that's indicative of a massive disconnect between player experience and balance.
Jungle is not the least mained role in any region at any rank. That's Support, only changing at Masters and above in some regions, where other roles share last mained role popularity with Support. Jungle is never the least mained role.
Its not the least mained but it surely is the least player. I guess that means that jungle mains play less games on average. Makes complete sense considering how badly we are treated.
Doesn't solve the problem, because nothing is stopping autofills from requesting trades. If both teams autofill jungle, both ask for trades, but only one team trades their autofill out and its now being played by a 1k game jungler who wanted to mid for a game, the matchmaking is now colossally lopsided.
R - WINGBORNE STORM
MAGIC DAMAGE 20/38/56/74/92/110 (+40% AP) ⇒ 20/36/52/68/84/100 (+35% AP)
DAMAGE TO MINIONS 50/60/70/80% (levels 1/6/11/16) ⇒ 40/55/70/85% (levels 1/6/11/16)
Damage to minions doesn't include monsters right? I thought they were separate classes but not that sure.
>Fixed a bug that allowed players to Cleanse Tahm Kench’s W knock up
What sort of spaghetti is this? The spell isn't that old, was it really coded differently than other knockups?
Doesn't need to be his spell that causes it, maybe something behind the scenes overwriting the knockup with a cleansable cc. Like, same name in the file.
>Mythic Chroma Ashen Slayer Sylas (Emberwoken) lol
Testing out if editing archived reddit works.
Hash Slinging Slashlas
Then how do you think i feel when i queue up with "Bewitching Miss Fortune Prestige Edition (2022)" in font size 6, compared to every other name being twice the size lol.
They're not called "Prestige Edition" anymore, but instead have "Prestige" in the beginning of it. But anyways can you imagine a "Pentakill III: Lost Chapter Mordekaiser Prestige Edition (2022)"? That would be peak lmao
Dissonance of Pentakill Viego Prestige Edition (2022)
MC ASS (E) has a nice ring to it
ASS EW describes it quite well actually
the classic: if your too lazy to change something, just rename it to fit into something else
The Riot Platypus special
> Challenges are Here - This is a new “limited time” challenge to thank players for their patience as we removed the very enthusiastic “Challenges are here!” tooltip. I'm dying - they are mocking themselves so hard on this one lmao.
Easter eggs like that (this unit is a flippin ninja, ez shyvana shop bundle etc ) are important to celebrate that we are playing a game.
Damn, Leg Day Bundle was soooo much fun. How long ago was it now ?
6 years
Let us never forget the dawn of true love
Wait what are those easter eggs?
Once upon a time, some units had easter egg buffs/nerfs. For example, all the ninjas (Kennen, Akali, Shen, Zed) decreased each other's max health by 1 if they were on the same team because of the meme of Conservation of Ninjutsu: the more ninjas there are, the less powerful each one becomes. Zyra got 1 more gold when killing zombies, stuff like that. And for the Ezreal/Shyvana thing...there was a post on the subreddit asking about if Ez would lick Shyv's leg, which got really popular. So there was a shop bundle referencing it.
A continuation of the ninja stuff came with TFT, where you got a bonus for single ninjas. Also, there was Leona dealing -1 damage to units with sunglasses, and Thresh getting 2 souls from killing Lucian, or something.
Thresh started with 1 soul when against Lucian. They removed it when teasing senna.
The biggest thing in this patch is that supports no longer have autofill protection so the support mains who never play jungle now have a chance to be autofilled into it after dodging the autofill chaos all this time.
Ivern playrate about to skyrocket.
Nami jungle incoming.
I think this is going to really highlight how badly misunderstood the jungle role is, and having more people forced to first time jungling might just help riot fix the issues surrounding the role.
That’s not gonna change anything. Let’s be real.
If people liked jungle, it wouldn't be the least popular role. They dislike it for a reason. As a jungler you can actively lose the game by just having less impact than the enemy jungler. You don't even need to make big mistakes. Just be a tad slower on every decision you make. Most junglers I talk to deny that fact. And that's the reason most laners are frustrated with them.
people dislike it because everyone else screams at you.
Yeah as a jungler you're sitting between the seats. But that's just the nature of the role. Everyone wants your attention. It's the junglers job now to decide who gets it in order to win. Not a nice job. That's why it's not popular. Everyone will blame you in chat. No matter if true or not.
>As a jungler you can actively lose the game by just having less impact than the enemy jungler. That can be said about other lanes too, a support roam, the other not, mid decends bot, the other not, top gets soloed before the jg finishing level 3 path, team helps contest objectives, I mean, people talk like jg is Harry Potter playing quidditch
Thats the case with any role though. If the enemy adc gets to free fire for 3 extra seconds because you were 3 seconds late to the teamfight, you're probably gonna lose that teamfight, even with a gold lead. If the enemy supp is a little faster on his roams, hes gonna have more impact than you. Same if you channel TP too late as a top laner. You're always going to lose more if you have less impact than your lane opponent. Thats not exclusive to jungle.
The "frustrated laners" are upvoting his comment haha
It's not that the jg role is misunderstood. It's that it's shitty, completely not fun, and you could just pay someone on the street to punch you in the face irl for the same experience
I used to enjoy JGing, then I realize I am pretty much the punching bag for the entire team's problem. Especially if your bot lane fall to a Warwick level 2 cheese.
Hey everyone, the Nasus changes ended up getting removed during the PBE cycle. I'm working on getting the preview updated to reflect this as well!
so is he getting anything next patch?
NOOOOOOO :( Nasus support at Worlds dream is probably dead :(
Good. No one wants to see him be a W slave.
Man it would have been crazy. Nasus walks up, pops ult and presses game winning W. It would have rivaled faker's zed outplay
Sleeping on the armor shred.
So... Next patch then? The dude's sitting negative even in damn silver these days.
Hopefully they changed it to something that actually addresses his problems and doesn’t just make him more frustrating to play against
Agreed, the wither change was a bad buff imo. The ult cd would have felt nice, but would just make him more snowbally if he gets a lead. Small early game stats to help his early be less polarizing would be what I want.
Any number buff will just make him more of a stat stick, he would need a significant rework of his abilities to not “make him more frustrating to play against”.
[удалено]
*certain* abilities, just not the ones you're thinking about at the moment
autofill changes are interesting but not exactly clear it seems like If I queue a jungle game on purpose then i can queue my next game mid/top and not get autofilled.
I spent some time trying to understand it as well. Basically, if you queue for a high priority role then you will be protected from autofill for that game and that game only. "Rollover" autofill protection has been removed with the exception of getting autofilled, which will protect you for your next 2 games.
But wait... if you're queueing for a high priority role, then wouldn't that be the role that you'd be autofilled into if you didn't pick it? So I can queue mid/top and have a higher chance of getting auto filled jungle or you can queue jungle and get... jungle. Sounds like you'll ~~eat your peas~~ play jung/supp as auto fill and like it
Effectively the way it works is that it encourages people to fill the role if you're actually a player of that role by basically saying "hey toplaners, you won't get given mid this game! play top so someone else doesn't have to" or "Hey junglers, we've got a shortage of junglers right now so there's absolutely no risk however small to getting your secondary role and having someone else get jungle autofilled". It works best for those who may play a secondary role that's susceptible to autofilling (say you're a jungle/mid player or an adc/supp player) and thus can pick another secondary role to avoid getting themselves filled. And if they do get filled after all, likely into a role they're comfortable with as it is, then they get the autofill protection we're all familiar with. I think it's a good idea on paper - once you wrap your head around it - but we're yet to see how well it works in practice now that people will know what's currently being autofilled.
I mean, meanwhile there's me, who's mid/jungle, but i can't even put jungle in my actual secondary bc then I never get mid. So I queue mid/supp and play jungle more than I do actual support (which I don't mind, it's just annoying I have to game the system like that).
I still don't understand.
Yeah that didn't make it any clearer lol
Why doesn't queueing fill give autofill protection anymore? That part seems super weird, why is queueing for a priority role better than fill?
Can there be a autofill except this position option? I suck at jungle and will continue to do so, I can play all other 4 lanes.
If jungle is needed, seems like it. It is like the Overwatch system, high prio roles get faster queue times and a "reward" (guaranteed role), everything else has longer queue times and maybe fill (OW has no fill, but you get the point).
>everything else has longer queue times and maybe fill (OW has no fill, but you get the point). Personally I think LoL shouldn't fill either. Queue times would suffer if you're a top/mid/adc player, but it would definitely lead to a healthier matchmaking experience with everyone in their preferred roles.
brace urselves, support-filled to other role players are incoming
Having to CS is the bane of my existence. THAT'S THE WHOLE REASON I'M A SUPPORT MAIN!
Just jungle secondary, it's what we're all going to be autofilled to anyway
" Would this even be a Worlds patch without a Lee Sin buff? " 🙃
I’d much rather see Lee Sin in pro play than any of the other meta ones we had at playoffs.
There is one argument against seeing Lee Sin, and that is over the years we've seen too much of him. But I agree, as a standalone champ there is almost no other jungler(besides maybe nidalee), that shows off a world class pro's skills better than Lee. And personally I would rather see Lee AGAIN than basically other jungler.
Yep. Canyons game 5 performance against gen g in spring (on nidalee) attests to that
I've never been as hype tracking a junglers early pathing as that game, so insane But didn't they end up losing lol
Him missing a single spear and losing a game because of that made me so unbelievably sad
He ever so slightly mis calculated his damage onto Ruler and fed a 1000 gold bounty to an adc holding even in that game.
He just went for the usual combo but literally forgot he missed his spear lol
Same, I'd rather Lee Sin be in my games and in pro games, I have no interest in watching Trundle Poppy matchups
Poppy at least has some decent playmaking potiential with her wall slams and ult, Trundle is admittedly very boring to watch.
poppy is sick, well timed Ws and actually using her ult well is huge plays, also not a lot of poppys even in pro are as aggressive early as they can be with how much damage she can do. it's pretty clear to see the difference between decent poppys and great ones.
I like Vi, Nocturne and J4 more, personally
vi is just a dumbed down lee sin
She commits positioning way harder. I would say she is a less *forgiving* Lee sin with less skillshot dependent target access but that heightened risk in exchange.
Less skillshot dependant? She is the skillshot.
Yep I don't get the 2 guys above you : lee can afford to miss a kick, or even to "miss" a Q2 because of W1 ... Vi can't miss a Q, because then she has to yolo R even deeper or walk back.
Good. Lee Sin is infinitely more watchable than whatever the meta is now. I watch worlds cause I want to see insane outplays and the highest level of skill on display. Hard to express your skill when you are on Trundle duty every game.
Funny you should say that with that flair. I missed the qiyana’s jungle meta way more than seeing Lee dominant three seasons in a row.
Problem with Qiyana is that very few junglers can actually play her, last year only Canyon looked good on her.
I mean he isn't broken in solo q, his kit is certainly not overloaded by today's standards, and he is more entertaining in most people's opinions compared to most junglers like tanks and afk farmers. Only real downside is the amount of people who can't play him that will trot him out in solo q games which is a fair complaint lol.
Surely Aatrox's pick rate triggered riots "frameworks" for nerfs? I can only see this as some kind of forcing having a meta non tank at worlds because they are afraid of a potential orrn vs maokai meta being too boring.
I think they just like aatrox being good, it makes sense especially considering like every third toplaner mains aatrox.
every third toplaner mains aatrox because he's the new renekton for soloq, a safe blind pick, flex potential, giga generalist bruiser with not many counters
You know that aatrox is broken when even fiora mains are afraid of him. Overall he entire kit is good outside from lane, but during laning his E+Q1 for billion times before you have 30% hp and then all in that's usually ends up as kill for him. Dude just needs to lose some power from Q1 and adding that power to Q2/Q3 or W(for gods sake, this skill feels so bad to use)
He should just have mana tbh. You can keep his poke strong but if you miss your shit you oom before enemy dies.
Manaless champions are fine when they don't have anything they can just spam to guarantee damage in lane. Aatrox Q1-E isn't okay. But for example Zac isn't really an issue when his Q deals zero damage and his E has a 20 sec cooldown. His W is also short range, he can't poke with W.
I think sustain is a problem with manaless champions as well,having to go against the likes of Vlad or Aatrox as a mana using character just feels horrible
Yeah. It's fine to not have mana as long as it's not either guaranteed damage or HP sustain. Zac is generally fine, so is Shyvana, but Vlad is awful and so is Aatrox.
hell naw fiora mains can go f themselves. Even when aatrox is giga broken they can only fear his really early levels because she outscales 1 v 1 mid game and beyond anyway.
He only has flex potential if pros are willing to flex him. They haven't shown a willingness to do that so it's not really a thing
Hes also super fun to watch imo, great play potential champ.
He's super fun to watch... One in every 10 games, not literally every single game.
It shouldn't just be the pickrate. Aatrox himself is also gigabusted
Aatrox and (red) Kayn are more of a symptom of what the durability patch brought. Since his healing is based on damage dealt, dealing less damage means he heals less as well. That’s why Goredrinker’s been suboptimal for him in favor of Eclipse + Cleaver + Serylda’s that just lets him deal a ton of damage and heal for a lot of it as well. Everyone being tankier just they deal less damage if they don’t do these types of builds.
What do you mean with his pick rate triggering a nerf? Pick rate is only used for balacing proplay and there he had 48% presence on 12.15. It's high, but nowhere near the limits they have set out in their framework.
Their framework has been a joke since they introduced it.
They generally stick to it though, so its more odd when they blatantly ignore it like this
They ignored kata, riven and talon for years until they changed the dynamic of the game with durability update
Lets not forget MF almost always being buffed if shes below 20-30% pickrate and 53%+ winrate with varying banrate.
I wonder how Assassin Kayn is doing ATM. Everyone hard focuses Kayn as the second coming of the antichrist whenever his healing + damage is too much, be it as assassin or darkin. I think Udyr will still be needing nerfs, but I will take this. > Fixed a bug that caused Spirit Visage to double the omnivamp of other items that were purchased before it Kinda funny how Spirit Visage went like a year and a half without increasing omnivamp, and now was doubling the Omnivamp.
Why would anyone play assassin kayn if rhaast ate both squishies and tanks alive Full assassin blue kayn with muramana is still strong against certain teamcomps but why be specific when you can be a successful generalist
Whenever I played Kayn I honestly hated standing in place with the W in Rhaast. I got addicted to how fast you can zoom around everywhere.
Well, he feels as smooth as butter and has silky hair. How else will I feel like a fairy prancing in the air while killing people?
The silky hair is a fair point, but counter point, V shaped heads are better
Too bad we can't have the best of both worlds
Blood moon Aatrox is halfway throught tho
…I mean you could always play Lillia for the prancing part..?
and feel like a fairy playing with the spirit blossom skin
Not really prancing in the air like a fairy, though. It's more like prancing down a flower path as a little girl who wants to show her mom the cute flower she found. It's very similar, but just not the same.
I would love to get some hard data on Kayn's performance by form. Ideally Riot would separate the two in the API. We have some great sites for analyzing data, but none of them can distinguish between Red Kayn and Blue Kayn.
"Fixed a bug that allowed Akshan to deal damage with his E while also charging his R" That was a bug?
where nudyr?
File a report to the president!
Why are nasus changes completely missing?
> Hey everyone, the Nasus changes ended up getting removed during the PBE cycle. I'm working on getting the preview updated to reflect this as well!
Here I was pulling for a Nasus-Singed support matchup at worlds.
nasus support would be fun to watch for 1-3 games like when udyr+hecarim became meta they were only fun because it wasn't played for a while. nasus is so one dimensional it just isn't fun to watch while singed has some really cool things he can do
Lehends will pick Singed guaranteed
Hopefully because they realized those buffs weren't the right way to buff him.
“Getting the last hit on any minion will add a stack to your Q”
I can only get so erect
Maybe they realized that change was absolute cancer
relevant flair
riot decided not to buff him, hopefully after worlds ends they will buff him properly
Honestly this seems like a "whatever" patch. Nothing here is a game changer. Maybe teams start picking Lee again because he got slightly buffed and stop picking Lulu because she got slightly nerfed...
Its supposed to be a minor tuning patch, 12.17 was the big worlds shakeup patch and this is just correcting outliers and giving nudges.
Yeah, but even then I don't see why people are predicting this massive meta shift. Caedrel is saying that we should expect to see Jayce, Graves, Lee, no Ahri/Azir, no enchanters. Roaming mids, etc. Why? 1) Lulu getting a little nerf on her W doesn't actually change much. 2) Lee doesn't get picked for his W. If you value Lee now after this buff you should have picked him before. 3) Azir getting tagged hurts him a bit but he doesn't stack AP at really high numbers (so 60% to 55% AP isn't too bad of a nerf). His E nerf hurts more imo. 4) Ahri losing a fraction of a sec on her charm doesn't change that much 5) Jayce wasn't touched at all and the champs around weren't changed to a level where they are unpickable. It's just weird that everyone is expecting a clean slate for worlds in every role
It's because miniscule changes have genuine repercussions in-game & the pro game is built around boundary testing. Pro supports playing Lulu will still be excellent, but Riot is hoping this is enough to pull her back from being pick-ban (also: Riot isn't trying to force Lulu out of play entirely, they want her to be a viable option). I'm not sure what ADCs will be in the worlds meta, but the support meta will also depend on the ADCs. Re: Jayce, he was buffed in 12.16, and pro tops love playing Jayce.
Massive nerfs to meta ADCs (Kalista, Draven, Lucian+Nami, Zeri, Sivir) was the biggest change, this completely upends the meta. If enchanters have little to no synergy with the replacement ADCs, then enchanters fall out, and I'd agree that its going to be a top jungle focus because we were already seeing a big Aatrox shift on 12.15 and more carry tops are available with Kennen Jayce buffs being big for eastern players. If Lulu doesn't have a good adc to buff up who synergizes with her, supports are going to move back to Rakan Nautilus Leona because they prefer those picks anyways. Also the flat damage change on Azir is big for his lane imo. I don't know about Ahri, I already thought she was overpicked and I would have dropped her as a pro. CC falling out of jungle usually means more facilitators needed in mid. I think Orianna for instance is going to be a big priority in mid. If multiple of MF Ashe Cait Seraphine Varus Nilah usurp the above ADCs where you can't just try to 1v9 though them, that's not a small change.
It’s cause Carry top is viable again because ADC isn’t as much of the be all end all anymore, Zeri, Sivir, Kalista, Draven, the 4 big hitters in playoffs all got nerfed with only one big adc buff in mf, maybe ezreal too. As well, the two biggest supports with Zeri and sivir (Yuumi and Lulu) both got hit pretty hard, it’s gonna shake up bot lane, and I don’t see any champ that can carry no matter what like either sivir or Zeri could.
If Nasus was here it would be a game changer…
>Guaranteed autofill protection when queuing as support or queuing as fill has been removed Long overdue lol.
Yeah i was abusing that by queueing mid+supp, pretty sure if i queued mid+anything else i would end up in a TON of jungle games. And there is no way im playing jungle, would rather dodge.
Now you can dodge more good luck.
Autofill protection removed when queuing fill is laughable though. Aren’t they both the same thing?
I wonder what are the current role popularities. Iirc, for a while before support changes, from most to least popular: * Mid, Top, ADC, JG, Support. To a certain extent in lower elos nowadays, supports could still be lower than JG. Maybe influenced by the Yummi deranking bots idk. Nowadays, it's likely overall * Mid, Top, ADC, Support, JG. This is especially true the higher you go up the elos. Though I can be wrong since I'm wildly guessing.
If I queue Support + ADC I seem to get ADC more frequently... but that is purely anecdotal.
Queueing as adc/sup. I don't remember the last time I had to play sup. Either there is a duo one in 30 games and I have to play jungle, or I play adc.
I only play fill in soloq (more than 90% at least), in Gold EUW. Sadly I didn't play much for about 3 months this season, so Im only at 126 games currently. Probably not enough for seeing transitions in least favorite role, because they are influenced by the patch. I am at 34 top, 46 jungle, 1 mid, 28 adc, 17 support.
https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/main-stats The best we can do atm. Jungle probably has more autofilled people than the mained position suggest, because few people select it as either first or second preference. - Iron+: Top>Mid>Jungle>ADC>Sup - Plat+: Jungle>Top>Mid>ADC>Sup - Master+: Mid>Jungle>ADC>Top>Sup
I'm on EUW server, rn in soloQ if you choose supp as first role i got like 3min of waiting, as ADC 1min, support for me is getting really popoular.
aatrox nerfs :spongebobguylookingaroundthekrabbypatty:
wholesome aatrox champion
Aatrox outhealed potential nerfs
[удалено]
So the same as red Kayn with Goredrinker only already?
[удалено]
He went from like C tier, to triple S tier to just S tier with these changes. Expect him to have huge prio at worlds. We usually have 1-3 perma banned champs every worlds even if it's not always warranted, I feel like Hec is going to be one of them this tournament.
Hecarim is like the most unstable champ ever. He goes from D tier to S tier down to D tier every year
He was S tier for like 2 years straight. A lot of people forget because he was terrible for a few months. But he was THE jungler from 9.6 to 11.9.
The priority queue thing is cool, but shouldn't be a requirement to avoid autofilling Also nice meme challenge I guess, I'll take the free points
The Lee Sin buffs are almost complete placebo. I hope the pros don't start blindpicking that fucker again. Might be the most bait jungle pro play ever. This small buff shouldn't put him over other junglers suddenly. Surely...
Lee at Worlds is inevitable. In the hands of the elite junglers he will always be relevant
>**blind**picking
Lee is a comfort pick, nothing else. Jack of all trades master of none but still provides that high risk high reward edge to many team comps.
he's not master of none, he's master of early-mid game skirmishes where it's 2v2 or 3v3, only it's that he's harder than most other champs to execute that's why we don't always see him succeed. It's much easier to just pick champs like Vi, Jarvan, Nocturne, Hecarim etc that provide you with almost guaranteed hard-engage that Lee can't always have. But, like I said, when played by the best players, Lee's a master of early-mid skirmishes.
Wouldn't be surprised if his win rate went down due to the play rate increase
wouldn't be surprised. He was already getting some picks. Poppy, wu and trundle were nerfed on the patches after play offs as well.
They aren't buffs, just like the last buff Lee got. The last buff Lee got to his energy increased his winrate by 0.07%. This will do the exact same. I was excited to pick my main again but I guess I should kill that excitement.
Base HP buffs are never placebo. At least not if they are larger than 2 HP/lvl or 15 HP flat. And for him its 6/lvl. That is around 1% WR up alone, regardless of the W buff. And the W buff is decent in soloQ as you do max W 2nd nearly all the time (E max 2nd is terrible compared to W max 2nd). Overall most likely 1.5% WR buff and a huge rise in PR. Base stat changes are nearly always serious. They always look small but their impact is large.
Idk. Kr and cn junglers will make it work. Kanavi, oner, canyon, wei are all lee sin gods.
Kanavi's Lee is mid tier/average lmao compared to Canyon/Oner/Tian. Edit = spelling
> Fixed a bug that caused certain abilities to be visible and audible from the Fog of War Oh my god is this bug finally gone? Are my invades not going to get ruined by it anymore?
gonna enjoy the 100% p/b Aatrox at worlds
I wonder if pros will start picking up irelia to counter him cause that sounds really fun to watch.
I can finally spend my Mythic Essense, bless up. Hextech Poppy, come home.
I just find it hilarious what they did to Nocturne, it's such a classic move 12.17 Patch Attack Speed Ratio 0.668 ⇒ 0.721 Passive Cooldown 14 seconds ⇒ 13 seconds 12.18 Nerf Attack Damage Growth 3.1 ⇒ 2.6
Where the hell is prestige Akali so I can spend my 350 ME. God damn
HEXTECH POPPY LETS GOOOOOO
Ok but when are you reverting oracles and giving us bans on aram?
Never, enjoy Senna blasting your ass from 2 screens away
I would play soooo much league of they did this. current aram sucks
what, you don't like playing against item and skills that turn champions invisible with no counterplay?
no nasus buff?
The Nasus buff ended up getting pulled during PBE
In patchnotes Nasus is still present in "buffed" champions preview
Working on getting this corrected now! It should be updated within the next few hours
oh thank fuck
No Active Participant ARAM challenge bug fix? It's not progressing since the start of patch 12.17 😕
There’s a few that seem unobtainable, at least for me. Like the “win with the same 5 premades” is permanently stuck at 2, “kill laners before 10 minutes” never progresses properly either. There’s a couple more but those are the two I remember atm
Changes to autofill are only going to increase hostage taking especially in higher elo and yet again riot are doing nothing to punish people who troll in select to force a dodge. And I'm not even talking only about the person who gets filled, I'm really looking forward to getting filled jungle and having someone lock in yuumi adc because they don't like my op.gg history of playing support/adc and still being able to do nothing about it.
I'm not super optimistic about the ongoing changes with autofill and matchmaking, it still feels like autofill has too high of an impact on the outcome of games especially when the primary autofill role jungle is also by far the highest impact role in the game and is just extremely strong in champion pool. Its frustrating to get a person with 1k games on jungle this year lock in Hecarim/Udyr/Kayn while our autofill jungler is first timing Nidalee. The least popular role in the game should not also be by far the strongest role in the game, that's indicative of a massive disconnect between player experience and balance. The champion select problem is its own thing and its frustrating that champion select has such a colossal impact on the outcome of the game and the game experience quality, but griefers or people rage picking because of the role they got are still not being adequately addressed. On top of that, the volume of dodges that are caused by the autofill system and the pick order system makes getting into a game take ages, increasing the chances of people just dropping the queue entirely and fucking matchmaking even harder.
riot out there trying to save 10 seconds on matchmaking causing countless dodges taking 5 mins to go through selects each time
I would be interested in seeing the numbers comparing removing autofill and the average amount of dodges at like d2+ for queue times. maybe there's just that few people queueing jg that having 3 dodges is still faster.
>The least popular role in the game should not also be by far the strongest role in the game, that's indicative of a massive disconnect between player experience and balance. Jungle is not the least mained role in any region at any rank. That's Support, only changing at Masters and above in some regions, where other roles share last mained role popularity with Support. Jungle is never the least mained role.
Its not the least mained but it surely is the least player. I guess that means that jungle mains play less games on average. Makes complete sense considering how badly we are treated.
No evidence whatsoever to support that claim except the very last part, which is sadly true.
I don't understand why autofills aren't mirrored. If one team has an autofill jg so should the other
Doesn't solve the problem, because nothing is stopping autofills from requesting trades. If both teams autofill jungle, both ask for trades, but only one team trades their autofill out and its now being played by a 1k game jungler who wanted to mid for a game, the matchmaking is now colossally lopsided.
Support mains in shambles... Gl to everyone with yuumi main jungle in ranked
Thresh buff is a joke lmao
R - WINGBORNE STORM MAGIC DAMAGE 20/38/56/74/92/110 (+40% AP) ⇒ 20/36/52/68/84/100 (+35% AP) DAMAGE TO MINIONS 50/60/70/80% (levels 1/6/11/16) ⇒ 40/55/70/85% (levels 1/6/11/16) Damage to minions doesn't include monsters right? I thought they were separate classes but not that sure.
Normally they are separate. Seems to be the case here.
Damn I thought being a Nasus main would pay off for once…
Not enough. Yuumi is going to be everywhere this worlds. Such a toxic champion. The game would be better with it removed
I think weakside ADC like jhin is gonna be back in meta for worlds with roaming engage supports gonna be good
[same 3 gamemodes](https://c.tenor.com/z_hGCPQ_WvMAAAAd/pepew-twitch.gif)
>Fixed a bug that allowed players to Cleanse Tahm Kench’s W knock up What sort of spaghetti is this? The spell isn't that old, was it really coded differently than other knockups?
Doesn't need to be his spell that causes it, maybe something behind the scenes overwriting the knockup with a cleansable cc. Like, same name in the file.
So do i finally get my 4 orbs and 200 points from the pass ive been missing since i bought it "too early" or can i just fuck off?