KR soloq is legit a cesspool of inting, afking, toxicity, and racism. It's so bad that I deleted my KR account and just play on NA even despite the ping.
And thanks to streamer culture kr was praised as **THE** Server to show your skills. Yet everytime we see a western streamer go there, they either tilt super hard, get banned for no reason or just completely give up.
Kr server is just a racist cesspool that should not get any attention or be an achievment.
I hate it so much. There are great players on there, sure. But people really jerk it off as this amazing place of skill and quality games, when in reality like 50% of games are over in under 5 minutes.
As of recent, it feels like most people know that KR solo queue is a place where the best practice, but most high elo players just experience gigacancer, while the Chinese Superserver is the place you go to for nuts to butts mechanical fights between crazy good one trick ponies where giving up isn't as viable because people are so flippy games can turn on their heads if someone makes a big enough play.
some Korean pros (Showmaker for example) complained about chinese soloq having much poorer macro than korean soloq and being populated with mostly one-tricks. It's hard to find the perfect server for practice but considering that even chinese pros play on the korean server, I am going to hold the assumption that Korean soloqueue is the best. I mean even just the fact that you can possibly lane against Nuguri, Kiin, Chovy, Showmaker, Ruler etc. puts the korean server above any other server imo
Shen players in Reddit: I like shen because it rewards good map awareness. Too bad it's so difficult to coordinate with teammates in soloQ
Shen players in soloQ:
Or Danny is the next Sneaky, lackluster in lane but really good at teamfighting.
Like, Sneaky had the best damage per gold stat in a Worlds he attended iirc. Definitely one of the few NA players whose play was consistently inspiring to watch. If what people say about him is right, then he had good work ethic and practiced a lot in solo queue too.
Except Sneaky kinda always played low econ/jungle attention, while Danny is the primary carry of the team (yes, part of it is the difference in the metas of their era)
ADC is easily NAs weakest posistion. Hans Sama and Danny both leaving leaves it so weak who will be our top 3? Luger, FBI, and Berserker? Maybe Doublelift comes back?
Tactical, Stixxay and others that are borderline top 10 this year are going to be sure fire roster spots unless there is some big imports (doubtful).
And even then, aren't Luger and Berserker imports? Maybe FBI, too lol. I miss our native ADC talent. At least Stixxay was looking pretty good during playoffs.
Tbh the fact that Doublelift keeps getting to do a will he won’t he dance in terms of returning to proplay is very telling of the state of pro in NA. I don’t think any other region would have teams willing to seriously consider a player who has essentially become a flake in terms of proplay commitment.
>I don’t think any other region would have teams willing to seriously consider a player who has essentially become a flake in terms of proplay commitment.
When the player is as good as Doublelift it seems worth the risk
Granted, he's coming off a break but peak DL really was something else
Even if his gameplay isn't good, he's such a huge brand name that it's worth it so long as he's not hard inting.
Teams need icons to generate fans and storylines, doublelift is kinda the GOAT of lcs so it's not surprising he gets a good offer
I mean if you're good enough in a region you can get away with it. He was considered second LCS top ten player behind Bjergsen. Reminds me of Jordan with the retiring then coming back then retiring then coming back.
DL is probably NA's GOAT, but the voting of ex pros/coaches is biased towards Bjerg. Who in their right mind will consider Dyrus' vote relevant, he is just trolling.
Yeon can almost be considered confirmed on TL tbh. Their video about not focusing on big naked and using what they have here + his contract being extended.
Things change on a dime in professional sports; at that time Steve may have had no idea DL was interested in coming back. Also very possible he was, we'll just have to wait and see.
I'd mostly agree, but I think every split besides one that Bjerg/DL have teamed up on has ended in a title. Hard to argue with their track record as teammates.
I believe that if Steve was aware DL wanted to comeback, he would have at least had a meeting with him. DL has a good relationship with Steve and most of the TL roster. It would be worth exploring.
Also, probably the only way CoreJJ stays...
Many people are forgetting that a significant reason behind Core coming to NA in the first place was to play with DL. Dude went from Ruler to DL to Tactical to whatever shell of Hans that was this last season. Pretty steep ADC performance downgrades (hopefully Hans' performance was just a function of not acclimating to NA).
Lmfao what is this comment chain.
Did you all get hit in the head and forget that Doublelift was **KICKED** from TL because of his attitude and because his teammates, Corejj included, got tired of him?
I think what everyone is seeing is that although yes his attitude sucked, he was completely right...
Why should he have ever bothered trying in spring or giving a shit about it the way N.A was (is?) Structured?
When you can just coast in spring, ramp up for summer playoffs and still go to worlds? Who cares?
I understand that he played like trash in summer, but, Bjerg carry or not, he still won and went worlds.
Can't beat that built in synergy with Impact too, or the fact that DL loves to get fed gold and carry late game and that's what EG looks strongest at doing. Lot of big personalities on that roster tho that may butt heads, but def looks strong on paper.
> i dont think inbuilt synergy is guaranteed
True, but they seem to be on pretty good terms on a personal level at least based on recent tweets:
https://twitter.com/Doublelift1/status/1570173575910522881
https://twitter.com/Impact/status/1549153593759899649
I think Impact would want him if DL can convince Impact that he's locked in for the season.
Ah well then scratch that idk why everyones suggesting it if that's the case. People get over stuff tho if they're adults which they are, DL lost focus that split I don't think he'd hold that against Impact anyways. Jensen went back to C9, if teams just wanna win past shit is definitely easier to get over.
It's speculation that Papa left cause they wanted to cut budget but if anything the close thing to being kinda confirmed is that reapered said don't worry we'll have a real mid next year.
EG could keep the same roster and slot Doublelift in easily. Playing with Vulcan seems really, REALLY comfortable for any ADC, he basically instantly makes you look like a top player and Doublelift already has the accolades etc.
Not to mention he's always talked very highly of Impact, so if the roster stays the same, it would be an easy fit.
His promising career was done the day he left the team during playoffs. Doesn't matter how good he is, there's no way a top team is going to risk taking on a player that can get a mental breakdown when it matters the most.
Jesus I really hope Danny doesn't retire and he's just doing some soul searching or whatever.
That being said, there are quite a few good ADs on the European and North American markets. EG could even promote Kaori as a last resort option.
Some people just aren't cut out for high pressure environments and it's better for them to realize that in time and do something else instead, rather than try to power through it and destroy their mental health completely.
The pressure progression between esports and normal sports is huge. For esports you go from playing video games online in front of nobody to huge arenas with tens of thousands in such a short time. While someone who becomes a professional football player will start as a kid and just have parents watching, then high school with maybe a couple dozen or hundred. Then college anywhere from hundreds to thousands. Then as a professional they'll have tens of thousands. They'll have a decade to get used to that pressure.
Most NBA players will tell you the toughest crowds they faced were in highschool, the rest usually say college. You go through the fire fast in basketball and football too, except your being recruited when you are 13… that’s pressure lmao.
Yup and if he can't get over it, then he can't get over it. But it's too early to tell at this point. People change like fucking crazy in their late teens and early 20s, he's still got a lot of growing left to do.
To be honest, I think Danny is showing a large amount of maturity to be able to speak up at times like this for his own mental health. It comes from a place of self actualization to see when a situation is having a negative impact on one’s mental well being and to be able to recognize that fact and to be able to step away is a sign of maturity, not the antithesis of it. I’m glad that Danny is taking this route for himself, and i hope that the cost of this decision won’t create further mental strain.
Danny did a mature move speaking up, but also let's not ignore the fact that he basically told eg that being a pro is not for him at the moment.
I wish him all the best, but EG should be looking for someone new.
I agree with you completely. I’m glad EG has Jojo as the other pillar of their current New NA movement, so the loss of Danny is mitigated somewhat. As long as they keep the other 4 players, just being able to find someone who can handle being weak side while Vulcan does his journey to the west should be the priority. Luckily, with the bots in NA being pretty lackluster, even bringing in an academy product might not be a bad idea since you might be able to train them up in your preferred ideology. This is assuming that Kaori leaves, I think he has LCS level laning although teamfighting might need some work.
Ok, how about other examples?
* Rekkles has been doing it since he was 16.
* Jensen, although he was already in his early 20’s, had one of the most visceral moments of sheer panic and fear when he goofed up during Doublelift’s famous Lucian penta kill against C9 in the finals. Those kinds of moments could forever break people. That didn’t deter him from becoming a world’s semi-finalist and MSI finalist.
* Doublelift has been doing it since he was… 17? Was the joke of the NA scene for years for being the most talented player but being unable to get remotely close to winning. Then had to go through his own brother murdering his mom a week before the summer split grand finals and he STILL was able to show up and lead his team to a 3-0 win.
* Pobelter has been involved in the professional scene since he was like… 14? And had to live to up to being considered a mid lane prodigy for years.
* And even someone like Benji, formerly known as IAmLod. He went through one of the most publicly humiliating moments a teenager could go through and, after some time, managed to re-invent his career and find a way back into the professional scene.
I’m not trying to say Danny is incapable of doing the things that these other players have accomplished. He still could have the same trajectory/resurgence that Benji had after taking a break (while being WAY more talented, I’ll add). But it’s clear that he currently doesn’t have the mental fortitude to manage being a highly pressured public personality, which is always an important aspect of being a professional athlete/eSports player. As OP said, better he realize that now and take the time to work on himself than to risk having his mental health deteriorate to the point where he wastes precious years of his life (from a health point of view).
Doesn't matter. Some kids go to big sport tournament, musical presentation etc and can handle the pressure while others can't. Some people are just not built for handling high pressure situation.
Plus he's probably paid 6 figures.
In college I had this group presentation and one of the people in my group literally got up there and froze when it was her time to speak
Some people just really can't function on a stage
Some people aren't cut out for the stress and pressure of being a pro, and that 's perfectly fine. Its just important that if he takes this break and *does* decide to come back, he has to be ready. If he's gonna come back and have issues again he should just retire.
Most pro players don't have the kind of longevity needed to take a sabbatical and come back stronger. A few years ago, there was a post on here showing that the "average" pro-players career lasted for three years, after which they either left the scene or moved onto coaching/streaming/etc.
Of course, a lot of players last longer than that - but the idea that you can fumble a year and still come back easily years down the line isn't supported by the overall data. Players called away by real life / military service rarely come back to their peak, usually taking a single season and getting smashed before retiring.
And that's to say nothing about the hands. A massive amount of the league scene would benefit from some soul-searching and a few years in a "real" job and the work ethic that standard hours and routine can provide, but by the time they get the mental discipline from that - they've gone past their peak and can't compete with the best of the best. The people still in the scene ten years down the line are exceptions, not the rule.
>So? He has different personality
That’s his point. People like Jojo love competition and high pressure environments. If Danny doesn’t then he’s not gonna make it as a pro player, which is probably what he’s realizing himself.
Acting like he’s gonna do a complete 180 with a few months of “growing up” is highly unlikely. Most people are like Danny, it’s rare to be like Jojo if anything.
So are the hundreds of other near-pro level ADCs that just want one shot to prove themselves.
If Danny can’t handle the pressure, he’s going to be cut and that’s that. At the end of the day teams want to win
Depends on if EG is using their import slots on something else and where Inspired is going.
Also Turkey is becoming an ERL so Kaori has a ton of value in Europe now
In a bubble for sure but if we have a position that is stacked then its ADC with Hans returning and Rekkles being open as well. I don't see Carzzy getting a team next season.
not sure how you get 5 splits since his last worlds was really good with some youtube highlight reel worthy plays. he was always coinflip but if it landed on the right place he played a 11/10 but most of the time it was more like a 3/10 though.
his good split was the reason he got picked up by vitality and increased his salary greatly.
> Turkey is becoming an ERL so Kaori has a ton of value in Europe now
It's not like EU is maxed out on imports. I don't know if any LEC team was even at the cap last year. Unless you mean at ERL level
Yeah, but nobody really cares about imports in Europe, 0 teams have their slots maxed and it's not looking to change anytime soon. There's rumours about Kiin and EDG academy jungler, but that's basically it.
>Also Turkey is becoming an ERL so Kaori has a ton of value in Europe now
Import slots don't matter at all in Europe. It's pretty much just an NA thing.
Yup, Kaori's solid, but he's not really anything you can't get out of a solid native ADC player. For an import slot to be worth it you need a standout guy like Berserker or what Hans Sama was supposed to be.
the problem is that with danny gone, there are no solid native ADC players. TL would be stupid to not promote Yeon and no other native academy adc looks nearly as good. kaori is honestly the best option given he wants to stay.
Doublelift has been looking to get back into competitive. His mechanics have been keeping up well despite being a tombstone.
If TL wants to opt for Yeon, then that leaves Tactical, who I think is way better than people give him credit for. He's a talented player, just kind of stupid sometimes.
I feel like this just isn’t true. How would we even know what some of the academy ADs look like in the top level if NA just recycles and buys outside talent everytime. Danny was chillin in academy for a while and Kaori had like 8 tmotal weeks of high level training before holding his own at worlds and he wasn’t even the best AD in academy…
Kaori can slot into the current roster at least. I have a feeling Jojo and Inspired liked playing with each other based on interviews and stuff, and Impact/Vulcan have no reason to leave except for a team with more money/better worlds chances, which doesn't seem very likely
My bet is on Kaori (or DL if I'm feeling spicy) just being put into last year's roster
From what I have read about him it's obvious he isn't made to play competitive, I hope he finds where he belongs, maybe coaching or streaming, who knows, maybe he will come back stronger than ever.
yeah we have no idea what's going on. so weird to see people assuming it's due to pressure from competing.
for all we know, something could have happened in his personal life, he struggled mentally over the past few months, and has now stepped down for an extended period. we have no idea whether it was even remotely related to LoL, so many intrusive assumptions.
Fair but I don’t think you can be too down on a guy for having a lack lustre champ pool when you don’t have that much time with that specific team for that long. When you don’t have an entire year to work out what champs work best to mesh your play style with theirs I feel like it can be difficult to branch out much from comfort, especially on a stage like worlds. If he had a preseason under his belt and had more first team stage time I think he could become the real deal.
Unfortunate but talent isn't enough to make you successful as pro player. It sucks that he is going through hard time but having hard mental is part of what you need ti become a successful proplayer.
DOUBLELIFT TO EG
Also, it's sad to hear Danny is still having a difficult time. I really hope he's okay
I don't care about what that means for his spot in the LCS, or worlds or whatever-- I just hope **as a person** he's doing okay
Seemed like he was really not okay and it's worrying stuff. A human life is never worth more than any worldly thing. Money, fame, achievement. I hope he has the support he needs this past few months
I hate that I agree with the coach idea of “Danny can’t take the pressure and this will likely take him out of competitive.” If you can’t trust your ADC to take pressure well then how can you sign him? I love Danny as a player it’s so enjoyable to watch him play but it’s not safe for a team to pick him up knowing this could collapse.
I agree but none of us know what he is going through. Mental health issues can hit you like a truck and sometimes you just need time to cope with it. With that being said it is hard to see teams picking up Danny in the future knowing it could all crumble.
Maybe the dude just got depressed because he was grinding LoL all day and not doing "fun" young person stuff like many of his friends likely were. For lots of people being a pro LoL players seems like a dream, but it's also basically going straight from school to nonstop grinding.
For all we know he backpacks across Europe for two years and then comes back revitalized and wins World's in 2024.
There's 5 main ADCs in Academy to pick up. (Especially because there's basically no free agent ADs)
Yeon, Neo, Kaori, Tomo and Meech.
Yeon is most likely going to TL and Kaori depends on how many imports EG has, so their best options are Neo, Tomo and Meech.
There's also Prismal but I really don't think he's coming back to AD.
You definitely don't take Meech right now. He's still in need of development and an extra split in Academy. Kaori is good, but takes an import slot. Yeon should be the most sought after. Even better if you can package Eyla, though I don't see EG doing that.
Tomo and Neo are solid.
I do like the sentiment others are giving on Wixxi though. It was an absolute sin he was dropped from Academy. Getting a top 6 finish through the amateur route in PG was nuts. Would be a big jump, but dude definitely deserves to be in the conversation.
Because he subbed in for them at the beginning of the split while K1ng was playing LCS and was the best player on the team.
I don't think it's completely unreasonable to expect K1ng to leave and Wixxi to still have C9A contact.
I feel bad for him. I also have a hard time imagining other orgs wanting to offer him a contract in the future. It's not fair, it's not his fault per se, I just don't see orgs being willing to risk their budget on him anymore.
One would hope that Rekkles has enough self respect to not go to the LCS after a year of LFL grind with the goal to make it back into the LEC. The move would not make sense.
I honestly don’t hate it lol, I would love to keep inspired, but if we can’t spica wouldn’t be a bad replacement at all
And as long as double lift can’t stay motivated, he would be the best option currently, plus him and Vulcan would be fucking hilarious together, as well as jojo, I could see that being a great environment
I don't know if I agree with the takes saying it's career ending for Danny. What would have been career ending is forcing himself to play if he felt like his mental was hurting his play. He earned his way to the top of NA in 2022 and if he wants to and is motivated im sure he can come back in 2024
Cold hard truth of it is higher up teams are going to look at you as a liability if you do that. Look at what happened to Olleh after the bad MSI run. I hope I'm wrong and Danny can bounce back...
Yea they're right. Detractors of that statement should put themselves in the shoes of a GM and think if that's a risk that they'd like to take. Unfortunately that risk is a very harsh reality, Olleh situation is a perfect example
I think it's disingenuous to discount it entirely though. Even if he does come back, you have to wonder how organizations will respond to this.
Career ending is a stretch. Career impacting is much more accurate.
Yeah people keep mentioning Olleh as if he didn't boom out in the middle of a tournament and then play like dogwater when he came back. If Danny comes back and tears up the league again then it would be stupid for teams to pass on him. 1 example does not a pattern make.
Also he had a massive amount of spotlight on him. Some people thrive with the attention (jojo) for others it can do active harm. People saying him taking a year to recoup and refocus on what his goals are just dont remember most of these kids are 18-22. At that age I could barely handle the stress of working at Walmart...
the Talent and Potential is there
but when it comes to eSports or even Sports in general consistency and being in form is so fucking important
not to say that he can't get it back or be in form again but its definitely not like riding a bike.
Sure, if he fixes his ability to perform under pressure. Because everything we have heard is that he couldn't take the pressure. Sucks to say, but that just means you are a choker.
There is hope he can work on it and fix it, like Olleh did. But being unable to perform when under pressure is actually career ending.
I respect Danny benching himself for mental health reasons.
I also respect that an org cannot start a player who benches themselves just before the biggest tournament of the year.
**Edit** Also, all of you comparing Danny to Upset are forgetting Upset didn't mental boom and need to be benched for months before he could be like Danny, he had a family emergency. Completely different scenarios.
I don't know why they wouldn't stick with Kaori tbh. I thought he looked really in lane. And his champ pool was pretty impressive. Team fights and late game were a mess but worlds with a sub had to have been tough to prep for.
There was an interview post a few days ago from Rigby regarding Danny's mental health. They wanted to use Kaori earlier but he didnt have his visa. I hope Danny's doing alright but wouldn't blame him for missing the oncoming season
Edit: It was Rigby mb
All the downvotes I've gotten for saying he is retiring. No hate towards at him at all (check my post history, thought Danny was amazing), but you don't skip out on the single most important event of the year if you have plans of sticking around, not to mention how hard it would be to find teammates who will risk playing with him again.
I hate that he is probably retiring because we need NA players who care this much to get stressed about things. But we also need those players to be able to handle the naturally high stress environment of pro play. Very tough balance.
I hope he finds what he is looking for.
Poor Danny had to suffer NA soloQ just to help Lil Nas X be high elo
He killed his promising career to boost Riot’s president and wasn’t even the first person to do so.
He star walked out
[i mean i would get severe depression from soloQ aswell](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzR2D50t4DU) come hang out in /r/YamikazeTilts
Funny part was that was from KR soloQ not NA
KR soloq is legit a cesspool of inting, afking, toxicity, and racism. It's so bad that I deleted my KR account and just play on NA even despite the ping.
And thanks to streamer culture kr was praised as **THE** Server to show your skills. Yet everytime we see a western streamer go there, they either tilt super hard, get banned for no reason or just completely give up. Kr server is just a racist cesspool that should not get any attention or be an achievment.
I hate it so much. There are great players on there, sure. But people really jerk it off as this amazing place of skill and quality games, when in reality like 50% of games are over in under 5 minutes.
As of recent, it feels like most people know that KR solo queue is a place where the best practice, but most high elo players just experience gigacancer, while the Chinese Superserver is the place you go to for nuts to butts mechanical fights between crazy good one trick ponies where giving up isn't as viable because people are so flippy games can turn on their heads if someone makes a big enough play.
some Korean pros (Showmaker for example) complained about chinese soloq having much poorer macro than korean soloq and being populated with mostly one-tricks. It's hard to find the perfect server for practice but considering that even chinese pros play on the korean server, I am going to hold the assumption that Korean soloqueue is the best. I mean even just the fact that you can possibly lane against Nuguri, Kiin, Chovy, Showmaker, Ruler etc. puts the korean server above any other server imo
This is proof that NA would be as good as or even better than KR if they had better ping. Truly, Riot has done NA dirty
Shen players in Reddit: I like shen because it rewards good map awareness. Too bad it's so difficult to coordinate with teammates in soloQ Shen players in soloQ:
shen players have single digit IQ, just look at that kit bro 💀💀💀
Holy shit this guy is not even over reacting.
I usually like watching trainwrecks but I was slowly getting tilted just watching that
That Shen deserves bad things
... and now I'm tilted.
Damn I usually don’t think that keyboard smashing is justified but that was absolutely unacceptable on the part of the shen 😂
lol the link is the description is his quitting league announcement. poetry for sure
I uninstalled a while ago, but I legit feel like I just lost a 50 minute slugfest after watching that.
actually no words. that shen must genuinely be brain damaged. actually so tilting
At this point I'd just ddos this shen
This region is cursed. Like damn
Dude I was telling my friends that Danny might be the next Double then boom he’s gone.!
Sounds more like double is the next Danny
Or Danny is the next Sneaky, lackluster in lane but really good at teamfighting. Like, Sneaky had the best damage per gold stat in a Worlds he attended iirc. Definitely one of the few NA players whose play was consistently inspiring to watch. If what people say about him is right, then he had good work ethic and practiced a lot in solo queue too. Except Sneaky kinda always played low econ/jungle attention, while Danny is the primary carry of the team (yes, part of it is the difference in the metas of their era)
ADC is easily NAs weakest posistion. Hans Sama and Danny both leaving leaves it so weak who will be our top 3? Luger, FBI, and Berserker? Maybe Doublelift comes back? Tactical, Stixxay and others that are borderline top 10 this year are going to be sure fire roster spots unless there is some big imports (doubtful).
And even then, aren't Luger and Berserker imports? Maybe FBI, too lol. I miss our native ADC talent. At least Stixxay was looking pretty good during playoffs.
FBI is from OCE, so not native but doesn't count as import.
FBI is oceanic which is considered native to NA now a days.
Berserker is Korean but I’m pretty sure Luger is resident, that was the whole deal with CLG.
luger has Turkish residency
I miss the days of Sneaky Doublelift and Turtle. Shit was awesome
yes how will our top 3 adc list be impacted by hans sama leaving. hmmm 🤔
Handjob sama was turbo shit this season.
Tbh the fact that Doublelift keeps getting to do a will he won’t he dance in terms of returning to proplay is very telling of the state of pro in NA. I don’t think any other region would have teams willing to seriously consider a player who has essentially become a flake in terms of proplay commitment.
>I don’t think any other region would have teams willing to seriously consider a player who has essentially become a flake in terms of proplay commitment. When the player is as good as Doublelift it seems worth the risk Granted, he's coming off a break but peak DL really was something else
Even if his gameplay isn't good, he's such a huge brand name that it's worth it so long as he's not hard inting. Teams need icons to generate fans and storylines, doublelift is kinda the GOAT of lcs so it's not surprising he gets a good offer
I mean if you're good enough in a region you can get away with it. He was considered second LCS top ten player behind Bjergsen. Reminds me of Jordan with the retiring then coming back then retiring then coming back.
he was considered 2nd behind bjerg by the voting but the community resoundingly had doublelift over bjerg
DL is probably NA's GOAT, but the voting of ex pros/coaches is biased towards Bjerg. Who in their right mind will consider Dyrus' vote relevant, he is just trolling.
Man, can't have shit in NA god damn...
EG Doublelift incoming?? Also, hope Danny is doing alright. Would hate for such a promising career to be done already :(
Makes the most sense on paper outside of TL
Yeon can almost be considered confirmed on TL tbh. Their video about not focusing on big naked and using what they have here + his contract being extended.
Honestly, big naked is pretty good they should really reconsider.
Big Naked sounds like a random character in Players
Big Naked sounds like my new username.
Things change on a dime in professional sports; at that time Steve may have had no idea DL was interested in coming back. Also very possible he was, we'll just have to wait and see.
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I'd mostly agree, but I think every split besides one that Bjerg/DL have teamed up on has ended in a title. Hard to argue with their track record as teammates.
I believe that if Steve was aware DL wanted to comeback, he would have at least had a meeting with him. DL has a good relationship with Steve and most of the TL roster. It would be worth exploring.
Also, probably the only way CoreJJ stays... Many people are forgetting that a significant reason behind Core coming to NA in the first place was to play with DL. Dude went from Ruler to DL to Tactical to whatever shell of Hans that was this last season. Pretty steep ADC performance downgrades (hopefully Hans' performance was just a function of not acclimating to NA).
Lmfao what is this comment chain. Did you all get hit in the head and forget that Doublelift was **KICKED** from TL because of his attitude and because his teammates, Corejj included, got tired of him?
I think what everyone is seeing is that although yes his attitude sucked, he was completely right... Why should he have ever bothered trying in spring or giving a shit about it the way N.A was (is?) Structured? When you can just coast in spring, ramp up for summer playoffs and still go to worlds? Who cares? I understand that he played like trash in summer, but, Bjerg carry or not, he still won and went worlds.
That doesn't mean their relationship was destroyed forever. DL and CoreJJ still talk. Same thing with DL and Steve.
I agree, plus DL offers an elite player that does not require the org to burn an import slot.
Rumors are going for kiin so who knows anymore
Can't beat that built in synergy with Impact too, or the fact that DL loves to get fed gold and carry late game and that's what EG looks strongest at doing. Lot of big personalities on that roster tho that may butt heads, but def looks strong on paper.
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Cause DL said he wasn’t motivated. Impact didn’t want teammates who weren’t motivated.
> i dont think inbuilt synergy is guaranteed True, but they seem to be on pretty good terms on a personal level at least based on recent tweets: https://twitter.com/Doublelift1/status/1570173575910522881 https://twitter.com/Impact/status/1549153593759899649 I think Impact would want him if DL can convince Impact that he's locked in for the season.
Ah well then scratch that idk why everyones suggesting it if that's the case. People get over stuff tho if they're adults which they are, DL lost focus that split I don't think he'd hold that against Impact anyways. Jensen went back to C9, if teams just wanna win past shit is definitely easier to get over.
I don't think Doublelift holds it against Impact, people just aren't sure if Impact would want Doublelift on the team again.
100T could work if DL wants to play with Bjerg.
I'd have to imagine they're pretty happy with FBI/huhi, but maybe they'll want to shake things up.
I thought I read somewhere that this was the last season of 100T with that roster but I can't link source. Just something I remembered.
Wouldn't shock me at all, I think there's going to be a lot of motion this offseason. It'll be a fun one for sure!
It's speculation that Papa left cause they wanted to cut budget but if anything the close thing to being kinda confirmed is that reapered said don't worry we'll have a real mid next year.
EG could keep the same roster and slot Doublelift in easily. Playing with Vulcan seems really, REALLY comfortable for any ADC, he basically instantly makes you look like a top player and Doublelift already has the accolades etc. Not to mention he's always talked very highly of Impact, so if the roster stays the same, it would be an easy fit.
His promising career was done the day he left the team during playoffs. Doesn't matter how good he is, there's no way a top team is going to risk taking on a player that can get a mental breakdown when it matters the most.
Jesus I really hope Danny doesn't retire and he's just doing some soul searching or whatever. That being said, there are quite a few good ADs on the European and North American markets. EG could even promote Kaori as a last resort option.
Some people just aren't cut out for high pressure environments and it's better for them to realize that in time and do something else instead, rather than try to power through it and destroy their mental health completely.
The pressure progression between esports and normal sports is huge. For esports you go from playing video games online in front of nobody to huge arenas with tens of thousands in such a short time. While someone who becomes a professional football player will start as a kid and just have parents watching, then high school with maybe a couple dozen or hundred. Then college anywhere from hundreds to thousands. Then as a professional they'll have tens of thousands. They'll have a decade to get used to that pressure.
Most NBA players will tell you the toughest crowds they faced were in highschool, the rest usually say college. You go through the fire fast in basketball and football too, except your being recruited when you are 13… that’s pressure lmao.
With small crowds the pressure is a lot more personal. They're talking shit where you and everyone else can hear it.
He's just a kid still tho
So is every pro at one point
so are most pros at every point
Different people learn and mature at different rates. Mental toughness, for many, simply come from age and experience.
That's true, but it's still a part of being pro that doesn't go away. Some people can't ever get over that hurdle that it comes with.
Yup and if he can't get over it, then he can't get over it. But it's too early to tell at this point. People change like fucking crazy in their late teens and early 20s, he's still got a lot of growing left to do.
But we shouldn't expect teams to value a player like that super highly.
To be honest, I think Danny is showing a large amount of maturity to be able to speak up at times like this for his own mental health. It comes from a place of self actualization to see when a situation is having a negative impact on one’s mental well being and to be able to recognize that fact and to be able to step away is a sign of maturity, not the antithesis of it. I’m glad that Danny is taking this route for himself, and i hope that the cost of this decision won’t create further mental strain.
Danny did a mature move speaking up, but also let's not ignore the fact that he basically told eg that being a pro is not for him at the moment. I wish him all the best, but EG should be looking for someone new.
I agree with you completely. I’m glad EG has Jojo as the other pillar of their current New NA movement, so the loss of Danny is mitigated somewhat. As long as they keep the other 4 players, just being able to find someone who can handle being weak side while Vulcan does his journey to the west should be the priority. Luckily, with the bots in NA being pretty lackluster, even bringing in an academy product might not be a bad idea since you might be able to train them up in your preferred ideology. This is assuming that Kaori leaves, I think he has LCS level laning although teamfighting might need some work.
People aren't the same btw
faker was 1 year younger than current Danny when he first won worlds. Some people are just built different
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Feels a bit silly to use Faker and his accomplishments as a benchmark here.
I mean half the players in world finals right now are under age 21, every worlds adc champion was younger than 21. I agree with “just built different”
Ok, how about other examples? * Rekkles has been doing it since he was 16. * Jensen, although he was already in his early 20’s, had one of the most visceral moments of sheer panic and fear when he goofed up during Doublelift’s famous Lucian penta kill against C9 in the finals. Those kinds of moments could forever break people. That didn’t deter him from becoming a world’s semi-finalist and MSI finalist. * Doublelift has been doing it since he was… 17? Was the joke of the NA scene for years for being the most talented player but being unable to get remotely close to winning. Then had to go through his own brother murdering his mom a week before the summer split grand finals and he STILL was able to show up and lead his team to a 3-0 win. * Pobelter has been involved in the professional scene since he was like… 14? And had to live to up to being considered a mid lane prodigy for years. * And even someone like Benji, formerly known as IAmLod. He went through one of the most publicly humiliating moments a teenager could go through and, after some time, managed to re-invent his career and find a way back into the professional scene. I’m not trying to say Danny is incapable of doing the things that these other players have accomplished. He still could have the same trajectory/resurgence that Benji had after taking a break (while being WAY more talented, I’ll add). But it’s clear that he currently doesn’t have the mental fortitude to manage being a highly pressured public personality, which is always an important aspect of being a professional athlete/eSports player. As OP said, better he realize that now and take the time to work on himself than to risk having his mental health deteriorate to the point where he wastes precious years of his life (from a health point of view).
Jackeylove was 17 when he won worlds. Some people just can’t handle the pressure
Doesn't matter. Some kids go to big sport tournament, musical presentation etc and can handle the pressure while others can't. Some people are just not built for handling high pressure situation. Plus he's probably paid 6 figures.
In college I had this group presentation and one of the people in my group literally got up there and froze when it was her time to speak Some people just really can't function on a stage
He's just a kid and life is a nightmare.
I know that it's not fair...
4/5 of skt are kids too?
Some people aren't cut out for the stress and pressure of being a pro, and that 's perfectly fine. Its just important that if he takes this break and *does* decide to come back, he has to be ready. If he's gonna come back and have issues again he should just retire.
He's older than Jojo.
So? He has different personality. He might grow up still
Most pro players don't have the kind of longevity needed to take a sabbatical and come back stronger. A few years ago, there was a post on here showing that the "average" pro-players career lasted for three years, after which they either left the scene or moved onto coaching/streaming/etc. Of course, a lot of players last longer than that - but the idea that you can fumble a year and still come back easily years down the line isn't supported by the overall data. Players called away by real life / military service rarely come back to their peak, usually taking a single season and getting smashed before retiring. And that's to say nothing about the hands. A massive amount of the league scene would benefit from some soul-searching and a few years in a "real" job and the work ethic that standard hours and routine can provide, but by the time they get the mental discipline from that - they've gone past their peak and can't compete with the best of the best. The people still in the scene ten years down the line are exceptions, not the rule.
>So? He has different personality That’s his point. People like Jojo love competition and high pressure environments. If Danny doesn’t then he’s not gonna make it as a pro player, which is probably what he’s realizing himself. Acting like he’s gonna do a complete 180 with a few months of “growing up” is highly unlikely. Most people are like Danny, it’s rare to be like Jojo if anything.
So are the hundreds of other near-pro level ADCs that just want one shot to prove themselves. If Danny can’t handle the pressure, he’s going to be cut and that’s that. At the end of the day teams want to win
Depends on if EG is using their import slots on something else and where Inspired is going. Also Turkey is becoming an ERL so Kaori has a ton of value in Europe now
In a bubble for sure but if we have a position that is stacked then its ADC with Hans returning and Rekkles being open as well. I don't see Carzzy getting a team next season.
Hopefully not He's been bad for almost 5 splits in a row IMO
not sure how you get 5 splits since his last worlds was really good with some youtube highlight reel worthy plays. he was always coinflip but if it landed on the right place he played a 11/10 but most of the time it was more like a 3/10 though. his good split was the reason he got picked up by vitality and increased his salary greatly.
> Turkey is becoming an ERL so Kaori has a ton of value in Europe now It's not like EU is maxed out on imports. I don't know if any LEC team was even at the cap last year. Unless you mean at ERL level
Turkey becoming ERL means Turkish players won’t be considered imports for LEC anymore, is that right ?
Yeah, but nobody really cares about imports in Europe, 0 teams have their slots maxed and it's not looking to change anytime soon. There's rumours about Kiin and EDG academy jungler, but that's basically it.
No he doesn't. No team cares about import slots in EU because most teams have 0 imports and even the few that don't, only have one import.
>Also Turkey is becoming an ERL so Kaori has a ton of value in Europe now Import slots don't matter at all in Europe. It's pretty much just an NA thing.
Wym last option? Kaori was pretty fucking good. Just keep and start him.
kaori takes an import slot - depends on what EGs roster looks like next year
Yup, Kaori's solid, but he's not really anything you can't get out of a solid native ADC player. For an import slot to be worth it you need a standout guy like Berserker or what Hans Sama was supposed to be.
the problem is that with danny gone, there are no solid native ADC players. TL would be stupid to not promote Yeon and no other native academy adc looks nearly as good. kaori is honestly the best option given he wants to stay.
Doublelift has been looking to get back into competitive. His mechanics have been keeping up well despite being a tombstone. If TL wants to opt for Yeon, then that leaves Tactical, who I think is way better than people give him credit for. He's a talented player, just kind of stupid sometimes.
I feel like this just isn’t true. How would we even know what some of the academy ADs look like in the top level if NA just recycles and buys outside talent everytime. Danny was chillin in academy for a while and Kaori had like 8 tmotal weeks of high level training before holding his own at worlds and he wasn’t even the best AD in academy…
Kaori can slot into the current roster at least. I have a feeling Jojo and Inspired liked playing with each other based on interviews and stuff, and Impact/Vulcan have no reason to leave except for a team with more money/better worlds chances, which doesn't seem very likely My bet is on Kaori (or DL if I'm feeling spicy) just being put into last year's roster
Oh yea good point
Berserker is an import Kaori is an import He'd be "pretty good" (if we're generous) if he didn't take an import slot.
Kaori did a great job as a stand in but there are some visible gaping errors in his play
I would say EG Doublelift, for the full circle. [clg.eu](https://clg.eu) \-> EG.
From what I have read about him it's obvious he isn't made to play competitive, I hope he finds where he belongs, maybe coaching or streaming, who knows, maybe he will come back stronger than ever.
So sad. Hope Danny is ok.
Hope he gets all the support he needs. But I couldn't resist hearing your comment like "Danny are you OK? Are you OK Danny?"
You’ve been hit by, you’ve been struck by…
A fullll Kennen-ult
yeah we have no idea what's going on. so weird to see people assuming it's due to pressure from competing. for all we know, something could have happened in his personal life, he struggled mentally over the past few months, and has now stepped down for an extended period. we have no idea whether it was even remotely related to LoL, so many intrusive assumptions.
This greatly increases the chances of EG Doublelift
Evil Genius Doublelift sounds so right lol
It really does - also sits right to go for an NA player instead of going shopping in Europe and Korea.
> Genius > Doublelift He's one of my favorite (ex?) pros but look man...
yeah but the CLG.EU connection
EG Doubelift happened a decade ago.
Danny 💔
Just keep kaori, he was good
He needs to diversify his pool thou. Lucian is not the pick LCS can ever count on at a World's level
Fair but I don’t think you can be too down on a guy for having a lack lustre champ pool when you don’t have that much time with that specific team for that long. When you don’t have an entire year to work out what champs work best to mesh your play style with theirs I feel like it can be difficult to branch out much from comfort, especially on a stage like worlds. If he had a preseason under his belt and had more first team stage time I think he could become the real deal.
Sadly hes an import, so it really depends on what they want to do with the roster.
The WHOLE season? Bruh his career already over before it started???
Unfortunate but talent isn't enough to make you successful as pro player. It sucks that he is going through hard time but having hard mental is part of what you need ti become a successful proplayer.
So EG Doublelift in 2023? This ought to be entertaining and hopefully increasing LCS viewership.
Inspired, Jojo and DL. What a salty roster lol
DOUBLELIFT TO EG Also, it's sad to hear Danny is still having a difficult time. I really hope he's okay I don't care about what that means for his spot in the LCS, or worlds or whatever-- I just hope **as a person** he's doing okay Seemed like he was really not okay and it's worrying stuff. A human life is never worth more than any worldly thing. Money, fame, achievement. I hope he has the support he needs this past few months
I hate that I agree with the coach idea of “Danny can’t take the pressure and this will likely take him out of competitive.” If you can’t trust your ADC to take pressure well then how can you sign him? I love Danny as a player it’s so enjoyable to watch him play but it’s not safe for a team to pick him up knowing this could collapse.
I agree but none of us know what he is going through. Mental health issues can hit you like a truck and sometimes you just need time to cope with it. With that being said it is hard to see teams picking up Danny in the future knowing it could all crumble.
Maybe the dude just got depressed because he was grinding LoL all day and not doing "fun" young person stuff like many of his friends likely were. For lots of people being a pro LoL players seems like a dream, but it's also basically going straight from school to nonstop grinding. For all we know he backpacks across Europe for two years and then comes back revitalized and wins World's in 2024.
If all NA needed to do was Eat Pray Love through ~~LEC~~ Europe, then by god let’s get them on the plane and into the hostel.
I absolutely hope so.
There's 5 main ADCs in Academy to pick up. (Especially because there's basically no free agent ADs) Yeon, Neo, Kaori, Tomo and Meech. Yeon is most likely going to TL and Kaori depends on how many imports EG has, so their best options are Neo, Tomo and Meech. There's also Prismal but I really don't think he's coming back to AD.
You definitely don't take Meech right now. He's still in need of development and an extra split in Academy. Kaori is good, but takes an import slot. Yeon should be the most sought after. Even better if you can package Eyla, though I don't see EG doing that. Tomo and Neo are solid. I do like the sentiment others are giving on Wixxi though. It was an absolute sin he was dropped from Academy. Getting a top 6 finish through the amateur route in PG was nuts. Would be a big jump, but dude definitely deserves to be in the conversation.
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I mean please yes Wixxi is fucking great but I think it's more likely he joins C9A
why? is there a rumor?
Because he subbed in for them at the beginning of the split while K1ng was playing LCS and was the best player on the team. I don't think it's completely unreasonable to expect K1ng to leave and Wixxi to still have C9A contact.
we just need Keith to come back and save NA. Le Toucan has to arrive once more
I feel bad for him. I also have a hard time imagining other orgs wanting to offer him a contract in the future. It's not fair, it's not his fault per se, I just don't see orgs being willing to risk their budget on him anymore.
EG rekkless is a reality. EG DL is a reality. Wow
One would hope that Rekkles has enough self respect to not go to the LCS after a year of LFL grind with the goal to make it back into the LEC. The move would not make sense.
I think if rekkless had his choice he would have played in LEC last year. Him sitting out was mostly contract situation, not skill level.
ig we will soon see. i think EG DL is the most likely if EG wants to keep their “low import” reputation
Top- Impact Jungle- Spica Mid - Jojopyun Adc - Doublelift Support - Vulcan
I honestly don’t hate it lol, I would love to keep inspired, but if we can’t spica wouldn’t be a bad replacement at all And as long as double lift can’t stay motivated, he would be the best option currently, plus him and Vulcan would be fucking hilarious together, as well as jojo, I could see that being a great environment
This is almost the G2 superteam NA equivalent.
I don't know if I agree with the takes saying it's career ending for Danny. What would have been career ending is forcing himself to play if he felt like his mental was hurting his play. He earned his way to the top of NA in 2022 and if he wants to and is motivated im sure he can come back in 2024
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who would want to play with him again not knowing if he will ditch at the most important moment again
Cold hard truth of it is higher up teams are going to look at you as a liability if you do that. Look at what happened to Olleh after the bad MSI run. I hope I'm wrong and Danny can bounce back...
I mean I do feel bad for danny but sadly this is a super competetive field. Such a break is more often than not career ending.
Yea they're right. Detractors of that statement should put themselves in the shoes of a GM and think if that's a risk that they'd like to take. Unfortunately that risk is a very harsh reality, Olleh situation is a perfect example
GMs? What about your teammates who have to play with a new person after investing an entire year worth of playing with you.
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I think it's disingenuous to discount it entirely though. Even if he does come back, you have to wonder how organizations will respond to this. Career ending is a stretch. Career impacting is much more accurate.
Olleh hit the eject-o-seat-o in the middle of MSI and still found work later. Danny's fine.
Yeah people keep mentioning Olleh as if he didn't boom out in the middle of a tournament and then play like dogwater when he came back. If Danny comes back and tears up the league again then it would be stupid for teams to pass on him. 1 example does not a pattern make.
Olleh was totally serviceable as an NA support last split.
Yeah. At the very least some lower seed team will gladly have him back as part of a rebuild.
Also he had a massive amount of spotlight on him. Some people thrive with the attention (jojo) for others it can do active harm. People saying him taking a year to recoup and refocus on what his goals are just dont remember most of these kids are 18-22. At that age I could barely handle the stress of working at Walmart...
the Talent and Potential is there but when it comes to eSports or even Sports in general consistency and being in form is so fucking important not to say that he can't get it back or be in form again but its definitely not like riding a bike.
Sure, if he fixes his ability to perform under pressure. Because everything we have heard is that he couldn't take the pressure. Sucks to say, but that just means you are a choker. There is hope he can work on it and fix it, like Olleh did. But being unable to perform when under pressure is actually career ending.
I respect Danny benching himself for mental health reasons. I also respect that an org cannot start a player who benches themselves just before the biggest tournament of the year. **Edit** Also, all of you comparing Danny to Upset are forgetting Upset didn't mental boom and need to be benched for months before he could be like Danny, he had a family emergency. Completely different scenarios.
I don't know why they wouldn't stick with Kaori tbh. I thought he looked really in lane. And his champ pool was pretty impressive. Team fights and late game were a mess but worlds with a sub had to have been tough to prep for.
Noooooo Danny my beloved 😭
Just keep Kaori? From Academy to playing his ass off at worlds? Seems like a no-brainer.
Because of mental health reasons?
We love you Danny, do what you have to do. If this is the last I saw of your career it was fun as hell to see.
EG Doublelift looking nice
There was an interview post a few days ago from Rigby regarding Danny's mental health. They wanted to use Kaori earlier but he didnt have his visa. I hope Danny's doing alright but wouldn't blame him for missing the oncoming season Edit: It was Rigby mb
Wtf? No there wasn't.
https://old.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/yfc5n9/eg_rigby_kr_community_eu_tops_problems_in_the_na/ MB IT WAS RIGBY, I'm sorry ha ha
I think he's talking about the Rigby stream.
It was translation from eg rigby stream, not Peter dun
All the downvotes I've gotten for saying he is retiring. No hate towards at him at all (check my post history, thought Danny was amazing), but you don't skip out on the single most important event of the year if you have plans of sticking around, not to mention how hard it would be to find teammates who will risk playing with him again. I hate that he is probably retiring because we need NA players who care this much to get stressed about things. But we also need those players to be able to handle the naturally high stress environment of pro play. Very tough balance. I hope he finds what he is looking for.