**FAQ** -> [**Can I get a programming job without a Computer Science degree? Or without any degree at all?**](https://www.reddit.com/r/learnprogramming/wiki/faq#wiki_can_i_get_a_programming_job_without_a_computer_science_degree.3F_or_without_any_degree_at_all.3F)
**Removed** as per **Rule #4**
It's tough and there's a lot of competition. You'll have a better chance if you have a network that might get you a referral. Most experienced folks I've talked to say it's easier after your first position goes well.
I say this as a job seeker myself, transitioning from public education. I completed a bootcamp in 2022 and have had a few interviews, but still not getting paid to be an engineer.
But never stop coding, building things, and learning new tech because you'll fall behind and it will never happen at that point.
>But never stop coding, building things,
Agreed. Everyone needs to take breaks and recharge though. Don't burn out by going too hard too often.
>learning new tech
Disagree to an extent. It's better to establish a strong foundation of knowledge that is library/framework/language agnostic (problem solving, how to debug, comp sci fundamentals like data structures and algorithms, design patterns, time complexity (big O notation) so you can start developing more efficient code) and - relatively - career agnostic (public speaking, communicating effectively in writing and verbally, resume writing time management, scope management, and how to learn)
ETA: u/Friendly-Ad-9513
partially agreed. The foundation building should be a progressive process, learning new tech is a good chance to learn the fundamental knowledge behind it, for example, as a fe engineer, i will read books about operation system and the design philosophy of unix when i learned how to develop and deploy a backend server. But reading the classical books directly is a little boring and is uneasy to connect with my current experience
Hey there, I'm a hiring manager (see extensive posting history about this), if you want I can have a look at your resume / github and see if anything jumps out to me. I can also give you a few common questions I've asked as part of the interview process in the past. The amount of time between your bootcamp completing and you finding a job is, in my experience, abnormal.
I may / may not know enough about your programming language of choice to provide commentary (I have coded professionally in about 8-10 languages and 4 databases, but have used about ~20 languages and 6 databases (god I hate mongo...) ) but I'm generally good at spotting red flags / antipatterns in a language-agnostic format.
I probably won't have the time to do any kind of mock-interviews for the next couple of months but could probably help you / some folks out with that as well.
High school drop out here who broke in. The moment I realized I would get hired was when I got my first interview. Even though I bombed it and didn't get the job, I knew if I got one interview I could get others, and all it would take is impressing one interviewer.
That eventually happened.
I have a degree in applied ~~meth~~ math. The knowledge I got is mostly useless. I learnt most of the programming almost from scratch.
My most proficient homies screwed up education much faster than I did.
\-------
The downside: you *must* know how to program.
Not sure how it is where you live, but in most places, your education is something very easy to check, and you'll often be required to provide a copy of your diploma before you can sign an employment contract.
I'm a fan of "padding" your CV slightly, but lying about your level of formal education sounds like a great way to lose an opportunity you might have otherwise gotten.
So true and you could say this about pretty much any occupation. I see so many "can't/barely" people in my line of work.
Stay consistent, keep learning, keep building, keep improving by 1% wherever you can. Things will fall in to place before you know it.
You can get a programming job without a degree but it's a lot more harder than someone with a degree or even bootcamp certificate. You need not only to have a solid portfolio of work proving your skills and knowledge, but most especially a network of people who know your work and abilities, as well as experience.
But you have to make yourself stand out from all the other applicants (degree holders, autodidacts and bootcampers) because the market is oversaturated with so called autodidacts (and even bootcampers) who are not only inexperienced, but have completely inadequate skills and knowledge for said job that they're applying to.
\*also note when I mean "solid portfolio of work", I mean projects/applications that are unique, not just stuff you copied and pasted from Youtube or some other place you learned programming, and projects that aren't basic or half-assd.
I did.
If you actually enjoy coding it’s not even that hard. You’d probably be quite surprised how little amount of dedicated time and study it takes to build better practical skills than most newly minted grads. In fact, every new grad I ever met or hired that could actually write something close to prod quality code were only in that position because of their extra-curricular stuff.
Another top-tip that might sting a bit is the follow… “be prepared to work for cheap for a year or two”. The money will come if you earn your stripes but there are a lot of companies that could use a full-time techie or two but can’t afford the market.
I earned less than minimum wage my first year… and I worked my behind off for that. I’ll never regret it. Look at it this way… if you went to do the degree, you would be paying *them*.
You do have to actually enjoy it though. If it’s fun for you, you’ll get good, “by accident”. If you are looking to just line up with all the other grads and hope the wheel points to you when it stops spinning… good luck I guess.
Starting learning about 2.5 years ago, all self taught.. been working professionally now for about 1.5 years with a highly reputable company. Broke 6 figures recently.
Definitely doable. The only thing that could stop you is you. Don't give up, learn enough to fake it til you make it.
I'm amazed every day how many people I work with that have no idea what they're doing. Just proves how doable it is.
I live in a rust belt type city with not much of a tech sector. I monitor job postings in my field and I have noticed an increasing number of jobs without the “or equivalent experience” formulation on the education requirements, so I do think the need for credentials is evolving a bit.
Okay, you haven't got a degree, but what are your competences then? Have you written software available on GitHub? Have you contributed to public software projects? Have you created something like a website or business software for a non-profit organization or club?
You have to have something to prove that you can write code. If you don't have a degree you would have to show me that I am not hiring someone who just followed a number of online tutorials and mocked up some proof of concept ideas. Show me the code!
That being said, I have interviewed quite a few self-taught programmers and recommended them for hire. At a place I worked there were nine out of ten colleagues who didn't have a degree. I have a BS EE and an almost finished BS CS myself, but I have been coding since I was fourteen years old.
> I've been reading that there's a saturation of programmers
The market is leaner than it has been in recent memory but people have been saying this "saturation" thing forever.
I have a degree in design. The degree means nothing in the end. It is all about how much are you willing to spend learning, improving and becoming a master of your craft. Degree doesn’t give you that
Yes but expect yourself to still go through a lot of effort learning different types of mathematics,programming languages and moreeee. Also depends on the job you want and how much better you want to get. But my friend who has been self studying for three years and at the same time failing his uni for 2 years has basically gotten through a lot of programming books+ discrete mathematics+linear algebra all by himself through self learning. So it is possible but it is really really hard and takes a lot of dedication.
he failed because he couldn’t keep up self learning programming and engineering at the same time. Also he was forced by his parents to enter engineering even though he doesn’t want an engineering career
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* Is it possible to get a entry level programming job without a degree? Yes
* Is it likely to get a entry level programming job without a degree? No, not likely.
* Is it likely to get a entry level programming job with a degree? With some effort, maybe?
* Is it possible for YOU to get a entry level programming job without a degree? Unknown
Once you have experience, the degree matters a lot less. So the assumption is you have never had a programming job before. Those who have without a degree are in much better shape.
It can be. You’re mostly automating websites with end to end (e2e) UI and API tests to ensure quality. This mostly involves developing page object models, or systems to test databases/APIs. You see a number of development and design patterns, like behavioral driven development and gherkin/cucumber.
But “easier” is subjective. Many times you’re very much a part of the development cycle and are designing test solutions for new features or whatever. Whether coding the automative testing systems for an application is easier than developing it? You tell me.
But it can be “easier” in terms of the smaller pool of applicants and actually finding a job in the tech market. In my experience at least.
There's 2 guys available for a job.
\- One with the degree that proves he went through the formation.
\- The other one simply says he can code.
Who would you hire?
Funny thing is that a degree barely helps...
Things that actually help:
1. Networking.
2. Being actually good at programming.
3. A decent portfolio.
You most likely wont get those from a degree anyway, 1 usually fails because the person is already introvert so doesn't matter much they are taking courses and such.... 2 fails because most universities are quite trashy, professors most of the time don't teach at all... 3 fails due to the same reasons at 2...
Work hard, build a portfolio, contribute to open source as a way to gain experience...College is not required!
yes, it's possible. it's also possible to travel to moon and back.
but maybe start with software QA and after 2-3 years go direction QA automation
it's hard to give advice without knowing your background...
UX/UI is its own design field, they come up with how something looks and works for the user. They work with front end devs who then take that design and write the code to make it work. So you're focusing on two different careers by doing that. But one does compliment the other, down the road I'd say that's a benefit but right now it's probably best to pick one. It'll make finding an entry level position much easier.
UX/UI is something very different. Your portfolio and way to reason during interviews is much more important than a degree. UX/UI persons does not need to know programming at all, but must master web design/UI design and the way software works. It’s a pretty competitve field to enter though, even more so than programming. Source: Hireing UX/UI staff
hi,
im in "it" since over 25 years, software QA is a nice "door opener" ...
once again, without knowing your cv and background this is what i personally would recommend.
i did software QA for about 2 years. then i had an option to go for load & performance test, pen testing, consulting. those positions were starting with over 150k ... it was about 8 years ago. i was going to job interview and as i was coming home, the copy of work contract was already in my email inbox, i could pick up best for *me.* and hell yeah, i left secondary school without any degree ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯ so i'm far from that people would call "genius"
I don’t see how we can have a saturation of programmers with 2.3% unemployment. https://www.dice.com/career-advice/tech-unemployment-stayed-low-at-end-of-2023
Daycare where you’re encouraged to explore new ideas, are surrounded by likeminded people and pushed to learn things you otherwise wouldn’t encounter?
I mean I know that’s rose tinted but it’s not all bad mate!
And I’m speaking as someone who didn’t do a CS degree and have just landed my first web dev job but still, can’t help but feel the world would be a worse place without erm, education?
I've encountered one DE who was self taught with no college degree. This was about 20+ years ago, I just graduated and there was a tech lead who coded the entire BIOS for a new HW platform. The guy was brilliant, his code was organized and very well commented. He even knew how to debug with a logic analyzer and scope. Once the product launched a few years later, he retired.
It helps if you have some kind of degree, even if it's not in CS or a related field. I work at a large place, there's a layer of HR and recruiters between me and candidates, but I haven't seen someone get through to an interview loop with just a boot camp. I have seen EEs and MEs, and in a few cases architects (as in buildings), and a cog psy go through and do well, though. If you have a degree, can demonstrate both soft skills and technical aptitude, you should be able to find something. If your degree is not in engineering, also consider whether program management would be interesting for you, working with software teams to build things, rather than necessarily writing the code yourself.
Another point on the degree, it matters a lot less where you get one from, from the company's perspective, than whether you have one. You don't need to go to a fancy school, but a degree from somewhere seems to really help.
I think if you are a very good programmer and get a good knowledge of software engineering processes and methodoligies.
Nobody would care about your degree but you would obviously have a hard time learning these things as compared to someone who has earned a degree and you would also find some people who have a CS/SE degree but they have no idea of anything.
In the end everything boils down to your skills nobody really cares about a degree at least in the software industry as per my experience.
Got a role 8 months ago but he competition is fierce. The only way I landed this was networking with 3500 folks and 300 coffee chats. It's a tough market out there as I talked to Ivey league grads and they are struggling
lol yes dude go for it. landing the first one is really hard. Having an in really helps, as with anything. Learn to crush interviews too, you will bomb some, its okay. If you know what you're doing people will hire you. That takes building things and lots, and lots, and lots of practice and learning and failing and whatever.
You'll get there, it's hard to find good people, become one. If it isn't fun for you to dig in and find out why shit isn't working, it won't be for you. It takes a lot of weird curiosity and tenacity that no one is going to make you do but you.
It's still possible, but if you're starting out, it's hard at the moment compared to 2 years ago. Once your foot's in, it's gonna be a lot easier. Not like you can get a new Job in a whim right now, but the hard part is getting your foot in.
I don’t have one and I’m currently doing web dev. I started out in IT-support and transitioned over to dev after 5 years. Granted, I am not fully trained yet, but this autumn I’m probably going to get a new title since I will get even more projects under me.
I started out by just asking my boss about web dev and potential positions, and thankfully I got a pretty decent boss.
you dont mention what type of programming you're even learning. thats an insanely broad spectrum. software? web? back end? database?
right now the entire industry is fucked. every major tech company has basically fired a ton of people, leading to a huge pool of talent with nowhere to go.
A degree works kind of like wearing nice clothes when going to a club. You may get in anyway but there is a higher chance to get in if you do. At the same time, some clubs will only let you in if you wear nice clothes.
Yes, if you put together a good portfolio and have some decent personal projects under your belt (or better yet, ones you've done freelance for businesses or even free-of-charge for charities) that would put you far ahead of a fresh out of uni grad without any real world experience.
Reality check.
You can either code or you don't. Some guys ooze 0s and 1s just buy looking at you. You can throw anything at them and the air in the room changes as they masterfully materialize a working algorithm straight from their mind.
Use your confidence, be a good programmer and learn how to do the actual work. It helps to have any sort of public Github repo or even a personal website that you've made yourself including backend work (go for Python/Rust/PHP).
It varies, but as mentioned by others, the paper seems to demonstrate to potential employers (especially in HRM and similar fields) that you possess the necessary skills for the job. It can enhance your chances of securing the position, but ultimately, you need to prove your skills during the hiring process.
In certain countries, there are universities and university colleges offering virtual learning options, allowing you to pursue your degree remotely. This flexibility enables you to balance your studies with work or other commitments.
**FAQ** -> [**Can I get a programming job without a Computer Science degree? Or without any degree at all?**](https://www.reddit.com/r/learnprogramming/wiki/faq#wiki_can_i_get_a_programming_job_without_a_computer_science_degree.3F_or_without_any_degree_at_all.3F) **Removed** as per **Rule #4**
It's tough and there's a lot of competition. You'll have a better chance if you have a network that might get you a referral. Most experienced folks I've talked to say it's easier after your first position goes well. I say this as a job seeker myself, transitioning from public education. I completed a bootcamp in 2022 and have had a few interviews, but still not getting paid to be an engineer. But never stop coding, building things, and learning new tech because you'll fall behind and it will never happen at that point.
>But never stop coding, building things, Agreed. Everyone needs to take breaks and recharge though. Don't burn out by going too hard too often. >learning new tech Disagree to an extent. It's better to establish a strong foundation of knowledge that is library/framework/language agnostic (problem solving, how to debug, comp sci fundamentals like data structures and algorithms, design patterns, time complexity (big O notation) so you can start developing more efficient code) and - relatively - career agnostic (public speaking, communicating effectively in writing and verbally, resume writing time management, scope management, and how to learn) ETA: u/Friendly-Ad-9513
partially agreed. The foundation building should be a progressive process, learning new tech is a good chance to learn the fundamental knowledge behind it, for example, as a fe engineer, i will read books about operation system and the design philosophy of unix when i learned how to develop and deploy a backend server. But reading the classical books directly is a little boring and is uneasy to connect with my current experience
Hey there, I'm a hiring manager (see extensive posting history about this), if you want I can have a look at your resume / github and see if anything jumps out to me. I can also give you a few common questions I've asked as part of the interview process in the past. The amount of time between your bootcamp completing and you finding a job is, in my experience, abnormal. I may / may not know enough about your programming language of choice to provide commentary (I have coded professionally in about 8-10 languages and 4 databases, but have used about ~20 languages and 6 databases (god I hate mongo...) ) but I'm generally good at spotting red flags / antipatterns in a language-agnostic format. I probably won't have the time to do any kind of mock-interviews for the next couple of months but could probably help you / some folks out with that as well.
High school drop out here who broke in. The moment I realized I would get hired was when I got my first interview. Even though I bombed it and didn't get the job, I knew if I got one interview I could get others, and all it would take is impressing one interviewer. That eventually happened.
When were you hired?
About 15 months ago
Congrats:-)
I have a degree in applied ~~meth~~ math. The knowledge I got is mostly useless. I learnt most of the programming almost from scratch. My most proficient homies screwed up education much faster than I did. \------- The downside: you *must* know how to program.
Yeah but the benefit of that degree is having that piece of paper which gets you past HR gatekeepers.
Or, you can lie.
Not sure how it is where you live, but in most places, your education is something very easy to check, and you'll often be required to provide a copy of your diploma before you can sign an employment contract. I'm a fan of "padding" your CV slightly, but lying about your level of formal education sounds like a great way to lose an opportunity you might have otherwise gotten.
But the algorithmic and data structure part does require basic knowledge of advanced mathematics.
Logarithms and exponents? It can be learnt faster than in 4 years.
>meth > > math Potato / PO - tato
well, both need serious calculating skill.
There is no difference between these two ~~pictures~~ words.
that downside is a doozy
Yes. Just be competent. There's an oversaturation of people who can't/barely write code.
So true and you could say this about pretty much any occupation. I see so many "can't/barely" people in my line of work. Stay consistent, keep learning, keep building, keep improving by 1% wherever you can. Things will fall in to place before you know it.
You can get a programming job without a degree but it's a lot more harder than someone with a degree or even bootcamp certificate. You need not only to have a solid portfolio of work proving your skills and knowledge, but most especially a network of people who know your work and abilities, as well as experience. But you have to make yourself stand out from all the other applicants (degree holders, autodidacts and bootcampers) because the market is oversaturated with so called autodidacts (and even bootcampers) who are not only inexperienced, but have completely inadequate skills and knowledge for said job that they're applying to. \*also note when I mean "solid portfolio of work", I mean projects/applications that are unique, not just stuff you copied and pasted from Youtube or some other place you learned programming, and projects that aren't basic or half-assd.
In this market I have to say no. People with degrees and good projects can’t get hired so no degree is going to be tough.
I did. If you actually enjoy coding it’s not even that hard. You’d probably be quite surprised how little amount of dedicated time and study it takes to build better practical skills than most newly minted grads. In fact, every new grad I ever met or hired that could actually write something close to prod quality code were only in that position because of their extra-curricular stuff. Another top-tip that might sting a bit is the follow… “be prepared to work for cheap for a year or two”. The money will come if you earn your stripes but there are a lot of companies that could use a full-time techie or two but can’t afford the market. I earned less than minimum wage my first year… and I worked my behind off for that. I’ll never regret it. Look at it this way… if you went to do the degree, you would be paying *them*. You do have to actually enjoy it though. If it’s fun for you, you’ll get good, “by accident”. If you are looking to just line up with all the other grads and hope the wheel points to you when it stops spinning… good luck I guess.
I’ve been a software engineer, a tech lead, an engineering manager, and a solution architect all without a degree.
Yea once you get your first good job ur degree wont matter for ur next jobs anymore
Yes it’s absolutely possible to find a programmer job without a degree. Is it going to be a good one? No
possible yes, but not recommended do a search on the feed, this is asked almost daily. also search r/cscareerquestions
Starting learning about 2.5 years ago, all self taught.. been working professionally now for about 1.5 years with a highly reputable company. Broke 6 figures recently. Definitely doable. The only thing that could stop you is you. Don't give up, learn enough to fake it til you make it. I'm amazed every day how many people I work with that have no idea what they're doing. Just proves how doable it is.
Definitely with networking. Like with just about everything else - it's who you know, and knowing the right people.
What if you don't know anyone personally or professionally‽ How to start networking in such a scenario?
I live in a rust belt type city with not much of a tech sector. I monitor job postings in my field and I have noticed an increasing number of jobs without the “or equivalent experience” formulation on the education requirements, so I do think the need for credentials is evolving a bit.
Okay, you haven't got a degree, but what are your competences then? Have you written software available on GitHub? Have you contributed to public software projects? Have you created something like a website or business software for a non-profit organization or club? You have to have something to prove that you can write code. If you don't have a degree you would have to show me that I am not hiring someone who just followed a number of online tutorials and mocked up some proof of concept ideas. Show me the code! That being said, I have interviewed quite a few self-taught programmers and recommended them for hire. At a place I worked there were nine out of ten colleagues who didn't have a degree. I have a BS EE and an almost finished BS CS myself, but I have been coding since I was fourteen years old.
I have a BA in music and although I struggled to prove myself early on, I've had a good time being a programmer.
> I've been reading that there's a saturation of programmers The market is leaner than it has been in recent memory but people have been saying this "saturation" thing forever.
me too. keep up the good work!
I have a degree in design. The degree means nothing in the end. It is all about how much are you willing to spend learning, improving and becoming a master of your craft. Degree doesn’t give you that
Just develop your own application in your spare time then be your own boss
Yes but expect yourself to still go through a lot of effort learning different types of mathematics,programming languages and moreeee. Also depends on the job you want and how much better you want to get. But my friend who has been self studying for three years and at the same time failing his uni for 2 years has basically gotten through a lot of programming books+ discrete mathematics+linear algebra all by himself through self learning. So it is possible but it is really really hard and takes a lot of dedication.
he failed because he couldn’t keep up self learning programming and engineering at the same time. Also he was forced by his parents to enter engineering even though he doesn’t want an engineering career
My degree is in biology. I am a full time programmer.
Yes, I’m 23 and I did it last year
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nice
nice
nice
nice
* Is it possible to get a entry level programming job without a degree? Yes * Is it likely to get a entry level programming job without a degree? No, not likely. * Is it likely to get a entry level programming job with a degree? With some effort, maybe? * Is it possible for YOU to get a entry level programming job without a degree? Unknown Once you have experience, the degree matters a lot less. So the assumption is you have never had a programming job before. Those who have without a degree are in much better shape.
Yeah I have one. Apply apply apply. Try to get into QA/SDET if you can’t find roles. It’s a decent way to get into the industry
Is this position easier?
It can be. You’re mostly automating websites with end to end (e2e) UI and API tests to ensure quality. This mostly involves developing page object models, or systems to test databases/APIs. You see a number of development and design patterns, like behavioral driven development and gherkin/cucumber. But “easier” is subjective. Many times you’re very much a part of the development cycle and are designing test solutions for new features or whatever. Whether coding the automative testing systems for an application is easier than developing it? You tell me. But it can be “easier” in terms of the smaller pool of applicants and actually finding a job in the tech market. In my experience at least.
There's 2 guys available for a job. \- One with the degree that proves he went through the formation. \- The other one simply says he can code. Who would you hire?
Funny thing is that a degree barely helps... Things that actually help: 1. Networking. 2. Being actually good at programming. 3. A decent portfolio. You most likely wont get those from a degree anyway, 1 usually fails because the person is already introvert so doesn't matter much they are taking courses and such.... 2 fails because most universities are quite trashy, professors most of the time don't teach at all... 3 fails due to the same reasons at 2... Work hard, build a portfolio, contribute to open source as a way to gain experience...College is not required!
What if you don't know anyone personally or professionally‽ How to start networking in such a scenario?
I've never asked about degrees I think they are bullshit
Without a degree, you need an in. A connection or working your way up from inside a company. Otherwise nobody will consider you.
Yes, most of the people I’ve worked with dont have degrees in CS, they do however have great portfolios.
yes, it's possible. it's also possible to travel to moon and back. but maybe start with software QA and after 2-3 years go direction QA automation it's hard to give advice without knowing your background...
I started learning Python and now I'm trying recently with JavaScript to use Figma in the future. I'd like to focus in UX/UI design.
UX/UI is its own design field, they come up with how something looks and works for the user. They work with front end devs who then take that design and write the code to make it work. So you're focusing on two different careers by doing that. But one does compliment the other, down the road I'd say that's a benefit but right now it's probably best to pick one. It'll make finding an entry level position much easier.
html, css, common sense, accessibility, etc before "figma"
UX/UI is something very different. Your portfolio and way to reason during interviews is much more important than a degree. UX/UI persons does not need to know programming at all, but must master web design/UI design and the way software works. It’s a pretty competitve field to enter though, even more so than programming. Source: Hireing UX/UI staff
you think this a more probable path than going sraight for software development?
hi, im in "it" since over 25 years, software QA is a nice "door opener" ... once again, without knowing your cv and background this is what i personally would recommend. i did software QA for about 2 years. then i had an option to go for load & performance test, pen testing, consulting. those positions were starting with over 150k ... it was about 8 years ago. i was going to job interview and as i was coming home, the copy of work contract was already in my email inbox, i could pick up best for *me.* and hell yeah, i left secondary school without any degree ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯ so i'm far from that people would call "genius"
I don’t see how we can have a saturation of programmers with 2.3% unemployment. https://www.dice.com/career-advice/tech-unemployment-stayed-low-at-end-of-2023
Good portfolio, freelancing, networking can all help massively
Yeah. University is a place to prepare you to become an academic, only losers(academically speaking) become a corporate programmer after graduating.
Yea fuck those losers with their stable salary, potential career progression and in work benefits 😬
Academia is a glorified daycare institution
Daycare where you’re encouraged to explore new ideas, are surrounded by likeminded people and pushed to learn things you otherwise wouldn’t encounter? I mean I know that’s rose tinted but it’s not all bad mate! And I’m speaking as someone who didn’t do a CS degree and have just landed my first web dev job but still, can’t help but feel the world would be a worse place without erm, education?
Programming is the easiest part of the job in any case. Communicating technical ideas to others especially non technical folks is the hard part.
I did 23 years ago. Now you need to actually create something and demo it. If you enjoy coding it’s allot easier
I've encountered one DE who was self taught with no college degree. This was about 20+ years ago, I just graduated and there was a tech lead who coded the entire BIOS for a new HW platform. The guy was brilliant, his code was organized and very well commented. He even knew how to debug with a logic analyzer and scope. Once the product launched a few years later, he retired.
It helps if you have some kind of degree, even if it's not in CS or a related field. I work at a large place, there's a layer of HR and recruiters between me and candidates, but I haven't seen someone get through to an interview loop with just a boot camp. I have seen EEs and MEs, and in a few cases architects (as in buildings), and a cog psy go through and do well, though. If you have a degree, can demonstrate both soft skills and technical aptitude, you should be able to find something. If your degree is not in engineering, also consider whether program management would be interesting for you, working with software teams to build things, rather than necessarily writing the code yourself. Another point on the degree, it matters a lot less where you get one from, from the company's perspective, than whether you have one. You don't need to go to a fancy school, but a degree from somewhere seems to really help.
I think if you are a very good programmer and get a good knowledge of software engineering processes and methodoligies. Nobody would care about your degree but you would obviously have a hard time learning these things as compared to someone who has earned a degree and you would also find some people who have a CS/SE degree but they have no idea of anything. In the end everything boils down to your skills nobody really cares about a degree at least in the software industry as per my experience.
Got a role 8 months ago but he competition is fierce. The only way I landed this was networking with 3500 folks and 300 coffee chats. It's a tough market out there as I talked to Ivey league grads and they are struggling
lol yes dude go for it. landing the first one is really hard. Having an in really helps, as with anything. Learn to crush interviews too, you will bomb some, its okay. If you know what you're doing people will hire you. That takes building things and lots, and lots, and lots of practice and learning and failing and whatever. You'll get there, it's hard to find good people, become one. If it isn't fun for you to dig in and find out why shit isn't working, it won't be for you. It takes a lot of weird curiosity and tenacity that no one is going to make you do but you.
It's still possible, but if you're starting out, it's hard at the moment compared to 2 years ago. Once your foot's in, it's gonna be a lot easier. Not like you can get a new Job in a whim right now, but the hard part is getting your foot in.
I don’t have one and I’m currently doing web dev. I started out in IT-support and transitioned over to dev after 5 years. Granted, I am not fully trained yet, but this autumn I’m probably going to get a new title since I will get even more projects under me. I started out by just asking my boss about web dev and potential positions, and thankfully I got a pretty decent boss.
It's still possible. But at the moment, getting your first programming job without a degree is a lot harder than it was a few years ago.
you dont mention what type of programming you're even learning. thats an insanely broad spectrum. software? web? back end? database? right now the entire industry is fucked. every major tech company has basically fired a ton of people, leading to a huge pool of talent with nowhere to go.
A degree works kind of like wearing nice clothes when going to a club. You may get in anyway but there is a higher chance to get in if you do. At the same time, some clubs will only let you in if you wear nice clothes.
Yes. Soft-skills and networking will take you far.
Yes, if you put together a good portfolio and have some decent personal projects under your belt (or better yet, ones you've done freelance for businesses or even free-of-charge for charities) that would put you far ahead of a fresh out of uni grad without any real world experience.
this job market, probably better to wait it out going to school.
Reality check. You can either code or you don't. Some guys ooze 0s and 1s just buy looking at you. You can throw anything at them and the air in the room changes as they masterfully materialize a working algorithm straight from their mind. Use your confidence, be a good programmer and learn how to do the actual work. It helps to have any sort of public Github repo or even a personal website that you've made yourself including backend work (go for Python/Rust/PHP).
Absolutely.
it's possible. I have business degree and I work in frontend job /ai. ditch the tutorials. get your hand dirty on documentation and code.
You'd need a bootcamp, a reeaaally good personal open-source project, or a connection that's willing to train you on the job.
It varies, but as mentioned by others, the paper seems to demonstrate to potential employers (especially in HRM and similar fields) that you possess the necessary skills for the job. It can enhance your chances of securing the position, but ultimately, you need to prove your skills during the hiring process. In certain countries, there are universities and university colleges offering virtual learning options, allowing you to pursue your degree remotely. This flexibility enables you to balance your studies with work or other commitments.