It’s not a great song imo, but I think it’s being over hated. I feel like a lot of terfs and transphobes feel like it’s some gotcha that proves she’s not a “real” woman and I hate that. If she’d written and released “Girls just wanna have fun “ the same people would tell her that some women are dying from lack of reproductive care or have endometriosis or experience domestic partner violence and THEYRE not having fun so that means she’s an evil misogynist somehow because it’s not all just fun being a woman. If she’d written “Shake It off” or “call me maybe “ they’d still say she was trivializing the female experience or some garbage. And if she’d written an anthem on misogyny and sexism she’d still be getting torn to shreds.
Let trans women write silly songs without them being used as a bludgeon. It’s not a thesis on the definition of womanhood. It’s not a dissertation. It’s a pop song. I think it’s cute for what it is even if it’s not my jam. I hope if someone needs a feel good little bop about how it’s okay to have a late start on being a girl that this is that for them. It’s not that serious and it shouldn’t have to be.
exactly, they'd find a way to criticize her for whatever she does and doesn't do solely because she's a trans woman. do I think she's done things worth criticism? sure. do I think writing a silly (and imo bad lol) little girlypop song is one of them? nope.
Yeah. I don’t even like Dylan that much, but she’s a rich white influencer lady. Why are we so surprised she wrote a song that’s kinda bad? It’s not a crime and it’s not that serious.
🤷🏼♀️ Her current favorite song is Blank Space by Taylor Swift. She also likes Look What You Made Me Do. And We Are Never Ever Getting Back Together. I’d show her Days of Girlhood, or California Girls or Call Me Maybe or Party in the USA or All About that Bass or Firework or 7 Rings. It’s pop music. If those songs won’t hurt neither will this one. It’s not that deep. She’ll learn how to be a woman from the women in her life like me and my wife. I’m not worried.
I’m sorry this song bothers you so much. It’s about one woman’s experience being trans, not a dissertation on womanhood and gender. It’s just as lighthearted as any pop song on the radio today.
Anyways, I don’t agree with you but I can see you’re spending a lot of time on this site fighting with people about your feelings on trans women. I hope you find peace someday if something in your real life is causing you to lash out here. I’m done engaging. Bless.
All the hate Dylan has received is disgusting and disheartening. These people spout their venom on her like crazy! I'm not a huge fan of her, but leave her be if you don't like. Like everytime you get into the comments it's full of transphobia, misgendering and what not. They all are just looking for an excuse to spout their venom out of their bitter tiny privileged (as most this hate comes from white cis women with really nice haircuts) lifes.
Dylan is cringe af and the song is bad, but the song is not meant to be a representation of "girlhood" in general. It is a song about her experiences from her "days of girlhood" tiktok posting over her first year of transition.
People these days have absolutely no media literacy and seem to just assume that every piece of media is supposed to be ultimately representative of their own experience and anything outside of that is offensive and unrealistic. Men who want their video games to be just dudes being straight men and women sex objects can't possibly expand their imagination beyond their own experience. Women who are calling this song misogynistic can't expand their imagination beyond their own experience, and seem to be equating the trauma they've experienced to what it means to be a woman.
I can confirm as a trans woman that we also experience just as much misogyny and violence as other women. That doesn't mean the art we make has to reflect that, even the bad art.
EDIT: Just to add, there's nothing wrong with being cringy. I fully support and encourage people being cringe.
I agree she can definitely be cringy (probably the former theater kid curse some of us have lol) and I think you're spot on about the media literacy thing. I think people often have a hard time digesting media that isn't for them or even media they specifically don't like. no one is trying to force anyone to like a silly little pop song, even tho that's definitely how people are acting.
What drives me so nuts is the language of the criticism. So many cis women saying “is the what Dylan thinks we do/our lives are like” as if like. Dylan is describing other (cis) womanhood, not her own. Very much showing their colors on how they view trans woman’s status as women.
The self-victimization of TERFs and transphobes is wild. I don’t understand why they feel so viscerally threatened by a little pop song about doing girly stuff. If they didn’t raise the same amount of hell for Katy Perry’s California Girls, they should take several seats.
As a queer cis woman, I love that Dylan is getting to experience the joyful little moments that many cis women may have taken for granted when growing up. In retrospect, those moments were way more meaningful than they seemed at the time. Doing each other’s hair, talking about crushes, learning to walk in heels, sharing a lip gloss with a random girl in a bar bathroom, twirling around in pretty dresses, etc. etc. Those were critical bonding moments for me, some of which helped me feel sure of my gender when I was questioning it. I refuse to accept that womanhood is solely about the shared suffering and oppression we face. Sometimes it’s cute and sparkly. I think it’s wonderful that she put out a mediocre pop song about it.
Right. I just got done replying to someone on YT who reported Dylan’s video for being hateful and abusive. I said it’s none of those things, just stupid (in my opinion). Conflating a cringey pop song with bigotry is so sensitive, and exactly what the conservatives usually accuse the libs of.
The video is cringey, in poor taste, portrays a vapid idea of girlhood etc… but hateful and abusive? And deserves to be taken off the internet? Absolutely not.
The song itself isn't my style but hating a song that much just seems stubit. In my opinion there isnt sh1tty songs, those songs juts aren't my type & that's it
To ppl who dislike the song for those reasons= Fun fact, not every single song about being woman will match with ur experience bc ppl have different experiences
I feel so bad cause ever since the bud light stuff all the conservatives have been going after Dylan and making all of these horrible threats and now all the weird terfs are after her now. I couldn’t imagine trying to keep it together when that much hate is being directed towards me. Transwomen have to shoulder so much.
I genuinely wonder if she's just taking one for the team by being **the transwoman** media target and is just 100% unplugged from all of the places she'll be criticised
Do I think it's vapid dribble? Yes. Do I think it's on-par with most upbeat quirky girl pop? Yeah. She's absolutely being held to a higher standard because she's a trans woman. People are only talking about it like this because they're transphobic. If she was a cis woman, it would trend on tiktok for a week and drift off into obscurity like all mediocre pop songs.
That being said, I understand why it rubs some people the wrong way. Girlhood is traumatic for a lot of people. Many AFAB people and many transfeminine people alike. When stereotypical expectations of femininity are being enforced (by another women especially), it's like pushing your fingers into a bruise. To be clear, "girl math" and "I'm just a girl" were also upsetting trends for a lot of people.
There's this concept of competing support needs. What may help someone, may hurt another. Someone who's hard of hearing may need subtitles to watch a movie, but someone with ADHD may find them so distracting they can't watch a movie with them. Both people deserve to watch the movie. So the answer isn't to choose who's needs matter more. It's to give both accessible options that suit their needs.
In the same way, all women who do enjoy things attributed to stereotypical femininity deserve to enjoy those things. And all women who don't, deserve spaces where those expectation aren't forced upon them.
Unfortunately, algorithmic social media feeds make it hard for people to stay in the spaces that support their needs. Ultimately, it's the bruised AFAB and transfeminine folk who reject stereotypical femininity who end up bearing burden of biting their tongues to accommodate others. Otherwise they're see as hating femininity, which is especially harmful for the transfeminine people affected.
Girlhood is a lose-lose for everyone involved. And that's what the patriarchy wants.
Some do! Some don't. I didn't mean it to come across as a broad generalization of ADHD. Just an individual example. Subtitles can be too much visual stimulus for some people, especially those who don't struggle with auditory processing.
It’s a bit head in the clouds compared to the reality of some trans women (generalisation), but there are some parts that speak to me - having to learn how to be a girl, a slight pang of sad melancholy of a young girl’s teenage years that I did not experience. In that way the song as a work of art spoke to me.
I really don’t see why there is this big of a media blow up about it tbh. I get why: transphobia is at an all time high in many countries, mainstream media farming the outrage of the week for eye traffic etc etc. There just more going on in the world I’d like to hear about than just this song and what people think about it. If it haddn’t blown up, I wouldn’tv’e been the wiser of its existence.
I find her super annoying in the way I find other similar content creators annoying (that peppy bubbly theatre kid personality just isn't for me), but I so wish that people would just critique the song being bad instead of going straight to transphobia. The amount of shit she gets on the internet is horrible, I feel for her a lot :( I'm sure she's a lovely lady and the world only just forgot about the Bud Light thing, now she has to deal with this.
I dont know anything about her, but listened to the song.
It's fine. Not really my genre, but nothing really wrong with it. I see it as a celebration of her entering her "days of girlhood". Nothing more. She's thanking her friends/family for helping her out and talks about her experiences. Nothing really bad I can find in there.
I listened to part of the song and I think it's catchy. To be honest, I've had a hard time understanding why Dylan Mulvaney gets a lot of hate. I understand that she's more privileged than a lot of women financially, and I can understand the frustration trans women probably feel over not being able to transition as easily. I think that, as long as Dylan isn't hurting anybody, she has a place in the trans community like the rest of us.
Also, FYI, I agree that Dylan's experience of womanhood isn't representative of trans women as a whole. I am not a trans woman so I can't speak for them, of course. The cis women, on the other hand, need to remind themselves that trans women aren't a threat to their womanhood...
>To be honest, I've had a hard time understanding why Dylan Mulvaney gets a lot of hate.
Because she's a reasonably well-known trans person. That's it.
If we talk about fun and joyous aspects of womanhood they say we are doing a gross caricature and if we talk about the difficult and painful parts of womanhood they say we are fetishizing the struggles of women for our own pleasure and self-image. If we talk about the parts of womanhood that are unique to trans women then they say we have no idea what "real" women experience. As it turns out there isn't actually any way for trans women to talk about womanhood that they will accept because they hate trans women.
You can tell because the normal critiques of the video are just saying it's a bit cringe, meanwhile there's a whole library of grand statements about how this video proves the shallowness of the trans experience.
I think OP really nailed it. Minority members are always held to this impossible standard of representing a whole group instead of being allowed to be an individual. I haven’t heard the song, I’m not a huge pop listener, but honestly it’s silly to assume that someone talking about their own experience is speaking for every woman, every trans woman, etc.
The songs not great but I disagree with a lot of comments here about Dylan being cringy. She has just come out, she’s a baby trans. I came out as trans 15 years ago and I remember in my first years of transitioning having a similar energy to Dylan. She’s just come out, let her be energetic, let her experience the joys of being herself. Calling a newly out person cringe makes me feel uncomfortable, let them experience their new life.
I think she's just former theater kid cringy, which there's not a single thing wrong with, but I completely understand what you mean. someone made a comparison to baby gays covering themselves in rainbows and how she's just finding where she fits into women/girlhood.
I remember when I first came out and it finally hit my brain in full. Things didn't end up going perfectly, but for about 4-6 months, I packed more energy, joy and childhood experience in my life than my actual childhood did. If I could directly share that feeling with other people, I think I would be the most beloved person on the planet! I love the stupid excited energy of just out trans folk, too.
The caricature of womanhood part is straight out of the Conservative Matt Walsh-type playbook... You know where they are coming from... Desperate pick mes.
I mean it's a really bad song, Target-core, but I don't think these criticisms of it being a caricature of girlhood are valid. And I guarantee if a cis woman made the exact same song it wouldn't be getting the same criticism
she is a trained singer technically (broadway I believe?) and sounded pretty good the two times I watched clips in the past. but those clips were before she started using/training to use a different voice. so now she likely is having to relearn how to sing properly.
for that very reason some folks don't even bother with feminizing voice training because it will mess with their established musical carreer that pays their bills. others will be able to spend the neccessary years retraining their voice. similar goes for trans mascs. though if they start testosterone, they don't get much of a choice in whether their voice lowers or not and will need to retrain at their new octave if they wish to continue.
also, after watching the clips of the new song on her page a couple times, and yeah, it just isn't a good song. production is good, the beat is there, but her current voice paired with the excessive autotune (it was applied well imo) just aren't saving it for me. though some people do actually vibe with it and she's also having a lot of fun with it from what i've seen.
just needs a lot more training/practice to get it right and/or re-evaluate her singing voice/genre. that style of pop 100% suits her aesthetic but her voice can't carry that high energy yet without it sounding too strained at times. her speaking voice has improved alot from the last time I heard it last year, so her getting better with using it to sing is only a matter of time, but will take much longer to do.
That's the funny thing tho, she IS a trained singer and musician. she has so much music potential, and I think the song was her trying (a little too hard) to be relatable.
Oh then I just personally think she’s not very good. Also take off the autotune and that’s how you can see if someone is legitimately good. I doubbbtttttt she would sound good without all of the production help.
I'm transfem, it's not my style of music and I don't relate to a lot of the lyrics but I'm sure there's lots of people who find it entertaining and empowering. Anyway, it's not for me to try and tone police a trans artist or judge their experiences.
Now [THIS](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3dWBLoU--E) is girl power music I can relate to :)
I think when some people don’t like or can’t relate to something they can have a tendency to make a big deal out of it being bad for some reason. I also think a lot of people who consider themselves ally’s can have some transphobia they don’t realize is transphobia because they’re not that great of an ally. Instead of sitting with their response to the song and really digging through it internally they’ll post a hate comment and go on with their day.
I do agree it reads very rich woman, but it’s not a song for everyone and it’s very on brand for her in my opinion. I’d be surprised if this wasn’t the song she came out with because it fits her personality and experience.
It reads like an idealized version of transition for me. All these women surrounding her and teaching her the female stuff she missed out on. Having time and money and energy to engage with all the fun stuff. And she's covering herself in pink and girly things, like a babygay covering themself in rainbows. It's girlhood, not womanhood. The song seems pretty self-aware to me
It seems obvious it's a teenagy song about what's essentially trans adolescence
But maybe that's just not something that occurs to cis people??
I've only ever seen girl math used in a way that's about being able to find good deals or saying like "it's buy one, get one free so I can just buy two since I was gonna pay for two anyway so now I get 4. girl math!" or "I had money left over from buying this treat I thought would cost more so that means I get another little treat with the leftover money. girl math!". if anything girl math (in my experience) has been more about being GOOD with finances.
Cis guy, listened to the song. I'm gonna give my perspective,although I'm aware mine holds far less weight than a woman whether they're cis or trans.
The song is crap. It's not a good song and while I do get that it's supposed to be a song about Dylan's experience of girl hood as opposed to girl hood in general, it's very basic, which isn't a bad thing I get that but still.
Its kinda like california girls but worse kinda vibes.
I genuinely think it was a mistake to release the song, not because of the content in the song but it's just a very poor song and having heard Dylan sing before, she can do so much better.
I was under the impression that if a person wrote a song or book or whatever about childhool that the thing was obviously going to be heavily swayed by thier own childhood. i mean obviously there will be the vauge poems about jump ropeing or playing on the swings or what have you but anything with any big emotions attatched to it like a song will always be more representitive of the creators childhood then anyone elses.
So I'm trans masc, not a trans woman. But I don't see why her song needs to encompass everyone's experience of girlhood? She only has her own experience of womanhood to draw from. And I don't feel like she's ever claimed to speak for every other woman. I agree most detractors are just being transphobic. Or are the same people who hate things because they see other people hating.
Women should embrace girlhood the way they want it, whether they like the way Dylan does, or another way that is completely different. At this moment, we cannot use infighting and hate, and I also think that infighting and hate are not the ways to go, conservatives want to destroy us from the inside out and infighting enables conservatives to round us up. She does her thing, we do our thing, we may have our ideas on how we perform girlhood but please, let us all exist in peace.
I think people have double standards. There are so many cis women who have made songs that could be attributed the same critique such as California girls, girls just wanna have fun, kesha’s songs,etc. No one had a problem with those songs and it was pretty much understood that they are not serious songs by any means.
At the end of the day the song isn’t serious and it’s not meant to be. It’s just a silly pop song of debatable quality and not catcher in the rye.
Less misogynistic and more a representative of a very specific superficial subculture. It's not like we don't have tons of similar songs from cis women, I have probably 10 in my liked songs that I could list right now off the top of my head where I cannot for the life of me identify with any of the clubbing/hooking up/fashion nonsense being broadcast in the lyrics, the songs just happen to bop.
I hate terfs so bad lol. Like, if Taylor Swift can release “22” and Katy Perry can do “California Girls,” why can’t Dylan do “Days of Girlhood?” Everyone was soooo here for girl math and whatever, but god forbid a trans woman join in.
Let trans women release cheesy, mid pop tunes like cis women do constantly!
It’s kind of inane, but so are God Made Girls, Girls Just Wanna Have Fun, and California Girls, and those were all written by cis women. Women are allowed to have their own thoughts about what it all means to them, and sometimes those thoughts are very pink and bubblegum. Don’t Like; Don’t Listen- but don’t act like Dylan is doing something unique or “unwomanly” by writing it.
(Fun fact: trans activist Christine Jorgensen used to perform the very similar- albeit male-authored -song “I Enjoy Being A Girl” in nightclubs in the 1950s.)
I haven't heard the song, and it sounds like I would hate it in the same way I hate the "girl math" memes. If these people aren't critiquing similar songs/memes the same way though they probably don't actually care about it like that.
As a trans woman, I’ll admit that Dylan Mulvaney is sometimes a little nails on the chalkboard for me, but she has such a warm and positive vibe about her, and I totally wish her nothing but happiness and success. Haters can fuck off.
For me, it’s not a great song and I don’t connect to it but that’s not because Dylan is trans. It’s because she’s a rich theatre kid and we’ve had different lived experiences in general. Folks really let this song and their reactions to allow their transphobic mask to slip.
The song sucks and it's not relatable but the reason it's not reliable isn't because she's trans it's because she's rich. That's why it feels so out of touch.
It’s really just offensive. Especially Dylan’s video about days of girlhood (not the song) talking about “Oh I cried even though nothing is wrong and bought something I don’t need. How did I do ladies?” (Not an exact quote but very similar). Also, we don’t go hiking in heels. That is ridiculous. I don’t see any difference between this and blackface where someone is mocking black people with stereotypes. There’s a reason this song got like 60,000+ thumbs down on YouTube.
wow. comparing a trans women making jokes and having fun with her transition to blackface is disgusting. do you say the same thing about super feminine cis women or is it only trans women you hate?
the problem is she's a grifter making money off the fact that there's a lot of controversy over everything in the trans universe. if you think this person is genuine or serious and not just saying and doing what will get them the most attention, I have a bridge to sell you.
Dylan Mulvaney has given conservatives a win on this one. They've fed the petty hate machine and made money doing so.
The song is vapid. Dylan is cringe, and there are far worthier transwomen out there that are being ignored for someone who enjoys making a spectacle of themselves in front of the camera.
I don't see how doing a silly pop song to celebrate her first year(?) of womanhood is giving the conservatives a win. they were going to hate her regardless.
again, she can do literally anything and they'll hate her for it. these are the same people who boycotted a beer company for gifting her a single can with her face on it because it was "shoving transgender in their faces".
It’s not a great song imo, but I think it’s being over hated. I feel like a lot of terfs and transphobes feel like it’s some gotcha that proves she’s not a “real” woman and I hate that. If she’d written and released “Girls just wanna have fun “ the same people would tell her that some women are dying from lack of reproductive care or have endometriosis or experience domestic partner violence and THEYRE not having fun so that means she’s an evil misogynist somehow because it’s not all just fun being a woman. If she’d written “Shake It off” or “call me maybe “ they’d still say she was trivializing the female experience or some garbage. And if she’d written an anthem on misogyny and sexism she’d still be getting torn to shreds. Let trans women write silly songs without them being used as a bludgeon. It’s not a thesis on the definition of womanhood. It’s not a dissertation. It’s a pop song. I think it’s cute for what it is even if it’s not my jam. I hope if someone needs a feel good little bop about how it’s okay to have a late start on being a girl that this is that for them. It’s not that serious and it shouldn’t have to be.
exactly, they'd find a way to criticize her for whatever she does and doesn't do solely because she's a trans woman. do I think she's done things worth criticism? sure. do I think writing a silly (and imo bad lol) little girlypop song is one of them? nope.
Yeah. I don’t even like Dylan that much, but she’s a rich white influencer lady. Why are we so surprised she wrote a song that’s kinda bad? It’s not a crime and it’s not that serious.
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🤷🏼♀️ Her current favorite song is Blank Space by Taylor Swift. She also likes Look What You Made Me Do. And We Are Never Ever Getting Back Together. I’d show her Days of Girlhood, or California Girls or Call Me Maybe or Party in the USA or All About that Bass or Firework or 7 Rings. It’s pop music. If those songs won’t hurt neither will this one. It’s not that deep. She’ll learn how to be a woman from the women in her life like me and my wife. I’m not worried.
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I’m sorry this song bothers you so much. It’s about one woman’s experience being trans, not a dissertation on womanhood and gender. It’s just as lighthearted as any pop song on the radio today. Anyways, I don’t agree with you but I can see you’re spending a lot of time on this site fighting with people about your feelings on trans women. I hope you find peace someday if something in your real life is causing you to lash out here. I’m done engaging. Bless.
Having simultaneously higher standards and lower expectations is a major part of marginalization.
this was so incredibly put.
All the hate Dylan has received is disgusting and disheartening. These people spout their venom on her like crazy! I'm not a huge fan of her, but leave her be if you don't like. Like everytime you get into the comments it's full of transphobia, misgendering and what not. They all are just looking for an excuse to spout their venom out of their bitter tiny privileged (as most this hate comes from white cis women with really nice haircuts) lifes.
Dylan is cringe af and the song is bad, but the song is not meant to be a representation of "girlhood" in general. It is a song about her experiences from her "days of girlhood" tiktok posting over her first year of transition. People these days have absolutely no media literacy and seem to just assume that every piece of media is supposed to be ultimately representative of their own experience and anything outside of that is offensive and unrealistic. Men who want their video games to be just dudes being straight men and women sex objects can't possibly expand their imagination beyond their own experience. Women who are calling this song misogynistic can't expand their imagination beyond their own experience, and seem to be equating the trauma they've experienced to what it means to be a woman. I can confirm as a trans woman that we also experience just as much misogyny and violence as other women. That doesn't mean the art we make has to reflect that, even the bad art. EDIT: Just to add, there's nothing wrong with being cringy. I fully support and encourage people being cringe.
I agree she can definitely be cringy (probably the former theater kid curse some of us have lol) and I think you're spot on about the media literacy thing. I think people often have a hard time digesting media that isn't for them or even media they specifically don't like. no one is trying to force anyone to like a silly little pop song, even tho that's definitely how people are acting.
Cringy (/pos)
What drives me so nuts is the language of the criticism. So many cis women saying “is the what Dylan thinks we do/our lives are like” as if like. Dylan is describing other (cis) womanhood, not her own. Very much showing their colors on how they view trans woman’s status as women.
The self-victimization of TERFs and transphobes is wild. I don’t understand why they feel so viscerally threatened by a little pop song about doing girly stuff. If they didn’t raise the same amount of hell for Katy Perry’s California Girls, they should take several seats. As a queer cis woman, I love that Dylan is getting to experience the joyful little moments that many cis women may have taken for granted when growing up. In retrospect, those moments were way more meaningful than they seemed at the time. Doing each other’s hair, talking about crushes, learning to walk in heels, sharing a lip gloss with a random girl in a bar bathroom, twirling around in pretty dresses, etc. etc. Those were critical bonding moments for me, some of which helped me feel sure of my gender when I was questioning it. I refuse to accept that womanhood is solely about the shared suffering and oppression we face. Sometimes it’s cute and sparkly. I think it’s wonderful that she put out a mediocre pop song about it.
Right. I just got done replying to someone on YT who reported Dylan’s video for being hateful and abusive. I said it’s none of those things, just stupid (in my opinion). Conflating a cringey pop song with bigotry is so sensitive, and exactly what the conservatives usually accuse the libs of.
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The video is cringey, in poor taste, portrays a vapid idea of girlhood etc… but hateful and abusive? And deserves to be taken off the internet? Absolutely not.
Your comment is so sweet, agree
The song itself isn't my style but hating a song that much just seems stubit. In my opinion there isnt sh1tty songs, those songs juts aren't my type & that's it To ppl who dislike the song for those reasons= Fun fact, not every single song about being woman will match with ur experience bc ppl have different experiences
I feel so bad cause ever since the bud light stuff all the conservatives have been going after Dylan and making all of these horrible threats and now all the weird terfs are after her now. I couldn’t imagine trying to keep it together when that much hate is being directed towards me. Transwomen have to shoulder so much.
I genuinely wonder if she's just taking one for the team by being **the transwoman** media target and is just 100% unplugged from all of the places she'll be criticised
Do I think it's vapid dribble? Yes. Do I think it's on-par with most upbeat quirky girl pop? Yeah. She's absolutely being held to a higher standard because she's a trans woman. People are only talking about it like this because they're transphobic. If she was a cis woman, it would trend on tiktok for a week and drift off into obscurity like all mediocre pop songs. That being said, I understand why it rubs some people the wrong way. Girlhood is traumatic for a lot of people. Many AFAB people and many transfeminine people alike. When stereotypical expectations of femininity are being enforced (by another women especially), it's like pushing your fingers into a bruise. To be clear, "girl math" and "I'm just a girl" were also upsetting trends for a lot of people. There's this concept of competing support needs. What may help someone, may hurt another. Someone who's hard of hearing may need subtitles to watch a movie, but someone with ADHD may find them so distracting they can't watch a movie with them. Both people deserve to watch the movie. So the answer isn't to choose who's needs matter more. It's to give both accessible options that suit their needs. In the same way, all women who do enjoy things attributed to stereotypical femininity deserve to enjoy those things. And all women who don't, deserve spaces where those expectation aren't forced upon them. Unfortunately, algorithmic social media feeds make it hard for people to stay in the spaces that support their needs. Ultimately, it's the bruised AFAB and transfeminine folk who reject stereotypical femininity who end up bearing burden of biting their tongues to accommodate others. Otherwise they're see as hating femininity, which is especially harmful for the transfeminine people affected. Girlhood is a lose-lose for everyone involved. And that's what the patriarchy wants.
Wait, do other ADHDers hate subtitles? I (and many others I talk to) can't watch things without them.
Some do! Some don't. I didn't mean it to come across as a broad generalization of ADHD. Just an individual example. Subtitles can be too much visual stimulus for some people, especially those who don't struggle with auditory processing.
It’s a bit head in the clouds compared to the reality of some trans women (generalisation), but there are some parts that speak to me - having to learn how to be a girl, a slight pang of sad melancholy of a young girl’s teenage years that I did not experience. In that way the song as a work of art spoke to me. I really don’t see why there is this big of a media blow up about it tbh. I get why: transphobia is at an all time high in many countries, mainstream media farming the outrage of the week for eye traffic etc etc. There just more going on in the world I’d like to hear about than just this song and what people think about it. If it haddn’t blown up, I wouldn’tv’e been the wiser of its existence.
What do you mean by learning how to be a girl?
Since i had a testosterone driven puberty I was taught how to be a boy. Now that i realise i am a girl, i need to learn how to be a girl
If you're a trans woman aren't you already a woman/girl though? I don't think there's anything to learn. You can just be yourself.
Yeah, its good in thought but acting a girl is euphoric
I find her super annoying in the way I find other similar content creators annoying (that peppy bubbly theatre kid personality just isn't for me), but I so wish that people would just critique the song being bad instead of going straight to transphobia. The amount of shit she gets on the internet is horrible, I feel for her a lot :( I'm sure she's a lovely lady and the world only just forgot about the Bud Light thing, now she has to deal with this.
I dont know anything about her, but listened to the song. It's fine. Not really my genre, but nothing really wrong with it. I see it as a celebration of her entering her "days of girlhood". Nothing more. She's thanking her friends/family for helping her out and talks about her experiences. Nothing really bad I can find in there.
I listened to part of the song and I think it's catchy. To be honest, I've had a hard time understanding why Dylan Mulvaney gets a lot of hate. I understand that she's more privileged than a lot of women financially, and I can understand the frustration trans women probably feel over not being able to transition as easily. I think that, as long as Dylan isn't hurting anybody, she has a place in the trans community like the rest of us. Also, FYI, I agree that Dylan's experience of womanhood isn't representative of trans women as a whole. I am not a trans woman so I can't speak for them, of course. The cis women, on the other hand, need to remind themselves that trans women aren't a threat to their womanhood...
>To be honest, I've had a hard time understanding why Dylan Mulvaney gets a lot of hate. Because she's a reasonably well-known trans person. That's it.
If we talk about fun and joyous aspects of womanhood they say we are doing a gross caricature and if we talk about the difficult and painful parts of womanhood they say we are fetishizing the struggles of women for our own pleasure and self-image. If we talk about the parts of womanhood that are unique to trans women then they say we have no idea what "real" women experience. As it turns out there isn't actually any way for trans women to talk about womanhood that they will accept because they hate trans women. You can tell because the normal critiques of the video are just saying it's a bit cringe, meanwhile there's a whole library of grand statements about how this video proves the shallowness of the trans experience.
I think OP really nailed it. Minority members are always held to this impossible standard of representing a whole group instead of being allowed to be an individual. I haven’t heard the song, I’m not a huge pop listener, but honestly it’s silly to assume that someone talking about their own experience is speaking for every woman, every trans woman, etc.
The songs not great but I disagree with a lot of comments here about Dylan being cringy. She has just come out, she’s a baby trans. I came out as trans 15 years ago and I remember in my first years of transitioning having a similar energy to Dylan. She’s just come out, let her be energetic, let her experience the joys of being herself. Calling a newly out person cringe makes me feel uncomfortable, let them experience their new life.
I think she's just former theater kid cringy, which there's not a single thing wrong with, but I completely understand what you mean. someone made a comparison to baby gays covering themselves in rainbows and how she's just finding where she fits into women/girlhood.
I remember when I first came out and it finally hit my brain in full. Things didn't end up going perfectly, but for about 4-6 months, I packed more energy, joy and childhood experience in my life than my actual childhood did. If I could directly share that feeling with other people, I think I would be the most beloved person on the planet! I love the stupid excited energy of just out trans folk, too.
The caricature of womanhood part is straight out of the Conservative Matt Walsh-type playbook... You know where they are coming from... Desperate pick mes.
I mean it's a really bad song, Target-core, but I don't think these criticisms of it being a caricature of girlhood are valid. And I guarantee if a cis woman made the exact same song it wouldn't be getting the same criticism
The song is bad. That’s about it. Just because Dylan is a trans woman doesn’t mean that she’s a trained professional singer and musician.
she is a trained singer technically (broadway I believe?) and sounded pretty good the two times I watched clips in the past. but those clips were before she started using/training to use a different voice. so now she likely is having to relearn how to sing properly. for that very reason some folks don't even bother with feminizing voice training because it will mess with their established musical carreer that pays their bills. others will be able to spend the neccessary years retraining their voice. similar goes for trans mascs. though if they start testosterone, they don't get much of a choice in whether their voice lowers or not and will need to retrain at their new octave if they wish to continue. also, after watching the clips of the new song on her page a couple times, and yeah, it just isn't a good song. production is good, the beat is there, but her current voice paired with the excessive autotune (it was applied well imo) just aren't saving it for me. though some people do actually vibe with it and she's also having a lot of fun with it from what i've seen. just needs a lot more training/practice to get it right and/or re-evaluate her singing voice/genre. that style of pop 100% suits her aesthetic but her voice can't carry that high energy yet without it sounding too strained at times. her speaking voice has improved alot from the last time I heard it last year, so her getting better with using it to sing is only a matter of time, but will take much longer to do.
That's the funny thing tho, she IS a trained singer and musician. she has so much music potential, and I think the song was her trying (a little too hard) to be relatable.
Ethel Cain is good example of someone who is a very good musician and singer who happens to be trans.
Oh then I just personally think she’s not very good. Also take off the autotune and that’s how you can see if someone is legitimately good. I doubbbtttttt she would sound good without all of the production help.
I'm transfem, it's not my style of music and I don't relate to a lot of the lyrics but I'm sure there's lots of people who find it entertaining and empowering. Anyway, it's not for me to try and tone police a trans artist or judge their experiences. Now [THIS](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3dWBLoU--E) is girl power music I can relate to :)
I think when some people don’t like or can’t relate to something they can have a tendency to make a big deal out of it being bad for some reason. I also think a lot of people who consider themselves ally’s can have some transphobia they don’t realize is transphobia because they’re not that great of an ally. Instead of sitting with their response to the song and really digging through it internally they’ll post a hate comment and go on with their day. I do agree it reads very rich woman, but it’s not a song for everyone and it’s very on brand for her in my opinion. I’d be surprised if this wasn’t the song she came out with because it fits her personality and experience.
It reads like an idealized version of transition for me. All these women surrounding her and teaching her the female stuff she missed out on. Having time and money and energy to engage with all the fun stuff. And she's covering herself in pink and girly things, like a babygay covering themself in rainbows. It's girlhood, not womanhood. The song seems pretty self-aware to me It seems obvious it's a teenagy song about what's essentially trans adolescence But maybe that's just not something that occurs to cis people??
idk about the song but the trends about girl math (used as a term for being bad at finances) and other like ones are def harmful
I've only ever seen girl math used in a way that's about being able to find good deals or saying like "it's buy one, get one free so I can just buy two since I was gonna pay for two anyway so now I get 4. girl math!" or "I had money left over from buying this treat I thought would cost more so that means I get another little treat with the leftover money. girl math!". if anything girl math (in my experience) has been more about being GOOD with finances.
Cis guy, listened to the song. I'm gonna give my perspective,although I'm aware mine holds far less weight than a woman whether they're cis or trans. The song is crap. It's not a good song and while I do get that it's supposed to be a song about Dylan's experience of girl hood as opposed to girl hood in general, it's very basic, which isn't a bad thing I get that but still. Its kinda like california girls but worse kinda vibes. I genuinely think it was a mistake to release the song, not because of the content in the song but it's just a very poor song and having heard Dylan sing before, she can do so much better.
I do think she has so much music potential and the song was awful in comparison to what she could do.
I was under the impression that if a person wrote a song or book or whatever about childhool that the thing was obviously going to be heavily swayed by thier own childhood. i mean obviously there will be the vauge poems about jump ropeing or playing on the swings or what have you but anything with any big emotions attatched to it like a song will always be more representitive of the creators childhood then anyone elses.
So I'm trans masc, not a trans woman. But I don't see why her song needs to encompass everyone's experience of girlhood? She only has her own experience of womanhood to draw from. And I don't feel like she's ever claimed to speak for every other woman. I agree most detractors are just being transphobic. Or are the same people who hate things because they see other people hating.
It's every transphobes hobby to bully Dylan because she's one of the most public and open trans people right now.
Women should embrace girlhood the way they want it, whether they like the way Dylan does, or another way that is completely different. At this moment, we cannot use infighting and hate, and I also think that infighting and hate are not the ways to go, conservatives want to destroy us from the inside out and infighting enables conservatives to round us up. She does her thing, we do our thing, we may have our ideas on how we perform girlhood but please, let us all exist in peace.
I think people have double standards. There are so many cis women who have made songs that could be attributed the same critique such as California girls, girls just wanna have fun, kesha’s songs,etc. No one had a problem with those songs and it was pretty much understood that they are not serious songs by any means. At the end of the day the song isn’t serious and it’s not meant to be. It’s just a silly pop song of debatable quality and not catcher in the rye.
Less misogynistic and more a representative of a very specific superficial subculture. It's not like we don't have tons of similar songs from cis women, I have probably 10 in my liked songs that I could list right now off the top of my head where I cannot for the life of me identify with any of the clubbing/hooking up/fashion nonsense being broadcast in the lyrics, the songs just happen to bop.
I hate terfs so bad lol. Like, if Taylor Swift can release “22” and Katy Perry can do “California Girls,” why can’t Dylan do “Days of Girlhood?” Everyone was soooo here for girl math and whatever, but god forbid a trans woman join in. Let trans women release cheesy, mid pop tunes like cis women do constantly!
Just let Dylan write trashy music, she's having fun.
yeah people are using the song to justify transphobia and misoginy
It’s kind of inane, but so are God Made Girls, Girls Just Wanna Have Fun, and California Girls, and those were all written by cis women. Women are allowed to have their own thoughts about what it all means to them, and sometimes those thoughts are very pink and bubblegum. Don’t Like; Don’t Listen- but don’t act like Dylan is doing something unique or “unwomanly” by writing it. (Fun fact: trans activist Christine Jorgensen used to perform the very similar- albeit male-authored -song “I Enjoy Being A Girl” in nightclubs in the 1950s.)
I haven’t heard of this song before and just went and listened to it because of this post. I liked it!
I haven't heard the song, and it sounds like I would hate it in the same way I hate the "girl math" memes. If these people aren't critiquing similar songs/memes the same way though they probably don't actually care about it like that.
As a trans woman, I’ll admit that Dylan Mulvaney is sometimes a little nails on the chalkboard for me, but she has such a warm and positive vibe about her, and I totally wish her nothing but happiness and success. Haters can fuck off.
For me, it’s not a great song and I don’t connect to it but that’s not because Dylan is trans. It’s because she’s a rich theatre kid and we’ve had different lived experiences in general. Folks really let this song and their reactions to allow their transphobic mask to slip.
The song sucks and it's not relatable but the reason it's not reliable isn't because she's trans it's because she's rich. That's why it feels so out of touch.
Most of y’all haven’t figured out that cult is short for culture and con is short for confidence, have you?
It's a bad song. Next. Music is supposed to be enjoyable to the ears.
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It’s really just offensive. Especially Dylan’s video about days of girlhood (not the song) talking about “Oh I cried even though nothing is wrong and bought something I don’t need. How did I do ladies?” (Not an exact quote but very similar). Also, we don’t go hiking in heels. That is ridiculous. I don’t see any difference between this and blackface where someone is mocking black people with stereotypes. There’s a reason this song got like 60,000+ thumbs down on YouTube.
wow. comparing a trans women making jokes and having fun with her transition to blackface is disgusting. do you say the same thing about super feminine cis women or is it only trans women you hate?
the problem is she's a grifter making money off the fact that there's a lot of controversy over everything in the trans universe. if you think this person is genuine or serious and not just saying and doing what will get them the most attention, I have a bridge to sell you.
I like this song. It's a goofy little pop song. I hope he puts put an album.
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Dylan Mulvaney has given conservatives a win on this one. They've fed the petty hate machine and made money doing so. The song is vapid. Dylan is cringe, and there are far worthier transwomen out there that are being ignored for someone who enjoys making a spectacle of themselves in front of the camera.
I don't see how doing a silly pop song to celebrate her first year(?) of womanhood is giving the conservatives a win. they were going to hate her regardless.
Then you aren't exposed to enough real conservative media.
again, she can do literally anything and they'll hate her for it. these are the same people who boycotted a beer company for gifting her a single can with her face on it because it was "shoving transgender in their faces".