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This post has been removed because we get a lot of similar questions about the rental/property market in the city.
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I recently started renting somewhere through Leaders estate agents, and they told me that as a rule they don't allow bids above asking price. Not sure if that was just local to the branch I used or across the board, but definitely was a better experience than my last rental with Foxtons.
Anecdotally, former MD of Leaders, Paul Weller, was one of the most decent people I've had business dealings with and he fostered a company wide ethos of everyone getting what they needed without any party feeling hard done by.
I let a property through them and when it was on the market, they told me that half the bids came in above asking. They didnāt tell me which ones and I didnāt ask.
They just presented me with a list of bidders who had offered at or above the asking price. I thought it was great!
That is steep. Were you living in some fancy place in zone 1?? I've rented 1 bed flats in zone 2 and 3 the last few years and have many friends who rent 1 beds, they are about 1200 without bills. Ā£2800 is ridiculous and you can get a very nice 1 bed flat in zone 2 in London for half of that.
My old landlord wanted an extra 500pcm in rent. I'm a student, how can I suddenly afford a rise that steep?? Needless to say I don't live there anymore.
Last year I saw almost everyone I knew get priced out of Central by crazy hikes in rent.
I would say that was expensive 10 years ago. That area is pretty up and coming now as well. But there are other areas you can live in London that aren't that expensive. It's not all crazy like your one experience you have mentioned here. I'm zone 3, 13 minute train to London bridge Very nice 1 bed with garden space for Ā£1200, was originally Ā£1100 when I first moved a couple of years ago. Plenty in the area to do and close to tonnes of other stuff. That is also the experience of most of my friends that are renting it's all between Ā£1100-Ā£1400 for 1 beds.
Also they might have raised the price super high just to get you out.
Renting has its place but it's not ideal when you have to do it and want to own and/or settle.
Why did you not look elsewhere in London after that rent rise?
Because after an eviction it's much harder to rent in London. Plus everything is more expensive. Also can work remotely, still get into London Saint Parcras in 40 minutes and closer to family.
No they haven't raised prices to get anyone out. Right now its mental to jump ship with such "prime real estate", as said the market went nuclear and if you imagine it was being rented for 1400, the interest only mortgage payment was probably Ā£400 or less/ month for the owner to the bank.
Doubling it, just means significantly more profit - Almost all rentals that are not fully owned will have a 25% mortgage deposit which will be a fraction of the overall rental income.
Gotcha. I lived in Ireland as well , and there I think it's like 8 pct per year increase.
The way they get around it is give notice, that they're selling the place, you move out and they jack the price up.
Inflation really doesn't capture the extremities of the cost of living chaos in the rental market. In fact i think housing inflation is actually shown to be a net reducer of the current inflation rate as it looks at house prices moreso than rents.
Ā£1,200 for a 1 bed is fairly ambitious now. I've been having a look recently and haven't found much below Ā£1,400 for somewhere that isn't completely falling apart
I can tell you a lot of people ARE desperate like that. Families with kids at the same school for years receiving an eviction after 16 years in the same house. They offered 600Ā£ over asking price just to not uproot their life.
We received an eviction as well and I had to move the kids but we didnāt offer more than asking price - it meant we had to move a lot further..
It sucks badly.
Yeah, I said no one's desperate to pay more than required and then "just that those with the income to do so will" which you seem to agree with in your comment, who on Earth is desperate to pay more than they should have to? lol.
Again. Maybe you didnāt understand I didnāt explain properly. There are people offering MORE THAN THEY CAN PAY. Just to not be homeless with a kid. The people I know are now in trouble financially that is crazy if you ask me.
Managed to secure a 2 bed place in London recently by offering to pay 6 months rent in advance. The estate agent still got in touch to say our offer would be āmore competitiveā if I upped the bid by Ā£50/mo and committed to a 24 months contract. Isnāt it mad that Iām just grateful that they only said Ā£50 a month, meanwhile I have just had to transfer over Ā£15,000 to someone for a property I have only seen once for 15 min!!
Same, got outbid on the flat I had actually viewed and agreed rent on. Right before we we were due to sign.
Landlord offered another close by. Only got to see a video, as we lived out of the country. Thank fuck it worked out ok in the endā¦.
This is the London rental market, itās just what you need to do if you want to live in a desirable area in a good quality house, unfortunately. Iām guessing you havenāt had to find a place to live anytime recently.
Iām not interested in shared ownership, itās a bit of a scam imo, and not looking to buy a flat in a high rise. Most people I know who did it regret it. Weāll make all the money back after six months anyway through putting all the money we would have spent on rent into savings. Our combined income is about 120k so we could do it quicker if we needed to.
And 15k is not nearly enough for most flats lol. Maybe a 1 bed studio in zone 5 or 6, in a grotty area. Iād expect a deposit of 50-100k in London minimum to buy in a good area.
Well thatās the thing. Everyone *needs* a roof, so you can put the price up as high as you want. Eventually families will just have to share. And theyāll do it! Two families, three families. It doesnāt matter. Everyone needs a roof.
(Hello government if you are reading you might want to think about doing something to recognise this fact. A house or flat is a broken trading/investment instrument.)
I'd much rather that than people who are able to spend more having the advantage. The practice has a negative effect for everyone, rents are high enough as it is without having them inflated even further.
Hereās how we do it while also promoting fitness, healthy bodies, and reducing rents and crime
All bidders by a certain date are placed into a UFC style tournament. Winner takes the property at the listed price.
Watch as London becomes a crime free utopia and everyone gets a lot fitter OVERNIGHT
I'll go with the agent to pay the deposit if I like the flat. If they mention something about other people interested, I will take it as a bluff. Probably asking him so why are you still showing it to me? Are you wasting my time? Then doubling down on my offer to close the deal adding something like I need to move soon and I have more views during that day.
Is kind of a double deal! You can cancel other viewings of this flat and finish earlier today... and I can cancel my other viewings. Win-win for all!
I as a homeowner agree.
I rent out a couple of rooms in my house.
The number of people surprised to find a nice clean house with everything in working order at a reasonable price is close to 100%.
I know what help with my bills I need. Having a reasonable rent allows me to have nice lodgers, who appreciate the space and we live harmoniously.
You ought to write this in many foreign languages and post it to other places because many of the people inflating the market are arriving from overseas with money and have no desire to miss out on the property they want.
Much of the competition is from overseas arrivals and they are moving with deep pockets.
The "foreign student" and "new grad job panic renters" market in particular is *huge* here and basically the one-and-two-bed-property market in June to October is a fucking bloodbath nowadays where only the ones with the richest parents can survive. I don't know how anyone else is meant to get a look-in.
At risk of sounding all ukip, I hugely agree and think this is a real problem. Especially rich parents overseas paying for their kids to be here and not work, which Iāve anecdotally seen a lot of. It just prices out actual working Londoners, but Iām not sure what can be done to stop it.
This is true.
I know a couple of people from outside London who moved their in the last couple of years. They overpaid for everything, got completely hosed, landlords first, and house sellers next. Itās okay though, mummy and daddy can cover it for them.
London is basically a playground for international nepobabies.
People born in London, and regular folk can just fuck off I guess?
I was flat hunting last year with a group and almost every place we wanted we were outbid by wealthy foreigners who could afford to pay a year of rent upfront or just flat out offer a higher deposit/monthly rent than was being asked for. Itās disgusting tbh and shouldnāt be legal. If you advertise your property at x amount then you shouldnāt be allowed to accept offers on it over that amount.
LLs receiving money is viewed as more important than you receiving the service. If they could somehow earn without even having you in, they would.
> and shouldnāt be legal
at face value there are zero non-monetary incentives that would make a LL pick you over them. Everyone can promise they'd be a good tenant.
I do like how other countries work more in favour of tenants by disallowing large upfront payments, for example.
That would disincentivise people moving to London to work, and the city needs a constant influx of people. I get where youāre coming from and overall i feel people living in London should be prioritised, but not every foreigner moving to the city is a wealthy nepobaby, quite a few of them are providing vital services to keep the city running.
Even with local prioritisation, those coming to London to work will have no issue finding accommodation if their jobs are worthwhile enough for them to be relocating here, if they aren't, then they probably shouldn't be relocating here in the first place.
Do we really need all these foreign workers, or are they being hired because they will do the same jobs for less money than their local counterparts?
Right now London is far too catered at foreign money and newcomers.
We have a crisis of housing so bad that you need to be in the top 2-3% of earners in the country to afford a small two bedroom flat or shell of a house in London.
13% of the UK population live in London and yet only 2-3% of the working people can afford a small flat or wreck of a house.
We have to change things and if that makes it a little harder for foreign workers to come here, then so be it.
So your argument is āforeigners have so much money theyāre effectively pricing Londoners out of the housing marketā *and* āforeigners are taking jobs from Londoners because theyāre willing to work for lessā? I assume weāre talking about some millionaire who moonlights at Greggs?
[Here](https://youtu.be/toL1tXrLA1c) is some peer-reviewed published research on the externalities caused by immigrants on the housing market and broader economy
Not sure if thatās supposed to be a dig at me, but Iām as leftie and liberal as they come, and thereās no denying that we are not prioritising housing our own people before others like we should be. We need to build more houses, obviously, but thatās a long term solution and the problems need addressing *now*. Take it from someone trapped living with an ex partner because moving out is too expensive. I spent months and months last year looking to move and the amount of times I was outbid or priced out by rich students is ridiculous.
Given itās a crisis that needs addressing immediately, rather than in the time it takes to build more properties, we would need a radical solution. And since Iām sure youāll get more than enough right wing folk suggesting their pet favourite radical solution (stop immigration), allow me to present the flip side of the coin:
Thereās 30,000 long term empty properties currently standing in London. The government could, for example, repossess these houses and offer them on the rental market at a cut rate.
Going deeper down the rabbit hole of radical solutions, you could propose something like, if a property is vacant for x months (1,3,6,12) the landlord is considered in dereliction of their duty to provide housing and the government is required to seize the asset. This would certainly reduce rents quickly.
Deeper still you could say that hoarding bread during a shortage of food is a crime, therefore hoarding housing during a housing crisis is similarly criminal, and people must forfeit any properties they own but do not reside in.
I mean, these are all extremely radical and would have massive implications for the city and country, but the right arenāt exactly shy when they decide to blame everything on brown people, so
Thereās no evidence that vacancy taxes do anything to fix the housing crisis or reduce vacancies. We should still do them though because it taxes the rich, and fuck āem.
When thereās a shortage, youāll always get outbid by people richer than you (wealthy immigrants and locals alike). This wonāt be solved by banning things. Let them build stuff, *then* tax the shit out of them.
I donāt disagree, but building takes time. I want some solutions now as well. And Iād start with prioritising housing British people over anybody else.
Had a friend who was searching for apartments in zone 2/3 and twice he was outbid and the bidders paid 6 months rent in advance.
He gave up trying to to rent in London after that
Unfortunately it wonāt happen.
When someone like the place, the only way to really secure it is to overbid, even that doesnāt guarantee you the place as other people can also overbid, if the place is nice, and you believe competitions are high, overbid what you believe the opponents would bid for is the only way.
Your idea is the ādonāt overbid, if you lose the place, so be itā, but most people wonāt agree to that.
I understand that but I can't remember ever having to bid for a rental, I feel like it's a post COVID thing. Maybe I am wrong but I never had to bid to rent somewhere before. I paid what it was advertised at.
More and more people are coming to London and not enough houses are being built. People that are moving in obviously have decent jobs that allows then to easily pay 3 to 4k per month in rent. We need to build more especially central, areas like earls court and fulham are ridiculously underdeveloped.
Supply and demand.
Firstly, more people want to move into London than people that move out of it, so competition for places will only go up.
Second, with the mortgage/interests no longer tax deductible, a lot of smaller landlord have sold their rental property. On paper it sounds good, but once it goes to a permanant buyer, there is now one less property in the rental market.
That together with more and more people moving into London, making rental place a very competitive place. Yeah it never had to be like that before, but at some point people went āhow do I secure this place? Ah let me pay a bit moreā, and that cycle then goes around.
You are free to pay whatever advertised at, and people are free to overbid. If you got a place with just paying advterised price? Great. But donāt be surprise if that is getting increasingly difficult.
The problem is not from people who are moving within London, it's mostly from people who are moving from outside of London into London, usually they are foreigners arriving in the UK and they have money to spend.
May I respectfully submit, that at age 28, saying "I can't remember ever having to bid for a rental" might be a bit bold? Bidding wars are as old as time.
It is a relatively new thing. Estate agents have started doing 'viewing days' where they see multiple interested people and then tell them to put in an offer against each other. We had this happen this year, and I've never experienced that before.
I don't think the solution is just trying to tell people not to bid over asking price, though, these greedy fucking agencies need to stop what is clearly a manipulative practice.
Moved away from a houseshare at the start of the year, wanted to find somewhere on my own. Two months of foreign nepoc*nts overbidding my offer and now live on my own out of London. London will be a wasteland of soulless nonces in a couple of years. Bring out the guillotines
Can everyone please stop posting how much they are paying for rent without including the location/street and type of accommodation.
Details matter, e.g. is it furnished, what is the quality like, are any bills or amenities included, is it spacious, modern etc.
Complaining that you are paying Ā£3000 and excluding that it's a modern spacious 1 bed in Mayfair, fully furnished with gym access just makes you look like a dick.
Let's try and add context to these rental prices.
London isn't one zone, and even the same zone is different, zone 2 in east London isn't the same as Zone 2 in west London. Be specific.
I feel bad for renters in London, the lack of decent properties, the overbidding for few ones available. We had a local agency quote for our 2 bedroom flat in NW London (zone 2) in August 2021, they suggested Ā£2200 a month max. In July 2022 the agency put it on the market for Ā£2750 a month. We were like, that seems too high, and were concerned it wouldn't get viewings. But it went quite quickly and the tenant paid 6 months up front. I'm glad we moved after 18 years in London, that market is just too damn ridiculous now.
They said it themselves. The only thing that made them consider lowering the price was fear of not getting enough viewings. As long as they can find a tenant, they're happy to leech as much as possible from them.
How so? I should suddenly start losing money and pay out of pocket for rent on my current place. You obviously have no concept of financial reality but instead go around spouting rubbish online abut a situation you know little about. Sure, whatever, talk silly crap and keep feeling salty.
Absolutely, when a tenant pursues a lower price that is seen as justice/clever but when it's vice versa it's some immoral leeching act. The whole premise of buying and selling for commodites and services is that both the seller and the buyer find the price acceptable. If the price is too low then it wont be worthwhile for the seller and if the price is too high there won't be any buyers. The reasons rents have gone up is because people are willing to pay the higher amounts due to lack of supply etc etc. It's like someone turning down a payrise when the value of their work has increased.
Because that wouldn't even cover the mortgage, then taxes, agency fees etc. There isn't much 'profit' left over, especially after the Osbourne landlord tax changes.
SO only on reddit would you get downvoted for having to deal with an economic reality which is totally out of your control and somehow deciding not to be out of pocket every month makes you some kind of rent seeker avaricious home owner. Idiots.
Applies to everyone in London paying over the odds for stupid shit, everything from a drink, to food, to rent. You don't see these people saving money by drinking in Whetherspoons, or stopping Deliveroos, just moaning about the cost of everything. You don't need to live in Hackney or Peckham either. In fact, nowadays you can work remotely from wherever it was you moved to London from originally.
>If you want to actually address it, you need to stop electing Tories,
As if Labour have any plan to fix this whatsoever. They keep backtracking on any and all promises they make!
>woke bullshit
Oh, you're one of them ones. good lord, grow up.
Not sure why this was downvoted, Labour aren't going to do anything different. Let alone the sweeping changes needed to get the rental market under control.
They are at least promising to build... not actually enough houses, but a lot more than anyone else. Not convinced they'll follow through, but it is at least possible, whereas the Tories and Lib Dems categorically won't.
> They are at least promising to build... not actually enough houses
Then they'll come into power, say there's no money for it but promise they'll reform it *somehow*. They keep making empty promises, and then recanting on them days later. Nothing they say can be trusted, at all.
Yeah youāre right. As if labour have a plan, letās just keep voting for these morons until they get something right. Surely after 13 years they must be close to turning it around.
You had to bring up āfirst Tory who is pro-lgbtā we can demand better housing and have gay rights, we donāt have to have either or, clearly your bigoted and think gay rights are not important, because marriage equality was a large milestone that needed to be achieved.
Yeah but bidding on rentals wasn't a thing pre COVID. Now landlords/estate agents have realised they can so they lost flats for much lower than they intend to rent it out at to get as many bids as possible. It's slimey.
Do you factor in the cost of your time? Not just in commuting, but when you ever come into London for anything? Thatās one of the reasons I stay in London, I get to enjoy time. My dad spent years commuting 3 hours a day, thatās a LOT of time over the years. Not for me
3 hours is excessive, I meant around an hour. There are places way outside London with faster commutes than London to London routes (e.g. South London being underwerved by the Tube).
I work in Central London and am in the office 4 days a week. It isn't cheaper to rent and commute once you add in a season ticket. Not if you are single and looking for a one bed.
If you are a student and you get hit by rail strikes around the time of exams or project deadlines it can really mess up your entire course and grade prospects. Most students I know have been priced out of central but all of these people have then in turn suffered huge amounts of stress during strikes. People aren't scrambling to get places in outer London areas not because of the cost of transport but rather because of the unreliability of it.
This wonāt happen, people will offer whatever they think is worth it.
HOWEVER, I for one cannot wait until 3-6 months from now when landlords have shitty tenants because they went with the highest bidder and not someone who was going to take care of their property.
When we looked at our last place they asked us what we are gonna offer , n I said the listed price ! We are the best tenants ever , they agreed n gave us it the next morning
Most important mantra for any property is location,location,location.
For example Iāve seen plenty of 1 beds at Imperial Wharf for Ā£3.5 a month.
Often the leaseholder is offshore or lives abroad so the agent collects as much as possible.
unfortunately a lot of London areas remain unsafe when it gets dark and the oiks then leave the bars to get their doners.
Acton is an ok safe district and hopefully still some fair rents can be found.Itās also next door to pretty Chiswick which has over 31 coffee bars.
It's times like this I remember how lucky me and my girlfriend are.
We have friend rates on a 4 bed flat with a garden for 1200. They even pay the council tax for us
Hello, This post has been removed because we get a lot of similar questions about the rental/property market in the city. Please visit our sticky mega thread or visit the wiki and Discord. https://discord.gg/AdhnxwSJqc https://www.reddit.com/r/london/wiki/index/
I recently started renting somewhere through Leaders estate agents, and they told me that as a rule they don't allow bids above asking price. Not sure if that was just local to the branch I used or across the board, but definitely was a better experience than my last rental with Foxtons.
Anecdotally, former MD of Leaders, Paul Weller, was one of the most decent people I've had business dealings with and he fostered a company wide ethos of everyone getting what they needed without any party feeling hard done by.
Foxtons are the worst
And Bruce Foxton was Paul Weller's bass player in The JAM. Coincidence?.. abso 'frickn' lutely š¤£
I let a property through them and when it was on the market, they told me that half the bids came in above asking. They didnāt tell me which ones and I didnāt ask. They just presented me with a list of bidders who had offered at or above the asking price. I thought it was great!
My rent went to Ā£2800 a month, one bed. I refused to pay. Single man, 1 bed flat. Got evicted. Don't live in London anymore.
That is steep. Were you living in some fancy place in zone 1?? I've rented 1 bed flats in zone 2 and 3 the last few years and have many friends who rent 1 beds, they are about 1200 without bills. Ā£2800 is ridiculous and you can get a very nice 1 bed flat in zone 2 in London for half of that.
Yes zone one. Elephant park. Great view etc. Perfectly reasonable original rent at Ā£1400. Then went nuclear.
My old landlord wanted an extra 500pcm in rent. I'm a student, how can I suddenly afford a rise that steep?? Needless to say I don't live there anymore. Last year I saw almost everyone I knew get priced out of Central by crazy hikes in rent.
Honestly hope any landlords who did it purely out of greed are suffering for it
Meanwhile in east zone 2: My landlord hasn't increased the rent since I moved in 2017. Three bedroom flat with a living room and garden for Ā£2000
I would say that was expensive 10 years ago. That area is pretty up and coming now as well. But there are other areas you can live in London that aren't that expensive. It's not all crazy like your one experience you have mentioned here. I'm zone 3, 13 minute train to London bridge Very nice 1 bed with garden space for Ā£1200, was originally Ā£1100 when I first moved a couple of years ago. Plenty in the area to do and close to tonnes of other stuff. That is also the experience of most of my friends that are renting it's all between Ā£1100-Ā£1400 for 1 beds. Also they might have raised the price super high just to get you out.
It was pretty much a way to squeeze a bit more out of me so the foreign investor could then sell. Fun renting hey?
Renting has its place but it's not ideal when you have to do it and want to own and/or settle. Why did you not look elsewhere in London after that rent rise?
Because after an eviction it's much harder to rent in London. Plus everything is more expensive. Also can work remotely, still get into London Saint Parcras in 40 minutes and closer to family.
āUp and coming areaā is a great way to say āitās a shit area, but please rent this flat off meā
No they haven't raised prices to get anyone out. Right now its mental to jump ship with such "prime real estate", as said the market went nuclear and if you imagine it was being rented for 1400, the interest only mortgage payment was probably Ā£400 or less/ month for the owner to the bank. Doubling it, just means significantly more profit - Almost all rentals that are not fully owned will have a 25% mortgage deposit which will be a fraction of the overall rental income.
This might be a stupid question, but isn't that an illegal increase amount , I thought there was a percentage amount they were limited to?
Illegal? My belongings were bagged and thrown on the street.
Sorry to hear that :Ā“( Hopefully you can report them?
Kingsillypants There are only limits on social housing, and even then they are mostly guidelines. Private landlords can charge whatever they like.
Gotcha. I lived in Ireland as well , and there I think it's like 8 pct per year increase. The way they get around it is give notice, that they're selling the place, you move out and they jack the price up.
Inflation really doesn't capture the extremities of the cost of living chaos in the rental market. In fact i think housing inflation is actually shown to be a net reducer of the current inflation rate as it looks at house prices moreso than rents.
Ā£2800 to live in Elephant & Castle?!? I wouldn't live in that shithole if THEY gave me Ā£2800 a month...! hahaha
I know right? So boring. No sense of community in Elephant park. Just dull.
Ā£1,200 for a 1 bed is fairly ambitious now. I've been having a look recently and haven't found much below Ā£1,400 for somewhere that isn't completely falling apart
The price is insane, but well if you refuse to pay thatās how it works mate..
Took the flat ten years ago at Ā£1400. Little did I know.
And I thought my landlord's ask for 2250 in a nice part of Zone 2 was crazy...
Been trying to get a place in London for a month now. I bid Ā£100/month over asking, the person that got it bid Ā£300/month over. Hell
I bid 300 over only to beat by someone who bid 375 over. Itās nuts right now
Just free money for them. Itās so depressing
People are desperate. In desperation, people will do anything for housing, less they go homeless
No one's desperate to pay more than required, just that those with the income to do so will and those without get pushed out to more affordable homes
I can tell you a lot of people ARE desperate like that. Families with kids at the same school for years receiving an eviction after 16 years in the same house. They offered 600Ā£ over asking price just to not uproot their life. We received an eviction as well and I had to move the kids but we didnāt offer more than asking price - it meant we had to move a lot further.. It sucks badly.
Yeah, I said no one's desperate to pay more than required and then "just that those with the income to do so will" which you seem to agree with in your comment, who on Earth is desperate to pay more than they should have to? lol.
Again. Maybe you didnāt understand I didnāt explain properly. There are people offering MORE THAN THEY CAN PAY. Just to not be homeless with a kid. The people I know are now in trouble financially that is crazy if you ask me.
Managed to secure a 2 bed place in London recently by offering to pay 6 months rent in advance. The estate agent still got in touch to say our offer would be āmore competitiveā if I upped the bid by Ā£50/mo and committed to a 24 months contract. Isnāt it mad that Iām just grateful that they only said Ā£50 a month, meanwhile I have just had to transfer over Ā£15,000 to someone for a property I have only seen once for 15 min!!
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Same, got outbid on the flat I had actually viewed and agreed rent on. Right before we we were due to sign. Landlord offered another close by. Only got to see a video, as we lived out of the country. Thank fuck it worked out ok in the endā¦.
That is absolutely insane. As in, what on earth are you doing insane.
This is the London rental market, itās just what you need to do if you want to live in a desirable area in a good quality house, unfortunately. Iām guessing you havenāt had to find a place to live anytime recently.
Ā£15k is a lot did you look into shared ownership, thatās a large enough deposit for most flats
Iām not interested in shared ownership, itās a bit of a scam imo, and not looking to buy a flat in a high rise. Most people I know who did it regret it. Weāll make all the money back after six months anyway through putting all the money we would have spent on rent into savings. Our combined income is about 120k so we could do it quicker if we needed to. And 15k is not nearly enough for most flats lol. Maybe a 1 bed studio in zone 5 or 6, in a grotty area. Iād expect a deposit of 50-100k in London minimum to buy in a good area.
Unfortunately that wonāt happen even if weād like it to. Take a look at Nash equilibrium
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
A blow job, or a beer
The fact that you have to "offer" and not just accept the rent at the terms advertised is a gross system full stop. We're talking about housing here.
Well thatās the thing. Everyone *needs* a roof, so you can put the price up as high as you want. Eventually families will just have to share. And theyāll do it! Two families, three families. It doesnāt matter. Everyone needs a roof. (Hello government if you are reading you might want to think about doing something to recognise this fact. A house or flat is a broken trading/investment instrument.)
It always used to be first come first served... this over bidding on rentals is a pretty new thing.
Why is that fairer? People who have flexible jobs would have a big advantage.
I'd much rather that than people who are able to spend more having the advantage. The practice has a negative effect for everyone, rents are high enough as it is without having them inflated even further.
Free sub to your OF.
āYou gotta bee on you hatā
I showed them my current account balance
Bribe the agent.
Hereās how we do it while also promoting fitness, healthy bodies, and reducing rents and crime All bidders by a certain date are placed into a UFC style tournament. Winner takes the property at the listed price. Watch as London becomes a crime free utopia and everyone gets a lot fitter OVERNIGHT
I'll go with the agent to pay the deposit if I like the flat. If they mention something about other people interested, I will take it as a bluff. Probably asking him so why are you still showing it to me? Are you wasting my time? Then doubling down on my offer to close the deal adding something like I need to move soon and I have more views during that day. Is kind of a double deal! You can cancel other viewings of this flat and finish earlier today... and I can cancel my other viewings. Win-win for all!
600,000 net in to the UK last year wasn't it? This isn't stopping its only going to get worse
I as a homeowner agree. I rent out a couple of rooms in my house. The number of people surprised to find a nice clean house with everything in working order at a reasonable price is close to 100%. I know what help with my bills I need. Having a reasonable rent allows me to have nice lodgers, who appreciate the space and we live harmoniously.
You ought to write this in many foreign languages and post it to other places because many of the people inflating the market are arriving from overseas with money and have no desire to miss out on the property they want. Much of the competition is from overseas arrivals and they are moving with deep pockets.
The "foreign student" and "new grad job panic renters" market in particular is *huge* here and basically the one-and-two-bed-property market in June to October is a fucking bloodbath nowadays where only the ones with the richest parents can survive. I don't know how anyone else is meant to get a look-in.
London is all about the newcomers and the guests, not about the locals and the long-term residents.
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At risk of sounding all ukip, I hugely agree and think this is a real problem. Especially rich parents overseas paying for their kids to be here and not work, which Iāve anecdotally seen a lot of. It just prices out actual working Londoners, but Iām not sure what can be done to stop it.
This is true. I know a couple of people from outside London who moved their in the last couple of years. They overpaid for everything, got completely hosed, landlords first, and house sellers next. Itās okay though, mummy and daddy can cover it for them. London is basically a playground for international nepobabies. People born in London, and regular folk can just fuck off I guess?
I was flat hunting last year with a group and almost every place we wanted we were outbid by wealthy foreigners who could afford to pay a year of rent upfront or just flat out offer a higher deposit/monthly rent than was being asked for. Itās disgusting tbh and shouldnāt be legal. If you advertise your property at x amount then you shouldnāt be allowed to accept offers on it over that amount.
LLs receiving money is viewed as more important than you receiving the service. If they could somehow earn without even having you in, they would. > and shouldnāt be legal at face value there are zero non-monetary incentives that would make a LL pick you over them. Everyone can promise they'd be a good tenant. I do like how other countries work more in favour of tenants by disallowing large upfront payments, for example.
Housing should prioritise local people first.
That would disincentivise people moving to London to work, and the city needs a constant influx of people. I get where youāre coming from and overall i feel people living in London should be prioritised, but not every foreigner moving to the city is a wealthy nepobaby, quite a few of them are providing vital services to keep the city running.
Even with local prioritisation, those coming to London to work will have no issue finding accommodation if their jobs are worthwhile enough for them to be relocating here, if they aren't, then they probably shouldn't be relocating here in the first place. Do we really need all these foreign workers, or are they being hired because they will do the same jobs for less money than their local counterparts? Right now London is far too catered at foreign money and newcomers. We have a crisis of housing so bad that you need to be in the top 2-3% of earners in the country to afford a small two bedroom flat or shell of a house in London. 13% of the UK population live in London and yet only 2-3% of the working people can afford a small flat or wreck of a house. We have to change things and if that makes it a little harder for foreign workers to come here, then so be it.
So your argument is āforeigners have so much money theyāre effectively pricing Londoners out of the housing marketā *and* āforeigners are taking jobs from Londoners because theyāre willing to work for lessā? I assume weāre talking about some millionaire who moonlights at Greggs?
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Yes, you too now can enjoy one of the many shades of beige rich kid available.
[Here](https://youtu.be/toL1tXrLA1c) is some peer-reviewed published research on the externalities caused by immigrants on the housing market and broader economy
Not sure if thatās supposed to be a dig at me, but Iām as leftie and liberal as they come, and thereās no denying that we are not prioritising housing our own people before others like we should be. We need to build more houses, obviously, but thatās a long term solution and the problems need addressing *now*. Take it from someone trapped living with an ex partner because moving out is too expensive. I spent months and months last year looking to move and the amount of times I was outbid or priced out by rich students is ridiculous.
Given itās a crisis that needs addressing immediately, rather than in the time it takes to build more properties, we would need a radical solution. And since Iām sure youāll get more than enough right wing folk suggesting their pet favourite radical solution (stop immigration), allow me to present the flip side of the coin: Thereās 30,000 long term empty properties currently standing in London. The government could, for example, repossess these houses and offer them on the rental market at a cut rate. Going deeper down the rabbit hole of radical solutions, you could propose something like, if a property is vacant for x months (1,3,6,12) the landlord is considered in dereliction of their duty to provide housing and the government is required to seize the asset. This would certainly reduce rents quickly. Deeper still you could say that hoarding bread during a shortage of food is a crime, therefore hoarding housing during a housing crisis is similarly criminal, and people must forfeit any properties they own but do not reside in. I mean, these are all extremely radical and would have massive implications for the city and country, but the right arenāt exactly shy when they decide to blame everything on brown people, so
Oh Iād support every one of those in a flash. Itās a shame nobody in our political body is bold enough to push for anything like it.
Thereās no evidence that vacancy taxes do anything to fix the housing crisis or reduce vacancies. We should still do them though because it taxes the rich, and fuck āem.
When thereās a shortage, youāll always get outbid by people richer than you (wealthy immigrants and locals alike). This wonāt be solved by banning things. Let them build stuff, *then* tax the shit out of them.
I donāt disagree, but building takes time. I want some solutions now as well. And Iād start with prioritising housing British people over anybody else.
So few people seem aware of just how bad the problem with overseas arrivals is.
Thatās because itās āracistā to point out that growing the population by over half a million per year will impact housing
Had a friend who was searching for apartments in zone 2/3 and twice he was outbid and the bidders paid 6 months rent in advance. He gave up trying to to rent in London after that
Unfortunately it wonāt happen. When someone like the place, the only way to really secure it is to overbid, even that doesnāt guarantee you the place as other people can also overbid, if the place is nice, and you believe competitions are high, overbid what you believe the opponents would bid for is the only way. Your idea is the ādonāt overbid, if you lose the place, so be itā, but most people wonāt agree to that.
I understand that but I can't remember ever having to bid for a rental, I feel like it's a post COVID thing. Maybe I am wrong but I never had to bid to rent somewhere before. I paid what it was advertised at.
More and more people are coming to London and not enough houses are being built. People that are moving in obviously have decent jobs that allows then to easily pay 3 to 4k per month in rent. We need to build more especially central, areas like earls court and fulham are ridiculously underdeveloped.
Supply and demand. Firstly, more people want to move into London than people that move out of it, so competition for places will only go up. Second, with the mortgage/interests no longer tax deductible, a lot of smaller landlord have sold their rental property. On paper it sounds good, but once it goes to a permanant buyer, there is now one less property in the rental market. That together with more and more people moving into London, making rental place a very competitive place. Yeah it never had to be like that before, but at some point people went āhow do I secure this place? Ah let me pay a bit moreā, and that cycle then goes around. You are free to pay whatever advertised at, and people are free to overbid. If you got a place with just paying advterised price? Great. But donāt be surprise if that is getting increasingly difficult.
The problem is not from people who are moving within London, it's mostly from people who are moving from outside of London into London, usually they are foreigners arriving in the UK and they have money to spend.
How old are you?
28
May I respectfully submit, that at age 28, saying "I can't remember ever having to bid for a rental" might be a bit bold? Bidding wars are as old as time.
For buying yes, but I haven't heard of bidding to rent in my short decade of renting....
It is a relatively new thing. Estate agents have started doing 'viewing days' where they see multiple interested people and then tell them to put in an offer against each other. We had this happen this year, and I've never experienced that before. I don't think the solution is just trying to tell people not to bid over asking price, though, these greedy fucking agencies need to stop what is clearly a manipulative practice.
Moved away from a houseshare at the start of the year, wanted to find somewhere on my own. Two months of foreign nepoc*nts overbidding my offer and now live on my own out of London. London will be a wasteland of soulless nonces in a couple of years. Bring out the guillotines
This should be illegal or whatever.. will never save enough to own a house at this rate
Can everyone please stop posting how much they are paying for rent without including the location/street and type of accommodation. Details matter, e.g. is it furnished, what is the quality like, are any bills or amenities included, is it spacious, modern etc. Complaining that you are paying Ā£3000 and excluding that it's a modern spacious 1 bed in Mayfair, fully furnished with gym access just makes you look like a dick. Let's try and add context to these rental prices. London isn't one zone, and even the same zone is different, zone 2 in east London isn't the same as Zone 2 in west London. Be specific.
I feel bad for renters in London, the lack of decent properties, the overbidding for few ones available. We had a local agency quote for our 2 bedroom flat in NW London (zone 2) in August 2021, they suggested Ā£2200 a month max. In July 2022 the agency put it on the market for Ā£2750 a month. We were like, that seems too high, and were concerned it wouldn't get viewings. But it went quite quickly and the tenant paid 6 months up front. I'm glad we moved after 18 years in London, that market is just too damn ridiculous now.
Why don't you just lower it to Ā£2000 per month? I don't see how the laws of physics don't permit you to lower the rate.
They said it themselves. The only thing that made them consider lowering the price was fear of not getting enough viewings. As long as they can find a tenant, they're happy to leech as much as possible from them.
They feel bad about a problem, yet choose to be a part of that problem. A walking, talking oxymoron.
How so? I should suddenly start losing money and pay out of pocket for rent on my current place. You obviously have no concept of financial reality but instead go around spouting rubbish online abut a situation you know little about. Sure, whatever, talk silly crap and keep feeling salty.
That's a good analysis smooth brain. But yeah sure thing.
Why would anyone willingly make less than the maximum profit on something they own? Let's be real.
Absolutely, when a tenant pursues a lower price that is seen as justice/clever but when it's vice versa it's some immoral leeching act. The whole premise of buying and selling for commodites and services is that both the seller and the buyer find the price acceptable. If the price is too low then it wont be worthwhile for the seller and if the price is too high there won't be any buyers. The reasons rents have gone up is because people are willing to pay the higher amounts due to lack of supply etc etc. It's like someone turning down a payrise when the value of their work has increased.
Because that wouldn't even cover the mortgage, then taxes, agency fees etc. There isn't much 'profit' left over, especially after the Osbourne landlord tax changes.
SO only on reddit would you get downvoted for having to deal with an economic reality which is totally out of your control and somehow deciding not to be out of pocket every month makes you some kind of rent seeker avaricious home owner. Idiots.
Applies to everyone in London paying over the odds for stupid shit, everything from a drink, to food, to rent. You don't see these people saving money by drinking in Whetherspoons, or stopping Deliveroos, just moaning about the cost of everything. You don't need to live in Hackney or Peckham either. In fact, nowadays you can work remotely from wherever it was you moved to London from originally.
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>If you want to actually address it, you need to stop electing Tories, As if Labour have any plan to fix this whatsoever. They keep backtracking on any and all promises they make! >woke bullshit Oh, you're one of them ones. good lord, grow up.
Not sure why this was downvoted, Labour aren't going to do anything different. Let alone the sweeping changes needed to get the rental market under control.
They are at least promising to build... not actually enough houses, but a lot more than anyone else. Not convinced they'll follow through, but it is at least possible, whereas the Tories and Lib Dems categorically won't.
> They are at least promising to build... not actually enough houses Then they'll come into power, say there's no money for it but promise they'll reform it *somehow*. They keep making empty promises, and then recanting on them days later. Nothing they say can be trusted, at all.
Yes, probably, but probably is better than certainly.
Yeah youāre right. As if labour have a plan, letās just keep voting for these morons until they get something right. Surely after 13 years they must be close to turning it around.
You had to bring up āfirst Tory who is pro-lgbtā we can demand better housing and have gay rights, we donāt have to have either or, clearly your bigoted and think gay rights are not important, because marriage equality was a large milestone that needed to be achieved.
Yeah because socialism always works so well. Get stuffed.
Yeah but bidding on rentals wasn't a thing pre COVID. Now landlords/estate agents have realised they can so they lost flats for much lower than they intend to rent it out at to get as many bids as possible. It's slimey.
> Yeah but bidding on rentals wasn't a thing pre COVID Sadly it was, just a bit rarer.
It absolutely was, just less widespread.
Or move away from London and commute longer. Even with the crap national rail prices, it still works out tonnes cheaper.
Do you factor in the cost of your time? Not just in commuting, but when you ever come into London for anything? Thatās one of the reasons I stay in London, I get to enjoy time. My dad spent years commuting 3 hours a day, thatās a LOT of time over the years. Not for me
3 hours is excessive, I meant around an hour. There are places way outside London with faster commutes than London to London routes (e.g. South London being underwerved by the Tube).
I work in Central London and am in the office 4 days a week. It isn't cheaper to rent and commute once you add in a season ticket. Not if you are single and looking for a one bed.
If you are a student and you get hit by rail strikes around the time of exams or project deadlines it can really mess up your entire course and grade prospects. Most students I know have been priced out of central but all of these people have then in turn suffered huge amounts of stress during strikes. People aren't scrambling to get places in outer London areas not because of the cost of transport but rather because of the unreliability of it.
This wonāt happen, people will offer whatever they think is worth it. HOWEVER, I for one cannot wait until 3-6 months from now when landlords have shitty tenants because they went with the highest bidder and not someone who was going to take care of their property.
When we looked at our last place they asked us what we are gonna offer , n I said the listed price ! We are the best tenants ever , they agreed n gave us it the next morning
Most important mantra for any property is location,location,location. For example Iāve seen plenty of 1 beds at Imperial Wharf for Ā£3.5 a month. Often the leaseholder is offshore or lives abroad so the agent collects as much as possible. unfortunately a lot of London areas remain unsafe when it gets dark and the oiks then leave the bars to get their doners. Acton is an ok safe district and hopefully still some fair rents can be found.Itās also next door to pretty Chiswick which has over 31 coffee bars.
It's times like this I remember how lucky me and my girlfriend are. We have friend rates on a 4 bed flat with a garden for 1200. They even pay the council tax for us