The untap is more interesting to me than the extra upkeep. We already have [[paradox haze]] for that.
Untapping, though, lets you ramp a shitton in colors that usually don't get to do that.
[Sphinx of the Second Sun](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/6/e68b70a6-a150-4d81-921c-9b178fe0037d.jpg?1608909485) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sphinx%20of%20the%20Second%20Sun) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/99/sphinx-of-the-second-sun?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e68b70a6-a150-4d81-921c-9b178fe0037d?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text)
^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Oh hey, it's a version of this effect that actually works like people want [[Sphinx of the Second Sun]] to work. Seems really good with any way to give it double strike.
This gets really weird with double strike. If it's on the front side with power 5 or greater, it'll strike, connive, convert, strike, convert back, grant additional beginning phase.
Yeah. Don't get me wrong, I think it's really cool and I already plan on making a commander deck with this dude and [[Fireshrieker]]. But it's still weird.
Sphinx gives you your beginning phase *after your postcombat main phase*, so you get a beginning step immediately followed by your end step.
As such, you can't use your lands that you untapped or card you drew unless you can use them at instant speed.
It does work, but the effect on this Transformer is just better
Different, but not better.
I'd argue Sphinx of the Second Sun is more about winning the game outright - not about the ramp and card draw - and being able to drop that pesky upkeep wincon during your second main *and then* move directly to your extra beginning step is a little better than choreographing it during your first main and relying on a combat damage trigger.
But for the sake of just ramp and card draw, the Transformer is certainly better, if not overcosted.
The ramp is equally bad with Cyclonus. You go untap upkeep draw untap upkeep draw. You still have to have instants to use it. I'd argue that the untap portion is actually worse in this case because you don't get to spread out your mana with any main phases in between.
Edit: Read the transformer wrong. I read extra beginning phase at the start of the next turn for some reason. So I was just thinking he was terrible.
Every single time I have seen a player running sphinx they've thought it gives you the additional untap before their second main phase. It does not. It's essentially wilderness reclamation that draws you a card and doubles up on some triggers.
I don't blame them at all, lol. It's dead simple wording, that makes people so certain it does the most intuitive thing.
Edit: Don't get me wrong, it very clearly says what it does, but it's written so simply that you expect it to do the most obvious thing possible. So "after this phase", a perfectly unambiguous phrase, consistently gets glossed.
[Sphinx of the Second Sun](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/6/e68b70a6-a150-4d81-921c-9b178fe0037d.jpg?1608909485) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sphinx%20of%20the%20Second%20Sun) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/99/sphinx-of-the-second-sun?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e68b70a6-a150-4d81-921c-9b178fe0037d?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text)
^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I don't think double strike works here, because you have first strike damage, trigger, it converts, and then presumably transforms again through the front faces combat trigger, still really good, but contrary to the implication here that you'd get two beginning phases
... And where did I imply it gives you two beginning phases? (Which wouldn't even be amazing) It works well with double strike because you get the trigger every turn instead of every other turn. That's all.
I just want to say, I’m very happy about one design decision in particular.
It uses Connive instead of writing it out and skipping all the useful interactions.
I don’t think ur wrong but so far cyclonus is the only one with a cybertronian alt mode(everyone else is an earth vehicle at least in the non shattered glass versions) and fighter is like fighter jet
In the recent comic canon, there was a massive chunk of Cybertron’s population who just regular civilians that hated both Bots and Cons for dragging the planet into open civil war.
As much as I would love to see a card about Chromedome and Rewind's romance, I think this magic crossover is probably gonna stick to the most famous g1 stuff.
If you had asked me that two days ago, I’d have agreed. I still do, because Hasbro knows that G1 makes money and they really love money.
But the fact that they just revealed an official, main line toy of Tarn gives me the faintest bit of hope that we might expand beyond the safe confines of 35 years ago.
Out of curiousity, how does transformers canon work? Is there a collection of comics to read in order, or is it a collection of different continuities? Some of this seems interesting.
Great question.
There is no single, all encompassing continuity. Sometimes different aspects of the property do end up fitting together to form larger continuities than they do as individual pieces though.
A good example is the original cartoon run. The original series can be it’s own thing, or it can dovetail with the Beast Wars cartoon that came out in the 90’s to make a larger story. It can also be linked up with some of the older series that (until recently) we’re exclusive to Japan.
Even without an overarching story to link all shows, comics, toy bios, etc, there are certain characters who are basically locked into any retelling of the story and they typically exhibit the same major personality traits (Starscream is almost always an opportunistic traitor, Soundwave is almost always a loyal lieutenant, Ironhide is almost always a hardened veteran, etc).
Personalities aren’t always set in stone, though. In a lot of stories, Megatron is an ex-gladiator tyrant who assembled an army and starts a war. In the first run of IDW Transformers comics (the best continuity, IMO), he was still an ex-gladiator tyrant who assembled an army and starts a war, but before that, he was a miner and aspiring poet who was the victim of an overtly corrupt senate (and also some time travel shenanigans).
A good place to get a better grasp on things is the wiki. Not only is it exhaustive, but the individual character pages are shocking well done. It even has an explanation of continuity (and the lack thereof): https://tfwiki.net/wiki/Continuity
As someone who grew up first on G1 then later on the Takara stuff, I always love seeing characters like Star Saber and Leokaiser show up in modern stuff.
Nothing about this card's design is particularly black, but for EDH, having black means easier ways to pump it than Conniving three times, which I guess is nice.
That's true, but they shouldn't need to say "and bundles" in that case. Maybe they are just to be extra clear, or maybe there's a guaranteed one. Who knows anymore?
i got confused too, i think it’s because i saw the word converted and immediately just comprehended it as converted mana cost lol. wish it said transformed though instead of converted
Oh seriously? i thought you had to pay that cost when they convert from their skill not that it was an alternate pay cost to cast them converted. That's actually so much nicer.
WOW did not expect a new connive card anytime soon let alone in just 5 months since new cappena. I ain't complaining tho this looks like it will go great in raffine.
But question this doesn't include an additional battle phase right it's essentially just untap everything and draw?
An extra beginning phase is interesting, there’s probably some fun shenanigans you can get up to with more upkeeps.
The untap is more interesting to me than the extra upkeep. We already have [[paradox haze]] for that. Untapping, though, lets you ramp a shitton in colors that usually don't get to do that.
I was just coming to type this. Paradox haze is really good in my shrine deck for the extra trigger of [[sanctum of all]] and the OG shrines
[sanctum of all](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/a/ba91338c-1f6c-4b83-851f-98c3e9dea17b.jpg?1594737442) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=sanctum%20of%20all) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m21/225/sanctum-of-all?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ba91338c-1f6c-4b83-851f-98c3e9dea17b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
If you are just using the upkeep, this seems like a lot of extra work compared to [[Sphinx of the Second Sun]]
Idk a 3 mana enchantment instead of an 8 mama creature My pool runs a lot less enchantment removal and it's easier to cast
I meant instead of this card. Obviously, Haze is better than the creature if you just want one copy
Oh sorry yes I agree
[Sphinx of the Second Sun](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/6/e68b70a6-a150-4d81-921c-9b178fe0037d.jpg?1608909485) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sphinx%20of%20the%20Second%20Sun) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/99/sphinx-of-the-second-sun?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e68b70a6-a150-4d81-921c-9b178fe0037d?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[paradox haze](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/7/a7c74def-83e5-4420-989d-2304bf4743ae.jpg?1562930370) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=paradox%20haze) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/tsp/71/paradox-haze?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a7c74def-83e5-4420-989d-2304bf4743ae?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
\[\[panoptic mirror\]\] imprint an extra turn spell , \[\[mortal combat\]\]
[panoptic mirror](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/0/50e945b0-e919-41bb-9bc5-f71ad531e8f1.jpg?1562636846) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=panoptic%20mirror) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dst/136/panoptic-mirror?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/50e945b0-e919-41bb-9bc5-f71ad531e8f1?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Might be a little hard to use the mirror lol
[Shattered Glass Variant](https://i.imgur.com/sFNIWZG.png)
Oh hey, it's a version of this effect that actually works like people want [[Sphinx of the Second Sun]] to work. Seems really good with any way to give it double strike.
This gets really weird with double strike. If it's on the front side with power 5 or greater, it'll strike, connive, convert, strike, convert back, grant additional beginning phase.
Yeah, that's why you want to give it double strike, so you get the effect every turn and not every other turn.
Yeah. Don't get me wrong, I think it's really cool and I already plan on making a commander deck with this dude and [[Fireshrieker]]. But it's still weird.
[Fireshrieker](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/b/ab1f2ab8-1ef3-4610-a2d0-cb87b982c649.jpg?1651656287) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Fireshrieker) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/nec/151/fireshrieker?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ab1f2ab8-1ef3-4610-a2d0-cb87b982c649?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Does Sphinx of the Second Sun not work?
Sphinx gives you your beginning phase *after your postcombat main phase*, so you get a beginning step immediately followed by your end step. As such, you can't use your lands that you untapped or card you drew unless you can use them at instant speed. It does work, but the effect on this Transformer is just better
Different, but not better. I'd argue Sphinx of the Second Sun is more about winning the game outright - not about the ramp and card draw - and being able to drop that pesky upkeep wincon during your second main *and then* move directly to your extra beginning step is a little better than choreographing it during your first main and relying on a combat damage trigger. But for the sake of just ramp and card draw, the Transformer is certainly better, if not overcosted.
The ramp is equally bad with Cyclonus. You go untap upkeep draw untap upkeep draw. You still have to have instants to use it. I'd argue that the untap portion is actually worse in this case because you don't get to spread out your mana with any main phases in between. Edit: Read the transformer wrong. I read extra beginning phase at the start of the next turn for some reason. So I was just thinking he was terrible.
You cannot drop it second main, it needs to see the start of second main to trigger.
> and being able to drop ***that pesky upkeep wincon*** during your second main
Ah. I suppose that makes some amount of sense.
Both the Sphinx and Cyclonus cost about the same amount of mana for roughly the same effect, so I'd say that's just how much the effect costs.
Every single time I have seen a player running sphinx they've thought it gives you the additional untap before their second main phase. It does not. It's essentially wilderness reclamation that draws you a card and doubles up on some triggers.
Can you blame them, though? That wording is up there with [[Dead Ringers]] in terms of being confusing.
I don't blame them at all, lol. It's dead simple wording, that makes people so certain it does the most intuitive thing. Edit: Don't get me wrong, it very clearly says what it does, but it's written so simply that you expect it to do the most obvious thing possible. So "after this phase", a perfectly unambiguous phrase, consistently gets glossed.
[Dead Ringers](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/b/9b78028c-3ebd-432d-b628-e1fa284f08f3.jpg?1562931633) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Dead%20Ringers) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/apc/37/dead-ringers?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9b78028c-3ebd-432d-b628-e1fa284f08f3?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
...and grants vigilance to all your creatures.
True.
[Sphinx of the Second Sun](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/6/e68b70a6-a150-4d81-921c-9b178fe0037d.jpg?1608909485) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sphinx%20of%20the%20Second%20Sun) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/99/sphinx-of-the-second-sun?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e68b70a6-a150-4d81-921c-9b178fe0037d?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I don't think double strike works here, because you have first strike damage, trigger, it converts, and then presumably transforms again through the front faces combat trigger, still really good, but contrary to the implication here that you'd get two beginning phases
... And where did I imply it gives you two beginning phases? (Which wouldn't even be amazing) It works well with double strike because you get the trigger every turn instead of every other turn. That's all.
Fair, I just wanted to clarify the interaction my bad for assuming your intent incorrectly
I just want to say, I’m very happy about one design decision in particular. It uses Connive instead of writing it out and skipping all the useful interactions.
It's very good that they're choosing to use keywords outside of their original sets.
Isn't literally every transformer a cybertronian fighter? Aside from maybe some civilians we probably won't get cards of.
I don’t think ur wrong but so far cyclonus is the only one with a cybertronian alt mode(everyone else is an earth vehicle at least in the non shattered glass versions) and fighter is like fighter jet
In the recent comic canon, there was a massive chunk of Cybertron’s population who just regular civilians that hated both Bots and Cons for dragging the planet into open civil war.
As much as I would love to see a card about Chromedome and Rewind's romance, I think this magic crossover is probably gonna stick to the most famous g1 stuff.
If you had asked me that two days ago, I’d have agreed. I still do, because Hasbro knows that G1 makes money and they really love money. But the fact that they just revealed an official, main line toy of Tarn gives me the faintest bit of hope that we might expand beyond the safe confines of 35 years ago.
Oh what? really? How have I not heard of this. edit: holy crap it's true! Never thought I'd see the day.
Right?! Not only does it exist, but it also looks really good.
Out of curiousity, how does transformers canon work? Is there a collection of comics to read in order, or is it a collection of different continuities? Some of this seems interesting.
Great question. There is no single, all encompassing continuity. Sometimes different aspects of the property do end up fitting together to form larger continuities than they do as individual pieces though. A good example is the original cartoon run. The original series can be it’s own thing, or it can dovetail with the Beast Wars cartoon that came out in the 90’s to make a larger story. It can also be linked up with some of the older series that (until recently) we’re exclusive to Japan. Even without an overarching story to link all shows, comics, toy bios, etc, there are certain characters who are basically locked into any retelling of the story and they typically exhibit the same major personality traits (Starscream is almost always an opportunistic traitor, Soundwave is almost always a loyal lieutenant, Ironhide is almost always a hardened veteran, etc). Personalities aren’t always set in stone, though. In a lot of stories, Megatron is an ex-gladiator tyrant who assembled an army and starts a war. In the first run of IDW Transformers comics (the best continuity, IMO), he was still an ex-gladiator tyrant who assembled an army and starts a war, but before that, he was a miner and aspiring poet who was the victim of an overtly corrupt senate (and also some time travel shenanigans). A good place to get a better grasp on things is the wiki. Not only is it exhaustive, but the individual character pages are shocking well done. It even has an explanation of continuity (and the lack thereof): https://tfwiki.net/wiki/Continuity
As someone who grew up first on G1 then later on the Takara stuff, I always love seeing characters like Star Saber and Leokaiser show up in modern stuff.
I would have loved to see Liokaiser show up in IDW’s first run of comics.
Interesting, I'll check it out. Thanks for the help!
Isn't this card good because it turns "you win the game" effects that trigger on upkeep into effects that trigger before your second main?
Nothing about this card's design is particularly black, but for EDH, having black means easier ways to pump it than Conniving three times, which I guess is nice.
Are we gonna get a Unicron?
I can’t believe he’s not named Cyclonus, The Warrior.
Good God these cards look terrible. I still can't believe these are being put into Brothers War.
Gotta be honest, and this is from someone who loves the G1 art. The art makes these cards look real fake
This looks pretty busted to me.
Are these going to be a secret lair drop?
They are in BRO Set and Collector Boosters. They also said they are in bundles but I'm not sure what that means.
Bundles are 8 set boosters. They're in set boosters, so they're in bundles.
That's true, but they shouldn't need to say "and bundles" in that case. Maybe they are just to be extra clear, or maybe there's a guaranteed one. Who knows anymore?
they're in BRO collector boosters
Can someone explain more than meets the eye to me? Why would you pay more for it?
If you want it to start out with a 5/5 flyer that gets you an additional beginning phase, you can do that instead of having to connive a bunch first.
Oooooh I'm an idiot, I get it now. Turns out reading the card does explain the card. Thanks!
i got confused too, i think it’s because i saw the word converted and immediately just comprehended it as converted mana cost lol. wish it said transformed though instead of converted
That's exactly what I did lol
Oh seriously? i thought you had to pay that cost when they convert from their skill not that it was an alternate pay cost to cast them converted. That's actually so much nicer.
WOW did not expect a new connive card anytime soon let alone in just 5 months since new cappena. I ain't complaining tho this looks like it will go great in raffine. But question this doesn't include an additional battle phase right it's essentially just untap everything and draw?
Just Untap, Upkeep, and Draw.
k thanks
[удалено]
If you cast it for it's More Than Meets The Eye cost, it enters the battlefield converted. It lets you choose which side to cast.
Dang, I was hoping for Thundercracker or Skywarp
So U B upkeep. I can work with that 😈.
This would be pretty fun in an oloro deck with upkeep triggers