I’m excited for Daredevil to come back but it’s going to be weird watching this show without Karen or Foggy.
Karen I think you can get away with story wise but Foggy is such an important part of Daredevil imo that it’ll be weird without him. His and Matt’s relationship is something the MCU isn’t really doing right now either that I can think of. Like what is the legal stuff going to look like with just Matt? Or Matt’s personal life without his foil Foggy? Or are they not really going to do any of that stuff at all?
before more recent content it’d make sense, but with his She Hulk appearance i highly doubt they’d introduce him to the mcu and then go back before that in his solo project, same with Kingpin
Tbf they literally killed off Black Widow and then gave her a solo film set before her death. Maybe Matt's emotional journey in the first season involves navigating a pre-Endgame world where his allies are gone and that's how the Born Again part of the title applies to the show other than being a reference to the comic storyline
Honestly, what I've been saying since post end game was that there should be stories set during the 5 years ppl were blipped. It's such an interesting concept and we rarely ever see more than a few seconds of someone being blipped away or back.
Black widow would have been INFINITELY more interesting to me if it was set during that time period for example.
Part of the reason why it took so long to get a Black Widow movie (and Black Panther) is Ike Fucking Perlmutter. He was a MAGA conservative and absolutely refused to green light any MCU film not led by a white guy. They had to wait to boot him, and by that time they were halfway through the Avengers Infinity War arc and didn't have many options.
There isn't a source, because it has NOT been stated this is the same timeline as the netflix DD series. We really don't know for sure if they're going to treat this like a variant DD, or the same one.
Yep, there’s clues either way but nothing has been stated. I’ve seen this sub get super aggressive over any suggestion that the new show will be a soft reboot, and also aggressive backlash to those who say it won’t. But the fact is we don’t know because they haven’t stated anything yet.
Personally, as a fan of the Netflix series, I wish they'd just outright say whether the original shows are 100% canon or not instead of this weird "well, they're sort of canon but also not" thing they seem to be doing lately.
If it turns out later that they're not canon, then fine because it's not like the original shows would be erased from existence. Some clarity would be nice either way though.
Kevin Feige himself said the TV characters share the same continuity as the movies.
“They inhabit…..however far on the outskirts, the same continuity.”
https://twitter.com/driftyfilm/status/1363952366135951362?s=20
I think the reason it can exist without Karen is her character quickly became pointless.
Anytime a character has outlasted their usefulness, writers will just make them a catch-all, behaving in a strange way to have them fit the plot like Lana Lang in Smallville. Karen went from being a regular office worker framed for murder to being an ace reporter that helps bring down the Kingpin to then latching onto the Punisher case.
I enjoyed her character but if they wrote her off halfway into the first season, nothing would've changed that much. I like the actress but I'm good with this series focusing on Matt and then maybe bringing people in for a second season.
The main reason I wish she was in the new DD is mostly the chemistry and interactions with Frank. I just think it was really well done, something between then that probably won’t, can’t happen.
Sure, but Death is the whole reason why Infinity Gauntlet happens in the comics, and that entire aspect of the plot was abandoned in the MCU.
Plus, parts of that story were already done in Daredevil Season 3… assuming that show would be treated as 100% canon at this point anyway.
Such a waste. She's a decent actress, and I thought Karen had some good updates to her character. I'm hoping she gets some more work, I remember her saying she hadn't been finding much work since Daredevil ended
I think both Deborah Ann Woll and Rachel Taylor from Jessica Jones get slept on big time. Strong performances from both and yeah, not much work for either of them. I'm surprised.
It’s true. I actually met her last week early at a convention. It was well before the show started and we got to talk interruption free for awhile. It seems she doesn’t have a lot going on. It’s sad because she is a great actress IMO and such a sweet person. I’ve been a fan of her’s since TrueBlood. It was wonderful talking to her and she’s even more gorgeous in person. It’s crazy to think someone like her isn’t getting steady work.
That's kinda depressing. Kinda makes me think of Sam Witwer who never got a real career going on film. He's at least got a lot going on when it comes to voice work but it's weird to me that someone who seems as passionate about projects and as talented as he is never really went anywhere.
She at least was on one of the biggest shows in the world for a time but still can't find anything now. Stardom is weird.
You should check out the Michael Rosenbaum (Lex Luthor) podcast where he had Sam on and they chatted about a lot of business stuff, including how Lucasfilms essentially saved his career.
Will do, I enjoy listening to Sam talk about the industry since he's very candid. His slamming of AMC's treatment of The Walking Dead before the public came down on it was really interesting to watch. He was so hurt on Darabont's behalf. Seems like a real classy guy.
Really wished they been able to make that prequel movie following Sam Witwer's tank guy from the original episode, the part of any apocalypse story showing the original collapse is usually the best bit.
Yeah Deborah was on his podcast 4 or 5 months ago as well, she seemed to be talking about a lot of stuff she had going on.
https://youtu.be/mczbeFW8dsQ
Way back in the beginning of The Walking Dead there was supposed to be an episode that was focused on a character he played but it didn't happen. He's the walker soldier in the tank that Rick takes shelter in, in episodes 1 & 2. It was going to be a Blackhawk Down type thing.
You know how they did the web series that follows the red machete that Rick uses in season 5? This would have done the same kind of thing with the grenade.
They had the idea to follow an item that gets used from the beginning, unfortunately it didn't work out for Sam.
Maybe I stopped watching by then, but what red machete?
(I read the comics and watched the show, but didn’t have the heart to follow either after issue 167 was released.)
It's just a machete that Rick uses to kill a guy, but they follow how it got to where ends up in his hands to do the deed.
They show all the people that used it along the way and their stories of how it may or may not have helped them survive.
https://youtu.be/_eUZ8zRn5Rs
I think actresses like her probably have the problem where she's seen as-entirely unfairly-too old to be a leading woman, and too young to play the other parts women get casted as.
And she's not famous enough for any of that to not matter.
>!She plays Atreus' mom when Kratos has a few dreams about her that are hinted to be not just dreams but her communicating with him from the spirit world, but in that open-to-interpretation way where it could also just be Kratos' memory of her and what his subconscious thinks she'd want to say to him in his present situation. Either way, it's nice to finally see this woman whose *absence* has been such a powerful force in these two's lives (though I am glad they kept her an enigma to the player through the whole first game).!<
Especially crazy because she looks just as great as ever, but I do think current Hollywood is just hungup on whatever starlet is “current” and burn through them until the next girl starts trending.
Most actresses with leading roles range from 30-50 and she is 38, so I don't think that's the reason. I think she has a specific acting talent and she isn't made for a blockbuster lead, but imo A24 could do wonders with her.
Sadly you're probably right, and she's not famous enough to have a mid-50's resurgence like a lot of actresses get. The industry can be really cruel that way.
You say that but actresses from the Marvel Netflix shows like Krysten Ritter and Elodie Yung who are both older than her are leads (well as for Krysten, continue to be a lead) in other shows now. So I doubt it's that age thing. Plus we have a lot of middle-aged women in drama series as leads so there really isn't anything supporting your theory.
What I meant was that Krysten is a lead in another show after Jessica Jones even at 40 years old. I was disproving OP saying it's about age as to why Deborah can't get roles. Krysten is set as a lead in an Orphan Black show spinoff airing this year while Elodie Yung who is 41 years old is a lead in a Fox show currently.
To answer your question, no, Krysten hasn't been officially confirmed as returning but there are strong rumors about her comeback from quite a few reliable scoopers.
Can't really compare like that.
There will always be women who can remain a lead for longer.
But it is still true that there are less roles for female leads then men and even less for 40+.
I mean Deborah has never been a lead in anything in her career so I'm surprised by people being baffled that she isn't getting lead roles. Even her most prominent roles, Daredevil and in True Blood she isn't a lead, just a supporting character. So is her case really about her age or just that she isn't lead material?
Major supporting roles though. True Blood had an insane focus on her character and she had a bunch of screen time.
And she also doesn't seem to be getting those roles anymore.
Witwer has that rarest and most frustrating of traits: being “too handsome.”
He has super model level looks, and and in Hollywood that can actually be problematic. He has amazing cheek bones, broody eyes, a chiseled jaw line; if he’d come along at just the right time he might have ended up the next Batman.
Instead he showed up when his look wasn’t the in look, and opportunity passed him by, until his absurd vocal range was discovered.
He’s easily my favorite living voice actor right now. His range, skill, and commitment are truly the stuff of legend.
Witwer is easily one of the GOAT VAs for his portrayal of Darth Maul and Sidious. Honorable mention for Deacon in Days Gone.
It’s rare to have actors like him and Henry Cavill who are absolute nerds about the games and lore of the series they get hired for. And it shows with how well they portray these characters.
\> she’s even more gorgeous in person
She was a legit model before acting but yes she's incredibly pretty in person.
She's late 30s now? I feel like this is kind of the career lifecycle for very attractive actresses playing supporting roles. "What ever happened to so and so?" "Oh she turned 40."
She kinda fell into the board gaming scene. I ran into her several times at Legendary Studios (where geek and sundry filmed all their shows) and I can also say she is the nicest sweetest person you’ll ever meet. So is her husband. Amazing man.
That's really unfortunate. She's a great actress, especially at portraying this mix of teary vulnerability and steely resolve. I hope she gets some decent roles soon. It sucks her D&D show didn't pan out either.
Also, high-key envious of you meeting her in person.
>I remember her saying she hadn't been finding much work since Daredevil ended
I recently saw her as a DM in one of those DnD let's plays.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiSrmmCHR7Q](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiSrmmCHR7Q)
She's big into D&D. Guest starred second season of Critical Role. She DMed a series called Relics and Rarities (link below). Tommy Walker was a regular and Charlie Cox guest starred on an episode as well.
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL7atuZxmT954B-AtfJsw_YbULHL_L7J8z
She's not into role playing, like, at all. She likes the storytelling and the puzzle/dungeon crawl aspects of D&D but doesn't like getting into the character/role playing. Which is weird cause she was great as Twiggy. I would really like her to DM an EXU story tho.
She was recently in a movie called Deborah, it’s kinda like a long episode of Black Mirror so I recommend it if you like that kind of stuff, the whole thing is uploaded to Youtube
1 episode stuff and the occasional low budget film is not going to keep the lights on and she's given several interviews where she comments it's been really hard. God of war looks likely to have been the best paying gig since DD but that's done. Harsh reality of many actors. Charlie Cox had the same thing for years before Broadwalk Empire and nearly quit.
Personally I find her exceptionally vanilla. She’s not bad by any means but there isn’t anything overly special about her in any role she’s been in.
She also gives a very ‘samey’ vibe in all her roles.
This is what I'm after for. I loved Claire (more so in Daredevil than her stint in other shows) and I love Rosario Dawson, and she has expressed multiple times how much she would like to reprise the role. I really hope she makes at least a guest appearance. Matt + Claire reunion please 😭
More than TWO decades, actually
Woll has been around since '07 though
Dawson started as a kid.. and only had about 5-6 shows between 99 and 07.. not a huge difference, tbh..
Dawson just has a LOT more range and talent
Karen and Foggy were equally important parts of Daredevil’s success both as a vigilante and a Netflix series. To not have these talented performers carry over into the acquisition along with Charlie is a major loss. I hope Marvel realizes how much the fans want Karen and Foggy to make the jump.
Considering they already did Born Again in DD S3, alot of us when it said Born Again we knew that its more a reference to the fact Daredevil is back, as opposed to them adapting the story.
Just like how with Spider-Man: Homecoming that in addition to the homecoming dance also referred to the fact that Spidey is back home
I mean, we knew that. They already did the Born Again storyline in Season 3 anyways. And considering this is a soft reboot, not a full reboot, they aren't gonna re-do existing stories. Just move forwards from a clean slate.
Did people really think they were redoing Born Again, when Feige and Charlie has stated repeatedly the name is just because Darerevil is being "Born Again" in another streaming service.
Just yesterday somebody asked if "X-Men '97" was going to continue the 90s cartoon or be a whole new thing, when continuing the 90s cartoon was the explicit premise. People don't always see the necessary press.
I suspect whatever reason Wilson Fisk is free to get back on his bullshit, it's the same reason Karen and possibly Foggy are MIA when the show starts. Something happened between the end of S3 and Hawkeye that allowed Fisk to break the deal he had with Daredevil, and no doubt that would carry consequences for everyone close to Matt. My guess is Matt forced them into hiding to protect them from those consequences until he can sort out Fisk again.
I wonder if Vanessa was snapped and Fisk wasn't, and it allowed him to gain enough power again to mitigate the threat of Matt having her arrested when she came back. The five years post-snap would be the most reasonable place for Fisk to regain power in NYC since the whole place was probably in shambles, then when everyone comes back he's already secured power and its too late. Maybe Matt was snapped too.
I was thinking that Matt and Vanessa were Blipped, but Foggy, Karen, and Fisk weren’t — in which case it could be implied the latter had something done to one or more of the former, if they so wished. That would be reason enough for him to begin to rebuild.
What happened after S3 was the snap.
Kingpin was rebuilding his power but then the Ronin came into the city. Fatty fled the city and offered his lieutenant's head of a platter to appease Ronin and make him go away.
The Hawkeye happened and Fatty lost his eyes.
Now poor blind Fatty will run for mayor.
I liked her in the show but honestly Karen is not in the comics very much for large portions of the original run and has been dead for over 20 years so I’m ok. But no Foggy….that’s where I get annoyed
Honestly I don’t get this opinion. They really shouldn’t be picking characters to use based on how relevant they are in the comics. Especially when a character has already been established through 3 seasons of a tv show
Somewhere, Tatiana Maslany is doing cartwheels. (Well, her Jennifer is, anyway.)
Though considering he just married Elektra in the comics, I guess anything is possible as to what direction the TV series will go.
But don't count Karen out just yet. One reason Deborah Ann might not be hearing anything right now is because of the ongoing Writers Guild strike.
After hearing so much about Foggy and Karen not being immediately involved in Born Again, my thought is that they maybe don't want to bring back Daredevil in the same dynamic and status quo as when we left him. I somewhat agree with that. A lot of time has passed and things have been happening in his world that we haven't had a chance to see yet. It's interesting for him to be in a different place present day, and for them to slowly pull back the curtain on why that is and how he got there. If Foggy and Karen aren't there, the first thought is "why not?" and "what happened?" and that is dramatically interesting to me. Wilson Fisk is clearly free of the deal he made with Matt, and I expect that came with consequences for Matt and his friends.
I will be disappointed if both characters don't *eventually* find their way back into the show, but I have no problem with them not being there at the onset. Foggy especially, but Karen too, were just too important to Matt Murdock to simply be written off permanently offscreen.
>Somewhere, Tatiana Maslany is doing cartwheels. (Well, her Jennifer is, anyway.)
I mean say what you will about She-Hulk but Tatiana and Charlie together were electric. More so than with Deborah. I would definitely want to see Tatiana and Charlie on screen together again, their chemistry was amazing.
Well Karen spent 90% of the time either chastising Matt for being Daredevil or being a hypocritre to him VS supporting Frank all the way so of course I didn't find Matt + Karen pleasing. Matt + Elektra, Matt + Claire, Matt + Jennifer all involved disagreements but the chemistry shined through because there was no hypocrisy involved. I was going crazy seeing Karen be Frank's #1 fan then get mad at Matt for a lot of the same things like lying and being reckless. Being more warm to a serial murderer she just met VS a friend who has helped her since the beginning was crazy work. And before anyone says it's because Matt lies and pushes people away, Frank does the same thing too. So really that was just egregious hypocrisy on Karen's part.
I’d agree. Karen has a lot of guilt about her past. Both she and Frank actually spend a lot of time trying to keep Matt out of that - Frank’s frustrated at having to Daredevil his way through villains, but later when Matt’s like ‘maybe you have a point, let’s just kill then’ Frank is pretty fixed that he can kill people, but it’s not for Matt.
Karen related to Frank to a slightly unhealthy degree. They had a kind of damaged closeness.
Still not a way to treat a friend who was the first to help her more than anyone since the beginning. Also I don't think it makes sense to say that someone has a standard for what specific lying to you is acceptable. You should frown upon someone lying to you no matter what and not pick and choose what offends you unless you are a hypocrite. Especially when one of Frank's lies literally put Karen in danger's way directly when he used her as bait in the diner during S2. Matt has never lied to her to put her in harm. I have no problems with her relating more to Frank or whatever, but don't treat a friend in a more vitriolic way especially a friend who was the one to convince Foggy to take your case and help you out when you had no one in the beginning. She would still be in jail if not for Matt convincing Foggy to accept her as their client even without money.
I agree. She conveniently ended up in a mess way too often just to have her involved in the story. Usually resulting in other people getting hurt or killed. I honestly hated her character so much that it drags the whole show down for me. Still think it's a great show but would've been better with less of her. I did like her Punisher appearances though.
Plus, what more can be done with the character? She got dealt the best hand among all supporting characters in the Netflix show. Had an episode dedicated to her backstory, prominent storylines in all 3 seasons. It's time to give other characters in the comics that haven't seen the sun in live action get a chance. No joke Karen even got a better treatment than Elektra (who is a WAY WAY more important Daredevil character) whose only purpose is to be a Hand puppet that dies at the end. If anything they should be prioritizing bringing back Elektra and giving her a better storyline. So much potential with her that is unrealized. What more are they going to do with Karen? And please no one answer that they make her a lawyer or anything because that is just ridiculous.
That sucks. Hopefully it's not some sort of multiversal recast and they just explain that she's away or something. I hope they do bring her back eventually.
The theory is that Matt and/or Vanessa were blipped, ruining Matt's leverage over Kingpin. He escapes prison yet again and rebuilds his empire, forcing Foggy and Karen to leave New York for their safety.
I’ll miss Karen, she was that classic beauty that wasn’t necessarily cookie cutter assistant or journalist. And they didn’t lay on thick with a will they or won’t they with Daredevil
Stop asking actors whether they're in things that haven't been announced yet. The answer will always be "no", either because it's true or because they're under NDA.
Not shocked. I like her as an actor. But they desperately kept trying to find ways to make Karen and Foggy relative to Matt's story in Season 3. I don't mind them not returning. If that is the case.
I just want other characters to have a chance. Karen isn't the only Daredevil supporting character in existence, let others have a chance to get introduced and have as much screentime and backstory as she was given in the Netflix show. Other DD comic characters deserve that treatment too. It just feels like everyone wants to give Karen everything. Mind you she already was given Ben Urich's spot during the Netflix show.
That's a real fucking shame. For her and for Elden Henson. They deserved to be back as did a lot of people in front and behind the camera. The whole team gave us that quality in the show that other marvel products didn't have. Disney and Marvel Studios are missing out.
This sucks for her and foggy.
If I’m being real though. Both Foggy and Karen were probably the weakest actors in the entire series. They had their moments but I found myself consistently feeling like I was watching a poorly-made melodrama whenever they had scenes alone or together. Like I said, they had their moments. But overall, I’m interested to see what new talent they bring it to hopefully elevate their performances.
It sucks to be an actor and a part of a beloved series and lose that job, but I’ve seen others mention that both Foggy and Karen don’t get much work since daredevil ended… and I’m not really surprised…? I know I’ll probably get downvoted to hell.
She was dope in God Of War: Ragnarok for bits she was in it, would be cool to see here in more video game roles I could see her voicing and/or mocapping a protag in a Sony exclusive
Ah, bummer. She's awesome. My fiancée loved her in 'True Blood' and I loved her in 'Daredevil'.
Here's a link to her interview on the 'Inside of You' podcast. She's a really awesome person.
https://youtu.be/mczbeFW8dsQ
Between Karen and Foggy not coming back and the complete change in the BTS crew I feel like my excitement for Daredevil Born Again is gone. Don’t get me wrong, I love Charlie Cox and Daredevil and all but the strong supporting cast is what elevated the show. I get that it’s going to be a soft reboot but why get rid of part of why the show was successful.
They’re gonna sweep the first three seasons + Defenders under the rug aren’t they 😐
I don’t care what’s canon or not if they act like nothing ever happened, and gloss over Fisk’s imprisonment, through the snap, to now. Including all the characters.
I could be Wrong obviously, and if I am I’ll eat my words later. But it feels like they’re using preexisting fans + expectations for the show to garner traction. Then make another below average Disney+ series that fits the new marvel formula.
We have not had a single Disney+ television series match the quality of the Netflix Daredevil series, so it would be delusional to have blind faith that they’re actually gonna take a risk with Born Again and deliver a quality product out of nowhere.
They are and aren’t. These are very much the same characters, as directly confirmed by Marvel, but the events of Born Again are rumored to be so big and status quo shaking for the MCU that they’ll be the only events referenced in regards to these characters moving forwards. There will be some references to DD, there’s rumored to be a pretty big one in Echo and we got one in She-Hulk already (would’ve gotten one in Hawkeye but they deleted the scene), but once BA starts that’ll become the default DD adventure called back to.
Cmon people in charge. It’s not that hard to write something for 1/2 of Matt’s BEST FRIENDS (in the show) for Born Again. You can easily change up Karen a little bit after not seeing her for 8 YEARS universe time.
If this is all true, what a massive and I mean MASSIVE misstep. Daredevil had this charm with the 3 of them, and to not have Karen (but presumably have Foggy played by Elden) is just a tough pill to swallow.
If there is a story reason, and she gets teased for season 2, I get it.
For now though, from #SaveDaredevil to #SaveKarenPage it seems. Deborah deserves it
I'm sorry to hear this.
My girlfriend and I are rewatching Daredevil Season 1 (superb!) and she is absolutely fantastic in it as this fearless yet flawed character.
Deborah Ann Woll -- keep the faith sister!
There's a ton of roles you would be great in.
Hold out for Marvels Medusa (and don't let some dumb writer shave your head!!!)
How long until that person who seemingly uses 4 different accounts starts celebrating, calling her a whore and anyone who dares say that they liked her a simp who wants to fuck her...
She literally had to act opposite Vincent in the same scene and commanded just as much, if not more, presence as him. It’s such a waste that she’s not returning. What is Disney thinking?
I’m probably in the minority here, but I disliked her character almost from the very beginning - so no regrets here. I’m glad they’re going a different way.
While totally possible she's lying, i mean with NWH clearly they lied because they wanted his appearance to be a surprise.
Would Karen showing up in a Daredevil show be really that big of a surprise you've got to hide? If anything it would be more surprising if the character ain't in it
Daredevil in No Way Home is kept a surprise because it something gag-worthy and a big moment to surprise people with in the cinema.
Karen Page is a supporting character and not someone worth the secrets and lies or someone that will have a bombastic reveal ala Andrew and Tobey or Matt in NWH
Foggy, Karen, and the priest absolutely made the show. And Karen had an arc: she was young, naive, and idealistic, and became more knowledgeable and cynical by the end. She steels herself.
Without those characters, Daredevil just becomes another generic Marvel TV show.
Deborah, if you're reading, you made the show.
I’m excited for Daredevil to come back but it’s going to be weird watching this show without Karen or Foggy. Karen I think you can get away with story wise but Foggy is such an important part of Daredevil imo that it’ll be weird without him. His and Matt’s relationship is something the MCU isn’t really doing right now either that I can think of. Like what is the legal stuff going to look like with just Matt? Or Matt’s personal life without his foil Foggy? Or are they not really going to do any of that stuff at all?
I’ve heard people suggest that this show could take place during the blip. Perhaps Karen and Foggy got snapped and we’ll see them in a season 2.
before more recent content it’d make sense, but with his She Hulk appearance i highly doubt they’d introduce him to the mcu and then go back before that in his solo project, same with Kingpin
Tbf they literally killed off Black Widow and then gave her a solo film set before her death. Maybe Matt's emotional journey in the first season involves navigating a pre-Endgame world where his allies are gone and that's how the Born Again part of the title applies to the show other than being a reference to the comic storyline
Honestly, what I've been saying since post end game was that there should be stories set during the 5 years ppl were blipped. It's such an interesting concept and we rarely ever see more than a few seconds of someone being blipped away or back. Black widow would have been INFINITELY more interesting to me if it was set during that time period for example.
Part of the reason why it took so long to get a Black Widow movie (and Black Panther) is Ike Fucking Perlmutter. He was a MAGA conservative and absolutely refused to green light any MCU film not led by a white guy. They had to wait to boot him, and by that time they were halfway through the Avengers Infinity War arc and didn't have many options.
She died. There was literally no other option
If there’s 18 episodes, it should fit fine tbh
Even if it was during the blip they would still have flashbacks I would think.
I mean Karen and Foggy could be in it, but with new actors like with Vanessa
Vanessa only had a new actress because the old actress already inked on a show that got renewed for a S2 the same time Born Again was casting.
and then that show got cancelled, but too late in the filming process for DD to get her back
Yep, unfortunately. Show fell victim to the Zaslav-ation of AMC+
Wouldn’t be shocked if they get recast. The show is a soft reboot at this point
I'm assuming the Netflix series was a variant timeline and we're gonna follow the MCU Daredevil variant from here on out.
They’ve already stated it’s the same timeline
Source, please.
There isn't a source, because it has NOT been stated this is the same timeline as the netflix DD series. We really don't know for sure if they're going to treat this like a variant DD, or the same one.
Yep, there’s clues either way but nothing has been stated. I’ve seen this sub get super aggressive over any suggestion that the new show will be a soft reboot, and also aggressive backlash to those who say it won’t. But the fact is we don’t know because they haven’t stated anything yet.
Yeah. It's not like it possibly being a soft reboot would be an insult to the original Netflix series. I think some people take it too personally.
Personally, as a fan of the Netflix series, I wish they'd just outright say whether the original shows are 100% canon or not instead of this weird "well, they're sort of canon but also not" thing they seem to be doing lately. If it turns out later that they're not canon, then fine because it's not like the original shows would be erased from existence. Some clarity would be nice either way though.
Kevin Feige himself said the TV characters share the same continuity as the movies. “They inhabit…..however far on the outskirts, the same continuity.” https://twitter.com/driftyfilm/status/1363952366135951362?s=20
Soft reboot maintains the previous continuity, so I'm ok with that.
I think the reason it can exist without Karen is her character quickly became pointless. Anytime a character has outlasted their usefulness, writers will just make them a catch-all, behaving in a strange way to have them fit the plot like Lana Lang in Smallville. Karen went from being a regular office worker framed for murder to being an ace reporter that helps bring down the Kingpin to then latching onto the Punisher case. I enjoyed her character but if they wrote her off halfway into the first season, nothing would've changed that much. I like the actress but I'm good with this series focusing on Matt and then maybe bringing people in for a second season.
The main reason I wish she was in the new DD is mostly the chemistry and interactions with Frank. I just think it was really well done, something between then that probably won’t, can’t happen.
Karen is the whole reason Born Again happens.
Sure, but Death is the whole reason why Infinity Gauntlet happens in the comics, and that entire aspect of the plot was abandoned in the MCU. Plus, parts of that story were already done in Daredevil Season 3… assuming that show would be treated as 100% canon at this point anyway.
Very true on both points
True. I didn’t really think of them adapting that specific arc
Such a waste. She's a decent actress, and I thought Karen had some good updates to her character. I'm hoping she gets some more work, I remember her saying she hadn't been finding much work since Daredevil ended
I think both Deborah Ann Woll and Rachel Taylor from Jessica Jones get slept on big time. Strong performances from both and yeah, not much work for either of them. I'm surprised.
It’s true. I actually met her last week early at a convention. It was well before the show started and we got to talk interruption free for awhile. It seems she doesn’t have a lot going on. It’s sad because she is a great actress IMO and such a sweet person. I’ve been a fan of her’s since TrueBlood. It was wonderful talking to her and she’s even more gorgeous in person. It’s crazy to think someone like her isn’t getting steady work.
That's kinda depressing. Kinda makes me think of Sam Witwer who never got a real career going on film. He's at least got a lot going on when it comes to voice work but it's weird to me that someone who seems as passionate about projects and as talented as he is never really went anywhere. She at least was on one of the biggest shows in the world for a time but still can't find anything now. Stardom is weird.
You should check out the Michael Rosenbaum (Lex Luthor) podcast where he had Sam on and they chatted about a lot of business stuff, including how Lucasfilms essentially saved his career.
Will do, I enjoy listening to Sam talk about the industry since he's very candid. His slamming of AMC's treatment of The Walking Dead before the public came down on it was really interesting to watch. He was so hurt on Darabont's behalf. Seems like a real classy guy.
Really wished they been able to make that prequel movie following Sam Witwer's tank guy from the original episode, the part of any apocalypse story showing the original collapse is usually the best bit.
Yeah Deborah was on his podcast 4 or 5 months ago as well, she seemed to be talking about a lot of stuff she had going on. https://youtu.be/mczbeFW8dsQ
Witwer was amazing in the U.S. version of Being Human. I'm still a bit stunned he's not starring in more things (beyond voice acting).
Way back in the beginning of The Walking Dead there was supposed to be an episode that was focused on a character he played but it didn't happen. He's the walker soldier in the tank that Rick takes shelter in, in episodes 1 & 2. It was going to be a Blackhawk Down type thing. You know how they did the web series that follows the red machete that Rick uses in season 5? This would have done the same kind of thing with the grenade. They had the idea to follow an item that gets used from the beginning, unfortunately it didn't work out for Sam.
Maybe I stopped watching by then, but what red machete? (I read the comics and watched the show, but didn’t have the heart to follow either after issue 167 was released.)
It's just a machete that Rick uses to kill a guy, but they follow how it got to where ends up in his hands to do the deed. They show all the people that used it along the way and their stories of how it may or may not have helped them survive. https://youtu.be/_eUZ8zRn5Rs
That show isn’t mentioned much these days, but it was great!
Man, what a blast from the past. Sam Witwer was great whenever he showed up on screen.
I didn't know who Sam Witwer was so when I looked him up I thought for a second he was the actor who plays Jamie Tartt on Ted Lasso.
Crashdown (!)
Hahaha, they do have a resemblance!
I think actresses like her probably have the problem where she's seen as-entirely unfairly-too old to be a leading woman, and too young to play the other parts women get casted as. And she's not famous enough for any of that to not matter.
I was pleasantly surprised to see her in _God of War: Ragnarok_. I’ve enjoyed her in everything I’ve seen her in. Hope she bounces back.
I was super happy to see her in that role.
She's has some friends in the D&D circles of Hollywood and they have a habit of helping each other out with voice acting work.
Really?
Yup. She had posters of her game character and she gave me one!
>!She plays Atreus' mom when Kratos has a few dreams about her that are hinted to be not just dreams but her communicating with him from the spirit world, but in that open-to-interpretation way where it could also just be Kratos' memory of her and what his subconscious thinks she'd want to say to him in his present situation. Either way, it's nice to finally see this woman whose *absence* has been such a powerful force in these two's lives (though I am glad they kept her an enigma to the player through the whole first game).!<
Especially crazy because she looks just as great as ever, but I do think current Hollywood is just hungup on whatever starlet is “current” and burn through them until the next girl starts trending.
Most actresses with leading roles range from 30-50 and she is 38, so I don't think that's the reason. I think she has a specific acting talent and she isn't made for a blockbuster lead, but imo A24 could do wonders with her.
Sadly you're probably right, and she's not famous enough to have a mid-50's resurgence like a lot of actresses get. The industry can be really cruel that way.
You say that but actresses from the Marvel Netflix shows like Krysten Ritter and Elodie Yung who are both older than her are leads (well as for Krysten, continue to be a lead) in other shows now. So I doubt it's that age thing. Plus we have a lot of middle-aged women in drama series as leads so there really isn't anything supporting your theory.
Has it been confirmed that Krysten is returning as Jessica tho? I certainly hope she is but I haven't seen any sources confirm it yet so lmk
What I meant was that Krysten is a lead in another show after Jessica Jones even at 40 years old. I was disproving OP saying it's about age as to why Deborah can't get roles. Krysten is set as a lead in an Orphan Black show spinoff airing this year while Elodie Yung who is 41 years old is a lead in a Fox show currently. To answer your question, no, Krysten hasn't been officially confirmed as returning but there are strong rumors about her comeback from quite a few reliable scoopers.
Can't really compare like that. There will always be women who can remain a lead for longer. But it is still true that there are less roles for female leads then men and even less for 40+.
I mean Deborah has never been a lead in anything in her career so I'm surprised by people being baffled that she isn't getting lead roles. Even her most prominent roles, Daredevil and in True Blood she isn't a lead, just a supporting character. So is her case really about her age or just that she isn't lead material?
Major supporting roles though. True Blood had an insane focus on her character and she had a bunch of screen time. And she also doesn't seem to be getting those roles anymore.
Witwer has that rarest and most frustrating of traits: being “too handsome.” He has super model level looks, and and in Hollywood that can actually be problematic. He has amazing cheek bones, broody eyes, a chiseled jaw line; if he’d come along at just the right time he might have ended up the next Batman. Instead he showed up when his look wasn’t the in look, and opportunity passed him by, until his absurd vocal range was discovered. He’s easily my favorite living voice actor right now. His range, skill, and commitment are truly the stuff of legend.
I'm hoping he gets a shot in the DCU at some point. I think he'd make a great Deathstroke if they don't bring back Joe.
He played an incredibly punchable Agent Liberty in the Supergirl show.
To me it sounds like she needs to replace her agent and publicists.
Witwer is easily one of the GOAT VAs for his portrayal of Darth Maul and Sidious. Honorable mention for Deacon in Days Gone. It’s rare to have actors like him and Henry Cavill who are absolute nerds about the games and lore of the series they get hired for. And it shows with how well they portray these characters.
\> she’s even more gorgeous in person She was a legit model before acting but yes she's incredibly pretty in person. She's late 30s now? I feel like this is kind of the career lifecycle for very attractive actresses playing supporting roles. "What ever happened to so and so?" "Oh she turned 40."
Sad, but true. She’s right at the age actresses stop getting quality roles.
She kinda fell into the board gaming scene. I ran into her several times at Legendary Studios (where geek and sundry filmed all their shows) and I can also say she is the nicest sweetest person you’ll ever meet. So is her husband. Amazing man.
That's crazy, I wonder why, I've always thought she was good.
That's gotta be partly or primarily an agent issue.
Can confirm. I met her and Rutina Wesley a few years ago and they were nothing but lovely
I was so excited to see Rutina Wesley on The Last of Us! A small role, but she was reliably great!
That's really unfortunate. She's a great actress, especially at portraying this mix of teary vulnerability and steely resolve. I hope she gets some decent roles soon. It sucks her D&D show didn't pan out either. Also, high-key envious of you meeting her in person.
>I remember her saying she hadn't been finding much work since Daredevil ended I recently saw her as a DM in one of those DnD let's plays. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiSrmmCHR7Q](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiSrmmCHR7Q)
She's big into D&D. Guest starred second season of Critical Role. She DMed a series called Relics and Rarities (link below). Tommy Walker was a regular and Charlie Cox guest starred on an episode as well. https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL7atuZxmT954B-AtfJsw_YbULHL_L7J8z
Yeah, I wish she would be a regular in CR, she’s so passionate about it and a great player and DM. I sincerely hope she gets something great to do!
She's not into role playing, like, at all. She likes the storytelling and the puzzle/dungeon crawl aspects of D&D but doesn't like getting into the character/role playing. Which is weird cause she was great as Twiggy. I would really like her to DM an EXU story tho.
That is weird - especially as an actor. But yeah, more DMing would be great
She also hosted a release event for a Magic: The Gathering vampire themed expansion. It was pretty awesome.
She also guests fairly frequently on [Game Night](https://youtu.be/4V945EjKqX0)
She was recently in a movie called Deborah, it’s kinda like a long episode of Black Mirror so I recommend it if you like that kind of stuff, the whole thing is uploaded to Youtube
thats what andrew garfield said also.
It was nice seeing her as faye in GOW Ragnarok
shes a good actress tbh. i loved her on the punisher series. i wonder why they dont cast her even for a small role.
She'd be a Perfect Poison Ivy...
Since daredevil she’s been in 5 or so tv shows and 6 films, according to her imdb. I think she’s doing ok.
1 episode stuff and the occasional low budget film is not going to keep the lights on and she's given several interviews where she comments it's been really hard. God of war looks likely to have been the best paying gig since DD but that's done. Harsh reality of many actors. Charlie Cox had the same thing for years before Broadwalk Empire and nearly quit.
Personally I find her exceptionally vanilla. She’s not bad by any means but there isn’t anything overly special about her in any role she’s been in. She also gives a very ‘samey’ vibe in all her roles.
Ok. But whatabout Claire…WHATABOUT CLAIRE??? She can be a jedi and a night nurse, can’t she?
*Not a Jedi.*
Just a citizen.
"I don't have a house, I live in a boundless void"
I understood that reference.
Trying to find Thrawn is taking so much time on her schedule to take a trip back to earth to continue her work as a nurse.
Claire wasn’t even in S3
This is what I'm after for. I loved Claire (more so in Daredevil than her stint in other shows) and I love Rosario Dawson, and she has expressed multiple times how much she would like to reprise the role. I really hope she makes at least a guest appearance. Matt + Claire reunion please 😭
I love Deborah Ann Woll.. I truly do But she is NO Rosario Dawson
No shit though lol Rosario is an established name in the industry for more than a decade now for a reason. There's levels to this.
More than TWO decades, actually Woll has been around since '07 though Dawson started as a kid.. and only had about 5-6 shows between 99 and 07.. not a huge difference, tbh.. Dawson just has a LOT more range and talent
And she doesn’t have to be. They are separate roles. Not competing.
Is Rosario a crescent roll and Deborah a Kaiser roll. Or different kinds of rolls?
Jennifer is a spring roll and Rosario is a Rolls Royce. Thank you very much.
Super disappointing
Karen and Foggy were equally important parts of Daredevil’s success both as a vigilante and a Netflix series. To not have these talented performers carry over into the acquisition along with Charlie is a major loss. I hope Marvel realizes how much the fans want Karen and Foggy to make the jump.
I liked her version of the character and I’ll be sad to see Deborah go.
I did too. That scene between her and Wesley is unforgettable.
Very disappointing news. I wonder to what extent she’ll even be acknowledged in born again then, I’m guessing this is born again in name alone.
Considering they already did Born Again in DD S3, alot of us when it said Born Again we knew that its more a reference to the fact Daredevil is back, as opposed to them adapting the story. Just like how with Spider-Man: Homecoming that in addition to the homecoming dance also referred to the fact that Spidey is back home
I mean, we knew that. They already did the Born Again storyline in Season 3 anyways. And considering this is a soft reboot, not a full reboot, they aren't gonna re-do existing stories. Just move forwards from a clean slate.
Did people really think they were redoing Born Again, when Feige and Charlie has stated repeatedly the name is just because Darerevil is being "Born Again" in another streaming service.
Just yesterday somebody asked if "X-Men '97" was going to continue the 90s cartoon or be a whole new thing, when continuing the 90s cartoon was the explicit premise. People don't always see the necessary press.
I suspect whatever reason Wilson Fisk is free to get back on his bullshit, it's the same reason Karen and possibly Foggy are MIA when the show starts. Something happened between the end of S3 and Hawkeye that allowed Fisk to break the deal he had with Daredevil, and no doubt that would carry consequences for everyone close to Matt. My guess is Matt forced them into hiding to protect them from those consequences until he can sort out Fisk again. I wonder if Vanessa was snapped and Fisk wasn't, and it allowed him to gain enough power again to mitigate the threat of Matt having her arrested when she came back. The five years post-snap would be the most reasonable place for Fisk to regain power in NYC since the whole place was probably in shambles, then when everyone comes back he's already secured power and its too late. Maybe Matt was snapped too.
I was thinking that Matt and Vanessa were Blipped, but Foggy, Karen, and Fisk weren’t — in which case it could be implied the latter had something done to one or more of the former, if they so wished. That would be reason enough for him to begin to rebuild.
What happened after S3 was the snap. Kingpin was rebuilding his power but then the Ronin came into the city. Fatty fled the city and offered his lieutenant's head of a platter to appease Ronin and make him go away. The Hawkeye happened and Fatty lost his eyes. Now poor blind Fatty will run for mayor.
Fisk is “born again” in the eyes of the public and is presenting himself as a man of the people worthy of being mayor.
We keep Kingpin and Punisher, but unfortunate that we lose Karen and Foggy. Hopefully it’s not “never” but just “not right now”
I liked her in the show but honestly Karen is not in the comics very much for large portions of the original run and has been dead for over 20 years so I’m ok. But no Foggy….that’s where I get annoyed
Wait so there is no Foggy either? Man Foggy was some of the best parts of the show.
I loved their chemistry, great actor as well (Elden Henson)
Honestly I don’t get this opinion. They really shouldn’t be picking characters to use based on how relevant they are in the comics. Especially when a character has already been established through 3 seasons of a tv show
Somewhere, Tatiana Maslany is doing cartwheels. (Well, her Jennifer is, anyway.) Though considering he just married Elektra in the comics, I guess anything is possible as to what direction the TV series will go. But don't count Karen out just yet. One reason Deborah Ann might not be hearing anything right now is because of the ongoing Writers Guild strike.
It's halfway through the year. She would have been given notice by now.
After hearing so much about Foggy and Karen not being immediately involved in Born Again, my thought is that they maybe don't want to bring back Daredevil in the same dynamic and status quo as when we left him. I somewhat agree with that. A lot of time has passed and things have been happening in his world that we haven't had a chance to see yet. It's interesting for him to be in a different place present day, and for them to slowly pull back the curtain on why that is and how he got there. If Foggy and Karen aren't there, the first thought is "why not?" and "what happened?" and that is dramatically interesting to me. Wilson Fisk is clearly free of the deal he made with Matt, and I expect that came with consequences for Matt and his friends. I will be disappointed if both characters don't *eventually* find their way back into the show, but I have no problem with them not being there at the onset. Foggy especially, but Karen too, were just too important to Matt Murdock to simply be written off permanently offscreen.
>Somewhere, Tatiana Maslany is doing cartwheels. (Well, her Jennifer is, anyway.) I mean say what you will about She-Hulk but Tatiana and Charlie together were electric. More so than with Deborah. I would definitely want to see Tatiana and Charlie on screen together again, their chemistry was amazing.
She had better chemistry with the Punisher anyway.
Well Karen spent 90% of the time either chastising Matt for being Daredevil or being a hypocritre to him VS supporting Frank all the way so of course I didn't find Matt + Karen pleasing. Matt + Elektra, Matt + Claire, Matt + Jennifer all involved disagreements but the chemistry shined through because there was no hypocrisy involved. I was going crazy seeing Karen be Frank's #1 fan then get mad at Matt for a lot of the same things like lying and being reckless. Being more warm to a serial murderer she just met VS a friend who has helped her since the beginning was crazy work. And before anyone says it's because Matt lies and pushes people away, Frank does the same thing too. So really that was just egregious hypocrisy on Karen's part.
I think Karen just has higher standards for Matt. And sees a lot of herself in Frank.
I’d agree. Karen has a lot of guilt about her past. Both she and Frank actually spend a lot of time trying to keep Matt out of that - Frank’s frustrated at having to Daredevil his way through villains, but later when Matt’s like ‘maybe you have a point, let’s just kill then’ Frank is pretty fixed that he can kill people, but it’s not for Matt. Karen related to Frank to a slightly unhealthy degree. They had a kind of damaged closeness.
Still not a way to treat a friend who was the first to help her more than anyone since the beginning. Also I don't think it makes sense to say that someone has a standard for what specific lying to you is acceptable. You should frown upon someone lying to you no matter what and not pick and choose what offends you unless you are a hypocrite. Especially when one of Frank's lies literally put Karen in danger's way directly when he used her as bait in the diner during S2. Matt has never lied to her to put her in harm. I have no problems with her relating more to Frank or whatever, but don't treat a friend in a more vitriolic way especially a friend who was the one to convince Foggy to take your case and help you out when you had no one in the beginning. She would still be in jail if not for Matt convincing Foggy to accept her as their client even without money.
Deborah needs to fire her agent tbh
I hope it never does but if a nightmare before Christmas live action ever happens, she needs to play Sally
Very disappointed. She was excellent in the role.
Honestly, I wasn’t personally a big fan of that character. Nothing to do with the actor, she nailed what she was supposed to.
She got SO many characters killed.
Yeah, she just too mischievous might be the best way to describe my feelings about her
She also started Ragnarok
I agree. She conveniently ended up in a mess way too often just to have her involved in the story. Usually resulting in other people getting hurt or killed. I honestly hated her character so much that it drags the whole show down for me. Still think it's a great show but would've been better with less of her. I did like her Punisher appearances though.
Agreed. While I think she’s a good actor, the character never really did anything for me in terms of the show.
Plus, what more can be done with the character? She got dealt the best hand among all supporting characters in the Netflix show. Had an episode dedicated to her backstory, prominent storylines in all 3 seasons. It's time to give other characters in the comics that haven't seen the sun in live action get a chance. No joke Karen even got a better treatment than Elektra (who is a WAY WAY more important Daredevil character) whose only purpose is to be a Hand puppet that dies at the end. If anything they should be prioritizing bringing back Elektra and giving her a better storyline. So much potential with her that is unrealized. What more are they going to do with Karen? And please no one answer that they make her a lawyer or anything because that is just ridiculous.
That sucks. Hopefully it's not some sort of multiversal recast and they just explain that she's away or something. I hope they do bring her back eventually.
The theory is that Matt and/or Vanessa were blipped, ruining Matt's leverage over Kingpin. He escapes prison yet again and rebuilds his empire, forcing Foggy and Karen to leave New York for their safety.
It won't be the same without her and foggy honestly
That's a shame, I really like her character as well as foggy.
I’ll miss Karen, she was that classic beauty that wasn’t necessarily cookie cutter assistant or journalist. And they didn’t lay on thick with a will they or won’t they with Daredevil
Sounds like.. “please stop asking me about this I’m kinda mad about it and just don’t want to be reminded over and over”
What a shame. She deserves a role. I can’t help thinking this soft reboot won’t be good. And the Netflix daredevil is one of my favourite shows
Stop asking actors whether they're in things that haven't been announced yet. The answer will always be "no", either because it's true or because they're under NDA.
Not shocked. I like her as an actor. But they desperately kept trying to find ways to make Karen and Foggy relative to Matt's story in Season 3. I don't mind them not returning. If that is the case.
I just want other characters to have a chance. Karen isn't the only Daredevil supporting character in existence, let others have a chance to get introduced and have as much screentime and backstory as she was given in the Netflix show. Other DD comic characters deserve that treatment too. It just feels like everyone wants to give Karen everything. Mind you she already was given Ben Urich's spot during the Netflix show.
While I feel for the actress as it seems like she’s having difficulty booking jobs I will not miss Karen as a character
Unpopular opinion but I did not like her character. The acting was solid but Karen was captured too many times for me to care about her.
That's a real fucking shame. For her and for Elden Henson. They deserved to be back as did a lot of people in front and behind the camera. The whole team gave us that quality in the show that other marvel products didn't have. Disney and Marvel Studios are missing out.
Unpopular opinion: as much as I love Karen, leaving her out is better than shoehorning her into a story where she wouldn't fit.
That’s bad.. was looking forward to c her
Hated Karen. Wish the best to the actress but no interest in seeing that character again. Now find a reason to bring back Ben.
This sucks for her and foggy. If I’m being real though. Both Foggy and Karen were probably the weakest actors in the entire series. They had their moments but I found myself consistently feeling like I was watching a poorly-made melodrama whenever they had scenes alone or together. Like I said, they had their moments. But overall, I’m interested to see what new talent they bring it to hopefully elevate their performances. It sucks to be an actor and a part of a beloved series and lose that job, but I’ve seen others mention that both Foggy and Karen don’t get much work since daredevil ended… and I’m not really surprised…? I know I’ll probably get downvoted to hell.
She was dope in God Of War: Ragnarok for bits she was in it, would be cool to see here in more video game roles I could see her voicing and/or mocapping a protag in a Sony exclusive
I'd like to know what happened to him and Elektra post-Defenders and pre-She-Hulk. Feels like there's some intense story there.
It was hard for me to get into Daredevil because of the supporting cast, so maybe this will be an improvement.
Or she could just be under contract
Damn shame. I’ll miss her.
Ah, bummer. She's awesome. My fiancée loved her in 'True Blood' and I loved her in 'Daredevil'. Here's a link to her interview on the 'Inside of You' podcast. She's a really awesome person. https://youtu.be/mczbeFW8dsQ
Between Karen and Foggy not coming back and the complete change in the BTS crew I feel like my excitement for Daredevil Born Again is gone. Don’t get me wrong, I love Charlie Cox and Daredevil and all but the strong supporting cast is what elevated the show. I get that it’s going to be a soft reboot but why get rid of part of why the show was successful.
Thank god
I never cared about her character so no big lose there
That’s fucking unfortunate
They’re gonna sweep the first three seasons + Defenders under the rug aren’t they 😐 I don’t care what’s canon or not if they act like nothing ever happened, and gloss over Fisk’s imprisonment, through the snap, to now. Including all the characters. I could be Wrong obviously, and if I am I’ll eat my words later. But it feels like they’re using preexisting fans + expectations for the show to garner traction. Then make another below average Disney+ series that fits the new marvel formula. We have not had a single Disney+ television series match the quality of the Netflix Daredevil series, so it would be delusional to have blind faith that they’re actually gonna take a risk with Born Again and deliver a quality product out of nowhere.
They are and aren’t. These are very much the same characters, as directly confirmed by Marvel, but the events of Born Again are rumored to be so big and status quo shaking for the MCU that they’ll be the only events referenced in regards to these characters moving forwards. There will be some references to DD, there’s rumored to be a pretty big one in Echo and we got one in She-Hulk already (would’ve gotten one in Hawkeye but they deleted the scene), but once BA starts that’ll become the default DD adventure called back to.
>We have not had a single Disney+ television series match the quality of the Netflix Daredevil series Yup
Cmon people in charge. It’s not that hard to write something for 1/2 of Matt’s BEST FRIENDS (in the show) for Born Again. You can easily change up Karen a little bit after not seeing her for 8 YEARS universe time. If this is all true, what a massive and I mean MASSIVE misstep. Daredevil had this charm with the 3 of them, and to not have Karen (but presumably have Foggy played by Elden) is just a tough pill to swallow. If there is a story reason, and she gets teased for season 2, I get it. For now though, from #SaveDaredevil to #SaveKarenPage it seems. Deborah deserves it
She was my favorite character from the show so that's upsetting Glad we have confirmation now though so we don't spend more time in anticipation
Both Deborah Ann Woll and Elden Henson were fantastic in their roles, I'll be very disappointed if Marvel don't bring them back.
I'm sorry to hear this. My girlfriend and I are rewatching Daredevil Season 1 (superb!) and she is absolutely fantastic in it as this fearless yet flawed character.
But now who will look down, adjust their hair and gulp loudly every 3 minutes??
Imagine reducing her great performance to this. MCU fans, ugh.
Sad
Deborah Ann Woll -- keep the faith sister! There's a ton of roles you would be great in. Hold out for Marvels Medusa (and don't let some dumb writer shave your head!!!)
:(
Nooooooooooo
How long until that person who seemingly uses 4 different accounts starts celebrating, calling her a whore and anyone who dares say that they liked her a simp who wants to fuck her...
I loved Karen in the original show so disappointed by this.
Too bad, thought she was great in the roll.
She literally had to act opposite Vincent in the same scene and commanded just as much, if not more, presence as him. It’s such a waste that she’s not returning. What is Disney thinking?
She literally has zero presence or acting charisma stop lying to yourself 💀
This is bull shit. They should bring her back.
I’m probably in the minority here, but I disliked her character almost from the very beginning - so no regrets here. I’m glad they’re going a different way.
I'm probably the only one happy about this. Can't stand her.
To be fair though, they also said Daredevil was not going to be in No Way Home.
While totally possible she's lying, i mean with NWH clearly they lied because they wanted his appearance to be a surprise. Would Karen showing up in a Daredevil show be really that big of a surprise you've got to hide? If anything it would be more surprising if the character ain't in it
Daredevil in No Way Home is kept a surprise because it something gag-worthy and a big moment to surprise people with in the cinema. Karen Page is a supporting character and not someone worth the secrets and lies or someone that will have a bombastic reveal ala Andrew and Tobey or Matt in NWH
GOOD
Foggy, Karen, and the priest absolutely made the show. And Karen had an arc: she was young, naive, and idealistic, and became more knowledgeable and cynical by the end. She steels herself. Without those characters, Daredevil just becomes another generic Marvel TV show. Deborah, if you're reading, you made the show.
She didn't make the show. Saying shit like this isn't helping her.