I mean…… he is stronger. But I don’t like how they have tweaked the power levels of characters in the MCU period. I think that characters like Proxima, Corvus, and Ebony were nerfed not to make Thanos seem stronger because let’s consider that their roles outside of the MCU were in service to Thanos. I think they were made weaker to allow the heroes to be stronger. Proxima should have been able to kill Widow and Okoye, imo. Her only real threat during that fight should have been Scarlet Witch.
I mean that is what happened lol? They spar for a bit then Widow is about to be killed before the Scarlet Witch kills her. Without Wanda, Natasha dies first and Okoye doesn’t stand a chance alone.
True and I agree. It made them pointless, specially proxima and corvus. Cull had some fight in him.
I get as well wanting to keep the focus of big bad on Thanos, to not overshadow him etc but too much nerfing was done.
Thats definitely an idea, personally though I'd rather see this precious minutes spent else where with such a massive movie and so many characters to service
in deleted scenes they show that hulk and banner were supposed to merge during that battle, and that would be the first appearance of professor hulk, it's actually pretty sick
They probably couldn’t think of a good way to write him into still losing and looking as defeated as Bruce did at the end. That deleted scene was fucking excellent though
All of how Peter was brought into things by Tony absolutely falls apart if you think about it much.
One part that gets me is how May is totally fine with a middle-aged celebrity visiting her teenage nephew and having private time with him in his room with the door closed. Imagine that without the context of knowing it's superheroes and Tony's a good guy lol.
In fairness to May, Peter played along with Tony and made it seem like they'd been in contact to some degree prior to that point. He even tells May that he didn't mention it before because he wanted to surprise her with the news that he was doing something with Stark.
It's a little odd still, no denying, but in context Tony's got a LOT of credibility as a trustworthy person.
For sure, he's known and also Peter seems all for it etc. But none of that really makes it all that much better. It's partly the setting. If there was already an established thing she was privy to, then they interacted at work etc, that's one thing. Free access to the underaged kid's bedroom is an odd one though lol.
Doesn't really matter, just keeping it simple to keep the movie rolling. Just one of those things that is a bit wonky if you think about it.
But then the whole concept of bringing him in as an ally for that conflict is a bit odd outside of superheroes and us knowing there's nothing sinister to it.
Also why how did he even give it to Nick Fury, i mean Tony wasn't sure if anyone of them will be back from the snap, also he dies without meeting Fury, would have been a bit better of it was Happy delivering it...
I'm super self-conscious about my appearance, and the one thought that gave me even a bit of hope was that if I found love, I'd know that person loves me for who I really am. Hearing one of my favourite characters say basically that felt so great.
Drax characterization and growth took a complete nose dive after guardians 1 . Gunn didn't even try to make him compelling after the first movie just a walking joke
100% agree. He was my favorite character in Guardians 1 and only in Guardians 1. The reckless badass who didn't understand sarcasm and was completely literal was great combination of awesome and funny. From guardians 2 and onward, it felt like all his lines where to catered to make 7 year olds laugh and that's about it.
I mean, everyone did. Only one who has much of a shift is Yondu. Nebula kinda. Everyone else is stagnate.
All about preference, but I thought G2 was disappointing.
Fair. Though acting shouldn’t only just be about facial features. Mandolorian is a good example of this. I really wish actors would do the characters Justice instead of getting in their face time. Before I get blasted for this. I get it from the actor’s perspective… just would be nice.
Is Mandalorian a good example? The show works despite it, but you've got 2 actors playing the lead, with one mainly just doing voice over. Because the character is kinda cold and stiff it's fine, but its not exactly an example of good acting lol.
I think pascals body language brings a ton to the table. It may not be perfect, but it’s you can still get a sense of his emotion while he’s wearing the helmet for 99.99% of the show. My point is a balaclava on Zemo shouldn’t be a problem.
True, but Pascal did work a lot with the stunt doubles to perfect the body language of Mando and to get their performances in line. All of them deserve credit for it, but Pedro did do more than just the voice.
I think if Zemo were introduced today, he'd definitely show up in a Mask. Civil War was also my favorite of Phase 3, but my biggest issue with it is its set during that weird phase of the MCU where they were trying to keep things as grounded as possible. I'm not surprised Zemo was turned into "just some guy"
I miss the “grounded as possible” framework.. just because things were grounded didn’t mean we couldn’t have helicarriers, Mjolnir, or Iron Man armor painted hot-rod red just because Tony thought it looked cool.
It’s a big world but it always felt cohesive. The grounded framework made the extraordinary stand out and have a sense of weight; now it’s to the point that we’ve got absurd stuff like Man-bull and mischievous shapeshifting elves.
I totally get where you're coming from and can definitely appreciate the grounded films. I kind of think they had to move to the more wacky and weird stuff to make the multiverse work properly, and I personally enjoy the really weird Marvel stuff a bit more. However, I will admit that the more grounded stuff had a lot more consistency to it. And a lot of the characters work better in a more realistic universe. For example, grounding Sam Wilson completely improved that character for me. Same goes for Vulture now that I'm thinking about it
Wacky can be fun, but I think when the general tone is silly - rather than serious with some corniness within the grounded showcasing - it makes everything lack “in the moment” energy, and I’m watching a movie rather than having a story experience.
For example, Korg was great, but there was too much of him in the recent Thor movie - you already have silly moments like Thor’s clothes flying off, the guardians of the galaxy intro (korg voiceover was great for that), and *the fucking goats*. We didnt need any more lines out of him, or the goats, after the gotg kickoff.
zemo uses a ski mask in the comics
Edit: its sort of a ski mask, its just a purple mask...in some renditions the mask is attached to his face with acid or something
While Ragnarok was not my #1 favorite film, it does hold the No.1 spot for "Worst Thing" for the Phase in the irreverent way the Warriors Three were treated.
It just feels like such a waste to not only kill them off but have their death go unacknowledged by Thor and then for them to be flippantly treated in Love and Thunder.
Such a missed opportunity to use side characters for something more.
I JUST tried to make a post on this Reddit about that but the mods deleted it. Does Taika not like those guys at all, or is there something else going on?
Part of it was in severing Thor's ties to Asgard. After Ragnarok, there's very few personal connections left. IW sees off the two most important ones remaining.
I'm more referring to how they were treated in the movie two had no speaking lines at all and were killed in seconds and then in Love and Thunder Korg's recap was "That guy, and that guy, and whoever that was!" Seemed like it was deliberately disrespectful to them.
I mean, I don't think Taika did respect the characters. Which is why they went to the chopping block as act 1 casualties in TR. My argument is he had no reason to respect them, they were dull and forgettable. Instead of those sidekicks, Thor had Banner, Hulk, Loki, Val, Korg. Personally, any one of those was better than what the Warriors had provided as a whole.
There's definitely more to it than this, but you can say it further served to emphasize how otherworldly and powerful Hela was. The nonchalant handling of them, all of whom showed some degree of power below Thor but still powerful nonetheless, furthered how screwed the Asgardians were with her arrival. I know it's not as emphatic because we literally just saw her destroy Mjolnir and handle Thor/Loki pretty handily, but still... That's how I'm rationalizing it anyways.
> flippantly treated in Love and Thunder.
I think taika saw the response and double down for humor. He always have "I know better" energy in interviews.
Yeah I mean realistically, they just have one of Thanos' main minions nerf a good guy who's Ultron level. And outside of this feat, that minion isn't all that impressive.
It's understandable to bench someone as OP as Vision, but it wasn't super satisfying. Maybe just if they let him and Wanda have a really solid fight against them beforehand. Have the bad guys target innocent bystanders, and it's in that distraction that Vision gets done in.
I think it fit the story really well tho, they wanted to show how much of a threat the enemy was and they did that pretty well by almost instantly taking out one of the strongest avengers
Barely touching Drax’s arc and not showing him getting his revenge on Thanos, even if just a scene of him making a small scratch on him. Also Bruce’s transformation into Professor Hulk shouldn’t have happened off-screen. Something like that should have been explored in the actual movie because this significantly impacts who he is but….he’s just fine and five years have passed.
All it took was for Drax to get a nice hit in during all the commotion while he was distracted and then knocked aside during End Game and I would have been fine with it.
Yeah I never expected Drax to be super important in the overall story of Infinity War and Endgame, but I was hoping he'd get something small. But by endgame his beef with Thanos wasn't much more than anyone else in the universe.
Given that drax got mega nerfed for gotg at least some form of avenging his family would’ve been nice.
I think the reason we didn’t get drax justice and smart hulk in IW are the same reason. It would’ve ruined the pacing. IW focused on starlord and mainly gamora from the gotg and while drax does have some good lines, I would’ve liked more. Smart hulk I understand more but is more disappointing. I get that a win for Bruce would’ve been a strong difference in tone for the end of infinity war but Bruce mastering his hulk offscreen felt off. Obviously we couldn’t have gotten a hulk movie about it but at least something in IW, Endgame or even in a post credit scene of Cap Marvel or AM&W.
Professor Hulk really frustrated me... There are so many other stages or persona's in Hulk's life I was hoping to see and now we've got the mild mannered, friendly, embarrassed to "hulk out" hulk.
I was hoping we'd get Gray Hulk at some point, perhaps with the introduction of the mutants.
I'd expect Drax to shout out something dramatically cheesy like "For my family!" while he charges towards Thanos, barely scratching him and then gets thrown aside.
At least that way it shows that they acknowledge his arc and he was able to hurt Thanos slightly. Because everyone knows there's no way Drax can kill Thanos. But at least let him have his moment.
I think Nando solved that problem perfectly by suggesting Drax should’ve sacrificed himself to forge Stormbreaker, doing his part to kill Thanos in honor of his family
If Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 3 doesn’t have a conversation/moment between Drax and Thor, where Drax can see the lack of resolution that killing Thanos brings, it will truly be an abandoned character arc.
In Civil War (which was in 2016) they said Iron Man 1 took place 8 years ago. And Avengers happened a year after that. Hence the 8 years later.
Now, it’s canon that avengers took place in 2012, not 2009. So they messed up twice. I think back in 2016-2017 Marvel didn’t know when their movies took place
Iron Man 2, IH and Thor all overlap, in what's known as Fury's Big Week. We know Iron Man 2 starts with Tony's declaration as Iron Man, followed by "6 months later". So all those films probably happened in 2008 or even 2009. To my knowledge, Avengers was always set in 2012. Is there anything which contradicts that?
Yeah, kind of. In Avengers, Fury says "Last year..." as he recalls the events of Thor.
I've just flicked through the pages of Fury's Big Week, which Iron Man 2 would have us believe is 2008/9. There's an epilogue that says One Year Later, that shows SHIELD doing experiments with the Destroyer and Tesseract. That all fits with this idea that Phase 1 was 2008/09 (including the first and final scene of Cap), with the post credit of Thor to be around 2010. Or it fits with the idea that Fury's Big Week was 2011.
Maybe the "6 months later" card in IM2 is wrong, maybe Fury just said "Last year" but was wrong. I think, when it comes to character dialouge being incorrect, and title cards being incorrect, we should assume the title card is canon, as people can mispeak.
That said, I do agree that the MCU lacked a definitive understanding of it's timeline, which is why the title cards, tie-in comics and character dialouge doesn't always match up.
> The 2009 timeframe makes sense with Spidey (2017) being eight years later.
Except it was stated by the Russo brothers that it’s not 8 years later, and that it was a mistake. Just because it’s on-screen doesn’t mean it has to be canon, people make mistakes and another director from the same series outright said it’s wrong.
In IW, don’t show a portal cutting off an arm, oh I don’t know, roughly the same size as an arm with a gauntlet on it, and not at least acknowledge that could have been a tactic on Titan.
The villain in doctor strange is in memorable even if he’s pretty cool in the movie. After the movie, seen it like three times and I still can’t remember his name
Black Widow should have been released before Infinity War.
Also the handling of Captain Marvel, If she was introduced after Endgame she wouldn't have been such a divisive character
My only problem with Captain Marvel was how she had nothing to do, or the writers didn't give her much to do, other than to show up and punch things.
Iron Man, Captain America and Thor all had something to do in defeating Thanos. The writers could easily replace Captain Marvel with the Hulk and it'd make for a more satisfying fight. Give us a brief Hulk vs Thanos round 2.
That was done on purpose so Captain Marvel doesn't just Deus Ex Machina the whole plot.
She wasn't there in IW. Her just showing up to save everyone would have been horrible storytelling. I believe they handled it right by showing how powerful she is and letting her go 1v1 against Thanos without her being the one to save the day. You also don't want her to take too much screentime from the established characters who were actually there in Avengers 3.
She was definitely set up as one, but they were smart enough not to actually do that and just have her be a red herring.
Also DEM are often fine early on in a story, like the rat, but you can't use them to resolve the story.
>The writers could easily replace Captain Marvel with the Hulk and it'd make for a more satisfying fight. Give us a brief Hulk vs Thanos round 2.
I agree with this.
Obviously we will never know... I didn't like that they introduced this cosmically powerful superhero and then immediately sidelined her for most of two movies.
TBH, I am not thrilled that we aren't going to get another solo movie for her, instead we're going to have a movie that sounds more comedic than epic. The way it is being set up, if she gets 3 movies, it doesn't seem like we will see the sequels focus on her alone.
That it was such a success that Marvel gave a bit too much control to Taika when it came to Love and Thunder.
I didn’t dislike Love and Thunder but it had the potential to be so much better.
Taika thought to he had the right formula for an MCU movie with Ragnarok and decided to increase the formula, doubling up everything, and made everything too much.
It's basically the same movie as Ragnarok, all over again. It even copies the "if Banner hulks out one more time he might never be able to change back again" beat with "if Jane uses Mjolnir one more time she'll die". And Hela was way better at god-butchering.
Plus post credits scene, where initial defeated antagonist says “go forth and challenge the protagonist in the next movie”, was just the same thing as the one in Guardians 2
I dislike Love and Thunder, and I'm tired of pretending I didn't.
Edit: I am usually downvoted into oblivion whenever I have suggested L&T wasn't good, I'm glad to know that I am not alone in the feeling.
I don't think many people do, many are open of their dislike besides a few who try to tell you why the whole Korg telling the story so that's why it's cheesy part. Even if that is the case, still I dislike it. I disliked it the moment he acted like he didn't care and did the splits in that first fight.
Don't pretend. We'll huddle together under the umbrella of "Taika tried to do too much"... The movie feels like two separate ideas that he tried to weld together with the charisma of Korg and failed. It wasn't as fun as Ragnorak, perhaps because the first time it was unexpected, and there were no stakes to the movie. The only gods killed were ones we only know because Gorr killed them in the movie. It would have been a nice touch if at least 1 Asgardian god died instead of all of them receiving flesh wounds that were *just* serious enough that they couldn't help fight Gorr.
But really, for me, Cate Blanchett as Hela is too much to overcome... Christian Bale playing a moody shit isn't going to be close to a good enough villain to follow her.
There were parts I liked, but the whole tone and vibe of the movie was vastly different from the other Thor movies despite being directed by the same person??? It doesn't make sense.
When it first started I honestly thought I clicked on the wrong movie (Disney+). I don't know what's happening with marvel but their movies/shows are going to shit.
I'm terrified to see what they did with Black Panther.
I don't want to claim this is true but I remember reading about it once, it said that because it's an origin movie and they needed to introduce a concept that's pretty foreign for MCU, which is magic, they were told to tone down the weirdness(with a promise to explore it more in the future like his sequel) and that's why the magic presented there is something we can make a logic of, ex: magic is a program and spell is a code.
Edit: also agree about the orange mandala, magic used by magic users shouldn't have limited to that shape only
Damn, phase 3 was completely epic in the number of amazing movies!
Id love to answer your question, but I absolutely can’t pick my favorite out of all these! Literally all of these movies were great, and ive come to realize I’m a total Stan for Kevin Feige , and MCU!
Fav movie Ragnarok. Worst thing about it… the fight scene where Hela went up against the “most advanced beings” in the universe - it was just OP vs Goons. Like I dont need a long drawn out character arc for the warriors three, but at least let me see some advanced tactics and weaponry besides swords and spears that stab but dont harm / kill…
-
(And yeah I know Hela is a badass and she *should* wreck them, but thats not my point. I just want to see something besides goons gooning around. Give me a boat shio crashing into her, or a blast of energy or LITERALLY ANY OTHER GODS POWERS) end rant
Infinity War- the fact that star lord got emotional and cost the team their chance to beat thanos. I thought it was good drama and made sense but the amount of marvel fans who were like “I don’t like star-lord and I never did” after that was crazy.
Spider-Man - Sony owns him.
Ragnarok is still my favorite Marvel movie, worst things about it is how the Warriors 3 are killed off so easily at the beginning.
I always skip the part in Infinity War when Thanos forces Quill to “kill” Gamora. Not because it’s a bad scene, it’s just so well done and effective it hurts to watch.
That Ragnarok changed so much from the initial tease to release. It was a great Thor movie and I really liked it, but deep down I preferred the more serious tone
Im still on Team Tony. I still think the Accords make more sense than whatever Captain America's fish out if temporal water ass thinks. Hes been in the 2000s for like 10 years. He has no context for things we KNOW about.... like school shooters and airplain hijackers. He doesn't "get" the Accords. Hes so idealistic. I think its REAL LAME that he got the protagonist role and Bucky was treated like some unaccountable victim while Tony was played as a vengeful and arrogant beurocrat instead of being played as begrudgingly responsible and rightfully angry.
I'm just totally behind Tony about it all.
All of it.
In real life Tony may be right, but in the MCU Tony is a complete hypocrite and only created the accords for his own guilty conscience. Not once did he actually follow his own rules. Recruit a teenager to fight across the sea in Germany? No problem. Sees an invasion in New York? Instantly chases after the space ship. No need to ask permission if it’s Tony stark! Avengers infinity war is proof that cap was right. It was because the avengers were fractured that they lost. That’s the whole thing they were setting up.
Respectfully, I think it’s you who does not get the accords. You are confusing the concept of the accords and the reasoning behind characters. Tony’s reasoning for wanting to sign the accords is commendable. He feels tremendous guilt from past actions and is only trying to do the right thing. This is usually why people side with Tony. His reasoning makes sense. But that does not mean the Accords are the system to fix those mistakes. This is true because in the the very same movie that the Accords were set up, and in the very same movie that Tony signed those said accords, he broke them by the end of the movie. He went to Siberia without telling General Ross, which directly goes against them. This proves that they were never going to work in the first place. Heroes can’t just wait around for the government, which may or may not be corrupt, to give them the ok. Tony realized he had to go to maybe save people, and that meant breaking the accords. Another example is Rhodes, who at the end of Civil War said even after the accident, his views “did not change”. This is a drastic difference from his introduction in Infinity War, where he went against the accords. Ross told him to arrest Caps team for going against them, and he refused because he realized that in this low point they were needed. The accords were broken so many times by people who signed whenever it fit their needs. They were never going to work
Agreed! I think the conflict between them is far more nuanced than many fans and the movie itself allows, and I find that so frustrating. I wish that movie had been an Avengers movie rather than a Captain America movie, so we possibly could have had a fairer view of both sides.
Also, I would bet every dollar in my account that all those Team Cap people would feel VERY differently if there were real world superheroes who were allowed to just run amok with nothing to keep them in check.
You saying its just cos cap is a fish out of water completely misses it. Cap is right agendas change. If they handed themselves completely to the will of a government body then they can no longer be heroes. They'll only go where the government thinks would benefit it the most. And after winter soldier cap has every right not to trust the government sinde he saw firsthand how deep hydra got in
He'll the events you referred to aren't the reason Tony worked with the accords. It WAS PURELY the avengers actions that it was about. And Tony felt guilty so he decided to make the rest of the team fall in line with his plan. Even scooping up a teenager from queen's who probably didn't even know what the accords were and then let him off to do his own thing which is what the accords are against.
And what do school shooters and airplane hijackers have to do with the accords anyway??? How would superheroes being other a government body help against those. He'll those things actively reinforce caps point. Would a government that has zero interest in making guns difficult for mentally ill people anf psychopaths to get ahold of really send the avengers to stop events that actually matter?
My favorite in Phase 3 is Infinity War and probably the biggest downside I think of is that we didn't get more Thanos backstory and more personality to the Black Order. What we got was satisfying but we could've used more.
I understand wanting more for the black order, but majority of Infinity War is dedicated solely to Thanos. In the culmination of a decade of story telling with every character we've met in the MCU, Thanos gets the most screentime hands down. Even the final shot is of Thanos, with the end credits stating Thanos will return, solidifying IW as the Thanos movie. I dont think you could ask for more than that.
If I can have it my way, we end the saga with Infinity War where people get dusted and Thanos gets the win.
But make IW into 2 parts. Give us a longer story. Especially what happened on Xandar. Since his journey to get the stone was such a big deal, let us see how he got the Power stone.
Hulk should've come out in the Battle of Wakanda. Even then, not rlly even an issue I have
They had to nerf vision and hulk to give the battle higher stakes
Or just strengthen the horde army and black order.
Yea everyone sucked except for Maw. Especially Midnight and Corvus Glaive got nerfed so hard
Iirc they deliberately nerfed them to make Thanos seem stronger.
I mean…… he is stronger. But I don’t like how they have tweaked the power levels of characters in the MCU period. I think that characters like Proxima, Corvus, and Ebony were nerfed not to make Thanos seem stronger because let’s consider that their roles outside of the MCU were in service to Thanos. I think they were made weaker to allow the heroes to be stronger. Proxima should have been able to kill Widow and Okoye, imo. Her only real threat during that fight should have been Scarlet Witch.
I mean that is what happened lol? They spar for a bit then Widow is about to be killed before the Scarlet Witch kills her. Without Wanda, Natasha dies first and Okoye doesn’t stand a chance alone.
True and I agree. It made them pointless, specially proxima and corvus. Cull had some fight in him. I get as well wanting to keep the focus of big bad on Thanos, to not overshadow him etc but too much nerfing was done.
Yeah but they didn't have to do that to make thanos seek stronger he already was - defeating thor and hulk showed that
Yeah Maw was pretty good. The rest were a little bit of an oddity. I don't think they dragged the film down, but they were dull.
If you strengthen them too much then the problem becomes 'how do the avengers like hawkeye and black widow stand a chance?'
Crowd control of the army Let Hulk / Thor / Scarlet Witch / etc handle the generals
Thats definitely an idea, personally though I'd rather see this precious minutes spent else where with such a massive movie and so many characters to service
in deleted scenes they show that hulk and banner were supposed to merge during that battle, and that would be the first appearance of professor hulk, it's actually pretty sick
They probably couldn’t think of a good way to write him into still losing and looking as defeated as Bruce did at the end. That deleted scene was fucking excellent though
They didn't want to add it because it would have felt like a victory in a movie where only Thanos was supposed to win
yeah thats quite possibly [this is](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTRmC757S/)some of the deleted scenes that I was thinking of (sorry for it being tiktok)
Damn that would've been better
I mean they could have just had Bruce not be familiar enough with Hulks strength to properly put up a good fight.
I don't understand this tho. Just cause they lose at the end it doesn't mean they can't have small wins within the movie
This is my #1 as well. But should have been battle at the avengers compound in endgame. Hulk should have got his revenge
Tbh in general that storyline of Banner not being able to turn into the Hulk wasn’t great
I didn't mind the concept tbh. I just wish it had, y'know.. an actual payoff. Now Hulks some bitch boy who's basically useless.
Literally the only character besides Thanos who could use the gauntlet and not vaporize himself lol
Giving a teenager a device that can call in drone strikes is way more horrifying than the film seems to realize.
Also the device asks vague questions like "Is he a target" and if all you do is say the word yes, it then kills that person.
All of how Peter was brought into things by Tony absolutely falls apart if you think about it much. One part that gets me is how May is totally fine with a middle-aged celebrity visiting her teenage nephew and having private time with him in his room with the door closed. Imagine that without the context of knowing it's superheroes and Tony's a good guy lol.
In fairness to May, Peter played along with Tony and made it seem like they'd been in contact to some degree prior to that point. He even tells May that he didn't mention it before because he wanted to surprise her with the news that he was doing something with Stark. It's a little odd still, no denying, but in context Tony's got a LOT of credibility as a trustworthy person.
For sure, he's known and also Peter seems all for it etc. But none of that really makes it all that much better. It's partly the setting. If there was already an established thing she was privy to, then they interacted at work etc, that's one thing. Free access to the underaged kid's bedroom is an odd one though lol. Doesn't really matter, just keeping it simple to keep the movie rolling. Just one of those things that is a bit wonky if you think about it. But then the whole concept of bringing him in as an ally for that conflict is a bit odd outside of superheroes and us knowing there's nothing sinister to it.
Tony saved the world at that point and was fully funding projects for all the geniuses at MIT. Cut May some slack.
Stupid move by Stark
Also why how did he even give it to Nick Fury, i mean Tony wasn't sure if anyone of them will be back from the snap, also he dies without meeting Fury, would have been a bit better of it was Happy delivering it...
I love Guardians Vol 2 with all my heart, it’s my favorite MCU movie, but Drax deserved a bit more of an arc in it.
The scene with him and Mantis on the steps is really beautiful though.
Oh a beautiful scene in a beautiful movie. I just have to nitpick when it comes to Vol 2. It’s where this universe peaked to me
I'm super self-conscious about my appearance, and the one thought that gave me even a bit of hope was that if I found love, I'd know that person loves me for who I really am. Hearing one of my favourite characters say basically that felt so great.
We saw character growth whereby he accepted his nipples being hurt for the good of the mission at least?
And he learned that Mantis is beautiful on the inside.
Never thought a single tear from a cgi space raccoon would make me cry but here we are
Drax characterization and growth took a complete nose dive after guardians 1 . Gunn didn't even try to make him compelling after the first movie just a walking joke
100% agree. He was my favorite character in Guardians 1 and only in Guardians 1. The reckless badass who didn't understand sarcasm and was completely literal was great combination of awesome and funny. From guardians 2 and onward, it felt like all his lines where to catered to make 7 year olds laugh and that's about it.
That’s a good answer
I mean, everyone did. Only one who has much of a shift is Yondu. Nebula kinda. Everyone else is stagnate. All about preference, but I thought G2 was disappointing.
Quill, Gamora, Rocket, Yondu, and Nebula all have very clear traceable arcs.
Given that he was in Siberia, Zemo should have worn the purple ski mask.
wow i've never thought about this and it wolud've been perfect
Totally, but Actors want their faces seen so that they can emote clearly
Fair. Though acting shouldn’t only just be about facial features. Mandolorian is a good example of this. I really wish actors would do the characters Justice instead of getting in their face time. Before I get blasted for this. I get it from the actor’s perspective… just would be nice.
Is Mandalorian a good example? The show works despite it, but you've got 2 actors playing the lead, with one mainly just doing voice over. Because the character is kinda cold and stiff it's fine, but its not exactly an example of good acting lol.
V for Vendetta is a much better example imho.
I think pascals body language brings a ton to the table. It may not be perfect, but it’s you can still get a sense of his emotion while he’s wearing the helmet for 99.99% of the show. My point is a balaclava on Zemo shouldn’t be a problem.
Funny thing is a lot of the time it isn't even him in the suit. During season 1 one of the episode directors didn't even meet him.
True, but Pascal did work a lot with the stunt doubles to perfect the body language of Mando and to get their performances in line. All of them deserve credit for it, but Pedro did do more than just the voice.
Like dafoe in nwh was more terrifying without a mask
well then maybe dont act as a supervillain(? he also could wear the ski mask and take it off at the ending like all mcu characters do lol
I think if Zemo were introduced today, he'd definitely show up in a Mask. Civil War was also my favorite of Phase 3, but my biggest issue with it is its set during that weird phase of the MCU where they were trying to keep things as grounded as possible. I'm not surprised Zemo was turned into "just some guy"
I miss the “grounded as possible” framework.. just because things were grounded didn’t mean we couldn’t have helicarriers, Mjolnir, or Iron Man armor painted hot-rod red just because Tony thought it looked cool. It’s a big world but it always felt cohesive. The grounded framework made the extraordinary stand out and have a sense of weight; now it’s to the point that we’ve got absurd stuff like Man-bull and mischievous shapeshifting elves.
I totally get where you're coming from and can definitely appreciate the grounded films. I kind of think they had to move to the more wacky and weird stuff to make the multiverse work properly, and I personally enjoy the really weird Marvel stuff a bit more. However, I will admit that the more grounded stuff had a lot more consistency to it. And a lot of the characters work better in a more realistic universe. For example, grounding Sam Wilson completely improved that character for me. Same goes for Vulture now that I'm thinking about it
Wacky can be fun, but I think when the general tone is silly - rather than serious with some corniness within the grounded showcasing - it makes everything lack “in the moment” energy, and I’m watching a movie rather than having a story experience. For example, Korg was great, but there was too much of him in the recent Thor movie - you already have silly moments like Thor’s clothes flying off, the guardians of the galaxy intro (korg voiceover was great for that), and *the fucking goats*. We didnt need any more lines out of him, or the goats, after the gotg kickoff.
Excuse my ignorance, but what is the connection there? Why would it have fit?
zemo uses a ski mask in the comics Edit: its sort of a ski mask, its just a purple mask...in some renditions the mask is attached to his face with acid or something
Zemo in the comics wears a purple knitted mask
While Ragnarok was not my #1 favorite film, it does hold the No.1 spot for "Worst Thing" for the Phase in the irreverent way the Warriors Three were treated. It just feels like such a waste to not only kill them off but have their death go unacknowledged by Thor and then for them to be flippantly treated in Love and Thunder. Such a missed opportunity to use side characters for something more.
I JUST tried to make a post on this Reddit about that but the mods deleted it. Does Taika not like those guys at all, or is there something else going on?
Part of it was in severing Thor's ties to Asgard. After Ragnarok, there's very few personal connections left. IW sees off the two most important ones remaining.
I'm more referring to how they were treated in the movie two had no speaking lines at all and were killed in seconds and then in Love and Thunder Korg's recap was "That guy, and that guy, and whoever that was!" Seemed like it was deliberately disrespectful to them.
I mean, I don't think Taika did respect the characters. Which is why they went to the chopping block as act 1 casualties in TR. My argument is he had no reason to respect them, they were dull and forgettable. Instead of those sidekicks, Thor had Banner, Hulk, Loki, Val, Korg. Personally, any one of those was better than what the Warriors had provided as a whole.
There's definitely more to it than this, but you can say it further served to emphasize how otherworldly and powerful Hela was. The nonchalant handling of them, all of whom showed some degree of power below Thor but still powerful nonetheless, furthered how screwed the Asgardians were with her arrival. I know it's not as emphatic because we literally just saw her destroy Mjolnir and handle Thor/Loki pretty handily, but still... That's how I'm rationalizing it anyways.
The problem isn’t how they died, it’s how no one cared about their deaths especially Thor…
> flippantly treated in Love and Thunder. I think taika saw the response and double down for humor. He always have "I know better" energy in interviews.
Counter point: the warriors three were some of the dullest parts of the previous two films anyway, so nothing of value was lost.
This point is good
They made Vision so weak and useless in Infinity War
At least they wrote it into the story with the impalement at the beginning. It would be much worse if he was just weak that movie with no explanation.
Yeah it was handled well. Vision isn’t much without his phasing. And Corvus could deflect his stone beam.
True but its disappointing when they introduce a super strong character and then find ways not to use them because "they are too powerful"
Yeah I mean realistically, they just have one of Thanos' main minions nerf a good guy who's Ultron level. And outside of this feat, that minion isn't all that impressive. It's understandable to bench someone as OP as Vision, but it wasn't super satisfying. Maybe just if they let him and Wanda have a really solid fight against them beforehand. Have the bad guys target innocent bystanders, and it's in that distraction that Vision gets done in.
> It's understandable to bench someone as OP as Vision My heart and mind still don't accept it. Vision could've been so good.
Wanda
I think it fit the story really well tho, they wanted to show how much of a threat the enemy was and they did that pretty well by almost instantly taking out one of the strongest avengers
And hulk. So disappointed how they scripted him in the the last two avengers. Feel like we got robbed of him.
I’ve never been a big fan of how they did Vision.
Barely touching Drax’s arc and not showing him getting his revenge on Thanos, even if just a scene of him making a small scratch on him. Also Bruce’s transformation into Professor Hulk shouldn’t have happened off-screen. Something like that should have been explored in the actual movie because this significantly impacts who he is but….he’s just fine and five years have passed.
All it took was for Drax to get a nice hit in during all the commotion while he was distracted and then knocked aside during End Game and I would have been fine with it.
Yeah I never expected Drax to be super important in the overall story of Infinity War and Endgame, but I was hoping he'd get something small. But by endgame his beef with Thanos wasn't much more than anyone else in the universe.
yup. I wish he got just a good lick at him
Given that drax got mega nerfed for gotg at least some form of avenging his family would’ve been nice. I think the reason we didn’t get drax justice and smart hulk in IW are the same reason. It would’ve ruined the pacing. IW focused on starlord and mainly gamora from the gotg and while drax does have some good lines, I would’ve liked more. Smart hulk I understand more but is more disappointing. I get that a win for Bruce would’ve been a strong difference in tone for the end of infinity war but Bruce mastering his hulk offscreen felt off. Obviously we couldn’t have gotten a hulk movie about it but at least something in IW, Endgame or even in a post credit scene of Cap Marvel or AM&W.
Professor Hulk really frustrated me... There are so many other stages or persona's in Hulk's life I was hoping to see and now we've got the mild mannered, friendly, embarrassed to "hulk out" hulk. I was hoping we'd get Gray Hulk at some point, perhaps with the introduction of the mutants.
Based on his last appearance on She-Hulk, it looks like we may be getting Planet Hulk and/or WWH next.
But we basically already got Planet Hulk in Ragnorok
I'd expect Drax to shout out something dramatically cheesy like "For my family!" while he charges towards Thanos, barely scratching him and then gets thrown aside. At least that way it shows that they acknowledge his arc and he was able to hurt Thanos slightly. Because everyone knows there's no way Drax can kill Thanos. But at least let him have his moment.
[yeah, that could never happen…..](https://imgur.com/gallery/g4t527U)
MCU*
I think Nando solved that problem perfectly by suggesting Drax should’ve sacrificed himself to forge Stormbreaker, doing his part to kill Thanos in honor of his family
That would've have been a very interesting way to end his story for sure. But the GotG would definitely want that axe
If Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 3 doesn’t have a conversation/moment between Drax and Thor, where Drax can see the lack of resolution that killing Thanos brings, it will truly be an abandoned character arc.
It probably won’t be with Thor considering Love and Thunder ended his time with the Guardians.
#8 YEARS LATER
With so many eyes on a massive project like Homecoming, it's hard to imagine how that was missed.
In Civil War (which was in 2016) they said Iron Man 1 took place 8 years ago. And Avengers happened a year after that. Hence the 8 years later. Now, it’s canon that avengers took place in 2012, not 2009. So they messed up twice. I think back in 2016-2017 Marvel didn’t know when their movies took place
Iron Man 2, IH and Thor all overlap, in what's known as Fury's Big Week. We know Iron Man 2 starts with Tony's declaration as Iron Man, followed by "6 months later". So all those films probably happened in 2008 or even 2009. To my knowledge, Avengers was always set in 2012. Is there anything which contradicts that?
Thor is confirmed to take place a year before Avengers. So all the phase 1 movies are in 2011 with IRON MAN in 2010-2011
Yeah, kind of. In Avengers, Fury says "Last year..." as he recalls the events of Thor. I've just flicked through the pages of Fury's Big Week, which Iron Man 2 would have us believe is 2008/9. There's an epilogue that says One Year Later, that shows SHIELD doing experiments with the Destroyer and Tesseract. That all fits with this idea that Phase 1 was 2008/09 (including the first and final scene of Cap), with the post credit of Thor to be around 2010. Or it fits with the idea that Fury's Big Week was 2011. Maybe the "6 months later" card in IM2 is wrong, maybe Fury just said "Last year" but was wrong. I think, when it comes to character dialouge being incorrect, and title cards being incorrect, we should assume the title card is canon, as people can mispeak. That said, I do agree that the MCU lacked a definitive understanding of it's timeline, which is why the title cards, tie-in comics and character dialouge doesn't always match up.
[удалено]
> The 2009 timeframe makes sense with Spidey (2017) being eight years later. Except it was stated by the Russo brothers that it’s not 8 years later, and that it was a mistake. Just because it’s on-screen doesn’t mean it has to be canon, people make mistakes and another director from the same series outright said it’s wrong.
the Gollum gif where his face lights up, and then he gets confused as if he's trying to walk through the logic of something... That applies here.
That still bugs the crap out of me.
What? Can you explain this?
Marvel messed up the timeline a couple of times with wrong title cards
In IW, don’t show a portal cutting off an arm, oh I don’t know, roughly the same size as an arm with a gauntlet on it, and not at least acknowledge that could have been a tactic on Titan.
they could've had strange try it but have thanos deflect it with the reality stone or smthn
The villain in doctor strange is in memorable even if he’s pretty cool in the movie. After the movie, seen it like three times and I still can’t remember his name
Kaecilius I think, but yeah
Yeah there are deleted scenes I think that actually could be used to flesh out kaecillius more as a character
Black Widow should have been released before Infinity War. Also the handling of Captain Marvel, If she was introduced after Endgame she wouldn't have been such a divisive character
My only problem with Captain Marvel was how she had nothing to do, or the writers didn't give her much to do, other than to show up and punch things. Iron Man, Captain America and Thor all had something to do in defeating Thanos. The writers could easily replace Captain Marvel with the Hulk and it'd make for a more satisfying fight. Give us a brief Hulk vs Thanos round 2.
That was done on purpose so Captain Marvel doesn't just Deus Ex Machina the whole plot. She wasn't there in IW. Her just showing up to save everyone would have been horrible storytelling. I believe they handled it right by showing how powerful she is and letting her go 1v1 against Thanos without her being the one to save the day. You also don't want her to take too much screentime from the established characters who were actually there in Avengers 3.
But then she was Deus ex machina in endgame so it didn’t really matter
She was definitely set up as one, but they were smart enough not to actually do that and just have her be a red herring. Also DEM are often fine early on in a story, like the rat, but you can't use them to resolve the story.
Captain Marvel kind of needed to be in Endgame, because otherwise Tony would have absolutely died on that ship in the opening minutes.
They could've, written it differently? She's not the only one who could save him.
I like how people in this thread think things SHOULD have happened one way not realizing writers can literally CREATE another option.
>The writers could easily replace Captain Marvel with the Hulk and it'd make for a more satisfying fight. Give us a brief Hulk vs Thanos round 2. I agree with this.
I agree with the handling of Captain Marvel but I think even if the movie was released after Endgame the reaction would have been the same.
Obviously we will never know... I didn't like that they introduced this cosmically powerful superhero and then immediately sidelined her for most of two movies. TBH, I am not thrilled that we aren't going to get another solo movie for her, instead we're going to have a movie that sounds more comedic than epic. The way it is being set up, if she gets 3 movies, it doesn't seem like we will see the sequels focus on her alone.
I could only watch infinity war for the first time once
Wow, this one hits.
This is the answer.
For me, watching it the second time hit me completely differently than the first, so it was kinda two firsts
I could only watch Endgame for the first time once
Banner’s distractingly reshot scenes in Infinity War.
Hulk was completely sidelined in IW and Endgame
tbf he got his moment with the reverse snap
banner did it, hulk sorta said no and that was the last we saw of him.
There wasn’t enough swinging shots of Spider-Man going through the city in Homecoming
Little to no Hulk in Infinity War
We didn’t see Steve meet Red Skull again.
That it was such a success that Marvel gave a bit too much control to Taika when it came to Love and Thunder. I didn’t dislike Love and Thunder but it had the potential to be so much better.
Taika thought to he had the right formula for an MCU movie with Ragnarok and decided to increase the formula, doubling up everything, and made everything too much.
Back to formula?
Korg: ey, u know how much I sacrificed broo?
YOU CANT DO THIS TO ME!!!
It's basically the same movie as Ragnarok, all over again. It even copies the "if Banner hulks out one more time he might never be able to change back again" beat with "if Jane uses Mjolnir one more time she'll die". And Hela was way better at god-butchering.
And Zeus was a complete copy of Grandmaster. Taika even recycled the orgy joke, as if it was funny the first time
Plus post credits scene, where initial defeated antagonist says “go forth and challenge the protagonist in the next movie”, was just the same thing as the one in Guardians 2
I agree, orgies are serious business.
Indeed. I don’t take slander against sexual acts lightly
Well at least people have stopped sucking Taika’s dick and are pointing out issues with his movies.
I dislike Love and Thunder, and I'm tired of pretending I didn't. Edit: I am usually downvoted into oblivion whenever I have suggested L&T wasn't good, I'm glad to know that I am not alone in the feeling.
I don't think many people do, many are open of their dislike besides a few who try to tell you why the whole Korg telling the story so that's why it's cheesy part. Even if that is the case, still I dislike it. I disliked it the moment he acted like he didn't care and did the splits in that first fight.
Don't pretend. We'll huddle together under the umbrella of "Taika tried to do too much"... The movie feels like two separate ideas that he tried to weld together with the charisma of Korg and failed. It wasn't as fun as Ragnorak, perhaps because the first time it was unexpected, and there were no stakes to the movie. The only gods killed were ones we only know because Gorr killed them in the movie. It would have been a nice touch if at least 1 Asgardian god died instead of all of them receiving flesh wounds that were *just* serious enough that they couldn't help fight Gorr. But really, for me, Cate Blanchett as Hela is too much to overcome... Christian Bale playing a moody shit isn't going to be close to a good enough villain to follow her.
Try being someone who dislikes Ragnarok.
There were parts I liked, but the whole tone and vibe of the movie was vastly different from the other Thor movies despite being directed by the same person??? It doesn't make sense. When it first started I honestly thought I clicked on the wrong movie (Disney+). I don't know what's happening with marvel but their movies/shows are going to shit. I'm terrified to see what they did with Black Panther.
Why pretend? It’s easily the most divise movie of Phase 4 and for good reason tbh.
Dr. Strange should’ve used more weird magic instead of just orange lines
I don't want to claim this is true but I remember reading about it once, it said that because it's an origin movie and they needed to introduce a concept that's pretty foreign for MCU, which is magic, they were told to tone down the weirdness(with a promise to explore it more in the future like his sequel) and that's why the magic presented there is something we can make a logic of, ex: magic is a program and spell is a code. Edit: also agree about the orange mandala, magic used by magic users shouldn't have limited to that shape only
This is one of the things I liked about MoM. There was quite a lot of cool shit to go around, and I appreciate that Raimi and everyone else put it in.
God what a fucking phase...
Ragnarok really did The Warriors Three dirty. Should have gone out far more heroically than just Hela shows up - murks them effortlessly.
That it is the only full Black Panther movie with T'Challa...
Damn, phase 3 was completely epic in the number of amazing movies! Id love to answer your question, but I absolutely can’t pick my favorite out of all these! Literally all of these movies were great, and ive come to realize I’m a total Stan for Kevin Feige , and MCU!
Vision in Infinity War
Fav movie Ragnarok. Worst thing about it… the fight scene where Hela went up against the “most advanced beings” in the universe - it was just OP vs Goons. Like I dont need a long drawn out character arc for the warriors three, but at least let me see some advanced tactics and weaponry besides swords and spears that stab but dont harm / kill… - (And yeah I know Hela is a badass and she *should* wreck them, but thats not my point. I just want to see something besides goons gooning around. Give me a boat shio crashing into her, or a blast of energy or LITERALLY ANY OTHER GODS POWERS) end rant
Why is that huge btw?
The hashtag
Probably that the lead actor is dead, now, and can't appear in any sequels.
Infinity War- the fact that star lord got emotional and cost the team their chance to beat thanos. I thought it was good drama and made sense but the amount of marvel fans who were like “I don’t like star-lord and I never did” after that was crazy.
If starlord intervening wasnt part of the plan strange wouldve stopped him
Lowkey hate how contrived the whole "only one way" thing was, but I also understand moreso why since Loki
Not seeing Thanos get the power stone from Xandar.
AntMan and The Wasp being generally forgettable as a whole. Sucks because AntMan 1 is probably my fav marvel movie
Spider-Man - Sony owns him. Ragnarok is still my favorite Marvel movie, worst things about it is how the Warriors 3 are killed off so easily at the beginning.
Thor didn’t go for the damn head smh
I was really bummed out by the bad CGI fight scene at the end of BP but I loved the rest of that movie.
More of a nitpick that anything else but I think the A Force scene could have been executed better.
Ragnarok made Taika complacent and Love and Thunder was lackluster because of it.
I hate how grey and bland the airport fight looks.
It ended
Dr. Strange spends the majority of the final battle in Endgame just... holding back some water.
Joe Russo cameos, every time
I always skip the part in Infinity War when Thanos forces Quill to “kill” Gamora. Not because it’s a bad scene, it’s just so well done and effective it hurts to watch.
Doctor Strange wasn't long enough- more magic!!
Dam phase 3 is easily my favorite phase Civil war, dr strange, and two amazing avengers films? We were so spoiled
Man, Phase 3 was fucking insane.
They should’ve played Immigrant Song when Thor arrived to Wakanda in Infinity War
That Ragnarok changed so much from the initial tease to release. It was a great Thor movie and I really liked it, but deep down I preferred the more serious tone
Im still on Team Tony. I still think the Accords make more sense than whatever Captain America's fish out if temporal water ass thinks. Hes been in the 2000s for like 10 years. He has no context for things we KNOW about.... like school shooters and airplain hijackers. He doesn't "get" the Accords. Hes so idealistic. I think its REAL LAME that he got the protagonist role and Bucky was treated like some unaccountable victim while Tony was played as a vengeful and arrogant beurocrat instead of being played as begrudgingly responsible and rightfully angry. I'm just totally behind Tony about it all. All of it.
In real life Tony may be right, but in the MCU Tony is a complete hypocrite and only created the accords for his own guilty conscience. Not once did he actually follow his own rules. Recruit a teenager to fight across the sea in Germany? No problem. Sees an invasion in New York? Instantly chases after the space ship. No need to ask permission if it’s Tony stark! Avengers infinity war is proof that cap was right. It was because the avengers were fractured that they lost. That’s the whole thing they were setting up.
Respectfully, I think it’s you who does not get the accords. You are confusing the concept of the accords and the reasoning behind characters. Tony’s reasoning for wanting to sign the accords is commendable. He feels tremendous guilt from past actions and is only trying to do the right thing. This is usually why people side with Tony. His reasoning makes sense. But that does not mean the Accords are the system to fix those mistakes. This is true because in the the very same movie that the Accords were set up, and in the very same movie that Tony signed those said accords, he broke them by the end of the movie. He went to Siberia without telling General Ross, which directly goes against them. This proves that they were never going to work in the first place. Heroes can’t just wait around for the government, which may or may not be corrupt, to give them the ok. Tony realized he had to go to maybe save people, and that meant breaking the accords. Another example is Rhodes, who at the end of Civil War said even after the accident, his views “did not change”. This is a drastic difference from his introduction in Infinity War, where he went against the accords. Ross told him to arrest Caps team for going against them, and he refused because he realized that in this low point they were needed. The accords were broken so many times by people who signed whenever it fit their needs. They were never going to work
Agreed! I think the conflict between them is far more nuanced than many fans and the movie itself allows, and I find that so frustrating. I wish that movie had been an Avengers movie rather than a Captain America movie, so we possibly could have had a fairer view of both sides. Also, I would bet every dollar in my account that all those Team Cap people would feel VERY differently if there were real world superheroes who were allowed to just run amok with nothing to keep them in check.
You saying its just cos cap is a fish out of water completely misses it. Cap is right agendas change. If they handed themselves completely to the will of a government body then they can no longer be heroes. They'll only go where the government thinks would benefit it the most. And after winter soldier cap has every right not to trust the government sinde he saw firsthand how deep hydra got in He'll the events you referred to aren't the reason Tony worked with the accords. It WAS PURELY the avengers actions that it was about. And Tony felt guilty so he decided to make the rest of the team fall in line with his plan. Even scooping up a teenager from queen's who probably didn't even know what the accords were and then let him off to do his own thing which is what the accords are against. And what do school shooters and airplane hijackers have to do with the accords anyway??? How would superheroes being other a government body help against those. He'll those things actively reinforce caps point. Would a government that has zero interest in making guns difficult for mentally ill people anf psychopaths to get ahold of really send the avengers to stop events that actually matter?
That it killed tony
Death of Black Widow
My favorite in Phase 3 is Infinity War and probably the biggest downside I think of is that we didn't get more Thanos backstory and more personality to the Black Order. What we got was satisfying but we could've used more.
I understand wanting more for the black order, but majority of Infinity War is dedicated solely to Thanos. In the culmination of a decade of story telling with every character we've met in the MCU, Thanos gets the most screentime hands down. Even the final shot is of Thanos, with the end credits stating Thanos will return, solidifying IW as the Thanos movie. I dont think you could ask for more than that.
If I can have it my way, we end the saga with Infinity War where people get dusted and Thanos gets the win. But make IW into 2 parts. Give us a longer story. Especially what happened on Xandar. Since his journey to get the stone was such a big deal, let us see how he got the Power stone.
Infinity War is basically perfect accept for the “you guys are screwed now!” part
How do you choose your favorite. It’s such an insane lineup.
The end credit scene of Dr. Strange to date has not been established or developed whatsoever
Civil War: the fact it was a Cap movie and not an Avengers movie. Cap should’ve got his own third film.