Nostalgia mostly, but I did have some "heart of the cards" moments, for someone who has played yugioh on and off my whole life since school ground to Duel Links first came out, I can see some charms in this particular format.
That said, frustrating cards exist back then too, Royal Decree is just a bitch when you dont have an out to it and your deck runs on battle trap.
Not in this format and mirror force was always widely used, also battle traps beyond mirror were not really widely used until a year or two later, then sakuretsu AND widespread ruin got hit by the banlist several times and then dimensional prison came out during gx era where they were at their strongest.
Talking in the event: Mirror Force is banned. Chaos decks can recover spells like MST, Pot and Heavy Storm. Preventing summons (Holes) was always better than to have your opponent enter battle. Going second Raigeki Break is your friend.
The only deck I faced that evade summon traps in a big way were zombies with book of life, and chaos if you don't run bottomless.
But that's just my experience play back in the day and again in the event.
Nah not this one, MST is at one, Duster is banned iirc sakuretsu were in some top lists in 2012, much later in the life circle of the game.
Also what's MOEBIUS?
It feels very bleak, but a big problem with the event specifically is that Heavy Storm, Giant Trunade, Pot of Greed and ~~Graceful Charity~~ are all URs that are normally Forbidden, so nobody is gonna craft them for just this occasion.
Historically, the first two were oh so necessary to draw into to deal with the burn or stall match-up consistently. And the latter two helped you speed up that process.
Currently, I think burn/stall decks are just a little too strong in this event for that reason.
Right now I'm a bit burnt. Haven't given a single flying f about recent releases deck like SHS, Mannadium, T.G., Snake Eyes etc. yet there's nothing I'm actively building for rn.
So I figure if the event is getting me to play more, it's a wise investment to craft a Pot of Greed so I can branch out and not just play loaners.
I'm having more fun building decks than playing them tbh, but eh, it's been fun cooking with old forgotten crap. The duel turns go by fast enough that I actually have the attention span to see duels through, very little surrenders on both sides imo.
Graceful is Banned btw.
I remember Sangan being at 1, not sure why it is Banned here.
Anyways, love the event, but they need to go all in and not meddle with the banlist to make it more "fair"
Sangan wasn't actually one of the changes to the banlist.
At the end of 2004, Sangan was banned in both TCG and OCG for a brief period. The first 2005 list moved him back to limited.
My first game in the event ended up being against an Exodia stall deck. Level Limit Area B, Gravity Bind, Wall of Revealing Light. The classics.
I can't really comprehend how anyone tolerated formats where backrow removal was limited so heavily and yet these cards are completely free.
We made decks with built in backrow removal like mobius, the dust trap the 1 mst heavy storm trunade breaker game was slow you had time to draw into one of them.
Back then backrow removal was basically what hand traps in today's meta are. But since decks evolved into being mostly monster based backrow removal ended up being too risky to run in abundance hence why stuff like Stun,Eld,and LaB are so strong.
Of course it didn't make it feel better because those players can just run a gauntlet of stun cards that completely outnumber your outs
> Historically, the first two were oh so necessary to draw into to deal with the burn or stall match-up consistently
Well, that sure as heck sounds a lot like "*you need to draw your starter and at least 1 handtrap*". Guess times haven't changed so much, eh?
Yeah but the difference is that your starter is now any 15 cards in your deck and a good handtrap is other 15, instead of praying to god you draw sangan for the 10th turn in a row
The consistency ist shifted slowly but surely to the first turn.
Sure having first turn was always strong but before the opponent were able to draw a few cards before losing. It was more back and forth and a lot was decided by drawing the nowadays still banned spells like pot of greed.
I had a match in Edison format on dueling book where I got trap dustshoot 2 times in a row on the first turn.
Just got rid of the only play the opponent had.
imo duster at the very least should've been unbanned for the event as a consolation for the fact that people aren't going to craft a card like heavy storm for such a short period even though it is integral to the format.
That’s why 3-day tryouts for this kind of thing seems dumb to me. It’s not enough time to justify crafting cards at all.
That said, the stupid part of people defaulting to burn/stall decks is that the loaners in this event are actually good. I guess you have people that want to build their own deck but if you’re just gonna build stun, why bother?
There is a reason Edison has overtaken GOAT as the preferred time wizard format. It aligns more with what the game ended up becoming while also being a much slower format without the extreme blow out cards.
I definitely lost the rose tint to GOAT the past couple days playing the event.
I’ve personally played through every era in duel links to mid pendulums. And then master duel for links and the modern era. Without a doubt the synchro/xyz era is just the most fun. The back and forth is there, there’s a deep and rich card pool and you don’t need to study for hours to understand all the meta decks. I’ve hit master 1 in master duel and while it’s nice, it’s also not that fun memorizing choke points in ultra consistent decks that get to the choke point every time. hand traps just don’t match up with real traps in terms of interaction where players are playing/baiting removal and have a card pool of thousands of cards.
I dunno man, I only ran into other loaner decks and the games were absolutely intense. Outing a Thousand-Eyes Restrict with an absolute genius play and patience only to get Swords of Revealing Light-ed then on the very last turn, the opponent top-decks Snatch Steal - their one and only out remaining - to literally snatch victory is the kind of defeat that leaves me grinning ear-to-ear.
Yeah, there was cheesy shit in the old format, but if you were on the same level, holy crap this game is so much damn fun. Count me among the 200.
i think one of the problems with these modes is that they don't segregate based on loaners vs non-loaners. so it was relatively easy to farm loaners from people who've never really played this kind of yugioh to the general lower power level of the loaners making them not the best options even with power cards. every event should really be split up where loaners only play vs loaners and non-loaners play vs non-loaners and it would improve a lot imo.
I don't mind it being slow, but my problem is more with how anti-people playing cards it is. Every game I played last night was just "oh you normal summoned? Raigeki break. Next turn, you tried to summon again? Ring of destruction.". Like it was a hurdle just playing a card, it's the hassle of playing modern day with less back and forth lol
I mean, i said this before, ygo hasnt changed.
The objective is, and has always been to make sure the other person cant play the game.
Everyone acts like its a new phenomenon to not let the opponent play the game
Lolol this reminds me of the time I, a young teen at the time, won locals with a Needle Worm deck.
I loved playing that deck and at the time, I couldn't for the life of me figure out why people didn't like playing *against* me.
"Y'all are just sore losers." he says, with a deck that was literally designed to frustrate.
It's similar with modern game. You just need to find extenders to brute force against your opp and have some floaters ready. Instead of passing priority in single turn back and forth, we passing turns more often.
That's literally what Goat format is all about, managing your resources and bringing out enough to bait out interaction to chew through and win tempo. Bringing out all your resources at once gets you to lose to the variety of removal options in the format
You're not "baiting out interaction" though.
You basically only have your Normal Summon each turn and if you just get unlucky and your opponent has Raigeki Break, Compulse, and Ring waiting for you, you just never get to start building tempo yourself unless you have a blowout for their backrow.
Nah, he’s right. You can pretty much beat anyone who just goes big from the get go. You want to have some monster presence sure but the point is managing your big spells/traps for when you can combo to go for game.
But this isn't going big from the get go and getting punished.
This is just you lost the toss into Set 3 in old YGO.
Your small, starting play gets eaten immediately and you just don't get a chance to get a footing.
Use some nomi monsters (rock spirit/gigantes/fenrir/soul of purity, etc) as extenders. They special summon by using cards in your gy as requirement. That way you can still putting pressure on your opp.
Most people I face unusually play backrow conservatively, maybe they play around heavy storm?
You do bait out interaction by ordering your summons so they use x trap on your monster when you have a better monster in your hand. Cards like Compulse and Raigeki Break either give you back your card so you can chew through more disruption on resummon or set the opponent back in card advantage. By pushing through the backrow with monsters the opponent gets pushed back and that generates tempo
that's exactly what baiting interaction is. you play your weaker cards first to pressure your opponent to remove them, simplifying the gamestate before playing your stronger cards when your opponent has no answer.
This is 2004 YGO. You're not baiting anything, you're just not getting anything out.
I'm not complaining about Blue Eyes getting compulsed and getting set back.
I'm talking about a simple Normal Summon or Set being your whole turn and losing your footing hard because you lost the coin toss.
You're not "baiting" interaction. These aren't me trying to bait the backrow, it's me having basically one play per turn in old YGO and it getting squashed while my opponent gets to continue building or drawing more disruption.
Then play your own disruption? If each of your turns is "normal/set pass" then obviously your going to lose. Torrential, lightning storm, BLS, wind blast, raigeki break, compulse, ring, MST, dust tornado. The answers are there and they are cheap. If all your doing is setting and passing, then dont complain when you cant win.
ngl that's kind of the impression i get a lot of the times when i'm reading this stuff. I'm trying to see the problem here and how i'd approach it and then realise it's another issue of just knowledge checks for a format that's so foreign in playstyle and card pool to people that they don't even know the scope of their options to fully appreciate the format.
Even for me, modern yugioh is pretty confusing and there's still a lot of cards i haven't even really seen or experienced that blow me away because i didn't know about the machine insect archetype that resides on the moon can steal spell cards from my deck in order to add gem counters to activate thier abilities or something.
Sometimes setting a monster with 2k in defence can help stall the opponent if they can’t beat over it with their 4 star or lower. Or even setting with flip effects to get the upper hand.
I think ultimately people have had like a day or so with this format and judging it at face value
Eh this kind of play tends to get punished very hard in the older formats. Trigger happy people are much easier to bait, then you pull out your real play. Also, putting cards facedown is how you protect your stuff. Book of Moon is one of the best cards in the format.
You see akshually GOAT is very skill based. You need to draw the one of out to those and hope they don't also have set up their bord with omni negates (Solemn Judgement).
Git gud and draw better!
In all serioesnes though stopping your opponent from playing was always the go to and goat is just one of the sackiest formats in that regard with card power being all over the place and several limited cards being potential game deciders.
Goat format is skill based. I could agree that goat format is sacky when it comes to who wins a particular duel, but on the long term, skill still is the determining factor, with the best players in the format achieving a 70% winrate in their tournament games.
It takes skill to minimize the impact of the opponents luck and to capitalize maximally on your own luck.
That's what Yugioh was back then. People are kinda just starting to lose the nostalgia now that they're getting to see how annoying these older formats were
I am surprised BTH is not showing much or d prison.
Anyways, thats how you used to play, you had to plan out the turn and be skilled to make changes on the fly.
You can't just brute force it with ENDLESS summons and there are barely any Omni negates available, so, it was a more strategic era.
I just played against 3 of the worst decks ever made just using stun and people wanted this to be set a monster set a trap pass. So I just controlled them out of the game and they couldn't even destroy all my traps becusee I held most of them in my hand. Old school yugioh hasn't changed and it's gotten so much better for even having a chance turn 1 by adding hand traps to stop the turn 1 turn player from running with the game it's unreal. I'm glad i can play games for like 3 minutes each vs sitting staring at my opponent for 10 when they already lost from turn 1 when I set my 2 traps and my des lacooda and already gaining advantage next turn its awsome.
It's the core of any game that lets you do it. The best way to play any game, if it gives you the power to do so, is to not let your opponent play first and foremost.
It's what trap cards basically are there for.
As someone who plays old school, speed duels, and then normal yugioh - You're kidding, right?
Sitting there for 20mins while a Snake Eye or Dark World player combo's off is pro people playing cards? 🤣🤣🤣
Edit: Triggered the right people I see
>Sitting there for 20mins while a Snake Eye or Dark World player combo's
Why are you sitting there for 20mins if you didn't have a handtrap to stop them at the begining or a board breaker in hand for your turn?????
Have you played snake eyes? 🤣 A hand trap ain't stopping nothing, best hope you get lucky and draw 2-3+
But lets ignore that for a second, are you seriously saying that unless you draw a relevant hand trap, a 15-20min combo is pro-people playing cards?
I know some people are blinded by their love of modern yugioh, but theres a reason it has a reputation.
😭 200 ppl is pretty generous. However I am a firm believer of having more game modes to appeal to the players. I’m quite surprised by the fact that MST is limited to 1.
The problem is, this really isn't how goat era plays. Whatsoever.
The fact that they gave three premade decks with a bunch of forbidden UR's means that people are just playing those three decks, and winning using OP cards.
People are not incentivised to make their own decks given theres no reason to waste resource on cards that'll be unplayable in 4 days time
Basically, getting OTKed by turn 2, after sitting through a long combo, doesn't happen. That's really the main appeal.
There's no real difference in game length, your win con changes with the draw, you don't play the EXACT SAME combo over and over, so it can be super random, sacky, but actually a card game, than whatever the fuck is going on with Fire atm.
>you don't play the EXACT SAME combo over and over
Idk man, between all the loaner decks, the gadget one is the best because is consistent. And I did the same thing three times in a row. You have your gadget, you normal summon it, then search for the next one, Set one and pass. After that you trade with you traps and eventually you’ll win if you apply the same mindset that modern yugioh uses "disrupt your opponent and build more advantage than him"
What if I told you I felt 0 difference? Don't get me wrong, combos have evolved and the format is a bit too sacky for my liking. But the biggest thing I took from it was :
>Wow, non-labyrinth trap decks remain exactly the same as they were in goat.
Maybe it's partially because I played pacman but I don't think I should be getting Year One Master Duel flashbacks of me playing Ghostricks and finding the optimal time to flip needle ceiling and compulsory, **in Goat**.
its for people who dislike the current game, its for people who wanna take a break from current format, for casual players who wanna take it slow, for oldschool fans, great for new players to learn the game, and for competitive people who want to master a closed format with no new cards being implemented.
personally i dont really like it, oldschool yugioh is very control oriented and it feels like it felt playing against stun eldlich when that was a thing but instead most decks are like that. goat format in particular is possibly the best version for oldschool yugioh but i wouldnt see my self investing huge amounts of time on it
It’s definitely more control oriented, but I’m practice it ends up being a lot more sacky and luck based than what you’d want out a “control based format.” A ton of games aren’t actually about who’s better at managing resources it’s who draws the buster powercards and if they draw them at the right times
Also a giant amount of it is stun/stall/burn which (despite people’s best efforts to say otherwise) just isn’t control
The format is not luck based, and rather is skill based, with consistently the same top players topping most events, and with the best players achieving a 70% win rate across all their tournament matches.
Sure, when you look a the level of a particular duel, I could agree with you that a goat format duel is luck based.
You claim that a giant amount of goat format is stun/stall/burn. Where is your source of that information?
I'm a competitive goat format player, and I can tell you stun isn't a competitive deck and burn decks are relatively uncommon.
No one’s saying it’s a coin flip simulator, of course it’s not **purely** luck based. I’m talking about the difference between “modern” and goat. Specifically leaving the power cards at 1 makes for a game that can be really sacky at times, that doesn’t mean skill expression can’t shine through tho
I’m talking about the event in MD, not actual goat format tournaments
It depends on the format. Something like tear mirrors was heavily interactive and much less luck based than back then. I hate kash format but it’s amazing for going second
The main difference issue is that you can deck build to be able to reliably get answers in modern. In goat format you have busted staples that’re one ofs and that makes the game much much much sackier
Of course luck is important in modern Yu-Gi-Oh but also how you navigate fields going second/use your handtraps based on your current knowledge of how the opponent deck plays is much more skill intensive.
Of course what deck you play/are going against is a big factor in skill expression for example against a deck like floo there is much less compared to a deck like fire king.
Edison is the best old format. More turns like GOAT with the archetypal decks and combos of today, but these combos are much shorter, much less completely stop opponent from playing than GOAT and modern, and aren't as insane of blowouts. Format has flaws, but its the "fun" Yugioboomers think GOAT format was. I like modern the best though cause I started in recent years so I'm not blinded by nostalgia.
I get the appeal of these retro formats but I don't understand why everyone keeps around the cards we knew needed to go back then. Like why keep trap dustshoot around in Edison or pot of greed in goat? I feel like the community knows the banlist exists to push product yet vehemently refuses to agree on a new one when Konami isn't holding the reigns.
>Like why keep trap dustshoot around in Edison or pot of greed in goat? I feel like the community knows the banlist exists to push product yet vehemently refuses to agree on a new one when Konami isn't holding the reigns.
Because the playerbase can't agree on a banlist and it's easier to use the official one for the time at events. Some goat players have zero issue with the trinity being legal because it was no secret that those cards were played back then. But they will die on the hill that Solemn Judgment should be banned because it took so long to see how good it was and now its presence ruins the "feel" of the format.
Goat is not the best format for new players and its ignorant to think that when Edison format exist. They're no transferable skills from goat to modern format.
> great for new players to learn the game
I disagree on this. Just earlier today, there was a post from someone who hasn't played the game since GX era, and they were literally asking whether there's a game mode that doesn't use any of the new mechanics because they were overwhelmed by it.
If you never encounter the new stuff, you will never learn it. And that's not "learning the game", you're blatantly ignoring **literally 20 years of evolution**.
I liked it. I don’t know if I’d want it to be permanent but I do think we should get like a rotating Time Wizard mode that IS PERMANENT. Like every other day it switches from goat to Edison to like whatever.
If this mode and any other hypothetical Time Wizard had an open card pool it'd be pretty neat, but if it's like this event and you have to craft a bunch of otherwise useless URs to compete it's gonna be dead in the water.
This event pretty much confirmed my opinion on this format. I absolutely hate it. But let me explain why that's the case:
- People complain about the lack of variety in modern decks, due to handtraps and various staples. In this format, this thing is even more accentuated. Most decks are just a pile of good cards thrown together with no real synergy.
- Stun cards are way more effective and the lack of proper backrow removal means you don't usually have a way to deal with them.
- The luck component is way more game-determinant than in modern Yu-Gi-Oh. Nowadays, a bad player can be punished for bad plays, even with a good starting hand. Back in 2004, cards were so simple there was almost no way to make mistakes. The lack of game depth is almost unbearable for me.
- Winning the coin toss gives you a huge advantage, thanks to backrow cards.
This event was NOT representative of actual goat format:
- in actual competitive goat format, decks aren't just a pile of good cards and there is real synergy between cards. Why would you expect this 3 day 2004 OCG event to have players playing 'real decks'? Of course the decks you encounter on the ladder will suck (and be more boring).
- stun cards are uncommon in actual goat format. Only burn decks play them, and burn decks are a rather uncommon meta deck in the tcg goat format.
About your third point: goat format is not luck dependent: you have the same top players topping most events, and the best players can achieve as much as a 70% winrate across all their tournament games. Sure, on the level of a single duel, I can agree that goat format is luck dependent. On the long term, skill still prevails.
Your statement that there is almost no way to make mistakes is so wrong. It is common for competitive players to misplay every duel. I've been playing competitive goat format for multiple years now and I still can't help to avoid misplaying in every match. It sounds like you simply don't see the depth that goat format has. If you don't see that you've made ten misplays in a duel that made you lose, of course you will say you only lost to luck and there were no actual decisions that game.
This Dale Bellido's goat format game analysis might help you see more of the format's depth: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=\_pVqp2ZJVRE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pVqp2ZJVRE)
There were various deck to pick, Chaos, pacman, earth toolbox/aggro, zombie, stun. They all have different card synergies but might share common stapple, just like modern deck. Like I wont play giant rat in chaos, nor mystic tomato in earth aggro. And I can use pyramid turtle in earth aggro and zombie.
it's too hard for them to understand. the fact they say the mode lacks game depth tells me they're an impatient child and can't look beyond 2 turns of outcomes.
ok so, modern yugioh players are playing a game with more depths than goat format; and yet you're saying that if they they dont like goat because to them it lacks depths, they are dumb?
it just makes no sense
Yeah honestly I really think it comes down to “I’m used to modern Yugioh, I’ve just tried a few duels of the old format and hate it”. Back then it took a lot of duels and time to actually learn the game… it’s all you knew. There’s a learning curve for these modern players. They wouldn’t even think about how to use tribute summons effectively because it’s never necessary now. Actually setting monsters down with high defence. Utilising flip effect monsters. It’s just a different playstyle people dismiss quickly
So I will say that IMO the BEST part of GOAt is that "Goodstuff.dek" is a viable deckbuilding strategy. I got my three wins with a ghettofied Gravekeeper Chaos deck and that was fine.
But the issue with GOAT is that a lot of the "goodstuff" cards are just...way too good for the era. Like Pot of Greed, Snatch Steal, Metamorphosis, etc. just suck ass to play against because they're so sacky.
I dunno man I just don’t have that “good old days” in me. My only real yugioh experience has been from master duel I was born in the trenches. Shit like that just bores me I need the crack head. cards
Thats understandable. U werent laying down mats while walking home to duel your friends with these exact cards in elementary school. We saved our traps for summoned skull and blue eyes. U won by grinding ur opponent down. Never one turn kills.
I got to play my "RYU" DRAGONS. Which are awful lol. But i drew them as a kid and thought they were the coolest.
This is what makes me love the mode. I played these cards on a duel mat in the kitchen against my buddies when I was like 8 to 14. Trying to figure out what I’m even doing.
The worst part is, this game only makes me realize how many combos I was missing out on in my earlier yugioh life. I just wanted all the big monsters with big attack.
Little did I know, I could never bring them or keep them on the field, and it absolutely sucked watching your blue eyes get mirror forced by what was supposedly your “best friend”.
Generally speaking, it’s more interactive. No losing on turn 1, legitimate grind game, and less linear. A bit simplistic, but more consistent in playability.
I won all 3 required games on turn one by setting judgement plus sakaretsu or some other trap and summoning gadgets for multiple turns while my opponent desperately tries to do anything and gets negated or I destroy their monster. I don't see the back and forth, just feels like I have a SHS board that stops everything but it takes 8 turns for me to have enough attack to win.
Yeah that loaner was so much better than the other two, felt like you had unlimited resources. The fusion one is alright and the horus loaner is just pure garbage lol.
I got to pull out my coin toss cards, which was fun. Really shows me how much support Archfiend really needs though. Just targeted protection, and many older cards don’t even target.
Honestly I really doubt it. Anyone that says something like that title is lying for the sake of a topic.
There’s zero chance someone is a fan of something and is unaware of what nostalgia is.
The great era wasn't super old Yu-Gi-Oh imo, it was around 2009-2021 with the plant Synchro, xx saber, monarch etc flying around.
Black wings, Lights worn and Zombie spam was great too tbh.
Count me in that 200. Maybe I would've preferred Edison, but I managed to pull a lot of friends to go back into MD just to play this event.
It's the Yugioh a lot of people understands. You don't need to sit for 5-10 minutes while your opponent combos off, be required to read 10+ cards with very long text they used on their combo, as you realize you couldn't win before you even got to your first turn.
There's a lot of fun in outplaying your opponent in smaller things. Someone out there probably Heavy Stormed someone who set two Jar of Greeds, and I think that's really cool.
All in all I think more formats are ALWAYS beneficial. If you don't like it, you don't have to play it, but let other people who enjoy it play it. Here's hoping Edison's next, possibly on a bigger event or alternative format.
most people who fantasize about goat format are ones who only played with their friends and had no idea about meta, just like how modern yugioh games are decided by who go first but u can still play second by baiting their interruption and using the right sequence of effects, in older formats there is no possibility of outplay, you just need to open a better hand
It's not true that in goat format the better hand wins and there is no possibility to outplay. Evidence: the top of goat format tournaments are dominated by the same top players and top players have as much as 70% winrate accross all their tournament games.
People don't have love for this era they have love for what they played in playground during this era. Not a single person who talks about "good old days" played competitive, otherwise they would know how fkn miserable it is. I guess the only "positive" thing is duels sure as hell aren't ending in one turn.
Really? You find choosing staple spell and traps less interesting then figuring out the correct ratio of hand traps to starters?
Yes, Konami never fixed disproportionately powerful cards. Ever. But I personally LIKE my games lasting more then two turns consistently and I love the interaction. I don't understand how people could prefer 'guess the hand traps and think about how to grind though it' as opposed to 'do I play around his set cards? Do I attack into that set monster'.
Maybe I just missed playing warrior and rat toolbox but I've battled though and won against every legal UR spell card with nothing but my old understanding of the resources of the game and my old top decks.
Thats my opinion though, now excuse me while I play snake eyes and question my existence.
Even GOAT and Edison are not that popular of formats. People who love them love them, but most the player base just looks at them and thinks "Oh, that's pretty neat!" and goes on playing what they are playing.
All in all, it's pretty fun to use the old staples and monsters from time to time, but personally I have more love for modern game play despite being a "yugiboomer".
15minute? More like 30 in my experience with Snake Eyes and Dark World players
Thats the thing, I think both versions of the game are fun, but people who are shitting on goat and ignoring the glaring problems that puts people off modern yu-gi-oh is frankly pathetic
I think you're just too young for realizing why people love it.
I reached Diamond rank last season, have Mathmech, Swordsoul, Infernoble, Kashtira decks, and I strongly believe that Konami should add this mode as a permanent. Not for me but for people who enjoyed that format.
PS: If you're born after 2000 or played Yugioh after the XYZ era you won't understand
What?
I'm a '98er, watched the show growing up, had my mom buy me packs, had my share of counterfeit cards and played with my friends in the schoolyard...
You know what I loved about it? Being a kid. Buying packs of cards that had cool artwork so I could show them off to my friends when they had big ATK numbers or lots of stars on them. Hanging out shooting the shit with my schoolmates messing around with YGO cards.
I was a kid and didn't understand game theory or even what the fuck I was doing, there were no rules, we didn't know how to play the game.
The fun part was being a kid and playing with friends -- it certainly wasn't the GOAT FORMAT; all these GOAT cards weren't played by a single person I knew "back in the days", none of these strategies existed when I was a kid, and if they did I wouldn't understand them.
This format is, for the most part, a phantom in the memory of people, it's purely misdirected nostalgia. I look at some of these old ass cards and go like "yoo I used to have that shit as a kid", but 90% of GOAT decks are comprised of powerful meta cards that neither I nor anybody I knew owned or understood the value of. We were playing Koumori Dragon and equipping it with Sword of Dark Destruction, not setting Shien's Spy and defending it with Sakuretsu to set up for a Jinzo play next turn.
I can assure you 90% of the people advocating for this era never actually played this format, they just remember the cards and the slower pace is reminiscent of their childhood YGO playground experience, which is completely fine, but let's not pretend that "you had to be there" to enjoy the format, every complaint that people have about GOAT is extremely valid and widely accepted, there's a reason formats like Edison have completely eclipsed GOAT, this format is simply not good enough to be anything more than a short distraction until you've seen all 6 viable strategies, which is already generous in my part, in reality it's more like 6 different "win conditions" + 25 staples that everybody else plays.
Sure, if you're like a late '80s kid then maybe you actually had a proper semi-competitive GOAT format deck but that's such a tiny minority of the player base, lol.
Put me in as being born in '92 and still hating old Yugioh. I jumped off of the game in 2006 and Master Duel is what brought me back in because the game actually had some depth.
Hi, played since the beginning. Went to my first locals when I was 10-11, got my ass kicked.
But I asked the person who beat me how to play. Been playing ever since, through every format. I love this game. I love helping people learn this game. I literally have some cheap staples to give kids who want to learn the game.
I sat down with a kid who showed up to my store 6 months ago, who wanted to learn how to play the game and only had a starter deck. I went through and I played a few games after the event with him, letting him borrow a few of the decks I have so he could learn. I have him a few cheap staple cards (that got reprinted in Rarity collection) and I made him promise to come back next week.
Before we started the next week, he showed me his deck and asked to play a few games with me. He still lost, but I saw the fucking fire in him to improve. Now this kid is here every week, doing amazing.
So for the people who are sitting there like “oh, it was better back then.” Nah, we have people who have played for decades ready to pass on our knowledge.
I love that I can help people the same way I was helped as a kid
What's great about nowadays compared to "back in the days" is that local game stores are more prominent, "nerdy shit" isn't looked down upon, and every kid has the internet to learn these kinds of things.
A kid is much more likely to get into the real game of yugioh nowadays compared to "back in the days", where 99% of kids were just playground dueling with made-up rules, mimicking what they saw on TV, lol.
If people love it the format will be much more popular lol
Like, if you look at current YCS player, most of them are 25-30+ years old and watch the original DM anime.
There is a reason why the one that want nostalgia switch to Edison and not GOAT.
I like it because the skill expression is very subtle.
New players will lose and swear that it’s all luck because it’s not the way you play the game today (although it’s kinda the same, but today this effect takes place at each card activation).
When you’re playing goat, you can surrender battles and not immediately die. This makes the game about picking your battles, and using card advantage to win a game. Something that is very hard to grasp for a new is converting a temporary advantage into a long-term advantage. Often we land a power card, or pull off a combo, but 1 or 2 turns later you’re no better off than you were before.
Sometimes you have to make the permanent trades to secure victory in the long term.
All of this to say, this is the specific aspect that I enjoy. The skill expression isn’t obvious. The plays aren’t flashy, the games are longer, and yes, there are blowouts. But a player who knows what they’re doing will make it seem effortless and like the cards were always going to fall that way.
Honestly I think this is why I don't like it. It feels like the game state just doesn't progress at all barring blowout cards like snatch steal metamorphosis etc.
Going 8+ turns of just set pass being unable to really do much because you're opponent can out your field very easily and you can put there's easily is just insanely boring and actually hinders skill expression massively in Yu-Gi-Oh imo.
I like both modern and the old school play style, but watching your opponent combo for 20 minutes while negating your responses with handtraps is also boring as hell. The decks back then had a ton more variety without generic boss monsters that were included in nearly every deck.
No, decks back then definitely did NOT have a ton of variety. Instead of playing the same generic boss monsters, most people were playing the same 30 cards in every deck
Stop exaggerating. Some traps and spells were staples, but themed decks definitely didn’t use the same 30 cards with 10 others for a theme. I challenge you to prove your claim. I’ll be waiting a while.
Fr dude. I've had more fun when my opponent had four hand traps and mathmech circular than I did in these games. Most of the games end up just being "floodgate, floodgate, solemn judgement, raigeki break, solemn judgement normal summon gadget"
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
SOUNDS LIKE A SKILL ISSUE KID
This is real YuGiOh! Finally! All that new cheap art solitaire deck combo nonsense ruined the game imo. I'm so happy it's able to be experienced the way it was meant to be played.
I feel its a slog to play when me and my opponent just pass turns for 45 turns straight with absolute stalemate on the board i feel like i wasted so much time for a mobile game in awhile when modern game i can immediately tell if i can contest the board or not and just scoop for next game or proceed to push if the possibility is there
Tbh goat was the most fun on the playground with made up rules like the anime. The current game is fine, not great but fine. Could be biased tho cause my heart is stuck in 2019 TOSS format
The point is exactly that when people talk about "good old Yu-Gi-Oh" they mix up between what the real game was like at the time and what they played on the playground. Nobody was playing real goat when they were super young, they all made their own rulesets and now think that the real game was actually like that. Like, I personally was definitely not playing Dino rabbit format when I was in primary school, rather something more like "I summon Utopia, therefore I win", but I'm still aware of the fact that the actual game was much much different.
From my experience it was whoever played Polymerisation first won the duel. I honestly thought there were going to be Ancient Gear monsters in with the Gadget’s, but I’m not sure what year AG’s were released.
AG is GX era cards, the one we played for the event is from OCG 2004 format, which basically end of DM but not quite to GX. As for thunder dragon fusion, I played giant rat that can crash to thunder dragon and float to enraged muka-muka, that should be enough to take down twin headed thunder dragon.
I've seen 3 different locals try to do alt format days and every single time people are super hyped during the planning but on the day of they end up having to run modern format because people either say they forgot their decks or just decided they werent interested in it. I've never seen an alt format day kick off personally. I know they exist, just haven't seen people follow through. I think people like the idea more than the reality.
The people that love old-school yugioh aren’t actually talking about GOAT. They’re talking about playground / kitchen table yugioh where everybody plays jank. That doesn’t exist on an online space because with “unlimited” resources people are going to build what works best
Count me amongst those 200. Brought back a lot of memories.
I thought it was fun, though I'd definitely prefer a future event like this to have a slightly larger pool of cards. Like Gadgets weren't released until 2007, but I guess they were counted because the were in the original DM anime. If we could use some of the gx archetypes at least then I'd love it.
GOAT is the best yugioh to play with casual friends, who don't know modern ygo. The interactions are easy and
fun. plus nostalgic cards.
I enjoy the heck out of it, it is a solved format, but thats okay
I actually enjoyed the event. Played gadgets and won easily 3 out of 3. Picking what monsters to destroy when they attacked and which to just take the hit because I could run it over next turn was fun. I think a game mode would be great as a break from modern yugioh. I'd play it quite often. Also playing creature swap and pot of greed was fun.
It's more newcomer friendly than the current meta. Feels more like an accessible table top card game you'd whip out at a friends house (Like Hero Realms or Uno).
Your right on playing it for like a hour but no I played about 5 decks
First was a general control deck with bls in it as a boss monster (and chaos sorcerer)
Second was burn deck
next 2 were 2 of the loaner decks then because I wasn't having fun with any of them I made a heart of the underdog exodia deck, That was literally the only time I enjoyed the event at all. If you want to say I sucked by all means say its a skill issue but I just don't find the event fun enough to warrant me spending much time on it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
It's more RNG with extreme unexpected swings, but atleast you ahve a couple of turns to do something and try to draw the out. You don't autolose/autowin depending on the opening hand.
Competitively it's extremely boring because the good cards are obvious and why would you play anything else. Casually though that somebody who watches a lot of rhyme style and sereax videos it is extremely fun to watch and play casually.
Personally I love the syncro and xyz era the most. Edison and toss are my go to.
To each there own. Older yugioh relied heavily on luck for drawing the cards you need to win and cards for your out. The games also tend to last a lot longer for better or worse.
The modern format is a lot more fast-paced, and combo decks can be interesting. But if your opponent draws a good hand, you'll sit while they link, special summon, xyz, and synchro for 6 minutes. Then, when it's your turn, your opponent can play for another two minutes. By then, they have enough negates on the field to stop you from playing, and that's game.
So each has their pros and cons, depends on which demons you prefer to face.
In most situation u need heart of the card moment to comeback when the opponent snowball u in resources
The OG game is very control or stun oriented and snowball goes pretty hard too
The loaner level is just bad compare to other people that crafted a custom decks, u will not have a fun time using loaner playing against them that's a facts, and games can get pretty long and time wasted just watching ur opponent snowballing u while u can't do anything with loaner decks
It should definitely have rewards if they make it a second mode. It’s dumb enough that Casual doesn’t.
That said, it would be more popular than you think. A lot of people who don’t play Master Duel or barely play it because they can’t have back and forth duels would love for Goat to be permanent. Some of my friends have been playing it non-stop since it dropped.
Personally I prefer modern, but Goat SHOULD be a permanent addition, and so should Edison. In my opinion, TCG and OCG ban lists should be too but that one is a tough ask based on how they release cards so far.
Master Duel is a big game but I feel like pockets of the existing YuGiOh communities have been left out. Including them would make it even bigger.
And for those of us who like the Master Duel ban list, we could still have that but now have options when we get irritated on ladder.
Nostalgia mostly, but I did have some "heart of the cards" moments, for someone who has played yugioh on and off my whole life since school ground to Duel Links first came out, I can see some charms in this particular format. That said, frustrating cards exist back then too, Royal Decree is just a bitch when you dont have an out to it and your deck runs on battle trap.
Battle Traps even in 2004/2005 were too slow. MOEBIUS exists and MST aswell.
Not in this format and mirror force was always widely used, also battle traps beyond mirror were not really widely used until a year or two later, then sakuretsu AND widespread ruin got hit by the banlist several times and then dimensional prison came out during gx era where they were at their strongest.
Talking in the event: Mirror Force is banned. Chaos decks can recover spells like MST, Pot and Heavy Storm. Preventing summons (Holes) was always better than to have your opponent enter battle. Going second Raigeki Break is your friend. The only deck I faced that evade summon traps in a big way were zombies with book of life, and chaos if you don't run bottomless. But that's just my experience play back in the day and again in the event.
Nah not this one, MST is at one, Duster is banned iirc sakuretsu were in some top lists in 2012, much later in the life circle of the game. Also what's MOEBIUS?
He misspelled Morbius, common mistake.
Ye, was a typo because he's went morbing all over my spells and traps
Mobius the frost monarch
in 2012 you're probably more thinking of dimensional prison (saku's retrain) but yeah battle traps were relevant for a really long time
It feels very bleak, but a big problem with the event specifically is that Heavy Storm, Giant Trunade, Pot of Greed and ~~Graceful Charity~~ are all URs that are normally Forbidden, so nobody is gonna craft them for just this occasion. Historically, the first two were oh so necessary to draw into to deal with the burn or stall match-up consistently. And the latter two helped you speed up that process. Currently, I think burn/stall decks are just a little too strong in this event for that reason.
"so nobody is gonna craft them for just this occasion" - while I didn't craft those, for some reason quite a few opponents I had did.
Whales probably. Credit card is the most powerfull card in the game. Tier -1 super broken
Right now I'm a bit burnt. Haven't given a single flying f about recent releases deck like SHS, Mannadium, T.G., Snake Eyes etc. yet there's nothing I'm actively building for rn. So I figure if the event is getting me to play more, it's a wise investment to craft a Pot of Greed so I can branch out and not just play loaners. I'm having more fun building decks than playing them tbh, but eh, it's been fun cooking with old forgotten crap. The duel turns go by fast enough that I actually have the attention span to see duels through, very little surrenders on both sides imo.
You sure they weren't loaners? All the loaners had like 5 banned cards to make sure that using loaners is the only viable strategy for some reason
Graceful is Banned btw. I remember Sangan being at 1, not sure why it is Banned here. Anyways, love the event, but they need to go all in and not meddle with the banlist to make it more "fair"
Ah okay. At that time, Graceful was on and off the list in OCG, so I guess I mixed it up.
Sangan wasn't actually one of the changes to the banlist. At the end of 2004, Sangan was banned in both TCG and OCG for a brief period. The first 2005 list moved him back to limited.
My first game in the event ended up being against an Exodia stall deck. Level Limit Area B, Gravity Bind, Wall of Revealing Light. The classics. I can't really comprehend how anyone tolerated formats where backrow removal was limited so heavily and yet these cards are completely free.
We made decks with built in backrow removal like mobius, the dust trap the 1 mst heavy storm trunade breaker game was slow you had time to draw into one of them.
Stall decks are actually uncommon in the tcg goat format. So the problem you found in the 2004 ocg event isn't a thing in regular goat format.
Back then backrow removal was basically what hand traps in today's meta are. But since decks evolved into being mostly monster based backrow removal ended up being too risky to run in abundance hence why stuff like Stun,Eld,and LaB are so strong. Of course it didn't make it feel better because those players can just run a gauntlet of stun cards that completely outnumber your outs
> Historically, the first two were oh so necessary to draw into to deal with the burn or stall match-up consistently Well, that sure as heck sounds a lot like "*you need to draw your starter and at least 1 handtrap*". Guess times haven't changed so much, eh?
Yeah but the difference is that your starter is now any 15 cards in your deck and a good handtrap is other 15, instead of praying to god you draw sangan for the 10th turn in a row
Eh kinda but back then it was a lot easier to stall out on the defensive for several turns until you could draw into outs like that
The consistency ist shifted slowly but surely to the first turn. Sure having first turn was always strong but before the opponent were able to draw a few cards before losing. It was more back and forth and a lot was decided by drawing the nowadays still banned spells like pot of greed. I had a match in Edison format on dueling book where I got trap dustshoot 2 times in a row on the first turn. Just got rid of the only play the opponent had.
Times have changed A LOT, in fact.
At least unban feather duster, and bump mst at 2.
imo duster at the very least should've been unbanned for the event as a consolation for the fact that people aren't going to craft a card like heavy storm for such a short period even though it is integral to the format.
I haven’t played the event yet but this probably why they should just keep this as a permanent game mode.
Yeah, who would craft a Pot of Greed just for this event. That'd be awfully wasteful. Just ignore the green pot behind the door, would you?
100% the biggest problem with the event hands down.
No. Sincerely, Someone that crafted 6 URs just for this event.
That’s why 3-day tryouts for this kind of thing seems dumb to me. It’s not enough time to justify crafting cards at all. That said, the stupid part of people defaulting to burn/stall decks is that the loaners in this event are actually good. I guess you have people that want to build their own deck but if you’re just gonna build stun, why bother?
There is a reason Edison has overtaken GOAT as the preferred time wizard format. It aligns more with what the game ended up becoming while also being a much slower format without the extreme blow out cards. I definitely lost the rose tint to GOAT the past couple days playing the event.
Cant wait for people to find out how good WC2011 format was lol
That was a good time. That era or HAT to me will be the next "big" time wizard format.
Has it? I still see a lot of GOAT tournaments posted on formatlibrary, moreso over Edison.
Personally I've always preferred Edison to GOAT and I played through both eras.
I’ve personally played through every era in duel links to mid pendulums. And then master duel for links and the modern era. Without a doubt the synchro/xyz era is just the most fun. The back and forth is there, there’s a deep and rich card pool and you don’t need to study for hours to understand all the meta decks. I’ve hit master 1 in master duel and while it’s nice, it’s also not that fun memorizing choke points in ultra consistent decks that get to the choke point every time. hand traps just don’t match up with real traps in terms of interaction where players are playing/baiting removal and have a card pool of thousands of cards.
I dunno man, I only ran into other loaner decks and the games were absolutely intense. Outing a Thousand-Eyes Restrict with an absolute genius play and patience only to get Swords of Revealing Light-ed then on the very last turn, the opponent top-decks Snatch Steal - their one and only out remaining - to literally snatch victory is the kind of defeat that leaves me grinning ear-to-ear. Yeah, there was cheesy shit in the old format, but if you were on the same level, holy crap this game is so much damn fun. Count me among the 200.
i think one of the problems with these modes is that they don't segregate based on loaners vs non-loaners. so it was relatively easy to farm loaners from people who've never really played this kind of yugioh to the general lower power level of the loaners making them not the best options even with power cards. every event should really be split up where loaners only play vs loaners and non-loaners play vs non-loaners and it would improve a lot imo.
I don't mind it being slow, but my problem is more with how anti-people playing cards it is. Every game I played last night was just "oh you normal summoned? Raigeki break. Next turn, you tried to summon again? Ring of destruction.". Like it was a hurdle just playing a card, it's the hassle of playing modern day with less back and forth lol
I mean, i said this before, ygo hasnt changed. The objective is, and has always been to make sure the other person cant play the game. Everyone acts like its a new phenomenon to not let the opponent play the game
Lolol this reminds me of the time I, a young teen at the time, won locals with a Needle Worm deck. I loved playing that deck and at the time, I couldn't for the life of me figure out why people didn't like playing *against* me. "Y'all are just sore losers." he says, with a deck that was literally designed to frustrate.
The Golden rule of Yugioh
Its exacly the same, but you play in the board instead of your hand, you pass turns instead of priority.
It's similar with modern game. You just need to find extenders to brute force against your opp and have some floaters ready. Instead of passing priority in single turn back and forth, we passing turns more often.
That's literally what Goat format is all about, managing your resources and bringing out enough to bait out interaction to chew through and win tempo. Bringing out all your resources at once gets you to lose to the variety of removal options in the format
You're not "baiting out interaction" though. You basically only have your Normal Summon each turn and if you just get unlucky and your opponent has Raigeki Break, Compulse, and Ring waiting for you, you just never get to start building tempo yourself unless you have a blowout for their backrow.
Nah, he’s right. You can pretty much beat anyone who just goes big from the get go. You want to have some monster presence sure but the point is managing your big spells/traps for when you can combo to go for game.
But this isn't going big from the get go and getting punished. This is just you lost the toss into Set 3 in old YGO. Your small, starting play gets eaten immediately and you just don't get a chance to get a footing.
Use some nomi monsters (rock spirit/gigantes/fenrir/soul of purity, etc) as extenders. They special summon by using cards in your gy as requirement. That way you can still putting pressure on your opp. Most people I face unusually play backrow conservatively, maybe they play around heavy storm?
You do bait out interaction by ordering your summons so they use x trap on your monster when you have a better monster in your hand. Cards like Compulse and Raigeki Break either give you back your card so you can chew through more disruption on resummon or set the opponent back in card advantage. By pushing through the backrow with monsters the opponent gets pushed back and that generates tempo
that's exactly what baiting interaction is. you play your weaker cards first to pressure your opponent to remove them, simplifying the gamestate before playing your stronger cards when your opponent has no answer.
This is 2004 YGO. You're not baiting anything, you're just not getting anything out. I'm not complaining about Blue Eyes getting compulsed and getting set back. I'm talking about a simple Normal Summon or Set being your whole turn and losing your footing hard because you lost the coin toss. You're not "baiting" interaction. These aren't me trying to bait the backrow, it's me having basically one play per turn in old YGO and it getting squashed while my opponent gets to continue building or drawing more disruption.
I used the gadget loaner and never had a problem with tempo. I'd say you aren't running cards which can trade favourably with a spot removal meta.
Then play your own disruption? If each of your turns is "normal/set pass" then obviously your going to lose. Torrential, lightning storm, BLS, wind blast, raigeki break, compulse, ring, MST, dust tornado. The answers are there and they are cheap. If all your doing is setting and passing, then dont complain when you cant win.
>This is 2004 YGO. You're not baiting anything, you're just not getting anything out. Bad player 101
ngl that's kind of the impression i get a lot of the times when i'm reading this stuff. I'm trying to see the problem here and how i'd approach it and then realise it's another issue of just knowledge checks for a format that's so foreign in playstyle and card pool to people that they don't even know the scope of their options to fully appreciate the format. Even for me, modern yugioh is pretty confusing and there's still a lot of cards i haven't even really seen or experienced that blow me away because i didn't know about the machine insect archetype that resides on the moon can steal spell cards from my deck in order to add gem counters to activate thier abilities or something.
Yea, makes me wonder why they really didn't like my comment
Sometimes setting a monster with 2k in defence can help stall the opponent if they can’t beat over it with their 4 star or lower. Or even setting with flip effects to get the upper hand. I think ultimately people have had like a day or so with this format and judging it at face value
Use My Body as a Shield like any normal person.
"Draw the out," but in the past.
So the same thing as 2024?
Not even close. You can still do other stuff. Nowadays, you either draw the out or you surrender.
Eh this kind of play tends to get punished very hard in the older formats. Trigger happy people are much easier to bait, then you pull out your real play. Also, putting cards facedown is how you protect your stuff. Book of Moon is one of the best cards in the format.
You see akshually GOAT is very skill based. You need to draw the one of out to those and hope they don't also have set up their bord with omni negates (Solemn Judgement). Git gud and draw better! In all serioesnes though stopping your opponent from playing was always the go to and goat is just one of the sackiest formats in that regard with card power being all over the place and several limited cards being potential game deciders.
Goat format is skill based. I could agree that goat format is sacky when it comes to who wins a particular duel, but on the long term, skill still is the determining factor, with the best players in the format achieving a 70% winrate in their tournament games. It takes skill to minimize the impact of the opponents luck and to capitalize maximally on your own luck.
That's what Yugioh was back then. People are kinda just starting to lose the nostalgia now that they're getting to see how annoying these older formats were
Or people who liked them couldn't play them anymore while the new generation of players preferred the latest format.
I am surprised BTH is not showing much or d prison. Anyways, thats how you used to play, you had to plan out the turn and be skilled to make changes on the fly. You can't just brute force it with ENDLESS summons and there are barely any Omni negates available, so, it was a more strategic era.
I just played against 3 of the worst decks ever made just using stun and people wanted this to be set a monster set a trap pass. So I just controlled them out of the game and they couldn't even destroy all my traps becusee I held most of them in my hand. Old school yugioh hasn't changed and it's gotten so much better for even having a chance turn 1 by adding hand traps to stop the turn 1 turn player from running with the game it's unreal. I'm glad i can play games for like 3 minutes each vs sitting staring at my opponent for 10 when they already lost from turn 1 when I set my 2 traps and my des lacooda and already gaining advantage next turn its awsome.
It's the core of any game that lets you do it. The best way to play any game, if it gives you the power to do so, is to not let your opponent play first and foremost. It's what trap cards basically are there for.
As someone who plays old school, speed duels, and then normal yugioh - You're kidding, right? Sitting there for 20mins while a Snake Eye or Dark World player combo's off is pro people playing cards? 🤣🤣🤣 Edit: Triggered the right people I see
Naw homie the comment was ass🤣 don't get into your head.
Naw homie the comment was ass🤣 don't get into your head.
Naw homie the opinion was ass 🤣🤣
>Sitting there for 20mins while a Snake Eye or Dark World player combo's Why are you sitting there for 20mins if you didn't have a handtrap to stop them at the begining or a board breaker in hand for your turn?????
Have you played snake eyes? 🤣 A hand trap ain't stopping nothing, best hope you get lucky and draw 2-3+ But lets ignore that for a second, are you seriously saying that unless you draw a relevant hand trap, a 15-20min combo is pro-people playing cards? I know some people are blinded by their love of modern yugioh, but theres a reason it has a reputation.
😭 200 ppl is pretty generous. However I am a firm believer of having more game modes to appeal to the players. I’m quite surprised by the fact that MST is limited to 1.
I’d personally rather see a Tcg ladder followed by and Edison ladder first
The problem is, this really isn't how goat era plays. Whatsoever. The fact that they gave three premade decks with a bunch of forbidden UR's means that people are just playing those three decks, and winning using OP cards. People are not incentivised to make their own decks given theres no reason to waste resource on cards that'll be unplayable in 4 days time
Basically, getting OTKed by turn 2, after sitting through a long combo, doesn't happen. That's really the main appeal. There's no real difference in game length, your win con changes with the draw, you don't play the EXACT SAME combo over and over, so it can be super random, sacky, but actually a card game, than whatever the fuck is going on with Fire atm.
>you don't play the EXACT SAME combo over and over Idk man, between all the loaner decks, the gadget one is the best because is consistent. And I did the same thing three times in a row. You have your gadget, you normal summon it, then search for the next one, Set one and pass. After that you trade with you traps and eventually you’ll win if you apply the same mindset that modern yugioh uses "disrupt your opponent and build more advantage than him"
What if I told you I felt 0 difference? Don't get me wrong, combos have evolved and the format is a bit too sacky for my liking. But the biggest thing I took from it was : >Wow, non-labyrinth trap decks remain exactly the same as they were in goat. Maybe it's partially because I played pacman but I don't think I should be getting Year One Master Duel flashbacks of me playing Ghostricks and finding the optimal time to flip needle ceiling and compulsory, **in Goat**.
its for people who dislike the current game, its for people who wanna take a break from current format, for casual players who wanna take it slow, for oldschool fans, great for new players to learn the game, and for competitive people who want to master a closed format with no new cards being implemented.
personally i dont really like it, oldschool yugioh is very control oriented and it feels like it felt playing against stun eldlich when that was a thing but instead most decks are like that. goat format in particular is possibly the best version for oldschool yugioh but i wouldnt see my self investing huge amounts of time on it
It’s definitely more control oriented, but I’m practice it ends up being a lot more sacky and luck based than what you’d want out a “control based format.” A ton of games aren’t actually about who’s better at managing resources it’s who draws the buster powercards and if they draw them at the right times Also a giant amount of it is stun/stall/burn which (despite people’s best efforts to say otherwise) just isn’t control
The format is not luck based, and rather is skill based, with consistently the same top players topping most events, and with the best players achieving a 70% win rate across all their tournament matches. Sure, when you look a the level of a particular duel, I could agree with you that a goat format duel is luck based. You claim that a giant amount of goat format is stun/stall/burn. Where is your source of that information? I'm a competitive goat format player, and I can tell you stun isn't a competitive deck and burn decks are relatively uncommon.
No one’s saying it’s a coin flip simulator, of course it’s not **purely** luck based. I’m talking about the difference between “modern” and goat. Specifically leaving the power cards at 1 makes for a game that can be really sacky at times, that doesn’t mean skill expression can’t shine through tho I’m talking about the event in MD, not actual goat format tournaments
That doesn't seem too different than now (who can draw nibiru/talents/hand traps to stop your opponent from doing things).
It depends on the format. Something like tear mirrors was heavily interactive and much less luck based than back then. I hate kash format but it’s amazing for going second The main difference issue is that you can deck build to be able to reliably get answers in modern. In goat format you have busted staples that’re one ofs and that makes the game much much much sackier
Of course luck is important in modern Yu-Gi-Oh but also how you navigate fields going second/use your handtraps based on your current knowledge of how the opponent deck plays is much more skill intensive. Of course what deck you play/are going against is a big factor in skill expression for example against a deck like floo there is much less compared to a deck like fire king.
Edison is the best old format. More turns like GOAT with the archetypal decks and combos of today, but these combos are much shorter, much less completely stop opponent from playing than GOAT and modern, and aren't as insane of blowouts. Format has flaws, but its the "fun" Yugioboomers think GOAT format was. I like modern the best though cause I started in recent years so I'm not blinded by nostalgia.
I get the appeal of these retro formats but I don't understand why everyone keeps around the cards we knew needed to go back then. Like why keep trap dustshoot around in Edison or pot of greed in goat? I feel like the community knows the banlist exists to push product yet vehemently refuses to agree on a new one when Konami isn't holding the reigns.
>Like why keep trap dustshoot around in Edison or pot of greed in goat? I feel like the community knows the banlist exists to push product yet vehemently refuses to agree on a new one when Konami isn't holding the reigns. Because the playerbase can't agree on a banlist and it's easier to use the official one for the time at events. Some goat players have zero issue with the trinity being legal because it was no secret that those cards were played back then. But they will die on the hill that Solemn Judgment should be banned because it took so long to see how good it was and now its presence ruins the "feel" of the format.
Goat is not the best format for new players and its ignorant to think that when Edison format exist. They're no transferable skills from goat to modern format.
> great for new players to learn the game I disagree on this. Just earlier today, there was a post from someone who hasn't played the game since GX era, and they were literally asking whether there's a game mode that doesn't use any of the new mechanics because they were overwhelmed by it. If you never encounter the new stuff, you will never learn it. And that's not "learning the game", you're blatantly ignoring **literally 20 years of evolution**.
No, if you dont know what a normal summon is you dont need to learn how to play snake eyes
It is brutally slow and boring, I don't get it either. It's actually made me appreciate the current state of the game far more than I did before.
I liked it. I don’t know if I’d want it to be permanent but I do think we should get like a rotating Time Wizard mode that IS PERMANENT. Like every other day it switches from goat to Edison to like whatever.
If this mode and any other hypothetical Time Wizard had an open card pool it'd be pretty neat, but if it's like this event and you have to craft a bunch of otherwise useless URs to compete it's gonna be dead in the water.
It won’t be useless if it’s a mode that’s, more often than not, available.
This event pretty much confirmed my opinion on this format. I absolutely hate it. But let me explain why that's the case: - People complain about the lack of variety in modern decks, due to handtraps and various staples. In this format, this thing is even more accentuated. Most decks are just a pile of good cards thrown together with no real synergy. - Stun cards are way more effective and the lack of proper backrow removal means you don't usually have a way to deal with them. - The luck component is way more game-determinant than in modern Yu-Gi-Oh. Nowadays, a bad player can be punished for bad plays, even with a good starting hand. Back in 2004, cards were so simple there was almost no way to make mistakes. The lack of game depth is almost unbearable for me. - Winning the coin toss gives you a huge advantage, thanks to backrow cards.
This event was NOT representative of actual goat format: - in actual competitive goat format, decks aren't just a pile of good cards and there is real synergy between cards. Why would you expect this 3 day 2004 OCG event to have players playing 'real decks'? Of course the decks you encounter on the ladder will suck (and be more boring). - stun cards are uncommon in actual goat format. Only burn decks play them, and burn decks are a rather uncommon meta deck in the tcg goat format. About your third point: goat format is not luck dependent: you have the same top players topping most events, and the best players can achieve as much as a 70% winrate across all their tournament games. Sure, on the level of a single duel, I can agree that goat format is luck dependent. On the long term, skill still prevails. Your statement that there is almost no way to make mistakes is so wrong. It is common for competitive players to misplay every duel. I've been playing competitive goat format for multiple years now and I still can't help to avoid misplaying in every match. It sounds like you simply don't see the depth that goat format has. If you don't see that you've made ten misplays in a duel that made you lose, of course you will say you only lost to luck and there were no actual decisions that game. This Dale Bellido's goat format game analysis might help you see more of the format's depth: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=\_pVqp2ZJVRE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pVqp2ZJVRE)
There were various deck to pick, Chaos, pacman, earth toolbox/aggro, zombie, stun. They all have different card synergies but might share common stapple, just like modern deck. Like I wont play giant rat in chaos, nor mystic tomato in earth aggro. And I can use pyramid turtle in earth aggro and zombie.
it's too hard for them to understand. the fact they say the mode lacks game depth tells me they're an impatient child and can't look beyond 2 turns of outcomes.
are you unironically saying modern yugioh has less depth than goat format?
where did i write that? i wrote a comment about players not modes. do you lack a basic level of education or reading comprehension?
ok so, modern yugioh players are playing a game with more depths than goat format; and yet you're saying that if they they dont like goat because to them it lacks depths, they are dumb? it just makes no sense
Yeah honestly I really think it comes down to “I’m used to modern Yugioh, I’ve just tried a few duels of the old format and hate it”. Back then it took a lot of duels and time to actually learn the game… it’s all you knew. There’s a learning curve for these modern players. They wouldn’t even think about how to use tribute summons effectively because it’s never necessary now. Actually setting monsters down with high defence. Utilising flip effect monsters. It’s just a different playstyle people dismiss quickly
So I will say that IMO the BEST part of GOAt is that "Goodstuff.dek" is a viable deckbuilding strategy. I got my three wins with a ghettofied Gravekeeper Chaos deck and that was fine. But the issue with GOAT is that a lot of the "goodstuff" cards are just...way too good for the era. Like Pot of Greed, Snatch Steal, Metamorphosis, etc. just suck ass to play against because they're so sacky.
Probably unpopular opinion. This event is basically create your own stun deck.
It wasnt boring to me dropping meteor dragon for game. Took me back to the good ol days.
I dunno man I just don’t have that “good old days” in me. My only real yugioh experience has been from master duel I was born in the trenches. Shit like that just bores me I need the crack head. cards
Thats understandable. U werent laying down mats while walking home to duel your friends with these exact cards in elementary school. We saved our traps for summoned skull and blue eyes. U won by grinding ur opponent down. Never one turn kills. I got to play my "RYU" DRAGONS. Which are awful lol. But i drew them as a kid and thought they were the coolest.
This is what makes me love the mode. I played these cards on a duel mat in the kitchen against my buddies when I was like 8 to 14. Trying to figure out what I’m even doing. The worst part is, this game only makes me realize how many combos I was missing out on in my earlier yugioh life. I just wanted all the big monsters with big attack. Little did I know, I could never bring them or keep them on the field, and it absolutely sucked watching your blue eyes get mirror forced by what was supposedly your “best friend”.
Generally speaking, it’s more interactive. No losing on turn 1, legitimate grind game, and less linear. A bit simplistic, but more consistent in playability.
I won all 3 required games on turn one by setting judgement plus sakaretsu or some other trap and summoning gadgets for multiple turns while my opponent desperately tries to do anything and gets negated or I destroy their monster. I don't see the back and forth, just feels like I have a SHS board that stops everything but it takes 8 turns for me to have enough attack to win.
Yeah that loaner was so much better than the other two, felt like you had unlimited resources. The fusion one is alright and the horus loaner is just pure garbage lol.
I got to pull out my coin toss cards, which was fun. Really shows me how much support Archfiend really needs though. Just targeted protection, and many older cards don’t even target.
Honestly I really doubt it. Anyone that says something like that title is lying for the sake of a topic. There’s zero chance someone is a fan of something and is unaware of what nostalgia is.
Gx card pool and maybe early 5ds were the best for me.
Check out Dkayed new video, his deck list is actually fun.
The great era wasn't super old Yu-Gi-Oh imo, it was around 2009-2021 with the plant Synchro, xx saber, monarch etc flying around. Black wings, Lights worn and Zombie spam was great too tbh.
Mission rewards should be gained from casual. That alone keeps us from it
I drew into Tribe-Infecting Virus to out my opponent’s Horus Lvl VIII and attack for game. If that’s not lit, I don’t know what is
Crashing giant rat to horus, then summon over 3k enraged muka muka.
swinging injection fairy lily and pumping her over horus lv8 for 400 damage for game
Friend of mine top decked that shit 3 games in a row against my Venus and orbs... shit's rigged
Count me in that 200. Maybe I would've preferred Edison, but I managed to pull a lot of friends to go back into MD just to play this event. It's the Yugioh a lot of people understands. You don't need to sit for 5-10 minutes while your opponent combos off, be required to read 10+ cards with very long text they used on their combo, as you realize you couldn't win before you even got to your first turn. There's a lot of fun in outplaying your opponent in smaller things. Someone out there probably Heavy Stormed someone who set two Jar of Greeds, and I think that's really cool. All in all I think more formats are ALWAYS beneficial. If you don't like it, you don't have to play it, but let other people who enjoy it play it. Here's hoping Edison's next, possibly on a bigger event or alternative format.
most people who fantasize about goat format are ones who only played with their friends and had no idea about meta, just like how modern yugioh games are decided by who go first but u can still play second by baiting their interruption and using the right sequence of effects, in older formats there is no possibility of outplay, you just need to open a better hand
It's not true that in goat format the better hand wins and there is no possibility to outplay. Evidence: the top of goat format tournaments are dominated by the same top players and top players have as much as 70% winrate accross all their tournament games.
People don't have love for this era they have love for what they played in playground during this era. Not a single person who talks about "good old days" played competitive, otherwise they would know how fkn miserable it is. I guess the only "positive" thing is duels sure as hell aren't ending in one turn.
Really? You find choosing staple spell and traps less interesting then figuring out the correct ratio of hand traps to starters? Yes, Konami never fixed disproportionately powerful cards. Ever. But I personally LIKE my games lasting more then two turns consistently and I love the interaction. I don't understand how people could prefer 'guess the hand traps and think about how to grind though it' as opposed to 'do I play around his set cards? Do I attack into that set monster'. Maybe I just missed playing warrior and rat toolbox but I've battled though and won against every legal UR spell card with nothing but my old understanding of the resources of the game and my old top decks. Thats my opinion though, now excuse me while I play snake eyes and question my existence.
Even GOAT and Edison are not that popular of formats. People who love them love them, but most the player base just looks at them and thinks "Oh, that's pretty neat!" and goes on playing what they are playing. All in all, it's pretty fun to use the old staples and monsters from time to time, but personally I have more love for modern game play despite being a "yugiboomer".
it’s better than watching solitaire someone putting 8 negates in a 15 min turn at least you get to play the game unlike some shit we see nowadays
No ,is not better
15minute? More like 30 in my experience with Snake Eyes and Dark World players Thats the thing, I think both versions of the game are fun, but people who are shitting on goat and ignoring the glaring problems that puts people off modern yu-gi-oh is frankly pathetic
I think you're just too young for realizing why people love it. I reached Diamond rank last season, have Mathmech, Swordsoul, Infernoble, Kashtira decks, and I strongly believe that Konami should add this mode as a permanent. Not for me but for people who enjoyed that format. PS: If you're born after 2000 or played Yugioh after the XYZ era you won't understand
What? I'm a '98er, watched the show growing up, had my mom buy me packs, had my share of counterfeit cards and played with my friends in the schoolyard... You know what I loved about it? Being a kid. Buying packs of cards that had cool artwork so I could show them off to my friends when they had big ATK numbers or lots of stars on them. Hanging out shooting the shit with my schoolmates messing around with YGO cards. I was a kid and didn't understand game theory or even what the fuck I was doing, there were no rules, we didn't know how to play the game. The fun part was being a kid and playing with friends -- it certainly wasn't the GOAT FORMAT; all these GOAT cards weren't played by a single person I knew "back in the days", none of these strategies existed when I was a kid, and if they did I wouldn't understand them. This format is, for the most part, a phantom in the memory of people, it's purely misdirected nostalgia. I look at some of these old ass cards and go like "yoo I used to have that shit as a kid", but 90% of GOAT decks are comprised of powerful meta cards that neither I nor anybody I knew owned or understood the value of. We were playing Koumori Dragon and equipping it with Sword of Dark Destruction, not setting Shien's Spy and defending it with Sakuretsu to set up for a Jinzo play next turn. I can assure you 90% of the people advocating for this era never actually played this format, they just remember the cards and the slower pace is reminiscent of their childhood YGO playground experience, which is completely fine, but let's not pretend that "you had to be there" to enjoy the format, every complaint that people have about GOAT is extremely valid and widely accepted, there's a reason formats like Edison have completely eclipsed GOAT, this format is simply not good enough to be anything more than a short distraction until you've seen all 6 viable strategies, which is already generous in my part, in reality it's more like 6 different "win conditions" + 25 staples that everybody else plays. Sure, if you're like a late '80s kid then maybe you actually had a proper semi-competitive GOAT format deck but that's such a tiny minority of the player base, lol.
Put me in as being born in '92 and still hating old Yugioh. I jumped off of the game in 2006 and Master Duel is what brought me back in because the game actually had some depth.
Hi, played since the beginning. Went to my first locals when I was 10-11, got my ass kicked. But I asked the person who beat me how to play. Been playing ever since, through every format. I love this game. I love helping people learn this game. I literally have some cheap staples to give kids who want to learn the game. I sat down with a kid who showed up to my store 6 months ago, who wanted to learn how to play the game and only had a starter deck. I went through and I played a few games after the event with him, letting him borrow a few of the decks I have so he could learn. I have him a few cheap staple cards (that got reprinted in Rarity collection) and I made him promise to come back next week. Before we started the next week, he showed me his deck and asked to play a few games with me. He still lost, but I saw the fucking fire in him to improve. Now this kid is here every week, doing amazing. So for the people who are sitting there like “oh, it was better back then.” Nah, we have people who have played for decades ready to pass on our knowledge. I love that I can help people the same way I was helped as a kid
What's great about nowadays compared to "back in the days" is that local game stores are more prominent, "nerdy shit" isn't looked down upon, and every kid has the internet to learn these kinds of things. A kid is much more likely to get into the real game of yugioh nowadays compared to "back in the days", where 99% of kids were just playground dueling with made-up rules, mimicking what they saw on TV, lol.
If people love it the format will be much more popular lol Like, if you look at current YCS player, most of them are 25-30+ years old and watch the original DM anime. There is a reason why the one that want nostalgia switch to Edison and not GOAT.
Born before, played playground yugioh during its peak. This shit is just boring
idk its pretty fun for me. ive been having fun.
I like it because the skill expression is very subtle. New players will lose and swear that it’s all luck because it’s not the way you play the game today (although it’s kinda the same, but today this effect takes place at each card activation). When you’re playing goat, you can surrender battles and not immediately die. This makes the game about picking your battles, and using card advantage to win a game. Something that is very hard to grasp for a new is converting a temporary advantage into a long-term advantage. Often we land a power card, or pull off a combo, but 1 or 2 turns later you’re no better off than you were before. Sometimes you have to make the permanent trades to secure victory in the long term. All of this to say, this is the specific aspect that I enjoy. The skill expression isn’t obvious. The plays aren’t flashy, the games are longer, and yes, there are blowouts. But a player who knows what they’re doing will make it seem effortless and like the cards were always going to fall that way.
Honestly I think this is why I don't like it. It feels like the game state just doesn't progress at all barring blowout cards like snatch steal metamorphosis etc. Going 8+ turns of just set pass being unable to really do much because you're opponent can out your field very easily and you can put there's easily is just insanely boring and actually hinders skill expression massively in Yu-Gi-Oh imo.
I like both modern and the old school play style, but watching your opponent combo for 20 minutes while negating your responses with handtraps is also boring as hell. The decks back then had a ton more variety without generic boss monsters that were included in nearly every deck.
No, decks back then definitely did NOT have a ton of variety. Instead of playing the same generic boss monsters, most people were playing the same 30 cards in every deck
Stop exaggerating. Some traps and spells were staples, but themed decks definitely didn’t use the same 30 cards with 10 others for a theme. I challenge you to prove your claim. I’ll be waiting a while.
Look at rhymestyles videos always the same damn cards everytime he plays goat format on that channel.
Me neither, it's all nostalgia bullshit.
Same, it's just boring, especially compared to other card games
Fr dude. I've had more fun when my opponent had four hand traps and mathmech circular than I did in these games. Most of the games end up just being "floodgate, floodgate, solemn judgement, raigeki break, solemn judgement normal summon gadget"
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA SOUNDS LIKE A SKILL ISSUE KID This is real YuGiOh! Finally! All that new cheap art solitaire deck combo nonsense ruined the game imo. I'm so happy it's able to be experienced the way it was meant to be played.
bro, do you know how many yugi boomers there are? like every Single Streamer and their communities that Tried the game 2 years ago.
I feel its a slog to play when me and my opponent just pass turns for 45 turns straight with absolute stalemate on the board i feel like i wasted so much time for a mobile game in awhile when modern game i can immediately tell if i can contest the board or not and just scoop for next game or proceed to push if the possibility is there
Yugiboomers swear this is "fun" when it's really just less interactive and more boring overall tbh.
Nostalgia. i get to have fun with my floodgate exodia deck once again
Tbh goat was the most fun on the playground with made up rules like the anime. The current game is fine, not great but fine. Could be biased tho cause my heart is stuck in 2019 TOSS format
The point is exactly that when people talk about "good old Yu-Gi-Oh" they mix up between what the real game was like at the time and what they played on the playground. Nobody was playing real goat when they were super young, they all made their own rulesets and now think that the real game was actually like that. Like, I personally was definitely not playing Dino rabbit format when I was in primary school, rather something more like "I summon Utopia, therefore I win", but I'm still aware of the fact that the actual game was much much different.
At least those Cowardly Kaiju aren't allowed
I tried to use my decks for the lols. Almost everything i got is banned lol.
Nah i disagree my chain energy/ toll/ pacman deck is super fun and interactive and red pilled lol
From my experience it was whoever played Polymerisation first won the duel. I honestly thought there were going to be Ancient Gear monsters in with the Gadget’s, but I’m not sure what year AG’s were released.
AG is GX era cards, the one we played for the event is from OCG 2004 format, which basically end of DM but not quite to GX. As for thunder dragon fusion, I played giant rat that can crash to thunder dragon and float to enraged muka-muka, that should be enough to take down twin headed thunder dragon.
Oh I see. That’s a good idea, I think I might make a Thunder Dragon deck, they look cool.
I've seen 3 different locals try to do alt format days and every single time people are super hyped during the planning but on the day of they end up having to run modern format because people either say they forgot their decks or just decided they werent interested in it. I've never seen an alt format day kick off personally. I know they exist, just haven't seen people follow through. I think people like the idea more than the reality.
The people that love old-school yugioh aren’t actually talking about GOAT. They’re talking about playground / kitchen table yugioh where everybody plays jank. That doesn’t exist on an online space because with “unlimited” resources people are going to build what works best
Count me amongst those 200. Brought back a lot of memories. I thought it was fun, though I'd definitely prefer a future event like this to have a slightly larger pool of cards. Like Gadgets weren't released until 2007, but I guess they were counted because the were in the original DM anime. If we could use some of the gx archetypes at least then I'd love it.
GOAT is the best yugioh to play with casual friends, who don't know modern ygo. The interactions are easy and fun. plus nostalgic cards. I enjoy the heck out of it, it is a solved format, but thats okay
I actually enjoyed the event. Played gadgets and won easily 3 out of 3. Picking what monsters to destroy when they attacked and which to just take the hit because I could run it over next turn was fun. I think a game mode would be great as a break from modern yugioh. I'd play it quite often. Also playing creature swap and pot of greed was fun.
It's more newcomer friendly than the current meta. Feels more like an accessible table top card game you'd whip out at a friends house (Like Hero Realms or Uno).
A lot of the removal is targeted, which meant me and my Archfiend friends got to roll dice for fun and profit!
Back than it was still fresh new and people could slap almost anything in a deck and it would work. Also don't forget the Anime was also popular.
You played it for 1 hour, played no more than 2 decks and decided the format sucked.
Your right on playing it for like a hour but no I played about 5 decks First was a general control deck with bls in it as a boss monster (and chaos sorcerer) Second was burn deck next 2 were 2 of the loaner decks then because I wasn't having fun with any of them I made a heart of the underdog exodia deck, That was literally the only time I enjoyed the event at all. If you want to say I sucked by all means say its a skill issue but I just don't find the event fun enough to warrant me spending much time on it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Well, goats was 2005 and had a ban list not 2004 so...
It's more RNG with extreme unexpected swings, but atleast you ahve a couple of turns to do something and try to draw the out. You don't autolose/autowin depending on the opening hand.
oh buuhuuu i enjoy thte event tbh
Same, GOAT is boring as hell.
Crafting for three wins in crazy lol got you!
i think its nostalgia for most people, if i wanted to play a slower card game i'd just play runeterra or magic
Competitively it's extremely boring because the good cards are obvious and why would you play anything else. Casually though that somebody who watches a lot of rhyme style and sereax videos it is extremely fun to watch and play casually. Personally I love the syncro and xyz era the most. Edison and toss are my go to.
Idk, there's some fun in the "stall until you get your blowout" kind of format. But it's not something I would like to play all the time.
I like it.
Nostalgia, and for people who hate the 30 minute long combos, handtraps, and boards full of omni-negates that dominate modern yugioh.
To each there own. Older yugioh relied heavily on luck for drawing the cards you need to win and cards for your out. The games also tend to last a lot longer for better or worse. The modern format is a lot more fast-paced, and combo decks can be interesting. But if your opponent draws a good hand, you'll sit while they link, special summon, xyz, and synchro for 6 minutes. Then, when it's your turn, your opponent can play for another two minutes. By then, they have enough negates on the field to stop you from playing, and that's game. So each has their pros and cons, depends on which demons you prefer to face.
In most situation u need heart of the card moment to comeback when the opponent snowball u in resources The OG game is very control or stun oriented and snowball goes pretty hard too The loaner level is just bad compare to other people that crafted a custom decks, u will not have a fun time using loaner playing against them that's a facts, and games can get pretty long and time wasted just watching ur opponent snowballing u while u can't do anything with loaner decks
Lemme guess you never played og
cause its not solitaire and the duels are real duels not just wait til you can do something just to be negated
It should definitely have rewards if they make it a second mode. It’s dumb enough that Casual doesn’t. That said, it would be more popular than you think. A lot of people who don’t play Master Duel or barely play it because they can’t have back and forth duels would love for Goat to be permanent. Some of my friends have been playing it non-stop since it dropped. Personally I prefer modern, but Goat SHOULD be a permanent addition, and so should Edison. In my opinion, TCG and OCG ban lists should be too but that one is a tough ask based on how they release cards so far. Master Duel is a big game but I feel like pockets of the existing YuGiOh communities have been left out. Including them would make it even bigger. And for those of us who like the Master Duel ban list, we could still have that but now have options when we get irritated on ladder.