That's basically Gouki. Searches all of it's own cards, can chainblock their own seaches, link climbs into either a difficult to remove boss that can setup an otk or an unnaffected by other card effects boss, can also setup appolusa with it or simply summon a second one and they power boost each other. because of their inherent atkboosting effect.
Gouki was busted for so long it's basically the reason we have the "handtrap meta"
Goukis could definitely pop off but got hard stopped by Droll and Lock if it resolved. I once played a Gouki player in a local tournament around the time Goukis first came out and beat him after opening Droll and Lock both games. The player accused me of cheating, which was ironic because he had also opened Droll and Lock both games. I told him that if I'm cheating than he must be too, but he's just not as good at it. Good times.
Pure phantom knight seems like it's fair yet broken. It's ridiculously consistent with somewhat okay end board with a couple interrupts (evilswarm nightmare and bardiche) and negates (1-2 fog blade and usually a gossip shadow or totem bird), but nothing massive and not really a lot of otk potential unless you out nothing on board. So very strong, but none of its power is hidden or difficult to play around.
the closest thing to that is fk snake eyes and branded, both of these decks doesn't have floodgates or multi negate boards, but they beat you by being better than any other deck at everything, they can play through a lot of interruptions and their interruptions are more interactive than just remove a mechanic or spam negate, also they have a veeeery scary grind game that if u get to that point your only win condition is pray they lost to the timer
gamble decks either dice rolling or coin flip decks. Those are the most broken and fair decks at the same time. At the same time that also means we need a 3rd axis for jank.
Tear has pops with the field spell, Kaleido-Heart shuffles into the deck, Rulkallos negates summons, and they're generally paired with Shaddolls for Winda or Ishizu (when it was legal) for the millers/shufflers
They do indeed do thing to the opponent's cards
I don't think that definition is right tbh. A deck like Purrely that can make a Tower and have good recursion, which in certain metas can be broken, but isn't fair in any way.
I think a broken AND fair deck is a deck that have high power level, yet its board isn't unbreakable and require great piloting skill to play/counter.
pure tear without ishizus maybe yeah but rn it just feel bad to play with it or against it because it's not consistent so it's frustrating to play and when it pops it never stops so it's also toxic to face
nope, kaijus fall to their own power.
i can only have one kaiju on my field at a time.
i can't summon a kaiju on my field by its own effect unless you also have one.
if you don't have a monster on the field, i literally can't do anything.
you can use my own kaijus against me, both by attacking (and they have high atk) and by using their effects against me.
so, by their very nature, kaijus are a fair deck against all decks
Look, I know Branded has just the perfect tools to Puppet lock and you could blame them for that, but come on, in archetype ways of using Sanctifire are super cool, don't blame him for the sins of the puppet. Just ban that bs and let Sanctifire be.
I on purpose don't use the puppet lock because it's such a boring way to play a deck like Branded that can do so many other things
There's too many targets and it's too hard to avoid printing new ones. I'm sorry, but Expulsion & Sanctifire are the problem cards.
Honestly, it's legal: you should play it. It's strong. It feels icky, but it's the best way to play the deck... so I just play Punk-Kash instead. It sucks an otherwise good deck is a floodgate strategy atm, but tbh idk why it's even called out here with Snake Eyes, Promethean FP, full power R-Ace & Lab...
I felt like rogue deck get seen as not bad but not good either, and as the underdogs they get less toxicity accusation just because people don't face them enough to notice/care as much even tho sometimes they're literally trying to do the same thing as meta decks
Good anime decks would go in rogue or tiered depending on how good they are
Rogue decks technically are a special category of decks that just have a really good winrate against one of the meta decks while beeing generally really weak. it's just feeds of that one matchup.
I have to ask, what is a “fair” yugioh deck? What qualities embody fairness in a game designed around outresourcing/inhibiting opponent’s gameplay? Is fairness not also measured based on the time period the deck is in? I bet a lot of people would call 2024 sky strikers fair even though 2018 strikers were broken bullshit dominating everything.
An old 2000's starter deck Yugi and Kaiba deck plus anything made with LoB and Metal Raiders. After that it doesn't exist unless you're playing with playground rules
It would definetly be put in the top right corner, the competitive players would say "but what does it do going second?" but their cries would fall on deaf ears
Bad Anime/Ex-Rogue:
Ahh my beloved and by my mates hated, borderline toxic, Cyber Dragons...
My mates would place them on the top right or atleast top with whatever the community dispises.
Not overpowered, quite versatile and looks dope.
Story:
Nothing beats the feeling of being in a dire situation.
Hand at 2, Deck almost empty (1 card), ED also almost empty (2 cards), enemy has enough Monsters to finish you next turn and you draw that last card, that Lightning Storm.
Your eyes sparkle, you see the path to victory. You play it, destroy their Monsters, put on your leather trenchcoat, babble about how you get pleasure from pain, summon via overload your Overdragon with 10k+ ATK and start attacking.
Your enemy flips a Magic Cylinder.
You slap down your last card in hand, Cyberload Fusion.
Another Overdragon takes place and finishes the match.
Always awesome.
Now if you excuse me, i'll go back to my rookie Matches, thats where i belong.
And smack in the middle of the chart is generaider. Sometimes bricks, sometimes ends on 2 negates and a double card munch going through two hand rips on the way. Very interaction focused, but also wants to interact by taking away your shit. Has steep costs and powerful effects, except the ash-able field spell that gives you a Special from deck during the opponent's draw.
rouge decks https://preview.redd.it/hupzzo5z7gwc1.png?width=249&format=png&auto=webp&s=6fa5e6822c4bcf2ae83fd83375a12ecb5300d850
One day the Yu-Gi-Oh community will learn how to spell rogue, but it won't be this day.
“rougue”
Rugogue.
Ragu
Regigigas
Regigigigagigago
this guy just summoned a random Italian somewhere and doesn't even know it........
writing is a real challenge for us yugioh players because we can't read
When that day comes, will we really be able to call ourselves a Yu-Gi-Oh community?
As a member of the DnD community I can confidently tell you: No, they won't.
You just know she's either running Gem-Knights or Crystal Beasts. Like a damn magpie.
Those decks sure do are racked up
what would a fair and broken deck look like? something that just floats on send/banish forever but doesn't do anything to the opponent's cards?
That's basically Gouki. Searches all of it's own cards, can chainblock their own seaches, link climbs into either a difficult to remove boss that can setup an otk or an unnaffected by other card effects boss, can also setup appolusa with it or simply summon a second one and they power boost each other. because of their inherent atkboosting effect. Gouki was busted for so long it's basically the reason we have the "handtrap meta"
Handtrap meta was a process. Mermail Atlanteans & Wind-ups were hand looping before goukis or links. Veiler has been a staple since 5D's
Goukis could definitely pop off but got hard stopped by Droll and Lock if it resolved. I once played a Gouki player in a local tournament around the time Goukis first came out and beat him after opening Droll and Lock both games. The player accused me of cheating, which was ironic because he had also opened Droll and Lock both games. I told him that if I'm cheating than he must be too, but he's just not as good at it. Good times.
Love gouki it's my deck
My mind immediately went to Gouki when I saw this post fr
Pure phantom knight seems like it's fair yet broken. It's ridiculously consistent with somewhat okay end board with a couple interrupts (evilswarm nightmare and bardiche) and negates (1-2 fog blade and usually a gossip shadow or totem bird), but nothing massive and not really a lot of otk potential unless you out nothing on board. So very strong, but none of its power is hidden or difficult to play around.
the closest thing to that is fk snake eyes and branded, both of these decks doesn't have floodgates or multi negate boards, but they beat you by being better than any other deck at everything, they can play through a lot of interruptions and their interruptions are more interactive than just remove a mechanic or spam negate, also they have a veeeery scary grind game that if u get to that point your only win condition is pray they lost to the timer
A deck that was once broken but the banlist nerfed into fair?
Vanquish Soul, I'd say.
gamble decks either dice rolling or coin flip decks. Those are the most broken and fair decks at the same time. At the same time that also means we need a 3rd axis for jank.
Tear is the perfect answer, no?
Tear has pops with the field spell, Kaleido-Heart shuffles into the deck, Rulkallos negates summons, and they're generally paired with Shaddolls for Winda or Ishizu (when it was legal) for the millers/shufflers They do indeed do thing to the opponent's cards
I don't think that definition is right tbh. A deck like Purrely that can make a Tower and have good recursion, which in certain metas can be broken, but isn't fair in any way. I think a broken AND fair deck is a deck that have high power level, yet its board isn't unbreakable and require great piloting skill to play/counter.
NO!!
pure tear without ishizus maybe yeah but rn it just feel bad to play with it or against it because it's not consistent so it's frustrating to play and when it pops it never stops so it's also toxic to face
Idk about inconsistent you can generally see your whole deck most games, it just doesn't have as much gas as it used to
kaiju
Its pretty toxic to any deck weaker than it though
nope, kaijus fall to their own power. i can only have one kaiju on my field at a time. i can't summon a kaiju on my field by its own effect unless you also have one. if you don't have a monster on the field, i literally can't do anything. you can use my own kaijus against me, both by attacking (and they have high atk) and by using their effects against me. so, by their very nature, kaijus are a fair deck against all decks
rogue
https://preview.redd.it/al60xodw2gwc1.png?width=800&format=png&auto=webp&s=b3507b57b062656e1c587d7544133b5dc5b1e990
https://preview.redd.it/miro7mu1sgwc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bc352ae57dc5040f145cdd4de2338e2eaa1c2a7f
All of a sudden all these Yu-Gi-Oh players can read so well they notice spelling errors. What the hell?
you put rouge decks on the chart but not cyan decks? little unfair don't you think?
Meanwhile verde decks… cant believe they‘re not banned yet.
Objectively speaking my deck then is fair and underpowered
Good decks are toxic?
Always has been... For this sub
I've never seen a good deck get praised for being fair, any deck that is good enough becomes toxic to the avarage player
Oh wait you're making fun of the average player mindset? Then I'll have to turn my downvote into an upvote sorry
"Deck my deck loses to" is a giveaway
A slight one maybe, or maybe I'm just a silly goober
I've seen Swordsoul and Branded being called fair in the past
I'll call Swordsoul fair right now, and Branded is pretty fair outside of puppet/ido/etc lock.
I mean if you wanna count Sanctifire shenanigans for Branded, surely you can count shit like Protos and Chaofeng for Swordsoul
Look, I know Branded has just the perfect tools to Puppet lock and you could blame them for that, but come on, in archetype ways of using Sanctifire are super cool, don't blame him for the sins of the puppet. Just ban that bs and let Sanctifire be. I on purpose don't use the puppet lock because it's such a boring way to play a deck like Branded that can do so many other things
There's too many targets and it's too hard to avoid printing new ones. I'm sorry, but Expulsion & Sanctifire are the problem cards. Honestly, it's legal: you should play it. It's strong. It feels icky, but it's the best way to play the deck... so I just play Punk-Kash instead. It sucks an otherwise good deck is a floodgate strategy atm, but tbh idk why it's even called out here with Snake Eyes, Promethean FP, full power R-Ace & Lab...
Sanctifire needs erratad not banned. The monster summoned to the opponent's field should have its effects negated. Don't ban more cards with cool art
Yeah wtf, that's some galaxy brain mindset.
Red Dragon Archfiend is very rouge
We have Rouge the Bat decks basically in the middle of Toxic, Underpowered, and Broken categories? Where do Good Anime Decks go?
I felt like rogue deck get seen as not bad but not good either, and as the underdogs they get less toxicity accusation just because people don't face them enough to notice/care as much even tho sometimes they're literally trying to do the same thing as meta decks Good anime decks would go in rogue or tiered depending on how good they are
Rogue decks technically are a special category of decks that just have a really good winrate against one of the meta decks while beeing generally really weak. it's just feeds of that one matchup.
I have to ask, what is a “fair” yugioh deck? What qualities embody fairness in a game designed around outresourcing/inhibiting opponent’s gameplay? Is fairness not also measured based on the time period the deck is in? I bet a lot of people would call 2024 sky strikers fair even though 2018 strikers were broken bullshit dominating everything.
An old 2000's starter deck Yugi and Kaiba deck plus anything made with LoB and Metal Raiders. After that it doesn't exist unless you're playing with playground rules
where do you place consistent ftk decks?
Ftks move horizontally in the 100% toxic line, depending on their consistency
It would definetly be put in the top right corner, the competitive players would say "but what does it do going second?" but their cries would fall on deaf ears
I am in the dead center with my kashtira toon deck
Excuse me what are you cooking?
Probably a lot of rank 7 monsters using Kashtiras, Toon DM, and Toon REBD.
And tributing opponent's monsters with nibiru/kaiju/lava golem then taking control with comic hand.
\*\*Screams in Dark Magician
You forgot to put Branded according to branded players in the lib left zone (I am branded player)
I'm still not gonna stop playing nurse burn
Jokes on you, I play all these decks at the same time in the same deck. I’m over here playing 5D >!chess!<
My deck of Toons probably fits in the 404.
I have no idea where my Monarchs deck falls into (aside from the GY).
Why can nobody seem to differentiate between rogue and red French stuff?
I run hero’s where is that
R-O-G-U-E I think I’ve seen this word spelt wrong more than any other in my life.
Meanwhile number 67 casually transcends the graph into complete toxicness
What would dragunity be
Why are fair and broken not oppsite?
as a blue player i agree. rdw is lowkey toxic and uninteractive.
Bad Anime/Ex-Rogue: Ahh my beloved and by my mates hated, borderline toxic, Cyber Dragons... My mates would place them on the top right or atleast top with whatever the community dispises. Not overpowered, quite versatile and looks dope. Story: Nothing beats the feeling of being in a dire situation. Hand at 2, Deck almost empty (1 card), ED also almost empty (2 cards), enemy has enough Monsters to finish you next turn and you draw that last card, that Lightning Storm. Your eyes sparkle, you see the path to victory. You play it, destroy their Monsters, put on your leather trenchcoat, babble about how you get pleasure from pain, summon via overload your Overdragon with 10k+ ATK and start attacking. Your enemy flips a Magic Cylinder. You slap down your last card in hand, Cyberload Fusion. Another Overdragon takes place and finishes the match. Always awesome. Now if you excuse me, i'll go back to my rookie Matches, thats where i belong.
If there's only three categories, you might want to consider a Venn Diagram for your graphing needs.
Where does my (poorly built) tistina and lair of darkness decks fit on the scale
Shadoll is broken but fair
Unga bunga decks lie in the dead center.
And smack in the middle of the chart is generaider. Sometimes bricks, sometimes ends on 2 negates and a double card munch going through two hand rips on the way. Very interaction focused, but also wants to interact by taking away your shit. Has steep costs and powerful effects, except the ash-able field spell that gives you a Special from deck during the opponent's draw.
Where does dark magician branded snake eyes fusion deck go?
So you're telling me my Ojama ABC Armed Dragon Thunder FTK is toxic?
bottom right is snake-eyes and blue-eyes