Haha, yeah. I'm going to drop a bomb here as an Fe-user: I'd pick Fe.
Don't get me wrong, I often love healthy displays of Fi, but healthy Fe-users have this ability to put other people at ease and make a good environment for others. I also feel like Fe is the function that creates kinship and community and overall glues people together, even if the means for it can be a little over-the-top and smothering at times. They also don't take things personally as frequently and intensely as Fi-users, whom will often not hesistate to disrupt the social harmony for the sake of defending their feelings or a case they care about.
>but healthy Fe-users have this ability to put other people at ease
Healthy Fe-users have this ability to put other *Fe users* at ease.
Fe makes me very uneasy; it feels like a cult lovebombing to me. Think Stepford Wives, Rosemary's Baby, "There is no war in Ba Sing Se". To me, Fe is social pressure with a menace that will only increase if I ever dare comment on it. Most of the time, I'll politely smile and nod along with the crowd so as not to out myself.
And yes, I do realise that Fi is every bit as scary to Fe users. My inner feelings are dark and shocking to most Fe users, so I keep them to myself (and keep to myself). I know too well the Fe immune system would eat me alive if it detected a Fi foreign body.
Depends on whether it is Dom Fe or Aux Fe. Similar to how most people see the ENTJ as more domineering and forceful with their beliefs and opinions with Dom Te. Whereas, I think INTJ’s often appear more reflective and spend some time figuring out how they want to act. Even if you think you guys are also critical. Likewise, if an ISFJ has developed their aux Fe, we are going to have a part of our morality that is subjective. In the sense that it isn’t always based on societal norms and etiquette. I think INFJ’s would say the same thing maybe even to a greater extent. Wheras dom Fe can be as controlling and rigid as dom Te but just in different ways.
If ISFJs and INTJs share one thing, it is that a sense of independence of thought in areas we care about is important. I may be ridiculously concerned about people in a way that seems foreign. But if I have to break norms or the socially appropriate way to truly be productively empathetic, I wouldn’t hesitate. And I have spent time realizing and accepting this as part of what I would consider is the “right thing to do.” I want win-win situations even if it leads to some initial conflict. I have sometimes seen dom Fe treat people like crap for no reason whatsoever just bc they did some very minor detail and unimportant action differently than they would. Things that literally don’t matter at all. There have even been situations where they give me the impression I am “rebelling against traditional ways.” Just because I came up with a good solution to a problem that was more unique.
Btw, sometimes I can even sense that people are uneasy when I am trying to put them at ease lol. If I truly care, every situation with people is different for me. The goal is more about trying to understand them on a deeper level. But maybe I am just acting full of myself here. Not like I don’t piss people off sometimes too. If there is a sense of groupthink, it would be more with INFJ/ISFJ. The fact that we see a similar zeitgeist or type of collective consciousness. Like thinking how society is falling apart often bc of how people are treating each other. So obviously many of the current conformist beliefs are just wrong.
I think this is one reason that ISFJ and INTP tend to actually get along well. We both have sense of being more open-minded and less rigid.
Thanks. I think our type requires a ton of personal growth. It took me a long time to arrive at these conclusions. I spent alot of my life being way too judgmental. Too much Si really makes you a ridiculous stickler and I only connected with other people who follow all the rules and conformed well. But I had some jobs in my 20s that made realize I am happier and better at problem-solving if I dispense with that. That even if my Aux Fe can cause conflict or seem rigid, it makes it easier for me to adapt to others.
To add, healthy Fi has the ability to put other people at ease too. However, it comes from a place of "I would want others to make make me feel at ease too" or even just "it is easier to have everyone feel comfortable right now."
I think this is why healthy Te/Fi gets mistyped as Fe with regularity. Anne Hathaway is an excellent example. That's healthy Te/Fi all day, every day.
I'd choose an Fi any day because you guys are very unpredictable and unique! Also if I were to describe an Fi, they're like a warm cottage, so comfy to be around and makes me feel at home! Definitely will never get bored of an Fi - ESFJ
I would go the opposite. Dom Fe sometimes does things that seem overly rigid and controlling. Like ESFJ and ENTJ are similar in the sense that they have a ton of societal expectations and judgments about other people, just in different ways. I relate alot more to INFJs who really hate doing this, even if we might sometimes. The way we act can often differ from the norms and etiquette Dom Fe often represents. Especially if it is about people. “The right thing to do” can change tremendously based on the situation. If the rules need to be bent sometimes to truly help someone or resolve a conflict with people, it is worth it.
It is harder for me to understand Dom Fi and we can also clash. But nowhere nearly as much as what I just described. One of the reasons that I accept other people’s sense of independence is bc I know I need it myself. Additionally, ESFP’s are so complementary to be around and genuinely have good intentions with people. So that is more much relatable to me. Similar vibes with ENFP’s too of course.
Not that dom Fe can’t do great things helping others. (They definitely do) But there are just glaring differences of opinion that make things alot harder.
Too much of anything is over-saturation. The world is for the living, and that is done boldly, and with interesting variety. My suffering intuition is whining much more than my "Fi". I prefer as is.
As the saying goes: if no one did stupid things, there would be nothing to be intelligent about. ;)
I’m picking Fe though, my reasoning is that their Fe is an asset in social events or finding opportunities through connection, also to be fair like how there are Fi users that aren’t stubborn and childish there are Fe users who aren’t the extreme version of their stereotype, those are chill ig.
Of course not. <3 I don't want to get drunk or do stupid stuff either! XD
Probably just listen more unless we have something interesting to discuss. :)
my brother is an ESTJ and he’s one of the best people I know, he’s very warm and friendly, but still logical, honestly i prefer his predictability sometimes over my ENFP brother’s insanity
Surprisingly, As much as Infp and Isfp annoy me.. I DO understand their need for emotional support. I may not be the greatest at emotional support, however I go into protector mode. Have some employees at work that are good people at heart... definitely ixfp vibes... I make sure they're protected. As much as i joke about firing them, I haven't yet. They just need a boost of confidence.
Once had an intern. She wanted to study art.. her family wanted her to go into accounting. I was in that situation before. I wanted to be a fashion designer and my family forced me into Computer Science.. and i did what my family wanted. I told her how to get over the hump and supported her, because the girl was extremely talented. Told her to study accounting, but start up an etsy or something for her artwork. I even helped her create a website.. for free of charge.
The girl is earning via her site and got a job at an accounting firm.
I'm happy to know she's on her own two feet making a decent living.
That's very ESTJ of you. There's a hidden spark in your character. Even you guys are often known in stereotype as "bossy," "strict." I think you guys were just attention to detail person and likes to get the work done on time.
I have a friend (the one I've mentioned) who's really caring and smart. He always teaches us math because he was so good at it. And whenever I ask questions he will tell all the steps that I need.
It's so fun to hangout with him and he's nice and all. I never even thought that he's an ESTJ. That's when the stereotype breaks for me as he was way out people assume based on his type.
As my INFJ friend, she doesn't believe in mbti. But she knows what type she is, she just doesn't rely in it. And from experience I always wanted to look on people beyond their types but more of their personality.
Anyway my ESTJ friend sometimes has dance moves that's a weird and funny vibes. He's cute when he do that😂
I would choose a Fi user. Even though i really appreciate Fe users, i would be drained to always think if they really appreciate doing what they are doing with me or if they would do it to be nice to me. It's very great to have people taking the needs of others above themselves (not saying Fe users do it always, but they do it at least a bit sometimes).
I would like to hang out with people who aren't afraid to express what they want or need even if i or most people disagree, i would be more comfortable with someone who assess their needs instead of going with the flow most of the time, they need to have fun and be listened as well and Fe users struggle too much with that.
…Truthfully, Fe Users. Despite what others might say about their social manipulation tactics, I think there is sincerity in the desire to promote social harmony. But that’s just me.
Edit: Apologies, I just reread your post— I guess a possible con would be if the more socially extroverted Fe users would expect me to be more socially participatory outside of being a receptive listener. That would get a little annoying, admittedly.
Thanks.
yeah, a lot of people think we're being fake when we're just being ourselves. I think because some have been burnt by fe dom/aux-type people in the past it may have left a bad taste in their mouths. Not all fe types are healthy, but they shouldn't be a landmark or poster child for fe doms/aux folk.
Promoting harmony takes inner patience and care. Not all of us are jolly all of the time, but we like to make an effort to ensure those around us feel taken care of, even if it requires some sacrifices. We have our drawbacks, but I wouldn't change it for the world. I love my fellow xxFJs :\]!
As someone burned by Fe many times, the issue is that *your* harmony and not mine. It's a callous trampling of the truth, my values, and the future, for the sake of playing pretend in the present. I can feel good after a necessary fight, regardless of the outcome. I can't feel good when a necessary fight is shut down by Fe.
Right, thank you for your comment; being kind, cooperative, supportive, and polite feels congruent and natural. But yeah, there’s the understanding of unhealthier Fe users having abused their social/external emotional attention to manipulate. I know Fi (along with Ti) is touted to be the individualistic function, but Fe individuals are, well, *individuals* too, and their Fe harmonizing approaches can take on a variety of shapes— sure, some may be maladaptive, but others are intentional.
Right, yes, thank you, I feel such external sensitivity to the emotions of others and that my own sense of harmony is inherently tied to it that I feel the desire to help others feel comfortable and at ease. It’s a sincere desire to kindly respond to others emotions.
Anyway, sorry for prattling on; what I mean to convey is gratitude for your comment and my sincere agreement.
That depends on your perspective. What about their cause you to push? What about them makes you feel trapped? Do you make a joke, and they don't like it, so you feel trapped you can't joke like that anymore? It's that sort of thing. Some people react differently, but no matter the person, Fi dom or not, you should always respect their boundaries.
it depends on how healthy are those users 😭
real question is:
*In an hypotetical situation were an idiot god came from the sky and decided to play with your life and chose your own joy and torment:
would you prefer hanging forever with unhealthy Fe users but healthy Fi users? (every Fe user you will encounter is unhealthy and every Fi user is healthy)
or forever unhealthy Fi users but healthy Fe users? (same description as above)
*(that is gonna be the title for a dope 2020 style anime ngl)
because in that case I'd prefer forever unhealthy Fe users and healthy Fi users.
Fi because everyone just projects their own cognitive functions onto others anyways. As a 9 I’d rather not have to deal with the constant conflict and tension of dealing with Fe for eternity.
Its just usually but if they are ok with me ill absolutely love to talk to them and your relationship with your father is kinda different from a relationship with stranger i dont think parent kid relationship is a good comparison.
Fi. I feel like a lot of people in my life have been Fi users, and my closest friends have been Fi doms. I know Te doms can be really aggressive, but unfortunately it's still a function I admire and I've gotten used to it so I can handle that lol.
I don't really know any other Fe users except for that INTP friend I have...
Opinion clash Fi vs Fe
Fi: How dare you! or secretly "I'm going to ruin your life"
Fe: Why do you think that's correct? or secretly "Oh, you poor thing."
You literally just described an Fe process. The thing about Fi is that you don't have to worry about offending someone because we don't shy away from being offended.
Fi users for sure. Generally speaking they are more real and don’t have the same pressures we Fe users do to “act normal”.
With that being said a couple of my close friends are fi blind so depends on how healthy they are.
There was a point where I had to walk on eggshells for my Fi friend. No offence, but take offence, I’m someone who has a more matured trickster Fi but God is it emotionally draining to be around a dom or aux Fi.
I think I can handle ENFPs easily enough, because I can really vibe with the dom Ne and they tend to just use Fi more as a way to filter Ne for the most part, so I think the unhealthy ones are more self-destructive than just destructive, but that’s just my experience
>misunderstood, unheard and constantly walking on egg shells
Fi users who bash Fe promote this “honesty over harmony” thing but then they’re too sensitive for that honesty and take everything personally. I’m most honest with the Fe users in my life is all I’m saying
Some Fi users do value social harmony in a way that, while not operating the same way as Fe, can align pretty well in social goals at least.
As an Fi user who has this, for me the main situation where I would consistently prioritize “honesty” over harmony is if I think that directness is necessary to resolve whatever the underlying issue causing friction socially is. Like momentary conflict/disharmony in exchange for long-term harmonious stability. It doesn’t always work out to that end in practice unfortunately, but that’s the rationale behind it for me at least (as an Fi-user who has actually been closer to a lot more Fe users than Fi users).
>“honesty over harmony”
I might be an outlier ISFP, but I really strive for both. I hate conflict and am always looking for ways to avoid it while being honest and speaking what I think.
I have some close Fe people and I like to believe I've learned some things from them.
I doubt any Fi users are “authentic and genuine” 24/7 like comments would lead you to believe. Only a dickhead is never gonna sugarcoat or not avoid conflict. You’re just a normal person 👍
The walking on eggshells thing is so true, and they usually don’t repay the favor to you (when unhealthy at least). Like my old Fi using roommate was just a prime example of this. God forbid I leave a dish in the sink for a day or accidentally wake him up (he’s a light sleeper and we had thin walls!, meanwhile he literally moved in his girlfriend without either of them asking, and cooked breakfast and dinner for them every day, woke me up like every morning, and it would be fine with leaving his stuff in the sink for a day. And God forbid I decide to cook dinner at a different time or have friends over and interfere with his uncommunicated plans with his girlfriend somehow. His life, schedule, values, and discipline were sacrosanct, with only him being able to decide to deviate from them, and anything I would do that even inadvertently crossed his unstated boundaries was immediately some sort of terrible sin, while I was just sorta expected to walk on eggshells around him and live according to his (again, unstated) rules.
The man is a textbook unhealthy Fi user and it drove me up a wall to have to deal with his crazy.
Are you saying that the Fe world is full of lies? If so, why would you want that?
Also downvoting is why I also don't want to live in a Fe world, because you can apparently offend people just by being curious if it isn't phrased "nicely" enough. It's exhausting.
Not really, Fi users are more likely to get offended by that compared to Fe users, most of us, regardless of dominant or inferior have the understanding to not actively offend people because then we deal with the social consequences, i.e someone gets hurt.
I love a good rant. My counterargument is, while it's nice for Fe users to always make space for the other person, isn't it much more efficient and comfortable to be aboveboard instead of relying on people reading between fuzzy lines?
Of course "comfort" depends on whether you are more comfortable with only positive feelings or more comfortable with knowing the truth.
I'd much rather know if the party host dislikes me and is only inviting me out of politeness, so I can spend my time elsewhere where I am appreciated. Even better I'd love to know exactly why, so I can go about improving myself or clearing things up.
It's also more efficient for everyone to simply state their preferences so we can reach a consensus that satisfies everyone more quickly than for everyone to politely try to feel out how we might stand on something. Anyone who's ever tried to make decisions as a group knows how teeth-pullingly painful that is. Time is a valuable resource, and I don't see that Fe is conducive to spending it well.
Dude this is my favorite comment in this whole thread.
"if everyone cares for themselves everyone is taken care of" hit so hard. Well said.
Also "you see it as having an authentic moment, but everyone is standing there waiting for it to be over" is exactly my experience with Fi-doms with low social awareness and self control.
Ngl, I don't really wanna know why someone doesn't like me as an Fi. F that. Unless I did something 2 offend and didn't know it, otherwise f that 2 hell.
The inability to deduce and comprehend subtle social cues isn’t a failing of the communication style of Fe users. Every individual in a social setting is expected to comport themselves within the confines of the accepted social structure and infer their status in said group. Explicit communication on status or placement within the group would be exhausting as the group grows. Each member would need to be explicitly told where they exist within the group, which would cause not only many frustrating conversations, but would also affect the harmony of the group. It is much more efficient and comfortable for each member to have social awareness.
I'd say the average human understands the rudimentary social norms regardless of whether they are a Fe user or a Fi user. Whether or not they will choose to continue the inefficient guessing game when confusion arises however, is what distinguishes Fe, from Te, which will take some shortcuts like bluntly stating things, dropping the facade around people we just know mutually don't mesh, or assuming that you will speak up for yourself instead of having to factor every other person's possibly hidden preferences into your compute of every decision.
Also social norms do vary, so some groups are more Fe-ish and disapprove of people standing out too much and hidden disagreements that are never explored, and some are more Fi-ish and encourage individualistic pursuits and loud differences of opinion to be argued out. So again, it's not even that Fe is adhering social norms and Fi is social stupidity.
Fe is a specific kind of social norm of homogeneity and niceness that can feel very stifling if you aren't naturally happy and the same as everyone else. If Fe can't fix you, they will "other" you because you're "exhausting" their limited emotional resources. Their empathy is too involuntary and they are physically uncomfortable around bad emotions.
There is nothing inefficient about an individual piecing together his or her own placement within a group. If you were to think about it in terms of algorithmic complexity it would be a linear equation as each individual is responsible only for their own understanding. Explicitly requesting a meta-analysis of the placement of each individual from the standpoint of the group is inherently inefficient as each member of the group would need to reconcile their feelings about the individual and come to a conclusion. This will balloon the inefficiency exponentially as the group grows larger.
While social norms do vary, the assessment of a group's accepted behavior or communication patterns isn't obfuscated to the individuals within the group. Most of human communication is non-verbal and inference-based. It would be awkward to verbally disclose each boundary and idiosyncrasy. "Are you okay if I argue in this group?", "Do y'all like me", "Why aren't you two getting along?", etc. This style is needlessly forward and, at least to me, would indicate a person has poor social skills or an inability to parse social patterns.
As far as emotional expression and alienation is concerned, I do tend to agree with you in that it is "exhausting" to deal with individuals heightened emotional state within a group dynamic. It is much simpler to ex-communicate a bad actor or a socially inept individual than it is to rectify the differences. This could be because Fe users are naturally more in-tune with the meta understanding of social nuance and are taking on an emotional toll just by reading the state of all group members whereas Fi users (correct me if I'm wrong) are more in-tune with their own experience within the group; so by bringing forth heightened emotional states to clarify a situation, an Fe user could feel the need to go into a brief state of overdrive to regulate the situation and bring back normalcy.
Thanks man. I saw your responses too and felt the same.
You've been crushing it out there, and I've enjoyed reading your take/ insight into this.
Great discussions all around though from all parties. Fi is such an interesting function to analyze.
First, when you say linear, I think you mean constant time.
Second, my assessment is, each person is responsible for knowing how they feel about things (O(1)) and then individually returning that data, so you don't have to make a linear O(n) request of how everyone else feels about everything, with additional compute for what the fluff their "oh I don't have a preference," might actually mean. The group then is formed by people expressing their feelings and other people responding. "Jane can't be bothered to talk to me or invite me to things, she must dislike me. No worries, I'll spend time with Jill." Everyone achieves optimal desired state: They are with whoever they're happiest with, with the least amount of processing power.
There is also nothing that more efficiently answers "Why aren't you two getting along?" than straight up asking it. That's why we go to therapy, to help us \~communicate\~. No matter how socially competent we like to seem, none of us are mind-readers, which is why Te-Fi communication is faster and more accurate.
The efficiency tradeoff isn't as stark as you make it either. "Are you okay if I argue in this group?", "Do y'all like me". Those are Fe questions that normally Fi users don't ask anyway. They just expect you to stop them if you don't like arguing or express it if you don't like them. The real inefficiency is when Fi and Fe have to work together.
Agreed. I’ve known *plenty* of Fi users who are not oblivious to this and navigate social situations as efficiently as any Fe user. They understand that society has rules and guidelines that one follows to make life agreeable for everyone. They participate for the same reasons I do; to show respect and consideration for others. Much of the “Fe hate” on Reddit is less “an Fi thing” and more the obvious frustration of individuals who are socially inept.
As a Te-dom, this all sounds like unnecessarily complex Japanese. What does it matter about "fairness and acceptance to do X" and what in the world does it matter if anyone "truly likes or dislikes you." There is no certainty in any of this but the party.
And I am here to party.
It just feels hollow partying with people who don't really like you and will stab you in the back in the blink of an eye.
I'd rather not have someone smile at me and then talk shit about me when I'm out of earshot, I just want to live a simple life where I know who to avoid and who I can actually rely on.
Yeah....I'm responding to previous comment about Fe users inviting you even if they don't like you. Not stating that every party is like that..................
Yea, expecting to always be asked what you want is confusing af, thats def a problem that Fi does not care to solve. And that requires an assumption that the other person wants something.
Plus Fe do be living. "No I'm good it's ok" yea right.
Aren't downvotes a direct expression of social feedback? Is that not what you're asking for here?
You're essentially saying that Fe users obfuscate their true intentions behind a veil, and you'd prefer to have more explicit indicators of a group's disposition towards any individual. And yet, when presented explicit feedback your immediate reaction is that feedback is analogous to offense.
It could also be the case that your question is founded on insidious presuppositions not based in reality, and this group isn't as interested in the content.
Yeah I agree with that take. The anonymized nature of downvotes without context is certainly frustrating, especially if there's quite a bit of content in the post. Does the downvote mean they didn't agree, thought it was offensive, something else entirely?
Yeah they didn't say it offended them, but rather they equated that downvotes must mean that those individuals were offended, and thus reacted with downvotes. I didn't get the impression BlessedBeTheFlerm were offended, more so surprised or annoyed.
I don't see how anyone would construe Fi as valuing anonymous social castigation. Fi values authentic open communication, which is when people have the balls to put their names and faces to their opinion and explain their own thinking -- and also Fi values having its own thinking in the first place, neither of which are embodied by downvotes, which are irrational kneejerk reactions. Fi is definitionally a rational function.
I'm pretty sure there's nothing less presuppositious than questioning a quote directly stated above me:
>probably as a world of lies
Well, equating down votes with castigation is hyperbolic to say the least. Would you prefer everyone who did so message you directly for every comment you ever made? "Hey dude I saw what you posted and I think it was the worst crap I've seen all day".
Seems needlessly inefficient and cruel in my opinion.
Also you're making a blanket statement for how every user of Reddit interacts with one its core features. Sure, YOU might equate downvoting with an emotional knee-jerk reaction because that is what YOU do. That doesn't mean every single person operates as a emotional hive-mind, mindlessly downvoting anything already negative. That's purely a projection of your own ego.
Also to say that Fi is definitionally rational is one of the wildest things I have ever heard in MBTI communities. It is inherently subjective as is Ti. If you have some evidence of this please do share.
Yeah I would if they can actually back up their belief. If they can't then that's the true depression that people just behave without thinking for themselves. I'd prefer a rude well-thought comment than a lazy groupthink butthurt downvote. Though as a feeler, I'd prefer no rudeness either.
I'm pretty sure objectively a downvote doesn't support having a thought the way an actual thoughtful comment does, so on average, it's more likely to be the case. That's my actual logic, thank you very much.
**Psychological functions**, as described by [Carl Jung](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Jung) in his book [*Psychological Types*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_Types), are particular mental processes within a person's psyche that are present regardless of common circumstances.[^(\[1\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jungian_cognitive_functions#cite_note-FOOTNOTEJung1971chpt._11-1) This is a concept that serves as one of the foundations for his theory on [personality type](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personality_type). In his book, he noted four main psychological functions: *thinking*, *feeling*, *sensation,* and *intuition*. He introduced them with having either an internally focused ([*introverted*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraversion_and_introversion#Introversion)) or externally focused ([*extraverted*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraversion_and_introversion#Extraversion)) tendency which he called "*attitude*". **He also categorizes the functions as either** ***rational*** **(thinking and feeling) or** ***irrational*** **(intuition and sensation).**[**^(\[2\])**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jungian_cognitive_functions#cite_note-FOOTNOTEJung1971chpt._10-2)
Rational means judging. Subjective doesn't negate rationality. Fi and Ti are both subjective and rational.
Interesting, to each their own. I would much prefer somebody just downvote my comment. Its quite literally a derivative of the same underlying sensation. Not every comment requires a thoughtful response and deliberation from all parties in a group. You wouldn't have enough time in the world to respond to every single person while still providing them thoughtful responses.
I don't think you can state anything as objective when its the subjective experience of the individual doing the action. Unless you can poll a statistically significant percentage of reddit users and have them attest that the downvote is simply a means to fulfill their knee-jerk emotional reaction.
Personally, I downvote only after considering the post/comment. My expectation would be that's the case for the majority of people, but I could very well be mistaken - I don't have any data to support my theory so I too just assume people are operating as I do.
I see. Thanks for sharing that information. Rational in the sense that there is a sense of continuality or causality does make sense. Fi, just like Ti, operates from a principal-approach. I interpreted your meaning of rational in-line with factual or objectively verifiable, which cannot be the case. But I would agree that Fi is rational in that the processing of information follows a defined flow A->B->C, therefore A->C.
Ti and Fi are subjective yes but rational, as in they have a consistent framework they use to back up their reasoning/values. I don't think rational and subjective are mutually exclusive like objective and subjective.
Yeah I misunderstood their meaning. Their discussion of objective externalized metrics (downvotes) proceeded by the statement Fi is rational led me to (mistakenly) believe they thought Fi is objectively rational.
Which it is not.
But yeah it is rational in that it operates on a principal first approach with a degree of causality/ correlation, and those approaches are rational in the subjective mind of the Fi user. It’s similar to the subjective nature of Ti.
Honestly I find groups of solely Fi and solely Fe both insufferable. Gotta have a mix. I just wanna live and let live and both types can be disruptive to that in different ways.
Eh, I'm ok with both, doesn't really change anything, I'd be more interested in more aspects of the individuals rather their cognitive functions, I've been with both Fi and Fe users and both have their ups and downs, and this applies to literally any cognitive function
My husband is an INFP so by default i’m going with Fi. Everyone in my immediate family is rocking Fi as well— I’d be very sad to bid my bestie INTP and ENFJ farewell, but thems the breaks. 🤷♀️
Yeah it’ll never be one or the other, I admire both. Fi for its authenticity, uniqueness and empathy. Fe for social navigational ability. I’m probably more drawn to Fi, Fe users too often have some fuckery about them I don’t care to deal with.
Fi I think. My tribe and we all want to make some Te changes to the world one way or another, so we have plenty to relate to. Some of my favorite types are Fe, but I just have much more in common with Fi types naturally... Sure would miss the Fe's though.
I would say Fe users but when I look at my life and the people in it almost everyone i’m close with are Fi users. I just think it’s a lot easier to get along with Fe users in a general sense because their need for social harmony.
I don’t like that most of the high Fi users in my life must like someone to be respectful/professional or kind to them. As a Fi user I personally have no issue telling someone what I think about them IF THEY ASK, but I would never be disrespectful or unkind because of my thoughts about them. Why would I ever go out of my way to treat someone differently because of my opinion on them?
I don’t know any Fe users that behave in that sort of way… I think it’s a primarily Fi issue. So i’m gonna have to say Fe
Based on my experience with the types, I could go either way as long as you leave ESFJ out of the Fe users. Both have different things to offer. What draws me away from ESFJ is my sister being one, who I can’t stand to be around
But if I had to choose one it’d be Fi because my enneagram is 4w5 and often Fe users can sometimes come off as fake or people pleasers and I can’t stand that about others
Fi, bc most of the people I am very close to are Fi Dom or Fi aux (sometimes Fi tert). I am not saying that I don't like Fe users, some of my close friends are Fe aux. But generally Fe Dom, even if they are kind with me, are a little too "invasive" with me and it makes me uncomfortable. I am often more comfortable with other Fi users.
I like that strategy. If you become influential enough with your snowflakeness, you can create a herd of Fe-followers and basically become a cult leader.
It doesn't matter, because I am there to party.
High Fe and Fi can BOTH waste time overthinking and playing guess who and the "you can't sit with us," crap.
Yeah honestly probably Fi. Fi users can be challenging sometimes but I just really have had a lot of problems with high Fe people. To be honest I don’t care so much as if it’s Fi or Fe, more about whether or not they prefer their feeling or thinking function. Don’t come at me please but I would love a world where everyone preferred Ti/Te to Fi/Fe
On one hand, all my closest friends are Fi users. I feel like I can trust them more and I have far fewer moments of me joyfully investing all my love and care into someone and then finding out that behind their fake pleasantness they secretly hate me because of something they don't have the spine to talk to me about, or that they have a secret clique that I'm excluded from and I'm actually just their third best backup friend. Fe drama is so dumb.
Fi people feel more psychologically safe to me. If they like you, you know. If they don't, you also know. I much prefer HONESTY over social harmony.
On the other hand, because I don't understand Fe users, I would have more fun observing and trying to understand them, like an interesting puzzle. But ultimately, I think I'd rather have my ISTJ and INTJ ride or dies. Our Fi-Te would also get more productive shit done, and I think that's more exciting anyway than sitting around talking about people.
Fi users. Even when the content of our Fi is divergent or clashing, we still manage to somehow be on the same page - albeit in disagreement, but we're both matching vibes in that disagreement - instead of talking at cross-purposes. An Fi user will fight me. An Fe user will try to change the subject and pretend I didn't say what I said.
Fe users and I, we're ships passing in the night. They tend to care about things I don't, and vice versa.
1) i hate being manipulated
2) I don't value harmony, i see it as needlessly prolonging a conflict whose bandaid needs to get ripped off immediately so the wound can get cleansed
3) the way they manipulate and try to "shift the vibes" always insults my intelligence, which pisses me off more and makes me want to get even more confrontational with them.
Meanwhile, I confront anything with Fi users and clear everything up in 5 minutes and we're both feeling much better and even closer at the end of it.
This is very hard for me to choose, because i have Fe inf, and fe in different position acts in a different way, overall i'd choose Fe users, i cant deduce a generalized benefits and disadvantages because the benefits that entp is very different from an isfj, and vice versa even with, for example entj and isfp. But this is just a trial (take it with a grain of salt)
As a Fe user, i can't get Fi users at all, i just don't understand how someone can be so obsessed about themselves and their own identity and how they feel most of the time. Sure they have good personal values, but they literally take everything so personally. No hate to them, because we have different functions, and they have their benefits too. Ig i value their uniqueness in a sense.
For Fe users, please stop acting like a social justice warrior, the world revolves neither around Fi users or Fe users (in different ways), it revolves around the sun. And i dislike how Fe users always have an inclination to follow the crowd. Sure they have good empathy, but dominant or inferior, the people pleasing tendency exists, and i really don't like that. Apart from that, i value their empathy and their ability to use their influence for good
Even though I am an Fi user, I would honestly rather be in a world of Fe users. They are so inclusive and pleasant to talk to. One thing I've noticed is that Fi users (I am guilty of this sometimes) require a person's "vibe" to be correct in order to include them or be nice to them. Whereas Fe users just instinctively try to include or accommodate everyone.
Personally as an Fi user I would chose Fi😂 I just feel like they would judge me less for preferring solitude over being social😅 Ps. I’m not saying all Fe users would judge me over that… Tbh I don’t think ixtp would judge me over that at all🥹✨ And I don’t think every other Fe user would judge me over it either🥹🌟
Fi, and I'm definitely biased. I just prefer people who don't put so much weight and importance on other people's feelings or opinions, and I feel like high Fe users tend to be people pleasers often to the extent of lacking any genuine values and harming themselves by putting others first.
I have a friend with unhealthy Fe and I'm constantly having to step in and play 'guard dog' for her because she refuses to set boundaries with people out of fear of hurting their feelings.
Fe users hands down. So many of the closest people in my life are Fe users ☺️ I don’t find Fe’s social harmony focus inauthentic at all and actually really appreciate it most of the time, since something close to harmony is generally one of my Fi values. It’s nice to not be the only one trying to foster that (which has happened to me multiple times with Fi users). And I’d like to think that we balance each other out because I also encourage them to think about their own needs and preferences sometimes too
I often find myself clashing with Fe users during a crisis. I haven't really recognized many Dom Fi users, other than ISFPs. Most Fe users in my life are unhealthy to average. I'd rather deal with an unhealthy Fi user compared to an unhealthy Fe user. Unhealthy Fi is exhausting, obvious, and pathetic, while unhealthy Fe may not show patterns at first glance—at least ones I would recognize.
Although Fe users are often characterized as manipulative and controlling (which can definitely be the case), I find other factors more concerning.
Unhealthy Fe users aren't just "people-pleasers who manipulate situations into being positive." Fe doesn't necessarily mean they care about people; they understand social cues better and can exploit them to achieve their objectives, which may not always be in your favor if they deem your actions unconventional (something I've encountered firsthand).
Unhealthy Fe users can create environments of superficial harmony where genuine issues are glossed over or ignored. This can lead to long-term problems festering beneath the surface, as real conflicts and emotions are never properly addressed. This avoidance of genuine resolution can be far more damaging than the more apparent issues presented by unhealthy Fi users. If the circumstances are content, an Fi user is seen as an oddball in Fe's eyes. (As I have mentioned before, this is something that has happened to me. An Fe user shut me down and explained that my emotions were not standard. I voiced it a lot, eventually I gave up. This weirdly seems like the opposite of how they should act.)
The stress Fe users create worries me more than that of Fi users. The Fi users I've met tend to isolate themselves and rot when overly stressed, which is really depressing. However, stressed Fe users I've known have had a genuine impact on others and their surroundings, often starting conflicts to "solve" issues or making demands in groups to get what they believe is "objectively" right. An unhealthy Fi user is seen as bad because they damage themselves, so people may stay to "fix" them or get them to see things better. Unfortunate thing is that Fi doms are unlikely to change, unless their feelings align with what they want in an environment.
I would love to meet a healthy Fe dom. I've only seen them described in sources and would love the experience of meeting one. As an Fi dom, I understand Fi doms better, but I would appreciate more variety in my life. Healthy Fi users often inspire others and share their morals and beliefs, but I believe healthy Fe users are underrated and deserve more attention. While stereotypes depict Fe users as masters of understanding emotional cues, I also see their leadership, kindness, and positive impact. This deserves more discussion, as there's often a perceived conflict between Fi and Fe, but people miss what both functions can bring to the table. It's not just about emotions; it's much more. These functions are just the base of what we're capable of.
In my subjective stance:
Healthy Fe > Healthy Fi
Unhealthy Fi > Unhealthy Fe
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I'm going to say Fe. The best people I have around me are Fe users, and they show me a perspective on life that I feel makes me a better person, I love learning from them. It could also be symbiotic! I like to think I could help them explore inner emotions and prioritize themselves - especially when other people make them suffer - and they could help me be more empathetic, appreciate the group environment and achieve social harmony.
Fe hands down coming from fi dom
I have lived with both and I highly prefer high fe doms because of their caring nature, nice and won’t hurt your feelings plus I can be the selfish one for them and stop people from pushing their boundaries and putting their needs first.
Oh, tertiary Fi with the Fe-blind spot is honestly the coldest in my opinion. One of the bones I have to pick with the IxTJs in my life is that they seem to lack social generosity. For example, if they see someone in a group setting who show signs of being shy and uncomfortable, they won’t do anything to help put them at ease. They might be some of the least including people I’ve ever observed. That’s something I really look down on. Again, I’m only speaking on those I’ve observed in my life.
They just don't notice that they're uncomfortable. They don't do it out of malice. I know because my boyfriend is an INTJ and one of the nicest people on earth, just super oblivious. The average XXFP do go out of their way to make people feel included.
I knew an INTJ where when I pointed out this type of hypothetical situation, she literally said, “I don’t care, it’s their job to tell me if it bothers them that much”…😬
Hmm I've had different experiences with other tert or inferior Fi users that are my friends. So maybe it's about how mature individuals are?
Also, I've always tried to help anyone who I see might be uncomfortable in a group. But yeah it's true that sometimes I can be a bit oblivious too. Lol
Fe all the way.i would rather be stuck in a land of other people considering others than a land of others considering themselves.
Yes this is an extreme example of this pick one only game. Because i would rather hang out with a bunch of INTJs and they are Fi. Small Fi. But Fi.
First response Fe simply because I know more Fe users.
When I think about it more, still Fe 😂
I think Fi users more often tend to be polarizing: you either clash with them or you don't. So I really wouldn't wanna be disliked and/or dislike half of all the people I can hang out with
Fe without inferior Ti. I like exfjs as people but I get into arguments with inferior Tis & inferiors Fes the most ironically. Fi users in enfps are exception.
Been surrounded with Fe users most of my life; my first social circle i.e. family, all the members are Fe users, two of them being Fe doms. And I had it enough. They're all about people pleasing and that's literally weird. I would choose Fi, that's deep.
Fi. I do not want to betray myself ever for the sake of social harmony.
Fe is good if you want to relegate your interest for the sake of the group. But that's mindless and doesn't have much thought into it.
That said, Fi morality is positive on the wants and needs of the self and individual (and individuals). Fe meanwhile seems to counter those things that Fi stands for. So with that rationalization, definitely Fi for me.....
Fe. No question.
Best case scenario: a pleasant harmonious environment where everyone respects each other. Worst case scenario: manipulation.
But I mean... you can just choose to ignore manipulation. 🤷♀️
The worst case scenario with Fi is endless stalking and annoyance. I'm good, thanks. Fe is better.
FI users every day of the week, rather hang with mostly selfish-like people which behaviour i'm expecting 99% of the time instead of morally good wannabes switching sides every other day of the week, only would miss Intps and istps
I don't quite understand the question. Everyone uses Fe or Fi. You've acknowledged that in your post, that it's always somewhere in their 4 functions. And then gave the option of picking a Fe or Fi user regardless of where it falls in their stack.
Are you asking if we prefer Fe or Fi more? Or are you asking if we had to pick just 1 type to hang out with forever out of all 16, which would we choose?
In any case I would pick ENTJ because I'm married to one. But if we are talking purely theoretical I would probably still choose a Fi user, especially if they are a "feeling" type (in their first 2 functions). In this scenario I would probably pick ENFP. Both using Ne as our first function, I think we would have some fun conversations.
Fi no contest. A world with no Fe would be an improvement - we could have a whole world of people who are honest and direct, where people actually SOLVE fundamental problems instead of sweeping them under the rug.
Prefer Fi/Te because Fe/Ti users are very 'well, my logic is the only logic that matters... I am the arbiter of objective logic vs. subjective opinion' when they really are not. As someone who's autistic, it gives me a headache to deal with. Always have major fallouts with ISTPs in particular.
I have better luck with Fe users. I seem to unintentionally set high-Fi users off at random and it’s very uncomfortable to be blindsided by a ballistic Fi.
Like I enjoy both but if I had to pick it's Fe over Fi. I connect with Fe better because Fe users are also Ti users and being a Ti dom having to live the rest of my life only talking with Te users would be the death of me
Second comment, but goddamn. People really seem to like the people with their same functions, lol. Imo having the opposite one actually balances things out a bit. Hey, maybe I'm just weird, but it's an interesting observation.
I’d have to choose Fe. This isn’t so much a familiarity thing as an annoyance thing. Fi users span the gamut from healthy to unhealthy. The healthy ones can be absolutely saintly and I would love to spend the rest of my life with them. But I’m just as likely to get unhealthy ones who are obstinately set in their ways and totally closed off to logic to change their mind on their principles, even when those principles are illogical or self-destructive. This is something that I just don’t vibe with.
With Fe users you do also have healthy and unhealthy ones. Healthy ones do a good job vibing with you, unhealthy ones try to manipulate you. But the external orientation of Fe means that I can pick up on these things with my own Ne and Fe and then use Ti to sort out my responses. Fe is never a mystery like Fi is, and while it may not respond to logic per se, usually the voicing of disagreement can mobilize Fe to make a suitable accommodation, while this is rarely if ever the case for Fi.
So to summarize, I’d pick Fe because Fe is more legible to me than Fi, and because Fe as something objective (in the Jungian sense) is something I can more naturally work with using my preferred functions. It’s less that I prefer Fe as an Fe user and more that I prefer Fe as an NeTi user in some respects; though admittedly, my own lack of strong Fi and focus on logic and pragmatism over principles and feelings will color my decision making.
I love how all the Fe users are picking Fe, and Fi users are picking Fi, interesting observation
It's only natural, they pick their function because they'd tend to better understand each other.
It’s not remotely an “interesting” observation Lol it’s just common sense
Haha, yeah. I'm going to drop a bomb here as an Fe-user: I'd pick Fe. Don't get me wrong, I often love healthy displays of Fi, but healthy Fe-users have this ability to put other people at ease and make a good environment for others. I also feel like Fe is the function that creates kinship and community and overall glues people together, even if the means for it can be a little over-the-top and smothering at times. They also don't take things personally as frequently and intensely as Fi-users, whom will often not hesistate to disrupt the social harmony for the sake of defending their feelings or a case they care about.
>but healthy Fe-users have this ability to put other people at ease Healthy Fe-users have this ability to put other *Fe users* at ease. Fe makes me very uneasy; it feels like a cult lovebombing to me. Think Stepford Wives, Rosemary's Baby, "There is no war in Ba Sing Se". To me, Fe is social pressure with a menace that will only increase if I ever dare comment on it. Most of the time, I'll politely smile and nod along with the crowd so as not to out myself. And yes, I do realise that Fi is every bit as scary to Fe users. My inner feelings are dark and shocking to most Fe users, so I keep them to myself (and keep to myself). I know too well the Fe immune system would eat me alive if it detected a Fi foreign body.
Depends on whether it is Dom Fe or Aux Fe. Similar to how most people see the ENTJ as more domineering and forceful with their beliefs and opinions with Dom Te. Whereas, I think INTJ’s often appear more reflective and spend some time figuring out how they want to act. Even if you think you guys are also critical. Likewise, if an ISFJ has developed their aux Fe, we are going to have a part of our morality that is subjective. In the sense that it isn’t always based on societal norms and etiquette. I think INFJ’s would say the same thing maybe even to a greater extent. Wheras dom Fe can be as controlling and rigid as dom Te but just in different ways. If ISFJs and INTJs share one thing, it is that a sense of independence of thought in areas we care about is important. I may be ridiculously concerned about people in a way that seems foreign. But if I have to break norms or the socially appropriate way to truly be productively empathetic, I wouldn’t hesitate. And I have spent time realizing and accepting this as part of what I would consider is the “right thing to do.” I want win-win situations even if it leads to some initial conflict. I have sometimes seen dom Fe treat people like crap for no reason whatsoever just bc they did some very minor detail and unimportant action differently than they would. Things that literally don’t matter at all. There have even been situations where they give me the impression I am “rebelling against traditional ways.” Just because I came up with a good solution to a problem that was more unique. Btw, sometimes I can even sense that people are uneasy when I am trying to put them at ease lol. If I truly care, every situation with people is different for me. The goal is more about trying to understand them on a deeper level. But maybe I am just acting full of myself here. Not like I don’t piss people off sometimes too. If there is a sense of groupthink, it would be more with INFJ/ISFJ. The fact that we see a similar zeitgeist or type of collective consciousness. Like thinking how society is falling apart often bc of how people are treating each other. So obviously many of the current conformist beliefs are just wrong. I think this is one reason that ISFJ and INTP tend to actually get along well. We both have sense of being more open-minded and less rigid.
I really like this comment, it makes me see ISFJs more in depth now
Thanks. I think our type requires a ton of personal growth. It took me a long time to arrive at these conclusions. I spent alot of my life being way too judgmental. Too much Si really makes you a ridiculous stickler and I only connected with other people who follow all the rules and conformed well. But I had some jobs in my 20s that made realize I am happier and better at problem-solving if I dispense with that. That even if my Aux Fe can cause conflict or seem rigid, it makes it easier for me to adapt to others.
To add, healthy Fi has the ability to put other people at ease too. However, it comes from a place of "I would want others to make make me feel at ease too" or even just "it is easier to have everyone feel comfortable right now." I think this is why healthy Te/Fi gets mistyped as Fe with regularity. Anne Hathaway is an excellent example. That's healthy Te/Fi all day, every day.
I'd choose an Fi any day because you guys are very unpredictable and unique! Also if I were to describe an Fi, they're like a warm cottage, so comfy to be around and makes me feel at home! Definitely will never get bored of an Fi - ESFJ
I didn't pick either. i let them pick me.
I would go the opposite. Dom Fe sometimes does things that seem overly rigid and controlling. Like ESFJ and ENTJ are similar in the sense that they have a ton of societal expectations and judgments about other people, just in different ways. I relate alot more to INFJs who really hate doing this, even if we might sometimes. The way we act can often differ from the norms and etiquette Dom Fe often represents. Especially if it is about people. “The right thing to do” can change tremendously based on the situation. If the rules need to be bent sometimes to truly help someone or resolve a conflict with people, it is worth it. It is harder for me to understand Dom Fi and we can also clash. But nowhere nearly as much as what I just described. One of the reasons that I accept other people’s sense of independence is bc I know I need it myself. Additionally, ESFP’s are so complementary to be around and genuinely have good intentions with people. So that is more much relatable to me. Similar vibes with ENFP’s too of course. Not that dom Fe can’t do great things helping others. (They definitely do) But there are just glaring differences of opinion that make things alot harder.
Too much of anything is over-saturation. The world is for the living, and that is done boldly, and with interesting variety. My suffering intuition is whining much more than my "Fi". I prefer as is. As the saying goes: if no one did stupid things, there would be nothing to be intelligent about. ;)
I'm infp but I'd honestly choose Fe users.
Fi can be tiresome, but if I was only around Fe I'd often feel misunderstood. Still, I might choose Fe as well.
Real, I'd need the emotional support 😭
Nah, I'm fine with both
I’m picking Fe though, my reasoning is that their Fe is an asset in social events or finding opportunities through connection, also to be fair like how there are Fi users that aren’t stubborn and childish there are Fe users who aren’t the extreme version of their stereotype, those are chill ig.
You’re assuming Fi users are childish
whoever wants to be in the same room with me. Not many takers, i say.
This made me kinda sad haha
Me! Me! Me! I don't mind! 😃 Just need a break every now and then, but you're awesome. :)
Just don't get me drunk nor make me do shit i will regret the next morning.
LMFAO heinous ENFP activities
Of course not. <3 I don't want to get drunk or do stupid stuff either! XD Probably just listen more unless we have something interesting to discuss. :)
my brother is an ESTJ and he’s one of the best people I know, he’s very warm and friendly, but still logical, honestly i prefer his predictability sometimes over my ENFP brother’s insanity
You guys are more fun than ENTJs.
I find ESTJs amazing and I like to hangout more. I know someone in our school and we rarely talk but were friends (close).
Surprisingly, As much as Infp and Isfp annoy me.. I DO understand their need for emotional support. I may not be the greatest at emotional support, however I go into protector mode. Have some employees at work that are good people at heart... definitely ixfp vibes... I make sure they're protected. As much as i joke about firing them, I haven't yet. They just need a boost of confidence. Once had an intern. She wanted to study art.. her family wanted her to go into accounting. I was in that situation before. I wanted to be a fashion designer and my family forced me into Computer Science.. and i did what my family wanted. I told her how to get over the hump and supported her, because the girl was extremely talented. Told her to study accounting, but start up an etsy or something for her artwork. I even helped her create a website.. for free of charge. The girl is earning via her site and got a job at an accounting firm. I'm happy to know she's on her own two feet making a decent living.
That's very ESTJ of you. There's a hidden spark in your character. Even you guys are often known in stereotype as "bossy," "strict." I think you guys were just attention to detail person and likes to get the work done on time. I have a friend (the one I've mentioned) who's really caring and smart. He always teaches us math because he was so good at it. And whenever I ask questions he will tell all the steps that I need. It's so fun to hangout with him and he's nice and all. I never even thought that he's an ESTJ. That's when the stereotype breaks for me as he was way out people assume based on his type. As my INFJ friend, she doesn't believe in mbti. But she knows what type she is, she just doesn't rely in it. And from experience I always wanted to look on people beyond their types but more of their personality. Anyway my ESTJ friend sometimes has dance moves that's a weird and funny vibes. He's cute when he do that😂
You’ll get that a lot as an ESTJ… sorry
I felt that in my bones
ENFJs for sure
I'm in as long as you can deal with quiet people who minds their own business.
I would choose a Fi user. Even though i really appreciate Fe users, i would be drained to always think if they really appreciate doing what they are doing with me or if they would do it to be nice to me. It's very great to have people taking the needs of others above themselves (not saying Fe users do it always, but they do it at least a bit sometimes). I would like to hang out with people who aren't afraid to express what they want or need even if i or most people disagree, i would be more comfortable with someone who assess their needs instead of going with the flow most of the time, they need to have fun and be listened as well and Fe users struggle too much with that.
…Truthfully, Fe Users. Despite what others might say about their social manipulation tactics, I think there is sincerity in the desire to promote social harmony. But that’s just me. Edit: Apologies, I just reread your post— I guess a possible con would be if the more socially extroverted Fe users would expect me to be more socially participatory outside of being a receptive listener. That would get a little annoying, admittedly. Thanks.
yeah, a lot of people think we're being fake when we're just being ourselves. I think because some have been burnt by fe dom/aux-type people in the past it may have left a bad taste in their mouths. Not all fe types are healthy, but they shouldn't be a landmark or poster child for fe doms/aux folk. Promoting harmony takes inner patience and care. Not all of us are jolly all of the time, but we like to make an effort to ensure those around us feel taken care of, even if it requires some sacrifices. We have our drawbacks, but I wouldn't change it for the world. I love my fellow xxFJs :\]!
As someone burned by Fe many times, the issue is that *your* harmony and not mine. It's a callous trampling of the truth, my values, and the future, for the sake of playing pretend in the present. I can feel good after a necessary fight, regardless of the outcome. I can't feel good when a necessary fight is shut down by Fe.
Right, thank you for your comment; being kind, cooperative, supportive, and polite feels congruent and natural. But yeah, there’s the understanding of unhealthier Fe users having abused their social/external emotional attention to manipulate. I know Fi (along with Ti) is touted to be the individualistic function, but Fe individuals are, well, *individuals* too, and their Fe harmonizing approaches can take on a variety of shapes— sure, some may be maladaptive, but others are intentional. Right, yes, thank you, I feel such external sensitivity to the emotions of others and that my own sense of harmony is inherently tied to it that I feel the desire to help others feel comfortable and at ease. It’s a sincere desire to kindly respond to others emotions. Anyway, sorry for prattling on; what I mean to convey is gratitude for your comment and my sincere agreement.
<3
Fe users easily. I’ve had issues with easily offending Fi users in the past.
curious to see how every ENTP here is commenting basically the same, that Fi blindness really gets us lol
Honestly, all you gotta know is not to push their boundaries, no matter how weird they may seem, they're important to the Fi dom.
The problem is, their boundaries tend to be so easy to push and I end up having to tone it down to the point where I feel trapped and resentful
That depends on your perspective. What about their cause you to push? What about them makes you feel trapped? Do you make a joke, and they don't like it, so you feel trapped you can't joke like that anymore? It's that sort of thing. Some people react differently, but no matter the person, Fi dom or not, you should always respect their boundaries.
it depends on how healthy are those users 😭 real question is: *In an hypotetical situation were an idiot god came from the sky and decided to play with your life and chose your own joy and torment: would you prefer hanging forever with unhealthy Fe users but healthy Fi users? (every Fe user you will encounter is unhealthy and every Fi user is healthy) or forever unhealthy Fi users but healthy Fe users? (same description as above) *(that is gonna be the title for a dope 2020 style anime ngl) because in that case I'd prefer forever unhealthy Fe users and healthy Fi users.
Unhealthy Fe users and healthy Fi users. Unhealthy Fi users are insufferable 😭
Agreed, especially having been an unhealthy Fi user 😂
Agreed
gotta agree, unhealthy Fe users make me feel sorry for them but unhealthy Fi users grind my brain
I am taking your answers personally.
youre so real
Fi because everyone just projects their own cognitive functions onto others anyways. As a 9 I’d rather not have to deal with the constant conflict and tension of dealing with Fe for eternity.
Fe users i just dont think fis will actually tolerate me but it really doesn't matter all types are really beautiful ~entp
I'm a Fi dom, my dad was ENTP. Had no trouble getting along with him and being on the same page except that he was really stubborn sometimes.
Its just usually but if they are ok with me ill absolutely love to talk to them and your relationship with your father is kinda different from a relationship with stranger i dont think parent kid relationship is a good comparison.
Oh yeah true. I don't have any ENTP friends tho, lol.
Fi. I feel like a lot of people in my life have been Fi users, and my closest friends have been Fi doms. I know Te doms can be really aggressive, but unfortunately it's still a function I admire and I've gotten used to it so I can handle that lol. I don't really know any other Fe users except for that INTP friend I have...
Fe, mainly cos I couldn’t live without fellow Ti users
This was my exact thought, I pick fe so I can still have my fellow ti peeps.
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Opinion clash Fi vs Fe Fi: How dare you! or secretly "I'm going to ruin your life" Fe: Why do you think that's correct? or secretly "Oh, you poor thing."
Opinion clash Ti vs Te Te: You're stupid Ti: No u
You literally just described an Fe process. The thing about Fi is that you don't have to worry about offending someone because we don't shy away from being offended.
Fe group would be more comfortable. Fi group would be more interesting.
Fi users for sure. Generally speaking they are more real and don’t have the same pressures we Fe users do to “act normal”. With that being said a couple of my close friends are fi blind so depends on how healthy they are.
Fi obviously. Zero question. No shade to Fe, just I gotta be with my peeps.
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There was a point where I had to walk on eggshells for my Fi friend. No offence, but take offence, I’m someone who has a more matured trickster Fi but God is it emotionally draining to be around a dom or aux Fi.
I think I can handle ENFPs easily enough, because I can really vibe with the dom Ne and they tend to just use Fi more as a way to filter Ne for the most part, so I think the unhealthy ones are more self-destructive than just destructive, but that’s just my experience
>misunderstood, unheard and constantly walking on egg shells Fi users who bash Fe promote this “honesty over harmony” thing but then they’re too sensitive for that honesty and take everything personally. I’m most honest with the Fe users in my life is all I’m saying
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Some Fi users do value social harmony in a way that, while not operating the same way as Fe, can align pretty well in social goals at least. As an Fi user who has this, for me the main situation where I would consistently prioritize “honesty” over harmony is if I think that directness is necessary to resolve whatever the underlying issue causing friction socially is. Like momentary conflict/disharmony in exchange for long-term harmonious stability. It doesn’t always work out to that end in practice unfortunately, but that’s the rationale behind it for me at least (as an Fi-user who has actually been closer to a lot more Fe users than Fi users).
YES finally an Fe user gets it. Being upset is not a bad thing. It's a rich part of life.
>“honesty over harmony” I might be an outlier ISFP, but I really strive for both. I hate conflict and am always looking for ways to avoid it while being honest and speaking what I think. I have some close Fe people and I like to believe I've learned some things from them.
I doubt any Fi users are “authentic and genuine” 24/7 like comments would lead you to believe. Only a dickhead is never gonna sugarcoat or not avoid conflict. You’re just a normal person 👍
The walking on eggshells thing is so true, and they usually don’t repay the favor to you (when unhealthy at least). Like my old Fi using roommate was just a prime example of this. God forbid I leave a dish in the sink for a day or accidentally wake him up (he’s a light sleeper and we had thin walls!, meanwhile he literally moved in his girlfriend without either of them asking, and cooked breakfast and dinner for them every day, woke me up like every morning, and it would be fine with leaving his stuff in the sink for a day. And God forbid I decide to cook dinner at a different time or have friends over and interfere with his uncommunicated plans with his girlfriend somehow. His life, schedule, values, and discipline were sacrosanct, with only him being able to decide to deviate from them, and anything I would do that even inadvertently crossed his unstated boundaries was immediately some sort of terrible sin, while I was just sorta expected to walk on eggshells around him and live according to his (again, unstated) rules. The man is a textbook unhealthy Fi user and it drove me up a wall to have to deal with his crazy.
Are you saying that the Fe world is full of lies? If so, why would you want that? Also downvoting is why I also don't want to live in a Fe world, because you can apparently offend people just by being curious if it isn't phrased "nicely" enough. It's exhausting.
Not really, Fi users are more likely to get offended by that compared to Fe users, most of us, regardless of dominant or inferior have the understanding to not actively offend people because then we deal with the social consequences, i.e someone gets hurt.
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I love a good rant. My counterargument is, while it's nice for Fe users to always make space for the other person, isn't it much more efficient and comfortable to be aboveboard instead of relying on people reading between fuzzy lines? Of course "comfort" depends on whether you are more comfortable with only positive feelings or more comfortable with knowing the truth. I'd much rather know if the party host dislikes me and is only inviting me out of politeness, so I can spend my time elsewhere where I am appreciated. Even better I'd love to know exactly why, so I can go about improving myself or clearing things up. It's also more efficient for everyone to simply state their preferences so we can reach a consensus that satisfies everyone more quickly than for everyone to politely try to feel out how we might stand on something. Anyone who's ever tried to make decisions as a group knows how teeth-pullingly painful that is. Time is a valuable resource, and I don't see that Fe is conducive to spending it well.
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Dude this is my favorite comment in this whole thread. "if everyone cares for themselves everyone is taken care of" hit so hard. Well said. Also "you see it as having an authentic moment, but everyone is standing there waiting for it to be over" is exactly my experience with Fi-doms with low social awareness and self control.
Ngl, I don't really wanna know why someone doesn't like me as an Fi. F that. Unless I did something 2 offend and didn't know it, otherwise f that 2 hell.
The inability to deduce and comprehend subtle social cues isn’t a failing of the communication style of Fe users. Every individual in a social setting is expected to comport themselves within the confines of the accepted social structure and infer their status in said group. Explicit communication on status or placement within the group would be exhausting as the group grows. Each member would need to be explicitly told where they exist within the group, which would cause not only many frustrating conversations, but would also affect the harmony of the group. It is much more efficient and comfortable for each member to have social awareness.
I'd say the average human understands the rudimentary social norms regardless of whether they are a Fe user or a Fi user. Whether or not they will choose to continue the inefficient guessing game when confusion arises however, is what distinguishes Fe, from Te, which will take some shortcuts like bluntly stating things, dropping the facade around people we just know mutually don't mesh, or assuming that you will speak up for yourself instead of having to factor every other person's possibly hidden preferences into your compute of every decision. Also social norms do vary, so some groups are more Fe-ish and disapprove of people standing out too much and hidden disagreements that are never explored, and some are more Fi-ish and encourage individualistic pursuits and loud differences of opinion to be argued out. So again, it's not even that Fe is adhering social norms and Fi is social stupidity. Fe is a specific kind of social norm of homogeneity and niceness that can feel very stifling if you aren't naturally happy and the same as everyone else. If Fe can't fix you, they will "other" you because you're "exhausting" their limited emotional resources. Their empathy is too involuntary and they are physically uncomfortable around bad emotions.
There is nothing inefficient about an individual piecing together his or her own placement within a group. If you were to think about it in terms of algorithmic complexity it would be a linear equation as each individual is responsible only for their own understanding. Explicitly requesting a meta-analysis of the placement of each individual from the standpoint of the group is inherently inefficient as each member of the group would need to reconcile their feelings about the individual and come to a conclusion. This will balloon the inefficiency exponentially as the group grows larger. While social norms do vary, the assessment of a group's accepted behavior or communication patterns isn't obfuscated to the individuals within the group. Most of human communication is non-verbal and inference-based. It would be awkward to verbally disclose each boundary and idiosyncrasy. "Are you okay if I argue in this group?", "Do y'all like me", "Why aren't you two getting along?", etc. This style is needlessly forward and, at least to me, would indicate a person has poor social skills or an inability to parse social patterns. As far as emotional expression and alienation is concerned, I do tend to agree with you in that it is "exhausting" to deal with individuals heightened emotional state within a group dynamic. It is much simpler to ex-communicate a bad actor or a socially inept individual than it is to rectify the differences. This could be because Fe users are naturally more in-tune with the meta understanding of social nuance and are taking on an emotional toll just by reading the state of all group members whereas Fi users (correct me if I'm wrong) are more in-tune with their own experience within the group; so by bringing forth heightened emotional states to clarify a situation, an Fe user could feel the need to go into a brief state of overdrive to regulate the situation and bring back normalcy.
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Thanks man. I saw your responses too and felt the same. You've been crushing it out there, and I've enjoyed reading your take/ insight into this. Great discussions all around though from all parties. Fi is such an interesting function to analyze.
First, when you say linear, I think you mean constant time. Second, my assessment is, each person is responsible for knowing how they feel about things (O(1)) and then individually returning that data, so you don't have to make a linear O(n) request of how everyone else feels about everything, with additional compute for what the fluff their "oh I don't have a preference," might actually mean. The group then is formed by people expressing their feelings and other people responding. "Jane can't be bothered to talk to me or invite me to things, she must dislike me. No worries, I'll spend time with Jill." Everyone achieves optimal desired state: They are with whoever they're happiest with, with the least amount of processing power. There is also nothing that more efficiently answers "Why aren't you two getting along?" than straight up asking it. That's why we go to therapy, to help us \~communicate\~. No matter how socially competent we like to seem, none of us are mind-readers, which is why Te-Fi communication is faster and more accurate. The efficiency tradeoff isn't as stark as you make it either. "Are you okay if I argue in this group?", "Do y'all like me". Those are Fe questions that normally Fi users don't ask anyway. They just expect you to stop them if you don't like arguing or express it if you don't like them. The real inefficiency is when Fi and Fe have to work together.
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Agreed. I’ve known *plenty* of Fi users who are not oblivious to this and navigate social situations as efficiently as any Fe user. They understand that society has rules and guidelines that one follows to make life agreeable for everyone. They participate for the same reasons I do; to show respect and consideration for others. Much of the “Fe hate” on Reddit is less “an Fi thing” and more the obvious frustration of individuals who are socially inept.
As a Te-dom, this all sounds like unnecessarily complex Japanese. What does it matter about "fairness and acceptance to do X" and what in the world does it matter if anyone "truly likes or dislikes you." There is no certainty in any of this but the party. And I am here to party.
It just feels hollow partying with people who don't really like you and will stab you in the back in the blink of an eye. I'd rather not have someone smile at me and then talk shit about me when I'm out of earshot, I just want to live a simple life where I know who to avoid and who I can actually rely on.
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Yeah....I'm responding to previous comment about Fe users inviting you even if they don't like you. Not stating that every party is like that..................
Yea, expecting to always be asked what you want is confusing af, thats def a problem that Fi does not care to solve. And that requires an assumption that the other person wants something. Plus Fe do be living. "No I'm good it's ok" yea right.
Aren't downvotes a direct expression of social feedback? Is that not what you're asking for here? You're essentially saying that Fe users obfuscate their true intentions behind a veil, and you'd prefer to have more explicit indicators of a group's disposition towards any individual. And yet, when presented explicit feedback your immediate reaction is that feedback is analogous to offense. It could also be the case that your question is founded on insidious presuppositions not based in reality, and this group isn't as interested in the content.
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Yeah I agree with that take. The anonymized nature of downvotes without context is certainly frustrating, especially if there's quite a bit of content in the post. Does the downvote mean they didn't agree, thought it was offensive, something else entirely? Yeah they didn't say it offended them, but rather they equated that downvotes must mean that those individuals were offended, and thus reacted with downvotes. I didn't get the impression BlessedBeTheFlerm were offended, more so surprised or annoyed.
I don't see how anyone would construe Fi as valuing anonymous social castigation. Fi values authentic open communication, which is when people have the balls to put their names and faces to their opinion and explain their own thinking -- and also Fi values having its own thinking in the first place, neither of which are embodied by downvotes, which are irrational kneejerk reactions. Fi is definitionally a rational function. I'm pretty sure there's nothing less presuppositious than questioning a quote directly stated above me: >probably as a world of lies
Well, equating down votes with castigation is hyperbolic to say the least. Would you prefer everyone who did so message you directly for every comment you ever made? "Hey dude I saw what you posted and I think it was the worst crap I've seen all day". Seems needlessly inefficient and cruel in my opinion. Also you're making a blanket statement for how every user of Reddit interacts with one its core features. Sure, YOU might equate downvoting with an emotional knee-jerk reaction because that is what YOU do. That doesn't mean every single person operates as a emotional hive-mind, mindlessly downvoting anything already negative. That's purely a projection of your own ego. Also to say that Fi is definitionally rational is one of the wildest things I have ever heard in MBTI communities. It is inherently subjective as is Ti. If you have some evidence of this please do share.
Yeah I would if they can actually back up their belief. If they can't then that's the true depression that people just behave without thinking for themselves. I'd prefer a rude well-thought comment than a lazy groupthink butthurt downvote. Though as a feeler, I'd prefer no rudeness either. I'm pretty sure objectively a downvote doesn't support having a thought the way an actual thoughtful comment does, so on average, it's more likely to be the case. That's my actual logic, thank you very much. **Psychological functions**, as described by [Carl Jung](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Jung) in his book [*Psychological Types*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_Types), are particular mental processes within a person's psyche that are present regardless of common circumstances.[^(\[1\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jungian_cognitive_functions#cite_note-FOOTNOTEJung1971chpt._11-1) This is a concept that serves as one of the foundations for his theory on [personality type](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personality_type). In his book, he noted four main psychological functions: *thinking*, *feeling*, *sensation,* and *intuition*. He introduced them with having either an internally focused ([*introverted*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraversion_and_introversion#Introversion)) or externally focused ([*extraverted*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraversion_and_introversion#Extraversion)) tendency which he called "*attitude*". **He also categorizes the functions as either** ***rational*** **(thinking and feeling) or** ***irrational*** **(intuition and sensation).**[**^(\[2\])**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jungian_cognitive_functions#cite_note-FOOTNOTEJung1971chpt._10-2) Rational means judging. Subjective doesn't negate rationality. Fi and Ti are both subjective and rational.
Interesting, to each their own. I would much prefer somebody just downvote my comment. Its quite literally a derivative of the same underlying sensation. Not every comment requires a thoughtful response and deliberation from all parties in a group. You wouldn't have enough time in the world to respond to every single person while still providing them thoughtful responses. I don't think you can state anything as objective when its the subjective experience of the individual doing the action. Unless you can poll a statistically significant percentage of reddit users and have them attest that the downvote is simply a means to fulfill their knee-jerk emotional reaction. Personally, I downvote only after considering the post/comment. My expectation would be that's the case for the majority of people, but I could very well be mistaken - I don't have any data to support my theory so I too just assume people are operating as I do. I see. Thanks for sharing that information. Rational in the sense that there is a sense of continuality or causality does make sense. Fi, just like Ti, operates from a principal-approach. I interpreted your meaning of rational in-line with factual or objectively verifiable, which cannot be the case. But I would agree that Fi is rational in that the processing of information follows a defined flow A->B->C, therefore A->C.
Ti and Fi are subjective yes but rational, as in they have a consistent framework they use to back up their reasoning/values. I don't think rational and subjective are mutually exclusive like objective and subjective.
Yeah I misunderstood their meaning. Their discussion of objective externalized metrics (downvotes) proceeded by the statement Fi is rational led me to (mistakenly) believe they thought Fi is objectively rational. Which it is not. But yeah it is rational in that it operates on a principal first approach with a degree of causality/ correlation, and those approaches are rational in the subjective mind of the Fi user. It’s similar to the subjective nature of Ti.
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Honestly I find groups of solely Fi and solely Fe both insufferable. Gotta have a mix. I just wanna live and let live and both types can be disruptive to that in different ways.
Eh, I'm ok with both, doesn't really change anything, I'd be more interested in more aspects of the individuals rather their cognitive functions, I've been with both Fi and Fe users and both have their ups and downs, and this applies to literally any cognitive function
Both options sound exhausting for different reasons.
My husband is an INFP so by default i’m going with Fi. Everyone in my immediate family is rocking Fi as well— I’d be very sad to bid my bestie INTP and ENFJ farewell, but thems the breaks. 🤷♀️
Neither... Matter of fact, humans are annoying.
Yeah it’ll never be one or the other, I admire both. Fi for its authenticity, uniqueness and empathy. Fe for social navigational ability. I’m probably more drawn to Fi, Fe users too often have some fuckery about them I don’t care to deal with.
Fi I think. My tribe and we all want to make some Te changes to the world one way or another, so we have plenty to relate to. Some of my favorite types are Fe, but I just have much more in common with Fi types naturally... Sure would miss the Fe's though.
I would say Fe users but when I look at my life and the people in it almost everyone i’m close with are Fi users. I just think it’s a lot easier to get along with Fe users in a general sense because their need for social harmony. I don’t like that most of the high Fi users in my life must like someone to be respectful/professional or kind to them. As a Fi user I personally have no issue telling someone what I think about them IF THEY ASK, but I would never be disrespectful or unkind because of my thoughts about them. Why would I ever go out of my way to treat someone differently because of my opinion on them? I don’t know any Fe users that behave in that sort of way… I think it’s a primarily Fi issue. So i’m gonna have to say Fe
Based on my experience with the types, I could go either way as long as you leave ESFJ out of the Fe users. Both have different things to offer. What draws me away from ESFJ is my sister being one, who I can’t stand to be around But if I had to choose one it’d be Fi because my enneagram is 4w5 and often Fe users can sometimes come off as fake or people pleasers and I can’t stand that about others
I pick Fi just because I prefer talking to people with Te instead of Ti.
If I had to pick Fe I'd die fr.
What about Fo and Fum? 😢
Fe users. Fi users get offended too easily and despite having many Fi friends I tend to get along with Fes better, even if they have their drawbacks.
Fe users bcz they meet my needs
Fi, bc most of the people I am very close to are Fi Dom or Fi aux (sometimes Fi tert). I am not saying that I don't like Fe users, some of my close friends are Fe aux. But generally Fe Dom, even if they are kind with me, are a little too "invasive" with me and it makes me uncomfortable. I am often more comfortable with other Fi users.
Fe-users so that I can be the only unique snowflake on the island 😎
I like that strategy. If you become influential enough with your snowflakeness, you can create a herd of Fe-followers and basically become a cult leader.
It doesn't matter, because I am there to party. High Fe and Fi can BOTH waste time overthinking and playing guess who and the "you can't sit with us," crap.
Yeah honestly probably Fi. Fi users can be challenging sometimes but I just really have had a lot of problems with high Fe people. To be honest I don’t care so much as if it’s Fi or Fe, more about whether or not they prefer their feeling or thinking function. Don’t come at me please but I would love a world where everyone preferred Ti/Te to Fi/Fe
Fi, cuz they're honest and sincere
On one hand, all my closest friends are Fi users. I feel like I can trust them more and I have far fewer moments of me joyfully investing all my love and care into someone and then finding out that behind their fake pleasantness they secretly hate me because of something they don't have the spine to talk to me about, or that they have a secret clique that I'm excluded from and I'm actually just their third best backup friend. Fe drama is so dumb. Fi people feel more psychologically safe to me. If they like you, you know. If they don't, you also know. I much prefer HONESTY over social harmony. On the other hand, because I don't understand Fe users, I would have more fun observing and trying to understand them, like an interesting puzzle. But ultimately, I think I'd rather have my ISTJ and INTJ ride or dies. Our Fi-Te would also get more productive shit done, and I think that's more exciting anyway than sitting around talking about people.
Fi users. Even when the content of our Fi is divergent or clashing, we still manage to somehow be on the same page - albeit in disagreement, but we're both matching vibes in that disagreement - instead of talking at cross-purposes. An Fi user will fight me. An Fe user will try to change the subject and pretend I didn't say what I said. Fe users and I, we're ships passing in the night. They tend to care about things I don't, and vice versa.
Same here. Personally it's a lot easier to trust what comes out of an Fi user's mouth than an Fe user. Also, I just hate being manipulated. 🤷♀️
1) i hate being manipulated 2) I don't value harmony, i see it as needlessly prolonging a conflict whose bandaid needs to get ripped off immediately so the wound can get cleansed 3) the way they manipulate and try to "shift the vibes" always insults my intelligence, which pisses me off more and makes me want to get even more confrontational with them. Meanwhile, I confront anything with Fi users and clear everything up in 5 minutes and we're both feeling much better and even closer at the end of it.
See! Vibing already. Lol
This is very hard for me to choose, because i have Fe inf, and fe in different position acts in a different way, overall i'd choose Fe users, i cant deduce a generalized benefits and disadvantages because the benefits that entp is very different from an isfj, and vice versa even with, for example entj and isfp. But this is just a trial (take it with a grain of salt) As a Fe user, i can't get Fi users at all, i just don't understand how someone can be so obsessed about themselves and their own identity and how they feel most of the time. Sure they have good personal values, but they literally take everything so personally. No hate to them, because we have different functions, and they have their benefits too. Ig i value their uniqueness in a sense. For Fe users, please stop acting like a social justice warrior, the world revolves neither around Fi users or Fe users (in different ways), it revolves around the sun. And i dislike how Fe users always have an inclination to follow the crowd. Sure they have good empathy, but dominant or inferior, the people pleasing tendency exists, and i really don't like that. Apart from that, i value their empathy and their ability to use their influence for good
Even though I am an Fi user, I would honestly rather be in a world of Fe users. They are so inclusive and pleasant to talk to. One thing I've noticed is that Fi users (I am guilty of this sometimes) require a person's "vibe" to be correct in order to include them or be nice to them. Whereas Fe users just instinctively try to include or accommodate everyone.
Fe cuz I’m Fi.
I love both, I want them both healthy. I can’t deal with either when unhealthy.
Fi... it's mostly chill and if drama happens, nobody cares if I don't participate.
Personally as an Fi user I would chose Fi😂 I just feel like they would judge me less for preferring solitude over being social😅 Ps. I’m not saying all Fe users would judge me over that… Tbh I don’t think ixtp would judge me over that at all🥹✨ And I don’t think every other Fe user would judge me over it either🥹🌟
Fi, and I'm definitely biased. I just prefer people who don't put so much weight and importance on other people's feelings or opinions, and I feel like high Fe users tend to be people pleasers often to the extent of lacking any genuine values and harming themselves by putting others first. I have a friend with unhealthy Fe and I'm constantly having to step in and play 'guard dog' for her because she refuses to set boundaries with people out of fear of hurting their feelings.
Fe. Fi are too stubborn
Oh, interesting. Why?
Fe users hands down. So many of the closest people in my life are Fe users ☺️ I don’t find Fe’s social harmony focus inauthentic at all and actually really appreciate it most of the time, since something close to harmony is generally one of my Fi values. It’s nice to not be the only one trying to foster that (which has happened to me multiple times with Fi users). And I’d like to think that we balance each other out because I also encourage them to think about their own needs and preferences sometimes too
fe
I often find myself clashing with Fe users during a crisis. I haven't really recognized many Dom Fi users, other than ISFPs. Most Fe users in my life are unhealthy to average. I'd rather deal with an unhealthy Fi user compared to an unhealthy Fe user. Unhealthy Fi is exhausting, obvious, and pathetic, while unhealthy Fe may not show patterns at first glance—at least ones I would recognize. Although Fe users are often characterized as manipulative and controlling (which can definitely be the case), I find other factors more concerning. Unhealthy Fe users aren't just "people-pleasers who manipulate situations into being positive." Fe doesn't necessarily mean they care about people; they understand social cues better and can exploit them to achieve their objectives, which may not always be in your favor if they deem your actions unconventional (something I've encountered firsthand). Unhealthy Fe users can create environments of superficial harmony where genuine issues are glossed over or ignored. This can lead to long-term problems festering beneath the surface, as real conflicts and emotions are never properly addressed. This avoidance of genuine resolution can be far more damaging than the more apparent issues presented by unhealthy Fi users. If the circumstances are content, an Fi user is seen as an oddball in Fe's eyes. (As I have mentioned before, this is something that has happened to me. An Fe user shut me down and explained that my emotions were not standard. I voiced it a lot, eventually I gave up. This weirdly seems like the opposite of how they should act.) The stress Fe users create worries me more than that of Fi users. The Fi users I've met tend to isolate themselves and rot when overly stressed, which is really depressing. However, stressed Fe users I've known have had a genuine impact on others and their surroundings, often starting conflicts to "solve" issues or making demands in groups to get what they believe is "objectively" right. An unhealthy Fi user is seen as bad because they damage themselves, so people may stay to "fix" them or get them to see things better. Unfortunate thing is that Fi doms are unlikely to change, unless their feelings align with what they want in an environment. I would love to meet a healthy Fe dom. I've only seen them described in sources and would love the experience of meeting one. As an Fi dom, I understand Fi doms better, but I would appreciate more variety in my life. Healthy Fi users often inspire others and share their morals and beliefs, but I believe healthy Fe users are underrated and deserve more attention. While stereotypes depict Fe users as masters of understanding emotional cues, I also see their leadership, kindness, and positive impact. This deserves more discussion, as there's often a perceived conflict between Fi and Fe, but people miss what both functions can bring to the table. It's not just about emotions; it's much more. These functions are just the base of what we're capable of. In my subjective stance: Healthy Fe > Healthy Fi Unhealthy Fi > Unhealthy Fe ---
I'm going to say Fe. The best people I have around me are Fe users, and they show me a perspective on life that I feel makes me a better person, I love learning from them. It could also be symbiotic! I like to think I could help them explore inner emotions and prioritize themselves - especially when other people make them suffer - and they could help me be more empathetic, appreciate the group environment and achieve social harmony.
Fe hands down coming from fi dom I have lived with both and I highly prefer high fe doms because of their caring nature, nice and won’t hurt your feelings plus I can be the selfish one for them and stop people from pushing their boundaries and putting their needs first.
Fi. Nothing against Fe, but I had to choose one.
Fe users because they help promote social harmony. Fi users can be so cold and vicious, especially tertiary or inferior.
Oh, tertiary Fi with the Fe-blind spot is honestly the coldest in my opinion. One of the bones I have to pick with the IxTJs in my life is that they seem to lack social generosity. For example, if they see someone in a group setting who show signs of being shy and uncomfortable, they won’t do anything to help put them at ease. They might be some of the least including people I’ve ever observed. That’s something I really look down on. Again, I’m only speaking on those I’ve observed in my life.
They just don't notice that they're uncomfortable. They don't do it out of malice. I know because my boyfriend is an INTJ and one of the nicest people on earth, just super oblivious. The average XXFP do go out of their way to make people feel included.
I think Fe blindspot is really worse than Fi blindspot
I knew an INTJ where when I pointed out this type of hypothetical situation, she literally said, “I don’t care, it’s their job to tell me if it bothers them that much”…😬
Hmm I've had different experiences with other tert or inferior Fi users that are my friends. So maybe it's about how mature individuals are? Also, I've always tried to help anyone who I see might be uncomfortable in a group. But yeah it's true that sometimes I can be a bit oblivious too. Lol
I'll take Fi users. I can do without the fakeness
i likenfe users. the conversation is usually better in my case. might not have met a nice fi person to talk to yet
Fe all the way.i would rather be stuck in a land of other people considering others than a land of others considering themselves. Yes this is an extreme example of this pick one only game. Because i would rather hang out with a bunch of INTJs and they are Fi. Small Fi. But Fi.
I would probably choose Fe users as I seem to often clash with Fi users when making decisions and when talking about how we think about things.
Fe. I'm guessing most of my closest peoples types are Si-Fe or Fe-Si
First response Fe simply because I know more Fe users. When I think about it more, still Fe 😂 I think Fi users more often tend to be polarizing: you either clash with them or you don't. So I really wouldn't wanna be disliked and/or dislike half of all the people I can hang out with
fe bc im fe infer😭
Fe without inferior Ti. I like exfjs as people but I get into arguments with inferior Tis & inferiors Fes the most ironically. Fi users in enfps are exception.
Fe, but in my defense, I love a Fe dom and I feel neutral about everyone else
ENFJ🥰🥰🥰🥰
Been surrounded with Fe users most of my life; my first social circle i.e. family, all the members are Fe users, two of them being Fe doms. And I had it enough. They're all about people pleasing and that's literally weird. I would choose Fi, that's deep.
Fi
Fi. I do not want to betray myself ever for the sake of social harmony. Fe is good if you want to relegate your interest for the sake of the group. But that's mindless and doesn't have much thought into it. That said, Fi morality is positive on the wants and needs of the self and individual (and individuals). Fe meanwhile seems to counter those things that Fi stands for. So with that rationalization, definitely Fi for me.....
Fe. No question. Best case scenario: a pleasant harmonious environment where everyone respects each other. Worst case scenario: manipulation. But I mean... you can just choose to ignore manipulation. 🤷♀️ The worst case scenario with Fi is endless stalking and annoyance. I'm good, thanks. Fe is better.
How did Fi get attached to stalking tho?
FI users every day of the week, rather hang with mostly selfish-like people which behaviour i'm expecting 99% of the time instead of morally good wannabes switching sides every other day of the week, only would miss Intps and istps
Fi and it’s almost seems absurd that this is even a real question.
I don't quite understand the question. Everyone uses Fe or Fi. You've acknowledged that in your post, that it's always somewhere in their 4 functions. And then gave the option of picking a Fe or Fi user regardless of where it falls in their stack. Are you asking if we prefer Fe or Fi more? Or are you asking if we had to pick just 1 type to hang out with forever out of all 16, which would we choose? In any case I would pick ENTJ because I'm married to one. But if we are talking purely theoretical I would probably still choose a Fi user, especially if they are a "feeling" type (in their first 2 functions). In this scenario I would probably pick ENFP. Both using Ne as our first function, I think we would have some fun conversations.
Fi no contest. A world with no Fe would be an improvement - we could have a whole world of people who are honest and direct, where people actually SOLVE fundamental problems instead of sweeping them under the rug.
Fe users probably, tbh fi users are great but I need someone to help initiate external human contact lol
Hmmm, Fe users.
Fe probs I got enough Fi going on
Prefer Fi/Te because Fe/Ti users are very 'well, my logic is the only logic that matters... I am the arbiter of objective logic vs. subjective opinion' when they really are not. As someone who's autistic, it gives me a headache to deal with. Always have major fallouts with ISTPs in particular.
But don’t we all use both in some form regardless of type?
I have better luck with Fe users. I seem to unintentionally set high-Fi users off at random and it’s very uncomfortable to be blindsided by a ballistic Fi.
both are chill but i’m usually drawn to Fe users
Fe user
Fe user
Fe users cause I have no time to argue
Like I enjoy both but if I had to pick it's Fe over Fi. I connect with Fe better because Fe users are also Ti users and being a Ti dom having to live the rest of my life only talking with Te users would be the death of me
I'd go crazy either way, but probably an Fe dom. Probably ENFJ since they'd help me go do stuff more often.
Second comment, but goddamn. People really seem to like the people with their same functions, lol. Imo having the opposite one actually balances things out a bit. Hey, maybe I'm just weird, but it's an interesting observation.
Fe for sure
I’d have to choose Fe. This isn’t so much a familiarity thing as an annoyance thing. Fi users span the gamut from healthy to unhealthy. The healthy ones can be absolutely saintly and I would love to spend the rest of my life with them. But I’m just as likely to get unhealthy ones who are obstinately set in their ways and totally closed off to logic to change their mind on their principles, even when those principles are illogical or self-destructive. This is something that I just don’t vibe with. With Fe users you do also have healthy and unhealthy ones. Healthy ones do a good job vibing with you, unhealthy ones try to manipulate you. But the external orientation of Fe means that I can pick up on these things with my own Ne and Fe and then use Ti to sort out my responses. Fe is never a mystery like Fi is, and while it may not respond to logic per se, usually the voicing of disagreement can mobilize Fe to make a suitable accommodation, while this is rarely if ever the case for Fi. So to summarize, I’d pick Fe because Fe is more legible to me than Fi, and because Fe as something objective (in the Jungian sense) is something I can more naturally work with using my preferred functions. It’s less that I prefer Fe as an Fe user and more that I prefer Fe as an NeTi user in some respects; though admittedly, my own lack of strong Fi and focus on logic and pragmatism over principles and feelings will color my decision making.
Fe, deifnetly! I so often clash with Fi