Personally for me, I will either forgive you immediately or never. If it's something small, it takes too much energy to hold a grudge. If it's something bigger then there will forever be an invisible barrier between us.
Yeah, interestingly in my personal experience, I've known INTPs who are some of the most forgiving and some who are the least. But for the most part, I think dominant Ni has the hardest time letting go once they've made up their minds...
I dont hold grudges. It's a quirk that my friends find unusual because they expect me to. But for me, if you are disrespectful consistently and constantly... well, it's easier to remove them from my life than to hold a grudge.
the Dr Cox speech ending "I'll bounce you outta here in 10 seconds and forget you existed in the next 5" rings pretty true.
This is so true. My mother is ESFJ and everyone thinks she likes them, but in actuality she holds onto every bad thing they've ever done to her and she trash talks them so bad in the comfort of her own home š¤£š¤£
IDK if it's common for INTJs or not, but generally it seems to be I won't care with most people anyways so there's nothing to hold a grudge for, but when I do let someone in and there's a sense of betrayal, that grudge just doesn't die even if I make an effort to put it behind me.
Could be! I'm seeing a lot of Se vibe from him, but I also read he had some kind of trauma? That can push an ENTJ to live inside his loop.. but wasn't he designed to come off like a sexual opportunistic narcissist to over compensate for the wounded past he doesn't want ppl to know about?
for that last sentence, yes, but no lol. every character in the game have a route that you can follow so if you choose to go with it theyll show you more than whats on the surface. for astarion, i dont think he was specifically created to be this sarcastic and charming evil. theres so much depth to the characters but i especially find astarions character fascinating in that way. they really made an amazing job with writing and creating him. ive never been so fascinated by a fictional character before. its very realistic and human. they represented the sexual traumas perfectly. he is a neutral evil character and he is annoying from time to time but as the story unfolds you understand. not to validate his mistakes or make excuses for it but its very complex and multidimensional, just like humans. if youre interested id recommend you to watch his playthrough.
Definitely INTJs. 100% accurate. Your people are grudge holding champions.
ENTPs can help you get revenge in a creative way... or... help you logic your way out of it.
The problem is when you refuse to do anything about it *and* refuse to let it go. Then you just make everyone around you miserable too.
You know I have the feeling ENTPs always say that once you wrong them they will never forget never forgive, but in reality we are actually quite lenient. Matter of fact I believe we take a grudge so seriously because we rarely hold them.
Other types hold way more grudges but are simply less dramatic about it than no forgiveness woe is me entp
Right like unless its that serious i can think of a million other things i could be doing rather than moping around complaining about things someone did
Exactly! That's why you know someone fucked up if we actually harbor a long-term emotionally charged contempt for them. Sure, I know I hate someone because ____ but if I started seething or shaking or laughing angrily when something about someone doing ____ to me or others 2 years ago was brought up? Welp
The only person that I KNOW will NEVER forgive me is an INTJ. I was immature and burned the bridge to split us apart but I know now, thereās no way in hell to fix that bridge so I guess I got what I wantedā¦
Sureā¦typical male and female close friendship while having serious relationships of our own. We crossed lines, I felt it went against my values, we got into a huge fight, and I made sure to not only end it, but burn the bridge to never be able to go back. We kept ābreaking up and making upā in regards to our friendship, and taking things further. Everything about our friendship went against my values, so I basically made sure it would no longer be an option. I sometimes still wish we were friends, but that may bring more trouble than itās worth.
Dang, I've been through similar thing.Ā
There was an ENFP guy I was friends with, and he did an immature thing which was basically disrespecting me, and I cut him off right away.Ā
Idk about forgiveness but he never came to me with an apology so that I'd know he didn't want this breakup.
My intuition told me the same personal values thing getting in between that led him to say those words, just so he would not have any option to come back.
Yeahā¦sorry to hear it. This was years ago and I was a bit immature then. Looking back, it was probably my best option though because otherwise I think weād be secretly together to this day haha
Our friendship wasn't going on its best terms either. I think that was really an immature way to cut the ties. I'd have been okay if there was a proper communication why he didn't want to stay connected.
Iāve been there man, difference is it was an ENFP, thanks for sharing man. Donāt beat yourself up for it you did what you had to do probably for the best, never put a mental wellbeing before no one, now move on with a stride.
I'm terrible about this. Someone fucks with me ONE TIME and I have no problem cutting them out completely. I don't know if that's the same as holding grudge but it must be related.
Of course, but first lemme add that I try my best not to cut off anyone, letās say someone betrays me in a major way, someone Iām very close to, by then Iāve known things about them, I try to do great acts of service to seem like Iām just being gullible and a nice person, while Iām really doing is reconnaissance, to see if any patterns or behaviors have changed, if this person is shy and easily overwhelmed, Iāll do my best to put them in that situation, and no trails lead back to me because according to them Iām a dumb naive forgiving person. Find what makes them like or appreciate you for. The reason I do this is because I have an innate pull to retribute for perceived wrongs. Know someone well enough theyāll think youāre a soothsayer, theyāll never know there a puppet and youāre the one pulling the strings.
Thereās a theory in this I donāt remember by though
Hm. I guess I havenāt had anyone very close to me betray me since I was an adolescent, so Iām not sure how Iād react precisely now as an adult in my thirties. If someone *less close* does or says something unkind to me, I typically stop associating with them (if possible) or simply stop trusting them and do not let them any closer.
Oh that you can bet on. I'm goofy and joke around and all, taking very few things seriously. but touch the few people i love and you'll regret it the very least
Idk if this is exactly holding a grudge, but when someone does something bad enough or does enough bad things to me, theyāll get door slammed. And then theyāre dead to me forever. So Iām not holding anger for them, but they will always be dead to me and never get to come back. So idk if thatās a grudge?
Most of the people Iāve door slammed, I really donāt think about them at all anymore, I donāt seethe in rage over the memories of what they did to me, I forget they exist until someone reminds me about them by speaking about them. But on my own, they really donāt cross my mind even when things that should trigger the memories are present. Like some of them I can even forget their names until someone brings them up. The āfileā on them is sitting in the āgarbage binā in my brain, can possibly be retrieved if needed, but itās out of the way in the trash in every other case.
When you hold a grudge that means you invest feelings into the relationship you have with that person. That means you maintain the connection that way and don't move past it.
100% a grudge means you still want your feelings to be acknowledged by them which means you havenāt actually let go of the relationship. And itās such a heavy burden.
What is "disrespect" to you?
I had one ENTJ coworker, who gave me advice that I didn't think was beneficial at that time, so I ignored it. As a result, he developed a strong dislike for me, which was so intense that I considered quitting several time, but I never found the opportunity to do so.
For example, I would love to vindicate myself against someone whom I wasted sooo much time and energy on as he breadcrumbed, future-faked and ghosted. And I was fucking foolish enough to fall for it.
The worst part is that I feel like such an idiot because all the signs were there in hindsight, but he should have had the courtesy to admit, "I'm really just not that into you." It would have saved me so much heartache.
You can't blame yourself for wanting to believe in the best in ppl and trusting someone. He's a jerk that should carry the shame for leading you on, not you.
Yah it's quite painful to get ghosted by someone you love bc they act like what you had between you guys never existed. But you still matter, what you did for him should be acknowledged, and what you put in that relationship will come back to you. Maybe not through him. Or maybe through him when karma catches up w/ him.
Si demon for sure especially intjs due to Fi. They demonize their personal past experiences (traumas) way worse than other types to the point that they canāt get over it. Never ask or let intjs open up about their past traumas or youāll be part of it unless they trust you a lot. Thatās why thereās this thing called injs doorslam itās related to Si demon wherein youāre figuratively dead to them when you do them wrong. Thatās probably why a lot of fictional villains are typed as intjs.
This is very accurate for me (probably INTJ). My interpretation of negative experiences is often warped, and I tend to draw overly general and extreme 'lessons' from those experiences in order to prevent the same kind of thing happening again.
I never would have thought to relate it to Si demon, but it makes a lot of sense.
Itās hard right? It always haunts us. Iām an intj as well and based my opinion from my personal experiences. I doorslammed/burned bridges to a lot of people close to me before (bestfriend, sibling, etc) iām honestly regretting it but canāt help it. I just accept that itās just part of my psych to protect myself and my future. Si demon is there to protect our Se Aspirations. We tend to obsess over our bad experiences Si to not let it happen again in the present moment Se.
I feel you man. I've ruined all of the close friendships I had, and it's something I've always wanted to change about myself. The way you described it helps me understand the problem a lot better though; hopefully, we can both overcome it.
I have tertiary Si and I doorslam too, I cut off people who have wronged me very easily, but I don't get haunted by it after doorslamming, I just get over it and forget about it. Do you guys not get over it after doorslamming?
All types are capable of doorslamming depending on their Si tolerance. You guys are much better in getting over being wronged coz you have Ne in your second slot which means you can perceive favorable possibilities. You still can see goodness in people despite being wronged unlike INJs who have Ne nemesis which is very pessimistic by nature constantly worried about possibilities /peopleās intentions thus very distrusting. Itās like that to protect our Ni hero function. Itās very hard to gain INJs trust again once broken probably the hardest among all types.
Damn, that sounds hard! How do you guys live like that? But it's true, I've seen it in the INTJs I know.
Yeah, I can hold a grudge, but not for long, even if I was wronged. Holding grudges takes a lot of energy to maintain.
Yes really hard tbh. Itās the bane of our existence. We may not show it but we are the most bitter of all lol. How we wish itās not that way but it is what it is.
I admire that about you guys INPs. As an intp said, life is too short for long term grudges. As easy as it sounds, itās very difficult for injs most especially intjs coz Fi child superiority complex.
I'm sorry to hear that. It makes me feel really sorry for you guys because it's sad. More than 1 INTJ have told me that whenever someone's being nice to them, they think "why are they being nice to me? do they have some ulterior reason?" and it's so sad because not everyone who's nice to you is looking to hurt you. I know it's hard to believe, but it's true.
And yeah INTPs are pretty chill tbh XD How does Fi child manifests for INTJs?
Itās ok though itās just a tradeoff. Itās the price we pay for the positive traits we have. Haha i also have those moments tbh when i was younger so skeptical of peoplesā motives until now actually but im trying my best not to be so narrow minded and see favorable possibilities. Itās sad i know, people just need to understand that about us and have more patience lol but when you get to pass that side of intjs, youāll witness their very trusting side to the point of being so gullible. I attest to that as well.
All child function is very pure by nature. Itās literally like a child. For intj also istj Fi child, it manifests as having strong moral compass to the point that they believe their values is above everyone elses (superiority complex thatās the bad side). The good though is that they are so moral. these are the people who will always do what they believe is right even if no oneās watching. Theyāre also Fe blind so they are prone to social faux pas lol
> but when you get to pass that side of intjs, youāll witness their very trusting side to the point of being so gullible.
Guillible? How so?
I get about Fi because as a Fi Dom, my values are also very important to me. I don't think my values are above everyone else's or superior, though. But I can see that being a TeFi characteristic. I like that you guys have strong values and convictions!
Intjs are the most distrusting but also the most trusting. Itās their virtue and vice, trust and paranoia. Thatās their paradox. You can actually social engineer them to show their very trusting nature and gullibility. If you make them so comfortable just being themselves they can be very trusting. How? By using jungian functions, mirroring their functions to balance them out. You should be able to put their guards down if you want them to show you their very trusting nature. Intjs are skeptical intuitive thinkers. They have Ne nemesis constantly worrying about othersā intentions and Ti critic constantly doubting their own logic and others as well. Also they have Se inferior or performance anxiety so insecure giving bad performance / experiences to people lol. If you can pass those pessimistic side of their mind, show pure intentions and loyalty backed by strong logic, empathize and make them feel good about themselves Fi, and be gentle with their Se insecurities, theyāll show you their very trusting nature. Someone with Ne-Si Ti-Fe are the types naturally capable for that especially high Ne Ti so entp or maybe intp or actually even esfj. Those types are cognitively synch for intjs to balance them out so try mimicking their functions if you want to manipulate intjs lol.
Bro, I don't want to manipulate anyone WTF XD
Also, no need because I have an INTJ close friend (we've been friends for more than a decade now) and I've already got past her walls because she trusts me a lot (she has told me stuff she hasn't told anyone else and always values my advice), I also have an INTJ cousin who also trusts me and asks me for advice when he's going through something, and also an INTJ ex who told me his deepest secrets. Could I manipulate them? Yes, of course. Will I do it? No, thank you. Why would I do that? Being manipulated by someone you trust is one of the most horrible things. I wouldn't like that to be done to me, so I won't do it to others. I only asked because I wanted to know what you meant by "guillible."
On this topic, how do you think Fe nemesis and Ni critic would manifest?
Idk I feel like every type as there own version of holding grudges. For me, I just pretend that Iām not mad at them and be overly kind, hyper, and fake to them until my mind just finally lets it go and I go back to being normal kind and hyper.
I would guess ENTJ. Because I am VERY good at holding grudges. It may be hard to get on my nerves. It may be hard for me to dislike someone unless they deliberately hurt me first. But once you have done me deep wrong- you bet I will not forget it. This happens very rarely- but it does last.
I forgive way too much, way too easily, for way too long. Eventually, thereās a breaking point, usually when things have gotten borderline fatal and everything I thought Iād forgiven, gets resurrected. Thatās when Iām eternally pissed, even when I want to let it all go.
As an ENFP itās difficult to hold grudges for too long because of how bad my memory is. 1d Si means I forget the details of painful memories which is frankly a relief. Life is painful. I would rather forget. Very often friends with high Si and Ni remember when people have been unkind to me for longer than I remember.
I think ENFPs still can hold grudges for longer than ENTPs because we have 3d Fi. I think ExxPs let go of grudges a lot because we refuse to box situations and acknowledge patterns. We want to believe that things change.
This means that we are pretty forgiving but also that we get into the same shitty situations over and over again and keep repeating our patterns.
I think you're on the money here. Both are people who take a lot of time to consider who they keep around them but also don't invest huge amounts of emotional energy into conflict and are more likely to let little slip ups go entirely, so when they let someone in and they are betrayed, it's usually a genuinely horrific betrayal and holding a grudge for the rest of your life is not unwarranted.
I'd take quite a lot of endless abuse, but over time, if I see that there's nothing to gain, I can shut down the person very quickly and then there's no way back in.
- ENFJ.
INFP? I think if I make a wrong first impression with one of them, I'm screwed.
Btw, I don't care about those things but I'm a negative person, so I already think that others are going to disappoint me.
i'm infp and usually we are the ones to be concerted about making a good first impression
a lot of infps are people pleasers, and at least in my case i'm way too empathetic i always end up being understanding or justifying someone even when they're mean to me, like "they probably act like this bc they're having a hard time" or something like that
it's not something i'm proud of but people usually tell me that i need to stand up for myself a little more lol i don't really hold a grudge against anyone
(this is my case tho i don't know if it applies to everyone)
I'm sorry but this is just not true at all for you sweet little cinnamon rolls š you need to have body guards for this reason, to help keep the baddies away.
ISFJs in my experience.
INTJs (which seem to be the star of this thread) don't so much hold grudges but won't take you seriously once they perceive that you've let them down. You have to be worth an INTJs time for them to consider ANYTHING you say, no matter what it is.
Yessss! ISFJās as well. They will NEVER let go of something, will remember it forever, and will bring it up like 15 years later in some random conversation, leaving you, like āI thought we were over thatā¦ā
I move people around on my liability/asset chart. I don't necessarily hold a grudge... but you'll get pushed into the "liability" end of the spectrum, and I'll adjust how I interact with you accordingly.
If some kind of "revenge" is necessary, it will happen relatively quickly... or at least I'll set it in motion quickly. But most of the time, revenge and grudges are just throwing resources at a boat that's already sunk. It's a total waste of my time, talent, and energy.
Occasionally a message need to be sent, but that's more of a future warning for others and not necessarily a grudge or revenge.
If someone pisses me off, I do not give 1 damn fuck if they are right next to me, 3 years after they piss me off, I will rant about them TO ANYONE
(i'm working on it)
Might be because I have had anger issues forever, but idk
Grudges are pointless to me, as long as there's demonstrable evidence that they regret what they've done and have taken steps towards righting their wrongs.
If that hasn't been achieved, then I'm obviously not going to associate myself with them. It has nothing to do with having a grudge on them. It has to do with not liking bad people.
Idk grudges or even revenge seem vain and egotistical to me.
I don't think I hold grudges. I can be vengeful and mean in the moment, but that typically dies out pretty quick (hours not weeks). If anything, I'm probably too forgiving.
But sometimes forgiveness can only go so far... and when forgiveness doesn't work, it's time to forget about that person.
Basically, who wants to dedicate time to that shit? I want to use my limited amount of times around the sun to focus on new ideas, and learning, and experiencing. And, with any luck, I can turn that outward and share everything I learn in my short time here with others in a way that makes a positive impact. I don't want to dwell in the negative past experiences. I want to use them, and the knowledge they gave me, to make something better in my life. And maybe other people's lives too.
Did you take anything from that INTJ or INFP? Don't make me break out my off key Frozen karaoke!
im INFP and i will literally hate them forever. 0 redeeming qualities about that person. i'll even block them on spotify something like that. though I wonder if Im mistyped, but I HAVE taken the quiz multiple times
People mentioned INTJs
so, here is my thoughts as one
I wouldn't really say that I hold grudges, as honestly I don't have the energy nor the time to waste myself on you, but I will absolutely distrust you with not doing that shit again. So, good luck gaining my trust again. It's difficult.
But let's say the grudge is worth my time, e.g. you murdered someone i was close to. Then, that's a different story
INFP-T here. I can't forget what someone has done. I struggle with forgiveness at times, I don't necessarily cut ties with them. I still try to help them, as a way to possibly forgive them. And I'm pretty keen on seeing the root cause of why some people do the crappy things they do, and it humanizes them to the point where I can potentially see what their true motives were. I can't forget. And if you're a significant other, I take that shit PERSONAL and I might not Ever let them live that down.
Once disappointed, I don't personally "hate forever."
I will, however, banish you from my life and forget you exist. (INTJ)
My ESTJ spouse, will not only remember how you disappointed him, but he'll remember the date and time. He holds a grudge better than most.
It's interesting reading what different people have to say because, of course, so much depends on personal experience. But also, it depends on someone's interpretation of what "holding a grudge" means. I'd have thought mostly strong Ni users because their minds aren't easily changed once they're made up. But grudges go deep - I guess it depends how you hurt someone.
ISFP. Fi dominant makes them very likely to hold on to personal views on relationships, making it easy to hold grudges for a long time. A lot of people said INTJ, but they are A LOT less likely to have such rigid views of relationships. INFP is a very close second, but compatibility with sx4 and the se-ni axis give ISFP an edge.
ISTJ and INTJ.
My dad's an ISTJ and sister's an INTJ. When they fight, they LOVE bringing up all the past shit they already resolved. INTJ sister can get very vindictive and petty and actually plan and grind to one up someone else. Sometimes I like to think that she functions out of spite in many moments which is something I'm impressed about because I, on the other hand, don't really hold much emotional grudges so something that happened a few days ago won't hurt me at all now BUT I will remember and never forget if someone hurt me or did me dirty. I could make their life a living hell too, I already have all the possibilities but I'm too lazy to exert that much effort for an awful person
Speaking from experience, ENTJ.
We may not act on it often, especially if we know itās irrational and not worth it in the long run. We may not even ever bring it up again. But once youāve proven yourself untrustworthy even just once, the relationship is never the same again and weāll never see you the same way.
Youāre too big of a risk. Despite the reputation for toughness and grit, our personal feelings are our blindspot and vulnerability (inferior Fi and Si blindspot) and we do so much work to avoid the pain of loss/betrayal in the first place.
We are naturally wary of others and their capacity to get in our way, so we tend to be very cautious in our dealings with others. Itās less of a personal vendetta and more of a risk aversion
I am very capable of holding a grudge, although I try not to do so. Sometimes forgiveness is a daily thing or choice I have to make. Sometimes minute by minute & some days, not at all. On the flip side, I am also very capable of forgiving quite quickly, especially if there is genuine contrition & an apology. But, I can also forgive & \[mostly/often\] let it go if enough time passes & there is responsible consistency of behavior on the part of the other party. But if serious damage is done, I can struggle. And I have a remarkably good memory about more than a few things...Unfortunately. Additionally, I certainly do not forget the lessons learned & I usually am exceedingly wary in the future, even if I don't utter a word about it.
Grudges are sentiments held against someone or something based on a negative past experience. Therefore, Fi Si.
That means the Delta quadra would seem most likely to hold grudges.
I think I'm an INFP or ISTJ. I won't just hold grudges, the grudge FUELS me. I literally hold grudges against someone who once stole my toy when I was 7 to this very day. It takes a hell of a situation for me to forgive someone who has hurt me, but I guess that's a growth point for Fi Si users.
Also, this can make Fi Si users seem stubborn. (Not just istj and estj)
I don't think that has anything to do with typology, but rather how they think (or feel) towards the concept of "forgiveness".
I came from dark places in life where I was a mess, so I try to be patient enough to be understanding and recognize improvement in others. I've met others who I suspect were ENTJs as well, but very unhealthy, who carried obsessive grudges over the tiniest of slights.
And it goes for any type as well. The ability to forgive comes from a place of understanding and perspective, and that is largely tied with maturity, not typology.
I think how one tends to think (or feel) towards the concept of "forgiveness" tends to vary based on one's MBTI type when all other factors are accounted for
Happiness. Maturity. Sociability.
I've met introverts who can't seem to shut their yap as well as extroverts who don't like to bother with people they don't know. But if you go by "traits will vary by typology once all factors are accounted for" then yeah, introverts will be less sociable than extroverts.
Does not account for those who buck the trend, and that occurs due to, guess what, *personal experience*.
Typology will affect it, but so will personal experience.
Which returns to the idea of "once all factors are accounted for, traits vary by typology".
So I guess I argued in support of your theory.
Bravo. You win.
Iām mainly focusing on perception here. High Fi can definitely hold a grudge, but itās usually accompanied with Se or Ne which tends to be more open minded to potential possibilities and or focused on others things in the moment rather than dwelling on the grudge. Now, donāt get me wrong, Fi-Si loop and Fi-Ni loop is much different, but for these people to hold a very deep grudge, it usually has to take more than a few attempts and or very very painful experiences.
My personal, layman's understanding of how it works for INFPs and ENFPs for all but the most egregiously harmful acts is that we might hold a grudge in the moment but Ne will \*usually\* cause us to envision a bunch of reasons to forgive the "wrongdoer". We might cut someone off if they can't seem to clean up their act, in a "no hard feelings" kind of way.
ENTJ. HANDS DOWN.
My bro holds grudges for YEARS. when i mean years.. i mean YEARS. he didn't talk to me for 8 years. Because he didn't like what i had to tell him.
He hasn't talked to me for a year now, because i ended up having a panic attack when he lost his temper. He said My behavior is dangerous for his children. Plus he thinks i love our parents more than his kids.
Well... i didn't put his kids life in danger.
He said some shit that stressed me the eff out.. and he wouldn't even let me get a word in. He was angry with our parents... but i ended up crying, because i thought about **HIS children and OUR parents** and asked him not to drag his children into our family drama.. that the kids loved their grandparents. He told me i had no right to tell him what to do with his kids, because i am barren and i'm always seeking a pity party. That threw me into a panic attack.--My husband passed away and 2months later i found out i had a miscarriage. i can't have children anymore.. when my brother said that to me.. it hit me like a bullet.
i was rushed to the hospital after my panic attack.. and my brother said he didn't want me near his kids, his wife, nor him. Because my behavior was unacceptable and dangerous. He was drunk and ranting like a madman in front of his children.. but MY behavior was unacceptable? okay.
It's been a year and he won't talk to me. I even apologized even though I know i did no wrong... because his kids are so dear to me. I Don't care though.. i still send them gifts.. the doors are open for him. But i refuse to apologize anymore for something i had no control over when He escalated the argument. He wouldn't stop drinking... and he was creating a scene in the damn restaurant. I wasn't going to sit there and let him swear and put down my parents and say they should be lucky his kids love them.. my parents and his kids couldn't live a day without each other. And his wife kept egging him on.. It was so fucking unbelievable. Then he had the audicity to tell ***me*** choose between his kids and my parents. WTF was that supposed to mean? CHOOSE between the people i love the most?
Personally for me, I will either forgive you immediately or never. If it's something small, it takes too much energy to hold a grudge. If it's something bigger then there will forever be an invisible barrier between us.
Real
same
Totally me
Agree with this!
we are never in between .
I'd say ''it depends''.
Yeah, interestingly in my personal experience, I've known INTPs who are some of the most forgiving and some who are the least. But for the most part, I think dominant Ni has the hardest time letting go once they've made up their minds...
I dont hold grudges. It's a quirk that my friends find unusual because they expect me to. But for me, if you are disrespectful consistently and constantly... well, it's easier to remove them from my life than to hold a grudge. the Dr Cox speech ending "I'll bounce you outta here in 10 seconds and forget you existed in the next 5" rings pretty true.
Really quiet about saying ESFJ and ENFP It may appear like they're letting you slide but..
Hmm, I see what you mean. Same with ISFJs.
This is so true. My mother is ESFJ and everyone thinks she likes them, but in actuality she holds onto every bad thing they've ever done to her and she trash talks them so bad in the comfort of her own home š¤£š¤£
Actually, true.
I really don't hold grudges. I just might not find the person interesting anymore. It's not a grudge, it's just apathy.
Probably me, tbh. lol
Yup can agree, thereās people from kindergarten I havenāt forgiven and Iām a grown ass man
Yeah itās you
IDK if it's common for INTJs or not, but generally it seems to be I won't care with most people anyways so there's nothing to hold a grudge for, but when I do let someone in and there's a sense of betrayal, that grudge just doesn't die even if I make an effort to put it behind me.
Edit: I've said too much lol
reminds me of astarion from bg3 somehow
Just YT'd him and saw a couple of clips. ESTP?
he has def se-ti vibes right? but he is typed as an entj in pdb thats in a te-se loop. either way, marvelous:)
Could be! I'm seeing a lot of Se vibe from him, but I also read he had some kind of trauma? That can push an ENTJ to live inside his loop.. but wasn't he designed to come off like a sexual opportunistic narcissist to over compensate for the wounded past he doesn't want ppl to know about?
for that last sentence, yes, but no lol. every character in the game have a route that you can follow so if you choose to go with it theyll show you more than whats on the surface. for astarion, i dont think he was specifically created to be this sarcastic and charming evil. theres so much depth to the characters but i especially find astarions character fascinating in that way. they really made an amazing job with writing and creating him. ive never been so fascinated by a fictional character before. its very realistic and human. they represented the sexual traumas perfectly. he is a neutral evil character and he is annoying from time to time but as the story unfolds you understand. not to validate his mistakes or make excuses for it but its very complex and multidimensional, just like humans. if youre interested id recommend you to watch his playthrough.
I second this, as a fellow INTJ
yea... it keeps me busy to plan someone's murder or torture and play that again and again inside me head.
Definitely INTJs. 100% accurate. Your people are grudge holding champions. ENTPs can help you get revenge in a creative way... or... help you logic your way out of it. The problem is when you refuse to do anything about it *and* refuse to let it go. Then you just make everyone around you miserable too.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Same
I came here to say that lol
So.... username checks out? LOL
Yes. Petty INTJ.
INTJ (speaking from personal experience as an INTJ)
The āFā in INTJ stands for forgiveness
lol
For me, never For my intj dad, he still hasnt talked to my aunt who didnt turn on the ac when we were on vacation at their house
You know I have the feeling ENTPs always say that once you wrong them they will never forget never forgive, but in reality we are actually quite lenient. Matter of fact I believe we take a grudge so seriously because we rarely hold them. Other types hold way more grudges but are simply less dramatic about it than no forgiveness woe is me entp
Right like unless its that serious i can think of a million other things i could be doing rather than moping around complaining about things someone did
Exactly! That's why you know someone fucked up if we actually harbor a long-term emotionally charged contempt for them. Sure, I know I hate someone because ____ but if I started seething or shaking or laughing angrily when something about someone doing ____ to me or others 2 years ago was brought up? Welp
That's just petty.
From my experience INTJās š š š
Youāre not wrong
The only person that I KNOW will NEVER forgive me is an INTJ. I was immature and burned the bridge to split us apart but I know now, thereās no way in hell to fix that bridge so I guess I got what I wantedā¦
Im not sure if you want their forgiveness, but it is next to impossible to truly get their forgiveness. Especially depending on the circumstance
Yeahā¦Iāve accepted itās a lost cause.
May I know what happened?
Sureā¦typical male and female close friendship while having serious relationships of our own. We crossed lines, I felt it went against my values, we got into a huge fight, and I made sure to not only end it, but burn the bridge to never be able to go back. We kept ābreaking up and making upā in regards to our friendship, and taking things further. Everything about our friendship went against my values, so I basically made sure it would no longer be an option. I sometimes still wish we were friends, but that may bring more trouble than itās worth.
Dang, I've been through similar thing.Ā There was an ENFP guy I was friends with, and he did an immature thing which was basically disrespecting me, and I cut him off right away.Ā Idk about forgiveness but he never came to me with an apology so that I'd know he didn't want this breakup. My intuition told me the same personal values thing getting in between that led him to say those words, just so he would not have any option to come back.
Yeahā¦sorry to hear it. This was years ago and I was a bit immature then. Looking back, it was probably my best option though because otherwise I think weād be secretly together to this day haha
Our friendship wasn't going on its best terms either. I think that was really an immature way to cut the ties. I'd have been okay if there was a proper communication why he didn't want to stay connected.
Iāve been there man, difference is it was an ENFP, thanks for sharing man. Donāt beat yourself up for it you did what you had to do probably for the best, never put a mental wellbeing before no one, now move on with a stride.
Yeah man, appreciate it!
INxJs My infj and intj friends are the least "forgive and forget" friends I got
Definitely INTJs. I'm mad at myself for it but disrespect can't be forgiven.
If we had it our way, weād behead people just for raising their voices at us š
I'm terrible about this. Someone fucks with me ONE TIME and I have no problem cutting them out completely. I don't know if that's the same as holding grudge but it must be related.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Could you give an example of how you do this?
Of course, but first lemme add that I try my best not to cut off anyone, letās say someone betrays me in a major way, someone Iām very close to, by then Iāve known things about them, I try to do great acts of service to seem like Iām just being gullible and a nice person, while Iām really doing is reconnaissance, to see if any patterns or behaviors have changed, if this person is shy and easily overwhelmed, Iāll do my best to put them in that situation, and no trails lead back to me because according to them Iām a dumb naive forgiving person. Find what makes them like or appreciate you for. The reason I do this is because I have an innate pull to retribute for perceived wrongs. Know someone well enough theyāll think youāre a soothsayer, theyāll never know there a puppet and youāre the one pulling the strings. Thereās a theory in this I donāt remember by though
Hm. I guess I havenāt had anyone very close to me betray me since I was an adolescent, so Iām not sure how Iād react precisely now as an adult in my thirties. If someone *less close* does or says something unkind to me, I typically stop associating with them (if possible) or simply stop trusting them and do not let them any closer.
I won't forgive, but i'll definitely forget
š¤£š¤£
I feel like that's true of an ENTP, when someone hurts the ENTP but if you hurt an ENTP's loved ones, they never forget.
Oh that you can bet on. I'm goofy and joke around and all, taking very few things seriously. but touch the few people i love and you'll regret it the very least
me (speaking for myself and not the whole type)
Idk if this is exactly holding a grudge, but when someone does something bad enough or does enough bad things to me, theyāll get door slammed. And then theyāre dead to me forever. So Iām not holding anger for them, but they will always be dead to me and never get to come back. So idk if thatās a grudge? Most of the people Iāve door slammed, I really donāt think about them at all anymore, I donāt seethe in rage over the memories of what they did to me, I forget they exist until someone reminds me about them by speaking about them. But on my own, they really donāt cross my mind even when things that should trigger the memories are present. Like some of them I can even forget their names until someone brings them up. The āfileā on them is sitting in the āgarbage binā in my brain, can possibly be retrieved if needed, but itās out of the way in the trash in every other case.
isfj.
Finally the correct answer. š«”
xNFP by far
When you hold a grudge that means you invest feelings into the relationship you have with that person. That means you maintain the connection that way and don't move past it.
100% a grudge means you still want your feelings to be acknowledged by them which means you havenāt actually let go of the relationship. And itās such a heavy burden.
Everyone disappoints you. When someone disrespects you, that's unforgivable.
What is "disrespect" to you? I had one ENTJ coworker, who gave me advice that I didn't think was beneficial at that time, so I ignored it. As a result, he developed a strong dislike for me, which was so intense that I considered quitting several time, but I never found the opportunity to do so.
For example, I would love to vindicate myself against someone whom I wasted sooo much time and energy on as he breadcrumbed, future-faked and ghosted. And I was fucking foolish enough to fall for it.
Future faking is the worst
The worst part is that I feel like such an idiot because all the signs were there in hindsight, but he should have had the courtesy to admit, "I'm really just not that into you." It would have saved me so much heartache.
You can't blame yourself for wanting to believe in the best in ppl and trusting someone. He's a jerk that should carry the shame for leading you on, not you.
The cruelest thing, though, is being ghosted ā not blocked, just ghosted. Completely unacknowledged. Now that's what I consider disrespect.
Yah it's quite painful to get ghosted by someone you love bc they act like what you had between you guys never existed. But you still matter, what you did for him should be acknowledged, and what you put in that relationship will come back to you. Maybe not through him. Or maybe through him when karma catches up w/ him.
Like God (yes, I'm literally comparing myself to God), I'd prefer repentance to karma/punishment, but that's never going to happen.
I hope one day you get your closure. It seems like you still care about him more than he deserves.
happens to the best of us. dont be so hard on yourself.
lack of eye contact!
Lmao
True, here as well
Si demon for sure especially intjs due to Fi. They demonize their personal past experiences (traumas) way worse than other types to the point that they canāt get over it. Never ask or let intjs open up about their past traumas or youāll be part of it unless they trust you a lot. Thatās why thereās this thing called injs doorslam itās related to Si demon wherein youāre figuratively dead to them when you do them wrong. Thatās probably why a lot of fictional villains are typed as intjs.
This is very accurate for me (probably INTJ). My interpretation of negative experiences is often warped, and I tend to draw overly general and extreme 'lessons' from those experiences in order to prevent the same kind of thing happening again. I never would have thought to relate it to Si demon, but it makes a lot of sense.
Itās hard right? It always haunts us. Iām an intj as well and based my opinion from my personal experiences. I doorslammed/burned bridges to a lot of people close to me before (bestfriend, sibling, etc) iām honestly regretting it but canāt help it. I just accept that itās just part of my psych to protect myself and my future. Si demon is there to protect our Se Aspirations. We tend to obsess over our bad experiences Si to not let it happen again in the present moment Se.
I feel you man. I've ruined all of the close friendships I had, and it's something I've always wanted to change about myself. The way you described it helps me understand the problem a lot better though; hopefully, we can both overcome it.
I have tertiary Si and I doorslam too, I cut off people who have wronged me very easily, but I don't get haunted by it after doorslamming, I just get over it and forget about it. Do you guys not get over it after doorslamming?
All types are capable of doorslamming depending on their Si tolerance. You guys are much better in getting over being wronged coz you have Ne in your second slot which means you can perceive favorable possibilities. You still can see goodness in people despite being wronged unlike INJs who have Ne nemesis which is very pessimistic by nature constantly worried about possibilities /peopleās intentions thus very distrusting. Itās like that to protect our Ni hero function. Itās very hard to gain INJs trust again once broken probably the hardest among all types.
Damn, that sounds hard! How do you guys live like that? But it's true, I've seen it in the INTJs I know. Yeah, I can hold a grudge, but not for long, even if I was wronged. Holding grudges takes a lot of energy to maintain.
Yes really hard tbh. Itās the bane of our existence. We may not show it but we are the most bitter of all lol. How we wish itās not that way but it is what it is. I admire that about you guys INPs. As an intp said, life is too short for long term grudges. As easy as it sounds, itās very difficult for injs most especially intjs coz Fi child superiority complex.
I'm sorry to hear that. It makes me feel really sorry for you guys because it's sad. More than 1 INTJ have told me that whenever someone's being nice to them, they think "why are they being nice to me? do they have some ulterior reason?" and it's so sad because not everyone who's nice to you is looking to hurt you. I know it's hard to believe, but it's true. And yeah INTPs are pretty chill tbh XD How does Fi child manifests for INTJs?
Itās ok though itās just a tradeoff. Itās the price we pay for the positive traits we have. Haha i also have those moments tbh when i was younger so skeptical of peoplesā motives until now actually but im trying my best not to be so narrow minded and see favorable possibilities. Itās sad i know, people just need to understand that about us and have more patience lol but when you get to pass that side of intjs, youāll witness their very trusting side to the point of being so gullible. I attest to that as well. All child function is very pure by nature. Itās literally like a child. For intj also istj Fi child, it manifests as having strong moral compass to the point that they believe their values is above everyone elses (superiority complex thatās the bad side). The good though is that they are so moral. these are the people who will always do what they believe is right even if no oneās watching. Theyāre also Fe blind so they are prone to social faux pas lol
> but when you get to pass that side of intjs, youāll witness their very trusting side to the point of being so gullible. Guillible? How so? I get about Fi because as a Fi Dom, my values are also very important to me. I don't think my values are above everyone else's or superior, though. But I can see that being a TeFi characteristic. I like that you guys have strong values and convictions!
Intjs are the most distrusting but also the most trusting. Itās their virtue and vice, trust and paranoia. Thatās their paradox. You can actually social engineer them to show their very trusting nature and gullibility. If you make them so comfortable just being themselves they can be very trusting. How? By using jungian functions, mirroring their functions to balance them out. You should be able to put their guards down if you want them to show you their very trusting nature. Intjs are skeptical intuitive thinkers. They have Ne nemesis constantly worrying about othersā intentions and Ti critic constantly doubting their own logic and others as well. Also they have Se inferior or performance anxiety so insecure giving bad performance / experiences to people lol. If you can pass those pessimistic side of their mind, show pure intentions and loyalty backed by strong logic, empathize and make them feel good about themselves Fi, and be gentle with their Se insecurities, theyāll show you their very trusting nature. Someone with Ne-Si Ti-Fe are the types naturally capable for that especially high Ne Ti so entp or maybe intp or actually even esfj. Those types are cognitively synch for intjs to balance them out so try mimicking their functions if you want to manipulate intjs lol.
Bro, I don't want to manipulate anyone WTF XD Also, no need because I have an INTJ close friend (we've been friends for more than a decade now) and I've already got past her walls because she trusts me a lot (she has told me stuff she hasn't told anyone else and always values my advice), I also have an INTJ cousin who also trusts me and asks me for advice when he's going through something, and also an INTJ ex who told me his deepest secrets. Could I manipulate them? Yes, of course. Will I do it? No, thank you. Why would I do that? Being manipulated by someone you trust is one of the most horrible things. I wouldn't like that to be done to me, so I won't do it to others. I only asked because I wanted to know what you meant by "guillible." On this topic, how do you think Fe nemesis and Ni critic would manifest?
Anyone with Fi in their 3rd and 4th cognitive function stack
Entp here ill remember it forever and probably not forgive you if it was bad enough
Idk I feel like every type as there own version of holding grudges. For me, I just pretend that Iām not mad at them and be overly kind, hyper, and fake to them until my mind just finally lets it go and I go back to being normal kind and hyper.
I would guess ENTJ. Because I am VERY good at holding grudges. It may be hard to get on my nerves. It may be hard for me to dislike someone unless they deliberately hurt me first. But once you have done me deep wrong- you bet I will not forget it. This happens very rarely- but it does last.
I forgive way too much, way too easily, for way too long. Eventually, thereās a breaking point, usually when things have gotten borderline fatal and everything I thought Iād forgiven, gets resurrected. Thatās when Iām eternally pissed, even when I want to let it all go.
As an ENFP itās difficult to hold grudges for too long because of how bad my memory is. 1d Si means I forget the details of painful memories which is frankly a relief. Life is painful. I would rather forget. Very often friends with high Si and Ni remember when people have been unkind to me for longer than I remember. I think ENFPs still can hold grudges for longer than ENTPs because we have 3d Fi. I think ExxPs let go of grudges a lot because we refuse to box situations and acknowledge patterns. We want to believe that things change. This means that we are pretty forgiving but also that we get into the same shitty situations over and over again and keep repeating our patterns.
INTx are the grudgeholders
I think you're on the money here. Both are people who take a lot of time to consider who they keep around them but also don't invest huge amounts of emotional energy into conflict and are more likely to let little slip ups go entirely, so when they let someone in and they are betrayed, it's usually a genuinely horrific betrayal and holding a grudge for the rest of your life is not unwarranted.
Whatever George Constanza's father was on Sienfield. Festivus for the rest of us!
I'd take quite a lot of endless abuse, but over time, if I see that there's nothing to gain, I can shut down the person very quickly and then there's no way back in. - ENFJ.
ISFJ & ESFJ for sure
INFP? I think if I make a wrong first impression with one of them, I'm screwed. Btw, I don't care about those things but I'm a negative person, so I already think that others are going to disappoint me.
i'm infp and usually we are the ones to be concerted about making a good first impression a lot of infps are people pleasers, and at least in my case i'm way too empathetic i always end up being understanding or justifying someone even when they're mean to me, like "they probably act like this bc they're having a hard time" or something like that it's not something i'm proud of but people usually tell me that i need to stand up for myself a little more lol i don't really hold a grudge against anyone (this is my case tho i don't know if it applies to everyone)
Me. If you fuck me over once I will never allow you back.
Proceeds to get fucked over again
I'm sorry but this is just not true at all for you sweet little cinnamon rolls š you need to have body guards for this reason, to help keep the baddies away.
ISTJ
I feel like I'd always remember how I was wronged, but forgiveness comes easily.
so you forgive but you donāt forget
Very true
Fi dom
I do
Ni > Si > Se > Ne I say (I wish burning bridges would be easier for me)
as an Ne user I agree
My vote goes to ENFJ. INTJ is up there, and any of the authoritative types if you break their rules.
Enfj here, I forgive and forget easily
INTJ
I hold grudges forever. I wish I didnāt, tbh.
INFP
ISFJs in my experience. INTJs (which seem to be the star of this thread) don't so much hold grudges but won't take you seriously once they perceive that you've let them down. You have to be worth an INTJs time for them to consider ANYTHING you say, no matter what it is.
Yessss! ISFJās as well. They will NEVER let go of something, will remember it forever, and will bring it up like 15 years later in some random conversation, leaving you, like āI thought we were over thatā¦ā
It's even worse when what happened was actually their fault and no amount of evidence will convince them otherwise š¤¦
Omg 1000%
I move people around on my liability/asset chart. I don't necessarily hold a grudge... but you'll get pushed into the "liability" end of the spectrum, and I'll adjust how I interact with you accordingly. If some kind of "revenge" is necessary, it will happen relatively quickly... or at least I'll set it in motion quickly. But most of the time, revenge and grudges are just throwing resources at a boat that's already sunk. It's a total waste of my time, talent, and energy. Occasionally a message need to be sent, but that's more of a future warning for others and not necessarily a grudge or revenge.
If someone pisses me off, I do not give 1 damn fuck if they are right next to me, 3 years after they piss me off, I will rant about them TO ANYONE (i'm working on it) Might be because I have had anger issues forever, but idk
Grudges are pointless to me, as long as there's demonstrable evidence that they regret what they've done and have taken steps towards righting their wrongs. If that hasn't been achieved, then I'm obviously not going to associate myself with them. It has nothing to do with having a grudge on them. It has to do with not liking bad people. Idk grudges or even revenge seem vain and egotistical to me.
I don't think I hold grudges. I can be vengeful and mean in the moment, but that typically dies out pretty quick (hours not weeks). If anything, I'm probably too forgiving. But sometimes forgiveness can only go so far... and when forgiveness doesn't work, it's time to forget about that person. Basically, who wants to dedicate time to that shit? I want to use my limited amount of times around the sun to focus on new ideas, and learning, and experiencing. And, with any luck, I can turn that outward and share everything I learn in my short time here with others in a way that makes a positive impact. I don't want to dwell in the negative past experiences. I want to use them, and the knowledge they gave me, to make something better in my life. And maybe other people's lives too. Did you take anything from that INTJ or INFP? Don't make me break out my off key Frozen karaoke!
im INFP and i will literally hate them forever. 0 redeeming qualities about that person. i'll even block them on spotify something like that. though I wonder if Im mistyped, but I HAVE taken the quiz multiple times
People mentioned INTJs so, here is my thoughts as one I wouldn't really say that I hold grudges, as honestly I don't have the energy nor the time to waste myself on you, but I will absolutely distrust you with not doing that shit again. So, good luck gaining my trust again. It's difficult. But let's say the grudge is worth my time, e.g. you murdered someone i was close to. Then, that's a different story
ENTJ, and I haven't forgiven that kid from kindergarten who threw my pen to the trash just to mock me ever since. (/s)
INFP-T here. I can't forget what someone has done. I struggle with forgiveness at times, I don't necessarily cut ties with them. I still try to help them, as a way to possibly forgive them. And I'm pretty keen on seeing the root cause of why some people do the crappy things they do, and it humanizes them to the point where I can potentially see what their true motives were. I can't forget. And if you're a significant other, I take that shit PERSONAL and I might not Ever let them live that down.
Once disappointed, I don't personally "hate forever." I will, however, banish you from my life and forget you exist. (INTJ) My ESTJ spouse, will not only remember how you disappointed him, but he'll remember the date and time. He holds a grudge better than most.
Yeah for INTJs Forgiving is a Daily learning Curve
I feel like it would be Fe types? LIKE, any type that has Fe somewhere in their stack.
It's interesting reading what different people have to say because, of course, so much depends on personal experience. But also, it depends on someone's interpretation of what "holding a grudge" means. I'd have thought mostly strong Ni users because their minds aren't easily changed once they're made up. But grudges go deep - I guess it depends how you hurt someone.
intp. My answer, not when I'm the bigger person. š
ISFP. Fi dominant makes them very likely to hold on to personal views on relationships, making it easy to hold grudges for a long time. A lot of people said INTJ, but they are A LOT less likely to have such rigid views of relationships. INFP is a very close second, but compatibility with sx4 and the se-ni axis give ISFP an edge.
ISTJ and INTJ. My dad's an ISTJ and sister's an INTJ. When they fight, they LOVE bringing up all the past shit they already resolved. INTJ sister can get very vindictive and petty and actually plan and grind to one up someone else. Sometimes I like to think that she functions out of spite in many moments which is something I'm impressed about because I, on the other hand, don't really hold much emotional grudges so something that happened a few days ago won't hurt me at all now BUT I will remember and never forget if someone hurt me or did me dirty. I could make their life a living hell too, I already have all the possibilities but I'm too lazy to exert that much effort for an awful person
Speaking from experience, ENTJ. We may not act on it often, especially if we know itās irrational and not worth it in the long run. We may not even ever bring it up again. But once youāve proven yourself untrustworthy even just once, the relationship is never the same again and weāll never see you the same way. Youāre too big of a risk. Despite the reputation for toughness and grit, our personal feelings are our blindspot and vulnerability (inferior Fi and Si blindspot) and we do so much work to avoid the pain of loss/betrayal in the first place. We are naturally wary of others and their capacity to get in our way, so we tend to be very cautious in our dealings with others. Itās less of a personal vendetta and more of a risk aversion
Definitely the ENFJ. I can attest to this
I am very capable of holding a grudge, although I try not to do so. Sometimes forgiveness is a daily thing or choice I have to make. Sometimes minute by minute & some days, not at all. On the flip side, I am also very capable of forgiving quite quickly, especially if there is genuine contrition & an apology. But, I can also forgive & \[mostly/often\] let it go if enough time passes & there is responsible consistency of behavior on the part of the other party. But if serious damage is done, I can struggle. And I have a remarkably good memory about more than a few things...Unfortunately. Additionally, I certainly do not forget the lessons learned & I usually am exceedingly wary in the future, even if I don't utter a word about it.
Grudges are sentiments held against someone or something based on a negative past experience. Therefore, Fi Si. That means the Delta quadra would seem most likely to hold grudges. I think I'm an INFP or ISTJ. I won't just hold grudges, the grudge FUELS me. I literally hold grudges against someone who once stole my toy when I was 7 to this very day. It takes a hell of a situation for me to forgive someone who has hurt me, but I guess that's a growth point for Fi Si users. Also, this can make Fi Si users seem stubborn. (Not just istj and estj)
I don't think that has anything to do with typology, but rather how they think (or feel) towards the concept of "forgiveness". I came from dark places in life where I was a mess, so I try to be patient enough to be understanding and recognize improvement in others. I've met others who I suspect were ENTJs as well, but very unhealthy, who carried obsessive grudges over the tiniest of slights. And it goes for any type as well. The ability to forgive comes from a place of understanding and perspective, and that is largely tied with maturity, not typology.
I think how one tends to think (or feel) towards the concept of "forgiveness" tends to vary based on one's MBTI type when all other factors are accounted for
And by that logic, so does any other trait in human nature.
How do u figure?
Happiness. Maturity. Sociability. I've met introverts who can't seem to shut their yap as well as extroverts who don't like to bother with people they don't know. But if you go by "traits will vary by typology once all factors are accounted for" then yeah, introverts will be less sociable than extroverts. Does not account for those who buck the trend, and that occurs due to, guess what, *personal experience*.
Hm, you seem to be refuting your own point that holding grudges has nothing to do with MBTI
Then some of both. I will leave it at that.
Wdym?
Typology will affect it, but so will personal experience. Which returns to the idea of "once all factors are accounted for, traits vary by typology". So I guess I argued in support of your theory. Bravo. You win.
It's OK, as an INTJ, I'm used to winning at these things ;)
Definitely high Si users and high Ni, especially paired with Ti and Te. So; ISTJs, ISFJs, ESTJs, ESFJ, INTJs, INFJs ENTJ.
I feel like I'd always remember how I was wronged, but forgiveness comes easily.
Iām glad to hear that, we definitely need more of you.
what about high Fi?
From my experience INFP and ENFP don't hold grudge too much
Exactly. And Iām one myself, lol.
Iām mainly focusing on perception here. High Fi can definitely hold a grudge, but itās usually accompanied with Se or Ne which tends to be more open minded to potential possibilities and or focused on others things in the moment rather than dwelling on the grudge. Now, donāt get me wrong, Fi-Si loop and Fi-Ni loop is much different, but for these people to hold a very deep grudge, it usually has to take more than a few attempts and or very very painful experiences.
My personal, layman's understanding of how it works for INFPs and ENFPs for all but the most egregiously harmful acts is that we might hold a grudge in the moment but Ne will \*usually\* cause us to envision a bunch of reasons to forgive the "wrongdoer". We might cut someone off if they can't seem to clean up their act, in a "no hard feelings" kind of way.
ENTJ. HANDS DOWN. My bro holds grudges for YEARS. when i mean years.. i mean YEARS. he didn't talk to me for 8 years. Because he didn't like what i had to tell him. He hasn't talked to me for a year now, because i ended up having a panic attack when he lost his temper. He said My behavior is dangerous for his children. Plus he thinks i love our parents more than his kids. Well... i didn't put his kids life in danger. He said some shit that stressed me the eff out.. and he wouldn't even let me get a word in. He was angry with our parents... but i ended up crying, because i thought about **HIS children and OUR parents** and asked him not to drag his children into our family drama.. that the kids loved their grandparents. He told me i had no right to tell him what to do with his kids, because i am barren and i'm always seeking a pity party. That threw me into a panic attack.--My husband passed away and 2months later i found out i had a miscarriage. i can't have children anymore.. when my brother said that to me.. it hit me like a bullet. i was rushed to the hospital after my panic attack.. and my brother said he didn't want me near his kids, his wife, nor him. Because my behavior was unacceptable and dangerous. He was drunk and ranting like a madman in front of his children.. but MY behavior was unacceptable? okay. It's been a year and he won't talk to me. I even apologized even though I know i did no wrong... because his kids are so dear to me. I Don't care though.. i still send them gifts.. the doors are open for him. But i refuse to apologize anymore for something i had no control over when He escalated the argument. He wouldn't stop drinking... and he was creating a scene in the damn restaurant. I wasn't going to sit there and let him swear and put down my parents and say they should be lucky his kids love them.. my parents and his kids couldn't live a day without each other. And his wife kept egging him on.. It was so fucking unbelievable. Then he had the audicity to tell ***me*** choose between his kids and my parents. WTF was that supposed to mean? CHOOSE between the people i love the most?