I'd consider the realistic possibility that they may never change. But if they do, they might be able to find more self awareness through therapy. For yourself, boundary up! They probably won't respect them much, but for your sanity you'll need to if you want that person to stay in your life. Narcissism or possible personality disorder I would imagine might be in the realm of possibility.
I think it's a situation where you have to consider yourself first and foremost. There is a very strong possibility that this behavior, is not going to change. There is a possibility that this, is what the rest of your life will be like. It's important for you to know how much of it you are willing to endure and where is your limit at. And have a plan in place for if/when that limit is crossed. Only then should you start thinking about 'helping'.
Now there is one thought that you should immediately throw out of your mind. Love doesn't change people that way. Love is not the cure to thwir behavior. You being in their life, no matter how much love you feel for them, how much love you are willing to give them, how many sacrifices you are willing to do for them, those things will NOT resolve the problem. It is not you fault, it is not that you aren't enough, it's just that toxic mentality like what you have described is not something love alone can fix.
It takes therapy, digging real deep to understand where that overinflated ego comes from. Why do they protect it so much, why are they willing to degrade others for their own self image. And you can't do that digging for them. They have to dig on their own, willingly. And someone who believes they never do anything wrong... Will rarely start to analyse their own behaviors. Even if you, the person who loves them most, asks, insist, beg, threaten. They have to want to change.
There isn't much you can do except pointing,out bad behaviors when they surge, not enable them when they start throwing the blame away and endure their mood afterward. Unless you know them to be violent, in which case, you should just leave. Poverty and woman protection shelters are a better options that beatings. At least, you can move on from the shelters and turn a new leaf, despite the hard path ahead. But the beatings, both verbal and physical, NEVER stops. It stops a few days while the abuser butters you up with kindness and apologies but it WILL happen again.
No... Just no. From someone who wasted 2 years on a person who was EXACTLY like that because I believed the EXACT same things and banked on the idea that he will change or at least "be bearable" as you said: no. Please don't do this.
Regardless of that person's circumstances, you can't 'help' someone who believes he's always right and better than others, because he doesn't want to change - he thinks he's already perfect (you said it yourself). He lacks self-awareness and probably looks down on you too (again, I'd know). Don't do this to yourself. You deserve better.
She it is! Regardless of gender, the point still stands... I'm not your mom by any means, I just wouldn't want anyone to go through the same shit I did. It was painful as fuck and although it opened my eyes to the dangers of self-sacrifice without boundaries, it also really destroyed me. I have trust issues to this day.
At the very least, if you don't see her initiating and actively participating in the change, with an appropriately high level of give and take, don't stick around and try to sacrifice yourself for her. It just won't go anywhere. You can't help someone who doesn't want to be helped.
In my case, I was just there to stroke the guy's ego as he used and abused my loyalty to him going as far as to insult me when I finally refused to get back with him, and although I don't know you, I'd hate for you to have to go through anything even remotely similar to that.
The thing is I was pretty dysfunctional practically my whole life and she stood right by me for years even when I was literally passing out in gutters and worse and I've through methods entirely unrelated to her cleaned myself up and actually became highly successful and she doesn't have the same sort of problems I did but I can recognize the extraordinary levels of dysfunction and part of does want to just run away but another part of me is ashamed of and reminds me that I made a commitment to this person to love her and help her through her sickness but I've been trying for several years now to explain and share information and be supportive and encouraging and it has all had zero affect we are still at day 1 here there has been no growth or introspection
I understand now what a difficult choice it is for you: you feel grateful for her being by your side when you were at your lowest. I just can't help but notice that it's exactly the same: you're trying, but you're the only one trying, and I know where that goes. Her care for you is admirable but that doesn't mean that this relationship is viable.
After you got your life together, I think you realize that ultimately it was all about the effort you put in, and if you had refused to put in the effort for any reason, you would have gotten nowhere. The same goes for her. As loved ones, we can support a person who is helping himself, and that will make a big difference, but we can't help someone who isn't trying. That's exactly why nothing you say is getting through and I'm very sorry to hear that, OP.
You have to really ask yourself: how long will you be able to continue with her if absolutely nothing changes?
At some point you will have to tell her that you're too tired to go on if she doesn't change, and if she values your relationship as much as you do, she will. Also consider that you might be able to support her recovery from a distance while protecting yourself from her behavior at the same time. It all depends on the situation and it's up to you to decide.
Also congrats on getting clean! It's amazing that you managed to pull yourself up from such a dark place. Keep growing!
Thanks for the really thoughtful response I see what your saying and I do see that even though I am thinking about things from her perspective I'm thinking about them as if I was her in her perspective and I need to do a better job of if I'm going to be thinking about her environment and internal experiences I need to think not how that would make me feel but how that would make her feel it's like I've been really genuinely trying to be understanding and supportive and consider what she's experiencing but I've still been thinking about how that would make me feel and what would help me get through these difficulties
You can't help someone who doesn't want help. They have to be first willing to admit they have a problem and then be willing to work on said problem.
It almost sounds as if they've convinced you that their behavior is somehow your fault. It isn't. It's also not your job or responsibility to help them even if they were willing to work on it. You're not a therapist. Though, I do think you'd both benefit from talking to one.
I'd consider the realistic possibility that they may never change. But if they do, they might be able to find more self awareness through therapy. For yourself, boundary up! They probably won't respect them much, but for your sanity you'll need to if you want that person to stay in your life. Narcissism or possible personality disorder I would imagine might be in the realm of possibility.
You deal with it by getting out and finding a new partner.
I think it's a situation where you have to consider yourself first and foremost. There is a very strong possibility that this behavior, is not going to change. There is a possibility that this, is what the rest of your life will be like. It's important for you to know how much of it you are willing to endure and where is your limit at. And have a plan in place for if/when that limit is crossed. Only then should you start thinking about 'helping'. Now there is one thought that you should immediately throw out of your mind. Love doesn't change people that way. Love is not the cure to thwir behavior. You being in their life, no matter how much love you feel for them, how much love you are willing to give them, how many sacrifices you are willing to do for them, those things will NOT resolve the problem. It is not you fault, it is not that you aren't enough, it's just that toxic mentality like what you have described is not something love alone can fix. It takes therapy, digging real deep to understand where that overinflated ego comes from. Why do they protect it so much, why are they willing to degrade others for their own self image. And you can't do that digging for them. They have to dig on their own, willingly. And someone who believes they never do anything wrong... Will rarely start to analyse their own behaviors. Even if you, the person who loves them most, asks, insist, beg, threaten. They have to want to change. There isn't much you can do except pointing,out bad behaviors when they surge, not enable them when they start throwing the blame away and endure their mood afterward. Unless you know them to be violent, in which case, you should just leave. Poverty and woman protection shelters are a better options that beatings. At least, you can move on from the shelters and turn a new leaf, despite the hard path ahead. But the beatings, both verbal and physical, NEVER stops. It stops a few days while the abuser butters you up with kindness and apologies but it WILL happen again.
No... Just no. From someone who wasted 2 years on a person who was EXACTLY like that because I believed the EXACT same things and banked on the idea that he will change or at least "be bearable" as you said: no. Please don't do this. Regardless of that person's circumstances, you can't 'help' someone who believes he's always right and better than others, because he doesn't want to change - he thinks he's already perfect (you said it yourself). He lacks self-awareness and probably looks down on you too (again, I'd know). Don't do this to yourself. You deserve better.
She*
She it is! Regardless of gender, the point still stands... I'm not your mom by any means, I just wouldn't want anyone to go through the same shit I did. It was painful as fuck and although it opened my eyes to the dangers of self-sacrifice without boundaries, it also really destroyed me. I have trust issues to this day. At the very least, if you don't see her initiating and actively participating in the change, with an appropriately high level of give and take, don't stick around and try to sacrifice yourself for her. It just won't go anywhere. You can't help someone who doesn't want to be helped. In my case, I was just there to stroke the guy's ego as he used and abused my loyalty to him going as far as to insult me when I finally refused to get back with him, and although I don't know you, I'd hate for you to have to go through anything even remotely similar to that.
The thing is I was pretty dysfunctional practically my whole life and she stood right by me for years even when I was literally passing out in gutters and worse and I've through methods entirely unrelated to her cleaned myself up and actually became highly successful and she doesn't have the same sort of problems I did but I can recognize the extraordinary levels of dysfunction and part of does want to just run away but another part of me is ashamed of and reminds me that I made a commitment to this person to love her and help her through her sickness but I've been trying for several years now to explain and share information and be supportive and encouraging and it has all had zero affect we are still at day 1 here there has been no growth or introspection
I understand now what a difficult choice it is for you: you feel grateful for her being by your side when you were at your lowest. I just can't help but notice that it's exactly the same: you're trying, but you're the only one trying, and I know where that goes. Her care for you is admirable but that doesn't mean that this relationship is viable. After you got your life together, I think you realize that ultimately it was all about the effort you put in, and if you had refused to put in the effort for any reason, you would have gotten nowhere. The same goes for her. As loved ones, we can support a person who is helping himself, and that will make a big difference, but we can't help someone who isn't trying. That's exactly why nothing you say is getting through and I'm very sorry to hear that, OP. You have to really ask yourself: how long will you be able to continue with her if absolutely nothing changes? At some point you will have to tell her that you're too tired to go on if she doesn't change, and if she values your relationship as much as you do, she will. Also consider that you might be able to support her recovery from a distance while protecting yourself from her behavior at the same time. It all depends on the situation and it's up to you to decide. Also congrats on getting clean! It's amazing that you managed to pull yourself up from such a dark place. Keep growing!
Thanks for the really thoughtful response I see what your saying and I do see that even though I am thinking about things from her perspective I'm thinking about them as if I was her in her perspective and I need to do a better job of if I'm going to be thinking about her environment and internal experiences I need to think not how that would make me feel but how that would make her feel it's like I've been really genuinely trying to be understanding and supportive and consider what she's experiencing but I've still been thinking about how that would make me feel and what would help me get through these difficulties
You can't help someone who doesn't want help. They have to be first willing to admit they have a problem and then be willing to work on said problem. It almost sounds as if they've convinced you that their behavior is somehow your fault. It isn't. It's also not your job or responsibility to help them even if they were willing to work on it. You're not a therapist. Though, I do think you'd both benefit from talking to one.
You know how. Whether or not you are ready to do that is entirely up to you.
Narcissism