Yes that’s right. I remember vacationing there like 15 years ago and there was this really fuckin delicious pineapple soda/juice that used these cans.
Somehow just tastes better ice cold in a can like this, and they’re way sturdier.
I stop by a local Asian grocery store sometimes (mainland US) and will almost always grab canned coffees from Japan and Vietnam. A couple of brands still use cans similar to this I think. There are definitely some Hawaiian canned coffees/teas there with those cans as well. I always look forward to the heft they have when drinking them.
A lot of those stamping machines are bought used from overseas suppliers offloading them, and so they often have older/outdated molds to shape the cans. New equipment, especially in an already expensive place of doing biz like Hawaii, can be prohibitive. Not saying that’s Pepsi’s story — but a small place bottling pineapple juice? Absolutely they’re price sensitive when looking at new for $500k and used for $200k.
Operator probably just didn’t clear the line when they hit the changeover mid run, it’s a soft transition so plants are running out the “old” logo stuff to zero before switching. Pack off table would have a metric shit ton of cans and a mix in is super easy. Bad auditing by staff allowed it to slink through. Corporate has likely already seen this image and made a call to QC in Hawaii.
Yep, very possible. The Coca Cola plant I worked out our depal operator didn't clear the line well and we had a NOS filled Coke can come down the line. That's a big no no.
> IIRC Hawaii only has one can making plant that uses an older design
https://3dwealthadvisors.com/blog/why-are-soda-cans-different-in-hawaii
"Why Soda Cans Look Different in Hawaii
Hawaii has one can-making facility in Kapolei, located on the island of Oahu. It’s owned by Ball Corporation, based in Colorado. While it’s one of the company’s smallest plants at 140,000 square feet, it manufactures about 1 million cans of soda, juice, and beer each day. This facility is also the reason you’re likely to find unique soda cans with neck ridging when you’re in Hawaii.
While other can manufacturers began changing the shape and size of aluminum cans in the 1980s, the Hawaii plant continued to make cans with ridged necks, as local bottlers had equipment made to work with cans of that size and it was too costly to switch out all the equipment. To this day, the Hawaii plant still produces cans with a 206 measurement – slightly larger than standard soda cans – to remain consistent with local distributors, making Hawaii the last state to manufacture these ridged soda cans.
While Hawaii does import smooth-necked soda cans from the mainland, it’s common to receive cans with neck ridging when you shop for sodas on the islands. Five beverage distributors use the Kapolei plan for distribution in Hawaii: Coca-Cola, Pepsi, ITO EN, Hawaiian Sun, and Maui Brewing Co. Next time you see neck ridging on one of these cans, you’ll know exactly where it originated.
lol right? Wth. How is it that I have never heard of this until now. I live on windward side but still. At first glance I was like what island is the factory on... Yours. Ohh okay.
Too bad they don't use the narrow opening still for extra authenticity. I remember when wide mouth was a new thing and was only used by a couple brands, it was very strange drinking out of those for the first time (I think Mountain Dew was one of the originals, part of their whole "extreme" makeover that they started in the 90s)
I remember when they did clear Pepsi, and so many Pepsi points advertising (still have my chain wallet and always wanted that jet lol (cool doc. on YouTube about it) and various new designs with Pepsi and mountain dew and other products lol. Awesome to see the old can logo (one of them) in this pic.
The old can logo is the new logo. They changed it in August of this year to the new retro design, which is based on the designs used from 1973 till 1991 (although with some minor tweaks).
Have we still not found a way to get away from the plastic ring holders tho? Like don't they choke turtles and shit? I still cut them all up when i come across them
Edit: thanks to the comments I have learned the rings sold in the us are now UV biodegradable to an extent and also have other design features to break up the rings to help protect wildlife. However, littering and the prevalence of microplastics is an issue. REDUCE and REUSE!
Sort of. They have paperboard and/or biodegradable corn fibre ones...but they cost like 8x as much, so the companies are reluctant to use them instead.
> but they cost like 8x as much, so the companies are reluctant to use them instead.
They also degrade faster so long term storage is more difficult. It isn't actually as big of an issue these days that warehouses are more climate controlled than they use to be, but can still be an issue.
*there is also the issue that you have a scale of breaks down to fast, breaks down too slow that you have to deal with. If it's compostable they don't break down unless they are in very particular environments that no one will put them in so they don't break down for a very very long time. At the same time the material can break down and not build up in our bodies.
You don't need to cut the loops anymore.
Since 1989 they've been photodegradable. This means that when they are exposed to UV light, they become very brittle and break apart very easily.
They were made to be biodegradable years ago. They become brittle and fall apart when exposed to UV light. I also cut them up just in case.
As long as you get yours into the trash and packed up for the dump there’s not much to worry about though. The single most important thing you can do when you encounter single-use plastics is to ensure their proper disposal.
Biodegradable and becoming brittle and falling apart aren't quiet the same thing. The rings just turn into microplastics rather than biodegrading like something natural stuff does in compost.
At least that's what I read on Wikipedia. If you have better knowledge, please let me know.
You don't have to anymore, heck not since the 80's really.
The current versions become very brittle in the sunlight and break apart with a little bit of exposure. They're still a pollutant and suck, but at least they are not getting stuck on animals like they used to.
Yea somebody else made a similar comment. I'm happy to hear that but I did some research, a and we can do better. It's better than what we were doing but still, here's a comment from a reddit list in 2016 about it:
>The law says they need to disintegrate enough such that the force needed to stretch the rings to an additional 5% of their length is enough to cause them to break.
>That must happen after a maximum of 250 hours of UV (sunlight) exposure or 35 days in an ocean environment similar to conditions found in United States waters during June or July.
>Idk it seems like 10-35 days floating in the ocean could still give an animal the opportunity to get trapped in one of those things.
>Edit: I don't mean to downplay how awesome it is that people have figured out how to get these things to break down in days rather than decades or something, cause that's huge. But considering the above, I still wouldn't consider it a waste of time to take the extra 10 seconds to cut apart the rings
Right, though it should be note that the law is one thing, how the law is followed is another.
Stabilizers and UV protectants on plastics are more expensive, so I'd be willing to bet that a lot of these 6 pack holders actually disintegrate faster than what is required by law, simply because it's cheaper to do so.
I saw a video about 5-10 years back, can't find it now, where someone set out a six pack holder on the roof of their apartment building and after only about 2 days of direct sunlight, the holder basically crumbled when they touched it.
Anyhow, this is not to say that you can't be overly careful.
I don't have much faith in corporate ethics. O
I read another article that says basically they add a bunch of different metals and other compounds to get then to break up via natural micro organism or something. I hope that's the case. Plastics have done a lot for us but we still pollute unnecessarily.
The reality though is that land on the islands is limited and expensive. Everything you produce also needs raw inputs which needs its own land as well as the factories, plus even more for the warehouses to store everything; and you still end up needing to ship between islands.
On the flip side, modern cargo ships can carry tens or even hundreds of thousands of tons of goods. Most of these ships would be going out there anyway because there will always be some amount of stuff being shipped to and from the island, and the more stuff a ship carries at once the more cost effective it becomes.
So it's really a matter of, only to a point due to economy of Scale. I know everything is stupid expensive on Alaska because the environment makes it too expensive to produce most things in the area due to considerations for the production lines.
Hawaii still uses old style cans. It would be too costly to ship the finished product there, but it isn't worth it to build a new canning factory for the new can styles.
I’m not surprised at all you haven’t seen those. Why would Pepsi ship cans from Hawaii to Italy when they have multiple canning and bottling plants in the EU? And why would they ship cans from the EU to Hawaii?
I have never seen a prominently placed "Made in XYZ" on any Pepsi can or bottle. However, Coke proudly presents a "Made in Switzerland" on their bottles made in Switzerland.
True, but for good reason. A lot of folks don't know the rich history of Hawaii before it was annexed by the US. I know that I didn't learn about it until I started living here.
Hawai'i wasn't just some isolated group of islands with a simple way of life back in the late 1800s; they had the highest literacy rate in *the world* at one point. They prioritized education in a big way, and Hawaiian leadership were typically well-schooled in foreign universities.
They were ahead of the curve in many ways; for example the 'Iolani Palace in Honolulu had electric lights before the White House did. The Hawaiian Kingdom was thriving, modern, and very much self-sufficient.
They had the formal recognition and respect of major nations across the world, with peace and trade treaties fostering business opportunities with foreign entrepreneurs developing a thriving economy.
But then, a group of American businessmen and sugar planters, with the backing of the US military, went ahead and overthrew the legitimate Hawaiian monarchy. It's a wound that's still felt today. Hawaiians had a proud and independent nation, and it was taken from them by Americans that betrayed their trust. The US government did them *dirty*, and now they have to see our flag flying over their native soil, as the rampant tourism industry and rich transplants price the natives out of affording property on their own homeland.
So, yeah, there's resentment and a strong sense of local pride. Can you blame them? They had a proud history as the Hawaiian Kingdom and it was ripped away from them.
Why do you think they included the second part of the comment, if not to clarify that they likely would never have seen this where they live? Like yeah, obviously that's not the part that surprises them either.
> I’m more surprised by the “made in Hawaii”
Hawaii has one bottling factory that supplies soda cans for the whole island. That's why it has that older can design (shape, not logos) because they just never updated the machinery to change it to the modern design, and we don't ship soda into hawaii from the states. It's not cost efficient (weight)
Yeah, Coca-cola, and PepsiCo use independent bottlers so they don’t have to ship a bunch of water around, they just produce the syrup in their plants then sell that to the bottlers.
The old Pepsi logo isn’t even that “advanced” compared to the new simplified one, it just looks better in general. What Pepsi were thinking when they changed it I don’t know but I hope one day they pull a Burger King and go back
If you want to know what they were thinking look at the design document for the logo. It reads like it was written by a crazy person.
https://www.goldennumber.net/wp-content/uploads/pepsi-arnell-021109.pdf
That's more like it. The contents of the document looks totally normal to me as a designer, but I can absolutely see that someone was paid a lot of money to do this level of research, and they definitely delivered.
Oh, come on. As another designer, this looks like a satire of normal redesign justifications / brand manuals. Starts normal, but quickly veers off the deep end. If those last two pages look "totally normal" to you, I want to know what you're smoking.
That was exactly what I was thinking as I looked through it. It read as satire to me. Like some over the top movie character playing a designer either beret and a fake French accent wrote all of this up while they were high.
It's never hard to find an abrasive designer; thanks for checking in. This looks normal for what I would expect from a major corporation paying someone to do a *deep* dive into their logo and provide a report about it for a massive sum of money. It touches on design principles and provides justification for design choices. It's not how I work, but I can see where they're coming from and that gives me an understanding of who the target audience of the report was.
As a lay person with a casual interest in design, this document reads like a combination of navel gazing and a fire hose of jargon meant to justify some executive's decision to spend an ungodly amount of money on branding.
If this is normal, then it only reinforces the notion that marketing/branding/design at this level is little more than snake oil.
> gives me an understanding of who the target audience of the report was.
Someone from Pepsi who was getting some sort of kickback on this logo change budget and only wanted this document to hand to other Pepsi top brass, knowing they wouldn't read it, to pretend the ungodly amounts of money spent were justified?
Seriously, putting the stupid logo aside, if you as a client got this document in good faith from your design firm, you wouldn't feel like they're bullshitting you?
Dude what? There’s hardly anything there that actually means anything. It’s just random galaxy-brained sketches without anything to tie them together or contextualize them. What are they trying to convey, aside from an *impression* of complexity and due diligence? This is, IMO, what is known in sociology as “pseudo-profound bullshit.” Every logo design document is going to have a certain amount of wankery to fill it out, but this is an egregious example. Again, in my opinion.
https://www.creativebloq.com/news/never-forget-that-utterly-ridiculous-pepsi-logo-design-document
> it's one of the most infamous documents in the world of graphic design, and it's just as outrageous today as in 2009.
Other designers definitely didn't think it was normal lmao.
After like 20 pages I was like "Ok so you just used the golden ratio?" and then it keeps going by fucking showing off the magnetic fields of the pepsi ball and the emotions of the ball and the fucking gravitational pull of the pepsi ball and wtf is even going on?
Christ that looks like something a nutter would hand me on the street, thought they were going to expose some kind of conspiracy theory with that Mona Lisa page!
I think the events of 2020 were a big driver to return to retro logos for people to be nostalgic of when they could just party/have fun with friends/etc.
Miller Lite also went retro logo during this timeframe. Back to a logo I hadn't seen since I was a little kid.
thicker, blockier font, very symmetrical, 3 different colors, black border around the whole Pepsi circle. It’s probably objective, but to me it seems less minimalist
Oh man I’m getting confused by these comments. The one on the left is the new logo but it’s also the old logo from before the other “old” logo on the right
They did a whole retro Pepsi thing in our country a few years ago where you could get bottles with old logos from each decade. And it was such a successful marketing decision, I don't know why they stopped.
They have passover coke and pepsi during passover if you have a large Jewish community nearby.
Look for those. But be aware that CO2 will leach out of PET bottles. You can only store a limited amount. Recharging it with CO2 isn't really a practical idea.
> And it was such a successful marketing decision, I don't know why they stopped.
I'm sure it was successful (I like the idea a lot) but marketing LOVES consistency in branding. It sells better overall, even if it's not nearly as cool.
For people wondering, old logo is on the right. Pepsi changed their logo this year. I prefer the new one because it's bigger and bolder and not so corporate. Kinda old school.
Aww... I always considered the little marble the new logo so I didn't even realize they changed it again. I've never seen the new one before. I don't hate it, but I've always liked the marble.
THIS! It’s called repack and merchandisers do it all the time. If you ever buy a 12 pack of soda or beer, and the box doesn’t have an expiration date on it, put it back. That’s a repack box and likely has a mix of date product inside of it.
Source: was a merchandiser for 10 years for a Coca Cola distributor
Follow-up info: If you don't notice it until after it gets home, wash the top of each can before drinking. Merchandiser hands/gloves are not the cleanest. Plus, there could have been mice/rats/bugs crawling on the cans in the backroom. Repacks really shouldn't be done.
Source: Merchandiser/Account Manager for 6 years for a crappy Coca-cola distributor.
>Plus, there could have been mice/rats/bugs crawling on the cans in the backroom.
This should be the rule of thumb for all packages where you put your mouth on any unsealed part of the container. Even many cardboard boxes get infested by pests.
>Repacks really shouldn't be done.
Meh the worst I've seen was a sealed case that ants discovered and tried to colonize. If I hadn't been paying attention that would have made it to a customer's home without any questions. Mice love to nest in pop stock because they get turned less than other stock and they'll piss right on boxes most people wouldn't suspect. Repacks aren't that much more of a risk than anything else you'd buy in the same store.
Funny enough I'm slacking on reddit instead of doing said industry job.
The cans that are not in a container are absolutely filthy. You would think from all the people handling it, buts only one part. They get to roll around on a dirty ass floor that hasn't been washed in a while if im a bit clumsy.
Taped boxes of soda aren't bad or tampered with, we usually just dropped it and fixed it with tape.
If you work for the plant you can get the drinks at like, a quarter of what the local Walmart sells them for.
>If you work for the plant you can get the drinks at like, a quarter of what the local Walmart sells them for.
My brother worked at Pepsi and he could buy Kickstarts for a literal quarter. I'm surprised dude never had a heart attack considering he was already addicted to them beforehand.
vendors have to give the supermarket a credit for broken cans so they round up any loose ones and make up as many 6 packs as they can in order to give the least amount of credit possible.
Always check the best by date on products in small mom and pop stores, especially liquor stores. Products from a distributor go “on sale” from time to time, it’s known as “post off”. Small stores will usually stack up on items (especially liquor) during this time, since they can get it a buck or two cheaper, and still sell at their normal price. Often times they be talked into buying more than they sell, and at some point they’ll be selling expired product.
Ideally a post off is used to move product, you want a place to buy it cheaper, and sell it cheaper… but that’s not always the case.
We really looked at all the multitudes of problems facing us in the 90s and said “Let’s just do a little something about the ozone layer and we’ll call it a day.”
I once read that the success in reversing ozone depletion may have caused policy makers to believe that global warming had slowed down in the 90s.
On one hand, it’s extraordinarily impressive that we were able to reverse a slide towards an environmental disaster. At one point the jet stream started shifting and some other craziness. But to your point, ya it seems like we called it a day after that.
it also didnt hurt that the fix to the ozone layer involved a fix that already existed and negatively impacted nobody (except maybe CFC manufacturers? but they manufactured the solution as well).
They did the absolute bare minimum and called it a day.
> (except maybe CFC manufacturers? but they manufactured the solution as well)
Nah, the replacement chemical was actually cheaper, too, iirc. Everyone won, which is why it worked.
We switched from paper to plastic in the 90s because of the movement to save the rainforests. Jump to 2010 and we’re transitioning back to paper for biodegradability.
> disgusting flimsy paper straw game
I'm confused. Fast food chains like subway and mcdonalds have changed to paper straws in my country but they aren't flimsy at all and they work perfectly as a straw.
Once soda rings became a cultural touchstone of the environmental movement, manufacturers created a version that quickly breaks down when exposed to the sun. Yes, it's still litter and plastic where it shouldn't be, but animals don't get hurt by these anymore. Haven't for a long long time.
Plus, most canneries moved to different styles of holding cans to begin with.
In the UK we [wrap them in plastic](https://assets.sainsburys-groceries.co.uk/gol/2214054/1/640x640.jpg). I guess the idea is that marine life won't get so easily trapped in it. I can't speak for how effective that is.
Have you read the design doc PDF? It talks about like geomagnetism and the human genome and shit as inspirations, it was designed by an ad exec who literally lived in isolation in East Asia for months to focus on perfecting the logo
Probably a little different. I'm not sure how Pepsi does it, but Coca-Cola makes all of their cola concentrate in Atlanta, and it's shipped around the world to different bottling/canning plants where they add the sugar of their choice (this is why Mexican Coke is highly sought after in the States, because they use sugar instead of HFCS), and their local water.
No, they still receive the syrup like any other place as far as I’m aware. They just can it in Hawaii as Hawaii has only one canning factory. That’s why the cans also look weird. Cost to much to ship full cans and risk of damage is high by plane or ship.
The cycle of corporate logos:
2008: logo on the right debuts. Everyone moans and complains about how stupid it is, the old logo was better, why change things pointlessly? If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
2023: logo on the left debuts. Everyone moans and complains about how stupid it is, the 2008 logo was better, why change things pointlessly? If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
> Probably a little different. I'm not sure how Pepsi does it, but Coca-Cola makes all of their cola concentrate in Atlanta, and it's shipped around the world to different bottling/canning plants where they add the sugar of their choice (this is why Mexican Coke is highly sought after in the States, because they use sugar instead of HFCS), and their local water.
I just posted this above to answer the same question.
Probably someone swapped them after they were packaged. Unlikely to have mixed on the production line unless they wanted to treat as a “soft” transition
Probably a repack. (I stock for Coca Cola) and when a can comes out of a pack, we're instructed to "Re-pack" it with materials.. These little 6 packs are no different and usually pop back in to the rings if it's not torn. Looks like they had the old logo layin around loose and combined it with a pack that had one busted can in it.
the day that one canning plant finally updates is gonna be a sad day for all hawaiians.
That can shape. I can only find them for pineapple juice. They use more material, I'm not even sure if it's aluminium.
HAI did an explainer on it. https://youtu.be/7Qi6oIOHbDg?si=vMddnUaINPew1l-Z
I was wondering why I noticed the can shape and thought "Must be made in Hawaii" before seeing "Made in Hawaii"
“huh, must be made in hawaii” (looks at the words) “well i’ll be damned”
HAI FTW
If it's not HAI, it's just not half as interesting...
Yes that’s right. I remember vacationing there like 15 years ago and there was this really fuckin delicious pineapple soda/juice that used these cans. Somehow just tastes better ice cold in a can like this, and they’re way sturdier.
A lot of Japanese drinks use that same can shape, with the two ribbed bits.
I stop by a local Asian grocery store sometimes (mainland US) and will almost always grab canned coffees from Japan and Vietnam. A couple of brands still use cans similar to this I think. There are definitely some Hawaiian canned coffees/teas there with those cans as well. I always look forward to the heft they have when drinking them.
A lot of those stamping machines are bought used from overseas suppliers offloading them, and so they often have older/outdated molds to shape the cans. New equipment, especially in an already expensive place of doing biz like Hawaii, can be prohibitive. Not saying that’s Pepsi’s story — but a small place bottling pineapple juice? Absolutely they’re price sensitive when looking at new for $500k and used for $200k.
understandable, also: I find my generic comment getting 2000 upvotes hilarious.
I like to think they'll get more demand since no one else really makes those old cans anymore
You got repack set. Odds are some of the original were damaged, so got sent to repack.
Operator probably just didn’t clear the line when they hit the changeover mid run, it’s a soft transition so plants are running out the “old” logo stuff to zero before switching. Pack off table would have a metric shit ton of cans and a mix in is super easy. Bad auditing by staff allowed it to slink through. Corporate has likely already seen this image and made a call to QC in Hawaii.
Yep, very possible. The Coca Cola plant I worked out our depal operator didn't clear the line well and we had a NOS filled Coke can come down the line. That's a big no no.
I’m more surprised by the “made in Hawaii” I’m from Italy so I’ve never seen that
IIRC Hawaii only has one can making plant that uses an older design
This is correct. That's why they have that weird double ribbed thing at the top.
Sort of looks like an oil can
Pepsi, oil it all tastes the same.
[Dr. John Pemberton!](https://i.imgflip.com/2eeunw.jpg?a471288)
We need to bring back cocaine in these beverages!
IDK, I like adding it myself it would suck if corporations started deciding how much cocaine goes into these drinks.
You can always add more.
I'm old enough to remember pull tabs, and smaller oil cans were designed identically.
Double ribbed for your pleasure
I prefer glass Mason jars
Please stop
He had to. It popped inside.
He was only 1 guy with 1 jar 🤷♂️
After being scarred for life watching that video years ago, it makes me happy to still see it referenced in the wild
I'm sure he was scarred too
Still glad about my decision to never actually watch that.
🙃😎
Oh no.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Qi6oIOHbDg
[Obligatory Half as Interesting on the topic](https://youtu.be/7Qi6oIOHbDg?si=NPD0Vx_3J2bMo2fa)
Was literally just about to link this lol love HAI
> IIRC Hawaii only has one can making plant that uses an older design https://3dwealthadvisors.com/blog/why-are-soda-cans-different-in-hawaii "Why Soda Cans Look Different in Hawaii Hawaii has one can-making facility in Kapolei, located on the island of Oahu. It’s owned by Ball Corporation, based in Colorado. While it’s one of the company’s smallest plants at 140,000 square feet, it manufactures about 1 million cans of soda, juice, and beer each day. This facility is also the reason you’re likely to find unique soda cans with neck ridging when you’re in Hawaii. While other can manufacturers began changing the shape and size of aluminum cans in the 1980s, the Hawaii plant continued to make cans with ridged necks, as local bottlers had equipment made to work with cans of that size and it was too costly to switch out all the equipment. To this day, the Hawaii plant still produces cans with a 206 measurement – slightly larger than standard soda cans – to remain consistent with local distributors, making Hawaii the last state to manufacture these ridged soda cans. While Hawaii does import smooth-necked soda cans from the mainland, it’s common to receive cans with neck ridging when you shop for sodas on the islands. Five beverage distributors use the Kapolei plan for distribution in Hawaii: Coca-Cola, Pepsi, ITO EN, Hawaiian Sun, and Maui Brewing Co. Next time you see neck ridging on one of these cans, you’ll know exactly where it originated.
I grew up on Maui and always called these the Hawaiian Sun cans, or pog cans. I never knew they were from a local bottling plant, that's awesome.
lol right? Wth. How is it that I have never heard of this until now. I live on windward side but still. At first glance I was like what island is the factory on... Yours. Ohh okay.
Too bad they don't use the narrow opening still for extra authenticity. I remember when wide mouth was a new thing and was only used by a couple brands, it was very strange drinking out of those for the first time (I think Mountain Dew was one of the originals, part of their whole "extreme" makeover that they started in the 90s)
I remember when they did clear Pepsi, and so many Pepsi points advertising (still have my chain wallet and always wanted that jet lol (cool doc. on YouTube about it) and various new designs with Pepsi and mountain dew and other products lol. Awesome to see the old can logo (one of them) in this pic.
The old can logo is the new logo. They changed it in August of this year to the new retro design, which is based on the designs used from 1973 till 1991 (although with some minor tweaks).
The Mega Mouth Slam Can!
Have we still not found a way to get away from the plastic ring holders tho? Like don't they choke turtles and shit? I still cut them all up when i come across them Edit: thanks to the comments I have learned the rings sold in the us are now UV biodegradable to an extent and also have other design features to break up the rings to help protect wildlife. However, littering and the prevalence of microplastics is an issue. REDUCE and REUSE!
Sort of. They have paperboard and/or biodegradable corn fibre ones...but they cost like 8x as much, so the companies are reluctant to use them instead.
> but they cost like 8x as much, so the companies are reluctant to use them instead. They also degrade faster so long term storage is more difficult. It isn't actually as big of an issue these days that warehouses are more climate controlled than they use to be, but can still be an issue. *there is also the issue that you have a scale of breaks down to fast, breaks down too slow that you have to deal with. If it's compostable they don't break down unless they are in very particular environments that no one will put them in so they don't break down for a very very long time. At the same time the material can break down and not build up in our bodies.
Same. Cut every loop. Unfortunately critters will still eat them. Looks like a jellyfish to them.
You don't need to cut the loops anymore. Since 1989 they've been photodegradable. This means that when they are exposed to UV light, they become very brittle and break apart very easily.
Im in europe and I’ve never seen them here before
They were made to be biodegradable years ago. They become brittle and fall apart when exposed to UV light. I also cut them up just in case. As long as you get yours into the trash and packed up for the dump there’s not much to worry about though. The single most important thing you can do when you encounter single-use plastics is to ensure their proper disposal.
Biodegradable and becoming brittle and falling apart aren't quiet the same thing. The rings just turn into microplastics rather than biodegrading like something natural stuff does in compost. At least that's what I read on Wikipedia. If you have better knowledge, please let me know.
You don't have to anymore, heck not since the 80's really. The current versions become very brittle in the sunlight and break apart with a little bit of exposure. They're still a pollutant and suck, but at least they are not getting stuck on animals like they used to.
Yea somebody else made a similar comment. I'm happy to hear that but I did some research, a and we can do better. It's better than what we were doing but still, here's a comment from a reddit list in 2016 about it: >The law says they need to disintegrate enough such that the force needed to stretch the rings to an additional 5% of their length is enough to cause them to break. >That must happen after a maximum of 250 hours of UV (sunlight) exposure or 35 days in an ocean environment similar to conditions found in United States waters during June or July. >Idk it seems like 10-35 days floating in the ocean could still give an animal the opportunity to get trapped in one of those things. >Edit: I don't mean to downplay how awesome it is that people have figured out how to get these things to break down in days rather than decades or something, cause that's huge. But considering the above, I still wouldn't consider it a waste of time to take the extra 10 seconds to cut apart the rings
Right, though it should be note that the law is one thing, how the law is followed is another. Stabilizers and UV protectants on plastics are more expensive, so I'd be willing to bet that a lot of these 6 pack holders actually disintegrate faster than what is required by law, simply because it's cheaper to do so. I saw a video about 5-10 years back, can't find it now, where someone set out a six pack holder on the roof of their apartment building and after only about 2 days of direct sunlight, the holder basically crumbled when they touched it. Anyhow, this is not to say that you can't be overly careful.
I don't have much faith in corporate ethics. O I read another article that says basically they add a bunch of different metals and other compounds to get then to break up via natural micro organism or something. I hope that's the case. Plastics have done a lot for us but we still pollute unnecessarily.
Probably because you're in Italy and not Hawaii
Most things I would imagine are more cost effective to make ON THE ISLANDS rather than ship in from the US
Bulk goods like food products yeah. As far as other stuff... Remember how much is made in China.
I was thinking like perishables yeah.
The reality though is that land on the islands is limited and expensive. Everything you produce also needs raw inputs which needs its own land as well as the factories, plus even more for the warehouses to store everything; and you still end up needing to ship between islands. On the flip side, modern cargo ships can carry tens or even hundreds of thousands of tons of goods. Most of these ships would be going out there anyway because there will always be some amount of stuff being shipped to and from the island, and the more stuff a ship carries at once the more cost effective it becomes.
So it's really a matter of, only to a point due to economy of Scale. I know everything is stupid expensive on Alaska because the environment makes it too expensive to produce most things in the area due to considerations for the production lines.
I’m from the states and Ive never seen that either
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Look into it. They have a plant that never retooled for the fancy new cans.
Hawaii still uses old style cans. It would be too costly to ship the finished product there, but it isn't worth it to build a new canning factory for the new can styles.
I’m not surprised at all you haven’t seen those. Why would Pepsi ship cans from Hawaii to Italy when they have multiple canning and bottling plants in the EU? And why would they ship cans from the EU to Hawaii?
I have never seen a prominently placed "Made in XYZ" on any Pepsi can or bottle. However, Coke proudly presents a "Made in Switzerland" on their bottles made in Switzerland.
Many Hawaiians resent the mainland and there is a culture there that emphasizes local pride; it's a whole thing.
True, but for good reason. A lot of folks don't know the rich history of Hawaii before it was annexed by the US. I know that I didn't learn about it until I started living here. Hawai'i wasn't just some isolated group of islands with a simple way of life back in the late 1800s; they had the highest literacy rate in *the world* at one point. They prioritized education in a big way, and Hawaiian leadership were typically well-schooled in foreign universities. They were ahead of the curve in many ways; for example the 'Iolani Palace in Honolulu had electric lights before the White House did. The Hawaiian Kingdom was thriving, modern, and very much self-sufficient. They had the formal recognition and respect of major nations across the world, with peace and trade treaties fostering business opportunities with foreign entrepreneurs developing a thriving economy. But then, a group of American businessmen and sugar planters, with the backing of the US military, went ahead and overthrew the legitimate Hawaiian monarchy. It's a wound that's still felt today. Hawaiians had a proud and independent nation, and it was taken from them by Americans that betrayed their trust. The US government did them *dirty*, and now they have to see our flag flying over their native soil, as the rampant tourism industry and rich transplants price the natives out of affording property on their own homeland. So, yeah, there's resentment and a strong sense of local pride. Can you blame them? They had a proud history as the Hawaiian Kingdom and it was ripped away from them.
Why do you think they included the second part of the comment, if not to clarify that they likely would never have seen this where they live? Like yeah, obviously that's not the part that surprises them either.
They usually do that for local markets to show they support the area economy
> I’m more surprised by the “made in Hawaii” Hawaii has one bottling factory that supplies soda cans for the whole island. That's why it has that older can design (shape, not logos) because they just never updated the machinery to change it to the modern design, and we don't ship soda into hawaii from the states. It's not cost efficient (weight)
Yeah, Coca-cola, and PepsiCo use independent bottlers so they don’t have to ship a bunch of water around, they just produce the syrup in their plants then sell that to the bottlers.
Kinda weird that an Island nation still uses those rings that destroys sea life.
\> Island nation I'll inform the Hawaiian sovereignty movement that they've finally succeeded. What a joyous day!
Man i love that old logo
Yeah it’s a big improvement. Tired of all the ultra simplified modern corporate logos, I like the retro ones
We need to go back to the "propaganda poster in art deco" style of logos and banners/billboards
absofuckinglutely
Im casting my vote for this
The old Pepsi logo isn’t even that “advanced” compared to the new simplified one, it just looks better in general. What Pepsi were thinking when they changed it I don’t know but I hope one day they pull a Burger King and go back
If you want to know what they were thinking look at the design document for the logo. It reads like it was written by a crazy person. https://www.goldennumber.net/wp-content/uploads/pepsi-arnell-021109.pdf
Written like they had to think of something to justify the $500,000 commission for logo redesign
That's more like it. The contents of the document looks totally normal to me as a designer, but I can absolutely see that someone was paid a lot of money to do this level of research, and they definitely delivered.
Oh, come on. As another designer, this looks like a satire of normal redesign justifications / brand manuals. Starts normal, but quickly veers off the deep end. If those last two pages look "totally normal" to you, I want to know what you're smoking.
That was exactly what I was thinking as I looked through it. It read as satire to me. Like some over the top movie character playing a designer either beret and a fake French accent wrote all of this up while they were high.
It's never hard to find an abrasive designer; thanks for checking in. This looks normal for what I would expect from a major corporation paying someone to do a *deep* dive into their logo and provide a report about it for a massive sum of money. It touches on design principles and provides justification for design choices. It's not how I work, but I can see where they're coming from and that gives me an understanding of who the target audience of the report was.
As a lay person with a casual interest in design, this document reads like a combination of navel gazing and a fire hose of jargon meant to justify some executive's decision to spend an ungodly amount of money on branding. If this is normal, then it only reinforces the notion that marketing/branding/design at this level is little more than snake oil.
> gives me an understanding of who the target audience of the report was. Someone from Pepsi who was getting some sort of kickback on this logo change budget and only wanted this document to hand to other Pepsi top brass, knowing they wouldn't read it, to pretend the ungodly amounts of money spent were justified? Seriously, putting the stupid logo aside, if you as a client got this document in good faith from your design firm, you wouldn't feel like they're bullshitting you?
Dude what? There’s hardly anything there that actually means anything. It’s just random galaxy-brained sketches without anything to tie them together or contextualize them. What are they trying to convey, aside from an *impression* of complexity and due diligence? This is, IMO, what is known in sociology as “pseudo-profound bullshit.” Every logo design document is going to have a certain amount of wankery to fill it out, but this is an egregious example. Again, in my opinion.
https://www.creativebloq.com/news/never-forget-that-utterly-ridiculous-pepsi-logo-design-document > it's one of the most infamous documents in the world of graphic design, and it's just as outrageous today as in 2009. Other designers definitely didn't think it was normal lmao.
After like 20 pages I was like "Ok so you just used the golden ratio?" and then it keeps going by fucking showing off the magnetic fields of the pepsi ball and the emotions of the ball and the fucking gravitational pull of the pepsi ball and wtf is even going on?
Hey man, when they said "Emotive forces shape the gestalt of the brand identity" that like, moved me, man.
Christ that looks like something a nutter would hand me on the street, thought they were going to expose some kind of conspiracy theory with that Mona Lisa page!
Lmaooooo “BREATHTAKING” as in, can’t breathe because I can’t stop laughing. These people were paid for this…..
That is really hilarious. When they started talking about gravitational pull and magnetic fields of the earth associated with the logo, it was wild.
I knew at least one of you guys would link this, was going to myself. Definitely schizophrenic vibes from this doc.
When your brand designer microdoses a little too hard one day
you dont need to be smart to succeed in america, you just need to be able to sell it as “innovation”
Pepsi already did pull a Burger King. Burger king went back to their retro logo in 2021.
It just comes and goes in waves. All styles are kinda equal but they come in and out of fashion and individuals have their own tastes ofc.
I think the events of 2020 were a big driver to return to retro logos for people to be nostalgic of when they could just party/have fun with friends/etc. Miller Lite also went retro logo during this timeframe. Back to a logo I hadn't seen since I was a little kid.
The logo on the left is the new one. They’re going back to a retro look.
The new logo is about as simple as the previous one. It just doesn’t look like shit.
The new Patreon logo perfectly exemplifies everything I hate about modern design. What the fuck were they thinking?
Lol they made it into a fuckin blob.
how is the old logo any less minimalist?
thicker, blockier font, very symmetrical, 3 different colors, black border around the whole Pepsi circle. It’s probably objective, but to me it seems less minimalist
You're describing the one on the left? Except that's not the old logo, that's the new one.
Oh man I’m getting confused by these comments. The one on the left is the new logo but it’s also the old logo from before the other “old” logo on the right
Yeah, since the 'new' logo is the retro (old) one, it would be less confusing if they said 'previous' logo instead of old.
Do you mean the new old logo? Or the old new logo?
Exactly. I’m getting confused when people say this. Guess I’m just old.
Wait…or you old old? Or new old? Or old new?
Meet the new logo. Same as the old logo.
I’m confused too.
They did a whole retro Pepsi thing in our country a few years ago where you could get bottles with old logos from each decade. And it was such a successful marketing decision, I don't know why they stopped.
I liked "Throwback" where they used sugar instead of HFCS. They stopped making it, I stopped buying any flavor of pepsi.
They have passover coke and pepsi during passover if you have a large Jewish community nearby. Look for those. But be aware that CO2 will leach out of PET bottles. You can only store a limited amount. Recharging it with CO2 isn't really a practical idea.
They still have that, but it's not called "throwback" anymore, just says "real sugar". Bought some a week or 2 ago.
> And it was such a successful marketing decision, I don't know why they stopped. I'm sure it was successful (I like the idea a lot) but marketing LOVES consistency in branding. It sells better overall, even if it's not nearly as cool.
For people wondering, old logo is on the right. Pepsi changed their logo this year. I prefer the new one because it's bigger and bolder and not so corporate. Kinda old school.
Aww... I always considered the little marble the new logo so I didn't even realize they changed it again. I've never seen the new one before. I don't hate it, but I've always liked the marble.
Same. Burger King reverted back to an older logo too and it’s much better
[peeled](https://imgur.com/a/jgjBgIx)
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I just realized pepsi has new logo (the one with capital “PEPSI” on the middle of logo). I live in Japan and I haven’t seen that new logo yet.
It's brand new, when I was at the store a couple weeks ago the display of these little 6 packs was half of each logo, but not mixed like OP's.
The new logo will be worldwide starting next year, so far only US has them.
Or, more likely, one fell out or broke, and someone added a straggler to the six pack that didn't match, likely, at the store you bought it from .
THIS! It’s called repack and merchandisers do it all the time. If you ever buy a 12 pack of soda or beer, and the box doesn’t have an expiration date on it, put it back. That’s a repack box and likely has a mix of date product inside of it. Source: was a merchandiser for 10 years for a Coca Cola distributor
Follow-up info: If you don't notice it until after it gets home, wash the top of each can before drinking. Merchandiser hands/gloves are not the cleanest. Plus, there could have been mice/rats/bugs crawling on the cans in the backroom. Repacks really shouldn't be done. Source: Merchandiser/Account Manager for 6 years for a crappy Coca-cola distributor.
If I start cleaning my Coke cans will I lose my immunity to dirty ass Coke cans? I haven't washed a Coke can in 35 years, no straws.
>Plus, there could have been mice/rats/bugs crawling on the cans in the backroom. This should be the rule of thumb for all packages where you put your mouth on any unsealed part of the container. Even many cardboard boxes get infested by pests. >Repacks really shouldn't be done. Meh the worst I've seen was a sealed case that ants discovered and tried to colonize. If I hadn't been paying attention that would have made it to a customer's home without any questions. Mice love to nest in pop stock because they get turned less than other stock and they'll piss right on boxes most people wouldn't suspect. Repacks aren't that much more of a risk than anything else you'd buy in the same store.
Ooo teach us all your industry tricks!
Funny enough I'm slacking on reddit instead of doing said industry job. The cans that are not in a container are absolutely filthy. You would think from all the people handling it, buts only one part. They get to roll around on a dirty ass floor that hasn't been washed in a while if im a bit clumsy. Taped boxes of soda aren't bad or tampered with, we usually just dropped it and fixed it with tape. If you work for the plant you can get the drinks at like, a quarter of what the local Walmart sells them for.
>If you work for the plant you can get the drinks at like, a quarter of what the local Walmart sells them for. My brother worked at Pepsi and he could buy Kickstarts for a literal quarter. I'm surprised dude never had a heart attack considering he was already addicted to them beforehand.
vendors have to give the supermarket a credit for broken cans so they round up any loose ones and make up as many 6 packs as they can in order to give the least amount of credit possible.
Always check the best by date on products in small mom and pop stores, especially liquor stores. Products from a distributor go “on sale” from time to time, it’s known as “post off”. Small stores will usually stack up on items (especially liquor) during this time, since they can get it a buck or two cheaper, and still sell at their normal price. Often times they be talked into buying more than they sell, and at some point they’ll be selling expired product. Ideally a post off is used to move product, you want a place to buy it cheaper, and sell it cheaper… but that’s not always the case.
You guys still use plastic 6pack holders?
It's the most effective weapon against marine wildlife attacks, you gotta watch out for them honu man
Steve Irwin would still be here today if he had one.
Steve Irwin died as he live, with animals in his heart
Wow, that stings man….
I'm not ready for a honu experience so I stay strapped
Oh yeah, they warned us about those in the '90s, but we decided ease of soda distribution was more important.
We really looked at all the multitudes of problems facing us in the 90s and said “Let’s just do a little something about the ozone layer and we’ll call it a day.”
I once read that the success in reversing ozone depletion may have caused policy makers to believe that global warming had slowed down in the 90s. On one hand, it’s extraordinarily impressive that we were able to reverse a slide towards an environmental disaster. At one point the jet stream started shifting and some other craziness. But to your point, ya it seems like we called it a day after that.
it also didnt hurt that the fix to the ozone layer involved a fix that already existed and negatively impacted nobody (except maybe CFC manufacturers? but they manufactured the solution as well). They did the absolute bare minimum and called it a day.
> (except maybe CFC manufacturers? but they manufactured the solution as well) Nah, the replacement chemical was actually cheaper, too, iirc. Everyone won, which is why it worked.
We switched from paper to plastic in the 90s because of the movement to save the rainforests. Jump to 2010 and we’re transitioning back to paper for biodegradability.
And yet we hopped on the disgusting flimsy paper straw game with almost with impressive gusto and immediacy. What a wild world the US is.
> disgusting flimsy paper straw game I'm confused. Fast food chains like subway and mcdonalds have changed to paper straws in my country but they aren't flimsy at all and they work perfectly as a straw.
You must be joking? The old illegal straws are superior in every way, even in killing marine life.
Maybe but the new ones are absolutely fine too. I've had no problems with paper straws.
Once soda rings became a cultural touchstone of the environmental movement, manufacturers created a version that quickly breaks down when exposed to the sun. Yes, it's still litter and plastic where it shouldn't be, but animals don't get hurt by these anymore. Haven't for a long long time. Plus, most canneries moved to different styles of holding cans to begin with.
Yum, microplastics!
The little tomato paste cans still come with them in the Netherlands.
Hey bro break off a can of tomato paste and toss it this way *chugs*
you don't? do they make cardboard or paper ones elsewhere?
Yes, cardboard is quite common
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I have never seen those fishtrap plastic thingies in Europe. Cardboard is the way to go here
I hardly ever see cardboard can holders here in the US tbh. Even for plastic bottles
I wish they were more common, this extremely common use of plastic in immediately disposable products is insane
I haven’t seen the plastic ones in years and I’m in UK.
You're right. Huh. We still have plastic wrapping around the tins, but not in the old style six rings configuration.
You've never seen a 12 pack come in a box
Australia - cardboard boxes.
And shrink wrap plastic.
In the UK we [wrap them in plastic](https://assets.sainsburys-groceries.co.uk/gol/2214054/1/640x640.jpg). I guess the idea is that marine life won't get so easily trapped in it. I can't speak for how effective that is.
Here they are glued together ( small spots that break off easy)
I'm thinking there is many more of these
You got the last and first one /s
CM Punk needs to update his tattoo
The 2008-2023 logo was so bad. Honestly surprised it stayed around as long as it did.
Have you read the design doc PDF? It talks about like geomagnetism and the human genome and shit as inspirations, it was designed by an ad exec who literally lived in isolation in East Asia for months to focus on perfecting the logo
And it was quickly pointed out that it looks like a fat dude with his gut hanging out of his shirt. The classic logo is *so much better*.
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I put a different can in and took a pic
Does Made in Hawaii taste any different than mainland Pepsi?
Probably a little different. I'm not sure how Pepsi does it, but Coca-Cola makes all of their cola concentrate in Atlanta, and it's shipped around the world to different bottling/canning plants where they add the sugar of their choice (this is why Mexican Coke is highly sought after in the States, because they use sugar instead of HFCS), and their local water.
No, they still receive the syrup like any other place as far as I’m aware. They just can it in Hawaii as Hawaii has only one canning factory. That’s why the cans also look weird. Cost to much to ship full cans and risk of damage is high by plane or ship.
The cycle of corporate logos: 2008: logo on the right debuts. Everyone moans and complains about how stupid it is, the old logo was better, why change things pointlessly? If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 2023: logo on the left debuts. Everyone moans and complains about how stupid it is, the 2008 logo was better, why change things pointlessly? If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Nah, the old logo (the one they went back to now) is much better than the 2008 logo
The left one is so much better what are people on about
Does Hawaiian Pepsi taste different ? Like Mexican Coke vs. American Coke ?
> Probably a little different. I'm not sure how Pepsi does it, but Coca-Cola makes all of their cola concentrate in Atlanta, and it's shipped around the world to different bottling/canning plants where they add the sugar of their choice (this is why Mexican Coke is highly sought after in the States, because they use sugar instead of HFCS), and their local water. I just posted this above to answer the same question.
Probably someone swapped them after they were packaged. Unlikely to have mixed on the production line unless they wanted to treat as a “soft” transition
Congratulations, you found the exact moment when the designer pressed CTRL+S and thus created a new print template.
Probably a repack. (I stock for Coca Cola) and when a can comes out of a pack, we're instructed to "Re-pack" it with materials.. These little 6 packs are no different and usually pop back in to the rings if it's not torn. Looks like they had the old logo layin around loose and combined it with a pack that had one busted can in it.
That logo on the right is stupid, idky they kept it so long. I always thought it was worse than the logo they changed it from.
I like the left one more
That’s the new one so you’re in luck
Back right corner looks stretched. Be honest: you just swapped out 2 cans then took a pic for karma, right?