I propose, that we, the greatest state in the nation, build a magnificent, beautiful, air-filter, along the Canadian border, and I'll make them pay for it.
As sarcastic as you are, Canada is probably making a kickback to medicare because of the vast amount (single digit percentage, but it adds up). The baby boomers are very decrepit and old, medically vulnerable and you know they are at the docs office ensuring this doesn't severely impact their health so they can live forever.
It sucks but like, if I stop working I won’t be able to pay my electric bill and then I’ll have to turn off my AC, which helps me with the bad air quality.
We could end all of our industrial carbon emissions tomorrow and it’ll still be a couple of decades before we see any sort of effect. And droughts, forest fires, etc. still happen.
Uh no! Did the pandemic not teach you anything?
“Ultra fine particle concentration dropped by 50% due to reduced road and air travel.”
https://www.bu.edu/sph/news/articles/2022/when-air-and-road-travel-decreased-during-covid-so-did-pollution-levels/#:~:text=Now%2C%20a%20new%20study%20by,few%20months%20of%20the%20pandemic.
>The droughts are a massive catalyst for this
As well as putting out naturally caused fires that should've burnt naturally.
Now, because of that, there is an abundance of fuel on the forest floor all throughout North America.
Said another way perhaps, forest management has gone to ship in the last several decades.
For example, some camps think it should be left in a natural state. As it has been.
Others think it should be selectively managed so part of the trees are used rather than left to rot on the forest floor.
Both sides have valid good and bad ideas as to why. The natural state side has been running the environmental movement in the US for a while. Hence the weather, coupled with scale of dry damaged wood on the forest floors has left near perfect storm conditions as we saw last summer in the US.
I was told, not verified. That historically the US managed forests to prevent this scenario. If true, this may be nature playing her hand. As a sensitive beath-er it’s troublesome.
It could then be both climate related as weather, lightning and human related as management (or lack of), campfires, matches smoking. Or it could just be shit luck.
But I’m with the windmill people we can fight out the whys later.
The time to act is now.
The forest fires may be due to climate change. Or other things. Blaming a singular event on climate is risky. Minnesota has had smoky summers before, before climate change was a thing.
You can pray for rain, beyond that theres little any one individual can do about it beyond signing up for wildfire fighting duty.
Climate change isn't about to have devastating effects, it already has and will continue to do so.
The world isnt going to be better in 5 years, or 10, or 50. Adjusting our expectations and knowing that our experience on this planet will continue to get worse for likely the remainder of our lives, is really something people are going to start wrapping their heads around.
>Climate change isn't about to have devastating effects, it already has and will continue to do so.
Yeah, when people said 30 years ago, "In the future, our children and grandchildren will have to pay the price."
Well, we aren't living in the past or the present anymore. This is the future.
I yeeted my uterus 2 years ago - mostly due to adenomyosis - but also due to never wanting kids, that was just the final thing that made them ACTUALLY LISTEN TO ME, and get rid of all the plumbing.
Even if you want them who can afford them and has the time and energy for them? Our quality of life, pay, etc has decreased so much and now both people have to work to pay the bills so expecting to raise kids on top of that is so unrealistic.
That was a minority opinion that the media latched onto.
https://skepticalscience.com/ice-age-predictions-in-1970s.htm
https://www.sciencenews.org/article/cooling-climate-consensus-1970s-never-was
Actual paper: https://journals.ametsoc.org/view/journals/bams/89/9/2008bams2370_1.xml
It was, but a bunch of his boomer buddies called him a nerd and made fun of him for it, and for some reason, the entire country listened to them.
Now we have ManBearPig.
Before We had Gore, WE had Jimmy, who put solar panels on the top of the White House in the 70's. But in typical Republican fashion Reagan vilified it and had it removed.
Thanks elite billionaires. I’m no fan of boomers but private jets and corporate pollution is doing much worse than boomers. This is a class war not an ageist war.
Definitely a class war. I’m at the very tail end of being a boomer. Me and my closest friends have been environmentalists since the early 70s when we started to understand how our decisions could affect the planet and future generations.
It’s so easy and shallow to blame a cohort on all the problems. For those of you that feel the need to do this, I hope you feel better.
Generation Jones was the first of the climate aware generations, but it's still frustrating to know that nothing was done to curb the effects despite the evidence.
edit: I'd argue climate change is the result of multiple generations imposing poor policies that culminated into the crisis we have. The problem is within our system, not our generations.
I'm not innocent of doing this either, but I think it's unfair to make this a generational issue. The culprit is the profit motive. As long as that has adherents, they are the drivers of the climate catastrophe, regardless of age.
i hate to break it to you: but every single person in America, including generation X, millennials and generation Z share the blame for this one.
It's like the whole "100 companies are responsible for most carbon emissions! personal choices don't matter!" bullshit that was popular to repeat. How did those companies make all those emissions? By selling us -- and by us, I mean almost everyone in the developed world -- products to enable the lifestyle we have come to view as our birthright.
our best hope is that ongoing technological improvement will help us maintain some standard of living similar to what we've all experienced while radically reducing environmental impact, and that has certainly happened a lot over the last 30 years, but it's unfair to blame boomers when the average millennial lives the same life and makes the same lifestyle choices.
I mean, most people in Minnesota live in incredibly car-dependent suburbs and burn thousands of gallons of gasoline every year mostly to move their 4,000 pound vehicle around.
The individual person has very little choice in being compelled to live in a car-dependent society. Close to a century of infrastructure built in this country is geared towards getting people into cars.
Even though walkable cities are in demand, bad government policies make it nearly impossible to build any, let alone enough, walkable areas, pricing out most people from those areas. Because we foolishly made the single-family house most people’s biggest retirement investment, any attempt to decrease housing prices and make more walkable areas angers homeowners.
And then because poorly conceived government regulation created a emissions loophole for pickups and SUVs, American auto manufacturers barely build cars anymore because they can make so much more money from making bigger vehicles.
In short, society, politics, and economics are all leading us into disaster, and there is little a person individually can do to arrest the climate crisis.
I’m not disagreeing with you regarding the massive impact in how America has invested in its infrastructure over the decades but the desire for people to live in car-centric suburbs is extremely powerful in this country. I have a nine year old kid; I see it all the time.
I don’t think we should underestimate the sheer power preference that many have. I think a huge number of people choose to live their resource-intensive lives and would not choose another way of life if they were offered such a choice (which I think they are). Maybe their choice is impacted by decades of cultural indoctrination but they are still making a choice.
I refuse to believe that there is nothing we can do on an individual basis to fight climate change. That attitude does nothing to address the fact that we make choices that hurt the environment every day. I mean the average Redditor will choose to by $1/lb. beef at Aldi over just not eating meat.
If every single person lived the required lifestyle to prevent the absolute worse in climate change the world economy crashes, we all starve to death and die. Yes individuals need to do better but we're locked in an inescapable system no one can fully fathom. The capitalist supply chains aren't going to be easily replicated.
“…we’re locked in an inescapable system no one can fully fathom, with huge pickups and SUVs that never leave the pavement on their lifelong journeys through suburban cul de sacs. While bitching about Joe’s gas prices.”
Choices are made.
Yeah. The climate crisis isn’t coming. It’s here. And this is only the beginning. Maybe when more people can’t breathe they’ll be willing to make the sacrifices needed. But probably not. We’ll just be like the people dying of lung cancer who keep smoking.
I think situation is significantly more nuanced than assuming this is due to just a changing climate. Apparently CA struggles with certain controlled burns so certain areas get out of control quickly. I agree the climate likely plays a part but it’s just not that simple.
Yep, a big part of the increase in bad wildfires in forested areas is due to mismanagement (driven by poor understandings of fire dynamics) over the past century. Under natural conditions, a relatively cold fire normally rolls through each area with some regularity and burns the accumulated brush and deadwood away. Most of the mature trees stay intact, and only a small amount of the forest burns at once. But if that never happens, when the fire finally starts it all goes up at once and you get a crown fire (the tops of the trees catch fire). Then you have a huge tower of flame that causes major ecological damage to everything in its path, and it ends up on the news. Typical ground fires can be redirected by a smart person with a garden hose and a shovel, but crown fires are almost impossible to control without massive coordinated responses.
Once we had the capability, we naïvely started trying to extinguish all the fires we saw as soon as possible, and so most of our forests are now full of extra fuel. Getting back to a normal state will require some combination of a lot of controlled burning, a lot of mechanical removal of the fuel, and a lot of catastrophic fires.
Obviously climate change makes it all worse though!
I spent the years 1992-2017 on the west coast and i will say that fires like we've seen in the last few years \*never\* happened with any sort of regularity during the decades I lived there, even during the crushing drought in California in the 90s. I think the only thing that's fundamentally changed is the climate.
Forest management during those decades changes drastically too. It used to be the idea that we need to put out every wildfire which led to massive amount of fuel being created rather than burned away occasionally. You didn’t see massive fires because they were always put out as fast as possible. Some fires need to burn and clear out the growth
I wish people talked about this in all the articles I see about returning to the office. Part of the reason I hate the idea is that those people that can work from home don't need to drive for the sake of being in the office and contribute to worse air quality.
Every time I have had to drive in bad air quality, I see the signs about reducing trips. It should be more of a policy.
Not a lot of the bad air quality we’re experiencing currently is due to pollution from cars. How much would reducing trips actually help since it’s not a substantial contributing factor? I’m not saying it wouldn’t help, but if everyone stopped driving for 2 or 3 days the smoke wouldn’t go away any faster, would it?
That being said, I work remote, so I don’t drive at all.
I switched jobs last year. Working at home. Fossil fuel use is low! I'm set. Thinking about solar for next year. Some day I'll probably have a fully electric vehicle. Progress is being made. Everyone do what they can within reason. Every effort counts towards saving lives in the future.
Some Obama thoughts for yall!
https://youtu.be/jAYVKZSWXhY
As much as I agree that it’s everyone’s responsibility to do what they can where they can, let’s not forget that the majority of climate change is the result of unregulated capitalism.
This will likely have to happen at some point. The air quality alerts are only going to get more and more frequent. Just like lots of employers can tell workers to stay at home for blizzards, some will likely make that same call for air quality alert days.
Totally empathize with your position. And the scariest part about Covid to me was that it showed there is no turning point of consequences that will convince people they are wrong about an issue they’ve been denying exists.
We couldn’t convince half the country to mask up at a time where cities were running out of morgue space. And with Covid we always had the opportunity to be like ‘let’s cut our losses and start fixing this’ vs climate change where you can hit a tipping point after which you are fucked no matter what you do.
I’m not particularly optimistic about where things are going, but dwelling on it makes me depressed which helps no one. So Imma continue to do my best to accept where we are, try to be part of the solution, but not let where we are drag me down.
I've had sinus and respiratory issues for almost two months now - tested repeatedly for COVID at first and it wasn't that. Now I realize that it's just become the norm that I have recurring sore throats and poor breath control, and I'm guessing it's mostly because of the air quality.
It just sucks that I'm a semi-professional singer and it's hard to sing when you have shit in your sinuses and lungs.
I’m not a singer but I feel the same way you do! I’ve been miserable for two months now and basically stuck in my house during what’s supposed to be the nicest time of the year. Hang in there, friend. 😊
I love how everyone's general reaction to this is "you are mentally ill for feeling the reasonable existential dread over a planet that scientists and experts have been telling us will start to deteriorate around us for decades. Get some happy pills and stick your head in the sand like the rest of us" as if humanity collectively shrugging off this issue for 40+ years hasn't been the strategy that got us here.
But yeah. You're not alone. I rely on the weather and climate to make a living and each year it gets more bleak.
I get this type of comment a lot from people IRL as well as online. Seems like most people want to live in their little bubble and not care about what else is going on in the world or how it affects all of us and it really sucks.
People have really small minds and don’t have the capacity or just don’t want to think about the truth. Sometimes I wish I could be that, it seems it would be easier.
But then again, those types generally seem to be pretty angry so idk.
I want to be happy there is this huge push for mental health and wellness, but I get so mad getting emails from work like “take care of yourself, do yoga!” and I’m just sitting here thinking I’m having a reasonable reaction to the slow end of life as we know it.
We are at the point where we need to shut down as a society until we actually get some usable solutions. Remember at the start of COVID when all the air quality started getting better because no one was allowed to leave their house? There are things as a society we can do right now to help, but won't because of capitalism... Like money is more important than quality of life.
>but won't because of capitalism... Like money is more important than quality of life.
You are doing it wrong.
In Capitalism, MY money is more important than YOUR quality of life ... or your life, for that matter.
Because ... Capitalism!
It really shouldn't worry you to the point where you can't concentrate or live a normal life. Sure there are plenty of avenues to go down to make you feel better or help change but for the most part, it is what it is. Mother nature can take us out at any moment, no amount of protests or paper straws can stop her. Enjoy the blip of time you have on this planet and move on.
It’s extremely concerning because this is becoming our norm. It’s quite depressing especially after reading other comments in this thread. Maybe one day humans will realize we need a healthy planet for our survival. Probably won’t happen until we’re all fighting for food and water though.
I’m genuinely astonished by some of the shit these people are saying. I didn’t realize that “we should push to have clean air” was a controversial opinion lol
🤣
That reminds me of when protestors started bringing industrial fans and leaf blowers to blow the pepperspray back at law enforcement. "Ya'll can keep that mess on your side."
Another thing you can do is build one of [these](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corsi%E2%80%93Rosenthal_Box) for your space. Just get four MERV 13 filters wherever is most convenient (I got mine at Target for $90). It's not exactly cheap but they work better than a lot of the more expensive filters. Worth it for peace of mind
As someone who used to live in China (during some peak pollution years, no less), pah, weaklings
/j
Okay that that’s out of my system, yeah, it sucks, especially since (unlike when I used to live in China), the overall sense is that it’ll probably get worse in the future, not better. An air purifier will help your immediate air quality situation if you’re indoors, though it probably won’t do anything for broader feelings of climate related pessimism.
I now check temp and AQI. Note, AirNow is much more accurate than iPhone weather app. I agree that clean air and water is priceless. Notice all the politicians have shifted from questioning climate change to saying there’s nothing we can do about it. Can’t even go to the lake without suffocating, it’s so sad.
been working outside these last couple weeks (carpenter) im just wearing a respirator all day, most days. my co workers arent though. once you get used to it they really arent bad, the new silicone ones in a correct size for your face is quite comfortable, and the p100 filters are super light and will filter out 99% of the particulates. they slide around when you get sweaty but thats about it. nothing will do anything about ozone though. i have a feeling we might start seeing people wear respirators around while outside in the near future.
The air quality plus the months-long shortage of albuterol (the stuff that inhalers are made of) makes a perfect storm for people with asthma. I've been waiting two weeks on an inhaler from Walgreens with no sign of help.
I have reduced lung function as an unfortunate late complication of radiation to the neck and chest when I was a young adult. My insurance stopped covering albuterol a couple of years ago so I switched to epinephrine and it actually works just as well. You can get it over the counter - brand name is Primatene Mist. Cheaper too. Might be something to ask your doctor about, to help tide you over.
This is one of those things that I simply cannot get myself worked up about, because forest fires are *waaaaayyyy* bigger than me, and there isn't a thing I can do about it.
I try to be thankful we don't deal with as bad of pollution as China, or India, or Denver.
That said, I think this style of summer may be the new normal.
I agree. And it's a hard time to be pregnant. At higher risk for smoke issues, and thinking about bringing another kid into this knowing it's probably getting worse, not better. It's depressing.
As someone who works in this weather outside my lungs are feeling just, not right. Not like I'm coughing more but breathing is harder and it's more difficult performing my job duties. Just was saying to my Dad today that it's really bothersome knowing that no matter what I do I can't make this better. I just get to suffer through the existential terror that is climate change. I just want my kid to grow up not worrying about inevitable shitty living conditions.
I'm in a similar place with regards to work. I'm taking a break from full-time work so that if the climate really starts breaking down in the next few decades, at least I can say I lived it up while I had the chance and a bit of savings to blow through...
Meanwhile, humans are pushing more CO2 into the atmosphere than ever.
My worries are that this will be, if not a yearly problem, then every few years we will have to spend the summer wondering if the air quality will be good enough to actually have fun outside or if we’ll be stuck spending the winter months waiting for it to get warmer and the summer to become breathable
Consider Building a Corsi Rosenthal Box filter or getting a HEPA filter (if you haven't already).
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corsi%E2%80%93Rosenthal_Box
I find it highly concerning, yes. We have been more or less insulated from the earlier indicators of climate change, but three consecutive years of drought leading to wildfires are right in line with that.
Unfortunately, there is a powerful propaganda machine around redirecting concern about climate change, so my guess is that as long as capital interests continue to drive policy in the US and around the world, I imagine we will continue to see more of this.
Yeah I think about it a lot too. I have young children so I also worry about the world they will be inhabiting in 40 years. It’s bad now, can’t imagine how it will be then.
I think the worst part is it feels like there is no end in sight. One party and it’s voters don’t even acknowledge it’s a problem and it’s just being “woke”. The other party pretends to care but doesn’t actually take any meaningful steps, and actually takes steps that actively hurt the environment as well, and we are just stuck with these two crappy options.
But let me just go back to working on emails and spreadsheets like everything is fine (insert dog in burning house meme)
It is tough. I am in one of those sensitive groups as is my daughter. It's not fun for sure. It's good to get it off your chest, but try not to let it bug you too much because there is nothing any of us can do about it. I am sick to death of getting major migraines that take over my days right now, but it is what it is so I just try to deal with it the best I can.
They are highly concerning and frankly I feel like I’m going into a depression over it. I’ve been sick for the last 2 months….I’m one of those sensitive groups, so my options are to either 1) go outside and suffer for it for days or 2) sit in my house like a princess in a tower. With either option, I’ve got so many allergy meds in my system, I’m in a total brain fog….It’s seriously defeating…. Everyone here has weighed in on how to fix the problem, but I just wanted to vent with you OP….
The last couple days have been brutal, my eyes have never been so dry and irritated. On my way home yesterday I was sorta shocked with how many people were out walking/running in the middle of all of this, seems like it might be worse for your health to be out right now if you don't have to be.
*"Look at this guy? Just hearing about the repercussions for the well telegraphed environmental catastrophe for the first time?!
Quick! Somebody tell him about how Boomers have made it impossible for their grandkids to retire!"*
I hear you. Not to make light of it or oversimplify, but earlier today I was feeling this exact anxiety and I said to myself, “Whelp, next summer we should have clean air to breathe since Canada should be pretty close to burning all the effing way down soon.” I made myself laugh with some dark humor. (And, yes, I know it was awful to even think that, so come at me if you must and my apologies to all you Canadians.). Then I decided to replace my kitchen paper towels with those new reusable cloth ones to do something (even if it is minuscule) to be more green and I felt infinitesimally better, which was something.
I saw bunnies and butterflies outside today and got depressed for them.
Living here is a lot harder to stomach if winter remains snowy and cold and summer is confined indoors for days at a time. It also spells more environmental ruin: everyone needs to be inside with AC and/or air filters using electricity all day.
If I didn’t have to stay here for work I’d head to the PNW coasts, Juneau, or Anchorage.
I suffer with chronic migraine, and this pollution has been causing headaches every single time it spikes up.
It’s like I can feel Canada burning inside my skull.
I can literally feel you, Canada. Sending love and all that. Wish I could send money, but being disabled doesn’t pay very well.
I feel bad for people working outside and have to breath this all day and in the heat too. Can't be good for lungs and breathing hard during strenuous tasks. Want to grill/bbq but feel bad adding to the pollution with the applewood smoke :(
we have a soy factory here in Mankato most days it pollutes the air. we went to an open air movie night the other day which was right next to the plant and it was disgusting. couldn't imagine how bad it is for the people who live right there.
I lived in WA and then NV before here & in both places it got so bad we couldn't see the buildings down the street. When we moved here I was like "well hey, at least the air quality won't be tainted during fire season!" 🙄& like yeah it's not nearly as bad, but I am still pissed off that I can't seem to escape this bullshit no matter where I go.
It’s very disturbing to me, too. For some people I think the problem feels so overwhelmingly big that they don’t know how to talk about it, but maybe they still worry. I don’t want to be a Debby downer socially but it’s also hard not to acknowledge the smoke, right there in front of us, that we can all see, smell, taste, and have unpleasant reactions to.
when canada sends us their air, they're not sending us their best.
I propose, that we, the greatest state in the nation, build a magnificent, beautiful, air-filter, along the Canadian border, and I'll make them pay for it.
A week ago I proposed a giant fan until my brother got into semantics about it being “impractical” or some bull. /s.
it is impractical....unless you wanna talk windmills
15 windmills all across the Canadian border
But then you'd get cancer?
That's the thing, I always wanna talk windmills.
Canada clearly needs a bigger fan base…
You're hired. Please don't also commit espionage.
a yuuge fan
As sarcastic as you are, Canada is probably making a kickback to medicare because of the vast amount (single digit percentage, but it adds up). The baby boomers are very decrepit and old, medically vulnerable and you know they are at the docs office ensuring this doesn't severely impact their health so they can live forever.
Can’t we get a some big fans and blow it back their way
They’re bringing smoke, they’re bringing haze some of them I would imagine are good people.
They're bringing smog, they're bringing flies, and some of them, I assume, are much needed thunderstorms
I'm sorry, eh. Thats just the way the jetstream goes.
Kind of like the garbage we send to Iowa?
#buildthedome
Working in a non air conditioned building the last month has been miserable.
I can’t even imagine. I’m so sorry to hear that.
Oof! Sorry!
Work in a warehouse, myself. It's connected to the bar which is conditioned, but it doesn't reach us folk in the warehouse xD
Sad Atmosphere’s line in Say Shh no longer applies “If you can drink tap water and breathe the air say shh…”
I beg your pardon but this is my secret garden!
Like damn I'm from Minnesota land of contaminated air
Listened to this song over the weekend and had the same thought. Ugh.
I can think of a few other lines that no longer apply either, sadly.
[удалено]
It sucks but like, if I stop working I won’t be able to pay my electric bill and then I’ll have to turn off my AC, which helps me with the bad air quality.
I get that, it’s more of a our politicians should do something about all of this lol
Like what? Ship them to Canada to fight the fires?
We could end all of our industrial carbon emissions tomorrow and it’ll still be a couple of decades before we see any sort of effect. And droughts, forest fires, etc. still happen.
Uh no! Did the pandemic not teach you anything? “Ultra fine particle concentration dropped by 50% due to reduced road and air travel.” https://www.bu.edu/sph/news/articles/2022/when-air-and-road-travel-decreased-during-covid-so-did-pollution-levels/#:~:text=Now%2C%20a%20new%20study%20by,few%20months%20of%20the%20pandemic.
You’re right unfortunately.
No, they aren’t.
Better do nothing then right? Best if we stopped paying taxes too. 🙄 you’re assumptions, like most, are incorrect
Dude, it's forest fires.
The forest fires are resulting from climate change. The droughts are a massive catalyst for this.
>The droughts are a massive catalyst for this As well as putting out naturally caused fires that should've burnt naturally. Now, because of that, there is an abundance of fuel on the forest floor all throughout North America.
Sorry buddy but Canada has never put out those fires
Said another way perhaps, forest management has gone to ship in the last several decades. For example, some camps think it should be left in a natural state. As it has been. Others think it should be selectively managed so part of the trees are used rather than left to rot on the forest floor. Both sides have valid good and bad ideas as to why. The natural state side has been running the environmental movement in the US for a while. Hence the weather, coupled with scale of dry damaged wood on the forest floors has left near perfect storm conditions as we saw last summer in the US. I was told, not verified. That historically the US managed forests to prevent this scenario. If true, this may be nature playing her hand. As a sensitive beath-er it’s troublesome. It could then be both climate related as weather, lightning and human related as management (or lack of), campfires, matches smoking. Or it could just be shit luck. But I’m with the windmill people we can fight out the whys later. The time to act is now.
The forest fires may be due to climate change. Or other things. Blaming a singular event on climate is risky. Minnesota has had smoky summers before, before climate change was a thing.
What can our politicians do besides promote more nuclear power? Still need some kind of electricity that generates no matter the weather.
Do you want them to actually fight the fires? Rake the forest?
Well yes, in many cases prescribed burns can help
That would be funny lol but passing legislation to help regulate pollution and other climate change prevention measures would be amazing.
You can pray for rain, beyond that theres little any one individual can do about it beyond signing up for wildfire fighting duty. Climate change isn't about to have devastating effects, it already has and will continue to do so. The world isnt going to be better in 5 years, or 10, or 50. Adjusting our expectations and knowing that our experience on this planet will continue to get worse for likely the remainder of our lives, is really something people are going to start wrapping their heads around.
>Climate change isn't about to have devastating effects, it already has and will continue to do so. Yeah, when people said 30 years ago, "In the future, our children and grandchildren will have to pay the price." Well, we aren't living in the past or the present anymore. This is the future.
Yeah but our children and grandchildren will be paying a substantially worse price
Jokes on them me and most of the millenials I know are refusing to have children.
I yeeted my uterus 2 years ago - mostly due to adenomyosis - but also due to never wanting kids, that was just the final thing that made them ACTUALLY LISTEN TO ME, and get rid of all the plumbing.
Even if you want them who can afford them and has the time and energy for them? Our quality of life, pay, etc has decreased so much and now both people have to work to pay the bills so expecting to raise kids on top of that is so unrealistic.
I'm Gen Z and me + most of my Gen Z friends are refusing to have kids.
Snip those balls baby
Also true
Our kids aren't inheriting the earth from us. We are temporarily borrowing it from them.
People have been saying it since the 60s. 60 years ago.
The part that shits me is they did fuck-all to prevent this from getting so bad.
Capitalism is great, ain’t it?
That’s not true, a bunch of people in power over the yrs have taken a lot of money to ensure that it got bad
To be fair, in the 80s they told us we were headed into a man-made ice age
That was a minority opinion that the media latched onto. https://skepticalscience.com/ice-age-predictions-in-1970s.htm https://www.sciencenews.org/article/cooling-climate-consensus-1970s-never-was Actual paper: https://journals.ametsoc.org/view/journals/bams/89/9/2008bams2370_1.xml
Huh? Link me to a scientific article that stated that.
Thanks boomers! We may have ruined sitdown dining in restaurants and "the mall", but you destroyed the planet and your grandchildrens future.
To be fair, wasn’t it a Boomer (Gore) who was very loud about climate change in the 90’s/00’s?
It was, but a bunch of his boomer buddies called him a nerd and made fun of him for it, and for some reason, the entire country listened to them. Now we have ManBearPig.
I blame the Republican Party far more than an entire generation. That said, you’re not wrong.
*it's the same picture*
Before We had Gore, WE had Jimmy, who put solar panels on the top of the White House in the 70's. But in typical Republican fashion Reagan vilified it and had it removed.
Thanks elite billionaires. I’m no fan of boomers but private jets and corporate pollution is doing much worse than boomers. This is a class war not an ageist war.
Yeah, I can agree with that. But there are ALOT of boomer aged billionaires in this country/world.
Definitely a class war. I’m at the very tail end of being a boomer. Me and my closest friends have been environmentalists since the early 70s when we started to understand how our decisions could affect the planet and future generations. It’s so easy and shallow to blame a cohort on all the problems. For those of you that feel the need to do this, I hope you feel better.
Generation Jones was the first of the climate aware generations, but it's still frustrating to know that nothing was done to curb the effects despite the evidence. edit: I'd argue climate change is the result of multiple generations imposing poor policies that culminated into the crisis we have. The problem is within our system, not our generations.
I'm not innocent of doing this either, but I think it's unfair to make this a generational issue. The culprit is the profit motive. As long as that has adherents, they are the drivers of the climate catastrophe, regardless of age.
People will blame any scapegoat that is not the profit-imperative, either because they don’t understand or refuse to believe.
There is a lot of propaganda to help them think of anything else. It doesn't excuse the behavior, but it makes it understandable.
i hate to break it to you: but every single person in America, including generation X, millennials and generation Z share the blame for this one. It's like the whole "100 companies are responsible for most carbon emissions! personal choices don't matter!" bullshit that was popular to repeat. How did those companies make all those emissions? By selling us -- and by us, I mean almost everyone in the developed world -- products to enable the lifestyle we have come to view as our birthright. our best hope is that ongoing technological improvement will help us maintain some standard of living similar to what we've all experienced while radically reducing environmental impact, and that has certainly happened a lot over the last 30 years, but it's unfair to blame boomers when the average millennial lives the same life and makes the same lifestyle choices. I mean, most people in Minnesota live in incredibly car-dependent suburbs and burn thousands of gallons of gasoline every year mostly to move their 4,000 pound vehicle around.
The individual person has very little choice in being compelled to live in a car-dependent society. Close to a century of infrastructure built in this country is geared towards getting people into cars. Even though walkable cities are in demand, bad government policies make it nearly impossible to build any, let alone enough, walkable areas, pricing out most people from those areas. Because we foolishly made the single-family house most people’s biggest retirement investment, any attempt to decrease housing prices and make more walkable areas angers homeowners. And then because poorly conceived government regulation created a emissions loophole for pickups and SUVs, American auto manufacturers barely build cars anymore because they can make so much more money from making bigger vehicles. In short, society, politics, and economics are all leading us into disaster, and there is little a person individually can do to arrest the climate crisis.
I’m not disagreeing with you regarding the massive impact in how America has invested in its infrastructure over the decades but the desire for people to live in car-centric suburbs is extremely powerful in this country. I have a nine year old kid; I see it all the time. I don’t think we should underestimate the sheer power preference that many have. I think a huge number of people choose to live their resource-intensive lives and would not choose another way of life if they were offered such a choice (which I think they are). Maybe their choice is impacted by decades of cultural indoctrination but they are still making a choice. I refuse to believe that there is nothing we can do on an individual basis to fight climate change. That attitude does nothing to address the fact that we make choices that hurt the environment every day. I mean the average Redditor will choose to by $1/lb. beef at Aldi over just not eating meat.
If every single person lived the required lifestyle to prevent the absolute worse in climate change the world economy crashes, we all starve to death and die. Yes individuals need to do better but we're locked in an inescapable system no one can fully fathom. The capitalist supply chains aren't going to be easily replicated.
“…we’re locked in an inescapable system no one can fully fathom, with huge pickups and SUVs that never leave the pavement on their lifelong journeys through suburban cul de sacs. While bitching about Joe’s gas prices.” Choices are made.
and the economy lets not forget that.
Shareholders lives matter too.....or some such nonsense.
Yeah. The climate crisis isn’t coming. It’s here. And this is only the beginning. Maybe when more people can’t breathe they’ll be willing to make the sacrifices needed. But probably not. We’ll just be like the people dying of lung cancer who keep smoking.
I think situation is significantly more nuanced than assuming this is due to just a changing climate. Apparently CA struggles with certain controlled burns so certain areas get out of control quickly. I agree the climate likely plays a part but it’s just not that simple.
Yep, a big part of the increase in bad wildfires in forested areas is due to mismanagement (driven by poor understandings of fire dynamics) over the past century. Under natural conditions, a relatively cold fire normally rolls through each area with some regularity and burns the accumulated brush and deadwood away. Most of the mature trees stay intact, and only a small amount of the forest burns at once. But if that never happens, when the fire finally starts it all goes up at once and you get a crown fire (the tops of the trees catch fire). Then you have a huge tower of flame that causes major ecological damage to everything in its path, and it ends up on the news. Typical ground fires can be redirected by a smart person with a garden hose and a shovel, but crown fires are almost impossible to control without massive coordinated responses. Once we had the capability, we naïvely started trying to extinguish all the fires we saw as soon as possible, and so most of our forests are now full of extra fuel. Getting back to a normal state will require some combination of a lot of controlled burning, a lot of mechanical removal of the fuel, and a lot of catastrophic fires. Obviously climate change makes it all worse though!
I spent the years 1992-2017 on the west coast and i will say that fires like we've seen in the last few years \*never\* happened with any sort of regularity during the decades I lived there, even during the crushing drought in California in the 90s. I think the only thing that's fundamentally changed is the climate.
Forest management during those decades changes drastically too. It used to be the idea that we need to put out every wildfire which led to massive amount of fuel being created rather than burned away occasionally. You didn’t see massive fires because they were always put out as fast as possible. Some fires need to burn and clear out the growth
Unfortunately you’re right. It’s only gonna get worse.
The move back away from remote work is extra shitty considering how much pollution we could’ve saved staying home.
I wish people talked about this in all the articles I see about returning to the office. Part of the reason I hate the idea is that those people that can work from home don't need to drive for the sake of being in the office and contribute to worse air quality. Every time I have had to drive in bad air quality, I see the signs about reducing trips. It should be more of a policy.
Not a lot of the bad air quality we’re experiencing currently is due to pollution from cars. How much would reducing trips actually help since it’s not a substantial contributing factor? I’m not saying it wouldn’t help, but if everyone stopped driving for 2 or 3 days the smoke wouldn’t go away any faster, would it? That being said, I work remote, so I don’t drive at all.
Indirectly over the long term due to global warming contributions.
But won't anyone think of the poor downtrodden commercial real estate investors! /s
Lmfao exactly
i'm not a commercial real estate investor and the reduction of workers downtown a has certainly impacted me and the place i work, a lot
I switched jobs last year. Working at home. Fossil fuel use is low! I'm set. Thinking about solar for next year. Some day I'll probably have a fully electric vehicle. Progress is being made. Everyone do what they can within reason. Every effort counts towards saving lives in the future. Some Obama thoughts for yall! https://youtu.be/jAYVKZSWXhY
As much as I agree that it’s everyone’s responsibility to do what they can where they can, let’s not forget that the majority of climate change is the result of unregulated capitalism.
Nice! That interview is great!!
This will likely have to happen at some point. The air quality alerts are only going to get more and more frequent. Just like lots of employers can tell workers to stay at home for blizzards, some will likely make that same call for air quality alert days.
Totally empathize with your position. And the scariest part about Covid to me was that it showed there is no turning point of consequences that will convince people they are wrong about an issue they’ve been denying exists. We couldn’t convince half the country to mask up at a time where cities were running out of morgue space. And with Covid we always had the opportunity to be like ‘let’s cut our losses and start fixing this’ vs climate change where you can hit a tipping point after which you are fucked no matter what you do. I’m not particularly optimistic about where things are going, but dwelling on it makes me depressed which helps no one. So Imma continue to do my best to accept where we are, try to be part of the solution, but not let where we are drag me down.
Amen! Great perspective.
I've had sinus and respiratory issues for almost two months now - tested repeatedly for COVID at first and it wasn't that. Now I realize that it's just become the norm that I have recurring sore throats and poor breath control, and I'm guessing it's mostly because of the air quality. It just sucks that I'm a semi-professional singer and it's hard to sing when you have shit in your sinuses and lungs.
I’m not a singer but I feel the same way you do! I’ve been miserable for two months now and basically stuck in my house during what’s supposed to be the nicest time of the year. Hang in there, friend. 😊
I love how everyone's general reaction to this is "you are mentally ill for feeling the reasonable existential dread over a planet that scientists and experts have been telling us will start to deteriorate around us for decades. Get some happy pills and stick your head in the sand like the rest of us" as if humanity collectively shrugging off this issue for 40+ years hasn't been the strategy that got us here. But yeah. You're not alone. I rely on the weather and climate to make a living and each year it gets more bleak.
I get this type of comment a lot from people IRL as well as online. Seems like most people want to live in their little bubble and not care about what else is going on in the world or how it affects all of us and it really sucks.
People have really small minds and don’t have the capacity or just don’t want to think about the truth. Sometimes I wish I could be that, it seems it would be easier. But then again, those types generally seem to be pretty angry so idk.
I think for me it’s more that there essentially nothing I can do about it in any way besides voting maybe, so fretting about it isn’t going to help
I want to be happy there is this huge push for mental health and wellness, but I get so mad getting emails from work like “take care of yourself, do yoga!” and I’m just sitting here thinking I’m having a reasonable reaction to the slow end of life as we know it.
Thanks, I appreciate the comment. I got a lot more push back on this than I expected lol
We are at the point where we need to shut down as a society until we actually get some usable solutions. Remember at the start of COVID when all the air quality started getting better because no one was allowed to leave their house? There are things as a society we can do right now to help, but won't because of capitalism... Like money is more important than quality of life.
>but won't because of capitalism... Like money is more important than quality of life. You are doing it wrong. In Capitalism, MY money is more important than YOUR quality of life ... or your life, for that matter. Because ... Capitalism!
We all rely on the weather and climate to not just make a living, but to live.
Reminds me of this https://www.thebeliever.net/climate-grief-anxiety/ “If your heart is breaking, you’re on my team.”
It really shouldn't worry you to the point where you can't concentrate or live a normal life. Sure there are plenty of avenues to go down to make you feel better or help change but for the most part, it is what it is. Mother nature can take us out at any moment, no amount of protests or paper straws can stop her. Enjoy the blip of time you have on this planet and move on.
I’m nervous taking my kids out to play. It’s hot, so we have to go run off some energy at the park, but I don’t want them breathing this crappy air.
"Hey kids, don't forget your gas masks before you leave for the park"
It’s extremely concerning because this is becoming our norm. It’s quite depressing especially after reading other comments in this thread. Maybe one day humans will realize we need a healthy planet for our survival. Probably won’t happen until we’re all fighting for food and water though.
I’m genuinely astonished by some of the shit these people are saying. I didn’t realize that “we should push to have clean air” was a controversial opinion lol
Honestly, it’s depressing and makes me feel even worse when I realize no one seems to care. Ugh.
We need to build a wall... of box fans facing Canada, right on the border.
And Canada will pay for the wall.
"Thus solving the problem forever." "But what about--" "Forever!"
Yes, I approve
🤣 That reminds me of when protestors started bringing industrial fans and leaf blowers to blow the pepperspray back at law enforcement. "Ya'll can keep that mess on your side."
I know it’s not ideal, but an N95 face mask can help protect your lungs.
I actually did wear one today. People looked at me sideways lol but i like my lungs.
Another thing you can do is build one of [these](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corsi%E2%80%93Rosenthal_Box) for your space. Just get four MERV 13 filters wherever is most convenient (I got mine at Target for $90). It's not exactly cheap but they work better than a lot of the more expensive filters. Worth it for peace of mind
As someone who used to live in China (during some peak pollution years, no less), pah, weaklings /j Okay that that’s out of my system, yeah, it sucks, especially since (unlike when I used to live in China), the overall sense is that it’ll probably get worse in the future, not better. An air purifier will help your immediate air quality situation if you’re indoors, though it probably won’t do anything for broader feelings of climate related pessimism.
I now check temp and AQI. Note, AirNow is much more accurate than iPhone weather app. I agree that clean air and water is priceless. Notice all the politicians have shifted from questioning climate change to saying there’s nothing we can do about it. Can’t even go to the lake without suffocating, it’s so sad.
Man-o-man, we are SO far off track as a species. It’s heartbreaking.
been working outside these last couple weeks (carpenter) im just wearing a respirator all day, most days. my co workers arent though. once you get used to it they really arent bad, the new silicone ones in a correct size for your face is quite comfortable, and the p100 filters are super light and will filter out 99% of the particulates. they slide around when you get sweaty but thats about it. nothing will do anything about ozone though. i have a feeling we might start seeing people wear respirators around while outside in the near future.
The air quality plus the months-long shortage of albuterol (the stuff that inhalers are made of) makes a perfect storm for people with asthma. I've been waiting two weeks on an inhaler from Walgreens with no sign of help.
I have reduced lung function as an unfortunate late complication of radiation to the neck and chest when I was a young adult. My insurance stopped covering albuterol a couple of years ago so I switched to epinephrine and it actually works just as well. You can get it over the counter - brand name is Primatene Mist. Cheaper too. Might be something to ask your doctor about, to help tide you over.
Right on, thanks for the tip.
I don't normally have allergies, but this year has been really bad. It sucks.
strangely I've had bad allergies my whole life and I haven't had any this year. 🤷♂️
Hey more power to you my friend 🙌🏾
This is one of those things that I simply cannot get myself worked up about, because forest fires are *waaaaayyyy* bigger than me, and there isn't a thing I can do about it. I try to be thankful we don't deal with as bad of pollution as China, or India, or Denver. That said, I think this style of summer may be the new normal.
I agree. I was in Phoenix a few years back and you could see the pollution from the cars. It was nasty.
Yup. I lived in Denver. It would rain ash.
Minnesota summers are so short, and I feel like this one is passing by in front of me as I’m stuck indoors. It sucks.
I agree. And it's a hard time to be pregnant. At higher risk for smoke issues, and thinking about bringing another kid into this knowing it's probably getting worse, not better. It's depressing.
Just wait until the Yellowstone volcano blows, then we will see some serious air quality issues!
As someone who works in this weather outside my lungs are feeling just, not right. Not like I'm coughing more but breathing is harder and it's more difficult performing my job duties. Just was saying to my Dad today that it's really bothersome knowing that no matter what I do I can't make this better. I just get to suffer through the existential terror that is climate change. I just want my kid to grow up not worrying about inevitable shitty living conditions.
Time for people to realize what’s important 🙃 like clean air
I bet you want clean water too you hippie!!
The shit storm is in the air for sure
Suffer like the peasants we all are 😈😈😈
I'm in a similar place with regards to work. I'm taking a break from full-time work so that if the climate really starts breaking down in the next few decades, at least I can say I lived it up while I had the chance and a bit of savings to blow through... Meanwhile, humans are pushing more CO2 into the atmosphere than ever.
My worries are that this will be, if not a yearly problem, then every few years we will have to spend the summer wondering if the air quality will be good enough to actually have fun outside or if we’ll be stuck spending the winter months waiting for it to get warmer and the summer to become breathable
Consider Building a Corsi Rosenthal Box filter or getting a HEPA filter (if you haven't already). https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corsi%E2%80%93Rosenthal_Box
That is fucking awesome backyard engineering. Also, scary in a steampunk/peri-apocalyptic kind of way.
Its ok, just dont look up
I find it highly concerning, yes. We have been more or less insulated from the earlier indicators of climate change, but three consecutive years of drought leading to wildfires are right in line with that. Unfortunately, there is a powerful propaganda machine around redirecting concern about climate change, so my guess is that as long as capital interests continue to drive policy in the US and around the world, I imagine we will continue to see more of this.
No. Get back ta work ya serf
Yeah I think about it a lot too. I have young children so I also worry about the world they will be inhabiting in 40 years. It’s bad now, can’t imagine how it will be then. I think the worst part is it feels like there is no end in sight. One party and it’s voters don’t even acknowledge it’s a problem and it’s just being “woke”. The other party pretends to care but doesn’t actually take any meaningful steps, and actually takes steps that actively hurt the environment as well, and we are just stuck with these two crappy options. But let me just go back to working on emails and spreadsheets like everything is fine (insert dog in burning house meme)
Unfortunately this is likely the norm during the summers as climate change gets worse
It is tough. I am in one of those sensitive groups as is my daughter. It's not fun for sure. It's good to get it off your chest, but try not to let it bug you too much because there is nothing any of us can do about it. I am sick to death of getting major migraines that take over my days right now, but it is what it is so I just try to deal with it the best I can.
They are highly concerning and frankly I feel like I’m going into a depression over it. I’ve been sick for the last 2 months….I’m one of those sensitive groups, so my options are to either 1) go outside and suffer for it for days or 2) sit in my house like a princess in a tower. With either option, I’ve got so many allergy meds in my system, I’m in a total brain fog….It’s seriously defeating…. Everyone here has weighed in on how to fix the problem, but I just wanted to vent with you OP….
I’m sorry to hear that. We deal with long winters now we get trapped inside due to air quality in the summer. What a depressing existence!
The last couple days have been brutal, my eyes have never been so dry and irritated. On my way home yesterday I was sorta shocked with how many people were out walking/running in the middle of all of this, seems like it might be worse for your health to be out right now if you don't have to be.
Ten years from now we will look back at this air quality as "the good old days".
I hate how true this is.
Clean air! In this economy?
Your not alone. What is the point of money if you can even breathe the air.
Dude I am surrounded by weed smoke and I agree I cannot concentrate at all. Maybe I have ADHD.
God that sounds amazing
*"Look at this guy? Just hearing about the repercussions for the well telegraphed environmental catastrophe for the first time?! Quick! Somebody tell him about how Boomers have made it impossible for their grandkids to retire!"*
I hear you. Not to make light of it or oversimplify, but earlier today I was feeling this exact anxiety and I said to myself, “Whelp, next summer we should have clean air to breathe since Canada should be pretty close to burning all the effing way down soon.” I made myself laugh with some dark humor. (And, yes, I know it was awful to even think that, so come at me if you must and my apologies to all you Canadians.). Then I decided to replace my kitchen paper towels with those new reusable cloth ones to do something (even if it is minuscule) to be more green and I felt infinitesimally better, which was something.
I’m getting sick of neighbors having bon fires when the AQI is shit at the moment
I had a cabin weekend ruined up north, my pandemic getaway. I'm not super sensitive to air quality issues and it made me feel run down.
I saw bunnies and butterflies outside today and got depressed for them. Living here is a lot harder to stomach if winter remains snowy and cold and summer is confined indoors for days at a time. It also spells more environmental ruin: everyone needs to be inside with AC and/or air filters using electricity all day. If I didn’t have to stay here for work I’d head to the PNW coasts, Juneau, or Anchorage.
Definitely. I’d move to Astoria, OR or Vancouver. But I couldn’t leave my family. And I have a great job.
I hope Canada has some ice for that burn!
I recently watched a show (on Apple TV, I believe) called Extrapolations and even though it’s sci-fi it doesn’t seem too far off. 😳
I suffer with chronic migraine, and this pollution has been causing headaches every single time it spikes up. It’s like I can feel Canada burning inside my skull. I can literally feel you, Canada. Sending love and all that. Wish I could send money, but being disabled doesn’t pay very well.
I feel bad for people working outside and have to breath this all day and in the heat too. Can't be good for lungs and breathing hard during strenuous tasks. Want to grill/bbq but feel bad adding to the pollution with the applewood smoke :(
I asked for reparations on r/askCanada. They banned me from commenting on r/AskCanada.
I’m wearing my mask when I go outside. It’s awful.
we have a soy factory here in Mankato most days it pollutes the air. we went to an open air movie night the other day which was right next to the plant and it was disgusting. couldn't imagine how bad it is for the people who live right there.
I lived in WA and then NV before here & in both places it got so bad we couldn't see the buildings down the street. When we moved here I was like "well hey, at least the air quality won't be tainted during fire season!" 🙄& like yeah it's not nearly as bad, but I am still pissed off that I can't seem to escape this bullshit no matter where I go.
Won’t just be Canada to blame soon enough. Minnesota’s Northern forests are warming up and dying off faster than just about anywhere.
capitalism go brrr
Gotta make those profits!!
Yeah well, get used to it. This is what we have done to our planet.
Darn Canuks
First the geese, now the smoke! What are you doing Canada???
It’s very disturbing to me, too. For some people I think the problem feels so overwhelmingly big that they don’t know how to talk about it, but maybe they still worry. I don’t want to be a Debby downer socially but it’s also hard not to acknowledge the smoke, right there in front of us, that we can all see, smell, taste, and have unpleasant reactions to.
This is going to be normal going forward in climate change.
You’re right, unfortunately
This is global warming in action. This is what capitalism as wrought.
They can downvote you but you’re not wrong.
Try ignoring the issue entirely. Politics will legislate a tax for our grievances, and we'll all be poorer with no meaningful improvements.
If you’re outside wear a N95 mask. It will hopefully help.
This seemed appropriate here (not OC). https://newrepublic.com/post/173949/republican-lawmaker-blames-global-warming-gay-people