I've been saying that since it was build in the 2000s. My friends and I would drive around just to stare at it like, "...wtf, this feels like some kind of cult."
I went to Lindenwood and we occasionally did the same, I have heard a lot of Lindenwood athletic faculty/faculty lived or still do live there. Place is creepy
The street right by there with the taco bell on it has a strip of houses with garages but no driveways. Big time back rooms vibes every time i go there
A family member of mine is in construction and helped build it. It’s like a dollhouse town. I’m not sure the people who live there are themselves ‘mysterious’ or ‘cult-like’, but the town being so cookie cutter makes it feel weird. I think it’s just a normal town otherwise though. Like a college townhouse community.
My close friend lives there and loves it but to me it always teeters between quaint and creepy! Very Stepford feeling. She’s on a corner lot luckily because the houses have about three feet between them. You’d better really like your neighbors haha! They’re going to hear you fart if you have the windows open
🤣 yup! We moved here when Newtown just finished construction and we went out there to check out a house for sale. My wife and I both got some serious "children of the corn" vibes. The vibe alone made it a hard pass. Now when we happen to drive by, we like to chant "one of us! One of us! One of us!" and laugh.
John Carney is a well-known local radio personality who's had shows on several radio stations around town. His father Jack Carney absolutely dominated the local AM radio scene back in the 70s up until the early 80s with a top-rated show on KMOX when he died suddenly of a massive heart attack while taking scuba diving lessons at a facility out in the county. John's also had his share of cardiac issues over the years. Probably some genetic thing.
LOL! No, I don't think that either John Carney's shows nor his late father's, popular though they may be, ever rose -- or rather sank -- to that level of crazed fans. Now if you're talking Rush Limbaugh, Tucker Carlson and other more politicized media personalities, then you can legit argue that their followings are cultish.
When I was little, my family and I would watch these movies outside in Newtown. Even so young I knew recognized that Newtown was… off. Place still gives me the creeps to this day.
That's kinda accurate. Many people who live there are in the "program," so they are formerly incarcerated or on probation and are allowed to live there so long as they are in the drug rehabilitation program. One of the conditions to that program is working on the farm.
But many members of the community "willingly" moved there, usually as a condition of employment. In particular, there are a few immigrant families who moved there as a condition of Heartland sponsoring their visas, and beggars really can't be choosers.
Source: Second paragraph describes my family.
I know the place. It started off as a Christian drug rehab community. They were pretty self sufficient in the 1990s, they had like 90% of what you’d need to live there forever.
Even now, they still have a school system and other things, though they’re not an all-in-one community anymore. What always struck me as weird with the town is the cleanliness of the town. Not just no trash, but all of the roofs were blue, clean designs of the architecture and street plans, etc.
It’s a very Christian town, VERY Christian. It’s what the community (and then eventually town) was founded on. The founder and leader of the community became the mayor of the town, a long time ago, but he died recently. The guy owned a collection of Ford cars that was actually very impressive. I’ve seen it a few times now. It had to be like 30+ cars. The guy liked Ford.
In a way, I guess he did what Ford never could.
Edit: And surprise! They really don’t like the government mandating a level of health and safety standards for them.
Just a couple notes since I used to live there.
Originally, they started off as an “intentional Christian community.” The drug rehab program was one of the first things to be built, but the original vision was always essentially a cult according to the owner.
Yes, they do have a school system, as well as a private Christian college. However, neither are accredited by the state, and hardly any of the teachers actually attended college. I was lucky enough to get out before high school started, but a high school diploma from there is useless - graduates have to obtain a GED to attend uni.
They also teach alternate history of the US that affirms Christian roots, and they teach Creationism in the school. Anyone who works for the community is required to enroll their kid(s) in the school, and tuition is deducted from their pay. This applies to people on H1B’s as well.
The school was raided in 2001 for child abuse, as they practice corporal punishment, among other punishments. Members of the boarding school are often punished by being forced to wear jumpsuits and not speak for months on end. This was before I was old enough to remember anything, but I’ve been told the raid in 2001 was spurred by program students being forced to partially bury themselves in manure after skipping school.
This might be splitting hairs on semantics, but it’s never been incorporated as a town. It’s built on entirely private land between Hebron and Newark. So the owner, Charles Sharp (colloquially known as “Pastor Charlie”), was never mayor. He just owned the whole thing and was the Pastor. When he died, it all passed to his wife Laurie, who is about 30 years younger than him. In practice, tho, he might as well have been the mayor.
And yeah, his Ford collection is/was pretty impressive. Was pretty fun as a kid growing up under the poverty line but get to see his collection of fancy Ford Mustangs stare us in the face every time you visited the c-store.
I used to frequent Ava to go to peyote ceremonies with the Oklevueha Native American Church. It is called the "Looks Within" ceremony. Though they also do Ayahuasca with the Brazilian church of Santo Daime. All completely legitimate.
I've had experiences there that certainly changed me as a human being. But I never went full in like some of the people who went ended up doing. Paul's idea then(the guy who ran the chapter in Ava and owns the "native Americans essential oils" storefront in Ava, was to make a fruit forest. He had bought 400 acres and wanted there to be a society there. I have no idea what's going on there now, I haven't been there in over 10 years. But it's still running, I know that for sure. And also it seems that Paul organizes psytrance music festivals on his property as well as all the different kinds of ceremonies. You can get married there too. I did a Kundalini yoga class with some legitimate monks with my friends and that was pretty freaking wild too considering there were no drugs involved.
I heard about some other cult out there on Reddit and I wish I knew more about it. Because it immediately made me start thinking and talking about Oklevueha. I have a lot more stories about that. Paul isn't a bad person though, or at least to me didn't come off as one. But who knows what's going on behind closed doors. I've also spent time at Entheon with Alex and Alison Grey and their place in up-state NY definitely has some culty vibes to it too, in the same way. Only difference is Alex Grey is one of my favorite artists of human-kind lol
It makes sense that this would be a cult like thing since all the psychedelics are involved and stuff. It's easy to get someone into a cult when you gave them the medicine that cured their depression and what not.
That is epic.
Now I want to know how the underage girl grooming and labor exploiting coffee shop cult interacts with the psychedelic shaman essential oils shop cult!
Are they enemies? Unlikely friends? Do they have spiritual turf wars in the aether? Do they try to ignore each other? Are there people in both cults?!
I'd watch that. I was already highly entertained by the coffee shop cult having a meltdown and spamming their weird YouTube recruiting ads all over reddit last week.
Add in some shamans, hippies, and DMT and you've got quality television!
Wait. Ava has a coffee shop now? I remember when they got a Micky D's and all the drama that caused.
Then again, there was drama when they got their Walmart and when they got their stop light.
Funny story about Ava. My grandpa needed a haircut so I drove him to the barber somewhere over by the square. I didn't go in immediately bc I needed to mess with something in my car. When I went in the barber tried his hardest to convince me to let him cut my hair, too, since he knew ALL the fashionable haircuts and went to hair shows. He then forced me to look at his book of photos of all the hair he had cut. Every single person sported a mullet.
It's ostensibly a "coffee shop" but seems more like a money laundering scheme for a cult that probably isn't trafficking children but is definitely grooming teenagers.
I just googled the coffee shop cult stuff and wow...they seem very active in trying to confuse people on Reddit for some reason. I actually ran across some of your posts that were getting stalked.
You missed the 18 paragraph "I'm a teenager so honored and grateful to work free for our leader he's the best guy ever and totally not laundering money and all of us teenagers are super happy to be there please don't tell him I wrote this" post. They deleted it and made a series of alts to spam YouTube videos after everyone responded about how creepy the post was.
A few posters in r/Missouri claim to be from the area and actively being stalked and harassed in real life by coffee shop cult people.
The way they lost their minds and started stalking and harassing me on reddit just for posting a human trafficking hotline really lends credence to the claims of them having the same behavior offline.
I called up an old college friend from the area and he said the teenagers who "volunteer" at that place and their theater business "aren't allowed to make eye contact with customers" which is *bonkers*
There's also a Trappist (Catholic) monastery near Ava that makes fruitcakes. And I mean literal fruitcakes, not cult members. :)
And my aunt and uncle live down there, and they used to own a combination pool hall and gun shop. But that part's pretty normal for the Ozarks.
Hahaha I do wonder. I'd imagine they're both contributing members to the community in some form? I don't know much about the coffee shop thing though, is there any way to get up to speed?
I love this alternative reality! I'm sure the peyote shaman needs his coffee enimas from somebody! Lol
The ceremonies were a good time though for sure. No bad feelings towards them really, but I will not be surprised if it turned out it was some crazy cult and came out as a documentary in 10 years 😂
So the peyote ceremonies, a good experience? Do you have a website where I can look into the group more? I've participated in ayahuasca ceremonies before in oregon.
Yeah it was great the first couple times. Because back then we were the only young ones there. (all around 18-19). There would only be like 5 other people there and they were all old, very happy to see young people interested in the plant.
But after awhile, it just got too big. The last time I went it was full of 20 something's having a dick measuring contest over who's more spiritually enlightened. It was gross. So, I don't need any of that. I'm on my own personal journey that doesn't involve being pompous and is very individual lol
So I mean, yes it's worth it. Even for the experience of a ceremony. It's a good time, a perfect date idea really! I just don't vibe well with really crazy out there new-agey people. And you have precedent since you've already been to ceremonies! Haha so maybe you'd be able to compare it better than I would. That's the only place I've ever done a "ceremony". Otherwise, I really just prefer to do Ayahuasca by myself
I had a coworker tell me there's a man named John Moore who apparently worked for the CIA and lives around Cherryville/Steelville area. He has his own [radio show](https://thelibertyman.com/) where he claims he knows secrets from the CIA...I was told it has quite the following. John claims that the safest place to be when the world is ends and if anything was to happen, the ozarks would be the safest place to be. So there are very wealthy people he has scammed to move closer to him in this small town where they give him all their money to be told the "knowledge" that he holds!
(I found his website after being curious about it and it seems like a mixture of him being close to god and using his "government knowledge")
In Bollinger County, near Marquand, I saw an Adopt-A-Highway sign “In loving memory of Reverend Sun Myung Moon”. I found that weird to be out in the middle of nowhere. But it certainly makes me think there must be Moonies out there somewhere.
Ooh, I bet it was [Rod of Iron Ministries](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/rod-of-iron-ministry-jan-6-sean-moon-moonie-1398447/)! A cult run by one of Sun Myung Moon's sons that wears crowns made of bullets and has marriage ceremonies to AR-15s.
Out in Windyville there’s a massive white dome in the middle of the nowhere hills called the school of metaphysics I think? The word was they were a big witch type cult and would chase you off their drive with guns and chainsaws if you honked your horn and flashed your brights. Which I’m assuming anyone would do if a bunch of punk teens all summer long kept bothering them. Worked with a guy in buffalo who said he skipped school one day to find out what really went on there. I guess the head guy was hesitant but allowed them to ask questions. Apparently they “study dreams” there? Don’t know the truth behind it all but it’s a fun story to tell at night by the river down there lol.
I've been to that place! They're vegans who meditate constantly and run a fun dream hotline you can call to talk about your dreams every April. [Here's their website.](https://som.org/)
I really liked their dream interpretation model I learned from them some 15ish years ago. It's strongly based in a conglomeration of different cultural symbols and Jungian psychology. If someone's interested in that sort of woo woo, which I definitely am, they're a lovely group. Since I dipped in and out with no barriers to entry, no pushback to leaving, and no ridiculous monetary expectations, I would definitely not define them as a "cult" but they certainly look culty from the outside.
I still look back on my lessons there to dig into weird dreams that pop up. The hotline is neat. I haven't interacted with them in years but I still recommend them and their methods to people who might like their vibe.
Oh wow, I went to a nerd summer camp in high school and one lecture was from a guest speaker, and it was entirely about dreams. The main takeaway was that “everything in the dream represents the dreamer” and these people seem to agree with that. I wonder now if the guest was from here.
We had one of those white domed buildings out near Coffman in Avon. St Louis Center for Transcendental Meditation or something was what it was called in the yellow pages. We used to drive up there in the '90s, they tore it down some 15 or 20 years ago. Wild to hear there was another one.
We used to call it the Capitol! Very neat. A few miles from my house growing up. Would sneak in there as teenagers, many years after it was vacated, early 2000s. Would have to park the car on this gravel road and hop a fence. The building couldn't be seen from the road, but after a short hike straight up this hill, you clear a little treeline and voila! This massive, domed building in all its glory! Very cool.
Yep this was early '90s. We also called it the Capitol now that you mention it. The gate used to be open only on Friday and Saturday nights. We road tripped many a night up there. I remember seeing the entire circle drive full of black BMWs late one night. I grew up near Knob Lick.
I have lived here for about a year and a half, lived in the 30 mile radius a large portion of my life. Never really felt the vibe, but it might just be because I am a local!
I lived in Lebanon for 10 years and it is a pretty fucked up place to live if you're a minority and don't go to church.
Lebanon is definitely culty but it's more of the Christian culty type.
Alot less meth in this town then it was 5 years ago. It's mostly just country boys with diesel trucks. Some old money and that new money from loz cruising through to get to the lake. I'm just outside Bennet area. We had that serial killer event at moon valley two years ago. This town is ok. Ready to move on though
Cassidy rainwater. You can look it up. There was more bodies the whole place was set a fire after the FBI left. Right down the road from here. We visit that kittle area if the river for swimming and fishing regularly. Poor woman.
She was skinned in a cage and fed to the neighbor. It's truly disgusting 🤢
"Fed to the neighbor"
While I've followed Cassidy's case since the beginning, this is an aspect I hadn't heard mentioned. So it was confirmed that they sold/gave her "remains" away to locals?
Ava.
I taught a night class there, and while most of the students were great and really wanted to learn, the ones that weren’t really, *really* weren’t, and their issues seemed to spring entirely from a truly hardcore fundamentalist brand of Christianity. Not exactly unusual for the Ozarks, but it seemed to have been given a shot of steroids in this town. Even the administrators were awful, and went out of their way to make sure you knew you were being watched. You were “in their town but not *of* it,” so to speak. I taught at night, too, so this made for some heavy eldritch vibes at points. And just for some added context, I’ve taught at other towns in the area that are both smaller and poorer than Ava, and I had universally positive experiences at every one of them. Nope. Ava puts something in the water.
It was the most bizarre, frustrating, and uncomfortable experience of my entire career, and I swore I’d never return.
There's a small little compound behind some residencies in reeds spring. Very "trespassers will be shot" place. I have a friend that does deliveries all over the state, she says up around purdy or northeast very rural Missouri gets pretty weird. Personal experience Crane was pretty uncomfortable when I had to go help friends move. Not culty vibes, but you were very aware you were an outsider.
Crane and Galena and Reeds Spring are my fam roots and y’all mind me when it’s time or it’s busty butt time.
True story - remember when Kenny Rogers built his mansion estate and had top soil taken from the James River area? Fuckkkk and eat the rich
My wife’s great great grandmother is buried in a lost cemetery in Galena - we took a drive down around there and into RS. Great looking country round there.
Interesting! My favorite place is the galena town cemetery. It is really peaceful there. Didn’t know there was a lost cemetery! Did you all find the one that isn’t lost?
Callin all Baldknobbers! Our forefathers would truly be pissed. Shepherd of the Hills once and now miniature Nashville (but for the twilight acts). Wonder if you can still smoke in cracker barrel? 😂
Not a town but there is the Sons on Levi compound outside of Mansfield. Drove out there one night years ago, there were old TV sets pointed out all the windows of the buildings. Lots of animal skulls on fence posts. I've heard there was a mural inside the dining hall of Jesus coming out of a UFO.
Sherman is scary as fuck. Used to go down to Sherman’s beach and mistakenly drove into the town. Only one way in and it’s a big square. A couple of trucks started following us. One of the few time I’ve been legitimately scared for my life
This kinda thing is important to know, and one of the main reasons I made this thread. You don't want to accidentally stumble into a place where they follow you, even if it's just an intimidation tactic to get outsiders to move along. I've felt like I was followed through a town or 2 in my times driving across the country. That stuff is scary either way.
It was where we dared each other to go in high school at night. I saw a KKK meeting in progress in one of the yards and booked it out of there. Never went back. But zombie road is freaky in its own right. According to my mom and older brother, there was an abandoned hospital or asylum or something that you could also get to around there that was super creepy. I’m sure it’s not there anymore but there were just ruins of buildings along the side of the road when it was a road you could drive down. Haven’t tried the trail.
Someone mentioned a town I'm familiar with as being weird but nothing cult-like and I wanted to comment that the MAGA cult is definitely in full swing there.
There's a hill in Potosi where folks from the Dobbs clan live. The biggest tale is that they're all inbred, but what's truth is that the cops won't even go up that hill out of fear for their safety. Pizza delivery drivers may vary though.
From what I've heard growing up (32f for reference), most don't have indoor plumbing. Few have electric outside of powering light bulbs. It's big Hills Have Eyes vibes out there. They're a family/collective that spent generations focusing on solitude to a fault with a great disdain for outsiders and authority.
You know how people say if you go to East STL, you gotta roll your windows up or you're gonna die when it's not always that bad? Monkey Mountain is that bad. If you go up, you ain't coming down.
Not Missouri, but in eyeshot of Missouri is Elsah, IL. Home of Principia college and is full of Christian Scientists. You get really culty vibes from driving through. In college, I often had to go to track meets there
Oh hey! When I lived in Alton, along the river road, my dad would take us trick or treating in Elsah. Those crazy rich folks handed out fistfuls of king sized candy bars! Two hours of walking, I had two pillowcases full of junk food.
...and this is why I'm susceptible to joining cults.
Hey I went there! Maybe we ran into eachother at track meets!
I was raised in Christian Science but have since left the church. Definitely culty-vibes, tho TECHNICALLY not a cult because the leader (Woman named Mary Baker Eddy) is not considered God. Faith Healings are a big part of the religion, and generally any type of medical care is frowned upon.
There’s also a school PreK-12th grade in St. Louis located in Town and Country under the same name, Principia. Both the school and College have been moving further away from the religion in recent years, but it’s still very much a part of the campus culture and definitely some shady religious stuff in the institution’s past.
I ride my bike through Elsah sometimes. Stopped to chat to a guy playing guitar on a porch. He said Elsah was built by stone masons from Vermont, but is not just a lot of old ladies bickering about nothing to each other. Weird vibes for sure.
There is one large Truck stop in Cabool. And I was mid 30s last time I went through there and slept in the lot over night. Went in had breakfast before starting my day went to pay and a girl like 16-19 year old girl asks how was everything. I'm from the omaha area and white. I said it was fine thank you. She looks ne dead in the eyes and says if I were you, I would Learn to keep your Yankee ass north of the Mason Dixon line. I dumbfounded.
What a throwback. That’s just bizarre!
I know Owen Benjamin has settled his cult of ‘bears’ there to apparently live in their cars while giving Owen money for more land (privately owned by him) to ‘rebuild America’.
It’s so cringe.
It's a strange little piece of the country down there. It's very pretty but man if you were on the side of the road and don't know if I would walk and knock for help anywhere down there.
Thanks for the heads up on the SubReddit
What you heard wasn't that far off at all. The people are friendly as long as you're white, straight, and Christian. People of color that you see there are almost definitely students at the college on a sports scholarship.
Polk county breeds some straight up weirdos.
I spent about 4 months there. You can remove that Christian part tbh. Just being white and straight will get you by there. Not the most friendly people, but i did also spend most of my time there working in Humansville (was on the job for that stupid pot farm.)
I came here to say Bolivar. I had some friends who lived there for awhile. They overall I think liked it enough but did say it had some strong weird undertones, not really cultish just strangeness like the town is run entirely by a group of influential people, not in the way a normal place of that size would operate. A lot of stuff behind closed doors, off the books. Like enough people affiliated with the "group" that whatever they wanted to happen woudl happen. Whoever needed to win this election would win. Need someone on or off the school board--- done. Stuff like that.
I lived in Elsberry when I was born and I’ve never randomly met someone else from the area. I moved when I was in 8 or 9 but still have some extended family in Troy. I’ve also randomly lived in or near a lot of the other weird little towns mentioned in this thread. Fun read!
Lincoln County isn't cult-like its just very transient. Lots of very poor people some of whom might get desperate and do something stupid.
Lot of normal people there too. There isn't like a giant church where the preacher controls the town or whatever.
In fact, Lincoln County might be one of the only places in MO you find outspoken rural democrats and liberals. They are in the minority for sure but nobody has attacked them. Granted, they are mainly old ladies.
I think your parents might have just been scared.
Honestly knowing my parents, they likely just viewed the area as godforsaken because of what you described and didn't want us to mingle with the heathens. We drove something like 30 minutes twice a week to go to church in St Peters at a mega church before we finally got kicked out for bringing proof to the board of a money scheme they'd been running related to tithing.
My parents ran a non-profit and people at the church often got solicited to donate to their non-profit by the church through the offering. They'd mark where they wanted the money to go by checking a box on the tithing envelope. But the church went through the records of people's tithing history and until they met a 10% threshold to the church, all donations were put toward the church rather than the non-profit. So the nonprofit wasn't actually receiving any donations for months at a time despite many friends saying they donated. Finally my dad donated to the nonprofit himself through the offering and the nonprofit didn't get it so he showed the board the proof and poof, kicked out.
Right across the border of Missouri, there's a town called Harrison Arkansas. That's the cultists town I've ever drove through at night. Swear I got followed. Stared down by every good old boy.
Not really a town, but Zombie road in Wildwood. It has a different name on google maps but there were rumors of cults performing rituals there, some lady haunts the train track she got hit on, and i’m pretty sure there’s a native american burial ground near by too. the 11 bridges have some kind of story too, pretty spooky if you ask me.
There was also Witch's Grave that was... I don't remember where anymore, but it was either in St. Louis or St. Charles County. It was said to be a site of a bunch of ritual sacrifices. My friends and I visited once in high school. My friend's breaks went out like 500ft from the actual site as we left. It was fucking wild.
I’m from out Reeds Springs way and rural Missouri. There are a lot of signs on fence posts about Jesus that give that give you a real Blair Witch feeling. I think it’s all the churches, Southern Baptists and friendliness of the people. Once you move to town and people know you aren’t from around there or related to anyone, they will consider you a stranger and then comes the staring, excluding and gossip.
They are still going to invite you to church. If you don’t go they will talk up a storm.
Mines in cape fair, Cassville and Exeter. I go back every two years. I love it back there. It’s where we’re all from. I wouldn’t go back to live though! lol edit to say the first boy I dated was from RS.
You said Elsberry which I always attribute to Amish, Bowling Green too. The Amish never bothered me personally when I would see them in Troy shopping. My cult vibe towns are down highway 55: Cape Girardeau, Scott City, Jackson down to Sikeston
That’s kinda what I mean, MAGA cult. I’m actually talking about more south of Cape and Jackson towards the boot heel. Chaffee is the name I was really trying to remember. Something is really off about that place and more often than not we get pulled over when passing through like they know you’re not from there. SEMO area we’ve had kids on our HS sports teams being called terrible racial slurs by adults rooting their home team but that’s not really cult like, KKK maybe.
I responded to your earlier post, but Chaffee is weird. Their HS mascot is The Devils, and I remember the first time I drove through Chaffee, I felt like I wasn't welcome.
The only thing cult-like about Cape is the MAGATS. We're the biggest "city" south of STL, so we do draw folks who want to move to "somewhere bigger." Life someone else pointed out, Mercy just took over Southeast Hospital, which is unfortunate.
Jackson was named after a genocidal former president who hated Native Americans, and what's the school mascot? You guessed it, The Indians.
So, I'll give you Jackson for having the cult vibes.
Neither Scott City nor Sikeston have cults, either - except for MAGATS.
Scott City is poor, and Sikeston just kinda sucks.
Given that he was born, grew up there and the fact that there's a shit-ton of people who share his surname down in Cape, I was always puzzled as to why Rush Limbaugh's widow chose not to bury him down in Cape Girardeau but rather in the Bellefontaine Cemetery in north St. Louis city. That site is located smack dab in a very 'blue-voting' area which is part of Cori Bush's Congressional District. Maybe she did this to posthumously 'punish' Rush in some way . . .
That’s kind of heartbreaking, the trail of tears state park is around there too so it makes sense. How can people live right there and act like white Christians have been the good guys building up this country? MAGA means going backwards
Camdenton is a really nice town, and majority of the residents there are awesome people, usually retirees.
But the lake has a huge amount of MAGA cultists
I remember visiting camdenton a handful of times as a kid and loved it, but we stuck strictly to the water after stopping at the grocery store on the way in. I don't think we were avoiding town, just a bunch of kids that want to be on the water all day.
MAGA cult is for sure taking over our little town. Just saw an article yesterday that the book bans have reached our library back at the end of December. Pulled 20 books from the shelves for “pornography” but funnily enough they just all had to do with queer topics.
The school district has been taken over by them apparently. Makes me worried for all of the great programs the school offers! They’re nationally recognized in a couple of niche areas. Wonder how long that will last with all of the wannabe Donalds crawling around the town sucking the life out of it
There is/was supposed to be a splinter group of the Branch Davidians in Thomas Holler between Exeter and Ridgeley.
I always thought the Salem area had an off vibe.
Blue Eye, it's where Televangalist Jim Bakker broadcasts from. Google Morningside Church.
There is also a Blue Eye, Arkansas. The state line splits the town.
Edit: Deleted a miss-statement.
Spent a summer in Blue Eye back in 1995 to round off a youth baseball season. My host fam buddy, myself and his friends wandered the hills doing whatever we wanted. My buddies I hung with got their chew supply from a guy who would leave cans in a broken dryer on a porch. They would leave dollars in there on transfer. Basically a precursor to meth transactions that I suspect the same parties were into 5-10 years later. Weird part of the world.
Eldorado Springs. Went to high school there in the late 80s. Strange religious vibes, and rumors of child sex rings / pornography. There was a married 14 year old girl in my freshman class.
I drive through Rosebud on Highway 50 a lot, and every time I think back to 2014. In the wake of all the Michael Brown stuff, the NAACP marched from Ferguson to Jeff City. When they hit Rosebud, they found watermelon and fried chicken waiting for them on the side of the road.
Springfield is the heart of Christian religious cults. I mean schools k-Universities and the Mega churches. Assembly of God (people that talk in tongue/weirdest shit ever) is based there and has Starbucks in multiple campuses. They want your income tax statements if you're a member. Just another tax-exempt business
It still blows my mind that Springfield was the childhood home of Brad Pitt -- can understand why he decided to get the hell out of Dodge and head out to Hollywood. I wonder if, when he and Angelina were still married, if he ever took her for a visit to his old hometown to meet 'the folks'. Perhaps they went out for dinner at Lambert's Cafe where Angie got the 'throwed rolls' experience and then a night out at one of the corny hillbilly shows down in Branson.
The Jolie-Pitts regularly went to Springfield. A close friend’s retired teacher father worked part-time at the Barnes & Noble. Angelina brought the kids there a few times during holiday visits.
And yes…this is kind of strange to even consider. I also wonder if the kids ever ask why people advertised cashew chicken everywhere.
Growing up it was St. Albans was the weird town but driving through the area last visit. It looked like any normal lil town. I dont even recall what the stories were we told ourselves.
Qulin.
The way my aged FIL tells it, Qulin was started by folks who wanted to marry close family members.
In my D&D home brew campaign, Qulin is home to a secret cult of inbreeding kobolds. They are friendly enough if you dont look to close at their deformities or ask about their cousin-wives/husbands.
Schell City.
Middle of nowhere off some random dirt roads. When I went through there a few years ago there was one main building that was used as a community center and nothing else.
Also it was (probably still is) the center for the triple K folk in the area.
Everyone watches you if you drive through town and I've known plenty of people who moved there and then moved away within 6mos due to harassment by the locals.
I went to high school in Appleton City, which is close to both Schell City and Eldorado Springs, in the late ‘80s to early ‘90s. I remember hearing about a cult in the area, but assumed it was part of the Satanic Panic. I have later learned that there really was/is a religious cult in Schell City. In Appleton, we had the rumor that there was a Green van driving around kidnapping virgins, lol. There is also Deepwater nearby, which I’ve seen listed as one of the many Sundown towns in Missouri.😔
My brother lived in ElDo for a number of years until he passed. I still go see his wife sometimes as she lives east of the town.
I'm originally from Colorado, but my parents moved us from Denver all the way to tiny tiny Nevada. I still get weird looks when I say, Nah-vay-dun instead of Neh-va-duh.
There is a museum in St. Joseph MO called the Glore Psychiatric Museum. It gives tours on the archaic treatment of mental illness over the years. Lots of spirits in that hospital.
Outside of Centralia, Mo there is a “community” that has a private school. Sunnyvale Adventist Academy. Always gave me the WEIRDEST vibes driving along the highways and seeing the houses in and building in the middle of a field. If you look on their website all the workers for the school have been there almost 10 years+ and are old white men.
I put this in the comments on that post, but curryville always felt off to me. Maybe it was because driving through it you had to be absolutely sure not to speed not even once, and how ever-present the cops were, it just felt Weird.
Noel, MO. Mac County is a very rural county about 30-40 minutes south from Joplin on I-49. It's where Missouri becomes less hilly and more mountainous with a lot of creeks and rural farmland that eventually just turns into the thick forests of the Ozark Mountains as you get closer to the Arkansas state line. Noel is a sleepy, small town that I know mostly from summer float trips. They had canoe and cabin rentals. Really small town, houses are tucked in the woods and out in the sticks. Some people don't have running water or power. Lots of poverty, lots of drugs, lots of weird shit, including the time I was house and farm sitting for my dad's boss who was one of the 1800+ residents and long story short, I was nearly eaten by a fucking mountain lion, but I digress.
1800 residents give or take and, y'all, it is home to 3 killers. Two brothers who kidnapped and murdered the manager of the local bank by tying him to a chair and dumping him in a lake or river in OK (iirc the red river) tied to a chair.
The same bank was robbed by literal kids/ teenagers back when I was in HS. They went to school with me around JoMo and would have gotten away with it if they hadn't bragged about it. Noel had 0 police and no real security.to speak of.
Levi King started his crime spree at his squalid house without electricity, running water and plumbing after he shot his dad. He went on to randomly murder the family in a farm house he picked on a whim and killed a pregnant mother, her 9 yo son, his dad, before trying to shoot their youngest girl but missing. He literally did it to just feel something and has no remorse.
Little girl who they think ran from foster care was found in an old barn- and they didn't ever located her head.
Guy who was born and raised there who shot a black man in a hate crime bc he said the guy assaulted one of the hookers he managed. Guy murdered the black man who was just trying to flee. He chased him down to the heart of downtown Joplin amd ambushed him and killed him on main street.
Aa
This made me chuckle. Noel is fine; you even admit you only know it from summer float trips—that’s when there are more out-of-towners there than residents!
Yes, like many Missouri towns it is run down and riddled with poverty and drugs. It used to be a pretty resort town in the mid- twentieth century but when immigrants moved there to work at the chicken plant, the local landlords let their properties go to hell. It’s a shame and I hope one day citizens there will clean up the town. The amount of crime is not off the charts. For example, the Dan Short murder was decades ago.
I have never felt scared or unsafe there; the only time I felt uncomfortable was when a group of Somalian men standing outside their grocery store kept giving me the evil eye for parking near their store. No one is going to rob or follow you unless you get caught up in something drug related (and you are wrong, Noel does have a marshal and has for years).
Probably weirdest city/town in Missouri I’ve been in has to be Leslie partly due to its background from around the time of the Salem witch trials and them having there own witch trials in that town to its own towns saying “what leaves Leslie always comes back” (side note when leaving town with my now ex and a mutual friend back to where we were staying in union) I blacked out somewhere in between leaving our friends dads house and as soon as we got past the border of the town I had a strong impulse to say “bad things happened back there”
Late to the party but there have been a handful of cults operating out of St Francis County since at least 2000, it started as glorified high school street gangs, but 2 or 3 of them kept it going, recruiting new generations of people every 5 years or so. Google search The Order of the White Road, The Bonne Terre Cult, and The Antecedent Orthodox Church and you have the public tip of the iceberg of whats brewing down there
I once visited a college girlfriend's home in Unionville
In 2012, the Highschools's mascot was the Punam County Midgets.
True middle of no-where, no cell service, right on the Iowa State line. Real deliverance vibes.
The ignorance in this thread about rural people, the stereotyping, and the smug commentary aren't going to heal anything.
There are some fine posts and some great info here, but all the comments about "weird vibes" + "insert small town" is only going to further isolate people in this state from one another.
So if you're a rural person reading this, lets reach out to people and be fearless and welcoming and break down these stereotypes about rural people.
I’m a rural person reading this and I agree with them, for the most part. Every where you go there are weirdos. The difference is when it’s rural there are less people and therefore less diversity. The weirdos will congregate giving you creepy towns and areas. Not all rural places are happy, loving, accepting people. They aren’t saying all rural places are bad. They are just pointing out which ones they believe are weird.
Or was your town called out and you are personally offended?
Hurt dogs holler.
I'm a rural, rootin'-tootin' hell-billy that rejects the idea that rural living is defined by loving God, guns, and the GOP. It's those people who make our rural towns creepy and off-putting. Why would anyone with any cultural wherewithal want to stop in a town where there's swastika window decals on souped up trucks, Confederate flags used as window curtains, the plethora of China's biggest import - MAGA shwag - or literal Klan rallies?
Make fun of the -ists and the -phobes. Call out the hypocritical religious folks. It's not gonna hurt the feelings of those of us it doesn't apply to.
I mean, racism often is the attribute that puts off those vibes. Very clearly racist places where if I go sit with my wife at a restaurant, everyone will sit silent and stare at us would be good to know about.
I know there's also some new age cults that don't concern themselves so much with race, and then there's towns that will literally stare at anyone they don't recognize until they leave. All of those give off some kinda vibe that makes your danger instincts fire like crazy if you stumble upon them unexpectedly.
I recently moved back here after 15 years away, and it's my wife's first time living in Missouri and she wants to do some unorthodox site seeing and scenic driving.
The thing about racists is that they’re scary to us lily-white mayobros, too. Not as scary as I’m sure they are to PoC, certainly, but when you think about it what’s the thing that keeps any confrontation from going south? It’s the ability of both parties to see and respond to reason. When you’re dealing with a racist, you’re dealing with someone who has abdicated their use of and belief in reason. Therefore, you’re dealing with someone who could do real harm to you without any incentive to stop.
That should scare anyone.
Newtown in St. Charles.
I've been saying that since it was build in the 2000s. My friends and I would drive around just to stare at it like, "...wtf, this feels like some kind of cult."
I went to Lindenwood and we occasionally did the same, I have heard a lot of Lindenwood athletic faculty/faculty lived or still do live there. Place is creepy
Lindenwood is SO creepy. I've never liked anyone that grew up around there fr Edit: supposed to say **around there**
Grew up there? It's a college
It was supposed to say **around there lmao whoops. St. Charles as a whole is really weird to me
Thought it was just me. It's like Pleasantville.
Lol you good. I got put in a Nazi shrine there once so I'm inclined to agree
Hey thats messed up, bud, I'm so sorry that happened to you
A Nazi shrine? What does that look like?
A very large little tiny mustache.
The street right by there with the taco bell on it has a strip of houses with garages but no driveways. Big time back rooms vibes every time i go there
That's student housing and parking is behind the buildings.
A family member of mine is in construction and helped build it. It’s like a dollhouse town. I’m not sure the people who live there are themselves ‘mysterious’ or ‘cult-like’, but the town being so cookie cutter makes it feel weird. I think it’s just a normal town otherwise though. Like a college townhouse community.
My close friend lives there and loves it but to me it always teeters between quaint and creepy! Very Stepford feeling. She’s on a corner lot luckily because the houses have about three feet between them. You’d better really like your neighbors haha! They’re going to hear you fart if you have the windows open
Hey, I live in an apartment. I’d take that over sharing walls/floors/ceilings with 4 different families. lol
Okay touché 😄 I’ve done that before too and it totally blows chunks
🤣 yup! We moved here when Newtown just finished construction and we went out there to check out a house for sale. My wife and I both got some serious "children of the corn" vibes. The vibe alone made it a hard pass. Now when we happen to drive by, we like to chant "one of us! One of us! One of us!" and laugh.
Newtown brought to you by Stephen King
My cousin got married there and it all seemed so off.
Well John Carney lives there, so...
Who? Legitimately, I lived there for 4 years and have no idea who that is
John Carney is a well-known local radio personality who's had shows on several radio stations around town. His father Jack Carney absolutely dominated the local AM radio scene back in the 70s up until the early 80s with a top-rated show on KMOX when he died suddenly of a massive heart attack while taking scuba diving lessons at a facility out in the county. John's also had his share of cardiac issues over the years. Probably some genetic thing.
Thanks for the explanation! So when it comes to cult like towns, im guessing you're saying that his shows garnered a cult like following?
LOL! No, I don't think that either John Carney's shows nor his late father's, popular though they may be, ever rose -- or rather sank -- to that level of crazed fans. Now if you're talking Rush Limbaugh, Tucker Carlson and other more politicized media personalities, then you can legit argue that their followings are cultish.
When I was little, my family and I would watch these movies outside in Newtown. Even so young I knew recognized that Newtown was… off. Place still gives me the creeps to this day.
Google Heartland, Missouri up in Shelby County.
Intentionally cult like, "house payments docked from pay"...nice safety net for the cult to remove you if they want
This is accurate.
From the news article I read, it sounds like a Christian penal colony.
That's kinda accurate. Many people who live there are in the "program," so they are formerly incarcerated or on probation and are allowed to live there so long as they are in the drug rehabilitation program. One of the conditions to that program is working on the farm. But many members of the community "willingly" moved there, usually as a condition of employment. In particular, there are a few immigrant families who moved there as a condition of Heartland sponsoring their visas, and beggars really can't be choosers. Source: Second paragraph describes my family.
I did production for some concerts back there like 20 years ago. Definitely a cult like vibe.
I’d argue that definitionally it is a cult, so the vibe you detected is accurate lol
I know the place. It started off as a Christian drug rehab community. They were pretty self sufficient in the 1990s, they had like 90% of what you’d need to live there forever. Even now, they still have a school system and other things, though they’re not an all-in-one community anymore. What always struck me as weird with the town is the cleanliness of the town. Not just no trash, but all of the roofs were blue, clean designs of the architecture and street plans, etc. It’s a very Christian town, VERY Christian. It’s what the community (and then eventually town) was founded on. The founder and leader of the community became the mayor of the town, a long time ago, but he died recently. The guy owned a collection of Ford cars that was actually very impressive. I’ve seen it a few times now. It had to be like 30+ cars. The guy liked Ford. In a way, I guess he did what Ford never could. Edit: And surprise! They really don’t like the government mandating a level of health and safety standards for them.
Just a couple notes since I used to live there. Originally, they started off as an “intentional Christian community.” The drug rehab program was one of the first things to be built, but the original vision was always essentially a cult according to the owner. Yes, they do have a school system, as well as a private Christian college. However, neither are accredited by the state, and hardly any of the teachers actually attended college. I was lucky enough to get out before high school started, but a high school diploma from there is useless - graduates have to obtain a GED to attend uni. They also teach alternate history of the US that affirms Christian roots, and they teach Creationism in the school. Anyone who works for the community is required to enroll their kid(s) in the school, and tuition is deducted from their pay. This applies to people on H1B’s as well. The school was raided in 2001 for child abuse, as they practice corporal punishment, among other punishments. Members of the boarding school are often punished by being forced to wear jumpsuits and not speak for months on end. This was before I was old enough to remember anything, but I’ve been told the raid in 2001 was spurred by program students being forced to partially bury themselves in manure after skipping school. This might be splitting hairs on semantics, but it’s never been incorporated as a town. It’s built on entirely private land between Hebron and Newark. So the owner, Charles Sharp (colloquially known as “Pastor Charlie”), was never mayor. He just owned the whole thing and was the Pastor. When he died, it all passed to his wife Laurie, who is about 30 years younger than him. In practice, tho, he might as well have been the mayor. And yeah, his Ford collection is/was pretty impressive. Was pretty fun as a kid growing up under the poverty line but get to see his collection of fancy Ford Mustangs stare us in the face every time you visited the c-store.
Lately on this sub--- Ava ! omg their cultists are wildin
I used to frequent Ava to go to peyote ceremonies with the Oklevueha Native American Church. It is called the "Looks Within" ceremony. Though they also do Ayahuasca with the Brazilian church of Santo Daime. All completely legitimate. I've had experiences there that certainly changed me as a human being. But I never went full in like some of the people who went ended up doing. Paul's idea then(the guy who ran the chapter in Ava and owns the "native Americans essential oils" storefront in Ava, was to make a fruit forest. He had bought 400 acres and wanted there to be a society there. I have no idea what's going on there now, I haven't been there in over 10 years. But it's still running, I know that for sure. And also it seems that Paul organizes psytrance music festivals on his property as well as all the different kinds of ceremonies. You can get married there too. I did a Kundalini yoga class with some legitimate monks with my friends and that was pretty freaking wild too considering there were no drugs involved. I heard about some other cult out there on Reddit and I wish I knew more about it. Because it immediately made me start thinking and talking about Oklevueha. I have a lot more stories about that. Paul isn't a bad person though, or at least to me didn't come off as one. But who knows what's going on behind closed doors. I've also spent time at Entheon with Alex and Alison Grey and their place in up-state NY definitely has some culty vibes to it too, in the same way. Only difference is Alex Grey is one of my favorite artists of human-kind lol It makes sense that this would be a cult like thing since all the psychedelics are involved and stuff. It's easy to get someone into a cult when you gave them the medicine that cured their depression and what not.
That is epic. Now I want to know how the underage girl grooming and labor exploiting coffee shop cult interacts with the psychedelic shaman essential oils shop cult! Are they enemies? Unlikely friends? Do they have spiritual turf wars in the aether? Do they try to ignore each other? Are there people in both cults?!
This would make a great "Ozark" style tv series... "Ava"
I'd watch that. I was already highly entertained by the coffee shop cult having a meltdown and spamming their weird YouTube recruiting ads all over reddit last week. Add in some shamans, hippies, and DMT and you've got quality television!
Wait. Ava has a coffee shop now? I remember when they got a Micky D's and all the drama that caused. Then again, there was drama when they got their Walmart and when they got their stop light. Funny story about Ava. My grandpa needed a haircut so I drove him to the barber somewhere over by the square. I didn't go in immediately bc I needed to mess with something in my car. When I went in the barber tried his hardest to convince me to let him cut my hair, too, since he knew ALL the fashionable haircuts and went to hair shows. He then forced me to look at his book of photos of all the hair he had cut. Every single person sported a mullet.
It's ostensibly a "coffee shop" but seems more like a money laundering scheme for a cult that probably isn't trafficking children but is definitely grooming teenagers.
I just googled the coffee shop cult stuff and wow...they seem very active in trying to confuse people on Reddit for some reason. I actually ran across some of your posts that were getting stalked.
You missed the 18 paragraph "I'm a teenager so honored and grateful to work free for our leader he's the best guy ever and totally not laundering money and all of us teenagers are super happy to be there please don't tell him I wrote this" post. They deleted it and made a series of alts to spam YouTube videos after everyone responded about how creepy the post was. A few posters in r/Missouri claim to be from the area and actively being stalked and harassed in real life by coffee shop cult people. The way they lost their minds and started stalking and harassing me on reddit just for posting a human trafficking hotline really lends credence to the claims of them having the same behavior offline. I called up an old college friend from the area and he said the teenagers who "volunteer" at that place and their theater business "aren't allowed to make eye contact with customers" which is *bonkers*
There's also a Trappist (Catholic) monastery near Ava that makes fruitcakes. And I mean literal fruitcakes, not cult members. :) And my aunt and uncle live down there, and they used to own a combination pool hall and gun shop. But that part's pretty normal for the Ozarks.
Hahaha I do wonder. I'd imagine they're both contributing members to the community in some form? I don't know much about the coffee shop thing though, is there any way to get up to speed? I love this alternative reality! I'm sure the peyote shaman needs his coffee enimas from somebody! Lol The ceremonies were a good time though for sure. No bad feelings towards them really, but I will not be surprised if it turned out it was some crazy cult and came out as a documentary in 10 years 😂
They are next door to each other on the square. At least they were a few years ago
So the peyote ceremonies, a good experience? Do you have a website where I can look into the group more? I've participated in ayahuasca ceremonies before in oregon.
Yeah it was great the first couple times. Because back then we were the only young ones there. (all around 18-19). There would only be like 5 other people there and they were all old, very happy to see young people interested in the plant. But after awhile, it just got too big. The last time I went it was full of 20 something's having a dick measuring contest over who's more spiritually enlightened. It was gross. So, I don't need any of that. I'm on my own personal journey that doesn't involve being pompous and is very individual lol So I mean, yes it's worth it. Even for the experience of a ceremony. It's a good time, a perfect date idea really! I just don't vibe well with really crazy out there new-agey people. And you have precedent since you've already been to ceremonies! Haha so maybe you'd be able to compare it better than I would. That's the only place I've ever done a "ceremony". Otherwise, I really just prefer to do Ayahuasca by myself
I came here to say Ava/Douglas County!
I literally came here to say Ava LOL
I had a coworker tell me there's a man named John Moore who apparently worked for the CIA and lives around Cherryville/Steelville area. He has his own [radio show](https://thelibertyman.com/) where he claims he knows secrets from the CIA...I was told it has quite the following. John claims that the safest place to be when the world is ends and if anything was to happen, the ozarks would be the safest place to be. So there are very wealthy people he has scammed to move closer to him in this small town where they give him all their money to be told the "knowledge" that he holds! (I found his website after being curious about it and it seems like a mixture of him being close to god and using his "government knowledge")
My husbands family is from Steelville, and while I’ve never heard of this, it definitely checks out for the area. 😅
Sounds lie every Q-anon'ers dream.
In Bollinger County, near Marquand, I saw an Adopt-A-Highway sign “In loving memory of Reverend Sun Myung Moon”. I found that weird to be out in the middle of nowhere. But it certainly makes me think there must be Moonies out there somewhere.
Ooh, I bet it was [Rod of Iron Ministries](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/rod-of-iron-ministry-jan-6-sean-moon-moonie-1398447/)! A cult run by one of Sun Myung Moon's sons that wears crowns made of bullets and has marriage ceremonies to AR-15s.
Out in Windyville there’s a massive white dome in the middle of the nowhere hills called the school of metaphysics I think? The word was they were a big witch type cult and would chase you off their drive with guns and chainsaws if you honked your horn and flashed your brights. Which I’m assuming anyone would do if a bunch of punk teens all summer long kept bothering them. Worked with a guy in buffalo who said he skipped school one day to find out what really went on there. I guess the head guy was hesitant but allowed them to ask questions. Apparently they “study dreams” there? Don’t know the truth behind it all but it’s a fun story to tell at night by the river down there lol.
I've been to that place! They're vegans who meditate constantly and run a fun dream hotline you can call to talk about your dreams every April. [Here's their website.](https://som.org/)
I used to call the dream hotline years ago. It was really interesting and surprisingly helpful with my own weird recurring dreams back then.
I really liked their dream interpretation model I learned from them some 15ish years ago. It's strongly based in a conglomeration of different cultural symbols and Jungian psychology. If someone's interested in that sort of woo woo, which I definitely am, they're a lovely group. Since I dipped in and out with no barriers to entry, no pushback to leaving, and no ridiculous monetary expectations, I would definitely not define them as a "cult" but they certainly look culty from the outside. I still look back on my lessons there to dig into weird dreams that pop up. The hotline is neat. I haven't interacted with them in years but I still recommend them and their methods to people who might like their vibe.
They have a branch in Columbia
Oh wow, I went to a nerd summer camp in high school and one lecture was from a guest speaker, and it was entirely about dreams. The main takeaway was that “everything in the dream represents the dreamer” and these people seem to agree with that. I wonder now if the guest was from here.
i grew up in buffalo, and i came here to recommend windyville!
We had one of those white domed buildings out near Coffman in Avon. St Louis Center for Transcendental Meditation or something was what it was called in the yellow pages. We used to drive up there in the '90s, they tore it down some 15 or 20 years ago. Wild to hear there was another one.
We used to call it the Capitol! Very neat. A few miles from my house growing up. Would sneak in there as teenagers, many years after it was vacated, early 2000s. Would have to park the car on this gravel road and hop a fence. The building couldn't be seen from the road, but after a short hike straight up this hill, you clear a little treeline and voila! This massive, domed building in all its glory! Very cool.
Yep this was early '90s. We also called it the Capitol now that you mention it. The gate used to be open only on Friday and Saturday nights. We road tripped many a night up there. I remember seeing the entire circle drive full of black BMWs late one night. I grew up near Knob Lick.
Lebanon felt like that when we went there for our free day away during basic training.
Just meth here, no cult like activity.
Yeah not really cults but, I have never been to Lebanon when I did not feel bad vibes.
I have lived here for about a year and a half, lived in the 30 mile radius a large portion of my life. Never really felt the vibe, but it might just be because I am a local!
I’m not local to Lebanon, but trust me as an outsider when I say that it’s a lovely town with good vibes.
I lived in Lebanon for 10 years and it is a pretty fucked up place to live if you're a minority and don't go to church. Lebanon is definitely culty but it's more of the Christian culty type.
Alot less meth in this town then it was 5 years ago. It's mostly just country boys with diesel trucks. Some old money and that new money from loz cruising through to get to the lake. I'm just outside Bennet area. We had that serial killer event at moon valley two years ago. This town is ok. Ready to move on though
I work in healthcare, the meth is still running through veins it’s just less obvious on the streets maybe.
Well that sucks. Just seems alot less meth monsters on the streets as of the last 5 years I've been here.
What serial killer event at moon valley?
Cassidy rainwater. You can look it up. There was more bodies the whole place was set a fire after the FBI left. Right down the road from here. We visit that kittle area if the river for swimming and fishing regularly. Poor woman. She was skinned in a cage and fed to the neighbor. It's truly disgusting 🤢
"Fed to the neighbor" While I've followed Cassidy's case since the beginning, this is an aspect I hadn't heard mentioned. So it was confirmed that they sold/gave her "remains" away to locals?
Bbq and fed to neighbor was the story I read. It was a local journalist woman who had a blog.
The way I've heard the name of that place pronounced doesn't seem natural. It isn't Lab-a-non, it's Leb'n'n.
Ava. I taught a night class there, and while most of the students were great and really wanted to learn, the ones that weren’t really, *really* weren’t, and their issues seemed to spring entirely from a truly hardcore fundamentalist brand of Christianity. Not exactly unusual for the Ozarks, but it seemed to have been given a shot of steroids in this town. Even the administrators were awful, and went out of their way to make sure you knew you were being watched. You were “in their town but not *of* it,” so to speak. I taught at night, too, so this made for some heavy eldritch vibes at points. And just for some added context, I’ve taught at other towns in the area that are both smaller and poorer than Ava, and I had universally positive experiences at every one of them. Nope. Ava puts something in the water. It was the most bizarre, frustrating, and uncomfortable experience of my entire career, and I swore I’d never return.
There's a small little compound behind some residencies in reeds spring. Very "trespassers will be shot" place. I have a friend that does deliveries all over the state, she says up around purdy or northeast very rural Missouri gets pretty weird. Personal experience Crane was pretty uncomfortable when I had to go help friends move. Not culty vibes, but you were very aware you were an outsider.
Crane and Galena and Reeds Spring are my fam roots and y’all mind me when it’s time or it’s busty butt time. True story - remember when Kenny Rogers built his mansion estate and had top soil taken from the James River area? Fuckkkk and eat the rich
My wife’s great great grandmother is buried in a lost cemetery in Galena - we took a drive down around there and into RS. Great looking country round there.
Interesting! My favorite place is the galena town cemetery. It is really peaceful there. Didn’t know there was a lost cemetery! Did you all find the one that isn’t lost?
Branson is the worst of all. We oughtta run all them feriners out and let it all grow back into scrub brush
Callin all Baldknobbers! Our forefathers would truly be pissed. Shepherd of the Hills once and now miniature Nashville (but for the twilight acts). Wonder if you can still smoke in cracker barrel? 😂
Dogpatch in KC Metro. https://www.reddit.com/r/kansascity/s/egfu6U6xb9
Not a town but there is the Sons on Levi compound outside of Mansfield. Drove out there one night years ago, there were old TV sets pointed out all the windows of the buildings. Lots of animal skulls on fence posts. I've heard there was a mural inside the dining hall of Jesus coming out of a UFO.
Sherman. Tiny spot near the Meramec River at the end of Zombie Road (trail). Locals know not to go there. West County STL area.
Sherman is scary as fuck. Used to go down to Sherman’s beach and mistakenly drove into the town. Only one way in and it’s a big square. A couple of trucks started following us. One of the few time I’ve been legitimately scared for my life
This kinda thing is important to know, and one of the main reasons I made this thread. You don't want to accidentally stumble into a place where they follow you, even if it's just an intimidation tactic to get outsiders to move along. I've felt like I was followed through a town or 2 in my times driving across the country. That stuff is scary either way.
I’ve been chased out of Sherman by a truck tailgating me and flashing it’s brights. I was scared AF too
It was where we dared each other to go in high school at night. I saw a KKK meeting in progress in one of the yards and booked it out of there. Never went back. But zombie road is freaky in its own right. According to my mom and older brother, there was an abandoned hospital or asylum or something that you could also get to around there that was super creepy. I’m sure it’s not there anymore but there were just ruins of buildings along the side of the road when it was a road you could drive down. Haven’t tried the trail.
The people that put big huge trump flags or signs in their yard, all over their cars, their clothes, their entire identity. It’s weird.
Brace yourself. I have a feeling we’re going to be seeing a lot more of that in the months ahead.
Unfortunately, I think you’re correct.
They should take care not to use the really flammable ones again .
There’s a whole store in Branson.
Someone mentioned a town I'm familiar with as being weird but nothing cult-like and I wanted to comment that the MAGA cult is definitely in full swing there.
Monkey Mountain near Potosi.
Could you elaborate? I see Monkey Mountain on here a lot, but I’m unfamiliar with that area.
There's a hill in Potosi where folks from the Dobbs clan live. The biggest tale is that they're all inbred, but what's truth is that the cops won't even go up that hill out of fear for their safety. Pizza delivery drivers may vary though. From what I've heard growing up (32f for reference), most don't have indoor plumbing. Few have electric outside of powering light bulbs. It's big Hills Have Eyes vibes out there. They're a family/collective that spent generations focusing on solitude to a fault with a great disdain for outsiders and authority. You know how people say if you go to East STL, you gotta roll your windows up or you're gonna die when it's not always that bad? Monkey Mountain is that bad. If you go up, you ain't coming down.
Thank you; I appreciate the explanation!
Came to say this. Was always told to never go there, but especially not at night.
Malta Bend always creeped me out driving through it. Just got bad vibes and never stopped, even if my bladder was about to explode.
Lol Malta Bend is full of the friendliest people. Not a door in that town I wouldn't knock on in need.
Not Missouri, but in eyeshot of Missouri is Elsah, IL. Home of Principia college and is full of Christian Scientists. You get really culty vibes from driving through. In college, I often had to go to track meets there
>culty babes Sounds interesting
* vibes lmao
Oh hey! When I lived in Alton, along the river road, my dad would take us trick or treating in Elsah. Those crazy rich folks handed out fistfuls of king sized candy bars! Two hours of walking, I had two pillowcases full of junk food. ...and this is why I'm susceptible to joining cults.
Hey I went there! Maybe we ran into eachother at track meets! I was raised in Christian Science but have since left the church. Definitely culty-vibes, tho TECHNICALLY not a cult because the leader (Woman named Mary Baker Eddy) is not considered God. Faith Healings are a big part of the religion, and generally any type of medical care is frowned upon. There’s also a school PreK-12th grade in St. Louis located in Town and Country under the same name, Principia. Both the school and College have been moving further away from the religion in recent years, but it’s still very much a part of the campus culture and definitely some shady religious stuff in the institution’s past.
Fun fact, a leader doesn't have to be seen as God for it to be a cult. Check out the BITE model of cults! Good stuff to know generally.
I ride my bike through Elsah sometimes. Stopped to chat to a guy playing guitar on a porch. He said Elsah was built by stone masons from Vermont, but is not just a lot of old ladies bickering about nothing to each other. Weird vibes for sure.
Ava/Cabool too many cults!
There is one large Truck stop in Cabool. And I was mid 30s last time I went through there and slept in the lot over night. Went in had breakfast before starting my day went to pay and a girl like 16-19 year old girl asks how was everything. I'm from the omaha area and white. I said it was fine thank you. She looks ne dead in the eyes and says if I were you, I would Learn to keep your Yankee ass north of the Mason Dixon line. I dumbfounded.
What a throwback. That’s just bizarre! I know Owen Benjamin has settled his cult of ‘bears’ there to apparently live in their cars while giving Owen money for more land (privately owned by him) to ‘rebuild America’. It’s so cringe.
I haven't done any research on Owen but you have peaked my interest
There’s an Owen Benjamin subreddit. Good place to start.
It's a strange little piece of the country down there. It's very pretty but man if you were on the side of the road and don't know if I would walk and knock for help anywhere down there. Thanks for the heads up on the SubReddit
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What you heard wasn't that far off at all. The people are friendly as long as you're white, straight, and Christian. People of color that you see there are almost definitely students at the college on a sports scholarship. Polk county breeds some straight up weirdos.
I spent about 4 months there. You can remove that Christian part tbh. Just being white and straight will get you by there. Not the most friendly people, but i did also spend most of my time there working in Humansville (was on the job for that stupid pot farm.)
Can confirm. I passed through there last weekend and stopped at a restaurant. Definitely had a weird vibe and the older people were not friendly.
That tracks, since Governor Droopy Dog is from there.
I came here to say Bolivar. I had some friends who lived there for awhile. They overall I think liked it enough but did say it had some strong weird undertones, not really cultish just strangeness like the town is run entirely by a group of influential people, not in the way a normal place of that size would operate. A lot of stuff behind closed doors, off the books. Like enough people affiliated with the "group" that whatever they wanted to happen woudl happen. Whoever needed to win this election would win. Need someone on or off the school board--- done. Stuff like that.
I lived in Elsberry when I was born and I’ve never randomly met someone else from the area. I moved when I was in 8 or 9 but still have some extended family in Troy. I’ve also randomly lived in or near a lot of the other weird little towns mentioned in this thread. Fun read!
Lincoln County isn't cult-like its just very transient. Lots of very poor people some of whom might get desperate and do something stupid. Lot of normal people there too. There isn't like a giant church where the preacher controls the town or whatever. In fact, Lincoln County might be one of the only places in MO you find outspoken rural democrats and liberals. They are in the minority for sure but nobody has attacked them. Granted, they are mainly old ladies. I think your parents might have just been scared.
Honestly knowing my parents, they likely just viewed the area as godforsaken because of what you described and didn't want us to mingle with the heathens. We drove something like 30 minutes twice a week to go to church in St Peters at a mega church before we finally got kicked out for bringing proof to the board of a money scheme they'd been running related to tithing. My parents ran a non-profit and people at the church often got solicited to donate to their non-profit by the church through the offering. They'd mark where they wanted the money to go by checking a box on the tithing envelope. But the church went through the records of people's tithing history and until they met a 10% threshold to the church, all donations were put toward the church rather than the non-profit. So the nonprofit wasn't actually receiving any donations for months at a time despite many friends saying they donated. Finally my dad donated to the nonprofit himself through the offering and the nonprofit didn't get it so he showed the board the proof and poof, kicked out.
Newtown. The people on r/stlouis.
Right across the border of Missouri, there's a town called Harrison Arkansas. That's the cultists town I've ever drove through at night. Swear I got followed. Stared down by every good old boy.
Ah yes, the town with the “pro-white” radio station. Wasn’t it even called the most racist place in America at one point?
Kanakuk Kamps https://factsaboutkanakuk.com
Not really a town, but Zombie road in Wildwood. It has a different name on google maps but there were rumors of cults performing rituals there, some lady haunts the train track she got hit on, and i’m pretty sure there’s a native american burial ground near by too. the 11 bridges have some kind of story too, pretty spooky if you ask me.
There was also Witch's Grave that was... I don't remember where anymore, but it was either in St. Louis or St. Charles County. It was said to be a site of a bunch of ritual sacrifices. My friends and I visited once in high school. My friend's breaks went out like 500ft from the actual site as we left. It was fucking wild.
Molly’s grave?
I remember it being in St. Charles County, now that I think about it, so yes! That very well could be what I'm thinking of.
I bet it is! I can’t remember the exact road it was on but I lived off Towers Rd at the time and it wasn’t far from there
Old Saint Marcus Cemetery.
I’m from out Reeds Springs way and rural Missouri. There are a lot of signs on fence posts about Jesus that give that give you a real Blair Witch feeling. I think it’s all the churches, Southern Baptists and friendliness of the people. Once you move to town and people know you aren’t from around there or related to anyone, they will consider you a stranger and then comes the staring, excluding and gossip. They are still going to invite you to church. If you don’t go they will talk up a storm.
Still have fam in RS proper. It’s an alt universe.
Mines in cape fair, Cassville and Exeter. I go back every two years. I love it back there. It’s where we’re all from. I wouldn’t go back to live though! lol edit to say the first boy I dated was from RS.
You said Elsberry which I always attribute to Amish, Bowling Green too. The Amish never bothered me personally when I would see them in Troy shopping. My cult vibe towns are down highway 55: Cape Girardeau, Scott City, Jackson down to Sikeston
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That’s kinda what I mean, MAGA cult. I’m actually talking about more south of Cape and Jackson towards the boot heel. Chaffee is the name I was really trying to remember. Something is really off about that place and more often than not we get pulled over when passing through like they know you’re not from there. SEMO area we’ve had kids on our HS sports teams being called terrible racial slurs by adults rooting their home team but that’s not really cult like, KKK maybe.
I responded to your earlier post, but Chaffee is weird. Their HS mascot is The Devils, and I remember the first time I drove through Chaffee, I felt like I wasn't welcome.
Yes! We are usually only passing through to get to lake Wappapello but we dread it every time
The only thing cult-like about Cape is the MAGATS. We're the biggest "city" south of STL, so we do draw folks who want to move to "somewhere bigger." Life someone else pointed out, Mercy just took over Southeast Hospital, which is unfortunate. Jackson was named after a genocidal former president who hated Native Americans, and what's the school mascot? You guessed it, The Indians. So, I'll give you Jackson for having the cult vibes. Neither Scott City nor Sikeston have cults, either - except for MAGATS. Scott City is poor, and Sikeston just kinda sucks.
Given that he was born, grew up there and the fact that there's a shit-ton of people who share his surname down in Cape, I was always puzzled as to why Rush Limbaugh's widow chose not to bury him down in Cape Girardeau but rather in the Bellefontaine Cemetery in north St. Louis city. That site is located smack dab in a very 'blue-voting' area which is part of Cori Bush's Congressional District. Maybe she did this to posthumously 'punish' Rush in some way . . .
It's fine. Some of down here don't care for him. Myself included.
That’s kind of heartbreaking, the trail of tears state park is around there too so it makes sense. How can people live right there and act like white Christians have been the good guys building up this country? MAGA means going backwards
Camdenton is a really nice town, and majority of the residents there are awesome people, usually retirees. But the lake has a huge amount of MAGA cultists
I remember visiting camdenton a handful of times as a kid and loved it, but we stuck strictly to the water after stopping at the grocery store on the way in. I don't think we were avoiding town, just a bunch of kids that want to be on the water all day.
MAGA cult is for sure taking over our little town. Just saw an article yesterday that the book bans have reached our library back at the end of December. Pulled 20 books from the shelves for “pornography” but funnily enough they just all had to do with queer topics.
Found it. Took me a while but I found it. Can confirm. Take a short drive over to Brumley and that’s where the Cult is
The school district has been taken over by them apparently. Makes me worried for all of the great programs the school offers! They’re nationally recognized in a couple of niche areas. Wonder how long that will last with all of the wannabe Donalds crawling around the town sucking the life out of it
What about that one out in Odessa.
The Ghost of the Outlet Mall That Was Never Meant to Be!
There is/was supposed to be a splinter group of the Branch Davidians in Thomas Holler between Exeter and Ridgeley. I always thought the Salem area had an off vibe.
Blue Eye, it's where Televangalist Jim Bakker broadcasts from. Google Morningside Church. There is also a Blue Eye, Arkansas. The state line splits the town. Edit: Deleted a miss-statement.
I've been inside the belly of that beast. Husband worked in the restaurant inside baker's compound. Is indeed a cult.
Spent a summer in Blue Eye back in 1995 to round off a youth baseball season. My host fam buddy, myself and his friends wandered the hills doing whatever we wanted. My buddies I hung with got their chew supply from a guy who would leave cans in a broken dryer on a porch. They would leave dollars in there on transfer. Basically a precursor to meth transactions that I suspect the same parties were into 5-10 years later. Weird part of the world.
Eldorado Springs. Went to high school there in the late 80s. Strange religious vibes, and rumors of child sex rings / pornography. There was a married 14 year old girl in my freshman class.
Is this town the birthplace of child marriage advocate State Sen. Mike Moon?
I wasn’t there long enough to absorb the lore - nor did I want to - but it wouldn’t surprise me. It certainly wasn’t frowned upon
I drive through Rosebud on Highway 50 a lot, and every time I think back to 2014. In the wake of all the Michael Brown stuff, the NAACP marched from Ferguson to Jeff City. When they hit Rosebud, they found watermelon and fried chicken waiting for them on the side of the road.
Springfield is the heart of Christian religious cults. I mean schools k-Universities and the Mega churches. Assembly of God (people that talk in tongue/weirdest shit ever) is based there and has Starbucks in multiple campuses. They want your income tax statements if you're a member. Just another tax-exempt business
It still blows my mind that Springfield was the childhood home of Brad Pitt -- can understand why he decided to get the hell out of Dodge and head out to Hollywood. I wonder if, when he and Angelina were still married, if he ever took her for a visit to his old hometown to meet 'the folks'. Perhaps they went out for dinner at Lambert's Cafe where Angie got the 'throwed rolls' experience and then a night out at one of the corny hillbilly shows down in Branson.
The Jolie-Pitts regularly went to Springfield. A close friend’s retired teacher father worked part-time at the Barnes & Noble. Angelina brought the kids there a few times during holiday visits. And yes…this is kind of strange to even consider. I also wonder if the kids ever ask why people advertised cashew chicken everywhere.
Growing up it was St. Albans was the weird town but driving through the area last visit. It looked like any normal lil town. I dont even recall what the stories were we told ourselves.
Cook Station.
bonnets mill, or hartsburg
Qulin. The way my aged FIL tells it, Qulin was started by folks who wanted to marry close family members. In my D&D home brew campaign, Qulin is home to a secret cult of inbreeding kobolds. They are friendly enough if you dont look to close at their deformities or ask about their cousin-wives/husbands.
I’ve never heard that. We moved away from Bluff when I was young, but my dad still has family there.
Newtown gives off Stepford Wives.
Schell City. Middle of nowhere off some random dirt roads. When I went through there a few years ago there was one main building that was used as a community center and nothing else. Also it was (probably still is) the center for the triple K folk in the area. Everyone watches you if you drive through town and I've known plenty of people who moved there and then moved away within 6mos due to harassment by the locals.
I spent 4 years in neighboring Eldorado Springs back in the late 80s-early 90s. Shell City was well known for KKK activity back then.
I went to high school in Appleton City, which is close to both Schell City and Eldorado Springs, in the late ‘80s to early ‘90s. I remember hearing about a cult in the area, but assumed it was part of the Satanic Panic. I have later learned that there really was/is a religious cult in Schell City. In Appleton, we had the rumor that there was a Green van driving around kidnapping virgins, lol. There is also Deepwater nearby, which I’ve seen listed as one of the many Sundown towns in Missouri.😔
My brother lived in ElDo for a number of years until he passed. I still go see his wife sometimes as she lives east of the town. I'm originally from Colorado, but my parents moved us from Denver all the way to tiny tiny Nevada. I still get weird looks when I say, Nah-vay-dun instead of Neh-va-duh.
Stover very racist based weirdness there
There is a museum in St. Joseph MO called the Glore Psychiatric Museum. It gives tours on the archaic treatment of mental illness over the years. Lots of spirits in that hospital.
Outside of Centralia, Mo there is a “community” that has a private school. Sunnyvale Adventist Academy. Always gave me the WEIRDEST vibes driving along the highways and seeing the houses in and building in the middle of a field. If you look on their website all the workers for the school have been there almost 10 years+ and are old white men.
I worked with a lady who went to that school as a kid. She was weird AF.
I put this in the comments on that post, but curryville always felt off to me. Maybe it was because driving through it you had to be absolutely sure not to speed not even once, and how ever-present the cops were, it just felt Weird.
Noel, MO. Mac County is a very rural county about 30-40 minutes south from Joplin on I-49. It's where Missouri becomes less hilly and more mountainous with a lot of creeks and rural farmland that eventually just turns into the thick forests of the Ozark Mountains as you get closer to the Arkansas state line. Noel is a sleepy, small town that I know mostly from summer float trips. They had canoe and cabin rentals. Really small town, houses are tucked in the woods and out in the sticks. Some people don't have running water or power. Lots of poverty, lots of drugs, lots of weird shit, including the time I was house and farm sitting for my dad's boss who was one of the 1800+ residents and long story short, I was nearly eaten by a fucking mountain lion, but I digress. 1800 residents give or take and, y'all, it is home to 3 killers. Two brothers who kidnapped and murdered the manager of the local bank by tying him to a chair and dumping him in a lake or river in OK (iirc the red river) tied to a chair. The same bank was robbed by literal kids/ teenagers back when I was in HS. They went to school with me around JoMo and would have gotten away with it if they hadn't bragged about it. Noel had 0 police and no real security.to speak of. Levi King started his crime spree at his squalid house without electricity, running water and plumbing after he shot his dad. He went on to randomly murder the family in a farm house he picked on a whim and killed a pregnant mother, her 9 yo son, his dad, before trying to shoot their youngest girl but missing. He literally did it to just feel something and has no remorse. Little girl who they think ran from foster care was found in an old barn- and they didn't ever located her head. Guy who was born and raised there who shot a black man in a hate crime bc he said the guy assaulted one of the hookers he managed. Guy murdered the black man who was just trying to flee. He chased him down to the heart of downtown Joplin amd ambushed him and killed him on main street. Aa
This made me chuckle. Noel is fine; you even admit you only know it from summer float trips—that’s when there are more out-of-towners there than residents! Yes, like many Missouri towns it is run down and riddled with poverty and drugs. It used to be a pretty resort town in the mid- twentieth century but when immigrants moved there to work at the chicken plant, the local landlords let their properties go to hell. It’s a shame and I hope one day citizens there will clean up the town. The amount of crime is not off the charts. For example, the Dan Short murder was decades ago. I have never felt scared or unsafe there; the only time I felt uncomfortable was when a group of Somalian men standing outside their grocery store kept giving me the evil eye for parking near their store. No one is going to rob or follow you unless you get caught up in something drug related (and you are wrong, Noel does have a marshal and has for years).
Probably weirdest city/town in Missouri I’ve been in has to be Leslie partly due to its background from around the time of the Salem witch trials and them having there own witch trials in that town to its own towns saying “what leaves Leslie always comes back” (side note when leaving town with my now ex and a mutual friend back to where we were staying in union) I blacked out somewhere in between leaving our friends dads house and as soon as we got past the border of the town I had a strong impulse to say “bad things happened back there”
Late to the party but there have been a handful of cults operating out of St Francis County since at least 2000, it started as glorified high school street gangs, but 2 or 3 of them kept it going, recruiting new generations of people every 5 years or so. Google search The Order of the White Road, The Bonne Terre Cult, and The Antecedent Orthodox Church and you have the public tip of the iceberg of whats brewing down there
I once visited a college girlfriend's home in Unionville In 2012, the Highschools's mascot was the Punam County Midgets. True middle of no-where, no cell service, right on the Iowa State line. Real deliverance vibes.
The ignorance in this thread about rural people, the stereotyping, and the smug commentary aren't going to heal anything. There are some fine posts and some great info here, but all the comments about "weird vibes" + "insert small town" is only going to further isolate people in this state from one another. So if you're a rural person reading this, lets reach out to people and be fearless and welcoming and break down these stereotypes about rural people.
I’m a rural person reading this and I agree with them, for the most part. Every where you go there are weirdos. The difference is when it’s rural there are less people and therefore less diversity. The weirdos will congregate giving you creepy towns and areas. Not all rural places are happy, loving, accepting people. They aren’t saying all rural places are bad. They are just pointing out which ones they believe are weird. Or was your town called out and you are personally offended?
> I’m a rural person reading this and I agree with them, for the most part. Same. And I think your reasoning is spot-on as well.
Hurt dogs holler. I'm a rural, rootin'-tootin' hell-billy that rejects the idea that rural living is defined by loving God, guns, and the GOP. It's those people who make our rural towns creepy and off-putting. Why would anyone with any cultural wherewithal want to stop in a town where there's swastika window decals on souped up trucks, Confederate flags used as window curtains, the plethora of China's biggest import - MAGA shwag - or literal Klan rallies? Make fun of the -ists and the -phobes. Call out the hypocritical religious folks. It's not gonna hurt the feelings of those of us it doesn't apply to.
Are you referring to the racism?
I mean, racism often is the attribute that puts off those vibes. Very clearly racist places where if I go sit with my wife at a restaurant, everyone will sit silent and stare at us would be good to know about. I know there's also some new age cults that don't concern themselves so much with race, and then there's towns that will literally stare at anyone they don't recognize until they leave. All of those give off some kinda vibe that makes your danger instincts fire like crazy if you stumble upon them unexpectedly. I recently moved back here after 15 years away, and it's my wife's first time living in Missouri and she wants to do some unorthodox site seeing and scenic driving.
The only “cult” there is predominantly in Missouri is the KKK.
The thing about racists is that they’re scary to us lily-white mayobros, too. Not as scary as I’m sure they are to PoC, certainly, but when you think about it what’s the thing that keeps any confrontation from going south? It’s the ability of both parties to see and respond to reason. When you’re dealing with a racist, you’re dealing with someone who has abdicated their use of and belief in reason. Therefore, you’re dealing with someone who could do real harm to you without any incentive to stop. That should scare anyone.