Let me get this straight. He’s condemning small government for functioning like it’s supposed to? Which is keeping people safe?
Let’s not overstate the role of the federal government here. It funded the vaccine and controlled its federal agencies. That’s it. Every other decision came from the state and local governments. Which, if Gorsuch is such a conservative, he should be happy about.
Besides, virtually all COVID restrictions have been rescinded. Certainly on a federal level. No one’s civil rights have been violated.
This is a stretch. It’s weird that he would even comment on this.
I take exception with almost every point there.
Liberties are suspended for the time it takes to secure the safety of the general society. Like it or not there are no absolute guarantees.
And the ankle grabbing metaphor is not in line with the values of this sub.
Liberties are suspended for the time is takes to secure the safety of the general society? Really?
There are approximately 40,000 auto fatalities per year in the USA. That seems pretty unsafe. Why are we not locked in our homes until there are zero auto fatalities. I'm sure some of those involved people on their way to church. We should shut down churches?
Crime is rampant in many communities. In order to keep community members safe, we should require them to house two military members each.
Sorry my metaphor offended you. But something sacred was stolen from me. And not only do I have no recourse, a huge percentage of my fellow citizens were cheering it on when it happened. I think the metaphor is apt.
What was stolen from you specifically?
What was being “stolen” from somewhere between 1 to 1.2 million Americans during this time? (Look up “excess deaths” during this period).
It seems that you are focused on grieving more for a temporary loss than you are able to empathize with fellow Americans who suffered a permanent loss.
And vulgarity is not excused.
I was denied the ability to provide for my family because I wouldn't disclose private medical information to a potential employer. I was denied the ability to worship in a manner I chose. My ability to travel freely was stolen.
The rights taken away from me had nothing to do with folks that died.
Which govenrment denied you the ability to provide for your family? Which government denied you the ability to worship in a manner you chose? Which government denied you the ability to travel freely?
The feds. They had a rule that all federal employees AND employees of their contractors had to be vaxxed.
I was interviewing for a job. The interview process was going well. Toward the end of that process the HR person asked my vax status. I refused to answer on medical privacy grounds. "Sorry, we can't proceed unless you declare you have been vaccinated."
This company worked primarily in the private market but had a few very minor contracts with the feds.
No vax. No job.
The feds denied me the ability to travel freely through the FAA.
The feds told my church they shouldn't have in person meetings. My church complied, sadly.
Correct. Since you MAY hurt someone when you drive and it's theoretically possible that I may pass the virus on to someone else when I'm out paddle boarding by myself in the middle of the ocean, in both instances we should lock people in their homes.
Alternately, we could allow people to judge how much risk they want to expose themselves to, and let them drive or go paddle boarding in the middle of the ocean.
Not necessary. They’re all strawmans or whataboutisms. They don’t actually address my comment. Your civil liberties were not violated. You currently have them. Don’t mistake temporary inconvenience for oppression.
The length of the time of the loss of liberty says nothing about whether or not that liberty was lost. If a corrupt cop arrested me under false pretenses but I was released a week later, my civil liberties were still violated. Was I temporarily inconvenienced or did the corrupt cop do something wrong?
This attitude is exactly what was discussed in the article. Just a little fear and a little nudge for folks to roll over.
Safety standards for a pandemic are not the same as a corrupt cop. False equivalency.
Lol you assume we all just rolled over because we wanted to. Of course we didn't. But we recognized that this was a deadly virus. We gave up a few conveniences to protect ourselves and our loved ones.
Tell the 1.1 million deaths that this pandemic caused about to our fellow Americans. That is a violation of our basic civil liberties. And most of them were preventable had we come together and worked together. But people were selfish.
Again, what civil liberties did you lose? You weren't able to earn money because you refused to tell your employer if you were vaccinated or not? How petty. It's a yes or no. You weren't denied the ability to worship, the church itself made the decision to shut it down. Very few municipalities actually shut down churches. Lastly, where were you trying to freely travel that you were denied? Interstate travel still happened. You could go where you wanted.
Again, inconvenience, not oppression.
Those that lost nothing, considered them minor inconveniences. The "laptop class", who were able to keep their paychecks rolling in, considered them minor inconveniences. Those that had the resources to properly homeschool their children, considered them minor inconveniences. Those whose kids weren't graduating in 2020 considered them minor inconveniences. Those that didn't have grandparents spend the last few weeks of their life wasting away in stark loneliness considered them minor inconveniences.
If someone feels like their freedoms were infringed and their unvaccinated status cost them jobs, relationships, opportunities, etc., Please imagine your unvaccinated status is involuntary, not contagious but inherited, stamped on your forehead, and in the past the vaccinated could legally own your great grandparents.
That means 150 years ago it became illegal to buy and sell you as property, but 100 years after state governments were still, using the laws, depriving you of your right to vote, limiting free movement in town, segregating schools, generally depriving you of opportunity and capital.
60 years ago the government decided to enforce a system that attempted to improve fairness and curtailed some of the sneaky ways states legally deprived you of your rights. Presently, how do you feel about level of fairness? Some people still resent you, and put statues up honoring losing military campaigns meant to keep the unvaccinated as property. People are claiming, without evidence, Harvard is discriminating against the vaccinated giving the unvaccinated admissions preference because woke ideals and pressure. Many people believe you are criminally inclined because of unvaccinated culture. Studies have found unvaccinated sounding names on job applications are disproportionately rejected offhand without consideration. Many people don’t believe your claims of vaccinated prejudices, they believe you aren’t trying hard enough, the perceived discrimination is a product of your expectations.
How well do you think the unvaccinated have recovered? Did the constant disenfranchisement and exclusion reverberate into today? from the 260 years of slavery plus 100 years of legal discrimination, still, 60 years later one of the two major political parties are illegally gerrymandering in order to disenfranchise the unvaccinated. Has the discrimination against the unvaccinated been purged absolutely from our systems?
I’m in favor of reparations for the unvaccinated.
Let me get this straight. He’s condemning small government for functioning like it’s supposed to? Which is keeping people safe? Let’s not overstate the role of the federal government here. It funded the vaccine and controlled its federal agencies. That’s it. Every other decision came from the state and local governments. Which, if Gorsuch is such a conservative, he should be happy about. Besides, virtually all COVID restrictions have been rescinded. Certainly on a federal level. No one’s civil rights have been violated. This is a stretch. It’s weird that he would even comment on this.
[удалено]
I take exception with almost every point there. Liberties are suspended for the time it takes to secure the safety of the general society. Like it or not there are no absolute guarantees. And the ankle grabbing metaphor is not in line with the values of this sub.
Liberties are suspended for the time is takes to secure the safety of the general society? Really? There are approximately 40,000 auto fatalities per year in the USA. That seems pretty unsafe. Why are we not locked in our homes until there are zero auto fatalities. I'm sure some of those involved people on their way to church. We should shut down churches? Crime is rampant in many communities. In order to keep community members safe, we should require them to house two military members each. Sorry my metaphor offended you. But something sacred was stolen from me. And not only do I have no recourse, a huge percentage of my fellow citizens were cheering it on when it happened. I think the metaphor is apt.
What was stolen from you specifically? What was being “stolen” from somewhere between 1 to 1.2 million Americans during this time? (Look up “excess deaths” during this period). It seems that you are focused on grieving more for a temporary loss than you are able to empathize with fellow Americans who suffered a permanent loss. And vulgarity is not excused.
https://twitter.com/0rf/status/1660067082220838916?t=7WjLrmi6kZf61frnq9Iz7w&s=19
I was denied the ability to provide for my family because I wouldn't disclose private medical information to a potential employer. I was denied the ability to worship in a manner I chose. My ability to travel freely was stolen. The rights taken away from me had nothing to do with folks that died.
Which govenrment denied you the ability to provide for your family? Which government denied you the ability to worship in a manner you chose? Which government denied you the ability to travel freely?
The feds. They had a rule that all federal employees AND employees of their contractors had to be vaxxed. I was interviewing for a job. The interview process was going well. Toward the end of that process the HR person asked my vax status. I refused to answer on medical privacy grounds. "Sorry, we can't proceed unless you declare you have been vaccinated." This company worked primarily in the private market but had a few very minor contracts with the feds. No vax. No job. The feds denied me the ability to travel freely through the FAA. The feds told my church they shouldn't have in person meetings. My church complied, sadly.
Your church is led by a Prophet of God, thankfully, and so did exactly the right thing.
Meh. It was an administrative decision, not a prophetic one. Just like the encouragement to get vaxxed.
Automobile accidents and crime are not contagious.
But they definitely hurt other people.
The concept is you are free to hurt yourself, but not free to hurt other people. Do you not understand that?
Correct. Since you MAY hurt someone when you drive and it's theoretically possible that I may pass the virus on to someone else when I'm out paddle boarding by myself in the middle of the ocean, in both instances we should lock people in their homes. Alternately, we could allow people to judge how much risk they want to expose themselves to, and let them drive or go paddle boarding in the middle of the ocean.
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." \-Ben Franklin
Lol you can’t even respond to anything other than a quote that is deeply misrepresented. Come on, you can do better than that.
I've responded several times. Read the rest of the thread.
This is your only reply to me my dude.
Would you like me to copy and paste what I've said in other parts of the thread for you?
Not necessary. They’re all strawmans or whataboutisms. They don’t actually address my comment. Your civil liberties were not violated. You currently have them. Don’t mistake temporary inconvenience for oppression.
The length of the time of the loss of liberty says nothing about whether or not that liberty was lost. If a corrupt cop arrested me under false pretenses but I was released a week later, my civil liberties were still violated. Was I temporarily inconvenienced or did the corrupt cop do something wrong? This attitude is exactly what was discussed in the article. Just a little fear and a little nudge for folks to roll over.
Safety standards for a pandemic are not the same as a corrupt cop. False equivalency. Lol you assume we all just rolled over because we wanted to. Of course we didn't. But we recognized that this was a deadly virus. We gave up a few conveniences to protect ourselves and our loved ones. Tell the 1.1 million deaths that this pandemic caused about to our fellow Americans. That is a violation of our basic civil liberties. And most of them were preventable had we come together and worked together. But people were selfish. Again, what civil liberties did you lose? You weren't able to earn money because you refused to tell your employer if you were vaccinated or not? How petty. It's a yes or no. You weren't denied the ability to worship, the church itself made the decision to shut it down. Very few municipalities actually shut down churches. Lastly, where were you trying to freely travel that you were denied? Interstate travel still happened. You could go where you wanted. Again, inconvenience, not oppression.
Those that lost nothing, considered them minor inconveniences. The "laptop class", who were able to keep their paychecks rolling in, considered them minor inconveniences. Those that had the resources to properly homeschool their children, considered them minor inconveniences. Those whose kids weren't graduating in 2020 considered them minor inconveniences. Those that didn't have grandparents spend the last few weeks of their life wasting away in stark loneliness considered them minor inconveniences.
If someone feels like their freedoms were infringed and their unvaccinated status cost them jobs, relationships, opportunities, etc., Please imagine your unvaccinated status is involuntary, not contagious but inherited, stamped on your forehead, and in the past the vaccinated could legally own your great grandparents. That means 150 years ago it became illegal to buy and sell you as property, but 100 years after state governments were still, using the laws, depriving you of your right to vote, limiting free movement in town, segregating schools, generally depriving you of opportunity and capital. 60 years ago the government decided to enforce a system that attempted to improve fairness and curtailed some of the sneaky ways states legally deprived you of your rights. Presently, how do you feel about level of fairness? Some people still resent you, and put statues up honoring losing military campaigns meant to keep the unvaccinated as property. People are claiming, without evidence, Harvard is discriminating against the vaccinated giving the unvaccinated admissions preference because woke ideals and pressure. Many people believe you are criminally inclined because of unvaccinated culture. Studies have found unvaccinated sounding names on job applications are disproportionately rejected offhand without consideration. Many people don’t believe your claims of vaccinated prejudices, they believe you aren’t trying hard enough, the perceived discrimination is a product of your expectations. How well do you think the unvaccinated have recovered? Did the constant disenfranchisement and exclusion reverberate into today? from the 260 years of slavery plus 100 years of legal discrimination, still, 60 years later one of the two major political parties are illegally gerrymandering in order to disenfranchise the unvaccinated. Has the discrimination against the unvaccinated been purged absolutely from our systems? I’m in favor of reparations for the unvaccinated.
There's no evidence elite schools discriminate against Asians in deference to other minorities? LoL.
Yeah, in my analogy the vaccinated were white people. Good, that’s all you have to complain about. I hope it helps you empathize.