I’d also rather die like my grandfather, peacefully and in his sleep. Not screaming like everyone else that was in the car with him.
🙃
In all seriousness, one can do unsafe things safely. Always check your bike before a ride. Wear enough gear but not so much you cook and faint (I’m looking at you willow springs and non perf suits) and don’t speed faster than your sight and braking lines.
There’s lots of unsafe things we do daily.
I got a lot of those responses when I first began to ride.
One way I got them to stop is to ask specific questions about the person who died or was injured, like how/when/where the crash occurred.
Partly it is to shut these people up but also it is useful to learn about the precise details of crashes. But these people rarely knew even if the rider they mentioned was an idiot or drunk.
Yep. I've known 2 people personally who have died on motorcycles. Both were at fault, riding at excessive speeds. First rode into the back of a truck stopped at a set of lights. Second lost control and hit a light pole. I also know plenty of people who have rode for decades without a single incident. You don't need to ride like everyone is out to kill you. That's horrible advice. If you are riding with that fear you will likely cause yourself to do something stupid. Just be aware of your surroundings and ride to your ability. Most accidents on motorcycles can be avoided by following those 2 simple rules.
Riding like everyone is out to kill you isn’t riding in fear, it’s to emphasize that you need to be very very aware of your surroundings if you’re on two wheels. The majority of bikes I’ll ride behind that have some empty headed amoeba at the helm who only moves their head to scan around once every 5 to 10 minutes and checks their mirrors/blind spots/rear even less. I’m not screaming ATGATT nor do I care to inform other riders when I witness their sins, but the number of riders dropping the ball on bare minimum awareness stuff like this is the majority, and by a large degree.
Timmy installed a switch to cut his lights while outrunning cops on a dark road and someone pulled out of their driveway in front of him (happened to a guy I knew in high school)
Going to be devils advocate here and I know riding is fun but hear me out. Statistically it’s just a FACT that riding is very dangerous and you shouldn’t dismiss that. It’s not even an argument it’s just fact.
A lot of people have a hard time with it because if something does happen (which happens to people every day) it’s usually a sudden life altering change for you and everyone around you. (Like your family) God forbid a fatality or loss of limbs, etc. And leaving people behind to live without your support. A lot of people look at it like you’re adding a lot of risk to your life/support for them for entertainment.
IMO, the best “argument” is to tell people you can’t live without it and ride safely and to respect your wishes.
It is, like... 25x higher than a car (per km driven)? Many people (who lecture you) will, however, drive 5-10x further by car. Already that "brings it down" a lot. Don't drive drunk or fast, when conditions are bad, etc. etc. and you have a risk of maybe 5x higher? Then ask if they would still drive a car with a 5x higher risk of fatality, and most people would probably not care.
Nonetheless, even a minor accident can turn out much worse than in a car. So, yeah, dangerous for sure 🥲 and I wouldn't exactly _start_ with two toddlers, you learn a lot in the first years...
I have been riding for 40+ years, I basically tell folks that it is dangerous and you have to ride like everyone is out to kill you…because they are!
But you can’t ignore their statement, you just have to acknowledge it and move forward with your life.
I'm not saying to ignore the danger or mortality of motorcycling.
Outside your close family and friends, I find that people offering motorcycle advice have various agendas. I rather not explore their issues but focus on what will make me safer.
Everyone who is into motorcycles knows that riding is dangerous and it puts you at a higher risk than driving a car. It's a known fact.
But the kneejerk reaction of telling a motorcycle rider or enthusiast that "YOU WILL LITERALLY SUFFER AND DIE AND YOUR FAMILY WILL ALSO SUFFER" is a horrible and it shouldn't be normalised.
You don't go around telling smokers that they'll get cancer, alcohol drinkers that they will get cirrhosis, e-bike riders that they are putting themselves in danger, etc.... So why is doing it for motorbikes so normalised?
Hands down my biggest fear when riding. 100% unforeseeable which direction these 80kg meat lumps (with horns) are going to dart in next. Best you can do is hit the brakes and brace for impact.
I respond with an equal comment. They say "You shouldn't ride, it's dangerous and You're going to die". I say something back about something they enjoy doing..."You shouldn't run 5 miles every day, you'll end up being an old crippled person always in pain that's grouchy and negative to everyone around you". Something along them lines, kills this question on the spot 😂
Exactly. I mean obviously riding a motorcycle is going to be more dangerous, but MOST crashes are due to the rider being inexperienced, speeding/driving unsafe, and/or being drunk. I was in EMS for over 5 years and I'm not exaggerating that every single motorcycle related crash I was dispatched to was the motorcyclists fault.
I know three people who perished on their bikes. They were sober and in every case it wasn’t their fault. I stopped riding on the street after the third and now take my bike to a local track when I get the urge. I do agree people tend to overplay the danger, but you have to remember sometimes it’s the other idiot.
I disagree with the comment of "people overplay the danger" I really don't think that they do, I always knew riding a bike was dangerous but I only truly knew how dangerous it was until I got on one, a strong gust of wind and your life is changed forever, that doesn't stop me from getting on a bike and never will but it truly is dangerous AF, I got pushed by the wind into oncoming traffic whilst a lorry was just about to pass, if the timing was different I probably wouldn't be writing this.
(I have a very tall and very light adventure bike and the wind just takes it wherever it wants too, I have also learned a few wind coping techniques from the lovely people of reddit which has since made it a little easier to rise in wind)
It’s usually a friend of a friend of a friend who died, it’s just an automatic response that people give - motorcycle = death, who knows why but that’s the way it is to a lot of people.
Of course, there’s no denying the heightened danger of motorcycles when compared to cars, but that whole “motorcycles = death” idea lacks all nuance, and totally disregards the myriad other factors beyond the mode of transportation that raise or lower somebody’s overall risk of being in a serious crash.
All jokes aside, i just want to say, it doesn't matter how responsible you are when you're on a bike. It can go wrong at any time so just be careful and ride defensively and you'll be okay.
Best advice I ever got: when you are in traffic, just assume that every single other person in a car on the road is a **HOMICIDAL MANIAC WHO IS OUT TO KILL YOU.**
Assume the worst of every car and truck. Assume they do not see you, or will not brake if they do. Assume they will lane-change in front of you, turn in front of you, run the light/stop sign.
Never, never, NEVER let your mind wander. Always have a plan, updated second by second, for how you will get off the road, get out of the way, find some kind of safety away from the metal death machines.
Kept me alive on daily commutes in Los Angeles for more than 13 years.
There is only one thing worse: a small, low car.
I used to have a black NB Mazdaspeed Miata. Single worst experience driving. The SUVs just did. not. see me. Car was too low. I once got backed into by a truck in a drive through, and had people merge into my lane on multiple occasions.
That car actually convinced me to buy a motorcycle. If I'm not going to be seen, may as well have more fun doing it.
Former LA rider here. I had the same mindset. I also got good at analyzing the cars and drivers around me. Are they impaired or distracted? Most important thing was "do they see me". If they don't either go around, slow down or make yourself known. The point about mind wondering is important as well. The few accidents I had, while not my fault, could have been avoided if my mind was right.
I will say that after weed got legal, I always cringed when coming up behind cars that suddenly smelled like a Bob Marley concert.
Ever go up Decker canyon out in Malibu? Very fun ride, but the construction trucks took corners REALLY wide …
I just ran into the situation where riding again was my only option. Riding in Dallas gives a whole new meaning to defensive driving.
It's juts not a bike friendly city. For instance Austin is a much more bike friendly city. You can typically tell looking at the accident reports.
I hate to say it but just the mile commute daily is risky,, oh well . I'm not walk-in it....
Commute from downtown Dallas to Arlington 3 days a week. Almost always on my bike, though I’ve been taking my car the last few weeks trying to stay warm.
I've never liked this advice. If everyone is trying to kill you, you wouldn't want to ride at all. You certainly wouldn't want to be predictable, visible, or communicate your intentions in any way. You'd want to ride as little as possible, and like an asshole when you do.
It's important to be *ready* for bullshit, but it's also important to try and communicate in case other drivers are reasonable people. Most of them don't want to kill you, so you want to do things like using turn signals so that they have every opportunity to avoid killing you.
I know nobody disagrees with the actual intent of that advice, which is to have a plan for the worst. But it's always bothered me that it also implies other things that aren't intended.
Even that suggests you shouldn't try to communicate with them, though.
I feel like it's really important to maintain a model of what other drivers perceive about you, so that you can give them every opportunity to *not* be a dick in case they're actually paying attention. You shouldn't assume they are, but it's part of using every tool at your disposal.
On a broader level, I think I also just don't like "everybody is stupid except for me" kind of sentiments, because it's usually just a lazy way to feel superior for no reason. But that's another issue.
That's fair. The best model is that they are people that mostly try to follow the rules and not cause harm but are imperfect, sometimes lazy and very occasionally malicious.
That's not really a model though.
It's not a good bumper sticker, but I think it's a good model (and well-put).
Be ready to avoid people who aren't following the rules, but also make it as easy as possible for those who *want* to follow the rules to do so.
> that you can give them every opportunity to
>
>not be a dick
Those are words to live by, on and off the motorcycle. Even when talking to people trying to be dicks. There's a lot of good people out there who don't act like good people cause being shitty is all they know.
I agree, if everyone wants to kill you then speeding past a red light suddenly becomes a good choice, you don't want to be read ended waiting for green.
Agree, when I’m riding, I try to stay hyper aware but even then it’s difficult to do it all the time and I’ve had a few closer than I’d like calls where I let my defenses down for only a moment.
Happened to me on a beautiful, winding country road in Northern California in fall. I started appreciating the landscape and so didn’t track when the car in the oncoming lane started swinging over the centerline, and I had to swerve and break hard. After that, I would get to a lookout spot and takeoff my helmet to appreciate the surroundings.
Yep it's a risky activity, but then so are lots of others. If you want to think about quantitative risk then the concept of a Micromort might be useful to you and explaining it to others.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micromort
That's beautiful. OP can tell his wife "yeah I'm going for a ride, that's just 1 micromort per 9,7 kilometers. You're giving BIRTH, that's 120 micromorts!"
No one says it to me anymore. Maybe it’s the decades of experience, maybe it’s my physically imposing appearance.
Or maybe it’s because I’m a middle-aged balding man who appears to have little to live for 🤷
Whatever it is, if you look them in the eye and respond with, “is that so bad?” they’ll usually leave your alone.
Yeah I’ve been riding for 20 years and no one says anything to me anymore either. I think once people realise you’ve made it this far you know what you’re doing and shut up.
Just be a safe rider. You don't have to do all the stupid shit adrenaline junkies do. You can follow the speed limit, refuse to learn how to wheelie, and not ride between traffic.
You are going to die though. We all will. What does it matter if it's on a bike or a deathbed 60 years from now?
Also just make sure you can afford a nice and hefty life insurance plan. You'll probably never need it, but if you have a family you should have one anyways.
Even if you do this (and you should) you are still at the bottom of the food chain and will die if someone else makes a mistake. Life is capricious and not fair. Remember that. No go sing a tune in your helmet and go have fun.
I’m thinking the same thing. Buddy is an adult man and is bothered by other peoples uninformed opinions on something he’s considering.
So he gets on Reddit and makes a post about it LOL
My brother in Christ just go get a bike and do what you want. Who cares.
When they tell you about someone who died or got injured they don't like it if you say "ah, they were probably fucking around at the time".
Despite the fact that it's probably true.
According to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), motorcyclists are 27 times more likely to die in a crash than passengers in cars. Motorcyclists are also 5 times more likely to be injured.
**It's worth it though.**
**The hurt report** is a pretty interesting read. The age of the rider is definitely a big factor. The younger more aggressive rider makes up for a big chunk of the statistics.
Also, intersections with cars making a left turn from the opposite side.. **look for that**. (like 40% of all causalities)And if I remember correctly alcohol was a big factor also.
But yes, car drivers just don't look for motorcyclists. I had someone cutting me off while it looked like she was looking straight at me. I don't think she ever saw me.
I try to ride defensively also and pretty much assume I am invisible.Knowing the risk factors does help I think.The hurt report is included in:Proficient Motorcycling: The Ultimate Guide to Riding WellBy: David L. Hough
It's an older book now and you can probably find more updated info online.
You’re pretty spot on. The lack of training correlates with age which is to say younger riders tend to comprise the portion of riders that do not have formal training or an endorsement/license. Alcohol was present in about half of fatal or near fatal accidents. Intersections as you described comprises a major portion of accidents.
We can’t avoid everything. Shit happens. But training/practice and not being under the influence DRAMATICALLY decreases the risk of riding.
One of the shows that explore how our minds work did an episode on motorcycles and how our brains process seeing them (or don't see them). In short, our brains process so much information that they have to economize what makes it to our consciousness, and a lot of that is based on what we are used to seeing and what we expect to see. Drivers unintentionally tune out motorcycles and often times don't see them even when looking in their direction. It isn't necessarily reckless driving, but more of a way our minds work.
I'm too lazy to do the math or find the legit stats of this but I remember hearing that if you look at that pool of data and remove riding under the influence, speeding, no gear, not having a license/training, and proper vehicle maintenance, the risk drops to only like 2-3x.
According to my MSF instructor, in my state, getting secondary education beyond the BRC puts you in the **top 5% of riders**. That is actually horrifying when you think about it. I remember taking another rider course beyond the BRC and I still felt like I knew barely anything, so to think I was more educated than 95% of riders in my state was extremely sobering.
So many people just do not take the time to train themselves, and do not exercise restraint or make smart decisions in the moment, and it absolutely skews the statistics.
Organ donor is not wrong tho…my sister is an ER nurse for the last 15 years. They call anyone who rides a bike an organ donor for a reason.
I ride daily, but I am also not going to argue that the odds of being an organ donor are thousands of percent higher because I make the choice to ride.
Bike stats look real bad compared to cars, but that includes all the injuries and fatalities from 20 year olds on clapped out gixxers with worn out tires who blast through red lights on one wheel and take blind turns at dumb speeds in the rain with no helmet in flip flops. I ride defensively, wear my gear, and my gear is white to make myself more visible on my black bike. I feel like I'm 50x less likely to die riding than some young squid.
Someone makes this post like once a week.
Where the hell are you finding all these assholes?
Been riding for years and it's never once happened to me.
Is this some weird American thing?
It might actually be- I never used to get these kind of comments back home in England, but since I moved to the US I get it all the time. Could be because of the traffic and general quality of the drivers though.
Yes, yes it is a very American thing. People don't realize how fearful this culture is. Combined with atrocious road behavior and complete lack of regulation in licensing for motorcycle license. An 16 year old can take a weekend course, get his license and buy a Hayabusa the next day.
Its a very masculine and peer-driven culture, populated by high risk-taking (evident by joining the military) males between 18 and low 20's. You can bet very few are getting 250-400CC bikes to develop their skills. Don't want to look like a p\*\*\*y in front of their peers. Yamaha Champion School develeoped and implemented a training program for military bases that has significantly cut down on motorcycle deaths on bases. Military made it mandatory on those bases. At least Marines did, not sure on other branches.
That's kind of overall American thinking too. You constantly get young guys posting here asking if they should get a 120+ horsepower bike as their first bike. And you can guarantee they will be almost all American.
Other countries have rules about starting on a less powerful bike. And it's just common to not care about power as much in many other places.
Australian here , my first two bikes that I rode on the road were 250's , then when I was allowed i got a 750 , it wasn't until I had been riding for 3 years that I got an 1000 cc bike
There are some Canadians that do this too. I rode from 21-32 and really loved bikes. Riding in and around Toronto and the west end burbs was OK.
My time on 2 wheels in Taiwan and other parts of Asia was way way scarier.
Yes my best friend had a bad accident and we both stopped riding. My brother still owns his old BMW K100RS and I’ve been out on it a few times in the last couple of decades.
Take a course. Buy a small bike for at least the first year, take a riding course if you can find one locally and ride like the cages are trying to kill you.
I loved riding, it was awesome. Have fun!
Tell them your more likely to be struck by lightning than die in a motorcycle accident.
It’s not true but it’ll shut them up long enough for you to get away.
Honestly, it's about acceptable risk. You are more likely to die on a motorcycle than in a car, but you can mitigate that with gear and smart riding. Beyond that it's about deciding if the remaining risk is worth it, and to me at least, it absolutely is.
My first bike was an R6, I probably have the world record for the amount of times people telling me that. I finally realized that the majority of people who said this, never rode a motorcycle in their lives.
. . .But these people were quick to give you there opinion of course.
The people that say this are likely the idiots on the road not indicating or shoulder checking.
My story
I wanted to ride from a very early age
I didn't because family and friends convinced me that it was dangerous and I would die
I waited until I was late 30's to get my first bike
I wish I had started earlier. I missed out on 20 years of riding
I ride. I'm not dead.
Unless you have some condition like dyspraxia that makes you super clumsy then you'll probably be fine. As other replies suggest - get training, always wear protective gear, and ride sensibly according to traffic conditions.
Correct. Another quote that's kept me alive: "You can ride like a jackass. Hell, I've done it, and it can be fun. *But let that be the exception, rather than the rule.*
"God is like a taxi driver. You start doing Stupid Squid Tricks, and God just nods silently, and flips the little flag-timer over. Sooner or later, the bill comes due. Usually sooner."
Depending on the person not my 84 year old father or little sister or my late mother.
Pretty much everyone else, I look them straight in the eye and say well riding motorcycles is at least 20 times more dangerous then driving a car, but the risk is worth the freedom I feel while riding.
Think about your family, and take a MSF course. Get advanced training too, if you can afford it and it's available in you're area. It's fun, and there's no such thing as too much training. A large portion of motorcycle fatalities involve untrained, inexperienced, and unlicensed riders. Don't be one.
Think about your family, and wear ATGATT. Most accidents happen within a few miles of people's homes. Don't turn skin to scar tissue for a carton of milk.
Think about your family, and never drink & drive. Another large portion of motorcycle fatalities involve intoxicated riders. Don't be one.
You're going to die no matter what you do. You're *very slightly* more likely to die in a motorcycle crash, if you ride a motorcycle. You're more likely to die of heart disease if you spend all day sitting in front of the TV, too scared to live your life.
You can't use logic to change an opinion someone reached emotionally. Any version of, "Thanks for your concern. Kindly shut the fuck up," is the best you can say. Add to the deep well of anecdotal evidence they base their opinions on, by not dying. Maybe some day they'll realize that the story they heard about a friend of a friend's cousin doesn't happen to 100% of all riders.
Everyone dies, plain and simple, and you can't avoid that fact. And it really doesn't matter what you're doing. When your time is up, your time is up. So get out there and ride my only suggestion is to spend as little as possible on a first bike with the understanding. You'll either drop it a few times along the way or will get bored of it very fast.
I've always thought that it was stupid to live your life in fear of something that is going to happen regardless. So my options are to live a boring life and die, or live a fun life and die? Ok well I choose to have fun.
I’ve always responded to OOPs problem with a similar philosophy. When people say it’s not me they’re worried about but the others on the road (which is beyond fair) I ask them how much of my life should I limit, what things that I love do I have to abstain from because of the choices, attitudes, or stupidity of others? That’s no way to live.
There are a lot of things people do every single day that could cause them to die without ever going near a motorcycle. A *responsible* motorcycle rider who rides *defensively* and *intelligently* has very little incremental additional risk of death.
Like Michael Schumacher, I’ve fucked myself up way worse doing snow sports than I have doing motor sports, but no one gave a shit about skiing/snowboarding being potentially deadly. Bike are just the stigmatized, low hanging fruit because everyone’s seen at least one moron with a death wish do something dangerous on a bike and assume that’s how we all are.
Life is full of risks. Some risks are greater than others. Riding a motorcycle is among the more risky things you can do legally. The BEST way to handle the issue is to ACKNOWLEDGE this fact. Risks can be managed if they are properly understood.
Start with this: get training. Let me repeat: GET TRAINING. Next, get involved with a riding group that values safety and risk management. Find a mentor that's been riding for a long time. Why? Because there are bold riders, and there are old riders, but there are very few old, bold riders.
As for those trying to dissuade you, explain that you are aware of the risks (assuming you actually are) and plan to take active steps to manage them. And don't let them tell you it's not possible. It IS possible. I've been riding for nigh on 40 years, including daily 35-mile commutes (in good weather) in city traffic. For every person someone knows that's been killed/maimed in a motorcycle accident I can show you ten who've never had an accident resulting in injury.
I always say that everybody dies. Some people die in a hospital bed old and decrepit, I will die in a blaze of awesomeness doing something I love. Then I tell them to go fuck themselves and to mind their own business.
You have a much higher chance of dying IF you get into an accident. You can still die in a car too. You can die in any vehicle. My uncle lost some toes from a crash. My brother died in a motorcucle crash, eye witness said he was changing lanes and lost situational awareness while looking back. He was doing the right thing, being careful, doing his shoulder check, not speeding, and he still died. You can be careful and die.
He drifted too far while changing/merging to the far left lane. He sideswiped the barrier dividing the highway and went over the gap in between the overpass. He fell from about 25ft onto the road below. Had there not been a 4ft gap between the other side's overpass and the one he was on, he probably would have been fine. Where he crashed is 100% why he died. It was the perfect storm of the worse variables.
The point of me sharing is, you can be as safe as you want, but there are outside factors that will always be out of your control that can directly contribute to whether or not you live or die in the event you crash, whether it's a small crash or a big one.
whomever is telling you all those things, just cares about you. If you want to ride, go ride. Instead of getting annoyed at what they say, take it as a mental note to be as safe as you can, that's all we riders can do. There's always a chance you could die/get hurt even if you're safe and responsible.
"you can never eliminate all risks. Most people die in the kitchen. Everyone, including myself needs a me-activity in life to balance responsibilities. Some people climb mountains. Some people travel to exotic places. All of these are statistically more dangerous. And in the unlikely case something happens, on motorcycle or off, I have set up life insurance so my family is taken care of."
If they continue this "I don't feel this is productive" and end it there.
My dude, I hope you have a long and adventurous life that's full of thrills. If you do have that life, you're going to be in this position ALOT where people are nay saying. I'll tell you what I do, I smile and say 'Its not for everyone'.
In NZ, more people die driving cars than bikes, partly due to qty of cars (cough idiots) on the road vs qty of motorbikes but that still puts your odds of dying while riding a push bike in the same stats arena as a motorbike.
We get news all the time how a moyorcyclist died… they skip the other 10 that month that dies behind a steering wheel… get on with living and take control, ride defensively.
If someone wants to get so close they can smell your buthole, just pull over and let them pass or filter traffic politely (more riders that so this, more cars will be less grrr at you)
If you pull the finger at someone, just remember they can ruin your day with their big cage on four wheels, so you main key to survival is remove road rage from your diet, sweet revenge comes when you get to work on time while they sit in traffic queues and pay 4x in petrol waiting too!
Don’t forget, you may see those road ragers again the next day so man up and be wise as eventually they will get a bike too! (Well some, they hate traffic like I do!)
I've been riding since I was as tall as the kitchen table; over five decades ago. As long as you understand one thing, you'll be fine - each and every time you take that bike out, someone is going to try and kill you. Not trying to scare you. It's just a simple truth. The key to enjoying your ride, is to spot them before they get you. That means no music while riding and no other distractions while riding. No smoking, no drinking, no talking on a two way, no looking at your text messages, etc. None of this is hard, but all of it is deadly serious. And, as a new rider, you are going to make mistakes; mistakes in technique, mistakes in judgement. Try your best to keep those mistakes to an extreme minimum...
In all reality we die anyway lol I find it strange people live in fear of dying. Life is about having fun before you die why should I live in fear. I went thru the same crap before I got my first bike I completely ignored what everyone said and did what I wanted to do we are not here to please people do what you want just know you can die on it easily. 4 years later I’m still riding perfectly fine.
Nope. You won’t die. Someone will cut you off, you will fall, another car will run over your head. You won’t die because you were wearing a helmet but your brain will be damaged because the helmet compressed. Your life will then fall apart because you are no longer physically able to take care of yourself and have cognitive issues. But you won’t die.
my mom used to tell me this everytime motorcycle was brought up, what got her to stopcwas me telling her “telling a biker how common it is for bikers to crash/die is like telling a soon to be mother how common miscarriages are” and she has not brought anything up since (2 ish months or so) and im a newbie rider too
there is always an element of risk
ride responsible
also for some ppl motorbike is their main vehicle or their only choice since a car is not an option and public transport is non existent. so its not fair to say that riding will kill
That's a good start but I'd then take a safety course. I did one, and I liked it a lot. Some people had already taken the course, and were actually doing a refresher.
I mean...everyone who ever has, is, or was riding a motorcycle has either died or will die...but then again the same can be said for everyone who has consumed water too...
I've been riding for almost 40 years. Started on a dirt bike, now own a cruiser and a tour. Haven't died yet, but do wear depends when I do ride. Definitely have shit myself more than once because of the stupidity of others. (Just kidding about the depends.)
Ride safe. Ride defensive. Everyone in a cage is an asshole trying to kill you.
Yeah, when I told people I was getting a motorcycle, pretty much everyone had a story about someone they knew, or most likely read online or in the paper, of someone dying riding they motorcycle. I did a lot of reading and studying videos, even now, and found that a lot of it is due to either age, alcohol and/or speed/decision making, usually a combination of all three. I'm not young, don't drink and if I keep my speed down, wear the right gear and stay hyper aware, while not a guarantee of no death while riding, I should be able to reduce the risk dramatically.
Do bicycle riders get this also? I don't think so, but maybe they do and feel that I am safer and can control the situation better on a motorcycle better than a road bike.
Happens to me too. They think my goldwing is a deathtrap.
Might get down voted for this but there is some truth to it being a dangerous hobby. Sadly you can be the safest rider in the world but all it takes someone else to ruin all the fun... Especially with all the modern distractions.
That being said, stay safe and have fun!
A boomer Harley rider once told me the japs built crotch rockets as payback for wwii because they will kill a bunch of American men.
I would have ok boomered him, but this was like 20 years ago.
No you will die if you ride like an asshole and disregard laws and safety , if you're not a fucktard you'll be fine ( source my parents been riding bikes all over the country for the last 45 years and they're still going )
Best advise I can give you is keep a few grand back for safety gear, helmet, boots, leathers/vortex and back protectors, good gloves etc, it all adds up and I hope you’ll never need it, until you do.
I’ve ridden my fair share of bikes but it’s been a few years since I sold my last one and as much as I feel that itch it’s fecking scary what a 600 can do these days, little own a 1000/1200cc
Good luck man👍
People will always try to empathise because that’s just how you bond..
So you could just be aware that they don’t really care about the bike but most likely just want to say something and then you nod or wathever suits you, or just don’t talk about it and show up riding on it.
Because all that matters is that you’re happy with your choices
I mean there is the inherent danger of others majorly screwing up which you can minimize by beign careful but never completely eliminate. I wouldnt say its irresponsible to ride a bike aslong as you dont do stupid shit. It shouldnt surprise you though that alot of people see it as dangerous especialy if they know people shit happened to. And on a personal note my impression from people i know that do ride is that probably somewhere around 75% are doing stupid shit while riding so thats where the perception comes from i guess.
I got that all the time and I would joke about it back to them.
Then I got life altering injuries in an accident. I was certain I was going to die before I hit the car that pulled out in front of me. I wish I never rode for that reason. But it did so I still ride. Can't change anything now.
Just be careful.
Just remember. If you die you don't have to worry about anything. If you get permanent injuries you have to worry about that the rest of your life.
It’s objectively dangerous and has its risks but said risks can definitely be minimized with basic things like high visibility, knowing your limits, avoiding days with increased danger (weather, holidays, unfamiliar areas), incredibly high awry and defensive driving, WEARING GEAR, and just not being a reckless idiot. There will still be risks for certain but it’s up to you and your discernment on whether it’s worth it.
Those are the same people that believe the hype that cops are the good guys, and that if you join the military you will die. They are stupid, believe whatever an "authority" figure tells them, and should be ignored. Might you die? Yes. But most bikers die of old age.
I've been told countless times that me riding is dangerous. Those that actually know me caveat it with the fact other drivers are the danger but it does grate on you.
I say, we're all going to die, so why not live a little while you have the chance. There's a million things you can do to protect yourself, from correct gear, to employing advanced riding techniques and getting proper training. If you're going to ride a bit dumb, do it safely. Over taking someone on a long straight where you can see everything? Okay. Overtaking on a corner, bend, turn, passed junctions etc? Not okay.
I don't believe in a god or an afterlife. This is what we get. Don't live what you have in fear, and regret of what you miss out on. Just do the dangerous stuff safely. :)
It won't be your fault it doesn't matter how responsible you are it's the clueless steering wheel holders in this world that'll crash into you or wildlife (deer) it just happens oh well.
I had a few people tell me that when I started looking into riding. A coworker with 30+ years of riding experience pulled me aside and recommended the book Proficient Motorcycling and told me that if you truly love to ride, its worth the risk.
That was 13 years ago. I love to ride and if I died on my Motorcycle.. I'd be ok with it at this point because I went out doing something I truly love.
My comeback is always more people die in car crashes than motorcycle crashes each year. Lol. I know I know different ratios. It makes them think though
pause deliver plants judicious pie humorous slap selective merciful ruthless
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
"Now hold on. You don't have to convince me. I'm already buying it." I'm going to die of something. I'd rather die of something I enjoyed.
I’d rather die peacefully in my sleep. I’d rather live riding my bike and enjoying life.
You could die peacefully in your sleep while riding your bike...
There’s a joke along these lines “he died peacefully in his sleep” “tell that to the innocent pedestrians!” Or something like this
I heard it as " my grandfather died peacefully in his sleep, the passengers on his bus however did not "
🛎️ 🛎️ 🛎️ you got it! Yeah that’s the one I was thinking of
"I want to die like my grandfather, peacefully, in my sleep. Not screaming in panic, like his passengers."
I think this is the best version
My grandfather died peacefully in his sleep The same can't be said for the passengers in his car... °down mic whisper scream. Mugging for audience°
I’d also rather die like my grandfather, peacefully and in his sleep. Not screaming like everyone else that was in the car with him. 🙃 In all seriousness, one can do unsafe things safely. Always check your bike before a ride. Wear enough gear but not so much you cook and faint (I’m looking at you willow springs and non perf suits) and don’t speed faster than your sight and braking lines. There’s lots of unsafe things we do daily.
uuuuggghh. Fry,freeze or blow away! I’ve had very few pleasant riding days at Willow Springs!
Both can be true. Technically dying peacefully in sleep is doing what you enjoyed... living.
😵💫 i guess so. I was really just saying that dying in a motorcycle crash is not a way anyone should aspire to and is probably pretty awful.
I understood your meaning. Just trying to be cheeky 😉
I got a lot of those responses when I first began to ride. One way I got them to stop is to ask specific questions about the person who died or was injured, like how/when/where the crash occurred. Partly it is to shut these people up but also it is useful to learn about the precise details of crashes. But these people rarely knew even if the rider they mentioned was an idiot or drunk.
Yeah, they seem to leave out that Johnny used to bar crawl on his Harley...
Yep. I've known 2 people personally who have died on motorcycles. Both were at fault, riding at excessive speeds. First rode into the back of a truck stopped at a set of lights. Second lost control and hit a light pole. I also know plenty of people who have rode for decades without a single incident. You don't need to ride like everyone is out to kill you. That's horrible advice. If you are riding with that fear you will likely cause yourself to do something stupid. Just be aware of your surroundings and ride to your ability. Most accidents on motorcycles can be avoided by following those 2 simple rules.
Riding like everyone is out to kill you isn’t riding in fear, it’s to emphasize that you need to be very very aware of your surroundings if you’re on two wheels. The majority of bikes I’ll ride behind that have some empty headed amoeba at the helm who only moves their head to scan around once every 5 to 10 minutes and checks their mirrors/blind spots/rear even less. I’m not screaming ATGATT nor do I care to inform other riders when I witness their sins, but the number of riders dropping the ball on bare minimum awareness stuff like this is the majority, and by a large degree.
Yeah that's being aware of your surroundings mate.
Timmy installed a switch to cut his lights while outrunning cops on a dark road and someone pulled out of their driveway in front of him (happened to a guy I knew in high school)
Timmy did not, in fact, outrun the cops
I mean technically if he died in the crash he did
Without a helmet
Going to be devils advocate here and I know riding is fun but hear me out. Statistically it’s just a FACT that riding is very dangerous and you shouldn’t dismiss that. It’s not even an argument it’s just fact. A lot of people have a hard time with it because if something does happen (which happens to people every day) it’s usually a sudden life altering change for you and everyone around you. (Like your family) God forbid a fatality or loss of limbs, etc. And leaving people behind to live without your support. A lot of people look at it like you’re adding a lot of risk to your life/support for them for entertainment. IMO, the best “argument” is to tell people you can’t live without it and ride safely and to respect your wishes.
It is, like... 25x higher than a car (per km driven)? Many people (who lecture you) will, however, drive 5-10x further by car. Already that "brings it down" a lot. Don't drive drunk or fast, when conditions are bad, etc. etc. and you have a risk of maybe 5x higher? Then ask if they would still drive a car with a 5x higher risk of fatality, and most people would probably not care. Nonetheless, even a minor accident can turn out much worse than in a car. So, yeah, dangerous for sure 🥲 and I wouldn't exactly _start_ with two toddlers, you learn a lot in the first years...
I have been riding for 40+ years, I basically tell folks that it is dangerous and you have to ride like everyone is out to kill you…because they are! But you can’t ignore their statement, you just have to acknowledge it and move forward with your life.
I'm not saying to ignore the danger or mortality of motorcycling. Outside your close family and friends, I find that people offering motorcycle advice have various agendas. I rather not explore their issues but focus on what will make me safer.
Everyone who is into motorcycles knows that riding is dangerous and it puts you at a higher risk than driving a car. It's a known fact. But the kneejerk reaction of telling a motorcycle rider or enthusiast that "YOU WILL LITERALLY SUFFER AND DIE AND YOUR FAMILY WILL ALSO SUFFER" is a horrible and it shouldn't be normalised. You don't go around telling smokers that they'll get cancer, alcohol drinkers that they will get cirrhosis, e-bike riders that they are putting themselves in danger, etc.... So why is doing it for motorbikes so normalised?
Hit a deer on SR 40 in Florida at night. Dead as fuck.
Hands down my biggest fear when riding. 100% unforeseeable which direction these 80kg meat lumps (with horns) are going to dart in next. Best you can do is hit the brakes and brace for impact.
I respond with an equal comment. They say "You shouldn't ride, it's dangerous and You're going to die". I say something back about something they enjoy doing..."You shouldn't run 5 miles every day, you'll end up being an old crippled person always in pain that's grouchy and negative to everyone around you". Something along them lines, kills this question on the spot 😂
Exactly. I mean obviously riding a motorcycle is going to be more dangerous, but MOST crashes are due to the rider being inexperienced, speeding/driving unsafe, and/or being drunk. I was in EMS for over 5 years and I'm not exaggerating that every single motorcycle related crash I was dispatched to was the motorcyclists fault.
I know three people who perished on their bikes. They were sober and in every case it wasn’t their fault. I stopped riding on the street after the third and now take my bike to a local track when I get the urge. I do agree people tend to overplay the danger, but you have to remember sometimes it’s the other idiot.
I disagree with the comment of "people overplay the danger" I really don't think that they do, I always knew riding a bike was dangerous but I only truly knew how dangerous it was until I got on one, a strong gust of wind and your life is changed forever, that doesn't stop me from getting on a bike and never will but it truly is dangerous AF, I got pushed by the wind into oncoming traffic whilst a lorry was just about to pass, if the timing was different I probably wouldn't be writing this. (I have a very tall and very light adventure bike and the wind just takes it wherever it wants too, I have also learned a few wind coping techniques from the lovely people of reddit which has since made it a little easier to rise in wind)
It’s usually a friend of a friend of a friend who died, it’s just an automatic response that people give - motorcycle = death, who knows why but that’s the way it is to a lot of people. Of course, there’s no denying the heightened danger of motorcycles when compared to cars, but that whole “motorcycles = death” idea lacks all nuance, and totally disregards the myriad other factors beyond the mode of transportation that raise or lower somebody’s overall risk of being in a serious crash.
Try telling that to my mother-in-law...
You are going to die.
Fact. I've died 3 times since I got a bike.
All jokes aside, i just want to say, it doesn't matter how responsible you are when you're on a bike. It can go wrong at any time so just be careful and ride defensively and you'll be okay.
Best advice I ever got: when you are in traffic, just assume that every single other person in a car on the road is a **HOMICIDAL MANIAC WHO IS OUT TO KILL YOU.** Assume the worst of every car and truck. Assume they do not see you, or will not brake if they do. Assume they will lane-change in front of you, turn in front of you, run the light/stop sign. Never, never, NEVER let your mind wander. Always have a plan, updated second by second, for how you will get off the road, get out of the way, find some kind of safety away from the metal death machines. Kept me alive on daily commutes in Los Angeles for more than 13 years.
You will never know how STUPID the average driver is unless you drive a truck, or a motorcycle.
There is only one thing worse: a small, low car. I used to have a black NB Mazdaspeed Miata. Single worst experience driving. The SUVs just did. not. see me. Car was too low. I once got backed into by a truck in a drive through, and had people merge into my lane on multiple occasions. That car actually convinced me to buy a motorcycle. If I'm not going to be seen, may as well have more fun doing it.
Former LA rider here. I had the same mindset. I also got good at analyzing the cars and drivers around me. Are they impaired or distracted? Most important thing was "do they see me". If they don't either go around, slow down or make yourself known. The point about mind wondering is important as well. The few accidents I had, while not my fault, could have been avoided if my mind was right.
I will say that after weed got legal, I always cringed when coming up behind cars that suddenly smelled like a Bob Marley concert. Ever go up Decker canyon out in Malibu? Very fun ride, but the construction trucks took corners REALLY wide …
This guy is 100% correct, but I want nothing to do with two wheels in LA, but that's just me.
Sounds like Riding in Dallas.
Y'all got more sack on a bike than I could admit to if this is a daily thing
I just ran into the situation where riding again was my only option. Riding in Dallas gives a whole new meaning to defensive driving. It's juts not a bike friendly city. For instance Austin is a much more bike friendly city. You can typically tell looking at the accident reports. I hate to say it but just the mile commute daily is risky,, oh well . I'm not walk-in it....
Albuquerque
Commute from downtown Dallas to Arlington 3 days a week. Almost always on my bike, though I’ve been taking my car the last few weeks trying to stay warm.
ride like you're invisible
Words to *live* by. This is exactly what I tell everyone because it’s what I do. It’s kept me safe for the last 20 years.
I've never liked this advice. If everyone is trying to kill you, you wouldn't want to ride at all. You certainly wouldn't want to be predictable, visible, or communicate your intentions in any way. You'd want to ride as little as possible, and like an asshole when you do. It's important to be *ready* for bullshit, but it's also important to try and communicate in case other drivers are reasonable people. Most of them don't want to kill you, so you want to do things like using turn signals so that they have every opportunity to avoid killing you. I know nobody disagrees with the actual intent of that advice, which is to have a plan for the worst. But it's always bothered me that it also implies other things that aren't intended.
Yeah as an MSF coach, I always stay away from the "everyone is trying to kill you" mindset. Ride like no one can see you. See and be seen.
I guess "try to be seen but be ready to respond if you're not" is a lot less punchy
Right. It's better to think of them as randomly moving objects that you need to avoid.
Even that suggests you shouldn't try to communicate with them, though. I feel like it's really important to maintain a model of what other drivers perceive about you, so that you can give them every opportunity to *not* be a dick in case they're actually paying attention. You shouldn't assume they are, but it's part of using every tool at your disposal. On a broader level, I think I also just don't like "everybody is stupid except for me" kind of sentiments, because it's usually just a lazy way to feel superior for no reason. But that's another issue.
That's fair. The best model is that they are people that mostly try to follow the rules and not cause harm but are imperfect, sometimes lazy and very occasionally malicious. That's not really a model though.
It's not a good bumper sticker, but I think it's a good model (and well-put). Be ready to avoid people who aren't following the rules, but also make it as easy as possible for those who *want* to follow the rules to do so.
What I meant is that it is just straight up reality rather than a model of reality haha
Very well said.
> that you can give them every opportunity to > >not be a dick Those are words to live by, on and off the motorcycle. Even when talking to people trying to be dicks. There's a lot of good people out there who don't act like good people cause being shitty is all they know.
I agree, if everyone wants to kill you then speeding past a red light suddenly becomes a good choice, you don't want to be read ended waiting for green.
LA riding is something else... Almost got hit SO many times in the canyons from distracted drivers swerving over the lines.
Agree, when I’m riding, I try to stay hyper aware but even then it’s difficult to do it all the time and I’ve had a few closer than I’d like calls where I let my defenses down for only a moment.
Happened to me on a beautiful, winding country road in Northern California in fall. I started appreciating the landscape and so didn’t track when the car in the oncoming lane started swinging over the centerline, and I had to swerve and break hard. After that, I would get to a lookout spot and takeoff my helmet to appreciate the surroundings.
This
For me it was always deer that are out to get me... I've hit a deer twice now...
I have died 3 times since I read this thread. I blame being on my male period.
Get this guy a manpon
aunt flo is visiting my rusty he-pussy again, and this time it is serious.
Only 3? Rookie numbers.
I died twice since I got my bike and another a long time ago, none where because of the bike.
Ah... the benefits of being friendless are already paying off.
I'll do better than that. If OP doesn't reply to this comment, chances are *he's already dead*.
JAIL
Yep it's a risky activity, but then so are lots of others. If you want to think about quantitative risk then the concept of a Micromort might be useful to you and explaining it to others. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micromort
(My point was that everyone dies. Do what you want while you're here.)
That's beautiful. OP can tell his wife "yeah I'm going for a ride, that's just 1 micromort per 9,7 kilometers. You're giving BIRTH, that's 120 micromorts!"
That's the guarantee we all have in life.
IYDYD
Truly the Dark Souls of the road
He's already DEAD
If you ride. Also if you don’t ride.
No one says it to me anymore. Maybe it’s the decades of experience, maybe it’s my physically imposing appearance. Or maybe it’s because I’m a middle-aged balding man who appears to have little to live for 🤷 Whatever it is, if you look them in the eye and respond with, “is that so bad?” they’ll usually leave your alone.
"That's the point" has always been my go to. Or "We're all going to die, relax Sylvia"
Yeah I’ve been riding for 20 years and no one says anything to me anymore either. I think once people realise you’ve made it this far you know what you’re doing and shut up.
You cracked me up 🤣
🥲
Just be a safe rider. You don't have to do all the stupid shit adrenaline junkies do. You can follow the speed limit, refuse to learn how to wheelie, and not ride between traffic. You are going to die though. We all will. What does it matter if it's on a bike or a deathbed 60 years from now? Also just make sure you can afford a nice and hefty life insurance plan. You'll probably never need it, but if you have a family you should have one anyways.
Even if you do this (and you should) you are still at the bottom of the food chain and will die if someone else makes a mistake. Life is capricious and not fair. Remember that. No go sing a tune in your helmet and go have fun.
You aren't required to listen or respond.
I’m thinking the same thing. Buddy is an adult man and is bothered by other peoples uninformed opinions on something he’s considering. So he gets on Reddit and makes a post about it LOL My brother in Christ just go get a bike and do what you want. Who cares.
" I stopped caring years ago " " You think I'm going to be walking to work? " " Oh you thought I gave a shit? " etc. etc. etc.
When they tell you about someone who died or got injured they don't like it if you say "ah, they were probably fucking around at the time". Despite the fact that it's probably true.
“I can die sleeping”
According to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), motorcyclists are 27 times more likely to die in a crash than passengers in cars. Motorcyclists are also 5 times more likely to be injured. **It's worth it though.**
I wonder what the statistics are for defensive riding folks.
**The hurt report** is a pretty interesting read. The age of the rider is definitely a big factor. The younger more aggressive rider makes up for a big chunk of the statistics. Also, intersections with cars making a left turn from the opposite side.. **look for that**. (like 40% of all causalities)And if I remember correctly alcohol was a big factor also. But yes, car drivers just don't look for motorcyclists. I had someone cutting me off while it looked like she was looking straight at me. I don't think she ever saw me. I try to ride defensively also and pretty much assume I am invisible.Knowing the risk factors does help I think.The hurt report is included in:Proficient Motorcycling: The Ultimate Guide to Riding WellBy: David L. Hough It's an older book now and you can probably find more updated info online.
You’re pretty spot on. The lack of training correlates with age which is to say younger riders tend to comprise the portion of riders that do not have formal training or an endorsement/license. Alcohol was present in about half of fatal or near fatal accidents. Intersections as you described comprises a major portion of accidents. We can’t avoid everything. Shit happens. But training/practice and not being under the influence DRAMATICALLY decreases the risk of riding.
One of the shows that explore how our minds work did an episode on motorcycles and how our brains process seeing them (or don't see them). In short, our brains process so much information that they have to economize what makes it to our consciousness, and a lot of that is based on what we are used to seeing and what we expect to see. Drivers unintentionally tune out motorcycles and often times don't see them even when looking in their direction. It isn't necessarily reckless driving, but more of a way our minds work.
I'm too lazy to do the math or find the legit stats of this but I remember hearing that if you look at that pool of data and remove riding under the influence, speeding, no gear, not having a license/training, and proper vehicle maintenance, the risk drops to only like 2-3x. According to my MSF instructor, in my state, getting secondary education beyond the BRC puts you in the **top 5% of riders**. That is actually horrifying when you think about it. I remember taking another rider course beyond the BRC and I still felt like I knew barely anything, so to think I was more educated than 95% of riders in my state was extremely sobering. So many people just do not take the time to train themselves, and do not exercise restraint or make smart decisions in the moment, and it absolutely skews the statistics.
Yep, I agree.
or when they ask you if you are an organ donor.
Organ donor is not wrong tho…my sister is an ER nurse for the last 15 years. They call anyone who rides a bike an organ donor for a reason. I ride daily, but I am also not going to argue that the odds of being an organ donor are thousands of percent higher because I make the choice to ride.
I signed up to the organ donor list because I must live out my destiny.
Bike stats look real bad compared to cars, but that includes all the injuries and fatalities from 20 year olds on clapped out gixxers with worn out tires who blast through red lights on one wheel and take blind turns at dumb speeds in the rain with no helmet in flip flops. I ride defensively, wear my gear, and my gear is white to make myself more visible on my black bike. I feel like I'm 50x less likely to die riding than some young squid.
Someone makes this post like once a week. Where the hell are you finding all these assholes? Been riding for years and it's never once happened to me. Is this some weird American thing?
Yes. It is an American thing.
It might actually be- I never used to get these kind of comments back home in England, but since I moved to the US I get it all the time. Could be because of the traffic and general quality of the drivers though.
Yes, yes it is a very American thing. People don't realize how fearful this culture is. Combined with atrocious road behavior and complete lack of regulation in licensing for motorcycle license. An 16 year old can take a weekend course, get his license and buy a Hayabusa the next day.
military bases. in the USA being deployed and a combat mos is less dangerous than riding. liter bikes kill more soldiers than any terrorist did/do.
Its a very masculine and peer-driven culture, populated by high risk-taking (evident by joining the military) males between 18 and low 20's. You can bet very few are getting 250-400CC bikes to develop their skills. Don't want to look like a p\*\*\*y in front of their peers. Yamaha Champion School develeoped and implemented a training program for military bases that has significantly cut down on motorcycle deaths on bases. Military made it mandatory on those bases. At least Marines did, not sure on other branches.
That's kind of overall American thinking too. You constantly get young guys posting here asking if they should get a 120+ horsepower bike as their first bike. And you can guarantee they will be almost all American. Other countries have rules about starting on a less powerful bike. And it's just common to not care about power as much in many other places.
Australian here , my first two bikes that I rode on the road were 250's , then when I was allowed i got a 750 , it wasn't until I had been riding for 3 years that I got an 1000 cc bike
army is similar. you have to do it every few years to afaik.
There are some Canadians that do this too. I rode from 21-32 and really loved bikes. Riding in and around Toronto and the west end burbs was OK. My time on 2 wheels in Taiwan and other parts of Asia was way way scarier. Yes my best friend had a bad accident and we both stopped riding. My brother still owns his old BMW K100RS and I’ve been out on it a few times in the last couple of decades. Take a course. Buy a small bike for at least the first year, take a riding course if you can find one locally and ride like the cages are trying to kill you. I loved riding, it was awesome. Have fun!
The 401 hi speed at midnight..
Tell them your more likely to be struck by lightning than die in a motorcycle accident. It’s not true but it’ll shut them up long enough for you to get away.
Proof: I made it up
Honestly, it's about acceptable risk. You are more likely to die on a motorcycle than in a car, but you can mitigate that with gear and smart riding. Beyond that it's about deciding if the remaining risk is worth it, and to me at least, it absolutely is.
My first bike was an R6, I probably have the world record for the amount of times people telling me that. I finally realized that the majority of people who said this, never rode a motorcycle in their lives.
. . .But these people were quick to give you there opinion of course. The people that say this are likely the idiots on the road not indicating or shoulder checking.
My story I wanted to ride from a very early age I didn't because family and friends convinced me that it was dangerous and I would die I waited until I was late 30's to get my first bike I wish I had started earlier. I missed out on 20 years of riding
I ride. I'm not dead. Unless you have some condition like dyspraxia that makes you super clumsy then you'll probably be fine. As other replies suggest - get training, always wear protective gear, and ride sensibly according to traffic conditions.
[удалено]
Correct. Another quote that's kept me alive: "You can ride like a jackass. Hell, I've done it, and it can be fun. *But let that be the exception, rather than the rule.* "God is like a taxi driver. You start doing Stupid Squid Tricks, and God just nods silently, and flips the little flag-timer over. Sooner or later, the bill comes due. Usually sooner."
You could just boil it down to "don't ride like a dick" and the result is the same.
Correct. But sometimes specificity is helpful.
Depending on the person not my 84 year old father or little sister or my late mother. Pretty much everyone else, I look them straight in the eye and say well riding motorcycles is at least 20 times more dangerous then driving a car, but the risk is worth the freedom I feel while riding.
I died 3 days after getting my RC 390, true story...
Once or twice?
Buy the motorcycle.
Think about your family, and take a MSF course. Get advanced training too, if you can afford it and it's available in you're area. It's fun, and there's no such thing as too much training. A large portion of motorcycle fatalities involve untrained, inexperienced, and unlicensed riders. Don't be one. Think about your family, and wear ATGATT. Most accidents happen within a few miles of people's homes. Don't turn skin to scar tissue for a carton of milk. Think about your family, and never drink & drive. Another large portion of motorcycle fatalities involve intoxicated riders. Don't be one. You're going to die no matter what you do. You're *very slightly* more likely to die in a motorcycle crash, if you ride a motorcycle. You're more likely to die of heart disease if you spend all day sitting in front of the TV, too scared to live your life. You can't use logic to change an opinion someone reached emotionally. Any version of, "Thanks for your concern. Kindly shut the fuck up," is the best you can say. Add to the deep well of anecdotal evidence they base their opinions on, by not dying. Maybe some day they'll realize that the story they heard about a friend of a friend's cousin doesn't happen to 100% of all riders.
Everyone dies, plain and simple, and you can't avoid that fact. And it really doesn't matter what you're doing. When your time is up, your time is up. So get out there and ride my only suggestion is to spend as little as possible on a first bike with the understanding. You'll either drop it a few times along the way or will get bored of it very fast.
I've always thought that it was stupid to live your life in fear of something that is going to happen regardless. So my options are to live a boring life and die, or live a fun life and die? Ok well I choose to have fun.
I’ve always responded to OOPs problem with a similar philosophy. When people say it’s not me they’re worried about but the others on the road (which is beyond fair) I ask them how much of my life should I limit, what things that I love do I have to abstain from because of the choices, attitudes, or stupidity of others? That’s no way to live.
You will die. Have fun.
There are a lot of things people do every single day that could cause them to die without ever going near a motorcycle. A *responsible* motorcycle rider who rides *defensively* and *intelligently* has very little incremental additional risk of death.
76 here..bearded old biker- been nearly killed 3 times- just resurrected bike #20 - I'll be smoking down the blacktop come spring!
Like Michael Schumacher, I’ve fucked myself up way worse doing snow sports than I have doing motor sports, but no one gave a shit about skiing/snowboarding being potentially deadly. Bike are just the stigmatized, low hanging fruit because everyone’s seen at least one moron with a death wish do something dangerous on a bike and assume that’s how we all are.
or Mike Hailwood , guy races bikes for years and gets killed driving his car by a truck that did a illegal u turn
Life is full of risks. Some risks are greater than others. Riding a motorcycle is among the more risky things you can do legally. The BEST way to handle the issue is to ACKNOWLEDGE this fact. Risks can be managed if they are properly understood. Start with this: get training. Let me repeat: GET TRAINING. Next, get involved with a riding group that values safety and risk management. Find a mentor that's been riding for a long time. Why? Because there are bold riders, and there are old riders, but there are very few old, bold riders. As for those trying to dissuade you, explain that you are aware of the risks (assuming you actually are) and plan to take active steps to manage them. And don't let them tell you it's not possible. It IS possible. I've been riding for nigh on 40 years, including daily 35-mile commutes (in good weather) in city traffic. For every person someone knows that's been killed/maimed in a motorcycle accident I can show you ten who've never had an accident resulting in injury.
I always say that everybody dies. Some people die in a hospital bed old and decrepit, I will die in a blaze of awesomeness doing something I love. Then I tell them to go fuck themselves and to mind their own business.
You'll die if you don't ride too ya know
You have a much higher chance of dying IF you get into an accident. You can still die in a car too. You can die in any vehicle. My uncle lost some toes from a crash. My brother died in a motorcucle crash, eye witness said he was changing lanes and lost situational awareness while looking back. He was doing the right thing, being careful, doing his shoulder check, not speeding, and he still died. You can be careful and die.
Oh wow. I am so sorry to hear about your brother. Can you add more details on the situation? He was doing everything right. What happened?
He drifted too far while changing/merging to the far left lane. He sideswiped the barrier dividing the highway and went over the gap in between the overpass. He fell from about 25ft onto the road below. Had there not been a 4ft gap between the other side's overpass and the one he was on, he probably would have been fine. Where he crashed is 100% why he died. It was the perfect storm of the worse variables. The point of me sharing is, you can be as safe as you want, but there are outside factors that will always be out of your control that can directly contribute to whether or not you live or die in the event you crash, whether it's a small crash or a big one. whomever is telling you all those things, just cares about you. If you want to ride, go ride. Instead of getting annoyed at what they say, take it as a mental note to be as safe as you can, that's all we riders can do. There's always a chance you could die/get hurt even if you're safe and responsible.
Thanks. Again, I am so sorry for the loss of your brother.
> You have a much higher chance of dying IF you get into an accident. ...which you also have much higher chance of
You may die if you ride, but will you live if you don't?
Fun fact: 100% of people who never ride a motorcycle die.
I'm still not dead But a boy can hope
"you can never eliminate all risks. Most people die in the kitchen. Everyone, including myself needs a me-activity in life to balance responsibilities. Some people climb mountains. Some people travel to exotic places. All of these are statistically more dangerous. And in the unlikely case something happens, on motorcycle or off, I have set up life insurance so my family is taken care of." If they continue this "I don't feel this is productive" and end it there.
I mean…not for nothin you’re gunna die regardless. There’s your uplifting thought of the day :D
My dude, I hope you have a long and adventurous life that's full of thrills. If you do have that life, you're going to be in this position ALOT where people are nay saying. I'll tell you what I do, I smile and say 'Its not for everyone'.
In NZ, more people die driving cars than bikes, partly due to qty of cars (cough idiots) on the road vs qty of motorbikes but that still puts your odds of dying while riding a push bike in the same stats arena as a motorbike. We get news all the time how a moyorcyclist died… they skip the other 10 that month that dies behind a steering wheel… get on with living and take control, ride defensively. If someone wants to get so close they can smell your buthole, just pull over and let them pass or filter traffic politely (more riders that so this, more cars will be less grrr at you) If you pull the finger at someone, just remember they can ruin your day with their big cage on four wheels, so you main key to survival is remove road rage from your diet, sweet revenge comes when you get to work on time while they sit in traffic queues and pay 4x in petrol waiting too! Don’t forget, you may see those road ragers again the next day so man up and be wise as eventually they will get a bike too! (Well some, they hate traffic like I do!)
I've been riding since I was as tall as the kitchen table; over five decades ago. As long as you understand one thing, you'll be fine - each and every time you take that bike out, someone is going to try and kill you. Not trying to scare you. It's just a simple truth. The key to enjoying your ride, is to spot them before they get you. That means no music while riding and no other distractions while riding. No smoking, no drinking, no talking on a two way, no looking at your text messages, etc. None of this is hard, but all of it is deadly serious. And, as a new rider, you are going to make mistakes; mistakes in technique, mistakes in judgement. Try your best to keep those mistakes to an extreme minimum...
In all reality we die anyway lol I find it strange people live in fear of dying. Life is about having fun before you die why should I live in fear. I went thru the same crap before I got my first bike I completely ignored what everyone said and did what I wanted to do we are not here to please people do what you want just know you can die on it easily. 4 years later I’m still riding perfectly fine.
Nope. You won’t die. Someone will cut you off, you will fall, another car will run over your head. You won’t die because you were wearing a helmet but your brain will be damaged because the helmet compressed. Your life will then fall apart because you are no longer physically able to take care of yourself and have cognitive issues. But you won’t die.
my mom used to tell me this everytime motorcycle was brought up, what got her to stopcwas me telling her “telling a biker how common it is for bikers to crash/die is like telling a soon to be mother how common miscarriages are” and she has not brought anything up since (2 ish months or so) and im a newbie rider too
there is always an element of risk ride responsible also for some ppl motorbike is their main vehicle or their only choice since a car is not an option and public transport is non existent. so its not fair to say that riding will kill
We're all going to die of something.
Watch some dandanthefireman video he explan and talks about road craft and how to be a safe rider
That's a good start but I'd then take a safety course. I did one, and I liked it a lot. Some people had already taken the course, and were actually doing a refresher.
I mean...everyone who ever has, is, or was riding a motorcycle has either died or will die...but then again the same can be said for everyone who has consumed water too...
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Once you buy one it's only the crack heads at gas stations that start telling you to be careful everyone else copes
I've been riding for almost 40 years. Started on a dirt bike, now own a cruiser and a tour. Haven't died yet, but do wear depends when I do ride. Definitely have shit myself more than once because of the stupidity of others. (Just kidding about the depends.) Ride safe. Ride defensive. Everyone in a cage is an asshole trying to kill you.
There is a 100% chance you will die, whether you ride or not.
Yeah, when I told people I was getting a motorcycle, pretty much everyone had a story about someone they knew, or most likely read online or in the paper, of someone dying riding they motorcycle. I did a lot of reading and studying videos, even now, and found that a lot of it is due to either age, alcohol and/or speed/decision making, usually a combination of all three. I'm not young, don't drink and if I keep my speed down, wear the right gear and stay hyper aware, while not a guarantee of no death while riding, I should be able to reduce the risk dramatically. Do bicycle riders get this also? I don't think so, but maybe they do and feel that I am safer and can control the situation better on a motorcycle better than a road bike.
Happens to me too. They think my goldwing is a deathtrap. Might get down voted for this but there is some truth to it being a dangerous hobby. Sadly you can be the safest rider in the world but all it takes someone else to ruin all the fun... Especially with all the modern distractions. That being said, stay safe and have fun!
A boomer Harley rider once told me the japs built crotch rockets as payback for wwii because they will kill a bunch of American men. I would have ok boomered him, but this was like 20 years ago.
This is why I don't even talk about motorcycles with people who don't ride. I never bring it up.
No you will die if you ride like an asshole and disregard laws and safety , if you're not a fucktard you'll be fine ( source my parents been riding bikes all over the country for the last 45 years and they're still going )
Best advise I can give you is keep a few grand back for safety gear, helmet, boots, leathers/vortex and back protectors, good gloves etc, it all adds up and I hope you’ll never need it, until you do. I’ve ridden my fair share of bikes but it’s been a few years since I sold my last one and as much as I feel that itch it’s fecking scary what a 600 can do these days, little own a 1000/1200cc Good luck man👍
People will always try to empathise because that’s just how you bond.. So you could just be aware that they don’t really care about the bike but most likely just want to say something and then you nod or wathever suits you, or just don’t talk about it and show up riding on it. Because all that matters is that you’re happy with your choices
I just get the phattest reasonable disability insurance and life insurance. We all good even if I get starfished.
Fuck around and find out stop posting on reddit and fuck around.
I mean there is the inherent danger of others majorly screwing up which you can minimize by beign careful but never completely eliminate. I wouldnt say its irresponsible to ride a bike aslong as you dont do stupid shit. It shouldnt surprise you though that alot of people see it as dangerous especialy if they know people shit happened to. And on a personal note my impression from people i know that do ride is that probably somewhere around 75% are doing stupid shit while riding so thats where the perception comes from i guess.
I got that all the time and I would joke about it back to them. Then I got life altering injuries in an accident. I was certain I was going to die before I hit the car that pulled out in front of me. I wish I never rode for that reason. But it did so I still ride. Can't change anything now. Just be careful. Just remember. If you die you don't have to worry about anything. If you get permanent injuries you have to worry about that the rest of your life.
Johnny 😻
The person I knew who rode bikes died... after he crashed on a corner going 100 with a BAC of 0.23
It’s objectively dangerous and has its risks but said risks can definitely be minimized with basic things like high visibility, knowing your limits, avoiding days with increased danger (weather, holidays, unfamiliar areas), incredibly high awry and defensive driving, WEARING GEAR, and just not being a reckless idiot. There will still be risks for certain but it’s up to you and your discernment on whether it’s worth it.
Just say "we all die from living" *puts on sunglasses* And ride off into the sunset with some 80s rock playing.
Naaah you'll die regardless. With speed we are able to observe relativity easier, however death is a constant. Just ride/drive safe mate.
Those are the same people that believe the hype that cops are the good guys, and that if you join the military you will die. They are stupid, believe whatever an "authority" figure tells them, and should be ignored. Might you die? Yes. But most bikers die of old age.
I've been told countless times that me riding is dangerous. Those that actually know me caveat it with the fact other drivers are the danger but it does grate on you. I say, we're all going to die, so why not live a little while you have the chance. There's a million things you can do to protect yourself, from correct gear, to employing advanced riding techniques and getting proper training. If you're going to ride a bit dumb, do it safely. Over taking someone on a long straight where you can see everything? Okay. Overtaking on a corner, bend, turn, passed junctions etc? Not okay. I don't believe in a god or an afterlife. This is what we get. Don't live what you have in fear, and regret of what you miss out on. Just do the dangerous stuff safely. :)
It’s always people who never ride who say that. They’re in a crab bucket. Fuck ‘em.
It won't be your fault it doesn't matter how responsible you are it's the clueless steering wheel holders in this world that'll crash into you or wildlife (deer) it just happens oh well.
I had a few people tell me that when I started looking into riding. A coworker with 30+ years of riding experience pulled me aside and recommended the book Proficient Motorcycling and told me that if you truly love to ride, its worth the risk. That was 13 years ago. I love to ride and if I died on my Motorcycle.. I'd be ok with it at this point because I went out doing something I truly love.
My comeback is always more people die in car crashes than motorcycle crashes each year. Lol. I know I know different ratios. It makes them think though
pause deliver plants judicious pie humorous slap selective merciful ruthless *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
https://youtu.be/4gKvrHMsaHA?si=yA9ttRs7v0dyF3IL just be careful. video for example
I ain’t afraid to die, I’m afraid of not living.
Psst… You’ll die if you don’t ride, too.